First off I enjoy your videos. Let me say to your critical viewers (and I do get it). I worked on the railroad for 42 years and retired as an engineer. While the "F" denotes that is the designed front of the locomotive, we did not get them that way for every run. There was not a turntable or wye at every location so sometime you just ran them as you got them. It was a slight pain to run them "backwards" but we did it all the time. I worked for the N&W (later NS) and we had a lot of locomotives that were long hood lead. The Southern also seemed to prefer long hood lead so when those roads got together we had a lot more. Also consider the branch lines. You would run from one end of the line doing your work, then run around the train and return back to the origin station. Guess what. Half of your trip would be long hood, the other half would be short hood. Also a lot of the N&W locomotives had dual controls. IE 2 control stands, one facing the long hood, the other facing the short hood. (those were great) We still had several of the Nickel Plate Road (my favorite road and what I model) GP-9's and they had the control stand facing the short hood. They had a forward facing horn with a pull rope to the front and another one for the long hood. You pulled the horn rope in accordance with the direction you were going. But you simply turned your chair around to face which ever direction you were going. While running those long hood forward you had to continually turn your head to look at the speed recorder on the wall of the short hood. Hope you enjoyed this bit of history from the "inside". Carry on, and keep enjoying that prototypical 3rd rail! Also "B" units the company, as well as the engineers, could not care less which end the front of those were. While those were rare where I worked we never turned one for any reason. So to address the title of your video, you really can't run a GP-9 wrong as long as it is going up and down the track.😜
Well said! AND people should remember why EMD came up with Geeps to begin with, ease of switching and set-out operations since F-units were blind toward the rear. Geeps solved that problem and were cheaper than F-units as well! So in the end it wasn't a mortal sin to run a Geep "wrong way" forward, that was one of their reasons for being. Railroads may have preferred a particular direction, hence the "F" but it certainly wasn't set in stone. I'll tell you, some people have WAY too much time on their hands!
Great video. I'll be honest with you, I ran my Pennsylvania gp9 backwards until I hit forward and it went the wrong way, mistakes happen, don't beat yourself up, thank you for walking us through the proper positioning if you're doing an mu arrangement. Love the Cargill facility you're building. And again, sometimes info will be wrong, you're human, I can't even reiterate all the information and learning that you have given myself and your viewers. Thanks for all that you put into the hobby and all that you do. Keep up the good work.
You're doing a great job you don't have to apologize for nothing. And that's coming from a former Conrail then CSX locomotive engineer. Conrail Quality #1..btw... Love the 73 Ford mustang on the roadway there.
Toy trains, its not hostage negotiations. So do your best and if you get something wrong... no big deal. Its cool that you care so much, thats why most people watch, because of how into these trains you are. Keep it up Dakman! We love ya buddy! And this is good cuz I've been running my GP9s backwards!! Ha ha ha ha! Who cares!! Nobody ever said anything {if they even realized}
Maybe when your GP9 Hooked up to the cars ,It was already in that Direction. There are no turntables in the middle of nowhere in real life. It's a Toy. Love all you do. Nobody is perfect.
Great job brother my MTH sd-9 Pennsylvania has cab figures facing long hood forward also, so I believe what your telling me great video, really liked the video this was something diffent and I had fun watching and learning
The thing with wether an EMD road switcher was built long hood forward or short hood forward was much like if it had dynamic brakes or not in that it was all up to the preference of the railroad. Some, like the Pennsylvania Railroad and Southern Railway, had theirs set up from the factory as long hood forward, and pretty sure with dynamic brakes due to some of the grades they ran over like Saluda on the Southern. However I am not an expert on the PRR or Southern ones due to living in Minnesota and thus being more familiar with the ones seen here in the Midwest where they were commonly set up for Short Hood forward operation with Dynamic brakes because some railroads here like the Great Northern, Northern Pacific, Milwaukee Road and CB&Q had lines heading west through mountains and thus ordered every engine with dynamic brakes.
I have been running my GP-9's, GP-7's and my FM's 'backwards since the early 1970's. To me, the cab should be to the front, not the back but apparently, this is not the case. I guess I'll stick with my F3's.
Many things to consider. The F is Federally required to designate the actual front of the loco. But remember the engineer side would be on the right side. Your video is showing the fireman side. Note that diesel locos run equally in either direction and in pairs the second unit would face the opposite direction to eliminate turning the units around. Not all roads ran the long end first. Lionel catalogs showed the GPs running long end first as did many roads but I have seen pics of The Wabash and N&W running them both ways. I think this was kind of a hold over thing due to steam locomotives having the cab in the rear. However safety and visibility dictates running the short end first. I will run mine short end first because that’s my preference, also all my trains will have a caboose. My road, my rules. My crews will be safe. The bottom line is how the loco was designed and in my world I bought them to run short end first just like modern locos. No wrong answers here. I’m not a rivet counter.
Dakman, it's not that you're wrong because I have pictures of GP7's and GP9's have the (F) for Front on eathere end of the Engine. on the Engine. On both of my GP7's and my GP 9 have Front (F) are on the short hood side.
Funny video,I wouldn't take comments so seriously, respect to everyone involved.
All I have to say is that you have a great channel and you keep everyone informed, keep up the good work.
Run the locomotives how you want to. It is your railroad.
That was fun Shawn. Like someone else said run your trains the way you want
First off I enjoy your videos. Let me say to your critical viewers (and I do get it). I worked on the railroad for 42 years and retired as an engineer. While the "F" denotes that is the designed front of the locomotive, we did not get them that way for every run. There was not a turntable or wye at every location so sometime you just ran them as you got them. It was a slight pain to run them "backwards" but we did it all the time. I worked for the N&W (later NS) and we had a lot of locomotives that were long hood lead. The Southern also seemed to prefer long hood lead so when those roads got together we had a lot more. Also consider the branch lines. You would run from one end of the line doing your work, then run around the train and return back to the origin station. Guess what. Half of your trip would be long hood, the other half would be short hood. Also a lot of the N&W locomotives had dual controls. IE 2 control stands, one facing the long hood, the other facing the short hood. (those were great) We still had several of the Nickel Plate Road (my favorite road and what I model) GP-9's and they had the control stand facing the short hood. They had a forward facing horn with a pull rope to the front and another one for the long hood. You pulled the horn rope in accordance with the direction you were going. But you simply turned your chair around to face which ever direction you were going. While running those long hood forward you had to continually turn your head to look at the speed recorder on the wall of the short hood. Hope you enjoyed this bit of history from the "inside". Carry on, and keep enjoying that prototypical 3rd rail! Also "B" units the company, as well as the engineers, could not care less which end the front of those were. While those were rare where I worked we never turned one for any reason. So to address the title of your video, you really can't run a GP-9 wrong as long as it is going up and down the track.😜
Well said! AND people should remember why EMD came up with Geeps to begin with, ease of switching and set-out operations since F-units were blind toward the rear. Geeps solved that problem and were cheaper than F-units as well! So in the end it wasn't a mortal sin to run a Geep "wrong way" forward, that was one of their reasons for being.
Railroads may have preferred a particular direction, hence the "F" but it certainly wasn't set in stone.
I'll tell you, some people have WAY too much time on their hands!
I appreciate the inside information!
Great video Shawn. I’m glad you ran it and had fun. That’s all that matters.
Great video. I'll be honest with you, I ran my Pennsylvania gp9 backwards until I hit forward and it went the wrong way, mistakes happen, don't beat yourself up, thank you for walking us through the proper positioning if you're doing an mu arrangement. Love the Cargill facility you're building. And again, sometimes info will be wrong, you're human, I can't even reiterate all the information and learning that you have given myself and your viewers. Thanks for all that you put into the hobby and all that you do. Keep up the good work.
Thanks for the kind words! Glad you enjoyed it.
You're doing a great job you don't have to apologize for nothing. And that's coming from a former Conrail then CSX locomotive engineer.
Conrail Quality #1..btw... Love the 73 Ford mustang on the roadway there.
Toy trains, its not hostage negotiations. So do your best and if you get something wrong... no big deal. Its cool that you care so much, thats why most people watch, because of how into these trains you are. Keep it up Dakman! We love ya buddy!
And this is good cuz I've been running my GP9s backwards!! Ha ha ha ha! Who cares!! Nobody ever said anything {if they even realized}
Maybe when your GP9 Hooked up to the cars ,It was already in that Direction. There are no turntables in the middle of nowhere in real life. It's a Toy. Love all you do. Nobody is perfect.
Great job brother my MTH sd-9 Pennsylvania has cab figures facing long hood forward also, so I believe what your telling me great video, really liked the video this was something diffent and I had fun watching and learning
Thanks for watching
It’ll be fun no matter which hood he is facing 👍🏻
Don't sweat it Shawn. Many of us ran our GP-9's incorrectly out of the box. Including myself.
Thanks much for your support
You can run your trains however you want to Shawn.
Cab forward or long nose forward, it doesn't matter shawn, its your railroad.
Thanks much
The thing with wether an EMD road switcher was built long hood forward or short hood forward was much like if it had dynamic brakes or not in that it was all up to the preference of the railroad. Some, like the Pennsylvania Railroad and Southern Railway, had theirs set up from the factory as long hood forward, and pretty sure with dynamic brakes due to some of the grades they ran over like Saluda on the Southern. However I am not an expert on the PRR or Southern ones due to living in Minnesota and thus being more familiar with the ones seen here in the Midwest where they were commonly set up for Short Hood forward operation with Dynamic brakes because some railroads here like the Great Northern, Northern Pacific, Milwaukee Road and CB&Q had lines heading west through mountains and thus ordered every engine with dynamic brakes.
It’s a hobby and supposed to be fun. Run your trains anyway you wish!
Cab 3 will tell you forward and reverse on the direction arrows
Look up LM&M RR they have a C&O GP7 the video is only 1:28.
It was the first that C&O bought.
My mth gp9's have the engineer facing short hood forward
My Locomotives travel across the layout top first... That's OK right?
I have been running my GP-9's, GP-7's and my FM's 'backwards since the early 1970's. To me, the cab should be to the front, not the back but apparently, this is not the case. I guess I'll stick with my F3's.
I love the EMD F3, F7 and F9
@@Dakman Me too. As a child, the FM was my favorite because it was the biggest at that time.
Many things to consider. The F is Federally required to designate the actual front of the loco. But remember the engineer side would be on the right side. Your video is showing the fireman side. Note that diesel locos run equally in either direction and in pairs the second unit would face the opposite direction to eliminate turning the units around. Not all roads ran the long end first. Lionel catalogs showed the GPs running long end first as did many roads but I have seen pics of The Wabash and N&W running them both ways. I think this was kind of a hold over thing due to steam locomotives having the cab in the rear. However safety and visibility dictates running the short end first. I will run mine short end first because that’s my preference, also all my trains will have a caboose. My road, my rules. My crews will be safe. The bottom line is how the loco was designed and in my world I bought them to run short end first just like modern locos. No wrong answers here. I’m not a rivet counter.
Dakman, it's not that you're wrong because I have pictures of GP7's and GP9's have the (F) for Front on eathere end of the Engine. on the Engine. On both of my GP7's and my GP 9 have Front (F) are on the short hood side.
Thanks much for the information