.270 Winchester; Hero or Zero?
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- Опубликовано: 27 июл 2024
- It's time to talk about the .270 Winchester, the good and the bad. And no matter how you feel about the .270 Win there's a lot we can learn from it.
Ballistics Studies: www.ballisticstudies.com/Know... 
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I agree with the lighter rifle, lighter recoil, and slower drop. That’s why I chose it. The 130 grain is the standard for a reason. You look at what O’Conner accomplished with that and there isn’t anything left to say.
That .270 Winn feels real nice chamber in a Browning Automatic !Recoil is not bad at all.
@@genelyda1102 Agreed. I have it in a BAR scoped with a Leupold Vari-X III 2.5-8 Super sweet gun.
After using the .270 since I was 17, (as a New Zealand Forest Service deer culler), 56 years ago, I have to say there is no better all round cartridge. IMHO of course. I've used a few others in that time including military service but I always come back to the .270.....Another great video Tom.
Thanks Sam and the older I get the more I appreciate the .270. A friend was thinking about a 25-06 recently but then he ran into the same thing I did when I had that same itch which is the .270 stays right there with the 25-06 on velocity but does it with a heavier bullet. I just can't see an advantage with the 25-06? And with the new powders today I can't see much advantage with the magnums. They definately got it right when they came out with the .270.
And you working for the New Zealand Forest Service culling deer is impressive. You guys have become legends amoung hunters world wide!
I’ve used the .270 Winchester in five countries over a period of 50 years. Killed numerous trophy-class bull elk, big Canadian whitetails, crumpled blue wildebeest and kudu. The cartridge has never failed me. There is virtually no difference in killing power between the .270 and the 30-06 Do your job and the .270 will definitely do the same. I’ve used numerous bullets through the years, Partitions, Bitterroots, Grand Slams etc. My absolute favorite is the 140 grain Swift A-Frame. I’ve used a lot of other rifle calibers as well from varmint calibers to heavy African calibers but I’m to be buried with my favorite .270
Thanks for sharing that Jim, including the part about the A-Frame. That's a bullet that I know is out there but I never hear anything about. I just always assumed it was similar to a partition but you're the first person I've ever heard comment on it's performance. I guess that's why it's still around after all of these years?
Excellent video, love the 270 Winchester, it’s a excellent cartridge.
Thanks 👍
Agree on that 👏
@@TomRiverSimpleLiving I got a old Sako finbear in 270. Awsome rifle. I'm having a 270ai custom made. Great video. Love all your videos
I agree, a .270 is a great hunting cartridge, giving up very little to the 7mm Mag, if any. Many years ago a friend of mine got an opportunity to go on a bear hunt in Canada when one of a group going had to cancel. He told me he really wanted to go, but the guide/host required the guys use a minimum of 3006 for their rifle. I offered to loan him a .300 Win Mag, but told him his 270 was adequate with proper bullets. Told him to get some Nosler partitions, I think they were 160 grain in weight. Anyway, he got some loaded and tested, was getting bout 1.5" groups at 100 yards, not as good as his normal, but adequate. He said the old guide kinda scoffed at his rifle at first, but later when he shot a big black bear behind the right shoulder and it exited the far side and the bear fell stone dead, the old man had a sudden admiration for the .270.
I'm very surprised a guide worth his salt would suggest a 270 wouldn't be an acceptable choice for black bears. I've personally seen my cousin kill two black bears with a 280 shooting 140 Accubonds. However, I will respectfully disagree that the 270 gives up very little to the 7MM Rem Mag. The 7MM Mag is a better choice with 160 + grain bullets at distances past 300 yards, especially on bull elk. I'd rather have the higher SD and energy afforded by 160 7MM bullets shot from a 7MM Rem Mag since a shoulder shot maybe the best choice in some circumstances. After all, it's better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it. Take care and best of luck in the field.
@@nmelkhunter1 I have to agree with both of you. I agree with you Kent that the .270 gives up very little to 7mm Mag especially with some of the new powders out now. I never mentioned it in a video but I did some pressure testing on that Westerner with the mag pro powder and it was pushing those 140gr bullets almost 3100 fps with no pressure signs which was pretty impressive. I don't even know what it would do 130gr bullets?
But I have to agree with you NMELKHUNTER when comes to Elk. I'm sure that larger bullet and powder charge would make a difference then?
@@TomRiverSimpleLiving It’s really the SD combined with the energy that makes a difference on shoulder shots since the bullet would be hitting large dense bone.
@@nmelkhunter1 With respect, I'm not sure what ballistics you are comparing, but the 150 grain in a 270 Win gives up literally nothing to the 160 in the 7mmRM. Most hunters are using factory ammo and comparing apples to apples in Federals premium line with a 100 yard zero:
270 Win - 150 Partition, .279 SD; .465 BC @2850 fps. At 450 yards drops 39.2", at 2026 fps and 1367 FPE.
7mmRM - 160 Partition, .283 SD; .475 BC @ 2950 fps. At 450 yards drops 39", at 2123 fps and 1601 FPE.
Near identical performance; I'd like to know what the 270 Win giving up...
@@rg8249 I’m getting 3030 FPS with 160 Partitions and 3050 with 160 Accubonds from a 24” Barrel. Both hand loads have been checked with three different chronographs. Since I don’t shoot factory ammunition that’s a big difference. I’m a firm believer, as are many of my friends who are guides, 1500 pounds of energy is the minimum for bull elk for shoulder shots at longer ranges.
Appreciate you covering 270 ! Learned the the hard way being young and listening to all the writers . Bought the latest and greatest 140 Winchester supremes ,shot my deer and clean thru him penciled . I went to track him and my buddies were waiting with their knives out to cut my shirt tail! I said I hit him square! One stuck one in the ground to his left behind some laurel he laid both lungs an heart.. I talked to an old hunter at the checking station he took one look says throw them on the shelf and buy you a soft point we’re woods hunters ! I did and next year first shot same place and they double fisted that exit wound ! That was over 40 years ago! Mr Jack O’Connor knew his stuff ! Wish I would have kept all those magazines 🙄. But you explained this for everyone way better than I could! Thanks and God Bless!
I'm trying hard to get better at explaining it but it's complicated stuff. It just comes down to bullet selection but it's tough explaining why. But I'm glad you enjoyed it.
I'm using a .270 and shot my first deer with it 4 days ago. Nosler Accubond bullet, 130 grains. That deer dropped like it was struck by lightning. Didn't make a large exit wound but man did it tear the vitals up. Slightly quartering towards off a ledge with a high shoulder shot. I had some doubts but now I'm sold. This is a great round with the proper bullets!
The bullet discussion about tough vs soft bullets is exactly why I switched to all copper bullets, excellent weight retention, reliable and rapid expansion and enough density to penetrate deep, I use a Barnes 140gr tsx and have had great luck
i think copper bullets are great too. Velocity still plays a crucial factor in bullet expansion though. Theres a sweet spot where these coppers like to really expand to full mushroom.
I’ve been hunting with a model 70 in .270 for 46 years. Its been everything I ever needed.
My father bought a 700 BDL 7mm rem mag in 65,still loves it and still shoots it to this day, he's in his 70's.He once told me if he had to do it all over again,he would go with the 270..he said jack oconner had it right all along,and the ammo distributor are the ones who messed it up..For my father to say that,it speaks volumes..I bought me a 270 this week to get ready for the upcoming deer season... I just wanted a new rifle, something different from my 308 and 243.. we'll see if he's rite.
I think he was!
Those of us that hunt with a 270 in a good rifle know exactly what they're capable of.
And the older I get the more impressed I am with the .270. A friend of mine is thinking hard about getting a 25-06 and I have to admit it would be fun to experiment with but the .270 is right there with it on speed plus the .270 is doing it with a heavier bullet and longer barrel life.
Great article. I’ve been hunting deer with a 270 since the early 70’s. I’ve always loved the flatter shooting and lower recoil compared to my 30-06 rifles. Funny coincidence, I standardized my hand loads for the 270 on the 140 gr Nosler Partition based on advice from an older shooter I respected in our deer camp. Results were always great and I never saw any need to change it.
Thanks for all the thought you put into this video.
I appreciate your honesty. Started out at 13 years old with a Pre '64 Model 70 that my Grandfather and given to my Dad. I was loading my own ammo and found (even at that age) with 130 grain soft boat-tails I got much better results loading them down to just over 2,800 fps. Getting
I've been using 270 for 25yrs and never had a problem dropping deer from 30yds to 400yds..I think that it's the best all around hunting caliber ..
400 yards?
Good for you!
But, most of us simply do not have the time or opportunities to shoot enough during the year to reliably "harvest" big game at much past 200 yards!
Believe me, I'd really love being able to spend at least a dozen range sessions every year with my favorite rifle! But, my busy life being what it is, I'm lucky to get some "practice" in three or four times in the month or two before opening day!
I had Two (2) uncles that shot Winchester
.270s in the 60's. I became a true believer in the cartridge watching them take mule deer and elk with one shot kills. I wouldn't hesitate to own one today, but I was distracted by a 7mm Remington Magnum. A great video with fantastic hunting story and a lot of wisdom, thank you!
My thinking is besides a good cartridge, they were good at shot placement. Dad's and uncles we can learn alot from.
Tom, this is the best info I have heard about my favorite caliber. An aspect I never gave much thought to - oh so true.
6 months ago I watched a video of yours now you’re my favorite. Keep them coming. Your presentation is really good. Don’t change. Thank you
Thanks Mark I appreciate that.
You are right on the mark about Ballistics Studies. I’ve been reading them for a few years now. Lots of honest down to earth info on a lot of cartridges. Keep up the good work. I really enjoy listening to you.
my dad was always a 270 lover, and it grew on us his kids. If my old man was still around he would be laughing with you and spinning a yarn or two. thanks for the info.
I'm glad you enjoyed it, and I'm sorry he's not here to join in with us.
Partitions are like two types of bullets in one. Brilliant design.
Great content. Thank you.
I'm 54 yrs old, and Ive used many calibers n loads. Since the 70s, I've hunted and killed well over 100 game head and more of deer.
The .270 Winchester 130 gr regular PSP is the best for deer hunting, period. Field use tells you what works not anything else.
When you consider the many variables, the .270 comes out number 1.
It hits hard, shoots flat, it's noticeably faster then most 30 caliber bullets, less wind drift, low recoil, and it simply poleaxes game.
I love the .30-06 and the .308, I own them too, however, I'll grab that .270 Winchester first when heading out, not even a question.
Don't even consider weird ass unpopular calibers, you want a bullet that's common and one you can find anywhere.
Top 3 below for deer hunting.
1. .270 Winchester 130 gr PSP
2. .308 Winchester 150 gr PSP
3. .30-06 Springfield 150 - 165 PSP
Exactly frigging Right!!
All overkill in my neck of the woods where a 44 or 30-30 work just fine. But I get your points. ......when you need to reach out there.
I totally agree with you😊 you will those three when you cannot find anything else
I agree too but 308 is my go to. Just personal preference.
25-06 120gr greatest deer cartridge ever
Hey Tom. Just wanted to thank you for all your great videos - I've learnt so much from them! Tomorrow I pick up my new Model 70 in .270😊 God bless from Australia..
Very good video. Obviosly, you put a lot of research into the .270 win and TY for sharing it. I own both caliber rifles like both of them but the one I go-to the most is the 270.
Not enough is said about bullet selection vs velocity and placement. Many times a caliber is blamed for poor performance when it is the bullet choice that is the problem. Bravo for bringing this to light.
MH
I've been shooting a ruger m77 270 since I was 18. That's 49 years, I'm 67 now. I've put 3 scopes on it, shot reloads and floated the barrel( no fiberglass bed) I've always shot the 130 grain bullet and have found the Hornaday whitetail the most accurate. Recently tried the Hornaday ballistic tip and it was all over the target. My particular gun doesn't like it. Last year I put a barrel dampener on it which improved accuracy. I can put 5 shots inside a quarter at 100 yards. Not match shooting, but I've dropped every deer I've shot at since I started hunting again 5 years ago. My longest shot has been right at 200 yards, no compensation. My scope is an old Bushnell 3-9 duplex. About 20 years old. My 270 has always gotten it done. Recoil could be lighter with a gun w/o a skinny sporter barrel, but when that buck is in my crossbars, I don't feel it.
I spent two weeks looking threw thousands of videos to find someone with good conversation on the 270. I needed something i could share with my wife. I finally gave up and purchased a book for her. Two days later I find your absolutely amazing video. You definitely gained a subscriber!!!
Thank you very much for that.
The 130 grain in the 270 is the perfect weight.The one thing you stressed was bullet construction and weight which is precisely right.One needs a handloader if using a 270 to load up the 130 to around 3050 to 3100 fps 3150 to 3200 is too hot,3050 the best speed.
I love the 270 as a pure deer gun that when used at sensible ranges can take moose or elk as well,and with the 130s.The 270 is such a light recoil caliber that doing more neck or head shots could be done provided you can take you're time.
Love my .270s...have a Remington mod 700 and a WInchester mod 70 mfg in 1950...been shooting both for years and never had an issue with either, shoulder or lungs...as with ANY gun, it's all about shot placement...loved the video!!
Tom, I gave my grandson my model 70, 270 cal. Winchester 3 yrs. Ago. His first year, his first buck, at 265 yds. Downhill on a power line r.w.y. down one shot. He got his second big! buck a year later. To say the least, he loves that 270.
It’s a hero in my book! I’ve been hunting with a model 700 in .270 for 23 years. I shoot federal premiums 130 grain btsp and hornady 130 sst. I’ve shot deer at 20yds out to 300yds and as long as I do my part right, they bring them down. Most I’ve shot drop in their tracks. If they run, they don’t go far. Hogs and coyotes don’t stand a chance either. Enjoyed the info!
I'm glad you enjoyed it.
Glad to hear the .270 is effective on hogs.
Btsp, right?
Thanks
@@MD-mm1zv yes federal 130 gr btsp. Shot placement is everything on hogs. High, in the shoulder shots are important.
The same deer shot twice really made me chuckle. Iv'e never heard anything like that. Thanks for the story and the video.
Glad you enjoyed it! And it was a true story. I sort of felt bad about selling that rifle because it was a real tack driver.
Just read a 22 year old article on .264 Winchester Mag. The .270 Winchester was very comparable in performance. Once again the .270 was demonstrated to be a real hot rod, magnum class cartridge without all magnum negatives.
270 has better twist rate but I’ll take my 264 win mag over it anyday. Anything heavier than 130g the 264 is gonna shoot wanky because of the stupid twist rate they won’t change. I can get under half inch groups out of my m70 264 with 130 grain nosler trophy grade any day
have taken dozens of deer mulies whitetails, several elk and black bears,
several rams (big horns) ,antelope, varmints with my ruger m77 270 cal.
love it. they usually drop.
bull elk went 100 yards.
a lot of the time i find the bullet in the hide.
great. cal for western canada
I see the points that have been made in this video. I have been hunting with the 270 for 35 years and reloading the same. I guess I have been extremely lucky because I have always found my dear within 50 yards of hitting it. The 270 has just never failed me and all these years I've been loading the Nosler partition. Thanks for the video and God bless.
I was a 3006 guy, only!!! I reload (50÷ yrs.) and have now realized the true value of the 270 and its great!
I love your tone and attitude, your communication skills are commendable
thank you for your straight forward ness and humble experience, I'm looking at getting another 270. God bless you and your family
That’s a beautiful rifle you’re showing. Absolutely gorgeous. I’ve been using the same .270 since I was 14 and am 33 now. Hasn’t yet failed me on deer and elk. Also, I use 130 grain cor-lokt tipped cartridges. Thanks for the video!
Love me some .270! Currently working with an Interarms Whitworth Mauser rifle. It's heavy and I doubt I'll ever hunt with it but I love owning and shooting it. Good vid, TR!
Thanks, and nice rifle! I hope to add an Interarms Whitworth one day to my on collection, it's just a matter of which caliber?
I have used Nosler Balististic Tip bullets over the past 2 decades. They perform flawlesly, if you place the bullet correctly; I have not had a large Buck go more then 60-70 yards, many drop on the spot. I'm using a Winchester model 70 chambered in .270 cal. shooting a 130 grain Nosler balistic tip.
This is a good explanation. My grandfather was one of the first in his area with a .270 and a scope and a reloader! My father hunted hunted his whole life with that caliber and I've been carrying it for 25 years. I would put the .270 up against any caliber.
I wish I had a grandpa like you to teach me this stuff and go hunting with me.
I bought my Remington 270 from my stepbrother. Along with the rifle, he gave me 3 boxes of ammo. All from different manufacturers,but all 130 grain. 2 brands were partitioned and the third was a boatail. I have shot mostly Axis deer for 25 years before I purchased the Remington and was shocked at the first deer I shot with it, ran off. But only for 20 yards before it dropped. I "penciled " 4 more, just behind the shoulders, before buying 150 grain Corelock's. My shooting distance mostly is 100 yards or less. Been hunting with it now 15 years.
Like every cartridge it's all about finding the bullet that works for you and how you hunt. Once you do that the 270 Win is an outstanding hunting cartridge.
If you think the 270 Win is a zero, we can't be friends. I've taken Caribou and Moose with 270 Win.
Don't worry, like I said I've become a fan of the .270 over the years. It just took awhile and me learning what happened with the ammo back in the 80's and 90's.
I don’t know how many elk, deer, antelope my grandfather has taken, along with his caribou, Dahl sheep, and moose with his .270. He always preached get as close to the animal as possible to make the cleanest and quickest kill as possible.
@@brycehiigel235 My kind of hunter!
I'm in Africa - I've shot many Kudu and Oryx with my 270 with 130gr bullets at distances up to 400 m.
@@robert8552 I don't doubt that at all, just a little jealous I haven't had the chance to do the same. Lol...
Sorry but out west here the 270 has always performed well. Not sure what you saw on the ground but we have seen fantastic results on deer sized game. My dad has shot the 270 since the 60's and I have continued. I do agree that bullets have really come a long way but I don't like the idea that it didn't work before 2001. That is just crazy.
It worked great before 2001 but then it didn't work so well during the 80's and 90's with some ammo. They started messing with what worked great and then by the 80's(?) they messed it up. If you get a chance read that article I posted a link to at ballistic studies.com. That was a real eye opener for me and explained why I, along with a lot of others, saw so many problems during that time period.
I two agree shoot a 270 fw 1958 my dads and taken a lot of deer bullet of choice win 130 sliver tip yellow box from 1970 or 80s still find them at gun shows one box lasts 10 yrs
Thank you for a greatly clarifying the projectile issues i have struggled with.
I felt the same way up until a month ago, and purchased my first one, added a scope and sighted it in, I am now a fan. The 75 year old Partition has never had a problem before or after 9/11.
Agreed.
I do not like a light bullet and do not want a .270, but i have to say that I learned a lot more on it with this video. Well done!
Thanks Jean, and I forgot to mention the big plus for the .270 which is it's maximum point blank range. It's tough to beat a .270 on MPR and that's where it really shines. It is a long distance cartridge and one of the best for that on deer.
Good video to have for the ups and downs of the .270 Win. I think it is a fine deer hunting cartridge and I have known one or two hunters from my school days that hunted with it. Strong enough to bring down a deer, lighter in recoil and readily available in a number of game hunting formations. But again, like you said, experimenting with hardness versus velocity and which is the best compromise.
Well done.
I totally agree with you. In my opinion, the 270 Winchester is an excellent round. It totally outperforms a 6.5 Creedmoor the 308 Winchester and many cases the 30-06 Winchester. Today Winchester loads 150 grain nosler LR that 2900 feet per second, which produces over 1,600 foot pounds of energy at 500 yards and has the same drop and drift has a 6.5 PRC. The only drawback of a 270 is the barrel twist. If they would bring it to a 1-8 twist it would be a better long range performing round using larger grain bullets (165-175).
View "Mark and Sam After Work". A few months ago they built a 1:8 long range .270 and shot 170gr bergers out of a 26" barrel.... over 3000yds....
a ver ¿ usted dice que el giro del cañon es un inconveniente? a mi con las de 140 es lo maximo, mala experiancia con la de 150 y la 168 matrix y el giro 1:10 alcanzo, si se bien en papel, pero no expandieron bien y penetraron sin expansion.... tenga en cuenta que weaterby usa diro 1:12.... se que muchos sueñan con el long range y disparo demasiado extremos 140 de balas comerciales matan bien a 600 metros y mas.... si usa torno se dara cuenta que tendra que construir una bullet usted mismo y que lo que viene comercial es muy estandar
listen to Ron Spomer’s video on 270 Win barrel twist. He talks about how the 150gr bullets performs better out of a 1:10 barrel than a 165&170gr bullets out of a 1:8 barrel at the 17:20 minute mark.
It appears they got it right 98 years ago.
want to shoot those long bullets in the .277 caliber? Try a 6.8 Western or a 27 Nosler.
Very interesting! Enjoyed your humility and knowledge! Kind of refreshing! Very insightful with references as well as an excellent teaching style that is easy to understand. I’m just getting back into mid to long range shooting but not really a hunter and have been overwhelmed with all the changes as well as all the additional cartridges on the market today and the intended usage for each one! So I’m more of a range guy who had not shot a high powered rifle in 30 years! I am an experienced shooter as far as law enforcement and military service are concerned but never really educated myself on the ballistics aspect! I have a lot to learn!
Ray, I suspect you know a lot more than you give yourself credit for? And yes there have been a lot of changes in shooting but the overwhelming majority of it is marketing. Shooting itself hasn't changed a bit. The same laws of physics that govern ballistics now are the same laws of physics that governed it since the beginning. I know that probably sounds over simplified but it really isn't and that's something I'm just starting to fully appreciate myself. A couple of weeks ago I carried a sporterized 1903a3 with a 1942 action and a 1943 barrel to the range and after bedding the action, free floating the barrel, and just cleaning the barrel it shot a 4 shot group under 3/4's of an inch @ 100 yards. And that was with just a random load and full length sized brass. Nothing has changed but the terms and the addition of a bunch renamed cartridges. The 6.5 Creedmoor is a great cartridge for shooting because everything for it is cheep and plentiful because it is so popular. But in terms of performance it's a 6.5x55 that has been around for well over 100 years and was part of the first generation of smokeless cartridges. Ballistically they're almost identical with the edge actually going to the 6.5x55 because it has a slightly larger case capacity. Learn the terms and have fun but just keep things in perspective.
great vid Mr River keep em coming!
Thanks, will do!
Good presentation. I think the 270 is a really good cartridge. So much that like you, I own more than one.
I have to laugh now at how many I own given how i used to feel about it. I don't think i mentioned just how many deer I saw lost with a .270 way back when but it was a lot. The ammo was that bad.
Your expertise is appreciated
Thank you for that Charlie.
My own personal experience - for 40 years I used a .270, shooting a 130gr PSP bullet - never missed and only a handful of deer ran no further than 20 yards. 30 of those years was using a Remington 760 Gamemaster with a Weaver K4 scope. Ten years ago, eyesight not what it used to be, I bought a modern bolt action rifle in .270 with a modern scope. Still haven’t missed. Since it’s always worked for me, never had the desire to try anything else.
I am a 30-06 man but I still LOVE the 270. It does the lighter bullets EXTREMELY well. Deer, antelope and mule deer hate the 270 too!
You could do .280 rem and shoot heavy and light bullets fast🙂
270 gets used alot here in South Africa for a good reason. Excellent calibre.
The .270 win is one of the greatest big game cartridges ever designed. I've taken over 20 deer with mine...all one shot kills. You just can't beat the 130 gr. Nosler partitions.
270 Winchester.. Great caliber with flat shooting and a mild recoil .. Possibly the best deer caliber 👏
I can't argue with a thing you said there, which might be why I now have more rifles chambered in .270 than any other cartridge?
This is a very informative video, thank you for posting. As for your pre-64 Winchester 70, it's beautiful! I have the identical rifle. It was my grand uncles and given to me by my grand aunt after he passed away. It's a 1949 serial number in .270. He bought it after leaving the service after WW2 and was his favorite deer hunting rifle. It's still in excellent condition and an amazing rifle. I will never sell it.
We've both been very blessed to end up owning such fine rifles. And like you I'll never sell mine either. I also have a feeling your grand uncle is rather pleased that you ended up with his rifle?
@@TomRiverSimpleLiving I totally agree and like how you followed up your response with a question mark. He would definitely be proud that I was awarded it(haha). It's an honor!
Thanks for a very good, informative video. Iv’e owned a Winchester Mod 70 , .270 i bought at a gas station when i was 20 years old. Im now 62 & it’s still my favorite bolt action that i shoot. I think i gave $120.00 for it with a Tasco scope . Man guns & ammo have gotten expensive!
Hi Tom, great channel. It’s an ongoing debate down here in Australia where we hunt our Sambar deer, and weather the .270 is sufficient. (.270 is the minimum legal caliber to hunt this species in Australia). Sambar deer are typically a 330 to 710 lb animal. It’s a popular calibre here and does the job with proper shot placement. However those that prefer the .308 and above continue to provide entertaining debate around the campfire LOL. Cheers from down under. 👍
Excellent video , Never heard it explained quite the way you did ,it gives me an even deeper appreciation for the 270 , I have one just have not taken much time to use it but that will be changing now !
PS. Thank you and you have a
👍new subscriber👍
I started hunting deer with a 30-06 in 1970 and switched to a 270 in the late 90's. When using the 30-06 it was with hand loaded 165gr Sierra BTSP bullets at around 2900 FPS. When I started using the 270 it was with 140gr Sierra SPBT bullets at 2900+ FPS then latter the Hornady 140SST Superformance ammo at 3000+fps. After taking dozens of whitetail and mule deer I never had a bullet, 270 or 06 pencil. I never had a 270 bullets blow up and not penetrate. I had only one 270 bullet fail to penetrate and that one I recovered up against the far side hide and that deer was DRT after getting hit at 40 yards. A number of shots were 40 to 70 yards and a lot around 200 plus yards and several right around 300 yards. One buck went down at 350 yards with factory 270 145ELD-X ammo and went clean through on a traversing the body shot. The 30-06 was a hammer and had some recoil to it. The 270 was perfect for deer, lots of muzzle energy and recoil was not as much as 06. Although I once shot a match with a 270 and after 60 rounds I felt it, my shoulder was a little sore. With the 270 I had nothing but one shot kills from as close as 40 yards and out o 350 yards. I never had a 270 bullet "fail" on me and never felt like the bullets I used did not perform properly. From my experience both cartridges work very well on deer and I have zero qualms about using a 270 to hunt with.
And that's what makes this such a divisive topic. A lot of people have had the exact same experience as you. But then a lot of people had some really bad experiences. Those that had no problems tended to assume the people that had problems couldn't shoot. But it wasn't that at all. It was luck of the draw as to what ammo you picked.
It's been 2 years since you posted this, but I just got my .270 ammo. I appreciate the rant because I like to understand everything. You can't do over-kill with the talking with me!
Thanks!
Great video and one of the best explanations of bullet performance I've ever encountered. Here in Upstate NY a long shot is 150 yards and so many of my friends are hunting with 7mm Rem Mags, 30/06 and even 308 with 165's or 180's no less and don't understand why they are always tracking solidly hit deer and don't understand how I can drop them in their tracks with a 300 Blackout bolt gun. I can turn up 2400 fps in my 22" Savage and those 125 gr. Nosler BT bullets almost never exit and anchor the meat DRT without a lot of damage. I'm forwarding your video to them in an effort to keep them from penciling their next critter and spending a lot of their time in the weeds searching for a blood trail.
It's the same here in S.C. And Ken you should appreciate this, my friend Joey that I did the .243 video with took countless deer with the .243 and never lost one. A friend of ours finally talked him into trying a 7mag and he lost 2 with the 7mag. I think that says it all?
Thanks for the great vid, Tom.
(settled on the .277/150 gr. SPEER Grand Slam @ 2800 fps)
I'm glad you enjoyed it, and that combination should be perfect!
Between Grand Slams and Partitions, there is no North American game you can't take with the 270.
That Grand Slam is a pretty decent bullet. I know one of my mule deer fell to a .30/165 out of a .30-06. I don't think they quite equal the Partition. That's a tough act to follow, and the reputation will never be beaten even if the bullet somehow could be. I may have a box of them for .270 that I never got around to loading. May have to give them a try.
Thank you for your no-nonsense approach to describing why a cartridge succeeds or fails. There are a lot of variables that can come into play when a bullet is sent downrange. I am one of those who is a lover of the .270. I have hunted with a Remington 700 in .270 for almost three decades and have taken scores of deer with it. I dare say, I have never lost a deer that I hit with it. My bullet of choice that has given me the most success is the Remington Core-Lokt 130 grain pointed soft-point. I just works for me.
I have to say those core lokts are hard to beat. I've taken deer with a lot of different bullets but the majority of mine have been taken with core lokts as well, just in different calibers, and I never lost a deer with them either.
I hit an Elk at 500 yards with a 150 Nozzeler. We found the bullet inside the cage it broke a rib before it hit the heart. Better to have had a larger caliber . Reckless shot but the 270 worked . The 130 grain boat tail is best through the 270 .
Nosler Partition has been killing game for almost 75 years.
Great video! I was hand loading my own 270 rounds in the mid-late 90's so I dodged the factory ammo garbage. Nosler partitions and Grand Slam bullets have put a bunch of big game in my freezer over the years.
Bullet fragmentation is real. My buddy was shooting a 7mm Rem Mag, and wanted extreme velocity for our long range NM mule deer hunt. He loaded some 120 to max loads. Long story short, he shot his large buck at about 100 yards, the buck flinched but kept on eating, a second shot did about the same. We could hear both bullets hit, but no results. I then shot him with my 30.06..DRT. Upon examination, the were two "pock marks" on the shoulder. The bullets blew up, did not penetrate past the hide.
I had a friend that had a bullet blow up from a 325 WSM. He got the deer but no exit wound. And he said when he shot he saw a puff of smoke come up from the deer. Turns out it was hair that he saw and it just looked like a puff of smoke. And we'll just say he had that 164gr bullet moving pretty fast. LOL
I guess I was lucky and somewhat naive when I started hunting with a 270 back in the late 1980s ... I started out hunting with the 150 grain Remington core-lock rounds and never had any issues whether it was a lung shot or chest shot they usually dropped or ran maybe 30 yards.
This ammo always worked well chambered in 30-30 (170) grain as well ... though it does have some accuracy issues at distances over 200 yards in 270 but that is very rare where I hunt in Ga.
Great video and thanks for the information 👍👍
I'm glad you enjoyed it Timonthy, and I think you and I both got lucky with core-locs. I used them in my .303 British in 180gr for a lot of years and it didn't matter where I shot them with that one either. I can't count the deer I took with core locs and never lost a one. And those core locs still work at a distance despite what people say. I've dropped deer in their tracks out to 300 yards with them.
My first hunt at age 17 i shot a 200lb Ram at 200yds w/ a Savage bolt action chambered in .243 using 100g CORE LOKT. The bullet went thru the left shoulder, both lungs, and lodged in the right shoulder. The Ram popped a wheelie and fell over dead.
My first hunt at age 17 i shot a 200lb Ram at 200yds w/ a Savage bolt action in .243 using 100g CORE LOKT. The bullet went thru the left shoulder, both lungs, and lodged in the right shoulder. The Ram popped a wheelie and fell over dead.
Thanks Tom. Another great video 👍
Glad you enjoyed it
Just found this guy and absolutely love his videos
Thank you for the history and information! I love my 270!
It's a great cartridge and I'm glad you liked the video.
Thanks for clearing up something thats kicked my tail for the past 34 years. On thanksgiving day of 1988 i lost the best buck i ever had a shot at. I crawled on my belly for about 100 yds to get a 100yd shot. There was no cover in the fresh chopped muck field, so i stayed on my belly while resting my rem 700, 270
In the soft mud rise along side a furrow. My target was the crease just behind the left shoulder about midway from back to belly. I knew it was a good shot, but he ran with no sign of injury for about 100 yds into the thick head hi dog fennel that had yet to be chopped. I gave him a few minutes but as it was starting to rain, i went to the point where he and several does entered the thick. I saw a very small amount of blood right there but that was it. As i searched the rain got harder and harder. After an hour in rain so hard i couldnt see my hand i started back to the truck feeling disgusted that the bigest buck i ever got a shot at was not comeing home with me. Well i had to work on that friday and then saturday morning so the soonest i could get back out there was saturday afternoon. They had finished chopping the field by then and i just lost hope of finding my buck.
I told my self that maybe i just grazed him, and he would live on knowing that was not likely. My brother worked on the same farm, and called me sunday morning to tell me that the farm owners teenage son and one of his buddies killed a nice 10 point that morning that had been shot right behind the left shoulder exiting on the right side. They said he was in a ditch a couple of blocks over from where i had been 3 days before and could not get up. I did see the rack, it was the same buck. I had just recently bought the 270 and gave my old 3006 whitch had never let me down tomy baby brother. It took a long time to regain any real confidence in that 270. I always thought that must have been a fluke, and had not thought about that deer in many years untill seeing this video. And now it all makes sence. I dont hunt a lot anymore, but still have that rifle and once in a while at the range it still drives tacks. Thanks for the info.
Got back from Africa 2 weeks ago, and I brought my 270…couldn’t have been happier!!!! Would never use anything else. Dropped a zebra, impala and blesbuck instantaneously at 110-115 yards respectively. I also spent a lot of time spotting in my scope and practicing. I was also using premium custom made Barnes ammo. My buddy brought his 30-06 and dropped everything with one shot as well. 80% is shot placement and 20% is ammo quality.
I agree completely with your sentiment, but I have to put more in phase on bullet selection. I saw way to many lost deer because of the ammo that were shot by first rate hunter. And if you get a chance to read the article I linked to in the description please do. I thought it did a lot to explain the importance of ammo and the issues professional hunters had with the .270 after manufactures slowed it down.
Outstanding discussion of bullets and the 270 cartridge. In the end, you summarized what I have thought for years.....velocity is not everything. I guess that's why I love my 6.5 Swede and my 7x57 Mauser. Both "advertised" muzzle velocities are 2650fps in 140gr SP. Magic bullets on deer and hogs in the woods. Tom, I quit shooting behind the shoulder years ago. I'm a center of the shoulder shooter because I got tired of watching deer run off. Your pre64 Featherweight gets prettier every time I see it lol.
The only time I worry about velocity is on those long shots and by the time that bullet gets way out there it has slowed down enough to be just right. In other words it matches the 7x57 and the 6.5 Swede!
And that pre 64 has really grown on me. It's funny how some rifles do that. And I suspect you'll run across another one just when you least expect it?
Worked at a sporting goods store in the 90s, and I remember the ballistic tip craze. There were the same stories and love/hate with them. .243 seemed to be very problematic with the blow up/no penetration because we saw lots of trades attempted for this reason. Sometimes we could advise just go back to "old" ammo they were successfully using and keep the rifle vs. trading, but many wanted to use these new magical bullets so they upped the caliber. That I believe started the 7mm mag craze, at least here that's what most went to. Good luck and God bless.
Very similar story here. A lot of people went to mag calibers because they completely lost confidence in standard hunting cartridges. One friend went to a .300 Win Mag and another to a .338 all because of having so many problems loosing deer with the new state of the art bullets.
I'm new to hunting, and only just bought my first firearm in 2019 after finally escaping Chiraq (was trapped there financially for 30 years).
I've been diving into the shooting world like you wouldn't believe, trying to make up for so much lost time. It saddens me that the hunting scene, especially here in WA, is very anti-new adult hunter, especially if you're from out of state and don't know anyone.
I found an amazing shooting 1943 Long Branch Enfield No.4 Mk1* for a mere $200 (had no sights, which were another $100, so $300 total). I've already figured out an amazing load for this rifle, as far as matching the original WWII .303 Brit ballistics, so that my iron sights match up. Great shooting rifle, smooth as butter, and my hand loads shrank my grouping out of a bench vice from 3 MOA to 0.93 MOA (shooting at 100 yards). Off a sandbag, I have little trouble hitting 8" plates at 350 yards, and no trouble hitting 18" plates at 450 yards. Anything bigger than about 4" at 200 yards and in is pretty much a guaranteed hit.
Now that I've developed a good load and my marksmanship (apparently I'm a natural with rifles, comes to me as easy as breathing... suck with handguns, though, and okay with shotguns), I want to learn more about bullet types, when/where to or not to use them, etc.
I hate that prior to getting into shooting, almost all my gun "knowledge" came from videogames and Hollywood. In other words, I've had to learn to unlearn the faulty information in my brain. Take for example, a visually stunning hunting simulator called "theHunter: Call of the Wild," in which soft point bullets are utter garbage with barely any penetration with hyper-rapid expansion, and polymer-tipped bullets are extreme penetrators with almost no expansion. The game makes the Mosin one of the shittiest rifles, offering only soft point 7.62x54R that are useless outside of about 50 yards. However, the game makes the .270 Win rifle one of the best general purpose big game rifles (if you run polymer tips), out performing just about every other caliber. Even the Enfield (in the Monte Carlo configuration) doesn't shoot anything or sound anything like my Enfield.
It seems the more I learn about firearms and ballistics, the more and more I hate Hollywood and videogames. The one exception to that is Arma 3, which has uncanny realistic ballistics and optics, especially with some of the expertly made mods that add in real world optics and rifles. In general, though, it's been a real eye-opener for me. I used to think for years I wanted a Glock for my first handgun, but the second I held one, I actually dropped it (right there for the entire gun store to see, quite embarrassing) because I hated how shitty the grip feels, like it's trying to fuck my palm with a knuckle. I ended up buying a gun I had never even heard of (Astra A-100, made in 1992, chambered in .40S&W), and I absolutely love it, aside from it being a >2 pound boat anchor of a pistol.
Since then, I've kept my mind open about different gun models and calibers. It seems I'm currently in the trough of the Dunning-Kruger Effect, in that place where you know enough to know you don't know nearly enough. I really appreciate your videos, as you seem to be a straight talker, you seem to know what you know and aren't afraid of letting us when you don't know something. You're like a chill version of Paul Harrell, one of the few guntubers that doesn't come across as trying to sell me things, stroke their own ego, or are on the hunt for views, but rather just someone who loves guns and wants to impart to others what they've learned through real world experience. Thank you for keeping it real.
Learning to hunt and getting into firearms is definitely tough when you don't know anyone. I've been starting small and slowly getting into it as a young adult, though hunting is popular enough in my part of Canada, I don't really know anyone. We're fortunate to live in a time when you can gain many of the benefits of mentorship by learning from others online (especially from channels without the fanfare, but with genuine experience to speak of). I've learned that there are a ton of strongly-held opinions that might not match what you will experience. Some of the most "popular" things might not work for you, and unpopular things might hit the spot. For instance, I've found I don't really like the Ruger 10/22; I respect its heritage and how adored it is, but I prefer other rifles. Some love or hate the 270 round in this video, or Glocks (very polarizing), the 40S&W, etc... Half the time it's just a preference and doesn't really matter. What you say about keeping an open mind is 100% spot on with what I've found to be the best approach as well.
The Long Branch Enfield is great -- made in Toronto, Canada... they can fetch upwards of CAD$1000 these days in decent shape in Canada due to the affinity of being one of the only wartime rifles we made here. They're awesome rifles -- be sure to take care of it and it should gain value (especially if you sell it to the Canadian market!).
Also, if you think Arma has accurate firearms... check out Escape from Tarkov... it's way over the top, but there are thousands of firearms, parts, ammo types, and customization all based on real parts (game made in Russia where the copyright might be ... well, anyways). Cheers
Thanks. I appreciate all your information and and experience
I always used Nosler Partition bullets from my .222 to .270 and .308. Best hunting bullets bar none! I shot a red deer (Australia) with my .222 using Nosler 55 gr partition (1973) and Sambar Deer with .270 130 gr Partition. Now I own a Sako 85 in .270. I have 550 130 gr Partition bullets for my re-loading. Could not be happier!
I don't think a better bullet has ever been built for hunting than the partition?
I learned a lot today. Thank you.
I'm glad you enjoyed it.
I did not know. Very informative. Great video
Thank you, and I'm glad you enjoyed it.
My father, may the good Lord love him forever, hunted with a 30-06 All of my lifetime and he loved that old model 54, lugging that thing around high altitude mountains every fall. I being a huge jack O'Connor fan used my lightweight 270 which of course was a lot more elegant and just as effective at crumpling deer right where they stood. It doesn't matter which you choose, like you said, put a well constructed bullet in a 6" circle behind the armpit and you have yourself a dead deer. Dear or not hard animals to kill at all. God bless
No company is going to advertise the flaw their bullet may have, this is great info on bullet performance based on where you prefer to place your shot, thank you
I started out on the 90’s with my .270 shooting a 130 grain Sierra game king. Ranges were mostly 100 yards and closer. Performance was amazing.
When bullets become available again I need to try some Gamekings. I've used them in .308 and they just weren't quite the bullet for .308 but they sure shot good and I could see them being outstanding in a .270.
Found the channel recently. Great videos!
Thanks Victor. I'm glad you like them!
Great conversation. Thanks.
Another example of bullet exploding; Once when elk hunting with my father who was carrying a 7mm mag. He shot an elk from a nice reasonable distance. It was a large bull. He hit the elk in its left shoulder and didn't drop the elk but the elk quit using that leg. I had to track that elk nearly 5 miles before I finally got a shot at it. I killed it at about 250 yards with a 7x57 with a shot through the lungs. When we cut up the elk the 175 grain bullet from the 7 mag. had broken the shoulder but didn't go any deeper. I believe that is a result of to much velocity for the bullet to handle. I have harvested a number of elk wherein I hit large bones with a 30-06 and it never failed to have a complete pass through except end to end.
One of the problems they had with the 7mag when it first came out was all of the existing 7mm bullets were made for the 7x57 and way to soft for the 7mm mag and they kept blowing up just like that one did on your father. Now it's just the opposite. The 7mm mag got so popular and the 7x57 is almost extinct and now it's tough to find a bullet soft enough for the 7x57. Not surprisingly the best bullets for the 7x57 are the ones that have been around for decades like the Speer Hotcore and Nosler Ballistic tip. Those were both originally designed for the 7x57 and still perform great in it.
Great info! I've been preaching the same for 44 yrs of hunting. Unfortunately most hunters have never been taught how to select the proper cartridge for what they are hunting and definitely not the proper projectile for that cartridge. Couple the above with little to no knowledge of anatomy and little if any knowledge of ballistics and we see why there are so many stories of the one that got away because "x" gun or "x" cartridge was used. This lack of the proper basic knowledge must be impressed on hunters at a young age and reinforced by us seasoned hunters to assure animals are humanely harvested. I really wish this type of info was required during every hunter safety class. It would ensure more clean kills and ultimately a better hunt for us all
I'm glad you liked it and I agree that it something that needs to be taught to younger hunters by us older ones.
One factor that many are not aware of. This cartridge was "introduced" in 1925. When most, if not all rifles owned and used by your average Deer hunter DID NOT USE A SCOPE! In fact, it wasn't until after WW2, say 1946 or later, that the big optical companies began to market decent scopes at prices the "average working Joe" could even afford!
So, for at least the first 25 years or more of the lifetime of this (the .270 Winchester) cartridge, game was shot with "iron sights", at ranges from 50 yards, on out to maybe 150 yards! And for back then, the factory ammo was just fine!
Today, with nearly every rifle sporting a scope, these same hunters can shoot at 200, 300, or even 400 yards!
Not that I would try to stretch it that far. But taking a big Buck Mule Deer at close to 300 yards, is not an off the table possibility 🤔
I've been living in Arizona for the last 35 years, 10 of those in Tucson where Jack O'Connor formed his hunting tactics. I hunt Coues whitetails on the Mexican border each year. In that country, shots between ridges at 400-600 yards are very common. The last two deer I shot were at 485 and 505 yards respectively. That reality shaped his perception of the .270. It is a superb long range deer cartridge and at the time there were very few cartridges even in the same ballpark. That's why in his writings you hear so much about the 7x57, .257 Roberts and the .30-06. For years I hunted exclusively with the Nosler Partition. Then I went through a phase where I hunted with the .257 Weatherby and Xbullets at 3700 fps. Now with laser rangefinders and range compensation reticles, I hunt with much more mild cartridges. The deer I mentioned above were shot with a 6.5 Creedmoor and a 6.5 Grendel. I've gravitated to the Nosler ABLR 129 grain bullet in the Grendel. That deer at 505 yards was quartering on and the shot diagonally traversed his body. He walked 15 yards and fell over in a ravine. You are right, the right bullet construction and placement and you don't need nearly the energy you thought you did in youth. Sorry for the long comment but this is interesting stuff to old hunters like me.
Well thanks for that long comment because I enjoyed it. And it really made me think about how hunting has ironically changed for a lot of us here in the east. East or west there's one rule that holds true for both and that is to kill a deer you first have to see it. Hunting here traditionally was in thick cover but a lot of us figured out that rule and we look specifically for places where we can see a long ways like power lines and pipelines and because of that a lot of us have started hunting more like you used to hunt. We want high velocities, flat trajectories, and a long maximum point blank range. And while the range finder changed hunting out your way they don't really work here. We just don't have time in most places to use a range finder before a deer gets by. So while you're going to lower power cartridges like we used to use we're going to faster and faster cartridges like you used to use. I've scratched my head on getting a .257 Weatherby mag several times just because I have a couple of spots that it would be perfect for reaching over to the next ridge top. And I have a few friends that use some really fast cartridges for such places. I just thought it was ironic to hear how your cartridges of choice have changed while we're starting to use the cartridges you used to. Just a few years ago who would have imagined that cartridges like the 6.5 Creedmoor and 6.5 Grendel could be useful out west and a .257 Weatherby mag could be useful here in the south east? So thank you very much for the long comment.
I used to be the same as you. I had no use for the .270 because everyone I knew had one. I am now in the same boat as you and own 2 of them. 4 of my daughters have taken bull elk with one of my rifles. 30-06 is still my favorite but I have no problems with the .270.
I shoot either the 140g accubond or 145g Eldx for all my big game and it does the to perfection.
I haven't tried the Eldx but I have been impressed with the Accubond.
Excellent presentation on a widely misunderstood round.
Thanks Dennis, I do appreciate that.
I love my .270 Winchester especially with a hand load 130 grain ballistic tip pushed with IMR 3031
This cartridge does not need to be defended, it just works. It is a good balance between whack and shoot ability. Used this on antelope, deer, moose mainly with 140 or 150 handloads, the 130’s were too explosive for my liking.
I know a few "Professionals" that have each ran Guide Services or Hunting Camps for at least 25 years each. And they all tell a similar story. At least 90-95% of their "Clients" simply can NOT hit a 6-8 inch circle at 200 yards! At least not with any reliably.
And secondly; Those hunters that arrive toting the latest, greatest "Super Magnum" rifle (usually brand new!) can barely keep their shots on the paper at 125 yards!!!
BUT. .......
Older gents, usually from rural America, and bringing an older and well used rifle of a "Classic Cartridge" such as the .270, .308 or even .30-06 can be expected to remain calm, follow instructions AND shoot very well, will bring home a great Deer, Elk, Bear, etc. Nearly every time! 😉
In my over 40 years of hunting, I've used three different types of bullets when hunting deer. I first used Remington Core-Lokt and then Hornady Interlock bullets in my .270. When I started reloading, I used Nosler Ballistic Tips in my .270 Win. and 300 Win Mag. and I've never looked back.