Story 1: Yeah, I don't know, performing SA in game, especially when everyone is saying no (and *especially* when there's a minor at the table), sounds like pretty good justification for a ban, drinking or no
No kidding. This is a great example of the one sticking point I have with Doge: He's *too* lenient sometimes. I understand being good to others, second chances, and the sort, but sometimes it feels like he bends over backwards to say "I think the group was too harsh to Problem Player/DM"
@@JoshtheOverlander Nah its more that the types of people who watch these videos are addicted to outrage porn. While this guy was a pretty extreme example and I don't blame them for banning his ass, a LOT of times too many people here wanna play D&D in the most vanilla uptight, PC way possible and get outraged when others don't immediately shun a player that steps out of line.
It is rare I disagree with Doge, but I think the group is justified to permaban Goblin Wizard. Him drinking too much before a session with a young player shows a lack of foresight and respect. Also booze does not create something out of nothing. The desire to do something like he did was always there. I know it is just a game, but trying to do a scene like that without the consent of all involved....
This is exactly what I was thinking. SA is a hard no at my table-and in a situation like this, the person would have been told to get out the second his intentions were made clear. ESPECIALLY in front of a minor, drinking or not. He could sit and wait for his ride on the step outside. Props to the barbarian for putting an end to it.
The cowboy ninja story made my day. The idea of a guy being a murderhobo and somehow missing that the description of a maniac murdering people is him is utterly hilarious to me.
OK... murderhobos typically have a Low Tolerance policy at my table... but SA is an instant "Leave my Table...Now" offense. I will not tolerate it. Doesn't matter if it's a friend or a complete stranger. And if I have a Minor at my table... then I'm sorry... booze or no, that's crossing a line. I would do as the Dwarven Kings of Old. He had born a grudge with me and shall be recorded in the Black Book of Grudges. He must pay his penalty or hence never be welcome at my table again.
He chose to drink before game, that should have been "get out of table and go home to sober" moment, followed by "if you ever do that again, you’re permanently out". Drunk people are unpredictable and stupid, often dangerous, and especially scary to children.
The murder hobo story has the same energy as those two comic book panels featuring Joker and Red Skull. "I may be a murder hobo, but I'm not a rappist"
"That magic thing must have cut off the oxygen to your brain. I may be a murderhobo lunatic, but I'm a FEMINIST murderhobo lunatic. Keep back, boys! This creep is mine!"
... I'm kind of shook that you're okay bringing the guy who talked about "violating [the elf's] holes" back to the table. Dude, I almost expected a kitty break after that. That shit was too much.
I think it's less about actions in the moment, and more about goblin demonstrating he's a rare case of someone that CAN be fixed/saved/etc., and become a better person. Because goblin did something you don't see from anyone who's merely a terrible person; goblin DIDN'T get upset when told he was still banned despite the apology. To me, and likely to Doge as well, that implies it was genuine regret of the mistake itself, rather than "regret of being caught". And I think it's important to actually try and facililitate betterment in situations like this; a PERMANENT ban is arguably *detrimental* here, since it can just end up signaling "there's no point trying to be better, because you're still punished anyways". Personally, I would have given Goblin an "indefinite" ban; no set time limit, but the door is open to earn his way back in by proving he can be better.
Alcohol lowers your inhibitions, but doesn't make you do anything you don't want to do. That dude was feeling things out, whether or not he let everything slip before he meant to or not, he wasn't just trying to "be funny". Only creeps think SA is funny. He would've gotten worse if left in the group, killing the character and banning the player was the absolute best outcome
Ngl if I had to kick a player for trying to SA an npc captive while claiming she wanted it, and had another player saying I'd been harsh, there'd be two open spots at my table. The fact it happened in front of a 12 year old just makes it worse, doge really needs to reassess when players deserve another chance and when ties need severed for the game to continue.
@@thezerowulf2046right? Lol There are a suspicious amount of people in these stories who are perfectly open and confortable with telling a group of people (sometimes strangers) that they want to rape a character and go into very specific detail about it. Most people dont just do that lol, even if it is "only happening in a game"
I like the Cowboy Ninja story. I was guessing he was going to be a surprise villain as soon as I heard him kill the cops. That he couldnt recall the description of himself over and over? It reads like a parody film.
I don't think there's any amount of remorse that'd let me allow a person who did that to an NPC to my table. I probably wouldn't feel comfortable even being around that person anymore. If he changes, all the power to him, but he can find a new group of friends to be normal around.
1st story: People who are like that will get worse =/ he tested the waters and is only sorry cause 'he got caught' sorta reasons. Otherwise it'd become the new norm if no one said anything much less did anything. He can do better at another group at that point.
Normally, yes. But one detail throws a giantass wrench into the pattern; goblin didn't get mad when remaining banned despite the apology. People who are "only sorry they got caught" just flat out don't do that.
The story with the Goblin Wizard, I have to disagree, Doge. The fact that the man thinks r*pe is an ok thing to joke about is a big enough red flag, regardless of anything else. I’m glad that group showed the Goblin (and the kid for that matter) that SA is unacceptable. Even as a joke. This group is a good example of how to handle that, I think. As an SA survivor, if the group did not get rid of the Goblin player, I would probably have not felt comfortable playing with them anymore. And I would wonder, if the Goblin felt comfortable joking about r*pe and ignoring the consent of the party when drunk, what other boundaries is he likely to cross when drinking?
it isn't real, he should be allowed to do what he wants, but the fact a kid was there was an issue true. if he wasnt, id say it isnt hurting anyone, even if someone is being offended, it isnt hurting them.
@@oneechanknowsbest615 Firstly, no. If the GM says it's not happening, it;s not happening. Secondly, the point of playing TTRPGs in all but the most 'Beer & Pretzels' games is to immerse yourself in the game world and to put yourself into a character's headspace. You're SUPPOSED to connect to them and to their goals, motives, and decisions, so saying "It's not real," is never a valid excuse for doing awful things that no one else wants to witness or partake in. This is a social hobby and that's why the social contract matters; you don't get to just do whatever you want regardless of whether it upsets others and wanting to displays a selfish and childish mentality. Goa nd play a single-payer video game if you don't want to respect other players. Also, it's not about 'being offended'. Do you have the slightest idea how many people have been the survivors of SA? Do you really think that emotional hurt isn''t just as real as the physical kind? Because if you do, you're flat-out wrong. Please grow some empathy.
@@BlueTressym very well put. And yes, it isn’t about being offended, it’s about feelings of safety and emotional wounds, etc. Thank you for putting this all into words!
@@mellsc9412 You are most welcome! My players and I explore pretty heavy subject matter in some of the games I run and both consent and trust are vital to doing that safely.
Goblin's ban sounds justified to me, but I am someone who has zero chill for folks who try to use being drunk as an excuse for that sort of stuff. They were sober when they made the choice to start drinking after all.
The Cowboy Ninja/Katana Killer one is actually really funny. I can see why it’d be super annoying at the time, but if you play it as a comedy and instead of seriously…
Yeah, outside of super extreme cases where it's allowed (and probably a game you shouldn't be anywhere near), SA definitely sounds like a good reason to kill, boot, and ban someone from the table and game. Moreso when a kid is at the table (nevermind the terrible parenting letting them play GTA). It'll never be okay. As for the cowboy ninja, there's this almost 'purity' to his murderhoboness. He's so focused on killing, basically being in the negatives of self-awareness, so unaware of the story, and so focused on rewards that he's basically undergoing tunnel vision.
Great vid, but I think I have to disagree with banning Goblin's player being a bit harsh. He tried to assault a tied up, defenseless character in front of a *12 year old*. That is vile, my friend. I would never want to play with someone like that in a game ever again.
Story 2: all I'm seeing is SpongeBob Hall monitor episode as I listen to this story. If only the other players had seen him and said "he's just standing there MENACINGLY!"
No, it's definitely not too harsh to ban someone for that sort of behavior. It is mortifying and disgusting for them to think that would ever be acceptable; alcohol or otherwise. If anyone ever does something like that in a game I'm running, they won't only be banned from my game. They will be banned from my life. I will not associate with someone who thinks that sort of behavior is okay. There is absolutely no excuse that can justify that sort of behavior. The circumstances of this syory just make it that much worse. Alcohol may have been a factor in removing their inhibitions, but it did not make them think or behave that way. I studied psychology and currently work in a half way house/treatment facility for recovering addicts and people coming out of prison. Alcohol itself doesn't make you do anything, it just removes a filter you normally have over everything. It's just an objective focus to deflect blame onto in order to avoid accountability. Basically alcohol only has as much power as the person using it gives it. Unfortunately, that behavior is how their mind actually thinks and will choose to act when they feel like they have a justifiable excuse to do so (i.e. "the alcohol/drugs made me"). My advice for everyone would be if someone shows you who they really are, especially like this, be wise enough to believe them the first time instead of giving them the chance to to so again. The goblin player needs some serious mental therapy and alcohol addiction counseling.
Cowboy Ninja sounds like a parody hero Adult cartoon character. In a vaccum explaining the story without the context of the ttrpg aspects sounds like a show on a streaming service.
I've been watching this channel and other RPG horror stories for years now, and it's wild. Like 2% of the stories I've heard have been of women being sexually inappropriate with men, but the other 98% are men who think r*pe is a fun time in a game. With such an extreme discrepancy, I think saying "not all men" is a fairly limp excuse for a culture that has long thought a woman's bodily autonomy is a joke, and treated violating it with the kind of cruel casualness that only sociopaths have. And don't take this as me denying, se*ual assault does happen to men, it really does, however most of the men who talk about it do it to shut women up when we talk about being se*ually assaulted, not because they actually care about other men. Men's se*ual assault is used as a weapon against women rather than a genuine concern...And quite frankly I think that's kind of disgusting. If you cared about men being se*ually assaulted, you would talk about that in other places other than using it as a bludgeon against women. ❤
@@funnyblog100Citation severely needed, mate. That sounds dangerously close to incel mythology... unless you mean that it's the same guys who think SA is "funny" who blame the male victims, in which case you'd be accurate.
Nope man is rarely blamed for SA in woman on man rape. Usually, and unfortunately, hes congratulated or mocked... Yet the 'blame' is squarely on the woman who made him 'lucky.' and seduced him. At best, if he didn't "fight her off" then he wanted it... Its disgusting both ways but its not even remotely comparable.
I'm not gonna make any personal claims about the player of story 1. However i'll just say that i'm a bartender and I drink a LOT while playing DnD. The most that happens is I giggle about things that aren't that funny, i've never tried to roleplay sexual assault in a DnD campaign. To me that's kinda weird.
That cowboy ninja story reminded me of that episode of Spongebob where he goes crazy hall monitor on the whole city and eventually starts trying to find a "Maniac" that's causing problems, not realizing that he is the maniac XD
Having played in 3.5, that wasn't how we did it, Sam. That was more 1st ed AD&D if anything, but it feels like Sam and his DM just had a highly adversarial relationship.
It's really a GM/DM style. My Cyberpunk 2020 GM was exactly like this and the other players would do the same thing, stretch the limits of the rules, GM changes the rules, players stretched the rules again, rinse, repeat. I got tired of playing real quick while my husband kept playing
Goblin wizard: Sorry, but that guy should get a permabann. He drinks too much and thinks, it is acceptable to SA a woman? As a female player, I wouldn't want to sit in teh same room with someone like him. And it makes one wonder, if he would stop with a fictional character tbh...
"I have telepathy, so I know she wants it." Uh, no dude. She's an NPC, which means the DM controls what she's thinking, not you. If the DM says no, then piss off. I don't think being drunk is an excuse. I'm of the opinion that alcohol doesn't make you do things you otherwise wouldn't, it makes you okay with doing things you're normally reluctant to do. If SA is what you think about when you're drunk, it tells me that SA is something you're okay with but normally wouldn't act on. It removes inhibition, not morals.
There is a pretty big moral difference between making your goblin do that in game and doing it irl. I mean, he was disgusting but lets not over the top.
@@seto_kaiba_ Fair, I have strong opinions on the subject, but maybe that's a bit much. Still, it would never even cross my mind to do that no matter the circumstances.
@@seto_kaiba_to be fair, you already stated in another comment on this video that you played a character exactly like goblin wizard and did the same thing that he did, so of course you'd be more sympathetic to him. If I ever met someone in a d&d game that ever tried to se*ually assault another character, not only would I ban them from my table but I would ban them from my life. Men like that are not to be trusted. It's not over the top to think that r*pe is one of the most vile things a person can do to another person. You obviously have some things you need to work out.
@@K_i_t_t_y84 Yeah I had a character like Goblin wizard a while ago--albeit he didn't got THAT far. Not really relevant to my point though. Its over the top to think someone who does that in a D&D game is no different than someone who would in real life. Just because its "grape" doesn't make the logic any less stupid. Its like saying that because I like to play GTA to mow down civilians that I must have mass shooter tendencies. Now you can object to content like that in game--that's completely reasonable. My objection is that a LOT of people who watch these horror stories seem to not have a good grasp of the fact that D&D is fictional. Also, funny you make this a "men" thing given that the player in my most recent game with "grape" in their backstory is a woman.
I really like the Idea of a Murder Hobo or other that guy stepping in to save the day when someone worse threatens the party. It’s a fun narrative, it makes me feel like there’s good in everyone.
Me thinks Katana Cowboy may have had some IRL mental issues going on. That level of unawareness, forgetting or not realizing the similarities of actions you just got thru doing as yourself/ character, is one I have never encountered without some one having some mental issues IRL.
Story 1: Red Flag, good he's banned! Being drunk doesn't make you another person, it lessens your self-control. Goblin Wizard's player showed his inner demons for all to see. Best he doesn't come back. Story 2: Mudererhobo without a clue. nuff said Story 3: It's not dark humour, Josh has the mind of a child predator and banning him was only right. But he should be on a watch list for life...dear lord...what an f-ed up thing to dm...gross... Story 4: Ops Roommate took a lot of liberties, op should have squashed early on. So many red flags that it's for the best he wasn't invited back. I, too, have a great friend I like to hang out with but in game he has so much baggage my group just don't want to deal with as a group, so I can relate to op not wanting his friend back for dnd.
The second story brings up a really old rule of mine: never let other people name your superhero. If you don’t believe me ask Captain Arabia, Street Vulture and the Flower City Phantom. (The Flower City is a nickname for Rochester, NY). Fortunately none of them were mine.
Story #1 - Another case of wondering why a GM tolerated this kind of play as far as he did. Kudos to the Bugbear for stepping up and actually doing the RIGHT thing, also to the DM for backing him up, and zero sympathy for the Goblin. I do not see his drunkenness as a valid excuse, but as COMPOUNDING his behavior. IF the party ever choose to let him back, that's their decision, but an extremely short leash is in order if so. Story #2 - 'The only things that are infinite are the Universe and human stupidity. And I'm not so sure about the Universe." Albert Einstein. Story #3 - Yes, Josh should have been kicked IMMEDIATELY, if not sooner. Story #4 - Honestly, when Sam freed that Vampire-God, I would have ruled that its first act would have been to consume Sam. It'd been chained up for an age, so I'm sure it'd be hungry. It is nice that he seems to have cleaned up his act somewhat since.
Well, words can not describe how flabberghasted I am that you chose to read the Chris Aspen Incident. That's my story, posted like, right when the subreddit became a thing. Makes me curious how the stories you take from there are chosen, is it just random or is there some form of backlog?
About the last story: How can a person with 15+ years of RPG think backgrounds are useless? I've never played a fully adversarial game, but I can imagine how it can work well. I've played backstabbing evil characters in groups of good/neutral characters and I've played with other people on the same role, and it can be really fun if the DM and the PCs weave a good story to why that evil character would go along with a "good" group, and why the group would tolerate the backstabbing and how they would cope. What I can't tolerate and comprehend is how can someone roleplay all those years and never mind giving their characters complex motivations and personality. Whatever they've been playing, it's wrong.
Showing up drunk for a session shows disrespect for the table. As do idiotic antics. It's obvious that the goblin was not the problem, it's PLAYER ITAH. I suggest avoiding them until they show up with an AA 30 day chip.
I think a lot of people are forgetting why Doge thinks the first player should be allowed back. He is literally the 1% who expressed genuine remorse for what he did whereas 99% of others would die on that hill
Story 1: even is being too drunk was a legitimate excuse, which it wasn't, getting heavily intoxicated in itself was already disobeying being on good behavior while the kid was playing with them in the first place. Don't get shitfaced to play D&D with a 12yo, how hard of a concept is that to understand? That was clearly a straw that broke the camel's back type situation, where the Goblin player probably already needed banning from the group before that incident, with that making it more obvious to even the player that would go along with his antics. ...Don't even need to mention what else was wrong about all of that. Story 2: -5 modifier on all wisdom checks. Story 3: may group has had a player play underage characters and we keep the adult stuff way away from them. It's also just plain lazy and telling how common SA content in these horror stories are almost always coupled with toxic no-save/no-escape/no-input scenarios. Story 4: yeah, your character tends to feel pretty useless when you didn't even bother to read the rules apparently.
13:17 given they said they were thankful to never play with that type of player again and this guy has 0 self-awareness to even begin to change I'd argue that's a hard no...
For the cowboy ninja story, there was really no one who told him about the real identity of the "katana killer" as himself? Like, no one? In several sessions? Even outside of the game? From real person to real person? I mean, I understand the importance of roleplaying in a TTRPG, but this is criminal.
Excuse me my dude? On the first story what he was trying to do getting banned was harsh? You might have some explaining to do from your point of view on that one. Drunk or not someone who is fantasizing / wanting to do stuff like that is grounds to never want to talk to that person at least.
I’ve listened to hundreds of these stories across multiple channels. I have never once felt like any of the stories were fake. This is the first time. That cowboy ninja one stank of lies. The way it was presented, the way he starts off by saying “I know exactly when it was” even though that provides nothing for the story other than getting the listener to feel like the story is more believable. I don’t know everything about it felt fake.
If you want goblin elf NC content go find a game where that's welcome. There are ERP and NCRP games you can do this stuff and a wealth of animated, drawn and written content of it. Don't bring it into a campaign it's not welcome and not Infront of minors.
On the story about drunk goblin you asked what we would do. I personally have rules specifically against anything involving SA, with the only exception being immediate fade to black moments at my strict discretion ie pre planned moments discussed beforehand and those are rare rare rare. That and the fact that at least 2 people told him to knock it off, one of which was the DM, and he continued anyway, he would have been perma banned on the spot. But not everyone enforces player safety rules from session 0 on. That is a prime example why communicating what is and isn't ok before the game starts is so important.
Okay, I haven't finished but I do need to get this out with regards to the permabanning in story one: The guy wasn't permabanned for doing adult stuff in front of kids, he was permabanned for doing an on-screen rape in game. Period. That's basically the one line that all but the most absolute depraved groups have. Even the horniest games I've ever been in refuse to tolerate on-screen SA of any sort. As for being drunk? Well, something about what the drunk man says being what the sober man thinks. Drunkenness doesn't change your personal moral compass or your sense of right and wrong, it changes what you think people will let you get away with.
I think the perma ban was fully appropriate. He role played sexual assault in front of a child after being warned not to by everyone INCLUDING the kid.
People in the comments talking about how permabanning was "the only acceptable option" are missing the point of uncertainty here. It's not what he did *during* the campaign, but *after* that is why anyone is torn about the outcome. Goblin showed something *RARE* when discussing behavior like that; enough self-awareness to not only give a genuine apology, but then to *NOT* get upset or lash out when remaining banned anyways. THAT is a sign of someone who legitimately just made a giant mistake and regrets doing so.
SA is an instant permanent ban from my games. No exceptions. I don't care how sorry they are, no one should think that's okay or even appropriate to joke about.
In my country a lot of the rpg stigma came from a case known as the katana killer, (el asesino de la katana) so I found the use of that moniker on the second story unfortunate to say the least
Story 1: Banned for life. I would never bfing him back. Story 2: Wow!!!! Story 3: Call the police. Story 4: Come on. Inexperience is never a great reason for some of these garbage decisions.
Honestly with Goblin, I can see banning him but I would give him a chance to play again after being given a chance to think about what he did and never do it again.
lol. Given what Goblin did and the description of your character, this literally sounds like Goblin Slayer to a tee. Like if I saw this irl, you could not convince me you haven't seen Goblin Slayer.
Ive had to ban hard liquor at the table due to past games ive ran. It's nothing but a big problem and if a player has a that guy buried just beneath hard alcohol will surely draw it out.
Rare doge L. I’m 10/10 times banning goblin wizard, alcohol doesn’t make that move more redeemable, especially with a kid at the table. Plus, at that point it’s either him or the kid’s cousin, and cousin didn’t get sloshed and try to play out his non-con scene in front of a pre-teen.
That barbarian murderhobo literally had a "maybe I don't want to be the bad guy anymore" moment.
Story 1: Yeah, I don't know, performing SA in game, especially when everyone is saying no (and *especially* when there's a minor at the table), sounds like pretty good justification for a ban, drinking or no
Drinking doesn't put evil thoughts in your head. All it does is dull your ability to say no to them.
@@MWH12085SEND HIM TO DETROIT
@@MWH12085 Plus, it's ultimately a choice whether or not to start drinking in the first place.
No kidding. This is a great example of the one sticking point I have with Doge: He's *too* lenient sometimes. I understand being good to others, second chances, and the sort, but sometimes it feels like he bends over backwards to say "I think the group was too harsh to Problem Player/DM"
@@JoshtheOverlander Nah its more that the types of people who watch these videos are addicted to outrage porn. While this guy was a pretty extreme example and I don't blame them for banning his ass, a LOT of times too many people here wanna play D&D in the most vanilla uptight, PC way possible and get outraged when others don't immediately shun a player that steps out of line.
It is rare I disagree with Doge, but I think the group is justified to permaban Goblin Wizard. Him drinking too much before a session with a young player shows a lack of foresight and respect. Also booze does not create something out of nothing. The desire to do something like he did was always there. I know it is just a game, but trying to do a scene like that without the consent of all involved....
Yeah - Rape is a red line in my group. He'd have been ejected from the group mid-session.
Yep, banned instantly upon the 1st instance. @@iainhowe4561
@@iainhowe4561with force. Ejected with force.
Doge is a little too soft/understanding.
This is exactly what I was thinking. SA is a hard no at my table-and in a situation like this, the person would have been told to get out the second his intentions were made clear. ESPECIALLY in front of a minor, drinking or not. He could sit and wait for his ride on the step outside. Props to the barbarian for putting an end to it.
Goblin getting instakilled and permabanned was quite literally the only acceptable option.
Ten bucks says that guy ends up on the offender registry by the age of 30. Gives off the vibes.
The cowboy ninja story made my day. The idea of a guy being a murderhobo and somehow missing that the description of a maniac murdering people is him is utterly hilarious to me.
Spongebob moment.
@@HunterOwens-fg2ol Yeah that's what I was thinking too. LITERALLY that one episode of spongebob lmao.
He's just standing there.....
STUPIDLILY!
OK... murderhobos typically have a Low Tolerance policy at my table... but SA is an instant "Leave my Table...Now" offense. I will not tolerate it. Doesn't matter if it's a friend or a complete stranger. And if I have a Minor at my table... then I'm sorry... booze or no, that's crossing a line.
I would do as the Dwarven Kings of Old. He had born a grudge with me and shall be recorded in the Black Book of Grudges. He must pay his penalty or hence never be welcome at my table again.
He chose to drink before game, that should have been "get out of table and go home to sober" moment, followed by "if you ever do that again, you’re permanently out". Drunk people are unpredictable and stupid, often dangerous, and especially scary to children.
The murder hobo story has the same energy as those two comic book panels featuring Joker and Red Skull.
"I may be a murder hobo, but I'm not a rappist"
Professionals have standards.
"That magic thing must have cut off the oxygen to your brain. I may be a murderhobo lunatic, but I'm a FEMINIST murderhobo lunatic. Keep back, boys! This creep is mine!"
@@lexcentrique2554 that's not even being a feminist, that's just not being a rapist.
@@lexcentrique2554 he wasn't a feminist tho, he was just protecting an innocent woman
@@GarkKahn Feminists can also be respectful towards women. I mean, that's the whole idea behind the thing.
... I'm kind of shook that you're okay bringing the guy who talked about "violating [the elf's] holes" back to the table. Dude, I almost expected a kitty break after that. That shit was too much.
I think it's less about actions in the moment, and more about goblin demonstrating he's a rare case of someone that CAN be fixed/saved/etc., and become a better person.
Because goblin did something you don't see from anyone who's merely a terrible person; goblin DIDN'T get upset when told he was still banned despite the apology.
To me, and likely to Doge as well, that implies it was genuine regret of the mistake itself, rather than "regret of being caught". And I think it's important to actually try and facililitate betterment in situations like this; a PERMANENT ban is arguably *detrimental* here, since it can just end up signaling "there's no point trying to be better, because you're still punished anyways".
Personally, I would have given Goblin an "indefinite" ban; no set time limit, but the door is open to earn his way back in by proving he can be better.
Alcohol lowers your inhibitions, but doesn't make you do anything you don't want to do. That dude was feeling things out, whether or not he let everything slip before he meant to or not, he wasn't just trying to "be funny". Only creeps think SA is funny. He would've gotten worse if left in the group, killing the character and banning the player was the absolute best outcome
Honestly the guy should be permabanned from life preemptively before he does something. Because people like him WILL do something.
Ngl if I had to kick a player for trying to SA an npc captive while claiming she wanted it, and had another player saying I'd been harsh, there'd be two open spots at my table. The fact it happened in front of a 12 year old just makes it worse, doge really needs to reassess when players deserve another chance and when ties need severed for the game to continue.
Nah, the Goblin Wizard earned his ban, even while drunk what he did was disgusting.
Are you kidding me? I think the ban was HELLA justified.
Imagine thinking these stories are real 😅
@@thezerowulf2046 Star Trek isn't real but one can still have opinions on a Starfleet member's actions, yo. Chill.
@@thezerowulf2046right? Lol
There are a suspicious amount of people in these stories who are perfectly open and confortable with telling a group of people (sometimes strangers) that they want to rape a character and go into very specific detail about it. Most people dont just do that lol, even if it is "only happening in a game"
I don't think I have a character that wouldn't kill Goblin
Same-well except for my second character who was basically just like the Goblin. I also got killed by my party and I DEFINITELY deserved it. lol.
Heck, I have more than a few _villains_ from my DM days who'd've killed Goblin for that.
Drunk goblin needed to be banned. Drunk or not, no excuse for pushing SA. Besides even sober he still thought it was funny. Boundaries are important.
I like the Cowboy Ninja story. I was guessing he was going to be a surprise villain as soon as I heard him kill the cops.
That he couldnt recall the description of himself over and over?
It reads like a parody film.
And he was in college?
Press X to doubt!
@@GarkKahnNah, I graduated college. There's some dense mfers there.
I don't think there's any amount of remorse that'd let me allow a person who did that to an NPC to my table. I probably wouldn't feel comfortable even being around that person anymore. If he changes, all the power to him, but he can find a new group of friends to be normal around.
Not even the act itself, but the whole "Trust me bro she wants it"? That's an harmful mentality and it doesn't come from booze.
Cowboy ninja sounds like an AMAZING parody character!
I feel that’s one step away from Cowboys and Aliens.
1st story: People who are like that will get worse =/ he tested the waters and is only sorry cause 'he got caught' sorta reasons. Otherwise it'd become the new norm if no one said anything much less did anything. He can do better at another group at that point.
Normally, yes.
But one detail throws a giantass wrench into the pattern; goblin didn't get mad when remaining banned despite the apology.
People who are "only sorry they got caught" just flat out don't do that.
@@greyrifterrellik5837 yes they do
The story with the Goblin Wizard, I have to disagree, Doge. The fact that the man thinks r*pe is an ok thing to joke about is a big enough red flag, regardless of anything else.
I’m glad that group showed the Goblin (and the kid for that matter) that SA is unacceptable. Even as a joke. This group is a good example of how to handle that, I think. As an SA survivor, if the group did not get rid of the Goblin player, I would probably have not felt comfortable playing with them anymore. And I would wonder, if the Goblin felt comfortable joking about r*pe and ignoring the consent of the party when drunk, what other boundaries is he likely to cross when drinking?
it isn't real, he should be allowed to do what he wants, but the fact a kid was there was an issue true. if he wasnt, id say it isnt hurting anyone, even if someone is being offended, it isnt hurting them.
@@oneechanknowsbest615 Firstly, no. If the GM says it's not happening, it;s not happening. Secondly, the point of playing TTRPGs in all but the most 'Beer & Pretzels' games is to immerse yourself in the game world and to put yourself into a character's headspace. You're SUPPOSED to connect to them and to their goals, motives, and decisions, so saying "It's not real," is never a valid excuse for doing awful things that no one else wants to witness or partake in. This is a social hobby and that's why the social contract matters; you don't get to just do whatever you want regardless of whether it upsets others and wanting to displays a selfish and childish mentality. Goa nd play a single-payer video game if you don't want to respect other players. Also, it's not about 'being offended'. Do you have the slightest idea how many people have been the survivors of SA? Do you really think that emotional hurt isn''t just as real as the physical kind? Because if you do, you're flat-out wrong. Please grow some empathy.
@@BlueTressym very well put. And yes, it isn’t about being offended, it’s about feelings of safety and emotional wounds, etc. Thank you for putting this all into words!
@@mellsc9412 You are most welcome! My players and I explore pretty heavy subject matter in some of the games I run and both consent and trust are vital to doing that safely.
Goblin's ban sounds justified to me, but I am someone who has zero chill for folks who try to use being drunk as an excuse for that sort of stuff. They were sober when they made the choice to start drinking after all.
The Cowboy Ninja/Katana Killer one is actually really funny. I can see why it’d be super annoying at the time, but if you play it as a comedy and instead of seriously…
Yeah, outside of super extreme cases where it's allowed (and probably a game you shouldn't be anywhere near), SA definitely sounds like a good reason to kill, boot, and ban someone from the table and game. Moreso when a kid is at the table (nevermind the terrible parenting letting them play GTA). It'll never be okay.
As for the cowboy ninja, there's this almost 'purity' to his murderhoboness. He's so focused on killing, basically being in the negatives of self-awareness, so unaware of the story, and so focused on rewards that he's basically undergoing tunnel vision.
Great vid, but I think I have to disagree with banning Goblin's player being a bit harsh. He tried to assault a tied up, defenseless character in front of a *12 year old*. That is vile, my friend. I would never want to play with someone like that in a game ever again.
Story 2:
Katana Cowboy: Wow, you guys are good. I'm the last person I expected, but I was looking for me all the time! It's the perfect crime!
Someone didn't get the memo that the game was not F.A.T.A.L.
Story 2: all I'm seeing is SpongeBob Hall monitor episode as I listen to this story. If only the other players had seen him and said "he's just standing there MENACINGLY!"
I was thinking the episode Peanuts where Patrick arrests himself for throwing a peanut at the clam and says “It’s the perfect crime.”
No, it's definitely not too harsh to ban someone for that sort of behavior. It is mortifying and disgusting for them to think that would ever be acceptable; alcohol or otherwise. If anyone ever does something like that in a game I'm running, they won't only be banned from my game. They will be banned from my life. I will not associate with someone who thinks that sort of behavior is okay. There is absolutely no excuse that can justify that sort of behavior. The circumstances of this syory just make it that much worse. Alcohol may have been a factor in removing their inhibitions, but it did not make them think or behave that way.
I studied psychology and currently work in a half way house/treatment facility for recovering addicts and people coming out of prison. Alcohol itself doesn't make you do anything, it just removes a filter you normally have over everything. It's just an objective focus to deflect blame onto in order to avoid accountability. Basically alcohol only has as much power as the person using it gives it.
Unfortunately, that behavior is how their mind actually thinks and will choose to act when they feel like they have a justifiable excuse to do so (i.e. "the alcohol/drugs made me"). My advice for everyone would be if someone shows you who they really are, especially like this, be wise enough to believe them the first time instead of giving them the chance to to so again. The goblin player needs some serious mental therapy and alcohol addiction counseling.
No douge, RPing SA is a perfectly valid reason for banning somebody. Please stop making the case to talk to these people for the sake of a game.
Cowboy Ninja sounds like a parody hero Adult cartoon character. In a vaccum explaining the story without the context of the ttrpg aspects sounds like a show on a streaming service.
Funny in an edgy way!? In what universe is rape funny!? And has anyone noticed it's always guys who think sexual assault is just *hilarious?*
Not really I think there are a lot of double standards. If woman rapes and abused a man the man is often blamed.
I've been watching this channel and other RPG horror stories for years now, and it's wild. Like 2% of the stories I've heard have been of women being sexually inappropriate with men, but the other 98% are men who think r*pe is a fun time in a game.
With such an extreme discrepancy, I think saying "not all men" is a fairly limp excuse for a culture that has long thought a woman's bodily autonomy is a joke, and treated violating it with the kind of cruel casualness that only sociopaths have.
And don't take this as me denying, se*ual assault does happen to men, it really does, however most of the men who talk about it do it to shut women up when we talk about being se*ually assaulted, not because they actually care about other men. Men's se*ual assault is used as a weapon against women rather than a genuine concern...And quite frankly I think that's kind of disgusting.
If you cared about men being se*ually assaulted, you would talk about that in other places other than using it as a bludgeon against women. ❤
@@funnyblog100Citation severely needed, mate. That sounds dangerously close to incel mythology... unless you mean that it's the same guys who think SA is "funny" who blame the male victims, in which case you'd be accurate.
@@solosynapse I mean the latter.
Nope man is rarely blamed for SA in woman on man rape. Usually, and unfortunately, hes congratulated or mocked...
Yet the 'blame' is squarely on the woman who made him 'lucky.' and seduced him. At best, if he didn't "fight her off" then he wanted it...
Its disgusting both ways but its not even remotely comparable.
I'm not gonna make any personal claims about the player of story 1. However i'll just say that i'm a bartender and I drink a LOT while playing DnD. The most that happens is I giggle about things that aren't that funny, i've never tried to roleplay sexual assault in a DnD campaign. To me that's kinda weird.
I have not laughed this hard at an RPG Horror story in a while. The Katana Killer's amazing lack of self-awareness is incredible.
Yeah, I'm not going to justify SA at my table, Goblin had to go.
Cowboy Ninja is so ridiculous, I wonder if the player knew exactly what he was doing and it was some kind of elaborate troll
That cowboy ninja story reminded me of that episode of Spongebob where he goes crazy hall monitor on the whole city and eventually starts trying to find a "Maniac" that's causing problems, not realizing that he is the maniac XD
Having played in 3.5, that wasn't how we did it, Sam. That was more 1st ed AD&D if anything, but it feels like Sam and his DM just had a highly adversarial relationship.
Exactly. I have been DM for MANY 3.5 campaigns, and it was always cooperative
Having played in 1st ed, I can confirm that it's not an "edition" thing, it's a "teenage edgelord" thing. Most of us grow out of it.
It's really a GM/DM style. My Cyberpunk 2020 GM was exactly like this and the other players would do the same thing, stretch the limits of the rules, GM changes the rules, players stretched the rules again, rinse, repeat. I got tired of playing real quick while my husband kept playing
Goblin wizard: Sorry, but that guy should get a permabann. He drinks too much and thinks, it is acceptable to SA a woman? As a female player, I wouldn't want to sit in teh same room with someone like him. And it makes one wonder, if he would stop with a fictional character tbh...
"I have telepathy, so I know she wants it." Uh, no dude. She's an NPC, which means the DM controls what she's thinking, not you. If the DM says no, then piss off. I don't think being drunk is an excuse. I'm of the opinion that alcohol doesn't make you do things you otherwise wouldn't, it makes you okay with doing things you're normally reluctant to do. If SA is what you think about when you're drunk, it tells me that SA is something you're okay with but normally wouldn't act on. It removes inhibition, not morals.
There is a pretty big moral difference between making your goblin do that in game and doing it irl. I mean, he was disgusting but lets not over the top.
@@seto_kaiba_ Fair, I have strong opinions on the subject, but maybe that's a bit much. Still, it would never even cross my mind to do that no matter the circumstances.
@@seto_kaiba_to be fair, you already stated in another comment on this video that you played a character exactly like goblin wizard and did the same thing that he did, so of course you'd be more sympathetic to him.
If I ever met someone in a d&d game that ever tried to se*ually assault another character, not only would I ban them from my table but I would ban them from my life. Men like that are not to be trusted.
It's not over the top to think that r*pe is one of the most vile things a person can do to another person. You obviously have some things you need to work out.
@@K_i_t_t_y84 Yeah I had a character like Goblin wizard a while ago--albeit he didn't got THAT far. Not really relevant to my point though. Its over the top to think someone who does that in a D&D game is no different than someone who would in real life. Just because its "grape" doesn't make the logic any less stupid. Its like saying that because I like to play GTA to mow down civilians that I must have mass shooter tendencies. Now you can object to content like that in game--that's completely reasonable. My objection is that a LOT of people who watch these horror stories seem to not have a good grasp of the fact that D&D is fictional. Also, funny you make this a "men" thing given that the player in my most recent game with "grape" in their backstory is a woman.
@@seto_kaiba_ nothing justifies that, but whatever helps you sleep at night.
I really like the Idea of a Murder Hobo or other that guy stepping in to save the day when someone worse threatens the party. It’s a fun narrative, it makes me feel like there’s good in everyone.
Me thinks Katana Cowboy may have had some IRL mental issues going on. That level of unawareness, forgetting or not realizing the similarities of actions you just got thru doing as yourself/ character, is one I have never encountered without some one having some mental issues IRL.
That first story? Nah fuck that shit, I would NOT allow that at my table, especially if a kid is at the table. Drunk or not, that’s not okay.
Just a reminder that a drunk tongue speaks a sober mind. He definitely had thought about stuff like that before the session. Permaban was appropriate.
Cowboy Ninja: the "hero" that city doesn't need or deserve right now.
It almost seemed like goblin wizard was just the friend of the barbarian and barb went with it just to ride with his buddy until things went too far.
Story 1: Red Flag, good he's banned! Being drunk doesn't make you another person, it lessens your self-control. Goblin Wizard's player showed his inner demons for all to see. Best he doesn't come back.
Story 2: Mudererhobo without a clue. nuff said
Story 3: It's not dark humour, Josh has the mind of a child predator and banning him was only right. But he should be on a watch list for life...dear lord...what an f-ed up thing to dm...gross...
Story 4: Ops Roommate took a lot of liberties, op should have squashed early on. So many red flags that it's for the best he wasn't invited back. I, too, have a great friend I like to hang out with but in game he has so much baggage my group just don't want to deal with as a group, so I can relate to op not wanting his friend back for dnd.
The second story brings up a really old rule of mine: never let other people name your superhero. If you don’t believe me ask Captain Arabia, Street Vulture and the Flower City Phantom. (The Flower City is a nickname for Rochester, NY). Fortunately none of them were mine.
Flower City Phantom actually goes kinda hard
The bugbear barbarian: "am a villian not a monster"
CowboyNinja trying to find "Katana Killer" is LITERALLY A SPONGEBOB EPISODE
Story #1 - Another case of wondering why a GM tolerated this kind of play as far as he did. Kudos to the Bugbear for stepping up and actually doing the RIGHT thing, also to the DM for backing him up, and zero sympathy for the Goblin. I do not see his drunkenness as a valid excuse, but as COMPOUNDING his behavior. IF the party ever choose to let him back, that's their decision, but an extremely short leash is in order if so.
Story #2 - 'The only things that are infinite are the Universe and human stupidity. And I'm not so sure about the Universe." Albert Einstein.
Story #3 - Yes, Josh should have been kicked IMMEDIATELY, if not sooner.
Story #4 - Honestly, when Sam freed that Vampire-God, I would have ruled that its first act would have been to consume Sam. It'd been chained up for an age, so I'm sure it'd be hungry. It is nice that he seems to have cleaned up his act somewhat since.
The cowboy ninja guy is a personifcation of the "Who killed Hannibal?" bit from The Eric Andre Show.
Cowboy be like: “Wait a minute Patrick, I'm the Katana Killer!”
The Cowboy Ninja story is something I would totally understand
Well, words can not describe how flabberghasted I am that you chose to read the Chris Aspen Incident. That's my story, posted like, right when the subreddit became a thing. Makes me curious how the stories you take from there are chosen, is it just random or is there some form of backlog?
Reminds me of the Hall Monitor episode of SpongeBob where SpongeBob and Patrick were hunting down a lunatic, not realising it was SpongeBob.
About the last story: How can a person with 15+ years of RPG think backgrounds are useless?
I've never played a fully adversarial game, but I can imagine how it can work well. I've played backstabbing evil characters in groups of good/neutral characters and I've played with other people on the same role, and it can be really fun if the DM and the PCs weave a good story to why that evil character would go along with a "good" group, and why the group would tolerate the backstabbing and how they would cope.
What I can't tolerate and comprehend is how can someone roleplay all those years and never mind giving their characters complex motivations and personality.
Whatever they've been playing, it's wrong.
Makes me wonder if they're one of those people who calls text-based RP with no actual rules "D&D."
Getting a "Patrick, I'm the maniac" vibe from story 2.
Showing up drunk for a session shows disrespect for the table. As do idiotic antics. It's obvious that the goblin was not the problem, it's PLAYER ITAH. I suggest avoiding them until they show up with an AA 30 day chip.
Perma banning a player for trying to rape an npc is a bit harsh you heard it here first
Coyboy Ninja is literally Spongebob from the hall monitor episode.
The goblin wizard deserved a punishment worse than a ban.
Maybe the real Katana Killer was the friends we made along the way.
I think a lot of people are forgetting why Doge thinks the first player should be allowed back. He is literally the 1% who expressed genuine remorse for what he did whereas 99% of others would die on that hill
Good for Barbarian Murderhobo. He saw that shit was fucked and he was like "Nope, I'm done with this."
Murder hobo SAVES the game?
Ima buy a lotto ticket and wait for the end of the world
Story 1: even is being too drunk was a legitimate excuse, which it wasn't, getting heavily intoxicated in itself was already disobeying being on good behavior while the kid was playing with them in the first place. Don't get shitfaced to play D&D with a 12yo, how hard of a concept is that to understand? That was clearly a straw that broke the camel's back type situation, where the Goblin player probably already needed banning from the group before that incident, with that making it more obvious to even the player that would go along with his antics. ...Don't even need to mention what else was wrong about all of that.
Story 2: -5 modifier on all wisdom checks.
Story 3: may group has had a player play underage characters and we keep the adult stuff way away from them. It's also just plain lazy and telling how common SA content in these horror stories are almost always coupled with toxic no-save/no-escape/no-input scenarios.
Story 4: yeah, your character tends to feel pretty useless when you didn't even bother to read the rules apparently.
13:17 given they said they were thankful to never play with that type of player again and this guy has 0 self-awareness to even begin to change I'd argue that's a hard no...
Cowboy Ninja's story is basically that SpongeBob moment where he's trying to find the Maniac (that was him).
For the cowboy ninja story, there was really no one who told him about the real identity of the "katana killer" as himself? Like, no one? In several sessions? Even outside of the game? From real person to real person?
I mean, I understand the importance of roleplaying in a TTRPG, but this is criminal.
What can say about the first story other than Spock's immortal words:
"Only Nixon could go to China"
Excuse me my dude? On the first story what he was trying to do getting banned was harsh? You might have some explaining to do from your point of view on that one. Drunk or not someone who is fantasizing / wanting to do stuff like that is grounds to never want to talk to that person at least.
I’ve listened to hundreds of these stories across multiple channels. I have never once felt like any of the stories were fake.
This is the first time.
That cowboy ninja one stank of lies. The way it was presented, the way he starts off by saying “I know exactly when it was” even though that provides nothing for the story other than getting the listener to feel like the story is more believable. I don’t know everything about it felt fake.
Story 2: The murder hobo sounds like he used up both his brain cells to make his character.
If you want goblin elf NC content go find a game where that's welcome. There are ERP and NCRP games you can do this stuff and a wealth of animated, drawn and written content of it. Don't bring it into a campaign it's not welcome and not Infront of minors.
On the story about drunk goblin you asked what we would do. I personally have rules specifically against anything involving SA, with the only exception being immediate fade to black moments at my strict discretion ie pre planned moments discussed beforehand and those are rare rare rare. That and the fact that at least 2 people told him to knock it off, one of which was the DM, and he continued anyway, he would have been perma banned on the spot. But not everyone enforces player safety rules from session 0 on. That is a prime example why communicating what is and isn't ok before the game starts is so important.
Doge, have you considered Kitties in3-D! I think the world is ready.
all the rpg horror story channels I watch have done the first story now and yet I watch each and every one of them just to hear their reaction lol
Okay, I haven't finished but I do need to get this out with regards to the permabanning in story one:
The guy wasn't permabanned for doing adult stuff in front of kids, he was permabanned for doing an on-screen rape in game. Period. That's basically the one line that all but the most absolute depraved groups have. Even the horniest games I've ever been in refuse to tolerate on-screen SA of any sort.
As for being drunk? Well, something about what the drunk man says being what the sober man thinks. Drunkenness doesn't change your personal moral compass or your sense of right and wrong, it changes what you think people will let you get away with.
Story 2 and 3: Intelligence was the player's dump stat.
I think the perma ban was fully appropriate. He role played sexual assault in front of a child after being warned not to by everyone INCLUDING the kid.
Last story: When problem player asked for a reward the monster should've killed him or something like in some movies to punish him
People in the comments talking about how permabanning was "the only acceptable option" are missing the point of uncertainty here.
It's not what he did *during* the campaign, but *after* that is why anyone is torn about the outcome.
Goblin showed something *RARE* when discussing behavior like that; enough self-awareness to not only give a genuine apology, but then to *NOT* get upset or lash out when remaining banned anyways. THAT is a sign of someone who legitimately just made a giant mistake and regrets doing so.
SA is an instant permanent ban from my games. No exceptions. I don't care how sorry they are, no one should think that's okay or even appropriate to joke about.
In my country a lot of the rpg stigma came from a case known as the katana killer, (el asesino de la katana) so I found the use of that moniker on the second story unfortunate to say the least
2nd story cowninja was playing Groo the barbarian lol
I would have just turned in the goblin and bugbear to the town since they killed their leader.
High school? Doge I have to wonder how the clueless edgelord made it out of elementary school.
Story 1: Banned for life. I would never bfing him back.
Story 2: Wow!!!!
Story 3: Call the police.
Story 4: Come on. Inexperience is never a great reason for some of these garbage decisions.
Story 1: I don't think DM was harsh in perma banning at all. The dude tried to perform SA in game in front of a child.
1st story: "Just because you're a "badguy', doesn't mean you're a bad guy."
Anyone else thing the first story sounds like Al Bruno III's Binder of Shame?
Honestly with Goblin, I can see banning him but I would give him a chance to play again after being given a chance to think about what he did and never do it again.
My Paladin would've done the same thing. 1) He's a Oath of Vengeance type Paladin and 2) he HATES goblins (
And no I have not seen Goblin Slayer
lol. Given what Goblin did and the description of your character, this literally sounds like Goblin Slayer to a tee. Like if I saw this irl, you could not convince me you haven't seen Goblin Slayer.
@@seto_kaiba_ I've read a few chapters of the Manga but never saw the anime.
Murderhobo with standards? Based!
Ive had to ban hard liquor at the table due to past games ive ran. It's nothing but a big problem and if a player has a that guy buried just beneath hard alcohol will surely draw it out.
Story 3: this is why I make all of my characters around my age or older, or at least make them be adults according to their race’s descriptions
21:50 - as a 3.5 veteran, no it very much was not.
Where's my breakfast!
NO! THAT'S NOT HOW 3.5 WAS BACK IN THE DAY! THAT GROUP WAS JUST SHIT! ESPECIALLY THE DM!
Rare doge L. I’m 10/10 times banning goblin wizard, alcohol doesn’t make that move more redeemable, especially with a kid at the table. Plus, at that point it’s either him or the kid’s cousin, and cousin didn’t get sloshed and try to play out his non-con scene in front of a pre-teen.
No. Banning the goblin player was not too harsh.