LEGIT fantastic info, and thank you for mentioning 3d files and 3d prints. Disney C&D'd my Darth Vader Red Bull Koozie on Thingiverse, so I know all about the Mouse Muscle.
Or as Ryan Zanfei of Tasty Peach Studios once said to me at a panel I attended at MatsuriCon this year: “Stay away from Disney... the mouse will eat you”
Thanks so much for the info Bill!! Super good timing too bc we are in the process of getting into props and costumes and had worries about this exact thing 😁
This was crazy perfect timing!! I was just asking myself this question and reached out to a copyright/trademark lawyer today to try and get feedback and then hopped onto youtube and your video was on my feed! Thank you for your experience and sharing your thoughts!! I will definitely still consult a law professional as you said but this was a overview with some fantastic points! Thank you! You ROCK!!!!
honestly, i think the safest bet is simply doing one-off commissioned pieces, and keeping all templates/molds if need be. i'm more on the sewing side of cosplaying, at least when it comes to what i'm likely to sell, so if i were to take an order for a Link costume, draft the patterns, etc then that's a one off. if someone else sees that costume and says "hey i want one too!" then it's easy to simply make another one without it being a mass production line. every item is made to order. that way you're also not getting bogged down in unsold matterial cost. back when it first aired, i made about a dozen attack on titan uniforms. sunk a lot of money into the fabrics, and sold 2 jackets and 4 capes. so those other coats just ended up being given away because no one would buy them. doing everything on a made to order basis, with examples of your previous work, is simply safer. that's how most chinese costume shops operate and use the "one off commission" thing as their work around.
how do places like rpc studio work? they are super open about not having the rights to marvel stuff but they make a fortune and its a well known big store
Solid advice and another reason you guys are successful where others have fallen away. Integrity and decency... and just being nice... they really go a long way. Kudos to you guys.
I once got a C&D letter from a company for selling something that was listed in the description as "Not a XXXX" they didnt like that their product was mentioned. It was weird, the form letter they sent was super harsh and legal, i just emailed them back very politely and asked what I could do to make them happy. The response i received was certainly written by a human and not a lawyer, so after a couple email exchanges it all worked out, I got to keep my listing just had to change the wording around a bit. But even still it was a big company and they just went looking for anything with their name in it, even if it was used in comparison to their product.
I was selling a vintage knock off, I didnt want buyers to think they were buying an original, sure it was old but it was an old fake. I was up front, i dont see that as being scummy.
Grateful for this post. My son, age 16, and on the Autistic Spectrum, is just getting involved in cosplay. We've watched a lot of prop tutorials and really like your format. My son loves crafting these things and frankly, he's good at it. I can see him maybe earning a little on etsy and finding a job can be hard on the spectrum so this would be great. With a couple of other makers I've had him write and ask if he can sell props he makes with their patterns. I think learning not to step on toes right from the beginning is super important. Some people will say no; that's inevitable. But many will say "sure, no problem." And frankly, those are the makers we want to support anyway. Thanks for sharing!
Sound advice Bill, most people don't understand that like with anything, if its worth doing and you have a passion for it, and wish to make a business modeled around that passion. You are absolutely running a risk and should have if not before weighed the level of that risk. I truly appreciate the content you put out there and can't wait to see you start delving more into your own creative properties.
Same goes for vinyl cutting decals. When I first started making decals I decided up front to purchase several "TM" logos via cds. It served me well with lots of sports orientated cut that I did though it did cost in the beginning. Great info video.
Very fair, honest and informative information. Your correct in your assessments of these company’s assets. They are not going to consider what your doing stealing from them unless you 1 make bad products 2 they choose to start making similar ones. 3 you are making substantial money from this enterprise The only thing I think you missed was that there is a difference between the fist to come up with something and the first to copyright or trademark something. This goes in part with company’s contesting your claims in order for the value of there existing intellectual property’s to decrease in value
I have never seen anyone in the fan based community of props, toys, and collectibles take as much, if not MORE, time to contribute back to the community as much as they do worry about making money. Your talents are most impressive, but man, I agree with another comment I see below, your heart of gold is what makes you the man you are. That truly "giving" mentality you have is really going to fuel taking "Punished Props" to the next level I think. I would love to some day work with/for a company with a person such as yourself at the helm.
I create crochet patterns and I run into these same issues. Some people are selling obviously copyrighted/licensed work for money. I thought about doing it because it's easy to be inspired by what you love, but it's not legal, so if I do a project out of love, I just put it for free. This way, basically 0 risk for me as a C&D would only make me take it down, not lose my market. Great video! Can't wait for the next one!
Refreshing to see someone who doesn't feel entitled, like they just automatically have the right to use someone else's IP and shame on the company for being mean and enforcing it. This was a very good video, respectful and helpful at the same time.
As a maker and business owner I really respect you guys for putting this out there. You are pillars in the community and your wisdom is valuable for makers. Many thanks for all you do.
I was reading your comments and saw you pretty much reply to Everyone! Wow, I already loved your videos and channel (it's what I watch sometimes when working in my shop on props) but as a content creator on RUclips I respect your dedication to your fanbase so much more. A lot of RUclipsrs just splash vids, and tell people to like, comment, then never read or reply to them. Keep up the Amazing work!!!👍🏻
The comments on our videos have been incredibly helpful and valuable. The least I can do is try to get back to as many fantastic people as possible. =)
Great video, Bill! I often toy with the idea of monetizing my prop making, but know that it’s a whole shwack of grey areas. Great to hear your thoughts and experience on the matter.
Amazing video Bill ! It's great that you cover the legal issues of Prop making , it's something people forget way too often , it was very instructive !
Thanks for this video, there is a lot of good things to think about in it! I've been watching you for a while and it's been awesome and inspiring to see your business grow, it's been inspiring for my own journey. I am lucky that my husband actually just graduated law school, focusing on IP law. It's good to have a lawyer on retainer haha
Very good information! Just recently I was wondering how these type of things were viewed from a legal sense. As usual, your video was most informative. Keep up the great work!
Just found this video and I'm so glad I did. I'm just getting into the maker hobby with aspirations of making it into a dream job. I found this video extremely insightful and full of positive reinforcement.
Yup. I got a cease and desist letter for hand made Nuka Cola cap necklaces on Etsy. They'd rather have you spend more for licensed plastic at Hot Topic. I'm okay with that. Plenty of other things out there to make.
Super late reply, but what about all of the lightsaber prop manufacturers across the world? There are dozens of companies who entire businesses run by making working lightsaber prop replicas. (mostly canon hilts) And you don't see Lucasfilm or Disney going after them. Strange, isn't it, Bill?
Thank so much for making this video!!! I am prop maker and I want to start selling some things was wondering this very same thing!! Great video, thank you for helping us aspiring makers and the community as a whole, you're amazing!! 😃🙌🏼
This is a great video and jogs my memory of writing how-to books on making chainmail a long time ago . . . in one of those books I was using images from the internet, chopping them up but still they weren't mine and I was feeling uncomfortable about doing this . . .so great ideas, thanks
Rando comment, You have been awesome about answering back when I comment on your videos. I just wanna say thanks and appreciate it. I plan on using your store just because you are so attentive to your fans. Thanks again
Thanks that is just perfect timing I was setting up a small business plan to sell small props on Etsy and this is showing what I could do. Luckily my mom is a lawyer so I can talk to her about this stuff.
This is becoming a bigger and bigger deal in some areas in the toy market. Transformers "3rd party toys" have been getting more and more brave over the years and have even began to branch out to other IPs (overwatch and TMNT to name a few) and we are starting to see the first push backs from the toy company's. I feel with the lowering of costs on 3D printers IP holders are starting to look much closer into things that a few years ago might have slid under the radar. I think as a fandom of certain creators ( I.E. Punished Props etc) we need to really start embracing original ideas and designs more to help keep moving in a positive direction.
Ohhh yes things have definitely changed in the past few years and they will continue to change going forward. I'm very interested to see if any actual legislation changing cases will emerge.
While what you say about embracing original ideas and designs makes a lot of sense in theory, the reality is that most people aren't interested in buying something new and original. What most people want are replicas of things they've seen from their favorite shows, movies, games, or anime; they want something that's recognizable to them as X from Y, not something they've seen or heard of before, no matter how cool it might be. I think that the closest to making something new and original that would sell would be an original design from an existing universe but not seen in the original media. For example, instead of making a copy of something seen in Mass Effect, make and sell something that looks like it's from the Mass Effect universe but is not actually something from the game.
Technically, the art style _can_ be trademarked (it's called "trade dress". See Apple vs Samsung lawsuit over trade dress. Depending on the company, licensing is easy and relatively cheap, especially if your product doesn't directly compete with their product(s). My rule of thumb (aka golden rule): if it was your original design, and someone else selling copies (or derivative work) at a profit, would you want a cut? If yes, you probably should get a license. I'm not a lawyer, but I have designed original products, and done copyright and trademark applications, and some of the products I've designed are licensed (for logos). Licensing is not rocket science (and much easier than coming up with original designs that will actually sell). There are loopholes for commissioned work - but they can be tricky.
When I hear of companies that take this type of stance, I stop buying from them and notify my friends of their actions. Of course I use common sense when deciding if they were justified. But for the most part, we as consumers have a choice individually and a voice when joined together. Whether they choose to listen is up to them.
As Someone who has wanted to get into prop building for a long time this is extremely helpful to know and I appreciate your time putting this out. As you said I know you're not a law person but still having a maker as established as yourself talking about these types of things it's very informative.
It sucks that some companies will C&D things that they have ZERO intention of providing. I went to an adult-aimed Harry Potter themed sleepaway camp, it only ran the once because WB sent the organizer a C&D.
Hey! New here and hooked to the channel :) Just thought I'd say thank you, for your quirky humor and your total professionalism. From my point ov view, and probably for a lot of cosplayers, you guys are living the dream (!!!) . I love how you managed to both inform and put things into perspective here. Would totally love to see your designs!
This is a worrying topic to tackle if ever you do fall into the hands of a law suit. Hopefully it doesnt happen at all. Considering we are just fans from the props we make, glad to stumble on this video. It's very important coming from creatives.
I am not a cosplay maker, but rather a n ex-game dev who dabbles in making. What you have offered here, in this video, is in my mind is solid advice and to be honest, made me respect you even more. You kept the topic honest and straight forward. These are good thoughts for anyone to keep in mind. Thank you.
Amazing video with lots of great info. I do a scale plastic model videos on RUclips when I was for some time using copyright music. When RUclips allowed me to start making money I went back and cut out all that music and then paid for my very own music.. this gave me 100% ownership of my content but also supported another maker at the same time. I also only build model kits that are legit licensed products. Great video and keep em coming
Thank you so much for this video, helps a lot to see things in a good and professional way! :) Had an Etsy item takedown due to intellectual property, I reacted like any person making things should do when confronted to a big compagny... Send nices words, apologised and tried to see if we could make an agreement! Also, how can we share works done thanks to your Foamsmith books? Just wondering, I gess there is lots of entries but I know a while back there was a way to send you pics of full cosplay! ;)
Might be worth doing a video about chasing other people on copyright. I know Miss Monster (who makes fecking nice stuff) has a lot of issues with people cloning her work.
Over on the RPF, and I believe many other props and costuming communities, recasting seriously frowned upon and known recasters are called out by name for the entire community to know not to deal with them.
I mean more in the legal things you should do. If its not something you've dealt with before, its all too easy to go from "hey, thats my stuff" to insult slinging and making the situation worse than if you just went the legal route.
I suppose that would depend on what exactly you, or someone else, is making that's being copied. If, for example, you're making replica sets of Stormtrooper armor and someone is making recasts and selling them as their own, there's not much you can do from a legal standpoint since what you're doing is not legal either. So trying to make a legal matter out of it would just get you in trouble as well. If, on the other hand, you're making something completely original and someone is copying it, you could send them a C&D, but for that to work you'd to have an actual lawyer at your disposal in case the recaster decides to call your bluff and ignore your C&D. I will add that the RPF is a pretty large community and if anyone is outed as a recaster there, almost no one from the RPF will do business with them ever again. Also, since many members of the RPF are members of other similar groups, they'll pass on the word to their other group(s) and the recaster will end up being shunned by the greater props and costuming community. This means that they'll only get business from the handful of people not associated with some prop &/or costuming site/group and the people who are only casually into this hobby. The former, I think, is a pretty small number of people, esp. when compared to number of people who would be a part of the overall community, and the latter are not likely to be willing to pay the prices that people (including recasters) generally charge for their replicas.
you could make something close to what it is that someone else makes but there can be differences in it the way it looks.. or have it in different colors.. but have it slightly different.. but i would rather just make my own stuff from what i think up.. maybe drawing off a little bit of everything but mostly it would be my own imaginative work... if it would be your own work.. thats your business
Thanks for this! I ended up finding this video as I started making polymer clay mini jason masks, and had dreams of soon making video game clay miniatures and dioramas, etc. Getting into all this, I had no idea that fan art is "illegal" basically, and I was pretty upset. Basically all my artistic plans were based on someone else's IP. I kept looking around at all these creators I respect and have followed for so long and wondering, well how come they're allowed to do all this? After watching your video it seems like, you CAN do it, treading as carefully and respectfully as possible, but if "they" tell you to stop, you must? I'm not sure where to go from here, but thank you for the informative video!
Brilliant video! I got hit with a couple of c&d's from 2 game companies recently after they clearly combed through etsy. It's not fun, but you accept it and move on. As annoying as it can be as a maker, it's the best way forward I think.
I used to sell handmade pins of Boku no Hero Academia (with my fan art on it) for like 5$ and I got a cease and desist after selling like one. Some company are really strict...
*Wall-O-Text!* Just do the work as 'commissions'. Customers can only buy one item at a time and there is a waiting period while you 'make the item'. It doesn't matter if you already have 20 made and can ship the next day; they can only buy one at a time and they have to wait a week or two to get it. Doing it that way implies you're making the items one at a time and your volume is small. I know this works because I do it with bisque Jumeau dolls. I have an original set of 1907 molds I bought at an auction years ago and I use them to make 3d printed copies. I also have a period-correct slip and resin formulas so the castings I make are as good as the original dolls. The reason I'm posting is because a several Japanese conglomerate of doll artisans bought every Jumeau mold they could find and they are trying to make the dolls a 'Japanese only' sort of thing. Some of these dolls can sell for as much as $2500 so there is a big demand and a stiff market for the originals. Most of the stuff people see on eBay are cheap knock-offs, btw.
I'm not sure the same amount of risk would apply to using this strategy for selling copies of things from more contemporary properties with more litigious copyright holders.
Punished Props thanks Bill , I agree with your sharing philosophy, the old saying a gardener that shares will have the best garden , ie you’ll get more seeds back from sharing than not. It’s still shocking how resistant people are to sharing , . I’ll have to keep looking, I won’t be working in the prop industry, but am trying to be better at promotion as an artist, something I’m woeful at, If anyone has any videos on promoting yourself please share , thanks
Any idea which companies besides Disney have a notoriety for C&D Orders? I'm not asking for people to talk shit, what I am asking in the name of protecting my business, as well as respecting the rights owner and stay away from their material.
less big companies, but i've heard the creators of homestuck and undertale can be kind of copywrite strict when it comes to selling items. i know the creator of FNAF wanted people to get permission before selling items, back before merch was in every toy store. he basically told me when i asked that one-off commissions and things were okay, but that building things in bulk wouldn't really be accepted.
I'm not an expert, but my understanding is that copyright laws in Japan are quite a bit more strict than other countries. Using artwork that is owned by a Japanese company has a greater chance of being struck down.
Great advice. The whole "intellectual property" issue is bound to reach a tipping point though. There's too much of a grey area legally for a lot of it. Imagine Disney trying to sue someone for making and selling Mjolnir (Thor's hammer) replicas. Disney owns Marvel and all its designs yes, but Thor and his hammer are part of Norse mythology. Can't copyright historical or mythological characters.
Punished Props Yeah if you completely duplicate their designs I could see there being a problem. But my thought is how close to their design is too close before they are just nitpicking you know?
Part of the answer to this question is who has the bigger legal department. Short of your being Microsoft, it will be Disney. If they decide to sue you wholesale about it, it won't matter if you're in the green, because you can't afford a suitable defense.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
LEGIT fantastic info, and thank you for mentioning 3d files and 3d prints. Disney C&D'd my Darth Vader Red Bull Koozie on Thingiverse, so I know all about the Mouse Muscle.
Do NOT upset the mouse!
Or as Ryan Zanfei of Tasty Peach Studios once said to me at a panel I attended at MatsuriCon this year: “Stay away from Disney... the mouse will eat you”
All hail our mouse overlord
Not surprising to see that House of Mouse hasn't lost it's faux niceness just like old (allegedly) racist, sexist Uncle Walt.
Solid advice for all creative business people!
Truth!
I love you
As a channel
You must follow the trump business model?
hi robin
Thanks so much for the info Bill!! Super good timing too bc we are in the process of getting into props and costumes and had worries about this exact thing 😁
For sure you guys! Happy to help out. =D
@@punishedprops They blew up
This was crazy perfect timing!! I was just asking myself this question and reached out to a copyright/trademark lawyer today to try and get feedback and then hopped onto youtube and your video was on my feed! Thank you for your experience and sharing your thoughts!! I will definitely still consult a law professional as you said but this was a overview with some fantastic points! Thank you! You ROCK!!!!
Excellent idea reaching out to a lawyer. =D
Cosplay Apprentice This is making me excited for your future
Thanks for making this, all of this info is super important and helpful!
You're welcome Jake!
Jake! I watch your channel, you’re awesome!
honestly, i think the safest bet is simply doing one-off commissioned pieces, and keeping all templates/molds if need be. i'm more on the sewing side of cosplaying, at least when it comes to what i'm likely to sell, so if i were to take an order for a Link costume, draft the patterns, etc then that's a one off. if someone else sees that costume and says "hey i want one too!" then it's easy to simply make another one without it being a mass production line. every item is made to order. that way you're also not getting bogged down in unsold matterial cost. back when it first aired, i made about a dozen attack on titan uniforms. sunk a lot of money into the fabrics, and sold 2 jackets and 4 capes. so those other coats just ended up being given away because no one would buy them. doing everything on a made to order basis, with examples of your previous work, is simply safer. that's how most chinese costume shops operate and use the "one off commission" thing as their work around.
I'm planning to follow exactly this model. Doing pieces by demand, without a mass production and varying on the theme. I hope it works well.
how do places like rpc studio work? they are super open about not having the rights to marvel stuff but they make a fortune and its a well known big store
As long as it's an original design, you can sell several of them like a hybrid of two separate themes or characters IMO.
Solid advice and another reason you guys are successful where others have fallen away. Integrity and decency... and just being nice... they really go a long way. Kudos to you guys.
I once got a C&D letter from a company for selling something that was listed in the description as "Not a XXXX" they didnt like that their product was mentioned. It was weird, the form letter they sent was super harsh and legal, i just emailed them back very politely and asked what I could do to make them happy. The response i received was certainly written by a human and not a lawyer, so after a couple email exchanges it all worked out, I got to keep my listing just had to change the wording around a bit. But even still it was a big company and they just went looking for anything with their name in it, even if it was used in comparison to their product.
That's a great example. It pays to be polite. =)
"Not a xxxx" is tag spamming. Legally and morally scummy.
I was selling a vintage knock off, I didnt want buyers to think they were buying an original, sure it was old but it was an old fake. I was up front, i dont see that as being scummy.
Grateful for this post. My son, age 16, and on the Autistic Spectrum, is just getting involved in cosplay. We've watched a lot of prop tutorials and really like your format. My son loves crafting these things and frankly, he's good at it. I can see him maybe earning a little on etsy and finding a job can be hard on the spectrum so this would be great. With a couple of other makers I've had him write and ask if he can sell props he makes with their patterns. I think learning not to step on toes right from the beginning is super important. Some people will say no; that's inevitable. But many will say "sure, no problem." And frankly, those are the makers we want to support anyway. Thanks for sharing!
Happy to help out. =D
Sound advice Bill, most people don't understand that like with anything, if its worth doing and you have a passion for it, and wish to make a business modeled around that passion. You are absolutely running a risk and should have if not before weighed the level of that risk. I truly appreciate the content you put out there and can't wait to see you start delving more into your own creative properties.
Same goes for vinyl cutting decals. When I first started making decals I decided up front to purchase several "TM" logos via cds. It served me well with lots of sports orientated cut that I did though it did cost in the beginning. Great info video.
Vids like this is another reason why I love your channel. Great advice and a great topic to get out there.
Happy to help out.
Very fair, honest and informative information. Your correct in your assessments of these company’s assets.
They are not going to consider what your doing stealing from them unless you 1 make bad products 2 they choose to start making similar ones. 3 you are making substantial money from this enterprise
The only thing I think you missed was that there is a difference between the fist to come up with something and the first to copyright or trademark something. This goes in part with company’s contesting your claims in order for the value of there existing intellectual property’s to decrease in value
I have never seen anyone in the fan based community of props, toys, and collectibles take as much, if not MORE, time to contribute back to the community as much as they do worry about making money. Your talents are most impressive, but man, I agree with another comment I see below, your heart of gold is what makes you the man you are. That truly "giving" mentality you have is really going to fuel taking "Punished Props" to the next level I think. I would love to some day work with/for a company with a person such as yourself at the helm.
Awe, thanks! Just doing my part to make the world a tiny bit better. =)
I create crochet patterns and I run into these same issues. Some people are selling obviously copyrighted/licensed work for money. I thought about doing it because it's easy to be inspired by what you love, but it's not legal, so if I do a project out of love, I just put it for free. This way, basically 0 risk for me as a C&D would only make me take it down, not lose my market.
Great video! Can't wait for the next one!
You've got the right idea! =)
Refreshing to see someone who doesn't feel entitled, like they just automatically have the right to use someone else's IP and shame on the company for being mean and enforcing it. This was a very good video, respectful and helpful at the same time.
As a maker and business owner I really respect you guys for putting this out there. You are pillars in the community and your wisdom is valuable for makers. Many thanks for all you do.
Good Info Bill, will there be a follow up build video where you make an IP Lawyer costume?
HA! No. =)
It's 'Cease & Desist Man!' Walks around in a business suit with a cape handing out C&D letters at DragonCon.
...or how to make your own lawyer out of floor mats.
Do the lawyer from Speed Racer, "That'sh for a court to deshide."
Just do like LegalEagle and buy a suit from Indochino :-)
I was reading your comments and saw you pretty much reply to Everyone! Wow, I already loved your videos and channel (it's what I watch sometimes when working in my shop on props) but as a content creator on RUclips I respect your dedication to your fanbase so much more. A lot of RUclipsrs just splash vids, and tell people to like, comment, then never read or reply to them. Keep up the Amazing work!!!👍🏻
The comments on our videos have been incredibly helpful and valuable. The least I can do is try to get back to as many fantastic people as possible. =)
Great video, Bill! I often toy with the idea of monetizing my prop making, but know that it’s a whole shwack of grey areas. Great to hear your thoughts and experience on the matter.
Happy to share. =D
Amazing video Bill ! It's great that you cover the legal issues of Prop making , it's something people forget way too often , it was very instructive !
Thanks!
God I love this video. Something I've thought about for a long time. Well done man. Awesome.
Thanks so much! =D
Thanks for this video, there is a lot of good things to think about in it! I've been watching you for a while and it's been awesome and inspiring to see your business grow, it's been inspiring for my own journey. I am lucky that my husband actually just graduated law school, focusing on IP law. It's good to have a lawyer on retainer haha
Well isn't that handy!? =D
As always informative, thank you for placing your support in the community.
You are most welcome.
Very good information! Just recently I was wondering how these type of things were viewed from a legal sense. As usual, your video was most informative. Keep up the great work!
You're awesome. Such great advice. Wishing you the best. You're videos have been incredibly inspirational!
Just found this video and I'm so glad I did. I'm just getting into the maker hobby with aspirations of making it into a dream job. I found this video extremely insightful and full of positive reinforcement.
That's great to hear! It can be hard to balance for sure.
I''d love to see more cosplay business advice! This was great.
Everything we've covered on the subject is here: punishedprops.com/business-talk/
Well said Bill, this helped clear up a lot of things I was unsure about, MORE LIKE THIS PLEASE !!!!!
I am sure I speak for all of us that we would love to see your own custom creations!
👍 if you agree!
Yup. I got a cease and desist letter for hand made Nuka Cola cap necklaces on Etsy. They'd rather have you spend more for licensed plastic at Hot Topic. I'm okay with that. Plenty of other things out there to make.
Super late reply, but what about all of the lightsaber prop manufacturers across the world?
There are dozens of companies who entire businesses run by making working lightsaber prop replicas. (mostly canon hilts)
And you don't see Lucasfilm or Disney going after them. Strange, isn't it, Bill?
That was a very solid review of business strategy options. I am impressed and I have done this for a long time.
Well thanks! =D
Really admire how much of a straight shooter you are, you set a great example for the rest of us.
Awe, thanks! =)
im currently doing a research about cosplay business, im glad to find this video.
Lots to think about. Excellent video. I do certain "space conflict" uniforms, and I've been wondering about diversifying.
Thank so much for making this video!!! I am prop maker and I want to start selling some things was wondering this very same thing!! Great video, thank you for helping us aspiring makers and the community as a whole, you're amazing!! 😃🙌🏼
This is a great video and jogs my memory of writing how-to books on making chainmail a long time ago . . . in one of those books I was using images from the internet, chopping them up but still they weren't mine and I was feeling uncomfortable about doing this . . .so great ideas, thanks
Rando comment, You have been awesome about answering back when I comment on your videos. I just wanna say thanks and appreciate it. I plan on using your store just because you are so attentive to your fans. Thanks again
Well that's very kind of you! We really appreciate your support :)
Great talk Bill, I've always wondered about this kinda grey area in prop making.
Thanks that is just perfect timing I was setting up a small business plan to sell small props on Etsy and this is showing what I could do. Luckily my mom is a lawyer so I can talk to her about this stuff.
Great video! Fantastic feedback and very true. If we get a S & A , comply. Diversity is also important. Thanks for the information
This was a good video, had lots of info and made a valid point. Keep up they great work Bill.
This is becoming a bigger and bigger deal in some areas in the toy market. Transformers "3rd party toys" have been getting more and more brave over the years and have even began to branch out to other IPs (overwatch and TMNT to name a few) and we are starting to see the first push backs from the toy company's. I feel with the lowering of costs on 3D printers IP holders are starting to look much closer into things that a few years ago might have slid under the radar. I think as a fandom of certain creators ( I.E. Punished Props etc) we need to really start embracing original ideas and designs more to help keep moving in a positive direction.
Ohhh yes things have definitely changed in the past few years and they will continue to change going forward. I'm very interested to see if any actual legislation changing cases will emerge.
While what you say about embracing original ideas and designs makes a lot of sense in theory, the reality is that most people aren't interested in buying something new and original. What most people want are replicas of things they've seen from their favorite shows, movies, games, or anime; they want something that's recognizable to them as X from Y, not something they've seen or heard of before, no matter how cool it might be. I think that the closest to making something new and original that would sell would be an original design from an existing universe but not seen in the original media. For example, instead of making a copy of something seen in Mass Effect, make and sell something that looks like it's from the Mass Effect universe but is not actually something from the game.
Technically, the art style _can_ be trademarked (it's called "trade dress". See Apple vs Samsung lawsuit over trade dress. Depending on the company, licensing is easy and relatively cheap, especially if your product doesn't directly compete with their product(s). My rule of thumb (aka golden rule): if it was your original design, and someone else selling copies (or derivative work) at a profit, would you want a cut? If yes, you probably should get a license. I'm not a lawyer, but I have designed original products, and done copyright and trademark applications, and some of the products I've designed are licensed (for logos). Licensing is not rocket science (and much easier than coming up with original designs that will actually sell). There are loopholes for commissioned work - but they can be tricky.
Great work! I like this final draft from the rough. Very much needed insight
The help I got from the PropTarts was invaluable. =D
Very informative for anyone thinking about starting up. Thanks
Thanks so much for watching!
Can I give this multiple thumbs up? Excellent advise Bill... thank you!
You're welcome!
When I hear of companies that take this type of stance, I stop buying from them and notify my friends of their actions. Of course I use common sense when deciding if they were justified. But for the most part, we as consumers have a choice individually and a voice when joined together. Whether they choose to listen is up to them.
Thank you for making this video. I have been an etsy seller for a while now and have run into some of these issues.
You're welcome!
Thanks for the general information, it is good to keep it all in mind.
+Dawid Scheffler You’re welcome.
Great Overview and thanks for sharing your opinion.
I want to be a costume designer/producer, mostly for theatre, but I figured a good way to get started would be to sell pieces to fellow cosplayers.
Totally!
As Someone who has wanted to get into prop building for a long time this is extremely helpful to know and I appreciate your time putting this out. As you said I know you're not a law person but still having a maker as established as yourself talking about these types of things it's very informative.
Happy to help out. =)
Thanks for the info Bill. Makes me feel better doing one off projects and low volume 3D prints for friends.
You're welcome!
What a great video, Bill !
Great vid! Definitely something people need to watch out for.
Question I’ve been wondering for a while🤔
Great video Bill very informative 👍
Thanks!
It sucks that some companies will C&D things that they have ZERO intention of providing. I went to an adult-aimed Harry Potter themed sleepaway camp, it only ran the once because WB sent the organizer a C&D.
Hey! New here and hooked to the channel :) Just thought I'd say thank you, for your quirky humor and your total professionalism. From my point ov view, and probably for a lot of cosplayers, you guys are living the dream (!!!) . I love how you managed to both inform and put things into perspective here. Would totally love to see your designs!
This is a worrying topic to tackle if ever you do fall into the hands of a law suit. Hopefully it doesnt happen at all. Considering we are just fans from the props we make, glad to stumble on this video. It's very important coming from creatives.
great video as always! thank you for sharing your knowledge.
Tons of great advice here. Thanks Bill!
You're very welcome, glad to be of help!
Good message and we'll spoken.
Wonderful Video. Love this kind of content. Thanks Bill
You're welcome!
This really helps a lot! Keep up with the great content! Thank you
You're welcome!
Great vid...honest, informative, and to the point!
super helpful i was just about to start a prop business and i now know that i need the copyright permission
Thank you for confirming my understanding of the risks man!
You're welcome. =D
Very interesting video even for a non cosplayer/propmaker
Thanks Bill. Much appreciated
You're welcome!
I am not a cosplay maker, but rather a n ex-game dev who dabbles in making. What you have offered here, in this video, is in my mind is solid advice and to be honest, made me respect you even more. You kept the topic honest and straight forward. These are good thoughts for anyone to keep in mind. Thank you.
Happy to help out, Jeff!
Great video, sound business philosophy, excellent advice.
Wonder how famous companies like volpin props does it or the company that makes those expensive light sabers
I was selling Fallout 4 keychains (3D printed text only) and sold about 8 and Bethesda then had it pulled off Etsy.
Thanks Bill for sharing lots of good info
You're welcome!
Thank you for the advice man, wisdom worth heeding!
You're very welcome!
Great idea for a video. Thanks.
You're welcome!
Amazing video with lots of great info. I do a scale plastic model videos on RUclips when I was for some time using copyright music. When RUclips allowed me to start making money I went back and cut out all that music and then paid for my very own music.. this gave me 100% ownership of my content but also supported another maker at the same time. I also only build model kits that are legit licensed products. Great video and keep em coming
Thank you so much for this video, helps a lot to see things in a good and professional way! :)
Had an Etsy item takedown due to intellectual property, I reacted like any person making things should do when confronted to a big compagny... Send nices words, apologised and tried to see if we could make an agreement!
Also, how can we share works done thanks to your Foamsmith books? Just wondering, I gess there is lots of entries but I know a while back there was a way to send you pics of full cosplay! ;)
We have a Foamsmith Gallery, but I fell behind on keeping it updated. Don't worry, we'll be updating it soon.
That's nice to hear, thank you for your dedication! And thanks for the motivation bost!
Thanks! great video, its like you said, depends on the risk someone wants to take. and te final statement, was great. greetings from argentina!
Thank you for the video ! very helpful and well put!
You're very welcome, happy to be of assistance!
Might be worth doing a video about chasing other people on copyright. I know Miss Monster (who makes fecking nice stuff) has a lot of issues with people cloning her work.
Yeah recasting could be a whole video unto itself.
Over on the RPF, and I believe many other props and costuming communities, recasting seriously frowned upon and known recasters are called out by name for the entire community to know not to deal with them.
I mean more in the legal things you should do. If its not something you've dealt with before, its all too easy to go from "hey, thats my stuff" to insult slinging and making the situation worse than if you just went the legal route.
I suppose that would depend on what exactly you, or someone else, is making that's being copied. If, for example, you're making replica sets of Stormtrooper armor and someone is making recasts and selling them as their own, there's not much you can do from a legal standpoint since what you're doing is not legal either. So trying to make a legal matter out of it would just get you in trouble as well. If, on the other hand, you're making something completely original and someone is copying it, you could send them a C&D, but for that to work you'd to have an actual lawyer at your disposal in case the recaster decides to call your bluff and ignore your C&D.
I will add that the RPF is a pretty large community and if anyone is outed as a recaster there, almost no one from the RPF will do business with them ever again. Also, since many members of the RPF are members of other similar groups, they'll pass on the word to their other group(s) and the recaster will end up being shunned by the greater props and costuming community. This means that they'll only get business from the handful of people not associated with some prop &/or costuming site/group and the people who are only casually into this hobby. The former, I think, is a pretty small number of people, esp. when compared to number of people who would be a part of the overall community, and the latter are not likely to be willing to pay the prices that people (including recasters) generally charge for their replicas.
you could make something close to what it is that someone else makes but there can be differences in it the way it looks.. or have it in different colors.. but have it slightly different.. but i would rather just make my own stuff from what i think up.. maybe drawing off a little bit of everything but mostly it would be my own imaginative work... if it would be your own work.. thats your business
Thanks for this! I ended up finding this video as I started making polymer clay mini jason masks, and had dreams of soon making video game clay miniatures and dioramas, etc. Getting into all this, I had no idea that fan art is "illegal" basically, and I was pretty upset. Basically all my artistic plans were based on someone else's IP. I kept looking around at all these creators I respect and have followed for so long and wondering, well how come they're allowed to do all this? After watching your video it seems like, you CAN do it, treading as carefully and respectfully as possible, but if "they" tell you to stop, you must? I'm not sure where to go from here, but thank you for the informative video!
Happy to help! Fanart is a complex thing and it's good to be aware of IPs! Enjoy your art and have fun creating!
This was really informative! Thank you as well for making the free files.
You're welcome!
Dude u have a Heart of Gold and u have some good advice
Why thank you!
Punished Props I subbed to u about a week ago and I don’t regret it!
I found this video very helpful. Thank you!
That was really interesting and thank you for your insights.
You're welcome.
Thanks for the insight Bill!
You're welcome!
Brilliant video! I got hit with a couple of c&d's from 2 game companies recently after they clearly combed through etsy. It's not fun, but you accept it and move on. As annoying as it can be as a maker, it's the best way forward I think.
For sure. If you don't rely exclusively on those items then you can be flexible and not be impacted as severely by those c&ds!
Polite and informative as ever. Good one Bill
Thanks!
Solid, honest advice. Thank you!
You are most welcome.
Great video! Is there a way I can contact you directly? I have some additional questions.
Please feel free to use punishedprops.com/contact-us/
Punished Props Academy Done! Thanks!
I used to sell handmade pins of Boku no Hero Academia (with my fan art on it) for like 5$ and I got a cease and desist after selling like one. Some company are really strict...
*Wall-O-Text!*
Just do the work as 'commissions'. Customers can only buy one item at a time and there is a waiting period while you 'make the item'. It doesn't matter if you already have 20 made and can ship the next day; they can only buy one at a time and they have to wait a week or two to get it. Doing it that way implies you're making the items one at a time and your volume is small.
I know this works because I do it with bisque Jumeau dolls. I have an original set of 1907 molds I bought at an auction years ago and I use them to make 3d printed copies. I also have a period-correct slip and resin formulas so the castings I make are as good as the original dolls. The reason I'm posting is because a several Japanese conglomerate of doll artisans bought every Jumeau mold they could find and they are trying to make the dolls a 'Japanese only' sort of thing. Some of these dolls can sell for as much as $2500 so there is a big demand and a stiff market for the originals. Most of the stuff people see on eBay are cheap knock-offs, btw.
I'm not sure the same amount of risk would apply to using this strategy for selling copies of things from more contemporary properties with more litigious copyright holders.
Great video, I would love to hear your thought on the thing I feel I am terrible at , self promotion as an artist
Here's a video I did on that subject a while ago: ruclips.net/video/rMmxSawf42w/видео.html
Punished Props thanks Bill , I agree with your sharing philosophy, the old saying a gardener that shares will have the best garden , ie you’ll get more seeds back from sharing than not. It’s still shocking how resistant people are to sharing , . I’ll have to keep looking, I won’t be working in the prop industry, but am trying to be better at promotion as an artist, something I’m woeful at, If anyone has any videos on promoting yourself please share , thanks
Really great video, very informative!
Thanks!
i used to work for the salkind (producer of 80's superman)
I know they have gone after people for Cosplay.
>>>I have known folks that got hired
i am in progress on doing a project for a thing I have cosplayed and been asked Not to sell...
Any idea which companies besides Disney have a notoriety for C&D Orders? I'm not asking for people to talk shit, what I am asking in the name of protecting my business, as well as respecting the rights owner and stay away from their material.
It's a varied list. I've heard Nintendo and Square Enix are fairly strict. There's more, I'm sure, but it's a sliding scale.
less big companies, but i've heard the creators of homestuck and undertale can be kind of copywrite strict when it comes to selling items. i know the creator of FNAF wanted people to get permission before selling items, back before merch was in every toy store. he basically told me when i asked that one-off commissions and things were okay, but that building things in bulk wouldn't really be accepted.
I'm not an expert, but my understanding is that copyright laws in Japan are quite a bit more strict than other countries. Using artwork that is owned by a Japanese company has a greater chance of being struck down.
Great advice. The whole "intellectual property" issue is bound to reach a tipping point though. There's too much of a grey area legally for a lot of it. Imagine Disney trying to sue someone for making and selling Mjolnir (Thor's hammer) replicas. Disney owns Marvel and all its designs yes, but Thor and his hammer are part of Norse mythology. Can't copyright historical or mythological characters.
I'm pretty sure they can copyright their interpretation and design of Mjolnir.
Punished Props Yeah if you completely duplicate their designs I could see there being a problem. But my thought is how close to their design is too close before they are just nitpicking you know?
Part of the answer to this question is who has the bigger legal department. Short of your being Microsoft, it will be Disney. If they decide to sue you wholesale about it, it won't matter if you're in the green, because you can't afford a suitable defense.