Superb test and as always your passion shines through. I have a 4 year old Specialized Gen 2 Turbo Levo so I was pleased to see that it came out top. However, my first motor broke and was replaced under warranty which Specialized then extended the warranty for 4 years, so bad then good. However earlier this year with my over 50 legs pushing my 90+ kilos, I ascended 1,151m above the campsite in Torla in the Pyrenees using only 50% of the now old 700watt hour battery. Now I was in eco a lot of the time as I was worried about getting back as the boss (AKA wife) had given clear instructions… “if you get hurt I’ll kill you”. So I totally agree with your recommendation on the 800 watt hour battery, not much extra weight and loads in reserve making massive adventures possible. As you’re in Spain the campsite lower down across the old bridge in Torla is amazing Keep up the great work Sam you’re a legend
Hey from Colorado Sam! Great review. Love the direction this technology is going. Getting better and better, can't wait for it to arrive in USA. Really curious about reliability long-term as well. Enjoy your riding!😊
Great review Sam and ignore the silly comments from other watchers. You clearly set out the parameters and limitations of the testing so for me it was an excellent comparison. Thanks for your hard work
hey Sam, an interesting comparison would be: Vertical multiplied by kilometers, divided by heart rate. That would take into account different terrain, tires, weight, suspension etc.
So now everybody will be talking and complaining about range... It is just normal. All depends on average speed, weight, vertical ascent and very important is also how much energy you add by legs. I have range 28km when riding full throttle and battery 840Wh. (I am lazy now and not giving much energy by legs) People realizing more Watts is more fun? ;)) Check M560 motor, 1250W conti! DJI motor would not see me in 200m. :)
I'd like to see a chart like at 10:46 show the range per Nm of power. Considering how much power the DJI Avinox is producing, I think it might be at the top of a chart like that. I've heard from a couple of other reviewers that the Avinox feels like the others when in the second or third highest power mode... so, in theory, if you rode the bike in one of those power modes, you would outstrip the other brands by some considerable margin. I'd like to hear your thoughts on that.
I think people sleep on bosch. I have gen 4 Trek rail with gen 4 bosch motor at 750W. I have done 55 km rides in only turbo mode and im 6.8 ft and 100 kilo. Bosch is beast when it comes to power and let me tell you that after doing 58km in turbo mode i still had about 10 percent left.
If I stay in eco I have gone 3000 feet vertical in 11 miles of climbing. I used 40% in 3 1/2 hours riding with my Turbo Levo I was riding with 2 strong riders on mechanical MTB’s. I will try full power next summer but there is too much snow on the trails now. I checked. E-bikes are truly capable.
Would love to see an outright climbing power comparison between the DJI and the Dyname 4.0. I sometimes race my powerplay in local XC races where its always Rocky Mountains on yhe podiums as the other motors just can't keep up. Guessing the DJIs will be up there if not ahead with their 30s extra boost feature.
You gotta do this test with all the motors in the same power WATTAGE...climbing long climbs at 600-650W is more than enough when trying to squeeze more vert out. If doing quick after work lap, then yea full boost full time.
That QuadLock is great, but I would highly recommend their vibration dampener to go with it. I didn't and the vibration wrecked my camera on my Samsung Galaxy S21 phone.
Did the test also today with my Levo and the AMFlow and the Levo is a bit more effecient but the DJI motor is so much powerfull and the Bike so playfull.
@ I am always impressed by the amazing trails you ride during your video’s. Would be amazing to get some tips on locations, area’s countries we could use to plan our next trips. Thanks again for everything you bring to the sport.
Thanks for the review. You do a good job on your videos, and work hard at it i see... but did you say you're gonna do a "long term" review in "2 weeks" ??? I can't see the point in that...
Great video as always and surprising that if it's giving it's peak of 850 (which is what turbo is supposed to do) it doesn't burn through that 800Wh quicker. I guess it becomes rider based at some point. I still worry that the governemnt is going to clamp down on these at some point especially if companies keep pushing the limits like this and bragging about it. 850Wh in 2.75 hrs is 290W avg which is obviously more than the 250W continuous allowed for a pedelec in the uk and that includes the time spent descending.
@@SamsBikes Not sure about Spain but in the UK ebikes are getting quite a bit of bad press because gangs are using E motor bikes to commit crimes, I've seen quite a few comments that they should be banned. Unfortunately, most people don't understand the difference between ebikes and something like a Surron.
@@curtrichardson8002 sure is, it actually makes it too slow to keep up with normal bikes in traffic. On the other hand there are several people that ride around our town not pedalling doing 30
Great vid Sam! I've heard it's so powerful that Eco mode can be compared to some other motors in Boost. This would mean giving ample assistance just in Eco. Is this true? If so, how much further is the range if you rode it in Eco until the battery is dead? How many nm of torque is there in Eco?
It's interesting that the Giant would get the shortest amount of range I get pretty good range with my 2022. I'm not doubting where it sit's compared to others it just tells me I could expect to go even farther with other motor systems unless the drivetrain including the tires and wheels were a major factor in that out come because they were setup so differently?
Hey mate, I did a similar range test on the Giant Trance E+ with 29 wheels and auto suspension and the results were much better and I put that down to the automatic suspension
Isn't the SRAM powertrain identical to the engine from Specialized Turbo? Thanks for the video, I'm looking forward to my amflow. However, I didn't like the rattling when going downhill ;)
People overlook the Bafang m620 for years. It's heavy but it has metal gears so it's super reliable, can be tuned heavily and it's power is superior to the DJI motor.
Hello, I am a gearbox developer. I am preparing to develop an integrated drive like MGU. I'm wondering if a sprocket 10T to 52T is appropriate on the E-MTB. I want to hear your thought. 1.In E-MTB, do you think the minimum gear 52T is appropriate (gear ratio 0.6)? 2.Do you think the top gear 10T is appropriate for the E-MTB (gear ratio 3.4)? 3.What do you think is the proper gear-up for the E-MTB? For the sprocket, it's 14-18%, are you happy with it?
@@SamsBikes Thank you for your response. The opinion is that the wide gear ratio of 11T to 52T is appropriate even though the mid-motor is powerful. I rarely do Instagram as I'm preoccupied with development. What is PM? Does it mean product introduction?
Pha, on 800Wh I would do 200km with ascending 2000 m. I have 400Wh battery on my Cube AMS Hybrid and without any problems I do 100km with ascending 1200m.
With Powerplay the power is relational to input to so pedaling harder will produce much less range. On a gen4 750Wh my range usually was 60km on turbo where as on Powerplay 720Wh it's 50km. That is on a normal ride on a hard ride I would expect the range to be slightly less. Where as Bosch tends to give you full power for a wide range. Bosch will still go fast putting 100 watts on pedals but Powerplay doesn't. I have 4500km on gen4 and 2500km on Powerplay.
good point... for me the best way to Measure this is heart rate and how much effort I put in when riding the bikes. thats why I always have a average rate of between 125 and 130
This doesn’t seem that impressive to me. My brother and I recently did a bike trip to the Sierras in California. One of the trails is a 34 mile ride with a 4300’ climb folowed by a 4300’ descent and a 6-7 mile flat road ride back to the shop where we rented the bikes. We rented Santa Cruz Hecklers with the Shimano Ep 801 motor and 750 watt batteries. We did the entire ride in a mix of Turbo and Boost and still had a full bar left at the end. I am 200lbs in full gear and ride fairly aggressively. This was 4300’ of proper steep big mountain climbing. Our time on the bike was nearly 4 hours. I would consider a 2 1/2 hr ride to be fairly short. Am I missing something?
Ok. Forgive the ignorance of a Yank when it comes to meters vs feet. I did the calculations and 1721 meters is 5646 feet. That is impressive considering the overall weight of the bike. Weight is very important to me. The lightweight bikes are far superior ro me. My dream bike would be this motor/battery combo in a Kenevo SL. I haven’t found any Ebike that handles as well as my Kenevo Sl, but range anxiety is definitely a problem.
Love these more scientific comparisons! Great data thanks for running it! TBH I'm a bit disappointed with the range - I don't think most people (anyone?) needs 120 torque but it's the combo of running fast and battery drain that should matter
First of all hope goes well the you and family after what happened in Spain, about the range like you said it may vary depending lots kf factors, but I'd like to see more, question of longevity of the motor, i will wait more time before buying one of them.
i'm surprised of the difference between the SRAM and Levo, since it's the same motor.... bike efficiency with the suspension design might play a bigger role than we think... The Amflow has a very similar suspension design to the Levo, and they are both in top 3. Sam, do you have the total climbing duration on your stats ? Assuming you barely use any battery going down, if you divide the Wh battery capacity by the time climbing, you could get the REAL WORLD power average of each motor. Assuming that in turbo (about 3.5x to 4x your input), you probably extract 100% of the power available by the motor, cuz your leg input only have to be about 175w to max out the motor, and that your gradient is fairly steady on that fire road. I did those math on my EP8, my climb takes 9min for 185meter of vertical, and it takes 10-11% of my 900wh battery, that gives me around 600w of average power output. I've got to admit that i'm a 6'3 195lbs guy, and my average heart rate is around 170-180bpm when climbing, so i definitely push enough on the pedal to get maximum assist.
Yep I was surprised too at the difference in the SRAM and Levo. It must be battery quality or software or both. Honestly the SRAM system was very average in almost every aspect. Maybe check out the extreme range test it gives more details. Also don’t read too much into the times of the rides. This was in summer and at my local trails so I know a lot of people I stop and talk to
@@SamsBikes don't worry, I listen to every video you put out. On paper, electric motor are very efficient, and the diffence between them should not be that much. But rated efficiency is at a specific rpm and power input, and is normally not at max power. The fact that the DJI is able to deliver 1000w is a testament that both motor AND battery are able to deliver that power, but it is probably not super efficient while doing so. The engineer have to choose the sweet spot, where they think the motor is most likely to be use, and design it around that, while keeping the size/weight low. The same thing apply to battery design. Not every battery can deliver the same punch with the same efficiency, that's why some heat up more than other. Take for example the DJI drone battery, they can empty their capacity in less than 20 minutes... that is no small feat... My guess is that DJI are a lot more competent than the other manufacturer to design a complete system that optimize all aspect (power, size/weight, efficiency), because they had no choice to do it while making drone, and they improve that on many iteration.
That is unbelievable Sam especially when you consider that the Avinox Turbo mode is at least one mode higher than every other brands turbo modes, what a machine love these comparisons also great work 👏👏
Tell them how long the bose motor lasts. At About 1000miles the motor dies how crazy is that and they keep pushing it saying it’s so great and this and that. 1000 miles is a disgrace you pay 7k for something to last 1000 miles
@ stop the cap those motors are junk they last a 1000 miles maybe 1100 if you’re lucky multiple people and friends have gone out on them look at all the forums with people having to buy motors every year or 2
![[#2024MAMA] BIGBANG (빅뱅) - 뱅뱅뱅 (BANG BANG BANG) + FANTASTIC BABY | Mnet 241123 방송](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EQsYfiPR9uM/mqdefault.jpg)
So what do we think riders? Impressive or what?
Very impressive, thanks for all these tests! Any news on other brands w/ DJI?
Any more MGU coverage? I've only seen you do the Rotwild so far. Simplon and Nicolai I'm curious about.
Thanks for all this testing Sam! I’m glad you’re doing it so we don’t have to 😂. Appreciate all the hard work that you do!
Great stuff Sam! Good to see you include most of the ebike brands out there. I think your comparisons are second to none.
What is your rider weight? 90kg?
I'm getting this for my 70th currently love my Reign, peace out✌️🙏🇦🇺
Superb test and as always your passion shines through. I have a 4 year old Specialized Gen 2 Turbo Levo so I was pleased to see that it came out top. However, my first motor broke and was replaced under warranty which Specialized then extended the warranty for 4 years, so bad then good. However earlier this year with my over 50 legs pushing my 90+ kilos, I ascended 1,151m above the campsite in Torla in the Pyrenees using only 50% of the now old 700watt hour battery. Now I was in eco a lot of the time as I was worried about getting back as the boss (AKA wife) had given clear instructions… “if you get hurt I’ll kill you”. So I totally agree with your recommendation on the 800 watt hour battery, not much extra weight and loads in reserve making massive adventures possible.
As you’re in Spain the campsite lower down across the old bridge in Torla is amazing
Keep up the great work Sam you’re a legend
hahaha my wife says the same thing.... Yep 800wh is totally enough for me and my style of riding. I''l defo try and check out the campsite
This is great work Sam. You seem to have done all you can to make what is a difficult apples to apples comparison accurate enough to be useful.
Thanks mate!
Elevation gain was impressive, amflow looks solid.
When battery is fully discharged a DJI drone will pop out and tow you home.
working on it 😂
hahaha gerat idea...
Great stats and comparisons. Well done! Keep'n it 💯! It's we why we luv ya dude!
Oh brother thanks so much for the kind words, it makes all the difference
Can’t wait until these come to CANADA!!!!🤘🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻
Yo bro how are you? yep this motor is crazy..
I mean, they will be illegal on most trails as they aren’t Class 1.
@@SamsBikes really good Sam! Keep up the good work… You’re killing it! 🤜🏼🤛🏼
Hey from Colorado Sam! Great review. Love the direction this technology is going. Getting better and better, can't wait for it to arrive in USA. Really curious about reliability long-term as well. Enjoy your riding!😊
Thanks mate... yep its a great time to be alive. haha
Currently this bike is illegal in the US. It’s motor is past the max limit for US laws which is 750w
Good stuff. Probably impossible but I'd love to see an efficiency test - all motors set to same Nm, Watts and assistance level then test.
Great suggestion would need a Dyno for that and its not really about that for me... I want to do the real world test with the average rider....
You are the LEGEND! Thanks for that sick test!
Thanks Champ...
great comparison Sam. i am impressed enough to now seriously consider the avinox as my next emtb motor system 🎉
Thanks mate
Great review Sam and ignore the silly comments from other watchers. You clearly set out the parameters and limitations of the testing so for me it was an excellent comparison. Thanks for your hard work
Thanks! 👍 it means a lot mate
Very useful content again, Sam! ALMOST 50K, mate! Well deserved! ❤
If major brands will use the Avinox it will really rock the boat :O
This will be happening sooner then we expect I feel
Hopefully they drop prices
hey Sam, an interesting comparison would be:
Vertical multiplied by kilometers, divided by heart rate.
That would take into account different terrain, tires, weight, suspension etc.
Great video Sam as always 👌👏
Thanks a ton!
Great review thanks! Can’t wait until it hits the US market!
So now everybody will be talking and complaining about range...
It is just normal. All depends on average speed, weight, vertical ascent and very important is also how much energy you add by legs.
I have range 28km when riding full throttle and battery 840Wh. (I am lazy now and not giving much energy by legs)
People realizing more Watts is more fun? ;)) Check M560 motor, 1250W conti! DJI motor would not see me in 200m. :)
thanks for your comment
I'd like to see a chart like at 10:46 show the range per Nm of power. Considering how much power the DJI Avinox is producing, I think it might be at the top of a chart like that. I've heard from a couple of other reviewers that the Avinox feels like the others when in the second or third highest power mode... so, in theory, if you rode the bike in one of those power modes, you would outstrip the other brands by some considerable margin.
I'd like to hear your thoughts on that.
I think people sleep on bosch. I have gen 4 Trek rail with gen 4 bosch motor at 750W. I have done 55 km rides in only turbo mode and im 6.8 ft and 100 kilo. Bosch is beast when it comes to power and let me tell you that after doing 58km in turbo mode i still had about 10 percent left.
They are good numbers
Thanks you Sam for this super vidéo 🤩
Fantastique Bike.
J'adore.
Quand sera 't'il dispo en France ?
Thanks Rider
Love your energy and passion. Missing Fazua motor
Great job Sam. Tell us more about the Specialized Levo...
Thanks mate! I love my Levo and my Amflow but very different bikes
If I stay in eco I have gone 3000 feet vertical in 11 miles of climbing. I used 40% in 3 1/2 hours riding with my Turbo Levo I was riding with 2 strong riders on mechanical MTB’s. I will try full power next summer but there is too much snow on the trails now. I checked. E-bikes are truly capable.
Thanks for sharing... you sound fit..
Thank you, Sam!
No worries legend
@ 👌
Nice one Sam 👍😎
Thanks 👍
Would love to see an outright climbing power comparison between the DJI and the Dyname 4.0. I sometimes race my powerplay in local XC races where its always Rocky Mountains on yhe podiums as the other motors just can't keep up. Guessing the DJIs will be up there if not ahead with their 30s extra boost feature.
You gotta do this test with all the motors in the same power WATTAGE...climbing long climbs at 600-650W is more than enough when trying to squeeze more vert out. If doing quick after work lap, then yea full boost full time.
I tried my best to give you a real world test
Yes you are correct that is really the only way to do that kind of comparison correctly.
Don’t get the hype here. It’s kinda like every other motor, perhaps other than a quick boost mode. Great as always video Sam
Thanks mate...
Great battery review!
Thanks mate
Gooooooooo Turbo!!! Woot woot! Just got my Specialized Levo Turbo Comp Carbon - mega sale - love love it! 😍.
Good choice haha 🤣
How much did you pay?
@ don’t burst my bubble and tell me you got a new one for 4k. 😝 I got mine for $5999.00 - US
@@gainknowledgeandinsight Buy me one and sent to Europe :(
@ ha! Are they much more there? Shouldn’t they be on sale there?
That QuadLock is great, but I would highly recommend their vibration dampener to go with it. I didn't and the vibration wrecked my camera on my Samsung Galaxy S21 phone.
Thanks for your advice... I have never had any problems with my Iphone for over 3 years.
Did the test also today with my Levo and the AMFlow and the Levo is a bit more effecient but the DJI motor is so much powerfull and the Bike so playfull.
I ride with my mate German on his Levo and we end about the same battery percentage always it’s very similar
does the coil shock make the bike feel more confidence inspiring and capable? And have you tried a 170mm fork? would love to hear back
Video coming soon... my Amflow is very Enduro now
Now thats an answer i like to hear!😆
Doing that same ride, always on trail mode, would be impressive too i'm sure!
Yep totally!
Looks like I’ll be keeping my Turbo Levo!!
Keep in mind this is normalized to same battery size. The DJI has a larger battery, so will likely go further than a Levo.
Yep the Levo is still a great option
Great video Sam. Hey, as a matter of interest, where are the trails in this video located? Cheers.
Thanks mate all the trails I ride are 45mins north of Madrid
Hey Sam great review, so do you think the weight difference of the bikes would've played apart in those stats?
We’ll done!👍
Thabks
He Sam, thanks for the great review. Could you let us know where you did the test drive in spain madrid?
I test my e-bikes all over Madrid. Let me know when your in Madrid and we can ride
@ I am always impressed by the amazing trails you ride during your video’s. Would be amazing to get some tips on locations, area’s countries we could use to plan our next trips. Thanks again for everything you bring to the sport.
Thanks mate yes a lot of amazing trails!
Thanks for the review. You do a good job on your videos, and work hard at it i see... but did you say you're gonna do a "long term" review in "2 weeks" ??? I can't see the point in that...
Thanks mate! Well I’ll be doing a 1000km review on the motor and system and possibly a 5000km next year
Great video as always and surprising that if it's giving it's peak of 850 (which is what turbo is supposed to do) it doesn't burn through that 800Wh quicker. I guess it becomes rider based at some point. I still worry that the governemnt is going to clamp down on these at some point especially if companies keep pushing the limits like this and bragging about it. 850Wh in 2.75 hrs is 290W avg which is obviously more than the 250W continuous allowed for a pedelec in the uk and that includes the time spent descending.
Thanks Tony, ive actually never thought about that definitely this should be the limit.
@@SamsBikes Not sure about Spain but in the UK ebikes are getting quite a bit of bad press because gangs are using E motor bikes to commit crimes, I've seen quite a few comments that they should be banned. Unfortunately, most people don't understand the difference between ebikes and something like a Surron.
@tonygregg6957 I don't think the extra power will be a problem here in California, UK is restrictive with speed. 15 mph is a joke.
@@curtrichardson8002 sure is, it actually makes it too slow to keep up with normal bikes in traffic. On the other hand there are several people that ride around our town not pedalling doing 30
@tonygregg6957 we have those too, not on single track though.
What is the weight of the bike with the aluminum wheels, the aluminum handlebar and the spring shock absorber?
Thanks for this very interesting video.
the amflow/avinox is an impressive bike package. which do you prefer riding downhill, the amflow or your turbo levo sl
Both great bikes but very different... The DJI motor is amazing and the Suspenion on the Levo SL is the best there is
Interesting, still love my brose good to see its up there will be interesting to see the new model which must be coming out soon 😁
@andre,,,,, apparently Brose has dropped the belt from their new motor . it will be interesting to see how that turns out .
Great vid Sam!
I've heard it's so powerful that Eco mode can be compared to some other motors in Boost. This would mean giving ample assistance just in Eco. Is this true?
If so, how much further is the range if you rode it in Eco until the battery is dead? How many nm of torque is there in Eco?
The more definitely had more power than anything I’ve tested. Eco is equal to turbo is a stretch but is a very good motor
@@SamsBikes It would be interesting to do the same test in Eco, to find max range. Heart Rate would be higher too and Cals.
Or, maybe in Auto?
It's interesting that the Giant would get the shortest amount of range
I get pretty good range with my 2022. I'm not doubting where it sit's compared to others it just tells me I could expect to go even farther with other motor systems unless the drivetrain including the tires and wheels were a major factor in that out come because they were setup so differently?
Hey mate, I did a similar range test on the Giant Trance E+ with 29 wheels and auto suspension and the results were much better and I put that down to the automatic suspension
I so need this bike 😊
It’s pretty special
Isn't the SRAM powertrain identical to the engine from Specialized Turbo? Thanks for the video, I'm looking forward to my amflow. However, I didn't like the rattling when going downhill ;)
Yes, it is but different battery and software
Wonder, how Bosch Gen 5 will compare. Could displace one of the first 3
lets see I'm doing it next week
@@SamsBikesexcellent, looking forward for to it as I’ve just ordered a new eMTB with the gen 5! Thanks, Sam.
I'm just wondering Sam, with all that power going through the drive train how the wear compares.
My bosch did 250miles in winter and needed a new chain and 2gears
It's a T type SRAM on the Pro so it should be fine.
I havent had any problems
People overlook the Bafang m620 for years. It's heavy but it has metal gears so it's super reliable, can be tuned heavily and it's power is superior to the DJI motor.
Nice vid and upgrades! How much does that guy weigh now?
I'm 85kg on a good day.
@ haha not you mate, the bike!
Sam defiantly the bike is a beast , what about to ride 100 km or more i'm sure we will need to reduce the assistance
i think the bikes that did the best probably have 48 volt systems ?
This would contribute to the overall efficiency somewhat ?
New here. Loved this vid. I will be back.
Thanks legend
Have a bosch motor, but didn't expect turbo levo. Interesting.
Yep 👍 all top 4 are great range
it's only 5% difference in elevation
Very helpful!
I’m glad
Would you says there’s any benefit to fitting a 38 fork instead of the 36? Obviously it will be heavier so that’s a con! Cheers
100% flex 💪 when hit harder trails
Hello, I am a gearbox developer.
I am preparing to develop an integrated drive like MGU.
I'm wondering if a sprocket 10T to 52T is appropriate on the E-MTB. I want to hear your thought.
1.In E-MTB, do you think the minimum gear 52T is appropriate (gear ratio 0.6)?
2.Do you think the top gear 10T is appropriate for the E-MTB (gear ratio 3.4)?
3.What do you think is the proper gear-up for the E-MTB? For the sprocket, it's 14-18%, are you happy with it?
send me a PM in Instagram.. I feel 11to 52 is a good number
@@SamsBikes Thank you for your response. The opinion is that the wide gear ratio of 11T to 52T is appropriate even though the mid-motor is powerful.
I rarely do Instagram as I'm preoccupied with development. What is PM? Does it mean product introduction?
Pha, on 800Wh I would do 200km with ascending 2000 m.
I have 400Wh battery on my Cube AMS Hybrid and without any problems I do 100km with ascending 1200m.
sounds like your very fit.
With Powerplay the power is relational to input to so pedaling harder will produce much less range. On a gen4 750Wh my range usually was 60km on turbo where as on Powerplay 720Wh it's 50km. That is on a normal ride on a hard ride I would expect the range to be slightly less. Where as Bosch tends to give you full power for a wide range. Bosch will still go fast putting 100 watts on pedals but Powerplay doesn't. I have 4500km on gen4 and 2500km on Powerplay.
good point... for me the best way to Measure this is heart rate and how much effort I put in when riding the bikes. thats why I always have a average rate of between 125 and 130
This doesn’t seem that impressive to me. My brother and I recently did a bike trip to the Sierras in California. One of the trails is a 34 mile ride with a 4300’ climb folowed by a 4300’ descent and a 6-7 mile flat road ride back to the shop where we rented the bikes. We rented Santa Cruz Hecklers with the Shimano Ep 801 motor and 750 watt batteries. We did the entire ride in a mix of Turbo and Boost and still had a full bar left at the end. I am 200lbs in full gear and ride fairly aggressively. This was 4300’ of proper steep big mountain climbing. Our time on the bike was nearly 4 hours. I would consider a 2 1/2 hr ride to be fairly short. Am I missing something?
Ok. Forgive the ignorance of a Yank when it comes to meters vs feet. I did the calculations and 1721 meters is 5646 feet. That is impressive considering the overall weight of the bike. Weight is very important to me. The lightweight bikes are far superior ro me. My dream bike would be this motor/battery combo in a Kenevo SL. I haven’t found any Ebike that handles as well as my Kenevo Sl, but range anxiety is definitely a problem.
haha yes for a 20kg ebike this is very impressive
Long day but worthy!!!! We’ll done!!!👌🙌👏👏👏👏
Thank my love great editing
How much do you weigh? That has been the major variable in battery life in my experience.
Love these more scientific comparisons! Great data thanks for running it! TBH I'm a bit disappointed with the range - I don't think most people (anyone?) needs 120 torque but it's the combo of running fast and battery drain that should matter
Thanks mate... I feel probably more than 80% of the rider will be too tired to ride this bike to 0% battery
i am only interested in what is the best combination. I am looking for IGH, DJI mid drive and belt drive with 3000 watts. is this possible?
Is the Amflow suitable for a 106kg kitted up rider 🤔...if I popped on a Fox 38 and upgraded the rear shock ?
First of all hope goes well the you and family after what happened in Spain, about the range like you said it may vary depending lots kf factors, but I'd like to see more, question of longevity of the motor, i will wait more time before buying one of them.
🔥🙌🏻
I need this !
Is the gen5 power production slower than on gen4? Gen5 is supposed to be "natural" which means lazy power production like Powerplay or Ep8.
The new Gen 5 is definitely more like the EP801
What is your total rider weight? I’m wondering how far I could reasonably go
I'm 85kg on a good day.
It still amazes me that the Powerplay is currently second in the list, even though I’ve been riding one for the last 2 and a half years 😂
is the battery removable ? Nice trails
no
Such an awesome bike, I’d definitely consider it as my next EMTB.
yep great bike and motor
What type of coil shock do you ride?!
Can I removed battery when I fly with this bike ?
Sorry you can’t bro
Can someone explain how it's 800w peak power, but the EU limit is 250w? Will an EU version be restricted to 250w? Or it that even how it works
I think, the range could be more......the Albert tires need more Power and Akku.
Sam do you think the bike is more thirsty in auto mode than in turbo? The results are quite impressive 👏👏
Good point Pablo, I feel in auto the range would be 10-20% better but would need to test
Suspension linkage design may affect the result.
not really a lot the bikes in this test are 4 bar
4 bar or not doesn't matter with anti squat maybe. the pivot height matters. well I don't know what bikes and how much anyway..
Where does the Bosch Gen 5 fit in Sam?
Next week rider
what about Bosch CX non Race?
Tyre pressure is for me a major range factor.
I mean it's sweet but ill probably never even see one !
I feel you will
When it can ride 45kmh+ with overlock for flat mountains? Anybody know?
you keep saying most powerful but the rocky is 108NM. which is more powerful and has a slightly smaller battery
There’s a couple of drags up steep hills in back to back comparisons on YT and the Dji wins hands down
Instead of asking Strava to keep track of your rides, you can now go to the Chinese government😂
i'm surprised of the difference between the SRAM and Levo, since it's the same motor.... bike efficiency with the suspension design might play a bigger role than we think...
The Amflow has a very similar suspension design to the Levo, and they are both in top 3.
Sam, do you have the total climbing duration on your stats ? Assuming you barely use any battery going down, if you divide the Wh battery capacity by the time climbing, you could get the REAL WORLD power average of each motor. Assuming that in turbo (about 3.5x to 4x your input), you probably extract 100% of the power available by the motor, cuz your leg input only have to be about 175w to max out the motor, and that your gradient is fairly steady on that fire road.
I did those math on my EP8, my climb takes 9min for 185meter of vertical, and it takes 10-11% of my 900wh battery, that gives me around 600w of average power output. I've got to admit that i'm a 6'3 195lbs guy, and my average heart rate is around 170-180bpm when climbing, so i definitely push enough on the pedal to get maximum assist.
Yep I was surprised too at the difference in the SRAM and Levo. It must be battery quality or software or both. Honestly the SRAM system was very average in almost every aspect. Maybe check out the extreme range test it gives more details. Also don’t read too much into the times of the rides. This was in summer and at my local trails so I know a lot of people I stop and talk to
@@SamsBikes don't worry, I listen to every video you put out.
On paper, electric motor are very efficient, and the diffence between them should not be that much. But rated efficiency is at a specific rpm and power input, and is normally not at max power.
The fact that the DJI is able to deliver 1000w is a testament that both motor AND battery are able to deliver that power, but it is probably not super efficient while doing so.
The engineer have to choose the sweet spot, where they think the motor is most likely to be use, and design it around that, while keeping the size/weight low. The same thing apply to battery design.
Not every battery can deliver the same punch with the same efficiency, that's why some heat up more than other.
Take for example the DJI drone battery, they can empty their capacity in less than 20 minutes... that is no small feat... My guess is that DJI are a lot more competent than the other manufacturer to design a complete system that optimize all aspect (power, size/weight, efficiency), because they had no choice to do it while making drone, and they improve that on many iteration.
That is unbelievable Sam especially when you consider that the Avinox Turbo mode is at least one mode higher than every other brands turbo modes, what a machine love these comparisons also great work 👏👏
10:44 where’s TQ HPR50?
yep its a SL motor, I'll try and do that soon
Does bike have ANT+/connect to Garmin?
Yes it does
how much is this bike?
Don't wake me up before you Go Go...I beg you thankyou Do DODO
Dijjer??
Tell them how long the bose motor lasts. At About 1000miles the motor dies how crazy is that and they keep pushing it saying it’s so great and this and that. 1000 miles is a disgrace you pay 7k for something to last 1000 miles
I habe over 4000km on my Levo with zero peorblems. Sorry to hear about your experience
@ stop the cap those motors are junk they last a 1000 miles maybe 1100 if you’re lucky multiple people and friends have gone out on them look at all the forums with people having to buy motors every year or 2
So between worst and best it's approx 300m. Not really a lot in it then really... hardly a massive difference in terms of elevation
Dump your shade and stop shouting.
Maybe then I will listen. 😂
Haha 🤣 funny guy!
Be interesting to see how many chains and cassettes that motor eats over the months 😂🤣 although SRAM is always more durable than Shimano IMO