I just have to say after driving in SF professionally, daily, during and after rush hour, for 4 years a decent percentage of human drivers aren't ready to drive there either. The layout is complex and with constant construction going on resulting in detours, lane closures combined with sporting events and tourist traffic it takes a driving competency a some (many) drivers just don't possess.
Kind of a hard question. But based on this video, how would you rate FSD in this video from 1-10. And let’s say for reference the average driver driving in SF would get an 8
@@markplott4820 I've seen New Deli and with all the bikes and animals it's definitely a challenge it looks like chaos to western eyes but if you watch there is a system in place. The worst place I have ever driven was through Tijuana Mexico in the mid-1970s. There were approximately 7 to 8 traffic lanes unmarked and no direction for traffic vehicles going both directions on both sides of the road with potholes literally large enough to stop a car completely and not be able to get out
@@danzafrir9193 FSD works amazing well without interventions in areas with well marked lanes and standard roads and road markings. The issue is places like SF that invent their own non standard markings that are seen nowhere else but there, its completely absurd, most new drivers would definitely have issues driving there. If you compare the tesla to a new average driver driving in SF for the first time, other then its edge cases and 'wobbly' driving, id say its better then a human. the wobbly driving is because of the absurd lane lines that the car cant quite figure out right away. This will improve with time. As for the edge cases, those will also improve with time and this test helps find them. its fairly improper to compare any human or a tesla that sees those areas for the first time to a driver that lives there and drives those roads daily, How could they ever compare? By the time they do, teslas will be driving perfectly everywhere else in the USA.
Thank you so much for commenting, it takes a while to put these videos together and comments like these always keep me wanting to make more! I'm so happy you enjoy them :]
At 9:50 I think the auto pilot system saw that it couldn’t pass and to avid going around that u-Haul truck, there for, following that it was kinda still in the others white Sedan’s way it folded the mirror signifying the drive of the white sedan to come on through, kinda like how we flash our lights the let others driver know that they can go in front of you.
Super impressed that it aborted passing the truck when it saw oncoming traffic and then pulled in behind the truck to let them pass! Wow. You're right about the path prediction on Lombard too; amazing!
8:30 tbh it’s more dangerous for drivers to stop randomly for pedestrians especially for those driving behind you. I really don’t like when people do this but realise it’s fairly normal. I think self driving should not do it.
Agreed! Even as a pedestrian I hate when cars stop for me. Like, just drive by and let me wait 1 second longer instead of you waiting 10 seconds and having to accelerate from zero.
@@AIDRIVR If you're up for a road trip, it would be really interesting to see how it behaves in Phoenix. Maybe even compare driving style and time to a Waymo with the same destination. That would finally tell us how much easier the location they chose really is.
I think the difference is that at least in Europe y’all know how to drive streets like this here in San Francisco or Straits or as complex as Europe but nobody really knows how to drive on them lol
That's normal in many countries but seems like in the US with "cars first"-strategy and infrastructure, it's considered bad to cross the streets anywhere but at crosswalks. "Jaywalking." There's not even a German word for it. "Verkehrswidriges Überqueren einer Straße."
@@DerKatzeSonne by having specific places to cross, drivers dont have to worry about people steeping out in front of them, makes it safer for everyone.
@@boostav Well... there's a difference between crosswalks (cars MUST stop; even though they usually don't care as long as no police is around) and "crossing the street somewhere". The latter one isn't illegal but you shouldn't cross in front of a vehicle (you don't have the right of way). Still: If you kill someone, good luck in front of court.
@@jessiejanson1528 Sure, just go to Switzerland, there are crossings everywhere and I love it. But in Germany... Nah. There just are so few that you aren't even really used to them. That sucks. BUT I think it should still be allowed to cross the street anywhere, just not without the right of way.
Wow FSD will stay beta for at least another 3 to 5 years. It will take more than 50% of development time to get the last 1% right and I guess they didn't even start working on that last percent. I think there is even a high probability that current tesla vehicles never get FSD with the current set of sensors and low res cams. Imagine all cars would use tesla's FSD. Traffic would slow down drastically and ultimately collapse. In a crowded asian city FSD would give up instantly. Still far away from usable besides highways. FSD must be able to handle ALL situations correctly on the first attempt without slowing down more than necessary. It seems still quite far from that and they want to roll out FSD to all their cars this year 🤷♂️🙈🙄. Remember all the disengagements in this video happened just in a few hours of driving. Still very very far from self driving. How can they call it beta? I would call it experimental.
I watch both this channel and Dirty Tesla, and from what I can see, your car seems way more confident in the things it does. His car will wait until there is a massive opening in traffic and then go after a few seconds. Your car seems to go even when there is still a car in the way, as a human would. I wonder why there is a difference.
This video is the perfect backdrop for a question I have that I am not sure if you have addressed in the past or not. We know that humans make driving decisions based not only on what they see vehicles and pedestrians doing, but also based on what drivers do. Specifically hand gestures, flashing high beams or even mouthing words. I can think of numerous occasions when I have reached a 4-way stop or a round-about at the same time as another vehicle and one driver will wave or motion for the other driver to go, even if the first driver had the right of way. I think recognizing these kinds of gestures would be valuable for the FSD software to be able to deal with. Say a Tesla is the second car at a 4-way stop and the first car hand motions or flashes high beams for the Tesla to go. A human driver would recognize this and assume the right of way. A similar situation would be when two vehicles are coming at each other and obstacles will only leave enough room for one vehicle. How can a FSD vehicle communicate with the other car in the absence of a human hand gesture? I think this is just another challenge that can certainly be eventually overcome, but it would seem to me to be one that genuinely has real-world implications. This video was very fascinating and I appreciate the time you took making it.
@@chickenchopfriedrice Yes, and also many drivers on the road are impatient and discourteous and therefore their actions are difficult to predict. All added together is gonna be a huge challenge for autopilot.
@@chickenchopfriedrice I've been to Bali and it was crazy. Scooters going in between cars and on sidewalks. Two lane in one direction had 3 lines of cars. Auto pilot follows road markings. The drivers in Bali often ignored road markings.
13:10 this situation with someone entering a car next to you is interesting. Have you ever tried how the AI behaves when standing close to a parked car next to you and while your Tesla starts to move, someone opens the door so far that your car would need to turn left to avoid it? Same with doors of parked cars getting opened into your lane while your car is at city speed.
you are such a cool and chill guy! I liked your attitude very much. keep up with nice work and thanks for your efforts to make our lifes more enjoyable
A lot of the time when we encountered pedestrians standing still waiting to cross the road, we hand signal the pedestrians to cross which FSD is lacking. The same goes true when two cars came to a four-way stop at the same time. A lot of human gesturing and face reading are involved to decide who goes first. I don't think FSD can do that. Some form of communication between the driver and FSD needs to be implemented for such cases.
Or increase driver education: Always yield to the car that arrived first. If you and another driver reach the intersection at the same time, yield if the car is on your right. ... At a four-way stop if two vehicles reach the intersection simultaneously, the vehicle on the left must yield the right-of-way to the vehicle on the right. driversed.com/driving-information/signs-signals-and-markings/right-of-way.aspx#:~:text=Always%20yield%20to%20the%20car,car%20is%20on%20your%20right.&text=At%20a%20four-way%20stop,the%20vehicle%20on%20the%20right.
Actually driving in SF is much Like driving in Italy. I think we won't see anytime soon FSD in Europe. Also for regional distinction. In Italy scooters are like bycicle for the code and you require to pass them without going in the opposite lane. So standing still at the crossing light for me is not right. Same thing for the pedestrian. Sometimes you give the way to the pedestrian on the crossing you won't move at all... But FSD is really impressive.
i drove in napoli, and i remember a bunch of traffic circles, with painted lines being kind of optional.. more scary was driving along the cinque terre, one laned roads up and down hills.. buses, etc.. and no one slows up, you just lay on the horn around curves. was fun if a little crazee
That has got to be some of the worst city planning/ I have ever seen lol, I mean damn I thought Europe was bad but SF is God awful. 99% of humans would get into crashes daily with this shit of road design.
Just found your channel. Can’t believe I’ve missed it until now. Your insights into FSD Beta really reflect a good understanding of how Neural Nets work and how Tesla is pursuing FSD. Thanks!
Ok, AI diver, we need to talk about your ‘tech comments’. Most of the time I don’t mind, but since you have a great following, we don’t want you communicating too many irregular statements. So if you don’t mind, let me update some of your commentary: 1. The ‘AI’ aka neural nets aka machine learning + matrix math is for pattern matching. For tagging objects in the videos stream, like people do real fast; that’s a dog, a box, a bunch of newspaper, a car, a person. It is NOT making trajectory projections nor movement decisions. 2. Linear programming and control logic are making control decisions, turn right, stop, accelerate. This cannot be unpredictable nor probabilistic. It is based on physics, the rules of a road (in each state), and the car’s physical characteristics. 3. Path prediction is linear algebra using Newton’s laws of physics. Acceleration, Speed and distance calculations. In the future, 2D or 3D cartography might be able to be added in (aka Lombard st in San Fran - it should already know the shape from a satellite map, including curvature and each corners apex - but it doesn’t yet) 4. In the future, the neural net MIGHT use pattern recognition to predict object trajectories but that would require a lot more study of POTENTIAL path projection of different object types, rather than actually watching what they’re doing in real time (I.e. why the car isn’t courteous and let people who are NOT moving at a crosswalk, cross it). More can be said, but I just wanted to disassociate the neural net comment from everyone thinking this non-deterministic mathematical capability is controlling everything the car does.
Thanks for a clarifying comment. Regarding 1. and 2. didn't Elon tweet a month ago that the FSD beta neural nets were increment by increment substituting the C++ hard coded path planing/control logic, more specifically right turns on red/creeping up for improved visuals? If that is indeed the case, how can you be so certain in your conclusions in 2.regarding the probabilistic vs coded rules approach? Am I missing something fundamental about the problem at hand, just curious?
@@erik.dahlberg “creeping...” if the cameras are feeding the video stream but are blocked at a corner by obstacles, the creeping is so it could have a wider view beyond the obstacles. This is similar to a person who has to creep up to see what’s coming at a stoplight. My point is the creeping is being performed by control logic, Which then stops, allows the NN to do all the work to pattern recognize, then allows the control logic to proceed forward again, pattern recognition continues to recognize new or advancing objects, till finally the control logic feels comfortable with causing the car to make a right turn. I’m not saying this is not a dynamic process...My point is the neural networks are not directly controlling the brakes and the accelerator. For example watch how the objects in the FSD screen will be recognized and then sometimes blink out and be re-recognized - would you want your accelerator and brake being controlled that erratically? No I don’t think so.
I’m so glad I discovered this channel. I really appreciate your content and I’m looking forward to the times when this channel will be huge because I know it will be and I am one of the early subscribers :) Btw it’s the first time I hear about Andrej Karpathy which is a little funny because I’m from the same little country then him :D (not to brag or anything)
Did you know that jaywalking is totally normal outside of the USA? There is a video here on RUclips which explains the history behind this. Even the word jaywalking isn't known outside the USA. Love your content . Subscribed. :-)
When will FSD be ready? Probably 2031. It is close yet so far from humans. In certain situations, humans communicate verbally to get out of a tight spot. "Man, you have to back up so I can pass." Can FSD understand and talk back?
SF traffic is baby stuff compared to what 90% of humankind experiences in their cities. Tesla's gonna have to set up labs in Dakar, Mumbai and Manila if it wants to seriously boost its AI's IQ. No evenly-paved roads there ; no markings ; crazy roundabouts ; vehicles with absent or defective signalling ; people and livestock all over the place ; scooters infiltrated in all nooks and crannies, often in the opposite direction. By the time it handles this it'll be grown-up.
Hey, Great Video. I wonder if you tested in foggy weather or heavy rain. I drove Uber for 3 months in SF, before city ban cars from Market st. It's always a nightmare to drive in the rain at night. 17 years of driving history in the bay area, I concider myself an experience driver. But still SF downtown + rain+ night = nightmare. I'm very curious how Tsla candle extreme weather conditions. Thank you.
Your disdain for pedestrians or you know, people outside of cars...is a bit frustrating. Americans have such a car fetish. You hate driving in san fran because it's built more for people not 2 ton metal death boxes
If that’s an edge case, FSD isn’t ready for european cities yet at all. Except the long boarders everything else is just normal in cities like Hamburg, Berlin, Praha, Paris, Zürich and so on. I would love to have FSD here but it needs to handle those situations waaaay better and smoother (you would have been honked to deafness with such slow decision making)
I mean... Budapest, Hungary, EU, has quite similar characteristics. Although for example most Italian cities are busier (eg. they have small cars and a lot more (non-electric) scooters, so more motorists on same road area), and UK has tighter roads, I'd say the challenge level and culture shown on this video is quite what you'd see in Budapest.
technology itself is really incredible. but as a $TSLA holder, I am not satisfied.... Elon said it shud be in the market with subscription in couple months but I think it won't be... prly end of this year or next year..? I just think it's not good enough to be operated as "business".
Live up a very curvy highway. FSD has gotten so good at controlling the fluctuating speeds required even around 180 degree turns. Very smooth. Still clips the yellow bumps slightly on some curves. Grateful for the safety it offers.
As someone who is intimately familiar with these streets both as a driver and a pedestrian (and as a skateboarder and biker!), I found this content very, very fascinating. I see AI cars (cruise, etc.) driving around all the time, and I always wonder what the subjective experience for the driver and AI is. Please, more of these videos in the city! 🌉👍 Edit : Your narration/annotation of the content is also excellent.
If I may, I challenge you to, with autopilot engaged, make the left turn from Westbound on Winston Drive onto Southbound 19th Ave, next to Stonestown Mall near San Francisco State. I lived in San Francisco for 4 years and this was my most loathed turn I have ever made in the city.
SF driving is SO different from normal driving. I lived there for a while, so I learned how to be comfortable. Then I came back to Contra Costa and realized on the first day that I was still driving as if I were in SF--I was a monster. lol. I now have two distinctly different styles of driving and easily switch back and forth. But if I didn't notice your license plate in SF, I would indeed beep at you, in that purely friendly way that is just to wake you up. lol
dear +AI DRIVR: i think you are way too optimistic calling that sw version a "beta". You had to take control of the vehicle several times so you didnt let the system decide. When a system is not ready to decide or is not ready to "self run", its an Alpha version, not a beta. I am a software programmer, I know what I´m saying. To my point of view there will not be an existing "beta" until the car fully drives alone. That is, without you even seated there. Still much work ahead.
"A human driver woould have debatably no problem getting this right turn right" Me watching the car turn: "OMFG it is gonna crash why did it turn here??!!! ... Ohhh, thats what this is supposed to be, pheeew!" This is not obvious at all if you are not familiar with those streets
Great video. If possible, next time, refrain from taking over unless the AI gives up completely. It would be nice to see if we can recover from these. By the way, I agree with the AI; I don’t think that the vehicle should stop for potential jaywalkers.
Maybe this is complex city driving from a US perspective but wait until Autopilot is put to the test in Naples, Italy or any major city in India. Look forward to seeing that :)
I use it in Switzerland and it only works ok on highways. Its very confused/dangerous on normal roads, especially on city streets. Its an extremely overhyped product and it will be many years before its ready to drive 100% on its own.
I know emergency vehicles have a special strobe light built in that flashes at a very specific frequency to control traffic lights. Wonder if they made the tesla recognize that same frequency strobe, letting that firetruck command a stop from autopilot. Or, like you said, it's just a fluke from big, red lights mounted up high on the truck.
1) Tesla needs to just geofence their teslas and allow self driving taxis earlier. 2) For their robotaxi service, perhaps full self driving could only be enabled when the tesla is without a passenger going from one person to another, but when tesla has a passenger, it goes to assisted self driving. This probably decreases the consumer risk and insurance premiums. Though passengers should be required to have an insurance policy, or the insurance would need to be worked out somehow. If 1) and 2) are combined, Tesla can probably start taxi service earlier.
I'm sort of shocked, but I guess it makes sense. Lombard street became the ultimate test of an Autonomous vehicles system. Until it can handle Lombard St (without HD maps) any autonomous system will be considered less than complete.
Your website is not working, I would just use Shopify to host your products, most basic and has full front end and back end features including active visitors, sales numbers, tax, free email notifications, automation of all sorts.
Very interesting as always (am M3 LR owner and waiting for my FSD!) Elon tweeted the other day something like ..." I drove a new rout without any interventions". The way I read it, he is implying that the car itself is learning and say 2dn of 3rd time on the same route it will drive better and better than the first time. I always thought that the car is only utilizing the knowledge pushed to it by the OTA updates and you will have to get a new update for the car to figure out how to overcome the situation it previously was not able to cope with
I think you should use Everyday Astronaut music if you were to continue putting music over the clips, he is huge help in informing the public about many innovations and Tesla and Elon related news, even if mainly space and SpaceX
8:30 IMO If pedestrians are stopped and waiting for a car to pass before crossing FSD and you should just drive because you are inconveniencing them by stopping. The time you take to slow down is their time that is being wasted. Then they have recheck the situation and change their plan (which was to cross behind you) and this also needs time. And as a pedestrian I prefer to cross behind a car it is so much easier and more comfortable. Also were there cars behind you? If yes then if you stop you potentially in some circumstances put the pedestrians at risk because some of those cars behind you will on occasion overtake.
well, Columbus and fishmans wharf is one of the most difficult area to drive, from a uber driver's perspective. I am not surprise that FSD won't do well here.
In order to appreciate how advance FSD is...it needs to be compared side by side with other systems but it's just that other systems are still just driving in their sandboxes and can't drive outside of them So FSD already wins in that regard
Your Tesla did the correct stop for the truck to reverse so why did you take over and block the truck from reversing. You should not have stopped the two people with a dog. Those people should have used the cross walk and by you stopping it gave them a flash belief they would be safe to do this again. You stop FSD too soon as FSD knows how close it can drive to objects you are in a poor position to decide to take over. Slow down the speed so you can check FSD is correct.
tbh i was expecting more trivial mistakes pretty incredible how the software is progressing.
Imagine being the guy in charge of what is basically car path finding, and being names Kar(car)pathy
Funny, never thought of that!
It’s simulation.
I swear to god I thought it was his username until I realized it was his real name
I think the name comes from the mountain range in middle and east Europe. Karpaty or Carpathian
@@WilliamDohnany Its correct. Anyways hillarious
I just have to say after driving in SF professionally, daily, during and after rush hour, for 4 years a decent percentage of human drivers aren't ready to drive there either.
The layout is complex and with constant construction going on resulting in detours, lane closures combined with sporting events and tourist traffic it takes a driving competency a some (many) drivers just don't possess.
Kind of a hard question. But based on this video, how would you rate FSD in this video from 1-10. And let’s say for reference the average driver driving in SF would get an 8
Lee - try Driving in New Deli India..........LOL.
@@markplott4820 I've seen New Deli and with all the bikes and animals it's definitely a challenge it looks like chaos to western eyes but if you watch there is a system in place. The worst place I have ever driven was through Tijuana Mexico in the mid-1970s. There were approximately 7 to 8 traffic lanes unmarked and no direction for traffic vehicles going both directions on both sides of the road with potholes literally large enough to stop a car completely and not be able to get out
@@danzafrir9193 FSD works amazing well without interventions in areas with well marked lanes and standard roads and road markings. The issue is places like SF that invent their own non standard markings that are seen nowhere else but there, its completely absurd, most new drivers would definitely have issues driving there. If you compare the tesla to a new average driver driving in SF for the first time, other then its edge cases and 'wobbly' driving, id say its better then a human. the wobbly driving is because of the absurd lane lines that the car cant quite figure out right away. This will improve with time. As for the edge cases, those will also improve with time and this test helps find them.
its fairly improper to compare any human or a tesla that sees those areas for the first time to a driver that lives there and drives those roads daily, How could they ever compare? By the time they do, teslas will be driving perfectly everywhere else in the USA.
You really go the extra mile with these commentaries, put together with care, consideration and good humour. I look forward to them, thanks so much.
Thank you so much for commenting, it takes a while to put these videos together and comments like these always keep me wanting to make more! I'm so happy you enjoy them :]
Dude you are stressing me out. You are crazy! I would have whimped out way sooner with many of these situations. Be safe!
damn son asimo up here in these comments
I’m just gonna casually leave a reply here. Cool to see asimo here.
Work on jailbreak!!!!
try FSD on MAD MAX mode..........LOL.
I had to look up your name one more time just to confirm the top sponsor lol
FSD Beta in SFO is like trying to learn swimming in a sea !!
Congrats on getting the shoutouts from karpathy the legend himself ! Can you upload a raw unedited version of the whole drive? Thanks
God, I love these videos.
Thank you!
The guy's name is Andrej "Karpathy" and he is the director of artificial intelligence and Autopilot Vision at Tesla? You can't make this stuff up.
At 9:50 I think the auto pilot system saw that it couldn’t pass and to avid going around that u-Haul truck, there for, following that it was kinda still in the others white Sedan’s way it folded the mirror signifying the drive of the white sedan to come on through, kinda like how we flash our lights the let others driver know that they can go in front of you.
There are 14 thumbs down on this video? Must have been the GM board of directors.
As a new resident to San Francisco, I'm not sure if I'm ready for the roads there yet.
Also, you trust FSD Beta more than I trust myself lol
Super impressed that it aborted passing the truck when it saw oncoming traffic and then pulled in behind the truck to let them pass! Wow.
You're right about the path prediction on Lombard too; amazing!
11:00 It’s obvious to us that the van is pulled over, while FSD was struggling over it, and I think the open door is the giveaway.
The way you put these videos together is just perfect. Best of all FSD beta testers!
8:30 tbh it’s more dangerous for drivers to stop randomly for pedestrians especially for those driving behind you. I really don’t like when people do this but realise it’s fairly normal. I think self driving should not do it.
Agreed! Even as a pedestrian I hate when cars stop for me. Like, just drive by and let me wait 1 second longer instead of you waiting 10 seconds and having to accelerate from zero.
Would be cool if you can do a drive around Cruise or Zoox HQ in SF😂
I actually did run into one lol I posted a pic of it on Twitter
@@AIDRIVR If you're up for a road trip, it would be really interesting to see how it behaves in Phoenix. Maybe even compare driving style and time to a Waymo with the same destination. That would finally tell us how much easier the location they chose really is.
@@niwasox3 That would be interesting
@@niwasox3 Also, Cruise in SF.
damn if this is an outlier in the USA, this is basically everywhere in europe.
I think the difference is that at least in Europe y’all know how to drive streets like this here in San Francisco or Straits or as complex as Europe but nobody really knows how to drive on them lol
FSD is impressive as always, definitely am surprised with how few scenarios FSD needed help.
Some of these situations it probably wouldnt have needed it, he usually stopped it prematurely just to be safe.
FSD BETA is def not ready for India.
You even have some viewers in Germany... Like me... I really Hope that FSD Beta gets pushed out to Germany soon :()
Nice videos man. They only started showing up on my recommendations a few weeks ago and has continued to deliver.
You know andrej karpathy (director of ai at tesla) tweeted out about your videos!
Did u even watch the video?
@@Cam-jl2if I commented before watching because he never replied to him on twitter so I assumed he still didn't know. Simmer down.
@@GS540 “simmer down” lmaoooo
@@Cam-jl2if glad I got a laugh out of you young whippersnapper.
The two people waiting to cross at 8:32 were waiting on a corner. It wasn't the middle of a street.
That's normal in many countries but seems like in the US with "cars first"-strategy and infrastructure, it's considered bad to cross the streets anywhere but at crosswalks. "Jaywalking." There's not even a German word for it. "Verkehrswidriges Überqueren einer Straße."
@@DerKatzeSonne Might as well not even bother painting cross walks if that's the case in Germany.
@@DerKatzeSonne by having specific places to cross, drivers dont have to worry about people steeping out in front of them, makes it safer for everyone.
@@boostav Well... there's a difference between crosswalks (cars MUST stop; even though they usually don't care as long as no police is around) and "crossing the street somewhere". The latter one isn't illegal but you shouldn't cross in front of a vehicle (you don't have the right of way). Still: If you kill someone, good luck in front of court.
@@jessiejanson1528 Sure, just go to Switzerland, there are crossings everywhere and I love it. But in Germany... Nah. There just are so few that you aren't even really used to them. That sucks. BUT I think it should still be allowed to cross the street anywhere, just not without the right of way.
Love from the UK watching at 3am in the morning.
I loved FSD using turn signals when going down Lombard Street! LOL!
Wow FSD will stay beta for at least another 3 to 5 years. It will take more than 50% of development time to get the last 1% right and I guess they didn't even start working on that last percent. I think there is even a high probability that current tesla vehicles never get FSD with the current set of sensors and low res cams. Imagine all cars would use tesla's FSD. Traffic would slow down drastically and ultimately collapse. In a crowded asian city FSD would give up instantly. Still far away from usable besides highways. FSD must be able to handle ALL situations correctly on the first attempt without slowing down more than necessary. It seems still quite far from that and they want to roll out FSD to all their cars this year 🤷♂️🙈🙄. Remember all the disengagements in this video happened just in a few hours of driving. Still very very far from self driving. How can they call it beta? I would call it experimental.
I watch both this channel and Dirty Tesla, and from what I can see, your car seems way more confident in the things it does. His car will wait until there is a massive opening in traffic and then go after a few seconds. Your car seems to go even when there is still a car in the way, as a human would. I wonder why there is a difference.
So funny that Andrej's name is "Car path(y)"...he's responsible for the car's path!!.
This video is the perfect backdrop for a question I have that I am not sure if you have addressed in the past or not. We know that humans make driving decisions based not only on what they see vehicles and pedestrians doing, but also based on what drivers do. Specifically hand gestures, flashing high beams or even mouthing words.
I can think of numerous occasions when I have reached a 4-way stop or a round-about at the same time as another vehicle and one driver will wave or motion for the other driver to go, even if the first driver had the right of way. I think recognizing these kinds of gestures would be valuable for the FSD software to be able to deal with. Say a Tesla is the second car at a 4-way stop and the first car hand motions or flashes high beams for the Tesla to go. A human driver would recognize this and assume the right of way. A similar situation would be when two vehicles are coming at each other and obstacles will only leave enough room for one vehicle. How can a FSD vehicle communicate with the other car in the absence of a human hand gesture?
I think this is just another challenge that can certainly be eventually overcome, but it would seem to me to be one that genuinely has real-world implications.
This video was very fascinating and I appreciate the time you took making it.
If autopilot can finally handle SF I would really be glad because then there is hope someday for autopilot in my city - Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia ;)
If Kuala Lumpur is anything like Bali, there is no hope. Complete disregard for lane markers. You have roads with 2 lane but 4 lines of cars.
why do you think KL is hard? maybe you are afraid other cars keep switching lanes?
@@chickenchopfriedrice Yes, and also many drivers on the road are impatient and discourteous and therefore their actions are difficult to predict. All added together is gonna be a huge challenge for autopilot.
@@chickenchopfriedrice I've been to Bali and it was crazy. Scooters going in between cars and on sidewalks. Two lane in one direction had 3 lines of cars. Auto pilot follows road markings. The drivers in Bali often ignored road markings.
Congrats on the shoutout I felt excited jst hearing you talk about it
You have no idea man, it's blowing my mind still
If you think this is bad... wait for the FSD vídeos in Europe. Normal roads in the US look like highways to us..
Most towns in Europe are as bad if not worse than SF for driving. Glad you guys are letting FSD learn before it comes here! 👍👏
13:10 this situation with someone entering a car next to you is interesting. Have you ever tried how the AI behaves when standing close to a parked car next to you and while your Tesla starts to move, someone opens the door so far that your car would need to turn left to avoid it? Same with doors of parked cars getting opened into your lane while your car is at city speed.
your Channel is so underradet no joke keep up the good content :D gratings from Switzerland
Thank you! :]
Really cool to see that the vast majority of these are extremely niche scenarios. Thanks for the video! I'm sure Tesla engineers really appreciate it.
Me: *expecting silly lane goofs*
4:06: dear god!
SF and California in general looks exactly like mexico
California was once Governed by MEXICO .
Thank you for keep perfecting FSD!
you are such a cool and chill guy! I liked your attitude very much. keep up with nice work and thanks for your efforts to make our lifes more enjoyable
Lots of interesting situations and you gave a great break down and analysis.
A lot of the time when we encountered pedestrians standing still waiting to cross the road, we hand signal the pedestrians to cross which FSD is lacking. The same goes true when two cars came to a four-way stop at the same time. A lot of human gesturing and face reading are involved to decide who goes first. I don't think FSD can do that. Some form of communication between the driver and FSD needs to be implemented for such cases.
Or increase driver education:
Always yield to the car that arrived first. If you and another driver reach the intersection at the same time, yield if the car is on your right. ... At a four-way stop if two vehicles reach the intersection simultaneously, the vehicle on the left must yield the right-of-way to the vehicle on the right.
driversed.com/driving-information/signs-signals-and-markings/right-of-way.aspx#:~:text=Always%20yield%20to%20the%20car,car%20is%20on%20your%20right.&text=At%20a%20four-way%20stop,the%20vehicle%20on%20the%20right.
More amazing videos. Keep up the great work!
I can barely drive in SF, tesla can get a pass for a little while
my new favorite series on YT lol!
When it goes down Lombard street, does autopilot know that it is going downhill?
Actually driving in SF is much Like driving in Italy. I think we won't see anytime soon FSD in Europe.
Also for regional distinction. In Italy scooters are like bycicle for the code and you require to pass them without going in the opposite lane. So standing still at the crossing light for me is not right.
Same thing for the pedestrian. Sometimes you give the way to the pedestrian on the crossing you won't move at all...
But FSD is really impressive.
i drove in napoli, and i remember a bunch of traffic circles, with painted lines being kind of optional.. more scary was driving along the cinque terre, one laned roads up and down hills.. buses, etc.. and no one slows up, you just lay on the horn around curves. was fun if a little crazee
That has got to be some of the worst city planning/ I have ever seen lol, I mean damn I thought Europe was bad but SF is God awful. 99% of humans would get into crashes daily with this shit of road design.
Yeah fender benders happen all the time in SF. It's a stressful place to drive for sure
8:39 in Greece is much more worse
Bruh. Real people from outside SF struggle to drive in SF (me included). You can't expect a machine to do it at this time.
It will get there. I do these tests for science!
If you think this roads are complex?
Check Indian roads! You would love it.
I can totally foresee an optional ‘crow’s nest’ camera. Man elevation really brings out the best in the lane detection!
Humans only need Two Cameras and a Neural Net computer.
retractable
9:21 - Can we appreciate the super modded 350z?
Is the self driving beta able to honk the horn??⚽️
so far I've never seen it anywhere, but it should soon.
autopilot drives like someone who drives in SF like once a month. a lot better than I expected.
This was a very thorough test of FSD's limitations. This is the test we need!!!! Much appreciated. Solid content!
Glad you enjoyed it, thanks for watching and leaving a comment!
Just found your channel. Can’t believe I’ve missed it until now. Your insights into FSD Beta really reflect a good understanding of how Neural Nets work and how Tesla is pursuing FSD. Thanks!
Thank you for watching and leaving a comment!
Thanks AI DRIVR, very interesting. Can you see FSD realistically being ready this year ?
Ok, AI diver, we need to talk about your ‘tech comments’. Most of the time I don’t mind, but since you have a great following, we don’t want you communicating too many irregular statements. So if you don’t mind, let me update some of your commentary:
1. The ‘AI’ aka neural nets aka machine learning + matrix math is for pattern matching. For tagging objects in the videos stream, like people do real fast; that’s a dog, a box, a bunch of newspaper, a car, a person. It is NOT making trajectory projections nor movement decisions.
2. Linear programming and control logic are making control decisions, turn right, stop, accelerate. This cannot be unpredictable nor probabilistic. It is based on physics, the rules of a road (in each state), and the car’s physical characteristics.
3. Path prediction is linear algebra using Newton’s laws of physics. Acceleration, Speed and distance calculations. In the future, 2D or 3D cartography might be able to be added in (aka Lombard st in San Fran - it should already know the shape from a satellite map, including curvature and each corners apex - but it doesn’t yet)
4. In the future, the neural net MIGHT use pattern recognition to predict object trajectories but that would require a lot more study of POTENTIAL path projection of different object types, rather than actually watching what they’re doing in real time (I.e. why the car isn’t courteous and let people who are NOT moving at a crosswalk, cross it).
More can be said, but I just wanted to disassociate the neural net comment from everyone thinking this non-deterministic mathematical capability is controlling everything the car does.
Thanks for a clarifying comment. Regarding 1. and 2. didn't Elon tweet a month ago that the FSD beta neural nets were increment by increment substituting the C++ hard coded path planing/control logic, more specifically right turns on red/creeping up for improved visuals? If that is indeed the case, how can you be so certain in your conclusions in 2.regarding the probabilistic vs coded rules approach? Am I missing something fundamental about the problem at hand, just curious?
@@erik.dahlberg “creeping...” if the cameras are feeding the video stream but are blocked at a corner by obstacles, the creeping is so it could have a wider view beyond the obstacles. This is similar to a person who has to creep up to see what’s coming at a stoplight. My point is the creeping is being performed by control logic, Which then stops, allows the NN to do all the work to pattern recognize, then allows the control logic to proceed forward again, pattern recognition continues to recognize new or advancing objects, till finally the control logic feels comfortable with causing the car to make a right turn. I’m not saying this is not a dynamic process...My point is the neural networks are not directly controlling the brakes and the accelerator.
For example watch how the objects in the FSD screen will be recognized and then sometimes blink out and be re-recognized - would you want your accelerator and brake being controlled that erratically? No I don’t think so.
Try again after Covid, would be interesting to see how FSD handles normal SF traffic.
If the Tesla team is looking for a city to benchmark their software, SF is your place lol
Definitely
Do you report situations like at 8:02 or Lombard St. to Tesla via the report button?
Disengagements automatically get sent to Tesla
I'm so glad you got a shout out. You really have done some great work getting to know the Beta.
4:03 skateboarders
watch out, you might appear in a gx1000 video xD
I’m so glad I discovered this channel. I really appreciate your content and I’m looking forward to the times when this channel will be huge because I know it will be and I am one of the early subscribers :)
Btw it’s the first time I hear about Andrej Karpathy which is a little funny because I’m from the same little country then him :D (not to brag or anything)
Thank you so much, I really hope you're right!
outstanding how you select only interesting scenes and comment well.
The reason you're videos are so popular is your content and commentary is so good.
Holy crap driving in SF the driver has to know the roads well or else accidents. A lot of drivers don't seem to give a crap.
Did you know that jaywalking is totally normal outside of the USA? There is a video here on RUclips which explains the history behind this. Even the word jaywalking isn't known outside the USA.
Love your content . Subscribed. :-)
When will FSD be ready? Probably 2031. It is close yet so far from humans. In certain situations, humans communicate verbally to get out of a tight spot. "Man, you have to back up so I can pass." Can FSD understand and talk back?
SF traffic is baby stuff compared to what 90% of humankind experiences in their cities. Tesla's gonna have to set up labs in Dakar, Mumbai and Manila if it wants to seriously boost its AI's IQ. No evenly-paved roads there ; no markings ; crazy roundabouts ; vehicles with absent or defective signalling ; people and livestock all over the place ; scooters infiltrated in all nooks and crannies, often in the opposite direction. By the time it handles this it'll be grown-up.
Hey, Great Video. I wonder if you tested in foggy weather or heavy rain. I drove Uber for 3 months in SF, before city ban cars from Market st. It's always a nightmare to drive in the rain at night. 17 years of driving history in the bay area, I concider myself an experience driver. But still SF downtown + rain+ night = nightmare. I'm very curious how Tsla candle extreme weather conditions. Thank you.
Your disdain for pedestrians or you know, people outside of cars...is a bit frustrating. Americans have such a car fetish. You hate driving in san fran because it's built more for people not 2 ton metal death boxes
If that’s an edge case, FSD isn’t ready for european cities yet at all. Except the long boarders everything else is just normal in cities like Hamburg, Berlin, Praha, Paris, Zürich and so on.
I would love to have FSD here but it needs to handle those situations waaaay better and smoother (you would have been honked to deafness with such slow decision making)
I mean... Budapest, Hungary, EU, has quite similar characteristics.
Although for example most Italian cities are busier (eg. they have small cars and a lot more (non-electric) scooters, so more motorists on same road area), and UK has tighter roads, I'd say the challenge level and culture shown on this video is quite what you'd see in Budapest.
technology itself is really incredible. but as a $TSLA holder, I am not satisfied.... Elon said it shud be in the market with subscription in couple months but I think it won't be... prly end of this year or next year..? I just think it's not good enough to be operated as "business".
Live up a very curvy highway. FSD has gotten so good at controlling the fluctuating speeds required even around 180 degree turns. Very smooth. Still clips the yellow bumps slightly on some curves. Grateful for the safety it offers.
As someone who is intimately familiar with these streets both as a driver and a pedestrian (and as a skateboarder and biker!), I found this content very, very fascinating. I see AI cars (cruise, etc.) driving around all the time, and I always wonder what the subjective experience for the driver and AI is. Please, more of these videos in the city! 🌉👍
Edit : Your narration/annotation of the content is also excellent.
If I may, I challenge you to, with autopilot engaged, make the left turn from Westbound on Winston Drive onto Southbound 19th Ave, next to Stonestown Mall near San Francisco State. I lived in San Francisco for 4 years and this was my most loathed turn I have ever made in the city.
SF driving is SO different from normal driving. I lived there for a while, so I learned how to be comfortable. Then I came back to Contra Costa and realized on the first day that I was still driving as if I were in SF--I was a monster. lol. I now have two distinctly different styles of driving and easily switch back and forth. But if I didn't notice your license plate in SF, I would indeed beep at you, in that purely friendly way that is just to wake you up. lol
dear +AI DRIVR: i think you are way too optimistic calling that sw version a "beta". You had to take control of the vehicle several times so you didnt let the system decide. When a system is not ready to decide or is not ready to "self run", its an Alpha version, not a beta. I am a software programmer, I know what I´m saying. To my point of view there will not be an existing "beta" until the car fully drives alone. That is, without you even seated there. Still much work ahead.
"A human driver woould have debatably no problem getting this right turn right"
Me watching the car turn: "OMFG it is gonna crash why did it turn here??!!! ... Ohhh, thats what this is supposed to be, pheeew!" This is not obvious at all if you are not familiar with those streets
Great video. If possible, next time, refrain from taking over unless the AI gives up completely. It would be nice to see if we can recover from these. By the way, I agree with the AI; I don’t think that the vehicle should stop for potential jaywalkers.
Maybe this is complex city driving from a US perspective but wait until Autopilot is put to the test in Naples, Italy or any major city in India. Look forward to seeing that :)
I use it in Switzerland and it only works ok on highways. Its very confused/dangerous on normal roads, especially on city streets.
Its an extremely overhyped product and it will be many years before its ready to drive 100% on its own.
I know emergency vehicles have a special strobe light built in that flashes at a very specific frequency to control traffic lights. Wonder if they made the tesla recognize that same frequency strobe, letting that firetruck command a stop from autopilot. Or, like you said, it's just a fluke from big, red lights mounted up high on the truck.
1) Tesla needs to just geofence their teslas and allow self driving taxis earlier.
2) For their robotaxi service, perhaps full self driving could only be enabled when the tesla is without a passenger going from one person to another, but when tesla has a passenger, it goes to assisted self driving. This probably decreases the consumer risk and insurance premiums. Though passengers should be required to have an insurance policy, or the insurance would need to be worked out somehow.
If 1) and 2) are combined, Tesla can probably start taxi service earlier.
I'm sort of shocked, but I guess it makes sense. Lombard street became the ultimate test of an Autonomous vehicles system. Until it can handle Lombard St (without HD maps) any autonomous system will be considered less than complete.
Considering Tesla is (still) based in the Bay Area, it’s surprising they don’t have full autonomy there. . But the level of autonomy is amazing.
Your website is not working, I would just use Shopify to host your products, most basic and has full front end and back end features including active visitors, sales numbers, tax, free email notifications, automation of all sorts.
Very interesting as always (am M3 LR owner and waiting for my FSD!) Elon tweeted the other day something like ..." I drove a new rout without any interventions". The way I read it, he is implying that the car itself is learning and say 2dn of 3rd time on the same route it will drive better and better than the first time. I always thought that the car is only utilizing the knowledge pushed to it by the OTA updates and you will have to get a new update for the car to figure out how to overcome the situation it previously was not able to cope with
I think you should use Everyday Astronaut music if you were to continue putting music over the clips, he is huge help in informing the public about many innovations and Tesla and Elon related news, even if mainly space and SpaceX
Version: 2020.48.35.7 is the version of the car software, not the FSD software?
8:30 IMO If pedestrians are stopped and waiting for a car to pass before crossing FSD and you should just drive because you are inconveniencing them by stopping. The time you take to slow down is their time that is being wasted. Then they have recheck the situation and change their plan (which was to cross behind you) and this also needs time. And as a pedestrian I prefer to cross behind a car it is so much easier and more comfortable. Also were there cars behind you? If yes then if you stop you potentially in some circumstances put the pedestrians at risk because some of those cars behind you will on occasion overtake.
well, Columbus and fishmans wharf is one of the most difficult area to drive, from a uber driver's perspective. I am not surprise that FSD won't do well here.
In order to appreciate how advance FSD is...it needs to be compared side by side with other systems
but it's just that other systems are still just driving in their sandboxes and can't drive outside of them
So FSD already wins in that regard
Your Tesla did the correct stop for the truck to reverse so why did you take over and block the truck from reversing.
You should not have stopped the two people with a dog. Those people should have used the cross walk and by you stopping it gave them a flash belief they would be safe to do this again.
You stop FSD too soon as FSD knows how close it can drive to objects you are in a poor position to decide to take over. Slow down the speed so you can check FSD is correct.
Tesla FSD at 4:06 : Pedestrians are coming at me from both sides and walking really fast, WTF is happening?