I graduated in 2012 from Fine art drawing at Camberwell and I felt that my course didn't prepare me for the real world at all! I always regretted not doing illustration as I thought they would better equip you to make money/a career from making art so this is vverrrrryyyy interesting! I did a blog post on about my thoughts on the matter if you fancy a read : www.finnleyelliott.co.uk/single-post/2018/07/03/What-I-didnt-learn-at-art-college
@zi am Hello! I had friends who studied at CSM who said the course was very similar to mine, minimal teaching and left you to your own devises. I always thought illustration would of taught you more of the practical side of running a business, but from speaking to other illustrators I don't think that is the case. I don't think it matters at all what uni you graduate from, if your work is of a high standard then it doesn't matter whether you've even been to uni. I think it would really depend on what you expect when you say securing a job? I don't think either course will guarantee a 9-5 job at the end of it. If you're talking about being a freelance illustrator / artist, whatever course you take it's in your hands to make the most of it. Experiment and throw yourself into making a tonne of art! Once you graduate it's exceptionally hard to work on your practice alongside a day job and you'll be in the best position to secure your first commissions if your portfolio is strong. I hope that helps. X
I knew that as an artist I would never be able to afford paying off student loans. So I decided to skip my 4 year degree and study at a community college (sometimes called a trade school) instead, and then just worked whatever parttime jobs were available while honing my skill. I'm getting more and more clients, but I don't have student debt, which I'm very grateful for. Just my unique experience... maybe it'll help someone :)
I think the issue of not informing students about what they'll end up doing afterwards is a general problem at many educations right now. Especially schools that doesn't have any type of internship. I meet many who either ends up working with something completely different than anticipated, or some who get suprised by how their day to day life ends up, even though they initially loved what they were studying. All saying they wish they had been taught more about what their future worklife could look like. And Yes, I can totally relate. I studied graphic design in Denmark and I wish they had taught us more about our options afterwards.(other than working full time of course) and maybe some in depth courses about tax, licensing and getting paid. Thank god for RUclips and people like you who share content about these things.💖
This intrigued me. I took graphic design at a community college in Canada in 2009. I'm now a decently successful illustrative designer (I'm very comfortable and content in my career, I suppose is a good way to put it). I call myself an illustrative designer because my work is primarily illustration, but often used in design settings. My course was 2 years, the first year actually being a buffer year called Applied Arts, which was an all encompassing creative course (illustration, photography, animation, design, etc). I was extremely pleased with the course, and though I've had my share of challenges in the "real world" since graduating, I am still quite happy with everything. One of the main reasons I find this interesting is because I honestly believe the difference between my experience and yours is just exactly what you said about needing preparation in the tech world. It's true, in order to be a professional artist these days, you have to know your way around the digital side of things. One of the main reasons I've been hired again and again is because I could take a project from start (traditional drawings and paintings) to finish (edited digital files) without help. I think it's super important to know the basics of graphic design if you're an illustrator because illustration and design (to me) go hand in hand. And the opposite as well: if you're a graphic designer, it's important to have an artistic talent/skill to supplement your design work. Now that I've written a novel (woops), I'm even more intrigued with this subject. I may have to do a blog post of my own! :) Enjoyed your video and all your videos, really. You're a lovely illustrator and person in general. Keep it up, love it.
That's such a good point - illustration and graphic design are very close. I'd not considered that designers need to adopt some illustrator traits but you're right - it can only improve how they approach a brief. Maybe a simple solution to my course's failings would be a combined graphic design and illustration year. That would have been so helpful, looking back.
Have you considered approaching your school with a proposal for them to hire you to help improve their curriculum? You could develop a curriculum that would help students with these issues. Your complaints about your university are highly valid and common, even in fine arts departments. You already are doing your part to help people with these videos, but I see a job opportunity that would be super valuable to the university system. Also, I don’t think you need to regret saying the name of the school. They should be accountable for their curriculum, and your (valid) opinion could be seen as valuable feedback.
Hi there! Bit late to the party with this video. But I completely share your sentiment. I graduated in 2016 and I worked harder than ever before that last year. Then it dawned on me slowly in the next half year that my diploma that I worked so hard for meant next to nothing in the real world. I took on a shitty and computer related job in a well known Dutch museum (Hi from Holland!). But there was no way I could grow and I really hated it. Fast forward one year after graduating I fell into what they described as 'bore out' I was burnt out from being extremely under challenged at my job. Biggest contrast ever since my graduation. I thought that this was what I had to do and everyone was pushing me in the direction of a boring day job. My body made me stop, It just wasn't for me. Now it's 2019 and I am a freelancer since 2017. Slowly my portfolio is growing and every job is extremely rewarding and enjoyable. I hope I never have to do something else than this. But I wish that uni prepared me much better. Thank god I come from a family of entrepreneurs so as time went on I learned I'm actually pretty business savvy. The 'bubble' effect at art school is so very real and as a young adult I took everything way too serious. Like my world would end if I didn't give 300%. Now I know that's bizar , I just wish that the art school 'climate' would change and educate students better. Give them more tools before they send them off to fend for themselves.
Thank you, Holly, for this great video and I would love more videos like this. Just graduated in July from a degree in graphic design with pathway illustration up North in Salford, so fortunately the design side was covered for me. I think we had the support we needed (they offer lifetime business/enterprise support, library access etc.) and the course was flexible to what an individual needed but when it comes to professional illustration I am glad that I stumbled upon the "Make Art That Sells" online courses while in my 2nd year. They helped me to understand what I need to do before graduating e.g. have my portfolio up and online, go to Bologna Children's Book Fair, make work that I want to get, and how to approach publishers/clients. All this aside, I still wasn't prepared of how scared and lost I would feel the months after graduation. I have a plan, but executing it is another matter and takes much more mental strength than I thought. It is definitely hard on my mental health to constantly battle with the "what ifs" and the insecurity that comes with this career. But I wouldn't want to do anything else. I kind of knew this would be coming, but feeling it is a different matter. I'm slowly working myself out of this paralysing feeling and started drawing again after quite a long break. Hearing you share that it is still tough and probably always will be challenging, just emphasises for me that I need to remind myself that is a long game, a marathon rather than a sprint. I'm still glad I chose this path, and I definitely don't regret it. It's beautiful and life will definitely never be boring.
I am in my third year studying illustration, having all the same anxieties you described here. The additional layer of stress is we are having to do 90% of the course online (paying the same price), with very limited access to resources. I already feared the course wasn’t preparing me for the world of work, now the limitations of the pandemic (though necessary) have heightened that fear ten fold. Solidarity with any other students experiencing the same thing!
Totally relate, I graduated last year from UAL and quickly realized I was not taught the business side of creation. I was just taught to make something which responded to a brief. I am now playing catch up and working hard to actually make the portfolio I should have during Uni, I am learning lots however as its off my own back and I know what I want to do slightly more. I wish I had spend a year out before going to university Love your videos, keep it up!
Just watched your very thoughtful video Holly. I graduated from art college back in the mid '70s and count myself very lucky to have been able to make a good living as an illustrator over the intervening years. Some thoughts that occur to me in response to your observations. Firstly in regard to the advice you got from your tutors regarding prepping yourself for life beyond art college. It was just as vague in my day and nowadays I think it might be a lot worse. While not wanting to denigrate art college staff-many of whom work long hours to help their students-the best advice you will get is from full-time illustrators and interactions with them at art college are few and far between-more so now when there is a requirement for all staff, including part-time staff to acquire post-graduate qualifications-so many illustrators who used to spend a day a week teaching art simply haven't got the time or inclination to devote to acquiring extra qualifications. Plus, the requirements of the curriculum mean that there are only a very few windows of opportunity for colleges to host visits from full-time illustrators. Secondly-colleges, my old alma-mater included are taking on way too many students, resulting in overcrowded lectures (people actually sitting in corridors to attend the lecture!). So more working from expensive to rent digs (and that was before the current troubles), course-work which is non-essential but fulfils the requirement for a degree of academic rigour and not enough emphasis on building drawing skills, handling lighting, mastery of design and composition, storytelling, handling briefs, how to interact with clients, the advantages and drawbacks of having an agent, things to watch out for when signing a contract, book-keeping-the list is endless. Thirdly, and perhaps this is the most important consideration. The world is not crying out for more illustrators-it never has done and I think we all know that. But, if your work is really grounded in the solid skill sets which every art college should be imparting, then you will be in there with a chance. I am a seriously old fart and I am still busy-in fact with new technology and the ability to create animations-busier than ever. For young people reading this who haven’t committed to an art college degree course, I would say think long and hard about whether you need to incur a mega-debt to pursue your passion. I know of many successful illustrators who either never attended art college or bailed out after a year. Check out the film Making It, which focuses on three US illustrators, it’s available on line and should provide helpful insight into what it takes to make a fulfilling and financially viable career as an illustrator. College really isn’t necessary and the chances of feeling let down by what an art college can actually deliver as well as the debt you will incur should make you receptive to the many alternatives that are out there. So my advice would be to think positive-draw, draw, draw and try and make your work stand out for the crowd-there are way too many illustrators producing work which is generic and predictable-find something to say which no one else is saying. You will have more chance of getting noticed and you will get have a greater chance of making a living from something you feel passionate about. www.peter-richardson-illustration.com
My experiences have been much different, but I truly appreciated this perspective. Your first blog post you discussed was actually the day my son was born (who is now 7.)
Hi Holly. Thanks for this video; I am not only a graduate and practitioner, but now a part-time lecturer at my old university, teaching the 'Professional Practice and Self Promotion' module for the 3rd years. Your video (and channel) echoes a lot of what I do try and prep students for the 'real world' ... so i'm sure you'll be happy to hear that there are some of us out there fighting the good fight. It's a balance though; I am very honest with the students but still have to be careful not to be too doom and gloom, as that fresh enthusiasm is also really important to ensure they keep bettering their portfolios, applying for jobs and not giving up too easily. I will be pointing them in the direction of your channel as well. Thank you for the time and effort you put into your content. :)
ps. reading some of the comments, one person suggests you finding a role in mentoring/tutoring at local universities. This 'Professional Practice and Self Promotion' module does exist at my University.. (and I am aware it's a rarity) but something that you should definitely try and have a conversation about with your local uni about perhaps covering for them.They would be lucky to have you and more universities NEED it..but unfortunately, lecturers are usually just that.. academics. Having a successful *working* artist also willing to teach is hard to find.
Hi Holly, it's nice to know that we're not alone in this. I graduated the same year as you and can completely relate to the struggles during the recession. When I finished uni I got married and so scraping pennies together for wedding and home was the priority at the time. it wasn't until late 20's (now 30) that I've tried to make a go of an art career - which has always been an challenge - especially as people seem to want something for nothing or minimal cost. Everything you said for 'part 2' was very much the same for my uni (Derby). Of course I value my time at uni, but the more practical business side of the illustration field was barely scratched from the surface. The little moments of useful lectures were as you say an introduction at best. One area in particular was a 1 morning lecture on paper. It's funny how at the time everyone was mocking how boring it was and dismissed the topic...but dear Lord I wish there were more lessons about paper! It's become a slight obsession now knowing what the best types of paper are for different mediums and 'bad' (unsuitable) paper is a big bug bare. It's a lifelong lesson really isn't it? How do you know when you've made it? Or is it a constant pursuit of knowledge, skill and fulfilment before moving onto the next lesson. As you say, maybe 3 years isn't enough to cover absolutely everything, and actually learning for yourself post uni builds you more as an individual and artist. Great video as always mdear xx
I went to RISD and I actually got a pretty solid education in marketing myself as an editorial illustrator which is awesome. However, our department had a pretty narrow point of view (generally, some teachers varied) and really aimed students at being witty political editorial illustrators or concept artists for tv, and people who worked in a more decorative "pretty" or "cute" style were looked down on. Now that I've left school and took off the blinders of the two illustration jobs we were served in our course, I realize I might be more of a fine artist and less of an illustrator, and now I have no idea how to market myself! I think students could use a more varied intro to how a number of art and illustration businesses work in general so they aren't pidgeonholed by their school's preference towards one type of arts job.
Natalie Kassirer hey Natalie! This was so interesting to read. Am thinking of applying soon and am at a major loss as to what to put in my portfolio. Do you mind walking me through what to put into my folio? Thank you so much, any help will be so appreciated😭
Great video. Thanks for sharing. I think students will benefit from people sharing these real world stories and reflections. Looking back I'm happy with my under grad education.. Then, I wanted to get a Master's in Fine Art but let myself get talked into switching to web design by the recruiter. That was a mistake. I quickly realized it wasn't worth the enormous amount of money I was paying and dropped out.
Hi Holly👋, thanks so much for sharing another wonderful video! I'm just finishing up my online degree in Graphic Design next week and this was so refreshing and lovely to see. I started the degree in the stream of Illustration but I was so afraid of the uncertainty that I switched to Graphic Design for a little more 'career security' or a job that I can work at to get me off the ground. As you said, it's not instantaneous and it's only now that I'm getting to actually begin my portfolio! I'm taking 6 months to go an au pair in Vienna, Austria and will paint during my mornings off and weekends between travel. During this time I will try to get a clear style and consistency going for myself in what I'm happy doing! It's inevitable we all evolve anyway in style but I'll find my starting point! 😊 Next year I'll get a more serious job in Scotland or Ireland (home). I don't know why I've told you all this, I suppose the last few years have been quite isolating as a 22 year old introverted young lady in a village in the west of Ireland! Watching your videos since you started has really filled me with hope and clarity that it's exactly the path I want to take despite all its challenges. 🙌 You are wonderful, I've thought about writing to you so many times but didn't want to sound like an Internet weirdo 😂 to me you have been a friend without ever even realising it, thank you thank thank you ☀️ Yours with heaps of admiration, Kerry 🍁💛 P. S. I am thinking to during this time of exploration and great creativity and adventure to begin documenting it all on Instagram/written blog, I can't afford video equipment just yet but I'll get there with quiet determination! 🌟 If you are in anyway at all interested my Instagram is: @kerryeugenie - very small and I haven't really posted much artwork other than some inktobers last year but I share nature and things that make me happy and will continue with the artwork again now that I'm free from university stresses! 😊 P. S. #2, sorry for gushing in such a lengthy message, it's my nature and I just don't know any other way 😅
You could never be an "internet weirdo" Kerry ! Thank you for sharing more about you - certainly sounds like you're on the right track and switching to graphic design sounds like a good choice for you. Like you say, its not like you've given up on illustration and it'll allow you to get a more creative job than waitressing (like I did) whilst you work on your portfolio! V wise.
It's all thanks to your honesty about the industry, thank you again so much! Hope I can find myself in the same type of shoes as you in a few years time :) All the very best & hope wedding preparations aren't too stressful! :)
I am now two years in, after graduating and it is hard and frustrating. But I learned a bit more about the real world of illustration during my studies, probaly because I took the time and did my masters degree as well. Thank you, Holly, for being real with us. You helped me quite a bit with your videos! Greetings from Germany ~
We graduated around the same time and it's very interesting to hear you reflect back on your feelings from back then, as it's definitely things I felt as well. (Although I studied film, not illustration. Ha, didn't really put it to use until the six months, but hey just posted my first vlog!) Thinking back to when I was in university, I realize social media was literally just starting (you needed a college e-mail to get facebook!) and hardly anyone sold anything online, so running business online was totally new. University wasn't prepared to teach me those things, it was too early. In many ways, we are pioneers of this online media. I feel most of my learning came in the years after university, learning how to run a business.
I’m going to uni in September to study textile design and your channel has been helping me for the past three years, through my last year of high school and my 2 years of college studying art and design and I’m happy that I know all these things that I wouldn’t if I never came across your channel. I feel prepared :)
I can relate! I am a nontraditional student who just graduated in May and I feel completely unprepared. During our senior seminar in the art program, I had to BEG our professor for more real world lessons like setting up a website, how to frame our work, where to find galleries instead of reading articles all day about "what art means." For the senior show, our work was displayed in the cafeteria and we were not given permission to show anything in the community, outside of the university. I thought it would have been a positive experience to go to local galleries and learn how to promote ourselves with the support of the school, but we never got that opportunity. It was a rough transition and I still feel like I need to rebuild my confidence as an artist, and figure out how to incorporate business practices as well. Yes, a lot of this comes with experience, but a warning would have been nice!!
This is interesting for me because my college does not have an illustration program, so I am in a Fine Arts Drawing program. But, I intend to become an illustrator. I find myself complaining about similar concerns and wishing we had an illustration program that focused more on things like the business aspects or working with different types of clients. It seems like the illustration program I am dreaming of might be more of a fantasy than the standard. Thanks for sharing, Holly!
Snap, I graduated with a 2:1 in illustration from Middlesex too! I agree with all the points you’ve made. I enjoyed every moment of the course at the time, but that’s mainly because I was happy to be given the time and space to explore different styles and media. Looking back on it now as someone struggling as a professional illustrator, our course definitely didn’t do enough to prepare us for the business side of things. More classes on digital work would have been much welcomed too. As far as I’m aware I don’t think many of my classmates are full time illustrators now sadly, I think you have to *really* want to make it to put up with all the struggle and sacrifice it takes.
Totally agree 10:22 !! I'm a design/illustration student and as this is such a modern career we should be taught how to survive as a professional after being a student. Its so frustrating being in class, learning about some old guy's theory about comunication or lerning about pre historic art, when we should be learning how to write a contract or how to bild a good portoflio .... how to find a job .... its my everyday existelcial crisis when I'm at uni .... just glad that there is chanels like yours that help us out .
Woah, this brings back memories! My story is a bit different, but yeah, I felt that exact similar frustrations right after I’ve graduated uni. I’ve actually studied graphic design, but at the very end of the year, I’ve come to realization that I have a stronger passion for illustration. So I was very unprepared and frighten about my future - what’s worse is that I was so unsure of myself that I did not had an illustration style/ strong illustrative direction. But yeah, I did felt my uni experience as a graphic design student felt a bit unfulfilling. It’s not to say I didn’t learn anything about design, but I’ve learned more from elsewhere and independently. During my 3rd year, we were more focused on our final projects and dissertations than our own portfolios for the real world. We’ve learned little about freelancing and real life business. The main good thing that did came out of uni was understanding myself better creatively and that I am more of an illustrator.
School taught me nothing about business. I tried to use my skills, had some success but under priced my work and got overwhelmed by trying to keep up with such low pay. I took a break, but now I'm trying to level up my artwork thanks to listening to all these great artists on youtube. Thanks!
Hello !! I'm a student at the same Uni just about to start my 2nd year in Illustration. Even though I haven't been here long, all I've heard from tutors is that they are trying to introduce more industry practice themed briefs, and making sure they give out industry based money-making advice, especially to those in the 2nd and 3rd years. That being said I think there's a long way to go and there's still not enough of an introduction into digital art and adapting to a world where print is diminishing. There have at least been 2-3 talks last year that, despite being optional, offered advice on this topic too, as well as increasing your social media reach and things like website design, from industry professionals, but there's some stuff here and there that people have complained is irrelevant to us. It's really interesting to hear your view as someone who graduated a few years ago because I'm interested to find out how the course may have changed and hopefully adapted to things like this but we'll see!! This course is perfect for me personally and I really can't wait to continue despite being aware of these things, but maybe it's because I am not and was never very industry focused?;; but putting it into context of someone who really has that ambition I can see how it's deeply unsatisfying to be in this position of feeling totally unprepared. Thank you so much for this video I'm happy people are talking about this kind of thing ;;
Heads up for a lengthy comment on school experience! I’m currently attending university for Painting & Drawing in Montreal and I agree with most things you’ve said. I also graduated from a college program of fine arts where I was taught many traditional ways of art but little to no business. I’m pleased that I learnt many forms of art but I wish I had learnt how to survive as an artist. I’m one of the select few classmates that even sell their art, let alone post regularly. I totally second your opinion on the lack of business education in the arts. There is only 3 full time teachers (7 part-time) in a 400+ student program. I also have ENDLESS issues with the school. From the school losing my portfolio, to people stealing paintings,and countless other interaction. I also noticed that the school keeps cutting the art department budget & funds while shovelling money to the other courses like business, and science (Not that I don’t see the importance of those subjects!) The more the school neglects the arts the less the teachers are inclined to care about their students future. I did have teachers that cared once I displayed large interest and saw them privately on my “free” time. They gave me advice once I built a respectful relationship with them. Not enough students care to talk to the teachers. Not enough students are told about the life without the “cushions of university” which results to them not looking for advice. I was included in that naivety once. I was forced to take a year break (from them losing my portfolio and not telling me until the first day of classes, even though I followed up numerous times prior to the starting semester) between college and university where I learnt what I needed to learn to sustain myself. I don’t mean to complain, it’s just my negative view from my experiences. I’m actually extremely thankful for the wake up call I was given and I did have wonderful teachers but I still feel that we aren’t taught how to approach university or use it to it’s full extent. Sorry for the essay, I just have SO much to say on the topic. P.s I do absolutely love your videos, they are super informative and mindful of the art world. I think you depict it in such an honest way. I don’t know much given my little experience compared to others but I’m super thankful for creators like you providing useful information and the truths on contests, free labour and ect. 💕🌱Thanks Holly
This is extremely helpful and im so thnkful to live in a time where it is easier to develop a community of people so are so willing to help eachother, especially when schools are often letting students down in mny aspects
i've graduated a few years now, but i remember that we barely covered the business end by the end of our graduation, that when i did get a contract job i had no idea how to do anything. thankfully, the company i was doing work with was SO nice and helpful; giving me some advice with setting up contracts and invioces. i was just so angry how my school barely covered this when they were really pushing us to be our own brand. how can i do that when i dont know how to price or set up contracts/invoices?? most of these schools just focus on you making the art, but everything else is glanced over, which is really sad and not helpful at all.
Wow very prescient writing. I just graduated with an art degree and have no idea how to find work or what to do with it, I feel like I'm stumbling around in the dark. Thanks for the tips and positive vibes as always. 🙂
This is super interesting to me, for various life reasons I did an English degree last minute when I initially wanted to study Illustration and I always felt like I had missed out. The things I’ve always wished I had support with were exactly what you’ve said you didn’t get in your course either, dealing with clients, the business side... Obviously I did miss out on practical things like experience, time to develop my skills and guidance but it’s funny that the things I worry most about most illustration students (seemingly) feel a bit short changed on too 🤔
It's interesting to see your perspective. I opted to quit pursuing art academically pre-a-level (because I despised the subject in my final year) deciding to pursue it in my spare time & possibly work towards studying it again at university. I've ended up studying for a classics degree, making and selling art/comics in my spare time. I've always had a sort of 'what if' notion regarding studying art at a higher level especially because I know its probably my "main" career aspiration.
I found the opposite in my animation program. We actually had a few classes on the business side: developing a portfolio, how to make a strong demo reel, writing a strong resume, applying for grants, creating a budget for a project, being a good employee and team player, using social media for career and business things (well, this was a web design class but I took it anyways), and creating a website for our portfolio. However, we were lacking many classes on the creative side like 3D modeling hair, 3D modeling clothing, creating particle effects like fire and snow (I learned a little bit of this by taking a game design class but I only learned how to do it in Unity which is not useful to me), how to rig any sort of creature who wasn't humanoid, and how to make realistic skin/lip/etc textures. I'm lucky that the internet is such a huge space of knowledge nowadays, because I can teach myself all these things, but I do believe my program left out some very important things to know in the animation industry, which is frustrating.
Sounds so familiar and painful! I graduated from Graphic design in 2011, it was the middle of recession and especially as a foreigner in a foreigner- sceptical country I couldn't get any jobs for over a year, ended up going back to school for a 2 year marketing course, because I hated being on unemployment benefits and after I graduated the whole cycle repeated, so again to escape unemployment I started my own illustration business, because it was nearly impossible doing freelance while on benefits. Right now I feel like things are starting to look a little bit brighter, but still it is such struggle! And btw all the important things I use on a daily basis- both illustration and design related and business- related I've learned on my own. School was completely useless in my opinion at least it was cheap to free where I live(d), so at least it didn't put me in debt. Both technology and the market today change so rapidly that your knowledge is already dated as you are acquiring it and most schools are way behind on modern times unfortunately!
I relate to so much of what you've said! I'm not entirely sure my course was worth the debt (I try not to think of the debt!) So true that it's often about being self-motivated to keep learning new skills and technology.
I graduated in Visual Arts and I want to focus my work towards illustration, so my case is the opposite of yours. Interesting video format, I really enjoyed listening to you read your own past comments, how curious that at some point you were considering turning to the arts! I would have enjoyed it anyway :)
This is sooo cute. The feeling of loss after graduation is definitely real. Some of our very lucky friends got job right away. Most drifted & taking up whatever jobs they can find. Some drifted even further away & do freelancing like me & you. Hahahahah...oh starving artists....
Wow. I find this video very interesting. I would never had thought that you had all these struggles and thoughts before getting at the place you are now. I find it very important for successful illustrators like you to share this type of content, for aspiring illustrators to know they can overcome these things too... This year will be the 3rd and final year of my illustration course and even now I don't feel hopeful and confident that I could make it as an illustrator and I am having many of the thoughts that you mentioned you had after graduating. I enjoy my time at college more than anything, I have learned things quicker than I would have learned by my own (both about improving my art, discovering what I like and where I would like to head to in the future) and I think that going to college is one of the best things I have done for myself . Even though (at college) we have talked about copyrights, contracts, invoices, (almost not at all about pricing) and things like that quite a few times, I feel like we haven't focus on these as much either (and generally the business side of it) and I turn to books and videos on RUclips like yours, to get more information and a realistic idea of what illustration as a career is going to be like. I value your videos a lot and the time you spent making them, I am sure that besides myself, they are very helpful and educational to all aspiring illustrators that follow you. Besides that I don't feel prepared at all to go out in the world after college, hopefully I will feel better about it after finishing my 3rd year. But at the same time I realize that some or most of these things and the business side of being an illustrator, you learn by doing so, even though it sounds scary going into a profession without being sure what it is that you have to offer and do, how to get there and all that. I do feel a lot that a pretty picture isn't going to take you far if you don't know what to do with it. Even though I believe this doesn't directly have to do with college/uni, as how you think and how much of a business mind you've got, as I have classmates that are already going to fairs, have online shops, get commissions, etc. So I feel like not feeling ready and not feeling confident about being an illustrator probably has to do with me as a person rather than things I could have been taught. I think the business side of art/illustration is a complicated thing to be taught, as there are so many different paths someone could take and everybody's path to success is different. Things like contracts, prices, etc, also depend on the industry you will choose to work for. Therefor I think this is why we are being taught some of it, but it is up to us building our own knowledge us well.
I'm definitely subscribing to your channel, I just finished my foundation year in art and design and will hopefully be moving onto a BA in Illustration, not sure though whether it is the best choice though. My choices are not the most vast since cough cough my grades aren't good enough in other areas to go into other careers.
Thanks for your amazing advice as always Holly! I used to spend so much time in my uni's library, I really miss being surrounded by so many art books and magazine. I remember saying to a friend once " I'm just going to go to the.." and she finished sentence for me :D
Interesting. I graduated last year but it’s picked up for me at the start of this year. I do a bit of everything within Visual Design or UX for digital only. I really like the discussion point on if an illustrator does need to expand their skillset in order to set realistic goals that can be adapted into the roles of a designer and whether or not these aspects are interchangeable.
I have just graduated in illustration and I have felt extremely lost since. I feel like illustration students are definitely not prepared for the real world and we are not shown the different career possibilities. It is just mostly about creating work in your style, which since graduating has actually been some what of a disadvantage. Many design jobs such as an in house designer, actually want you to have a portfolio of different styles which is very annoying when tutors have advised you to put together a portfolio of work in the same style. There definitely needs to be more sessions taught on the business side of illustration, how to handle graduating and what jobs can help support your art career. After going to New Designers it feels like you can only make it if you are the best which seems impossible when there is so much competition! Thank you for your videos Holly! They give me hope and encouragement that I may be able to gain a career in illustration some day.
I always felt art schools should provide marketing education. I did fine art and sculpture in Falmouth, and had no education at all in how to continue past those days. So I agree totally with your comments.
i graduated in 2016 and my illustration degree didnt prepare me really for the outside world. not so much how to create work... , but practical things like how to write a creative cv or best ways of getting experience. I've kinda stopped drawing now, but i managed to get a job as a graphic designer/ui design. its almost impossible for most people to get jobs in illustration or design. i managed to get an internship at penguin random house, which really helped me.
I have graduated in Graphic Design in 2019 to me it was one of the most commercial, by doing this course I fully expected to be guided in how to find clients or charge them, and really very little was focus on this, I felt exactly the same when you said "our tutors were waving goodbye to a group of unprepared ..in my case designers" focusing in the same grades and an exhibition but not in how to develop our careers.
This video is so interesting and I can relate a lot to what you say! I graduated from uni in 2008, but in graphic design (with a lot of classes about illustration, because in the province of Québec where I live, we don't have a specific degree in illustration at uni). At that time, I didn't feel prepared to go freelance as an illustrator. And I didn't have the encouragements of my family to go in that way... So I became a graphic designer for one year and a half and really didn't like it... After that, I returned to uni and did a Master's degree in Speech-Language Pathology... quite different from illustration, isn't it? When I was 30 years old, I realized that never in my life I chose a profession that I liked, for real. So 1 year ago I finally decided to give a try to be a freelance illustrator, the job I always dreamed about but never had the guts to try. So here I am, struggling, but happy and have a lot of fun, most of the time... ahah!! Even if I learned a lot in art school, I didn't learn about the business/marketing side of this artistic career. So I had to read a lot and learn by myself. And I just begin to understand a little bit how it works. So thank you for this video and for your honesty throughout your channel! And thank you for all your precious advices! Also, I'm vegan and I suffer from social anxiety too, and watching your videos is always a real pleasure. Have a nice weekend Holly!
This is so sad to see all the comments that they’ve been failed by unis for “real designer life” I too had this issue, I did a foundation degree to give myself another year to straighten my head and experiment in different techniques to find my style and the reason I did a foundation is because “it’ll prepare you for your BA and you’ll understand more about industry as well as get more offers for the hard bit of uni” and it’s the biggest waste of £9k I finished it, started my BA and then found out that the way the course is branded and the course content advertised it was the polar opposite so I’ve withdrawn and applied again to new places this time that can actually support my health conditions exactly the way my last place promised they would, I mean I was doing a textiles degree and 2 1/2 months in the lecturers just drop into conversation that we had to do 2 units that I physically couldn’t do because tables were too high, I had to use a jet wash and water but I have an electric wheelchair that can’t get right, less than 2 weeks before hand in they tell me I have to come up with something instead as the unit is compulsory so now I’m £18K down and I still feel like I’ve learnt nothing🙄 I don’t suppose you/anyone you know has had experience with Falmouth, bath spa, hca (Hereford college of arts), Cardiff met and abu (arts uni bournemouth) as it’d help me heaps to know what they like in portfolios etc x
Great one!Again:) I can see all commentators are illustrators.Most with art degree.I spent all my education path-which was extremely hard-on economics,finances and marketing...Hoping that my love for art creation would be enough to feel like an artist and eventualy I would work on my own rules as an artist knowing how to -economically-lead an art business ..But there is always that missing part:( The "university" one..I only hope that all those art courses I try to take part in and my hart work on my skills would fulfill that "hole" in my mind..Best regards!
I graduated from Illustration last year, a lot of this sounds very familiar! Definitely agree with the social media side of things, we had ONE non-mandatory workshop about using social media in the whole three years I was there. But the tutor running in was just not up to date with it at all, which I think was a problem with all the tutors on the course. I've had my Instagram account since I was about 15 ( @chloeelisedennis *wink wink*) but found that most of my course mates only started using it for art things in the last few months of us being at uni. It was bafflingly to me that the importance of being online hadn't been stressed throughout the whole three years. I have a friend who's a Fine Art grad who's only just realising she needs a social media presence.
Hi Holly! I’m coming to the end of my first year as an illustration graduate, and I’ve been doing a lot of reflection regarding what I was taught during my time at university. I’d love your input (or the input of anyone reading this) on whether I should bring up my issues with my university. We had countless lectures about not working for free, and how spec work is damaging our industry.. yet were then strongly encouraged to take part in competitions, such as the Penguin Book Cover competition - which was actually compulsory, and we were graded on our submissions. Since graduating I have educated myself more on spec work and dangerous competitions, and I cannot believe I was encouraged to take part. But then criticised for working for free... huh?!?! I’ve seen many of my peers take part in countless competitions since graduating, and I often share your videos in hopes they will see them and understand. Should I write to my university about my concerns? I don’t want to ‘call them out’ as they been good to me since graduating, and provided me with many paid opportunities/ commissions. I feel as I have a good relationship with them, and I’d hate for that relationship to be damaged. But I can’t help but think about their constant contradictions, and how their falling hundreds of creatives mind with such damaging advice... any advice would be so helpful, thank you for reading! xx
I went to school to study fine art and in our school illustration was really looked down on by professors. I wasn't taught how to make a career of being an artist or any digital tools. Two years later I've taught myself to paint digitally and I've slowly been gathering information on how to move into the illustration world (though I've yet to put it into use). I loved college and I think it did a good job of giving me the foundation for my art, but I think it completely failed to prepare me for the real world, especially the art world. Maybe it's because I studied fine art and we weren't supposed to be thinking about money, maybe not. But I'm certainly thinking about money now.
I agree 100 percent ive just graduated in illustration in july 2018 this year and im finding it so hard to get my work noticed. Ive recently gone for an interview and they made me work all day and paid me minimum 50 for all day 10-5 pm in a graphics role. I think placements are good i managed to work for george head office asda designing illustrations for childrens clothes.
I graduated from Falmouth University last year, I feel fairly lucky as were taught the digital side of things and had many lectures in third year about the business side of things. Despite that, I still feel so unprepared! Dealing with finance has been so difficult for me, and also finding the confidence to approach clients. I've been lucky with work this first year out of uni, but I've still had to work in m&s to sustain myself fully! I just hope it continues, it's always so scary after a quiet month
We made our web portfolios but I actually love that my uni pushed my physical ones, I live in London and go to a lot of portfolio reviews and have been lucky enough to have had a few exhibitions and find people remember me and often comment on loving my 'book' portfolio, the last review I went to everyone had ipads and the art directors seemed really refreshed my folder one!
I was considering Falmouth as a Uni actually - I heard the course is very good! Good to hear you felt it was balanced and helpful. Sounds like you're on the right track!
Sophie Mel this is so weird but she does she have Instagram I can message her on about it? I have so many questions to ask haha !!! If not, then I totally understand :)
Definitely don't be scared though, I graduated from falmouth illustration last year and had the time of my life, really just go there and put your all into and make sure to enjoy and make the most out of first year!
Honestly, most of the time, college teaches what's only convenient in a school setting. You are right with the lack of teaching the business side of things. It's just sad.
I am not an Illustrator nor have been lucky (perhaps ambitious) enough to get a university degree but I learnt a trade. Listening to your points, several things come to mind: First of all, most full time university tutors are there because they didn't make it in the world running their own business. In other words, they would not have those experiences you have made during your career and as you are now. Secondly, running a business, marketing, sales, advertising are all different careers in themselves for which you have to train mostly by visiting a uni or other facilities. Definitely, universities should offer these courses geared to creators and small businesses but perhaps they were/are already there but not at your university. Plus you might have not looked for them because - let's be honest - as a creator, do you really want to study this!? Thirdly, I would think that the tutors at uni really want to teach you the necessary skills you enrolled for to the best of their ability so the time there may not allow for this (no idea if this is so or not). However, they should definitely have taught you the skills to work digitally but this brings me back to my first point. Lastly, although I am quite sure you must have been artistic bevore visiting uni, they have taught you some skills that make you the wonderful Illustrator that you are. ;-)
I graduated in 2010 from Pratt in Brooklyn, NY. As an illustrator we actually had to have a minor in Graphic Design but pricing was rarely talked about. I think one of the best references given to me was the SCBWI website. Our biggest problem was the economy being bad in 2010 and graduating with a massive college debt in a very unaffordable city. The average debt after college for us was between 120-200 Thousand. Most of my piers had to be designers just to pay off their debts and at that point illustration seemed more impossible to get into.
I didn’t think there is any degree courses in illustration in India.So it is hard for creative people like me to learn on your own and struggle and cope on its own.I did my animation course but it was not exactly what I liked but just a bit near it.Still struggling today to get commissions as a freelance.I did have a RUclips and Instagram and hopefully like to be survive and make my mark in illustrations like you for example.
I graduated a year ago now, and I feel exactly the same as 2011 you! It's so frustrating how little practical advice we were given, and very few of us are working from my course.
Interesting how at the end you were considering going into an art-related job instead of pursuing illustration. I had a similar thought while going through my graphic design degree. It just seemed like it was beyond my abilities to really be a talented designer, but I'm both you and I didn't follow those doubts. I now make it a habit when talking to anyone starting in a creative field to mention that time when I thought about doing something "easier" - I think it's a common feeling, given the self-doubt so many creatives deal with.
So I just finished my Masters in illustration and animation and a lot more stress is put on digital illustration now I think. I enjoyed the time spent developing more animation based practice so maybe it's a bit better now? Haha that's very non committal. Basically it's hard but I. Did have tutors that made us question and present "what makes us special and different" so maybe the courses are evolving
I graduated from a graphic art/contemporary art practice degree in 2017. I want to teach/support adults in education and illustrate as the work comes in. I feel as an illustrator a degree is more about the final show as an opportunity to showcase. Kids save your tuition money and get together through social media and put on shows yourselves. Unless you need the degree as access to certain careers it’s largely irrelevant.
Hi Holly, have you ever considered furthuring your education, seeing as you've mentioned how much you enjoyed your course? Would it be benefitial at all in terms of furthuring your career? I really enjoyed this video :)
I finished my MA in Children's Book Illustration in 2013, and found many of the same issues. The creative tuition was amazing and so invaluable, and like you I miss the time I could spend doing exactly what I wanted. But business wise there was not much at all. It seemed like there was a build up to the degree show and if you weren't "picked up" there you just felt like a failure really. Since my year though, they have started having a stand at the Bologna book fair which I think has really helped the students develop a dialogue with publishers and agents whilst still under the guidance of the tutors. It took me three years to get published after graduating (during which time I was a health care assistant and worked in a shop) so I would say to others that if you don't get work from your initial degree show, don't give up hope, but find a way to keep working creatively and you will get there. :) Also I would say that the consensus used to be that traditional publishing was the only route to success, and that has completely changed now. You don't need a publisher to get your work out there - you can post your own work online, make and sell your own merchandise, etc, and it is just as valuable and respected (and sometimes as lucrative) as having a book in Waterstones.
This is great advice Lisa! Thinking back I wonder if the pressure around the degree show was more about the university's reputation than helping students find work? Or maybe I'm being overly suspicious!
Mmm, I'm worried fine art is in the same situation (or worse) of illustration. I studied at the fine art academy for 5 years and approached illustration after my diploma. I feel for me is really useful to have learned to paint in a variety of media, to draw a nude in scale 1:1 or to sculpt; at the same time I didn't receive advices on how start/build my own business as an artist and related important stuff. There was not even an internship or something that would put me into the "work world" before graduating.
I have just completed my illustration studies, and I'm already finding it mentally difficult. I had planned to return to my university in September to study MA Textiles Design. However after being accepted the course has now been canceled due to the lack of applications (I believe covid is the cause of this). I was organised and excited to learn and develop a textiles portfolio, but now plans have completely changed, and I am unprepared. I contacted my university, but they responded with an empty apology and waved me away. What am I to do now?! I desperately want to become a pattern designer and my degree work was heavily illustration for textiles. But I have gaps in my knowledge. I am struggling to find a textiles or print design internship - because they all want textiles graduates! I loved illustration because it is so broad, but now it is difficult to get someone to believe you specialise in a certain area. help help help. I also have no idea how to approach local art shops to get my work put on sale. I have an Etsy shop, but sales are slow... I feel so deflated. All my plans have been ripped away from me, and I've been left out in the cold.
Wonderful to hear from past AND present Holly :-) I went to uni for Costume Design, but am now a fine artist / illustrator. Similar to your time in education, I wasn't presented with practical ways to assert myself out in the "real world." Although Costume Design was a good base for learning color and shape, and a little drawing, as for the whole art career, I had to start from scratch. I'm still learning about taxes, pricing, contracts, marketing...it's a very DIY kind of job! But I'm so happy to be doing what I love. I always love your videos, Holly. Thank you for sharing your heart and your kind, thoughtful, helpful words
I've just finished my degree in Illustration and Animation. I'm not sure what exactly I want to do yet, so I'm starting my masters in September. I'm hoping I can use it to build my portfolio and as I have a degree, I can start looking for freelancing jobs like my coursemates but I won't have to get a full time crappy retail job, I'll be able to do the art I want for my course. I'm also hoping I can use this year to grow my social media accounts and get more exposure.
Oh yeah, memory lane. The one thing internet has brought us.... easy permanent record of what we did when XD and somewhere there is always a reminder of the past XD
Thank you for this video, I like the concept about creating work for your portfolio instead of work for free for others, I have a question why did you work as waitress ? why not asking your parents to support you until you get a job as illustrator ?
My mum supported me after uni by offering me a place to stay rent free whilst I paid back some debt - that was more than enough help! Then when I moved out I wanted to pay my own way and work things out for myself.
I graduated in 2012 from Fine art drawing at Camberwell and I felt that my course didn't prepare me for the real world at all! I always regretted not doing illustration as I thought they would better equip you to make money/a career from making art so this is vverrrrryyyy interesting! I did a blog post on about my thoughts on the matter if you fancy a read : www.finnleyelliott.co.uk/single-post/2018/07/03/What-I-didnt-learn-at-art-college
This was such a great blog post, thanks for sharing! Seems Fine Art & Illustration courses are lacking in the same areas
Your work actually stunning you got some real talent, I love cat painting
@zi am Hello! I had friends who studied at CSM who said the course was very similar to mine, minimal teaching and left you to your own devises. I always thought illustration would of taught you more of the practical side of running a business, but from speaking to other illustrators I don't think that is the case. I don't think it matters at all what uni you graduate from, if your work is of a high standard then it doesn't matter whether you've even been to uni. I think it would really depend on what you expect when you say securing a job? I don't think either course will guarantee a 9-5 job at the end of it. If you're talking about being a freelance illustrator / artist, whatever course you take it's in your hands to make the most of it. Experiment and throw yourself into making a tonne of art! Once you graduate it's exceptionally hard to work on your practice alongside a day job and you'll be in the best position to secure your first commissions if your portfolio is strong. I hope that helps. X
I CAN'T believe that illustration courses don't teach Photoshop and Illustrator!! That's a basic skill for any creative job.
Willa Gebbie Columbia College Chicago offers courses on these programs, although they are not guaranteed.
I knew that as an artist I would never be able to afford paying off student loans. So I decided to skip my 4 year degree and study at a community college (sometimes called a trade school) instead, and then just worked whatever parttime jobs were available while honing my skill. I'm getting more and more clients, but I don't have student debt, which I'm very grateful for. Just my unique experience... maybe it'll help someone :)
I think the issue of not informing students about what they'll end up doing afterwards is a general problem at many educations right now. Especially schools that doesn't have any type of internship. I meet many who either ends up working with something completely different than anticipated, or some who get suprised by how their day to day life ends up, even though they initially loved what they were studying. All saying they wish they had been taught more about what their future
worklife could look like.
And Yes, I can totally relate. I studied graphic design in Denmark and I wish they had taught us more about our options afterwards.(other than working full time of course) and maybe some in depth courses about tax, licensing and getting paid.
Thank god for RUclips and people like you who share content about these things.💖
This intrigued me. I took graphic design at a community college in Canada in 2009. I'm now a decently successful illustrative designer (I'm very comfortable and content in my career, I suppose is a good way to put it). I call myself an illustrative designer because my work is primarily illustration, but often used in design settings. My course was 2 years, the first year actually being a buffer year called Applied Arts, which was an all encompassing creative course (illustration, photography, animation, design, etc). I was extremely pleased with the course, and though I've had my share of challenges in the "real world" since graduating, I am still quite happy with everything. One of the main reasons I find this interesting is because I honestly believe the difference between my experience and yours is just exactly what you said about needing preparation in the tech world. It's true, in order to be a professional artist these days, you have to know your way around the digital side of things. One of the main reasons I've been hired again and again is because I could take a project from start (traditional drawings and paintings) to finish (edited digital files) without help. I think it's super important to know the basics of graphic design if you're an illustrator because illustration and design (to me) go hand in hand. And the opposite as well: if you're a graphic designer, it's important to have an artistic talent/skill to supplement your design work. Now that I've written a novel (woops), I'm even more intrigued with this subject. I may have to do a blog post of my own! :) Enjoyed your video and all your videos, really. You're a lovely illustrator and person in general. Keep it up, love it.
That's such a good point - illustration and graphic design are very close. I'd not considered that designers need to adopt some illustrator traits but you're right - it can only improve how they approach a brief. Maybe a simple solution to my course's failings would be a combined graphic design and illustration year. That would have been so helpful, looking back.
Have you considered approaching your school with a proposal for them to hire you to help improve their curriculum? You could develop a curriculum that would help students with these issues. Your complaints about your university are highly valid and common, even in fine arts departments. You already are doing your part to help people with these videos, but I see a job opportunity that would be super valuable to the university system. Also, I don’t think you need to regret saying the name of the school. They should be accountable for their curriculum, and your (valid) opinion could be seen as valuable feedback.
Hi there! Bit late to the party with this video. But I completely share your sentiment. I graduated in 2016 and I worked harder than ever before that last year. Then it dawned on me slowly in the next half year that my diploma that I worked so hard for meant next to nothing in the real world. I took on a shitty and computer related job in a well known Dutch museum (Hi from Holland!). But there was no way I could grow and I really hated it. Fast forward one year after graduating I fell into what they described as 'bore out' I was burnt out from being extremely under challenged at my job. Biggest contrast ever since my graduation. I thought that this was what I had to do and everyone was pushing me in the direction of a boring day job. My body made me stop, It just wasn't for me. Now it's 2019 and I am a freelancer since 2017. Slowly my portfolio is growing and every job is extremely rewarding and enjoyable. I hope I never have to do something else than this. But I wish that uni prepared me much better. Thank god I come from a family of entrepreneurs so as time went on I learned I'm actually pretty business savvy. The 'bubble' effect at art school is so very real and as a young adult I took everything way too serious. Like my world would end if I didn't give 300%. Now I know that's bizar , I just wish that the art school 'climate' would change and educate students better. Give them more tools before they send them off to fend for themselves.
Thank you, Holly, for this great video and I would love more videos like this. Just graduated in July from a degree in graphic design with pathway illustration up North in Salford, so fortunately the design side was covered for me. I think we had the support we needed (they offer lifetime business/enterprise support, library access etc.) and the course was flexible to what an individual needed but when it comes to professional illustration I am glad that I stumbled upon the "Make Art That Sells" online courses while in my 2nd year. They helped me to understand what I need to do before graduating e.g. have my portfolio up and online, go to Bologna Children's Book Fair, make work that I want to get, and how to approach publishers/clients. All this aside, I still wasn't prepared of how scared and lost I would feel the months after graduation. I have a plan, but executing it is another matter and takes much more mental strength than I thought. It is definitely hard on my mental health to constantly battle with the "what ifs" and the insecurity that comes with this career. But I wouldn't want to do anything else. I kind of knew this would be coming, but feeling it is a different matter. I'm slowly working myself out of this paralysing feeling and started drawing again after quite a long break. Hearing you share that it is still tough and probably always will be challenging, just emphasises for me that I need to remind myself that is a long game, a marathon rather than a sprint. I'm still glad I chose this path, and I definitely don't regret it. It's beautiful and life will definitely never be boring.
Such wise words. You've got the right mentality for the fight, thats for sure!
I am in my third year studying illustration, having all the same anxieties you described here. The additional layer of stress is we are having to do 90% of the course online (paying the same price), with very limited access to resources.
I already feared the course wasn’t preparing me for the world of work, now the limitations of the pandemic (though necessary) have heightened that fear ten fold. Solidarity with any other students experiencing the same thing!
Totally relate, I graduated last year from UAL and quickly realized I was not taught the business side of creation. I was just taught to make something which responded to a brief. I am now playing catch up and working hard to actually make the portfolio I should have during Uni, I am learning lots however as its off my own back and I know what I want to do slightly more. I wish I had spend a year out before going to university
Love your videos, keep it up!
Just watched your very thoughtful video Holly. I graduated from art college back in the mid '70s and count myself very lucky to have been able to make a good living as an illustrator over the intervening years.
Some thoughts that occur to me in response to your observations. Firstly in regard to the advice you got from your tutors regarding prepping yourself for life beyond art college. It was just as vague in my day and nowadays I think it might be a lot worse. While not wanting to denigrate art college staff-many of whom work long hours to help their students-the best advice you will get is from full-time illustrators and interactions with them at art college are few and far between-more so now when there is a requirement for all staff, including part-time staff to acquire post-graduate qualifications-so many illustrators who used to spend a day a week teaching art simply haven't got the time or inclination to devote to acquiring extra qualifications. Plus, the requirements of the curriculum mean that there are only a very few windows of opportunity for colleges to host visits from full-time illustrators.
Secondly-colleges, my old alma-mater included are taking on way too many students, resulting in overcrowded lectures (people actually sitting in corridors to attend the lecture!). So more working from expensive to rent digs (and that was before the current troubles), course-work which is non-essential but fulfils the requirement for a degree of academic rigour and not enough emphasis on building drawing skills, handling lighting, mastery of design and composition, storytelling, handling briefs, how to interact with clients, the advantages and drawbacks of having an agent, things to watch out for when signing a contract, book-keeping-the list is endless.
Thirdly, and perhaps this is the most important consideration. The world is not crying out for more illustrators-it never has done and I think we all know that. But, if your work is really grounded in the solid skill sets which every art college should be imparting, then you will be in there with a chance. I am a seriously old fart and I am still busy-in fact with new technology and the ability to create animations-busier than ever.
For young people reading this who haven’t committed to an art college degree course, I would say think long and hard about whether you need to incur a mega-debt to pursue your passion. I know of many successful illustrators who either never attended art college or bailed out after a year. Check out the film Making It, which focuses on three US illustrators, it’s available on line and should provide helpful insight into what it takes to make a fulfilling and financially viable career as an illustrator. College really isn’t necessary and the chances of feeling let down by what an art college can actually deliver as well as the debt you will incur should make you receptive to the many alternatives that are out there.
So my advice would be to think positive-draw, draw, draw and try and make your work stand out for the crowd-there are way too many illustrators producing work which is generic and predictable-find something to say which no one else is saying. You will have more chance of getting noticed and you will get have a greater chance of making a living from something you feel passionate about.
www.peter-richardson-illustration.com
My experiences have been much different, but I truly appreciated this perspective. Your first blog post you discussed was actually the day my son was born (who is now 7.)
Hi Holly. Thanks for this video; I am not only a graduate and practitioner, but now a part-time lecturer at my old university, teaching the 'Professional Practice and Self Promotion' module for the 3rd years. Your video (and channel) echoes a lot of what I do try and prep students for the 'real world' ... so i'm sure you'll be happy to hear that there are some of us out there fighting the good fight. It's a balance though; I am very honest with the students but still have to be careful not to be too doom and gloom, as that fresh enthusiasm is also really important to ensure they keep bettering their portfolios, applying for jobs and not giving up too easily. I will be pointing them in the direction of your channel as well. Thank you for the time and effort you put into your content. :)
ps. reading some of the comments, one person suggests you finding a role in mentoring/tutoring at local universities. This 'Professional Practice and Self Promotion' module does exist at my University.. (and I am aware it's a rarity) but something that you should definitely try and have a conversation about with your local uni about perhaps covering for them.They would be lucky to have you and more universities NEED it..but unfortunately, lecturers are usually just that.. academics. Having a successful *working* artist also willing to teach is hard to find.
Hi Holly, it's nice to know that we're not alone in this. I graduated the same year as you and can completely relate to the struggles during the recession. When I finished uni I got married and so scraping pennies together for wedding and home was the priority at the time. it wasn't until late 20's (now 30) that I've tried to make a go of an art career - which has always been an challenge - especially as people seem to want something for nothing or minimal cost. Everything you said for 'part 2' was very much the same for my uni (Derby). Of course I value my time at uni, but the more practical business side of the illustration field was barely scratched from the surface. The little moments of useful lectures were as you say an introduction at best. One area in particular was a 1 morning lecture on paper. It's funny how at the time everyone was mocking how boring it was and dismissed the topic...but dear Lord I wish there were more lessons about paper! It's become a slight obsession now knowing what the best types of paper are for different mediums and 'bad' (unsuitable) paper is a big bug bare. It's a lifelong lesson really isn't it? How do you know when you've made it? Or is it a constant pursuit of knowledge, skill and fulfilment before moving onto the next lesson. As you say, maybe 3 years isn't enough to cover absolutely everything, and actually learning for yourself post uni builds you more as an individual and artist. Great video as always mdear xx
I went to RISD and I actually got a pretty solid education in marketing myself as an editorial illustrator which is awesome. However, our department had a pretty narrow point of view (generally, some teachers varied) and really aimed students at being witty political editorial illustrators or concept artists for tv, and people who worked in a more decorative "pretty" or "cute" style were looked down on. Now that I've left school and took off the blinders of the two illustration jobs we were served in our course, I realize I might be more of a fine artist and less of an illustrator, and now I have no idea how to market myself! I think students could use a more varied intro to how a number of art and illustration businesses work in general so they aren't pidgeonholed by their school's preference towards one type of arts job.
Natalie Kassirer hey Natalie! This was so interesting to read. Am thinking of applying soon and am at a major loss as to what to put in my portfolio. Do you mind walking me through what to put into my folio? Thank you so much, any help will be so appreciated😭
Great video. Thanks for sharing. I think students will benefit from people sharing these real world stories and reflections.
Looking back I'm happy with my under grad education.. Then, I wanted to get a Master's in Fine Art but let myself get talked into switching to web design by the recruiter. That was a mistake. I quickly realized it wasn't worth the enormous amount of money I was paying and dropped out.
Hi Holly👋, thanks so much for sharing another wonderful video! I'm just finishing up my online degree in Graphic Design next week and this was so refreshing and lovely to see. I started the degree in the stream of Illustration but I was so afraid of the uncertainty that I switched to Graphic Design for a little more 'career security' or a job that I can work at to get me off the ground. As you said, it's not instantaneous and it's only now that I'm getting to actually begin my portfolio! I'm taking 6 months to go an au pair in Vienna, Austria and will paint during my mornings off and weekends between travel. During this time I will try to get a clear style and consistency going for myself in what I'm happy doing! It's inevitable we all evolve anyway in style but I'll find my starting point! 😊 Next year I'll get a more serious job in Scotland or Ireland (home). I don't know why I've told you all this, I suppose the last few years have been quite isolating as a 22 year old introverted young lady in a village in the west of Ireland! Watching your videos since you started has really filled me with hope and clarity that it's exactly the path I want to take despite all its challenges. 🙌 You are wonderful, I've thought about writing to you so many times but didn't want to sound like an Internet weirdo 😂 to me you have been a friend without ever even realising it, thank you thank thank you ☀️ Yours with heaps of admiration, Kerry 🍁💛
P. S. I am thinking to during this time of exploration and great creativity and adventure to begin documenting it all on Instagram/written blog, I can't afford video equipment just yet but I'll get there with quiet determination! 🌟 If you are in anyway at all interested my Instagram is: @kerryeugenie - very small and I haven't really posted much artwork other than some inktobers last year but I share nature and things that make me happy and will continue with the artwork again now that I'm free from university stresses! 😊
P. S. #2, sorry for gushing in such a lengthy message, it's my nature and I just don't know any other way 😅
You could never be an "internet weirdo" Kerry ! Thank you for sharing more about you - certainly sounds like you're on the right track and switching to graphic design sounds like a good choice for you. Like you say, its not like you've given up on illustration and it'll allow you to get a more creative job than waitressing (like I did) whilst you work on your portfolio! V wise.
It's all thanks to your honesty about the industry, thank you again so much! Hope I can find myself in the same type of shoes as you in a few years time :) All the very best & hope wedding preparations aren't too stressful! :)
I am now two years in, after graduating and it is hard and frustrating. But I learned a bit more about the real world of illustration during my studies, probaly because I took the time and did my masters degree as well.
Thank you, Holly, for being real with us. You helped me quite a bit with your videos! Greetings from Germany ~
We graduated around the same time and it's very interesting to hear you reflect back on your feelings from back then, as it's definitely things I felt as well. (Although I studied film, not illustration. Ha, didn't really put it to use until the six months, but hey just posted my first vlog!) Thinking back to when I was in university, I realize social media was literally just starting (you needed a college e-mail to get facebook!) and hardly anyone sold anything online, so running business online was totally new. University wasn't prepared to teach me those things, it was too early. In many ways, we are pioneers of this online media. I feel most of my learning came in the years after university, learning how to run a business.
I’m going to uni in September to study textile design and your channel has been helping me for the past three years, through my last year of high school and my 2 years of college studying art and design and I’m happy that I know all these things that I wouldn’t if I never came across your channel. I feel prepared :)
I can relate! I am a nontraditional student who just graduated in May and I feel completely unprepared. During our senior seminar in the art program, I had to BEG our professor for more real world lessons like setting up a website, how to frame our work, where to find galleries instead of reading articles all day about "what art means." For the senior show, our work was displayed in the cafeteria and we were not given permission to show anything in the community, outside of the university. I thought it would have been a positive experience to go to local galleries and learn how to promote ourselves with the support of the school, but we never got that opportunity. It was a rough transition and I still feel like I need to rebuild my confidence as an artist, and figure out how to incorporate business practices as well. Yes, a lot of this comes with experience, but a warning would have been nice!!
This is interesting for me because my college does not have an illustration program, so I am in a Fine Arts Drawing program. But, I intend to become an illustrator. I find myself complaining about similar concerns and wishing we had an illustration program that focused more on things like the business aspects or working with different types of clients. It seems like the illustration program I am dreaming of might be more of a fantasy than the standard. Thanks for sharing, Holly!
Snap, I graduated with a 2:1 in illustration from Middlesex too! I agree with all the points you’ve made. I enjoyed every moment of the course at the time, but that’s mainly because I was happy to be given the time and space to explore different styles and media. Looking back on it now as someone struggling as a professional illustrator, our course definitely didn’t do enough to prepare us for the business side of things. More classes on digital work would have been much welcomed too. As far as I’m aware I don’t think many of my classmates are full time illustrators now sadly, I think you have to *really* want to make it to put up with all the struggle and sacrifice it takes.
Totally agree 10:22 !! I'm a design/illustration student and as this is such a modern career we should be taught how to survive as a professional after being a student. Its so frustrating being in class, learning about some old guy's theory about comunication or lerning about pre historic art, when we should be learning how to write a contract or how to bild a good portoflio .... how to find a job .... its my everyday existelcial crisis when I'm at uni .... just glad that there is chanels like yours that help us out .
Woah, this brings back memories! My story is a bit different, but yeah, I felt that exact similar frustrations right after I’ve graduated uni. I’ve actually studied graphic design, but at the very end of the year, I’ve come to realization that I have a stronger passion for illustration. So I was very unprepared and frighten about my future - what’s worse is that I was so unsure of myself that I did not had an illustration style/ strong illustrative direction.
But yeah, I did felt my uni experience as a graphic design student felt a bit unfulfilling. It’s not to say I didn’t learn anything about design, but I’ve learned more from elsewhere and independently. During my 3rd year, we were more focused on our final projects and dissertations than our own portfolios for the real world. We’ve learned little about freelancing and real life business. The main good thing that did came out of uni was understanding myself better creatively and that I am more of an illustrator.
School taught me nothing about business. I tried to use my skills, had some success but under priced my work and got overwhelmed by trying to keep up with such low pay. I took a break, but now I'm trying to level up my artwork thanks to listening to all these great artists on youtube. Thanks!
Hello !! I'm a student at the same Uni just about to start my 2nd year in Illustration. Even though I haven't been here long, all I've heard from tutors is that they are trying to introduce more industry practice themed briefs, and making sure they give out industry based money-making advice, especially to those in the 2nd and 3rd years. That being said I think there's a long way to go and there's still not enough of an introduction into digital art and adapting to a world where print is diminishing. There have at least been 2-3 talks last year that, despite being optional, offered advice on this topic too, as well as increasing your social media reach and things like website design, from industry professionals, but there's some stuff here and there that people have complained is irrelevant to us. It's really interesting to hear your view as someone who graduated a few years ago because I'm interested to find out how the course may have changed and hopefully adapted to things like this but we'll see!!
This course is perfect for me personally and I really can't wait to continue despite being aware of these things, but maybe it's because I am not and was never very industry focused?;; but putting it into context of someone who really has that ambition I can see how it's deeply unsatisfying to be in this position of feeling totally unprepared. Thank you so much for this video I'm happy people are talking about this kind of thing ;;
Heads up for a lengthy comment on school experience!
I’m currently attending university for Painting & Drawing in Montreal and I agree with most things you’ve said. I also graduated from a college program of fine arts where I was taught many traditional ways of art but little to no business. I’m pleased that I learnt many forms of art but I wish I had learnt how to survive as an artist. I’m one of the select few classmates that even sell their art, let alone post regularly. I totally second your opinion on the lack of business education in the arts.
There is only 3 full time teachers (7 part-time) in a 400+ student program. I also have ENDLESS issues with the school. From the school losing my portfolio, to people stealing paintings,and countless other interaction. I also noticed that the school keeps cutting the art department budget & funds while shovelling money to the other courses like business, and science (Not that I don’t see the importance of those subjects!) The more the school neglects the arts the less the teachers are inclined to care about their students future. I did have teachers that cared once I displayed large interest and saw them privately on my “free” time. They gave me advice once I built a respectful relationship with them. Not enough students care to talk to the teachers. Not enough students are told about the life without the “cushions of university” which results to them not looking for advice. I was included in that naivety once. I was forced to take a year break (from them losing my portfolio and not telling me until the first day of classes, even though I followed up numerous times prior to the starting semester) between college and university where I learnt what I needed to learn to sustain myself. I don’t mean to complain, it’s just my negative view from my experiences. I’m actually extremely thankful for the wake up call I was given and I did have wonderful teachers but I still feel that we aren’t taught how to approach university or use it to it’s full extent. Sorry for the essay, I just have SO much to say on the topic.
P.s I do absolutely love your videos, they are super informative and mindful of the art world. I think you depict it in such an honest way. I don’t know much given my little experience compared to others but I’m super thankful for creators like you providing useful information and the truths on contests, free labour and ect.
💕🌱Thanks Holly
I can't wait to see your new cook book Holly. It's going to be a hit.!!
This is extremely helpful and im so thnkful to live in a time where it is easier to develop a community of people so are so willing to help eachother, especially when schools are often letting students down in mny aspects
i've graduated a few years now, but i remember that we barely covered the business end by the end of our graduation, that when i did get a contract job i had no idea how to do anything. thankfully, the company i was doing work with was SO nice and helpful; giving me some advice with setting up contracts and invioces. i was just so angry how my school barely covered this when they were really pushing us to be our own brand. how can i do that when i dont know how to price or set up contracts/invoices??
most of these schools just focus on you making the art, but everything else is glanced over, which is really sad and not helpful at all.
Wow very prescient writing. I just graduated with an art degree and have no idea how to find work or what to do with it, I feel like I'm stumbling around in the dark. Thanks for the tips and positive vibes as always. 🙂
This is super interesting to me, for various life reasons I did an English degree last minute when I initially wanted to study Illustration and I always felt like I had missed out. The things I’ve always wished I had support with were exactly what you’ve said you didn’t get in your course either, dealing with clients, the business side... Obviously I did miss out on practical things like experience, time to develop my skills and guidance but it’s funny that the things I worry most about most illustration students (seemingly) feel a bit short changed on too 🤔
You should be really proud of your self x
It's interesting to see your perspective. I opted to quit pursuing art academically pre-a-level (because I despised the subject in my final year) deciding to pursue it in my spare time & possibly work towards studying it again at university. I've ended up studying for a classics degree, making and selling art/comics in my spare time. I've always had a sort of 'what if' notion regarding studying art at a higher level especially because I know its probably my "main" career aspiration.
I found the opposite in my animation program. We actually had a few classes on the business side: developing a portfolio, how to make a strong demo reel, writing a strong resume, applying for grants, creating a budget for a project, being a good employee and team player, using social media for career and business things (well, this was a web design class but I took it anyways), and creating a website for our portfolio. However, we were lacking many classes on the creative side like 3D modeling hair, 3D modeling clothing, creating particle effects like fire and snow (I learned a little bit of this by taking a game design class but I only learned how to do it in Unity which is not useful to me), how to rig any sort of creature who wasn't humanoid, and how to make realistic skin/lip/etc textures. I'm lucky that the internet is such a huge space of knowledge nowadays, because I can teach myself all these things, but I do believe my program left out some very important things to know in the animation industry, which is frustrating.
That's so interesting to hear the opposite end of the spectrum - seems courses struggle to have a good balance of business and creative skills.
Sounds so familiar and painful! I graduated from Graphic design in 2011, it was the middle of recession and especially as a foreigner in a foreigner- sceptical country I couldn't get any jobs for over a year, ended up going back to school for a 2 year marketing course, because I hated being on unemployment benefits and after I graduated the whole cycle repeated, so again to escape unemployment I started my own illustration business, because it was nearly impossible doing freelance while on benefits. Right now I feel like things are starting to look a little bit brighter, but still it is such struggle! And btw all the important things I use on a daily basis- both illustration and design related and business- related I've learned on my own. School was completely useless in my opinion at least it was cheap to free where I live(d), so at least it didn't put me in debt. Both technology and the market today change so rapidly that your knowledge is already dated as you are acquiring it and most schools are way behind on modern times unfortunately!
I relate to so much of what you've said! I'm not entirely sure my course was worth the debt (I try not to think of the debt!) So true that it's often about being self-motivated to keep learning new skills and technology.
I graduated in Visual Arts and I want to focus my work towards illustration, so my case is the opposite of yours. Interesting video format, I really enjoyed listening to you read your own past comments, how curious that at some point you were considering turning to the arts! I would have enjoyed it anyway :)
Your videos are always interesting and full of good information. Great sharing!
Thank you!
This is sooo cute. The feeling of loss after graduation is definitely real. Some of our very lucky friends got job right away. Most drifted & taking up whatever jobs they can find. Some drifted even further away & do freelancing like me & you. Hahahahah...oh starving artists....
Wow. I find this video very interesting. I would never had thought that you had all these struggles and thoughts before getting at the place you are now. I find it very important for successful illustrators like you to share this type of content, for aspiring illustrators to know they can overcome these things too...
This year will be the 3rd and final year of my illustration course and even now I don't feel hopeful and confident that I could make it as an illustrator and I am having many of the thoughts that you mentioned you had after graduating. I enjoy my time at college more than anything, I have learned things quicker than I would have learned by my own (both about improving my art, discovering what I like and where I would like to head to in the future) and I think that going to college is one of the best things I have done for myself . Even though (at college) we have talked about copyrights, contracts, invoices, (almost not at all about pricing) and things like that quite a few times, I feel like we haven't focus on these as much either (and generally the business side of it) and I turn to books and videos on RUclips like yours, to get more information and a realistic idea of what illustration as a career is going to be like. I value your videos a lot and the time you spent making them, I am sure that besides myself, they are very helpful and educational to all aspiring illustrators that follow you.
Besides that I don't feel prepared at all to go out in the world after college, hopefully I will feel better about it after finishing my 3rd year. But at the same time I realize that some or most of these things and the business side of being an illustrator, you learn by doing so, even though it sounds scary going into a profession without being sure what it is that you have to offer and do, how to get there and all that.
I do feel a lot that a pretty picture isn't going to take you far if you don't know what to do with it. Even though I believe this doesn't directly have to do with college/uni, as how you think and how much of a business mind you've got, as I have classmates that are already going to fairs, have online shops, get commissions, etc. So I feel like not feeling ready and not feeling confident about being an illustrator probably has to do with me as a person rather than things I could have been taught.
I think the business side of art/illustration is a complicated thing to be taught, as there are so many different paths someone could take and everybody's path to success is different. Things like contracts, prices, etc, also depend on the industry you will choose to work for. Therefor I think this is why we are being taught some of it, but it is up to us building our own knowledge us well.
I'm definitely subscribing to your channel, I just finished my foundation year in art and design and will hopefully be moving onto a BA in Illustration, not sure though whether it is the best choice though. My choices are not the most vast since cough cough my grades aren't good enough in other areas to go into other careers.
Thanks for your amazing advice as always Holly! I used to spend so much time in my uni's library, I really miss being surrounded by so many art books and magazine. I remember saying to a friend once " I'm just going to go to the.." and she finished sentence for me :D
Interesting. I graduated last year but it’s picked up for me at the start of this year. I do a bit of everything within Visual Design or UX for digital only. I really like the discussion point on if an illustrator does need to expand their skillset in order to set realistic goals that can be adapted into the roles of a designer and whether or not these aspects are interchangeable.
I have just graduated in illustration and I have felt extremely lost since. I feel like illustration students are definitely not prepared for the real world and we are not shown the different career possibilities. It is just mostly about creating work in your style, which since graduating has actually been some what of a disadvantage. Many design jobs such as an in house designer, actually want you to have a portfolio of different styles which is very annoying when tutors have advised you to put together a portfolio of work in the same style. There definitely needs to be more sessions taught on the business side of illustration, how to handle graduating and what jobs can help support your art career. After going to New Designers it feels like you can only make it if you are the best which seems impossible when there is so much competition! Thank you for your videos Holly! They give me hope and encouragement that I may be able to gain a career in illustration some day.
I always felt art schools should provide marketing education. I did fine art and sculpture in Falmouth, and had no education at all in how to continue past those days. So I agree totally with your comments.
i graduated in 2016 and my illustration degree didnt prepare me really for the outside world. not so much how to create work... , but practical things like how to write a creative cv or best ways of getting experience. I've kinda stopped drawing now, but i managed to get a job as a graphic designer/ui design. its almost impossible for most people to get jobs in illustration or design. i managed to get an internship at penguin random house, which really helped me.
I have graduated in Graphic Design in 2019 to me it was one of the most commercial, by doing this course I fully expected to be guided in how to find clients or charge them, and really very little was focus on this, I felt exactly the same when you said "our tutors were waving goodbye to a group of unprepared ..in my case designers" focusing in the same grades and an exhibition but not in how to develop our careers.
This video is so interesting and I can relate a lot to what you say! I graduated from uni in 2008, but in graphic design (with a lot of classes about illustration, because in the province of Québec where I live, we don't have a specific degree in illustration at uni). At that time, I didn't feel prepared to go freelance as an illustrator. And I didn't have the encouragements of my family to go in that way... So I became a graphic designer for one year and a half and really didn't like it... After that, I returned to uni and did a Master's degree in Speech-Language Pathology... quite different from illustration, isn't it? When I was 30 years old, I realized that never in my life I chose a profession that I liked, for real. So 1 year ago I finally decided to give a try to be a freelance illustrator, the job I always dreamed about but never had the guts to try. So here I am, struggling, but happy and have a lot of fun, most of the time... ahah!! Even if I learned a lot in art school, I didn't learn about the business/marketing side of this artistic career. So I had to read a lot and learn by myself. And I just begin to understand a little bit how it works. So thank you for this video and for your honesty throughout your channel! And thank you for all your precious advices! Also, I'm vegan and I suffer from social anxiety too, and watching your videos is always a real pleasure. Have a nice weekend Holly!
Wow Josianne, I really admire the bravery it must have taken to switch paths like that - but so glad to hear you're happy. That's so important!
This is so sad to see all the comments that they’ve been failed by unis for “real designer life” I too had this issue, I did a foundation degree to give myself another year to straighten my head and experiment in different techniques to find my style and the reason I did a foundation is because “it’ll prepare you for your BA and you’ll understand more about industry as well as get more offers for the hard bit of uni” and it’s the biggest waste of £9k I finished it, started my BA and then found out that the way the course is branded and the course content advertised it was the polar opposite so I’ve withdrawn and applied again to new places this time that can actually support my health conditions exactly the way my last place promised they would, I mean I was doing a textiles degree and 2 1/2 months in the lecturers just drop into conversation that we had to do 2 units that I physically couldn’t do because tables were too high, I had to use a jet wash and water but I have an electric wheelchair that can’t get right, less than 2 weeks before hand in they tell me I have to come up with something instead as the unit is compulsory so now I’m £18K down and I still feel like I’ve learnt nothing🙄 I don’t suppose you/anyone you know has had experience with Falmouth, bath spa, hca (Hereford college of arts), Cardiff met and abu (arts uni bournemouth) as it’d help me heaps to know what they like in portfolios etc x
Great one!Again:) I can see all commentators are illustrators.Most with art degree.I spent all my education path-which was extremely hard-on economics,finances and marketing...Hoping that my love for art creation would be enough to feel like an artist and eventualy I would work on my own rules as an artist knowing how to -economically-lead an art business ..But there is always that missing part:( The "university" one..I only hope that all those art courses I try to take part in and my hart work on my skills would fulfill that "hole" in my mind..Best regards!
I graduated from Illustration last year, a lot of this sounds very familiar! Definitely agree with the social media side of things, we had ONE non-mandatory workshop about using social media in the whole three years I was there. But the tutor running in was just not up to date with it at all, which I think was a problem with all the tutors on the course. I've had my Instagram account since I was about 15 ( @chloeelisedennis *wink wink*) but found that most of my course mates only started using it for art things in the last few months of us being at uni. It was bafflingly to me that the importance of being online hadn't been stressed throughout the whole three years. I have a friend who's a Fine Art grad who's only just realising she needs a social media presence.
Hi Holly! I’m coming to the end of my first year as an illustration graduate, and I’ve been doing a lot of reflection regarding what I was taught during my time at university. I’d love your input (or the input of anyone reading this) on whether I should bring up my issues with my university. We had countless lectures about not working for free, and how spec work is damaging our industry.. yet were then strongly encouraged to take part in competitions, such as the Penguin Book Cover competition - which was actually compulsory, and we were graded on our submissions. Since graduating I have educated myself more on spec work and dangerous competitions, and I cannot believe I was encouraged to take part. But then criticised for working for free... huh?!?! I’ve seen many of my peers take part in countless competitions since graduating, and I often share your videos in hopes they will see them and understand. Should I write to my university about my concerns? I don’t want to ‘call them out’ as they been good to me since graduating, and provided me with many paid opportunities/ commissions. I feel as I have a good relationship with them, and I’d hate for that relationship to be damaged. But I can’t help but think about their constant contradictions, and how their falling hundreds of creatives mind with such damaging advice... any advice would be so helpful, thank you for reading! xx
I went to school to study fine art and in our school illustration was really looked down on by professors. I wasn't taught how to make a career of being an artist or any digital tools. Two years later I've taught myself to paint digitally and I've slowly been gathering information on how to move into the illustration world (though I've yet to put it into use). I loved college and I think it did a good job of giving me the foundation for my art, but I think it completely failed to prepare me for the real world, especially the art world. Maybe it's because I studied fine art and we weren't supposed to be thinking about money, maybe not. But I'm certainly thinking about money now.
I agree 100 percent ive just graduated in illustration in july 2018 this year and im finding it so hard to get my work noticed. Ive recently gone for an interview and they made me work all day and paid me minimum 50 for all day 10-5 pm in a graphics role. I think placements are good i managed to work for george head office asda designing illustrations for childrens clothes.
😊.... so glad to see you (somehow you feel like a studio-colleague 😂😂😂) Wishing you an amazing weekend 💗!!!
I graduated from Falmouth University last year, I feel fairly lucky as were taught the digital side of things and had many lectures in third year about the business side of things. Despite that, I still feel so unprepared! Dealing with finance has been so difficult for me, and also finding the confidence to approach clients. I've been lucky with work this first year out of uni, but I've still had to work in m&s to sustain myself fully! I just hope it continues, it's always so scary after a quiet month
We made our web portfolios but I actually love that my uni pushed my physical ones, I live in London and go to a lot of portfolio reviews and have been lucky enough to have had a few exhibitions and find people remember me and often comment on loving my 'book' portfolio, the last review I went to everyone had ipads and the art directors seemed really refreshed my folder one!
I was considering Falmouth as a Uni actually - I heard the course is very good! Good to hear you felt it was balanced and helpful. Sounds like you're on the right track!
I’m started my illustration degree in Bournemouth in two weeks so this was exciting to watch :) x
Jk is also full of anxiety watching this holy cow I’m scared :((
My sister is studying illustration there currently, about to go into second year! She's loving it :)
Sophie Mel this is so weird but she does she have Instagram I can message her on about it? I have so many questions to ask haha !!! If not, then I totally understand :)
She does, she'd be happy to as well :) her instagram is kimlwlk
Definitely don't be scared though, I graduated from falmouth illustration last year and had the time of my life, really just go there and put your all into and make sure to enjoy and make the most out of first year!
Honestly, most of the time, college teaches what's only convenient in a school setting. You are right with the lack of teaching the business side of things. It's just sad.
I am not an Illustrator nor have been lucky (perhaps ambitious) enough to get a university degree but I learnt a trade. Listening to your points, several things come to mind: First of all, most full time university tutors are there because they didn't make it in the world running their own business. In other words, they would not have those experiences you have made during your career and as you are now.
Secondly, running a business, marketing, sales, advertising are all different careers in themselves for which you have to train mostly by visiting a uni or other facilities. Definitely, universities should offer these courses geared to creators and small businesses but perhaps they were/are already there but not at your university. Plus you might have not looked for them because - let's be honest - as a creator, do you really want to study this!?
Thirdly, I would think that the tutors at uni really want to teach you the necessary skills you enrolled for to the best of their ability so the time there may not allow for this (no idea if this is so or not). However, they should definitely have taught you the skills to work digitally but this brings me back to my first point.
Lastly, although I am quite sure you must have been artistic bevore visiting uni, they have taught you some skills that make you the wonderful Illustrator that you are. ;-)
I graduated in 2010 from Pratt in Brooklyn, NY. As an illustrator we actually had to have a minor in Graphic Design but pricing was rarely talked about. I think one of the best references given to me was the SCBWI website. Our biggest problem was the economy being bad in 2010 and graduating with a massive college debt in a very unaffordable city. The average debt after college for us was between 120-200 Thousand. Most of my piers had to be designers just to pay off their debts and at that point illustration seemed more impossible to get into.
I didn’t think there is any degree courses in illustration in India.So it is hard for creative people like me to learn on your own and struggle and cope on its own.I did my animation course but it was not exactly what I liked but just a bit near it.Still struggling today to get commissions as a freelance.I did have a RUclips and Instagram and hopefully like to be survive and make my mark in illustrations like you for example.
I graduated a year ago now, and I feel exactly the same as 2011 you! It's so frustrating how little practical advice we were given, and very few of us are working from my course.
Very cool format 👍🏽 😙
Interesting how at the end you were considering going into an art-related job instead of pursuing illustration. I had a similar thought while going through my graphic design degree. It just seemed like it was beyond my abilities to really be a talented designer, but I'm both you and I didn't follow those doubts.
I now make it a habit when talking to anyone starting in a creative field to mention that time when I thought about doing something "easier" - I think it's a common feeling, given the self-doubt so many creatives deal with.
So I just finished my Masters in illustration and animation and a lot more stress is put on digital illustration now I think. I enjoyed the time spent developing more animation based practice so maybe it's a bit better now? Haha that's very non committal. Basically it's hard but I. Did have tutors that made us question and present "what makes us special and different" so maybe the courses are evolving
I graduated from a graphic art/contemporary art practice degree in 2017. I want to teach/support adults in education and illustrate as the work comes in. I feel as an illustrator a degree is more about the final show as an opportunity to showcase. Kids save your tuition money and get together through social media and put on shows yourselves. Unless you need the degree as access to certain careers it’s largely irrelevant.
Hi Holly, have you ever considered furthuring your education, seeing as you've mentioned how much you enjoyed your course? Would it be benefitial at all in terms of furthuring your career? I really enjoyed this video :)
I finished my MA in Children's Book Illustration in 2013, and found many of the same issues. The creative tuition was amazing and so invaluable, and like you I miss the time I could spend doing exactly what I wanted. But business wise there was not much at all. It seemed like there was a build up to the degree show and if you weren't "picked up" there you just felt like a failure really. Since my year though, they have started having a stand at the Bologna book fair which I think has really helped the students develop a dialogue with publishers and agents whilst still under the guidance of the tutors. It took me three years to get published after graduating (during which time I was a health care assistant and worked in a shop) so I would say to others that if you don't get work from your initial degree show, don't give up hope, but find a way to keep working creatively and you will get there. :) Also I would say that the consensus used to be that traditional publishing was the only route to success, and that has completely changed now. You don't need a publisher to get your work out there - you can post your own work online, make and sell your own merchandise, etc, and it is just as valuable and respected (and sometimes as lucrative) as having a book in Waterstones.
This is great advice Lisa! Thinking back I wonder if the pressure around the degree show was more about the university's reputation than helping students find work? Or maybe I'm being overly suspicious!
holly exley Oh yes, totally! And it can be such a demoralising experience. Xx
I have a degree in landscape architecture, yet in my school years we did only one garden design project :)
Mmm, I'm worried fine art is in the same situation (or worse) of illustration. I studied at the fine art academy for 5 years and approached illustration after my diploma. I feel for me is really useful to have learned to paint in a variety of media, to draw a nude in scale 1:1 or to sculpt; at the same time I didn't receive advices on how start/build my own business as an artist and related important stuff. There was not even an internship or something that would put me into the "work world" before graduating.
I have just completed my illustration studies, and I'm already finding it mentally difficult. I had planned to return to my university in September to study MA Textiles Design. However after being accepted the course has now been canceled due to the lack of applications (I believe covid is the cause of this). I was organised and excited to learn and develop a textiles portfolio, but now plans have completely changed, and I am unprepared. I contacted my university, but they responded with an empty apology and waved me away. What am I to do now?! I desperately want to become a pattern designer and my degree work was heavily illustration for textiles. But I have gaps in my knowledge. I am struggling to find a textiles or print design internship - because they all want textiles graduates! I loved illustration because it is so broad, but now it is difficult to get someone to believe you specialise in a certain area. help help help. I also have no idea how to approach local art shops to get my work put on sale. I have an Etsy shop, but sales are slow... I feel so deflated. All my plans have been ripped away from me, and I've been left out in the cold.
Have you looked at idi or any online ma courses 😀
Wonderful to hear from past AND present Holly :-) I went to uni for Costume Design, but am now a fine artist / illustrator. Similar to your time in education, I wasn't presented with practical ways to assert myself out in the "real world." Although Costume Design was a good base for learning color and shape, and a little drawing, as for the whole art career, I had to start from scratch. I'm still learning about taxes, pricing, contracts, marketing...it's a very DIY kind of job! But I'm so happy to be doing what I love. I always love your videos, Holly. Thank you for sharing your heart and your kind, thoughtful, helpful words
I've just finished my degree in Illustration and Animation. I'm not sure what exactly I want to do yet, so I'm starting my masters in September. I'm hoping I can use it to build my portfolio and as I have a degree, I can start looking for freelancing jobs like my coursemates but I won't have to get a full time crappy retail job, I'll be able to do the art I want for my course. I'm also hoping I can use this year to grow my social media accounts and get more exposure.
Pollygone Illustration do you have an update?
Also back working two times a week in customer service 😅
Pollygone Illustration thank you for getting back to me so quickly! i just started illustration in uni and i'm sort of worried about my future D:
This sounds very familiar :)
Oh yeah, memory lane. The one thing internet has brought us.... easy permanent record of what we did when XD and somewhere there is always a reminder of the past XD
Thank you for this video, I like the concept about creating work for your portfolio instead of work for free for others, I have a question why did you work as waitress ? why not asking your parents to support you until you get a job as illustrator ?
My mum supported me after uni by offering me a place to stay rent free whilst I paid back some debt - that was more than enough help! Then when I moved out I wanted to pay my own way and work things out for myself.