You don't need to be quick to take the tool out as the tool steel and tungsten carbide have different coefficients of thermal expansion (for tool steel about 12*10^-6 m / (m*K) (that is 0.012 mm per meter of diameter times the degrees of temperature change in Kelvin) and tungsten carbide about half of that) and when both are heated equally the steel will expand more. This is also the reason manufacturers usually don't recommend using HSS tools in heat shrink holders as coefficient of thermal expansion for HSS is quite close to that of steel - about 10**10^-6 m / (m*K).
Very simple to remove the endmill that broken off from the heat shrink holder. Step 1 remove pull stud step 2 remove screw stopper from the heat shrink or if it doesn’t have screw stopper disregard step 2. Step three heat the shrink fit holder repeatedly until the whole body of the shrink holder turns glowing red and broken endmill should fall right off. Step 4 quench shrink holder with coolant and ur all done. 1 final step is to inspect of the shrink holder can be salvaged. Have a nice day mafuckinist
I use shrink fit tooling on my tormach, reason being is all my work is slotting into tight spaces with a 3mm ball end mill fitted to a 10 or so centimeter extension. As you know once you start using extensions the chatter, squeal and run out is on another level, shrink fit tooling accuracy took care of it. Yes i use Map gas, broken bits are easily pulled out with pliers or pushed through when fitting the new end mill.
I've done the DIY version of this in my home garage for removing bearings. I heated the complete assembly up using a hot torch and then sprayed the bearing with compressed air from a can that cooled the bearing quickly enough to free it up. Same method works on seized bolts.
Cool stuff John, first time seeing the proper ways to install and remove the tools. At work we have one pretty big induction bearing heater that is running off 220V.
Never had any issues swapping tools in a large 50 taper HMC with the blowtorch method. Got a few slender tools from 6 to 12mm connection that I just spin the spindle by hand while using the torch to heat it up until the mill loosens. None of my toolholders got as hot as the one in the video, all of them are barely straw colored, so around 220-240c max.
Very cool! I thought those machines were a lot more expensive. It doesn't look like Maritool has any BT30 heat-shrink holders, so it doesn't matter for me regardless. I'm happy with the gripping strength and runout of my ER20 tool holders, but the narrow body of the heat shrink holders would be handy at times.
piece of advice, dont shrink hss tooling or steel indexable bodies, they dont always like to come out(or be ready to dedicate the holder) my favorite application is threadmills you will be amazed how much faster you can run them and still not get chatter. we have holders that change every day and have yet to see any performance loss like we are losing grip or gaining run out
A lesson in magic: Tungsten has a Mohs hardness of 9, 10 being diamond and a steel file being around 6.5. It also has almost the thermal conductivity of aluminum (178 W/m*K for tungsten and 205W/m*K for aluminum while steel and stainless steel and cast iron ranges between 10-100W/m*K) and last but not least it has almost half the thermal expansion coefficient of granite, which is thought to be one of the most thermally stable materials and used in metrology for this reason...That's magic!
I made a three step go/no gauge the other day and the middle step was so close that when I took it out of the vice the gauge pin no longer fit because my hand was warming it up as I was taking the work out of the vice. First time. I thought it was one of the coolest things I've seen. I could let go for about a minute and it would fit, then hold it for five to ten seconds and it wouldn't.
We don't use the stop nut, we just get the tool holders with the through spindle pull stud and have a piece of welding rod stick in the bottom when installing an end mill. It repeats to a few thou without any issue. Plus it's cheap and doesn't need a spring loaded holder or a stop nut that can come loose.
The automated coil movement seems a bit silly. Having the ability to invert the toolholder and let the tool drop out rather than needing to pull it out would be nice. Otherwise quite a nice system. They make small, inexpensive inductive bolt heaters for the automotive mechanic market. They might not have enough power to remove tools but would be a lot easier than a torch for installing.
This thing has quite a bit more power than those bolt heaters. There was a shot of the product page in the video, said this draws 24A @ 220V, for about 5 kW of power. Those bolt heaters are usually around 1 kW. I also wouldn't expect a bolt heater to be as efficient at transferring power to the work, since the frequency would be tuned to the application.
I know what tools you're talking about. And yes, they do have enough power to remove the tool. Way better option than paying 3+ thousand dollars for this overbuilt and slower tool.
Hak Kar this induction heating tool could be a lot more useful with a few tweaks. Logging the temperature cycle of the toolholder, logging the number of cycles per tool holder, a system to either extract the tool with the already available motion or detach the heating coil from the motion component and mount the tool holder so it is inverted and the tool will just drop free when the required expansion is reached It looks over engineered for what it does, but it seems like it could easily have options added for a production environment.
PSA: We had this happen out our shop last week by someone who made a mistake due to lack of knowledge. If you have multiple styles of tool holder, be intimately familiar with the difference between a shrink fit holder and a hydraulic holder. Should you ever accidentally put a hydraulic holder into an induction heater...the tool will explode.
When you break an endmill in one how easy is it to get out? Seems it would be really hard to heat and push from the backside at the same time and in the short window before the end mill heats up. too bad you don't have a Cat50 machine I would let you try some of my Schunk hydraulic clamping holders.
The holders have a depth stop in the back, just unscrew it and you have access to be backside of the tool. then just push it out at the time the timer comes to zero.
Most of them have some kind of through holes just for that reason. You heat up the holder with broken tool inside it, take the hot holder and push the tool out. Or turn the tool upside down and heat it and let the gravity do the trick.
Remove the pull stud and there's a whole through the holder you can then screw out the stop and put a 6mm rod up there place it in the heat shrink machine stopping the coil at the top heat it up and it will push rite out. It happens sometimes but it's not a train smash
If you had turned the spindle override to 50% or so, that end mill probably would have cut just fine with no coolant. You just can't seem to wrap your head around the chip load. That end mill wants .006 per tooth for a full slot. When you take those wimpy small step over cuts, you need to crank the feed rate up, a LOT. The coolant just lets you get away with poor feeds and speeds.
You can pick up DIY induction kits for less than $100 on gearbest, banggood, etc. The tricky part in comparison would be the understanding of the timing of the heat application, if there is some closed loop feedback and some sort of "program" that is using waveform manipulation to do ease-in, ease-out of energy applied. The machine I'm sure is designed more for end-user safety, but I'd have thought trying to keep the field as perpendicular as possible to the toolholder is important to maintain it's lifetime. Interesting application of induction heating though... nifty!
I've a set that's 20 years old (Iscar shrinkin system) . it works using a standard heater tho- not induction, and will only work well with carbide tooling, as it has a different thermal expansion.
You won’t see much advantage with shrink fits in roughing applications like this. A well balanced sidelock would outperform a shrink fit in that application. Where shrink fits shine is in long projection finishing applications, where you have to reach 6 inches out and have 2 inches of tool sticking out of the holder. The down side to shrink fits is the long gauge length they require. You’re already 3+ inches away from the spindle before you even get started and with nothing to dampen vibration, with the tool you have a nice, stiff, 4” long canter-levering tuning fork...
Samuel Kapoor You could rough with an end mill glued to a broomstick if you wanted to. Doesn’t make it the best suites holder for the application. There’s many reasons why shrink fits are not suited for heavy roughing and there’s better holders for the task. Side lock solid holders are still some of the best holders for roughing short of milling chucks. Shorter gauge length, better axial holding power (won’t pull out) and better dampening properties. Yes. You can rough with a shrink fit. But why? You’re not gaining anything, more expensive holder, and can’t be pushed as hard as a milling chuck or side lock holder.
For rouging I like the zero gauge er collet holders from Sandvik .. "Shortin"..other manufacturers do them also... not as sturdy as a side lock but a good all rounder and they give loads more z clearance. The SPR coated ER collets last for ages as well.
For tool removal, why not camp the end mill and hook a spring to the clamp so that when the tool holder heats up to the right diameter, the spring pulls the tool out of the holder. This method should allow for a DIY system.
I wish i would have putzed with some of the heat shrink tooling at my last shop. My idea, take apart a cheap induction cooktop and reform the coil, have a spring loaded fixture to pull or eject the tool as soon as theres enough slip, or just leave it chucked up, turn the machine on, and put the induction cooktop right next to the holder. Or trial and error with the holder wrapped in a wet towel in a microwave. Even better idea is to put a small spring on the index rod so as soon as its loose it pops out.
The heating you're talking about can be achieved with high frequency induction, rapid low penetration heating. Low frequency like the 60hz straight from the wall will be slower but deeper penetrating, better for melting instead of simple heating. Cool machine but could be done in an analog fashion for 1/10th the cost.
I have been saving my money for shrinks for a very long time.....still cannot afford to buy in. Still dreaming for now. Glad you focused on this important technology.
Look into Technara slim line shrink holders, different concept using shrink holders. Uses simple heat gun to heat and cool holders. Note always carbide cutters never high speed steel or you will be hard pressed getting them out.
Yup, have seen one 7 mm HSS drill in a holder and have to say that the runout is very good and solid connection, but once there is nothing to sharpen ;)
At work i use similar device by kennametal that after the tool is locked it sinks down in the machine and it is sprayed with coolant then come back up...so cool !
Arrow Racing Products If your coolant is causing rust, that’s a problem with the coolant. Either concentration is too low, bad water, or coolant needs replacing. But either way, your coolant should not be causing any rusting on anything, in fact it should be doing the opposite and be preventing things from rusting.
you can buy a 1000W induction heater system everywhere on internet for something like 30USD with the coil It would be a good project to do I think with arduino. You have to cool the coil, up and down the coil to adjust to tool length etc. Basically a copy of the marytool machine. Interesting project
In the land of the kiwi (nz) we call it Shrink fit, not to be confused with the heat shrink insulating tube that we heat up and shrink onto a solder join.
This may be a silly question from a novice; but would you ever have to worry about the tool heating up during machining to the point that the tool could loosen and fall out under high cutting load?
Do you not have size rings for your machine they help a lot with sizing different cutter holders. We have been running ours for 16 years now and never looked back
If you snap an endmill even with the bottom of the tool holder, it would be a nightmare to get the broken tool out. The only thing I can think of would be to weld (tig, mig?) a stud to the broken tool.
You know, the tolerances are so tight and expected runouts are so small, that you need to keep that stuff extra clean since even a thread from those gloves getting into the tool holder or on the surface of the tool can mess up the runout tolerance :D
I have an applications which would benefit from more "stick out" and less grip length on a tool that is only available in one shank length (A woodriff key cutter for an o-ring groove). How much less grip length do you think you could get away with using shrink fit?
I believe the tool holder intentionally uses a special stainless with a larger thermal expansion coefficient so even the tool also heats up you should be able to get the tool out.
When you removed the tool at the beginning, I wanted to see you do it without gloves ... just to prove that the tool itself wasn't being heated in the process ;-)
Correct me if i'm wrong, but i think that you aren't supposed to let the tool touch the bottom of the toolholder, or at least this is what is written in the manual of some of our heatshrink toolholders. Probably it's not that important.
For a long time I’ve wondered about the holders that looked like they had been hot I always thought it was a heat treatment thing (sort of is) I’d never heard of heat shrink holders
If heat and a push from the taper end didn't get the tool out then I'm going to guess you managed to bore a hole through the tool to relieve the fit somewhat.
The reason they work is not the speed it heats it Its that CARBIDE doesnt expand at the same rate so the steel holder expands MORE then the carbide tool which is the premise of it working
It is good when you just putting a tool on an empty holder but how about with a broken tool? We used to have them a couple of years ago,works fine for a while until you had broken tool and time is a constrain.
What do you mean when you say are becoming more accessible to shops like us. Aside from the machine how much would a shrink fit holder sell for along with sleeves to serve more than one end mill size and have you mentioned the sleeves and whether they effect the tool hold rigidity. I work at TechShop Abu Dhabi and I have always been interested in these for the making of deep molds using our 3 axis tm-1p.
I was just talking to Carl about the coating locations on double ended tools because they can't fit in my hydraulic chucks. Do you think they could fit in heat shrink? I was measuring .2505 diameter on 1/4" tooling. Im guessing it'd be more likely to work on larger diameter tools since the coating is a smaller percentage of the OD
You Can heat your tools up alot cheaper ways. I use heat shrunk holdets alot the last 10 years. Never had a induktion heater. Its No problem how fast you do it. Carbite does not expand the same AS the holder in metal
Check out ChrisFix’s latest gift guide video. He shows a hand held inductive heater that can be used to heat up tough to remove nuts. I don’t know if that would be powerful enough to use in this situation.
Very, very cool tech. Is there any concern for material warping after many cycles? Dumping and cooling the holder that many times, does it end with any run out?
The lips at the end of the holder begin to go and no longer shrink around the tool. Progressively gets worse from there with less and less of the internal bore actually gripping on the tool. Typically 1,000 heat cycles but higher end ones can go through 2k-3k cycles before needing to be replaced. Any vendor that says “they’ll never wear out” is just giving you marketing wank. Everything wears out eventually.
The internet says Carbide has roughly half the thermal growth rate of avg. steels,, Just saying , tool holder should expand more than the tool anyways.
I disagree with you about needing the heater to remove tools. I've been using a propane torch long enough to know better. And I'm not the only one doing that, there are plenty of other shops doing that. The smaller tools ( 1/8 in.) will require a bit more heat than the larger ones, but it's butt stinkin' easy to remove and insert end mills with a propane torch. You'll be fine. You might also experiment with a higher quality ER collet chuck and collet ( say a Lyndex ) if you are worried about end mills pulling out. And as other have noted the standard end mill holders are fantastic when used with Weldon shank tooling. Anyhow, have fun with the new toys.
Not really new technology. I was fitting tools to tool holders in the mid 80's with an induction heater and it was not a new machine when I was using it. No fancy digital though just timers and a voltage trip with an adjustment chart for different holder sizes. The holders used to bell mouth and needed checking with an air gauge, 0.004mm was enough for the scrap bin. Try hydraulic tool holders a lot quicker and easier to do a cutter change and compared to the shrink fit stuff I used in the 80's longer lasting.
I’ve been using shrink holders for about a year now with my torch method. Have never had an issue with carbide tools and a torch. Just don’t ever put a hss tool in one.
I had serious doubts about them, but what convinced me was a job that required a 240mm long access to a 12mm tool. They set me up with a machine for over 6 months and a bunch of trial collets and holders. The advantage there is that the system is self damping. I could've never thought that it was even possible to take normal cuts at that extension. Call them, they'll be more than willing to give you a trial system. Runouts are better than 3microns over normal tool holders over 240mm long the runout was 8microns. Its marginally more expensive than heat-shrink-fit, but you'll get better tool life and the way you use end mills, you'll see the payoff in less than 3 months. Let me add another thing. The heat shrink is not unlimited cycles, each heat shrink cycle adds a bit of hysteresis into the material of the holder, thus changing runout, internal dimension and the capability to tighten to original dimensions, such things don't exist with cold shrink. The cold shrink is proven for around 20k cycles. In the cold shrink systems, regofix gives you constant holding around the circumference as opposed to Shunk which is just three point. I've tested both.
Me too -- single burner induction cooking hot plate for the induction parts + some new PWM arduino code to drive it. Wonder how many watts of power one needs.
About three times as much power as you can put into one of those hot plates, ~5kW (if you want to match this thing's power output). Could always build the induction heater yourself, though it's somewhat more difficult than your average arduino project. inductionheatertutorial.com/
Those 5KW of heat are insanely efficiently pumped into the tool holder. The way the induction heaters work is that they actually use the tool holder as the heating element. The heat is generated by flowing a LOT of electricity through the metal of the tool holder. You can think of it as a transformer, where the secondary winding is 1 winding that is shorted.
I have yet to see any that are this powerful - and safe to make/use. Not saying it cannot but done, but most of the DIY ones have way less wattage than this
The tool he showed was only $3800. I could engineer such an induction heater, but to get it to the standard of quality and safety that it would be right to deploy to the shop floor, it would have cost more in my own time than a bought one. There's a big gap between what you can do in the danger of your home shop and what's suitable for the production floor when it has to be safe and reliable for years of operation.
Had these at the last place i worked. The induction heater makes the most awful sound imaginable when it is heating. Worse than fingernails on a blackboard. Was almost bad enough i almost got another employee to do it for me as i couldnt stand the sound.
We used a machine similar to this: www.theequipmenthub.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/md-131012-6.jpg at my former employer. The heat was generated by a Steinel HG 4000 E heat blower. It took few minutes to heat up but otherwise worked flawless.
Bearing heaters are nice but all you need if a temperature controlled fry pan or hotplate. 100deg C is all that is needed for bearings any more and the size is wrong and you start to run into problems with grease and temper. On most bearings 100c will give you 8~15 seconds to get into position. The only time I still use the induction heater is for bearings that wont fit into my fry pan.
Why not make the machine John... You disappoint me here.... Get some coper.. maybe a welder? Or a microwave transformer a arduino some linear guide rails... Go
And a high power LC resonator circuit to do the actual heating? Induction heaters are super complex, and waaaaaaaaaaaay out of scope of the kind of things NYC CNC does.
Alex Haws as has been stated in other comments, carbide has a hugely different rate of thermal expansion (smaller) therefore you could use oxy-acetylene to slowly heat the whole tool AND holder until the tool fell out.
You don't need to be quick to take the tool out as the tool steel and tungsten carbide have different coefficients of thermal expansion (for tool steel about 12*10^-6 m / (m*K) (that is 0.012 mm per meter of diameter times the degrees of temperature change in Kelvin) and tungsten carbide about half of that) and when both are heated equally the steel will expand more. This is also the reason manufacturers usually don't recommend using HSS tools in heat shrink holders as coefficient of thermal expansion for HSS is quite close to that of steel - about 10**10^-6 m / (m*K).
Gently chuck it in the lathe, spin it at a low rpm and apply heat from torch. Works every time.
We have been using this for a few years now at work. Haven’t heard any complaints about it.
Break an end mill flush in the tool holder and make a video about getting it out.
Upside down, blowtorch.
I wouldn’t recommend a blow torch although being ours have through holes you simply heat the holder and push the broken shank with a small rod.
use a vacuum tube with silcon rubber seal less than dia of cutter to suck down on the broken shank and pull it out
Very simple to remove the endmill that broken off from the heat shrink holder. Step 1 remove pull stud step 2 remove screw stopper from the heat shrink or if it doesn’t have screw stopper disregard step 2. Step three heat the shrink fit holder repeatedly until the whole body of the shrink holder turns glowing red and broken endmill should fall right off. Step 4 quench shrink holder with coolant and ur all done. 1 final step is to inspect of the shrink holder can be salvaged. Have a nice day mafuckinist
I use shrink fit tooling on my tormach, reason being is all my work is slotting into tight spaces with a 3mm ball end mill fitted to a 10 or so centimeter extension. As you know once you start using extensions the chatter, squeal and run out is on another level, shrink fit tooling accuracy took care of it. Yes i use Map gas, broken bits are easily pulled out with pliers or pushed through when fitting the new end mill.
Thanks John, for sharing your experience. Thanks to MariTool for being such an awesome company.
I've done the DIY version of this in my home garage for removing bearings. I heated the complete assembly up using a hot torch and then sprayed the bearing with compressed air from a can that cooled the bearing quickly enough to free it up. Same method works on seized bolts.
Cool stuff John, first time seeing the proper ways to install and remove the tools. At work we have one pretty big induction bearing heater that is running off 220V.
Never had any issues swapping tools in a large 50 taper HMC with the blowtorch method.
Got a few slender tools from 6 to 12mm connection that I just spin the spindle by hand while using the torch to heat it up until the mill loosens.
None of my toolholders got as hot as the one in the video, all of them are barely straw colored, so around 220-240c max.
Very cool! I thought those machines were a lot more expensive. It doesn't look like Maritool has any BT30 heat-shrink holders, so it doesn't matter for me regardless.
I'm happy with the gripping strength and runout of my ER20 tool holders, but the narrow body of the heat shrink holders would be handy at times.
piece of advice, dont shrink hss tooling or steel indexable bodies, they dont always like to come out(or be ready to dedicate the holder)
my favorite application is threadmills you will be amazed how much faster you can run them and still not get chatter.
we have holders that change every day and have yet to see any performance loss like we are losing grip or gaining run out
Wooooow. With the metric units addition, I can now clearly see how stupid fast the feed is :o
A lesson in magic: Tungsten has a Mohs hardness of 9, 10 being diamond and a steel file being around 6.5. It also has almost the thermal conductivity of aluminum (178 W/m*K for tungsten and 205W/m*K for aluminum while steel and stainless steel and cast iron ranges between 10-100W/m*K) and last but not least it has almost half the thermal expansion coefficient of granite, which is thought to be one of the most thermally stable materials and used in metrology for this reason...That's magic!
I made a three step go/no gauge the other day and the middle step was so close that when I took it out of the vice the gauge pin no longer fit because my hand was warming it up as I was taking the work out of the vice.
First time. I thought it was one of the coolest things I've seen. I could let go for about a minute and it would fit, then hold it for five to ten seconds and it wouldn't.
We don't use the stop nut, we just get the tool holders with the through spindle pull stud and have a piece of welding rod stick in the bottom when installing an end mill. It repeats to a few thou without any issue. Plus it's cheap and doesn't need a spring loaded holder or a stop nut that can come loose.
The automated coil movement seems a bit silly. Having the ability to invert the toolholder and let the tool drop out rather than needing to pull it out would be nice. Otherwise quite a nice system.
They make small, inexpensive inductive bolt heaters for the automotive mechanic market. They might not have enough power to remove tools but would be a lot easier than a torch for installing.
We tried - not enough heat to get the tool OUT. We *were* able to get the tool *in* :)
This thing has quite a bit more power than those bolt heaters. There was a shot of the product page in the video, said this draws 24A @ 220V, for about 5 kW of power. Those bolt heaters are usually around 1 kW.
I also wouldn't expect a bolt heater to be as efficient at transferring power to the work, since the frequency would be tuned to the application.
I know what tools you're talking about. And yes, they do have enough power to remove the tool. Way better option than paying 3+ thousand dollars for this overbuilt and slower tool.
Hak Kar this induction heating tool could be a lot more useful with a few tweaks. Logging the temperature cycle of the toolholder, logging the number of cycles per tool holder, a system to either extract the tool with the already available motion or
detach the heating coil from the motion component and mount the tool holder so it is inverted and the tool will just drop free when the required expansion is reached
It looks over engineered for what it does, but it seems like it could easily have options added for a production environment.
PSA: We had this happen out our shop last week by someone who made a mistake due to lack of knowledge. If you have multiple styles of tool holder, be intimately familiar with the difference between a shrink fit holder and a hydraulic holder. Should you ever accidentally put a hydraulic holder into an induction heater...the tool will explode.
When you break an endmill in one how easy is it to get out? Seems it would be really hard to heat and push from the backside at the same time and in the short window before the end mill heats up. too bad you don't have a Cat50 machine I would let you try some of my Schunk hydraulic clamping holders.
The holder always expands more than the carbide tool.
Yes the carbide has a much lower coefficient of thermal expansion than the toolholder
The holders have a depth stop in the back, just unscrew it and you have access to be backside of the tool. then just push it out at the time the timer comes to zero.
Most of them have some kind of through holes just for that reason.
You heat up the holder with broken tool inside it, take the hot holder and push the tool out. Or turn the tool upside down and heat it and let the gravity do the trick.
Remove the pull stud and there's a whole through the holder you can then screw out the stop and put a 6mm rod up there place it in the heat shrink machine stopping the coil at the top heat it up and it will push rite out. It happens sometimes but it's not a train smash
In trying to figure out why people keep suggesting small handheld induction heaters. John specifically mentioned in the video they don't work.
The Internet.
If you had turned the spindle override to 50% or so, that end mill probably would have cut just fine with no coolant. You just can't seem to wrap your head around the chip load. That end mill wants .006 per tooth for a full slot. When you take those wimpy small step over cuts, you need to crank the feed rate up, a LOT. The coolant just lets you get away with poor feeds and speeds.
look at the REGO-FIX power grip tooling. its a nice middle of the road system between the ER and heatshrink
You can pick up DIY induction kits for less than $100 on gearbest, banggood, etc. The tricky part in comparison would be the understanding of the timing of the heat application, if there is some closed loop feedback and some sort of "program" that is using waveform manipulation to do ease-in, ease-out of energy applied. The machine I'm sure is designed more for end-user safety, but I'd have thought trying to keep the field as perpendicular as possible to the toolholder is important to maintain it's lifetime.
Interesting application of induction heating though... nifty!
I've a set that's 20 years old (Iscar shrinkin system) . it works using a standard heater tho- not induction, and will only work well with carbide tooling, as it has a different thermal expansion.
I recommend having a bucket of coolant next to the induction heater. It saves a lot of time waiting for the holder to cool down.
You won’t see much advantage with shrink fits in roughing applications like this. A well balanced sidelock would outperform a shrink fit in that application.
Where shrink fits shine is in long projection finishing applications, where you have to reach 6 inches out and have 2 inches of tool sticking out of the holder.
The down side to shrink fits is the long gauge length they require. You’re already 3+ inches away from the spindle before you even get started and with nothing to dampen vibration, with the tool you have a nice, stiff, 4” long canter-levering tuning fork...
These holders are real popular with shops that have a lot of 5 axis machining. You will hardly see them at regular job shops.
They work perfectly for roughing applications we run them every day 360 days round the year great for volumil applications
Samuel Kapoor
You could rough with an end mill glued to a broomstick if you wanted to. Doesn’t make it the best suites holder for the application.
There’s many reasons why shrink fits are not suited for heavy roughing and there’s better holders for the task. Side lock solid holders are still some of the best holders for roughing short of milling chucks.
Shorter gauge length, better axial holding power (won’t pull out) and better dampening properties.
Yes. You can rough with a shrink fit. But why? You’re not gaining anything, more expensive holder, and can’t be pushed as hard as a milling chuck or side lock holder.
For rouging I like the zero gauge er collet holders from Sandvik .. "Shortin"..other manufacturers do them also... not as sturdy as a side lock but a good all rounder and they give loads more z clearance. The SPR coated ER collets last for ages as well.
Must not know about Haimer Safe-Lock...
For tool removal, why not camp the end mill and hook a spring to the clamp so that when the tool holder heats up to the right diameter, the spring pulls the tool out of the holder. This method should allow for a DIY system.
I wish i would have putzed with some of the heat shrink tooling at my last shop. My idea, take apart a cheap induction cooktop and reform the coil, have a spring loaded fixture to pull or eject the tool as soon as theres enough slip, or just leave it chucked up, turn the machine on, and put the induction cooktop right next to the holder. Or trial and error with the holder wrapped in a wet towel in a microwave. Even better idea is to put a small spring on the index rod so as soon as its loose it pops out.
The heating you're talking about can be achieved with high frequency induction, rapid low penetration heating. Low frequency like the 60hz straight from the wall will be slower but deeper penetrating, better for melting instead of simple heating. Cool machine but could be done in an analog fashion for 1/10th the cost.
I have been saving my money for shrinks for a very long time.....still cannot afford to buy in. Still dreaming for now.
Glad you focused on this important technology.
Just get a bolt remover. Way cheaper and faster to use.
Just heat the holers up with whatever you got.
Look into Technara slim line shrink holders, different concept using shrink holders. Uses simple heat gun to heat and cool holders. Note always carbide cutters never high speed steel or you will be hard pressed getting them out.
As a maker, it would be very easy for me to make a machine with an induction heater to do this. No need to get super fancy, like they did.
Nice explanation. Probably ought to mention as well that shrink holders cannot be used with HSS tools
Yup, have seen one 7 mm HSS drill in a holder and have to say that the runout is very good and solid connection, but once there is nothing to sharpen ;)
At work i use similar device by kennametal that after the tool is locked it sinks down in the machine and it is sprayed with coolant then come back up...so cool !
Also compared to ER collets they don't get coolant in so keeps the tool and holder free from rust long term.
Arrow Racing Products
If your coolant is causing rust, that’s a problem with the coolant. Either concentration is too low, bad water, or coolant needs replacing. But either way, your coolant should not be causing any rusting on anything, in fact it should be doing the opposite and be preventing things from rusting.
Yes i find most of the time that is the case but every now and then the coolant mix isn't perfect and then I can get some rust.
you can buy a 1000W induction heater system everywhere on internet for something like 30USD with the coil
It would be a good project to do I think with arduino. You have to cool the coil, up and down the coil to adjust to tool length etc. Basically a copy of the marytool machine. Interesting project
In the land of the kiwi (nz) we call it Shrink fit, not to be confused with the heat shrink insulating tube that we heat up and shrink onto a solder join.
This may be a silly question from a novice; but would you ever have to worry about the tool heating up during machining to the point that the tool could loosen and fall out under high cutting load?
Make a DIY Induction heater ! It's easy and cheap. Ebay sells almost completed boards.
Do you not have size rings for your machine they help a lot with sizing different cutter holders. We have been running ours for 16 years now and never looked back
If you snap an endmill even with the bottom of the tool holder, it would be a nightmare to get the broken tool out. The only thing I can think of would be to weld (tig, mig?) a stud to the broken tool.
You know, the tolerances are so tight and expected runouts are so small, that you need to keep that stuff extra clean since even a thread from those gloves getting into the tool holder or on the surface of the tool can mess up the runout tolerance :D
I have an applications which would benefit from more "stick out" and less grip length on a tool that is only available in one shank length (A woodriff key cutter for an o-ring groove). How much less grip length do you think you could get away with using shrink fit?
I believe the tool holder intentionally uses a special stainless with a larger thermal expansion coefficient so even the tool also heats up you should be able to get the tool out.
When you removed the tool at the beginning, I wanted to see you do it without gloves ... just to prove that the tool itself wasn't being heated in the process ;-)
It will get hot. Heat transfers pretty quickly
Try kilowood holder,unbelievable quality and value
Correct me if i'm wrong, but i think that you aren't supposed to let the tool touch the bottom of the toolholder, or at least this is what is written in the manual of some of our heatshrink toolholders.
Probably it's not that important.
For a long time I’ve wondered about the holders that looked like they had been hot I always thought it was a heat treatment thing (sort of is) I’d never heard of heat shrink holders
If heat and a push from the taper end didn't get the tool out then I'm going to guess you managed to bore a hole through the tool to relieve the fit somewhat.
The reason they work is not the speed it heats it Its that CARBIDE doesnt expand at the same rate so the steel holder expands MORE then the carbide tool which is the premise of it working
It is good when you just putting a tool on an empty holder but how about with a broken tool? We used to have them a couple of years ago,works fine for a while until you had broken tool and time is a constrain.
What do you mean when you say are becoming more accessible to shops like us. Aside from the machine how much would a shrink fit holder sell for along with sleeves to serve more than one end mill size and have you mentioned the sleeves and whether they effect the tool hold rigidity. I work at TechShop Abu Dhabi and I have always been interested in these for the making of deep molds using our 3 axis tm-1p.
Interesting stuff. And thanks mentioning at least some metric conversions.
I was just talking to Carl about the coating locations on double ended tools because they can't fit in my hydraulic chucks. Do you think they could fit in heat shrink? I was measuring .2505 diameter on 1/4" tooling. Im guessing it'd be more likely to work on larger diameter tools since the coating is a smaller percentage of the OD
You Can heat your tools up alot cheaper ways. I use heat shrunk holdets alot the last 10 years. Never had a induktion heater.
Its No problem how fast you do it. Carbite does not expand the same AS the holder in metal
After hours and hours of machining can the tool holder became so hot to loose part of his "grip power"?
On the tool holder heater, why is the induction heater motorized? Does it get hot?
I didn't see a card pop up for Eric's video... Can you put cards in your videos for other people's content?
Check out ChrisFix’s latest gift guide video. He shows a hand held inductive heater that can be used to heat up tough to remove nuts. I don’t know if that would be powerful enough to use in this situation.
We tried - enough heat to get the tool IN. Not enough to get it out.
There are some relatively cheap (
what about material de-formation that happens when u heat and cool it infinitely????
I’m an old school machinist didn’t have this nice machine
When are you going to make a DIY induction heater? I've seen a few plans for brass annealers on ye olde internet.
Did you bottom out the end mill in the holder? Or is best to keep it off the bottom?
Very, very cool tech. Is there any concern for material warping after many cycles? Dumping and cooling the holder that many times, does it end with any run out?
I'm told 'no'
The lips at the end of the holder begin to go and no longer shrink around the tool. Progressively gets worse from there with less and less of the internal bore actually gripping on the tool.
Typically 1,000 heat cycles but higher end ones can go through 2k-3k cycles before needing to be replaced.
Any vendor that says “they’ll never wear out” is just giving you marketing wank. Everything wears out eventually.
Keep in mind people this is only for carbide tools
Sweet video John! Hope to see you again soon =)
why does the probe touch 2 times per edge? where I work it only touches once per edge
DId you end up keeping this set up for the shop?
Did you look at the rego-fix
The internet says Carbide has roughly half the thermal growth rate of avg. steels,, Just saying , tool holder should expand more than the tool anyways.
I disagree with you about needing the heater to remove tools. I've been using a propane torch long enough to know better. And I'm not the only one doing that, there are plenty of other shops doing that. The smaller tools ( 1/8 in.) will require a bit more heat than the larger ones, but it's butt stinkin' easy to remove and insert end mills with a propane torch. You'll be fine.
You might also experiment with a higher quality ER collet chuck and collet ( say a Lyndex ) if you are worried about end mills pulling out. And as other have noted the standard end mill holders are fantastic when used with Weldon shank tooling. Anyhow, have fun with the new toys.
Not really new technology. I was fitting tools to tool holders in the mid 80's with an induction heater and it was not a new machine when I was using it. No fancy digital though just timers and a voltage trip with an adjustment chart for different holder sizes. The holders used to bell mouth and needed checking with an air gauge, 0.004mm was enough for the scrap bin.
Try hydraulic tool holders a lot quicker and easier to do a cutter change and compared to the shrink fit stuff I used in the 80's longer lasting.
I’ve been using shrink holders for about a year now with my torch method. Have never had an issue with carbide tools and a torch. Just don’t ever put a hss tool in one.
Have you tried regofix powrgrip? I just purchased that :-)
Heard good things about that system!
I had serious doubts about them, but what convinced me was a job that required a 240mm long access to a 12mm tool. They set me up with a machine for over 6 months and a bunch of trial collets and holders. The advantage there is that the system is self damping. I could've never thought that it was even possible to take normal cuts at that extension. Call them, they'll be more than willing to give you a trial system. Runouts are better than 3microns over normal tool holders over 240mm long the runout was 8microns. Its marginally more expensive than heat-shrink-fit, but you'll get better tool life and the way you use end mills, you'll see the payoff in less than 3 months.
Let me add another thing. The heat shrink is not unlimited cycles, each heat shrink cycle adds a bit of hysteresis into the material of the holder, thus changing runout, internal dimension and the capability to tighten to original dimensions, such things don't exist with cold shrink. The cold shrink is proven for around 20k cycles. In the cold shrink systems, regofix gives you constant holding around the circumference as opposed to Shunk which is just three point. I've tested both.
looks like an arduino project induction coils are fairly cheap.
Should look. Into powergrip it's the only way to go way better then heatshrink
Hi what is the price for the machine?
What was the link for Avant?
Tool holder in drill press, rotate, apply torch to side. Tool drops out.
Should have thrown a tenth indicator on it to show runout
Arduino + induction heater + home built frame = Wednesday widget
Me too -- single burner induction cooking hot plate for the induction parts + some new PWM arduino code to drive it. Wonder how many watts of power one needs.
About three times as much power as you can put into one of those hot plates, ~5kW (if you want to match this thing's power output).
Could always build the induction heater yourself, though it's somewhat more difficult than your average arduino project.
inductionheatertutorial.com/
👨💻 TechPorn 🤪 you can,t sleep🥺 when these pop up in youtube 😳👍 🕺🐨straya! i- luv this stuff- is don is good!
Youre not supposed to reheat the holder as quickly as you did. let it cool down completely or it will damage the holder.
You could always throw the tool in the freezer to help
Trying to get my shop to go the high speed route. Can you point me in the right direction?
According to their website, about 5kW of power from the induction heater, this is easily attainable.
Those 5KW of heat are insanely efficiently pumped into the tool holder. The way the induction heaters work is that they actually use the tool holder as the heating element. The heat is generated by flowing a LOT of electricity through the metal of the tool holder. You can think of it as a transformer, where the secondary winding is 1 winding that is shorted.
I was just mentioning that someone could fairly easily build their own if they were so inclined.
We looked - and there are some DIY plans out there. Risk is you're dealing with some high current - levels that could quickly kill you.
Current doesn't kill - voltage does
stizzit Not true, it's a combo of both. And you have the saying backwards anyways.
Fun fact: It is really easy to make induction heater.
I have yet to see any that are this powerful - and safe to make/use. Not saying it cannot but done, but most of the DIY ones have way less wattage than this
The tool he showed was only $3800. I could engineer such an induction heater, but to get it to the standard of quality and safety that it would be right to deploy to the shop floor, it would have cost more in my own time than a bought one. There's a big gap between what you can do in the danger of your home shop and what's suitable for the production floor when it has to be safe and reliable for years of operation.
Stop use alluminum XD use aisi or tough materials like c45. Alluminum can milled with normal hss and water eheh
Had these at the last place i worked. The induction heater makes the most awful sound imaginable when it is heating. Worse than fingernails on a blackboard.
Was almost bad enough i almost got another employee to do it for me as i couldnt stand the sound.
The orange vise at 5:26 made me sad :'(
You noticed! #blooperscoming
u can build a round heater from scrap instead of paying a few grand
We used a machine similar to this: www.theequipmenthub.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/md-131012-6.jpg at my former employer. The heat was generated by a Steinel HG 4000 E heat blower. It took few minutes to heat up but otherwise worked flawless.
1:45 bearing heater?? What is a bearing heater?
ruclips.net/video/0vL-sArhmkI/видео.html
Da L.
An old microwave 😁
Bearing heaters are nice but all you need if a temperature controlled fry pan or hotplate. 100deg C is all that is needed for bearings any more and the size is wrong and you start to run into problems with grease and temper. On most bearings 100c will give you 8~15 seconds to get into position. The only time I still use the induction heater is for bearings that wont fit into my fry pan.
I feel like this is something that you could make inexpensively
With precision equipment perhaps
I like 😮
Why not make the machine John... You disappoint me here.... Get some coper.. maybe a welder? Or a microwave transformer a arduino some linear guide rails... Go
We looked into it. There is (real) risk re: electricity/power/amps - the sort that can kill you.
And a high power LC resonator circuit to do the actual heating? Induction heaters are super complex, and waaaaaaaaaaaay out of scope of the kind of things NYC CNC does.
or...you know...some oxy...
Alex Haws as has been stated in other comments, carbide has a hugely different rate of thermal expansion (smaller) therefore you could use oxy-acetylene to slowly heat the whole tool AND holder until the tool fell out.
Just stick it in next time you cook some ribs on the Q, works good been doing it for years.
Hello morning
Ahhh thats what your making with your arduino project....
lol we have one, used it to day XD ain't even special anymore hahaha (sorry) than again i'm not working at a smal job shop.
We’re small, not a job shop and just started using these now. Size of shop shouldn’t matter.
still no HSK. SK is so dead it's not even funny.
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