I primarily model Z scale - what I find is that it doesn't take up *that* much less space than N, but, it looks a lot better in the small spaces than N does
@@chocolate_maned_wolf He means the size of the terrain and the environment around the locomotive, making Z scale "look a lot better in the small spaces than N does".
@@chocolate_maned_wolfBeing 40%-50% smaller than N, in a fixed space, the same train can have 40%-50% more scenery around it. You get a higher ratio of scenery to trains Vs. N scale, in the same space. This translates to vertical space as well. I know of a guy in my region who models the Gottardbahn, a Swiss mainline with a long tunnel in Z. Modeling in Z allows him to build “reasonably” high Swiss Alps in a warehouse type space. (I think he’s on RUclips.)
I model large steam transition era in N. To me HO is the best looking scale if you have the space. I don't have a ton of space so for me I'm stuck with N. It's a struggle to see all the details in N I can't imagine anything smaller!
How does a Z scale radius turn compare with N scale? I was planning on building a suitcase layout in N scale, but I’m thinking of moving over to Z scale if the minimum turn radius is significantly smaller.
I didn't know it was so costly. A basic small oval set with 3 cars and a locomotive I can find for $99 in N-scale, but a similar Z-scale set is triple that. Miniaturization does not come cheap. They look cute though. In truth I haven't owned a set since the late 1960s when as a kid I have an HO oval set with a yellow/blue Santa Fe diesel.
About 30 years ago when I was involved in model railroading, N and Z scale were mostly made with European prototypes in mind. There were more American prototypes represented in N than in Z, but not as much as HO and O. I hope that's changed over the last 30 years!
it's still that way- and prolly always will be. speaking in very general terms- the larger the scale, the more reliable and realistic the running quality will be. it's purely a matter of physics. with that being said, we removed our Z layout at my club due to lack of interest- and the guys all decided on DC, but even that didn't keep reliability and track maintenance from becoming an issue. we are now as we started out- an N scale club with 3 N scale layouts- one of them being DC, as well. being saddled with 'motor man' duties- I didn't mind at all seeing the tiny trains go- it was too much for me and the other guys who tried doing it- even without having to worry about decoder installs/issues. for a small layout with one-person operation- it's actually a workable scale, but throw in a larger pike AND digital control- it becomes too much of an endeavor to make it worthwhile. the cost factor was not a big deal, but it could be for a beginner who doesn't have money to burn.
Your application of foliage in this "Z" scale mini diorama is just beautiful. It is a stunning portrayal of depth and random natural appearance. I'd love to see you do a tutorial on how you created this awesome scenery.
Haha. Yeah you do! I was thinking about how it could be useful to have a Z scale line in the background of an N scale layout to do the whole forced perspective thing.
The Micro-Trains Z scale GP35s set a whole new standard for Z when they came out. Digitrax made DCC decoder replacement light boards for them, and we ran a 100 car train with 7 GP35s (3 up front, 3 mid-train, and 1 in back) for World's Greatest Hobby on Tour in Ft. Worth, Texas back in the day. Our modular Z scale layout was 4 feet wide and stretched for almost 40 feet in length. Fun times... But back to N scale.
I've been in z since 1983 and really enjoy it. Of course I model German and Swiss in Mini-Club and 1/220 however the fine scale Euro spec offerings in the last few decades have rubbed off on the US market and its GREAT to see! I'm into domestic US in my P48 and O scale 2 rail modeling however I love the entire hobby and model N with my 8 year old together. Wonderful video and thanks for sharing. -Erik Lindgren
I'm building a diorama right now showing a naval destroyer "train busting" in Korea circa 1950. The Destroyer is 1:350 and I need a steam locomotive (ideally of Japanese origins), tender and an old box car or two. It doesn't have to work. It doesn't need the motor or guts. Something that has been dropped on the floor will do as it'll been seen in the process of "blowing up" after being hit by a 4" naval high explosive shell. Z Scale is the closest size to 1:350 that is around and practical to obtain .
I was never into model trains, but always thought they were cool. Z scale trains hover, i think i could get into those. Have a track going around a tiny ledge right below the ceiling of a house and have a strip of led's next to the track. To most people, it would just look like an LED ledge but then the train goes by and you get a surprise lol
we are working on a high-line layout for the reception area at our club, but it's going to be HO scale. the guys are still trying to decide on a theme for the motive power and rolling stock as there is so much available in that scale. it will be a single-track layout, so we will probably use DC control which will make it more set-and-forget. our displaced Z scale club members are in charge of the high-line project and they are practically foaming at the mouth thinking about buying HO scale stuff.
"Say hello to my little friend" Scale is just a matter of zooming out and with the limitations of space z scale is actually the closest modelers can get to spatial realism. I'm really impressed with this Rokuhan stuff, all I had seen before was Marklin Z and it looked toyish.
The Z scale diorama layout gives you the feeling of a big world even though it's small. I'm also a Z gauge fan and I love small layout. I make a small diorama and introduce the process of making it on my homepage.
The details makes the difference. A bit of weathering can make it look more real and the little set-up looks neat. Great for people who don't have rooms or basements for model rail-roading. A Revell space ship model vs a Japanese Bandai that is 1/2 to 1/8 the size (Depending on the kit) LOOKS better because the smaller kit has 3x the details.
How ‘bout that?! At 0:52 That Lehigh Valley S2 on the cover of the Z Track Magazine is a locomotive I built for a client. I’m not making custom models anymore but it’s nice to see a real printed copy of the magazine with my work on it.
I'm really enjoying my Z scale. I built one layout, and now I'm on my second. There's a lot you can do in such a small scale. What I'm wondering now as I plan out another Z layout is whether or not 60' cars will handle the 195mm radius curves.
These days to make a model railway you have to think out of the box. (Especially if you want to attract the younger generation) I have a 8mm scale layout which is basically N gauge track and rolling stock but use tamiya accessories. Going to shows it does get a lot of attention.But when I explain the principle they can understand it
@@tommurphy4307 Excellent question. If they tasted good, folks would be inclined to eat them, and then the small trains would face extinction. Think of it as Darwinian self preservation. On a related note, broccoli florettes can be used as trees in Z scale dioramas, at least on small timeframes.
Lots of earth quakes! Nice video. Great demo layout. Was interested in Z for a couple of years, but wouldn't commit until I bought a house. Then I decided my eyes are so bad, I went 16mm narrow gauge instead with live steam. That has turned out to have its own set of issues...
my cat isn't interested in my home layout (N scale)- except when she wants attention from me. lucky for me she's 18 now and fairly low-maintenance. she has become a great cat-napper over the years.....
A fun video Steve. I first came across Z scale at the 1999 NMRA convention where a woman was demonstrating how to make Z scale trees. They came out pretty good and one of her comments was the scenic possibilities of Z scale. Ya gotta watch the earthquakes!!! I was rehanging a shop style light over an earlier layout and had one end up and was working on the other end when the chain slipped out of my fingers and made a direct hit on a Downtown Deco building still in kit form and broke a wall in 2 places. Once I got done swearing I realized I had just created a future building with some prime earthquake damage.
Those Rohukan controllers are great. I've used the double to run a 12 x 6 T-TRAK layout for an entire show and not depleted the batteries. I saw a huge Z-Trak layout at an N Scale convention, and one module was a port facility for vehicles arriving by ship, and it looked exactly like the one in Baltimore. The ship size was prototypical, and there were over 100 auto rack cars in the facility. I always figured that motor miniaturization would benefit Z eventually. I've seen the vibrate motors from pagers and later cell phones used as power.
Very cool! Yeah, those little vibrate motors from phones are obviously highly durable and reliable so probably great to use in model train applications.
How I would use these: O Scale: Small tracks, christmas trains. HO Scale: Most setups. N Scale: Long Japaneese bullet train setups Z Scale: Very long freight trains.
i can tell you from experience that very long trains and Z scale don't go well together. you have to worry about that physics thing again. not saying it can't be done, but the rolling stock has to be lighter at the far end of the trains- just like in prototype trains. also, grades and curve radii are of the utmost importance when dealing with really long strings of cars- forget about backing and switching such strings. you'll be doing a lot of body-mount coupler conversions and using LONG switches in your yards.
Like the earthquake at the end with runaway car....that didn´t derail ! When funny goofs can be useful😅😅😅 There is now even smaller with a loop that fit jus right on cowboy hat...... Not sure on my HO layout if a small Z scale would be right to mockup 1 1/2" live steamer scale. It would be cool to have live steamer diesel with peoples sitting in gondolas while the big HO train passes nearby. Don´t forget that in real life, in 1 1/2" scale, a 40 foot boxcar is 6 feet in lenght. There is also bigger scale where you don´t sit on, but in. Ultimately you arrive to full scale narrow gauge 2 feet track and wider. There is far more stuff in Z now than 10 years ago. The bad point i find, is i need magnifier to see it. But for small place, imagine just a 4 X 8 or 12, the empire you can do. Thanks for the show.
During the 80s i made a small HO scale R.R. with a quarry in the center and I used Z scale trucks and dozers and the like for a forced perspective.....it was kinda convincing....
That is the first time I have been able to compare OO and O thank you. I tried N scale but it was a nightmare. I gave it away I couldn't do anything with it from trying to join the Peco track to coupling the carriages. I'm too old to see it even. Thanks for showing this.
I wish the letter designations for train scales was in aphabetical order. Going by numerical scale is probably better primary nomenclature on that basis. We do numerical in every other modelling realm, so why should trains be different than the rest?
Algorythims seem to be working well for you. Videos are coming up for viewing the same day. I am going to build a small N gauge too small for industry switching. Probably scenery in a rural wooded area with a clearing, cabin, carport, shed, dirt access road, picnic table. You could too. About Z scale, the minimum turn radius is not much tighter then N, but because the train is so much smaller, a 2X3foot layout will look so much larger than the equivalent size N layout.
I hope I can get a set like that here in the U.K. I like USA outline models you do things slightly different in the US,we call Z zed,you call it Zee superb 😊,great channel Mark 😊😊
I have a team member at work in the UK and often do work for UK clients and I have to completely change my spelling and word usage in reports and presentations or people yell at me. LOL
I know an O scale 2 rail modeler that put a Z scale setup like a garden railroad on his O scale layout. He had figures riding the cars and other scenery..
I fine the Z scale trains quite tiny and cute! not to mention the many possibility you can do with them, like for example, having entrie railroad system inside a coffee or dinner table.😅
Great video and tutorial of the Z Scale train. I'm very impressed with it and how it works so well! Nice job as always on the 18x24 layout. Cheers from Laurel, Delaware USA
That's a small gauge of train I've seen it once here in blenheim a few years ago referd to trains in a match boxes nice one Steve cheers from Bruce .blenheim south island new Zealand
Great video Steve! Nice to see you giving Z a try. I've been in Z since the early 90s (but have also dabbled in HO and N). I always thought that with your focus being on small layouts Z would be a great addition for you.
that seems to work pretty well but most of my issues with N-scale are non-kato switches, especially double slips, so I wonder how those would perform in Z-scale
Used to be a local store in one of our malls that sold coffee tables with N or Z scale layouts in them. Very expensive, but the layouts were finely detailed with buildings, scenery and some had actual working lakes, streams and waterfalls. I wanted to buy one, but didn't have the funds at the time. One I was looking at had 3 z scale trains that could run at the same time, had switches to change tracks and had a 3 tier waterfall emptying into a flowing stream that ended at a lake with actual moving boats with people fishing in them and around the lake, included mountain terrain and a beautiful trestle bridge over the stream. And the entire thing was automated. Of course, it was the most expensive one in the shop too all in a standard glass top coffee table. Price at the time I was looking at it: $5,999.99 around 1999-2000 era. It was gorgeous. If I could have afforded it, I'd have definitely purchased it! Now that I'm legally blind and older, I only do O and G scale trains now. At least I can see them, but still have a little difficulty getting them on the rails 🤣🤣🤣
I had a Z scale train when I was a kid. It was a steam locomotive and you could pit a couple of drops of oil in it and it would smoke. My dad got a sheet of plywood and mounted the tracks to it so I could just slide it under my bed. I wish I could find something similar. Most z scale locomotives I find today are modern diesels.
There are some steam locomotives occasionally available. It is harder to make them run well in z scale whereas diesels are easier to manufacture so probably why.
@@ryano.5149 ryan: i bet you are a fan of the late carl arendt's 'small layout scrapbook'. check it out online- there are some inspiring little layouts in there- some are even in O or G scales.
I started this hobby recently with my first lay out which was in N scale. it's 11Inches wide by 23 inches long, inside my piano bench. but z scale is calling to me....
Isn't it ironic that as the average home/apt has gotten smaller, prototype rolling stock has gotten bigger with longer trains! I guess that's helped smaller scales. I can't imagine modelling autoracks and 70 foot boxcars in O scale. But you can certainly can model modern trains in Z or N scale. Thanks for the video.
I plan to have a video very soon showing T, Z, N, TT, HO, S, O, G side by side with some scale data and measurements. I’m just waiting on my s scale diesel to arrive in the mail.
yeah Z is quite fun, have a substantial amount of it myself and have done a few layouts over the years, but focused on HO narrow gauge at the moment (including HOf - mining on Z scale track basically). You have to keep it very tight (the joins) and on my last layout I spent some time soldering track joints to maintain electrical connectivity, as well as jump wires on the switches (I was using Marklin switches with micro trains and peco flex track). Its also good enough to run Nn3 as well, plenty of set track that can be weathered and sceniced up, you can still find Micro trains Nn3 cars, and with 3D printing, easy enough to design and print an engine to fit a AZL mech. And it will fit nicely into a case.. Also if you can hand lay 009/HOn30, you can hand lay Z as well. just tighter tolerances.
Maybe Nn3 with a small section of dual gauge (Nn3 on loop like your earlier traction loop) heh... Love your stuff Steve! if youre ever near Denver chasin’ lmk burgers are on me!
This made me curious what the smallest model railroad scale on the market is, which is apparently "T Scale," which works out to about 1:400 or 1:500 scale. The trains are narrower than your finger and some of the smaller locomotives fit comfortably on a coin. Interestingly, to aid with traction and electrical contact at their miniscule size, the powered wheels are magnetic - which has the strange added effect of making T-scale trains capable of climbing grades of 45 degrees or more! They're a bit pricy though, despite being so small, I imagine the level of precision necessary for it to work plus the niche aspect of it all means they're not cheap to make. Still, watching train cars smaller than your pinky finger pulled by a locomotive the length of a nickel run along a layout you can put just about anywhere certainly has its appeal!
Criey it really is small and I sometimes think OO is to small, I hope all the details are factory fitted and there are no Z or even N locos that have detail bags.
When I was a lad, I made an HO scale track set that was 3 metres by 2 meters. It had three and a half circuits and a figure 8. The little town had a McDonald's. I still put a water tower by the track for the steamers, A small pile of coal with a bulldozer and backhoe in the mix to shovel it. It had a crane car, a functional rail cleaner, a few F locomotives, some car carriers complete with vintage cars of the 1970s, two tracksters, and lots of crossovers. One day, there was a very heavy rain fall. The basement flooded. The track was ruined. I gave it all to someone that wanted it for parts. I was so proud of the bridge on that layout. It was a drawbridge I could control with the auxiliary AC power. I really miss it. Today. a simple figure 8 with one locomotive, four cars, and a basic power supply, costs as much as I put into the entire set back then. I guess a return to model train hobby is not for me.
@@StevesTrains The painful tragedy is that it was my first and longest lasting hobby. I think about it a lot. If I did not have to start 100% from nothing, I know I would still be in it. It is heartbreaking. Should I ever restart again, it will be N or Z gauge, DCC control, (which did not exist when I was a kiddo and young adult). Four diesels (one being Conrail), two steamers, two tracksters, one rail cleaner. For rolling stock, I want a 5 wagon long passenger train, a long somewhat modern freight car train, a short vintage freight to go with the steamers, and a few machine type utility wagons. I want a seaside layout with a beach, small aeroport, a seaport with cranes and docked vessels, and mountains. The price was reaching $7500. Of course, not all that is done at once. But just the beginning set was getting close to $1000. At least, I can still admire your work.
@@indridcold8433the main reason I started doing YT videos was to pay for the hobby, which it has done, albeit with a huge amount of extra work that leaves little actual time for the hobby (outside of recording videos). A bit of a catch 22 unfortunately.
I purchased an assortment of freight cars at Centerline Hobbies in Hyannis, Ma, for $3.00 each. If you look around, you can find some good stock at bargain prices...the fellows at Centerline are great! The only caveat I would have for used is if you can't hold ot in your hands, be leery!
I gather some nanotech or microprocessor lab has built an entire model train layout on a silicon chip somewhere in the world just to prove a point of what can be done with nanometer scale machines. Would make quite a major statement on the state of nanotech engineering
A bit off the Z scale topic, but, can you recommend a substitute for the Scenic Express MEDIUM NATURAL SOIL & DIRT. It seems that they have discontinued it.
Just trying to get into this, I wonder if these have any locomotives that use DCC with sound and steam; or is N probably the smallest you can go for all that?
So, I sort of do, but I have a wait list that I’ll probably never get through, or at least not in the next decade. Lol. I’ll slowly work through some of that list, but may also just build layouts and then offer them for sale first to those on the wait list and then put them up for general sale. I plan to make that a retirement job, but for at least another decade while I’m working full time I’ll have a hard time doing more than one layout per year for people and I have like 20 people on my waiting list.
Yeah, my eyesight is not good and hasn’t been since I was in elementary school and I do progressive lenses now, but it is still hard to see stuff in N scale and Z scale for me. On the flip side, I think my projects in smaller scales look better to my eyes sometimes because I can’t see the details so don’t notice what is missing. I turn 50 next year by the way. Time flies.
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i'm not entirely sure why i got recommended this, but these little trains look neat. it's nice to see people talk about the things they enjoy
I primarily model Z scale - what I find is that it doesn't take up *that* much less space than N, but, it looks a lot better in the small spaces than N does
what do you mean?
@@chocolate_maned_wolf He means the size of the terrain and the environment around the locomotive, making Z scale "look a lot better in the small spaces than N does".
@@chocolate_maned_wolfBeing 40%-50% smaller than N, in a fixed space, the same train can have 40%-50% more scenery around it. You get a higher ratio of scenery to trains Vs. N scale, in the same space. This translates to vertical space as well. I know of a guy in my region who models the Gottardbahn, a Swiss mainline with a long tunnel in Z. Modeling in Z allows him to build “reasonably” high Swiss Alps in a warehouse type space. (I think he’s on RUclips.)
I model large steam transition era in N. To me HO is the best looking scale if you have the space. I don't have a ton of space so for me I'm stuck with N. It's a struggle to see all the details in N I can't imagine anything smaller!
How does a Z scale radius turn compare with N scale? I was planning on building a suitcase layout in N scale, but I’m thinking of moving over to Z scale if the minimum turn radius is significantly smaller.
I didn't know it was so costly. A basic small oval set with 3 cars and a locomotive I can find for $99 in N-scale, but a similar Z-scale set is triple that. Miniaturization does not come cheap. They look cute though.
In truth I haven't owned a set since the late 1960s when as a kid I have an HO oval set with a yellow/blue Santa Fe diesel.
About 30 years ago when I was involved in model railroading, N and Z scale were mostly made with European prototypes in mind. There were more American prototypes represented in N than in Z, but not as much as HO and O. I hope that's changed over the last 30 years!
it's still that way- and prolly always will be. speaking in very general terms- the larger the scale, the more reliable and realistic the running quality will be. it's purely a matter of physics. with that being said, we removed our Z layout at my club due to lack of interest- and the guys all decided on DC, but even that didn't keep reliability and track maintenance from becoming an issue. we are now as we started out- an N scale club with 3 N scale layouts- one of them being DC, as well. being saddled with 'motor man' duties- I didn't mind at all seeing the tiny trains go- it was too much for me and the other guys who tried doing it- even without having to worry about decoder installs/issues. for a small layout with one-person operation- it's actually a workable scale, but throw in a larger pike AND digital control- it becomes too much of an endeavor to make it worthwhile. the cost factor was not a big deal, but it could be for a beginner who doesn't have money to burn.
Your application of foliage in this "Z" scale mini diorama is just beautiful. It is a stunning portrayal of depth and random natural appearance. I'd love to see you do a tutorial on how you created this awesome scenery.
Video on building the layout including how I did the trees next week!
Delightful.
Transversing switches a problem in z scale, without frequent derailments?
Looking forward to next week Steve. I am working on a HO scale mountain on my layout, and I like what you have done on your Z scale layout.
Great. now I need to buy a z scale starter set. THANKS STEVE🤪
Haha. Yeah you do! I was thinking about how it could be useful to have a Z scale line in the background of an N scale layout to do the whole forced perspective thing.
The Micro-Trains Z scale GP35s set a whole new standard for Z when they came out. Digitrax made DCC decoder replacement light boards for them, and we ran a 100 car train with 7 GP35s (3 up front, 3 mid-train, and 1 in back) for World's Greatest Hobby on Tour in Ft. Worth, Texas back in the day. Our modular Z scale layout was 4 feet wide and stretched for almost 40 feet in length.
Fun times... But back to N scale.
can't imagine trying to turn that train 180 degrees inside of 4 feet. those locos would have to be running at EXACTLY the same speed all the time.
40 feet wow. ...did you started on Atlantic shore ending on Pacific one ?
In HO it´s about 100 feet long !
I've been in z since 1983 and really enjoy it. Of course I model German and Swiss in Mini-Club and 1/220 however the fine scale Euro spec offerings in the last few decades have rubbed off on the US market and its GREAT to see! I'm into domestic US in my P48 and O scale 2 rail modeling however I love the entire hobby and model N with my 8 year old together. Wonderful video and thanks for sharing. -Erik Lindgren
I'm building a diorama right now showing a naval destroyer "train busting" in Korea circa 1950. The Destroyer is 1:350 and I need a steam locomotive (ideally of Japanese origins), tender and an old box car or two. It doesn't have to work. It doesn't need the motor or guts. Something that has been dropped on the floor will do as it'll been seen in the process of "blowing up" after being hit by a 4" naval high explosive shell. Z Scale is the closest size to 1:350 that is around and practical to obtain .
The Rokuhan switches are amazing! Very smooth and positive. They include isolation circuits for spurs. The switch motor is hidden in the body.
This was fun to watch. If your ever in the need of Z or N scale models stop by and take a look of what we have to offer for your layouts
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I was never into model trains, but always thought they were cool. Z scale trains hover, i think i could get into those. Have a track going around a tiny ledge right below the ceiling of a house and have a strip of led's next to the track. To most people, it would just look like an LED ledge but then the train goes by and you get a surprise lol
That would be cool!
you are FULL OF FUN, dog!
@@tommurphy4307 yup with the EAT sign in the kitchen and everything
we are working on a high-line layout for the reception area at our club, but it's going to be HO scale. the guys are still trying to decide on a theme for the motive power and rolling stock as there is so much available in that scale. it will be a single-track layout, so we will probably use DC control which will make it more set-and-forget. our displaced Z scale club members are in charge of the high-line project and they are practically foaming at the mouth thinking about buying HO scale stuff.
"Say hello to my little friend" Scale is just a matter of zooming out and with the limitations of space z scale is actually the closest modelers can get to spatial realism. I'm really impressed with this Rokuhan stuff, all I had seen before was Marklin Z and it looked toyish.
AZL makes really great Z scale rolling stock and locomotives.
Yes they do from what I can tell!
My first model train was an N scale. It looked awesome going around the Xmas tree every year in my childhood. 🎄
The Z scale diorama layout gives you the feeling of a big world even though it's small.
I'm also a Z gauge fan and I love small layout. I make a small diorama and introduce the process of making it on my homepage.
The blooper at the end 😆
Thanks for showing off the Z scale!
It’s incredible how much detail goes into this tiny train
No pilot detail on the loco. Only can be viewed from the side to look good.
The details makes the difference. A bit of weathering can make it look more real and the little set-up looks neat. Great for people who don't have rooms or basements for model rail-roading.
A Revell space ship model vs a Japanese Bandai that is 1/2 to 1/8 the size (Depending on the kit) LOOKS better because the smaller kit has 3x the details.
How ‘bout that?! At 0:52 That Lehigh Valley S2 on the cover of the Z Track Magazine is a locomotive I built for a client. I’m not making custom models anymore but it’s nice to see a real printed copy of the magazine with my work on it.
Very cool!
thats very impressive- i shy away from doing motor tune-ups on Z scale motive power!
I'm really enjoying my Z scale. I built one layout, and now I'm on my second. There's a lot you can do in such a small scale. What I'm wondering now as I plan out another Z layout is whether or not 60' cars will handle the 195mm radius curves.
These days to make a model railway you have to think out of the box.
(Especially if you want to attract the younger generation)
I have a 8mm scale layout which is basically N gauge track and rolling stock but use tamiya accessories.
Going to shows it does get a lot of attention.But when I explain the principle they can understand it
I have always just loved Z scale trains. Always had HO but Z was always really fascinating.
me too, the amount of detail is surprising.
why don't they make them taste good?
@@tommurphy4307 Excellent question. If they tasted good, folks would be inclined to eat them, and then the small trains would face extinction. Think of it as Darwinian self preservation. On a related note, broccoli florettes can be used as trees in Z scale dioramas, at least on small timeframes.
Lots of earth quakes! Nice video. Great demo layout. Was interested in Z for a couple of years, but wouldn't commit until I bought a house. Then I decided my eyes are so bad, I went 16mm narrow gauge instead with live steam. That has turned out to have its own set of issues...
Looking forward to the follow-up video. I can see my cats encouraging me to start a Z-scale layout.
my cat isn't interested in my home layout (N scale)- except when she wants attention from me. lucky for me she's 18 now and fairly low-maintenance. she has become a great cat-napper over the years.....
Yep and put some catnip grass too😅😅😅
The close up shots of the train rolling past as amazing; so smooth and such great detail, it looks quite large.
That’s Impressive 👍😃OperateOnOperator
I haven't been into train sets for years but I think HO scale would be my favourite.
Z Scale offers the opportunity of running trains in more realistic vast scenic settings.
not really so scale-specific- more like how-much-room-do-you-have specific.
For those who want the Z scale set can create a huge scenery of different types of buildings, farms and industrial areas.
I need one of these. I'm looking to build my first ever train set, but I hardly have space anywhere.
A fun video Steve. I first came across Z scale at the 1999 NMRA convention where a woman was demonstrating how to make Z scale trees. They came out pretty good and one of her comments was the scenic possibilities of Z scale.
Ya gotta watch the earthquakes!!! I was rehanging a shop style light over an earlier layout and had one end up and was working on the other end when the chain slipped out of my fingers and made a direct hit on a Downtown Deco building still in kit form and broke a wall in 2 places. Once I got done swearing I realized I had just created a future building with some prime earthquake damage.
Every accident brings new opportunities!
Those Rohukan controllers are great. I've used the double to run a 12 x 6 T-TRAK layout for an entire show and not depleted the batteries. I saw a huge Z-Trak layout at an N Scale convention, and one module was a port facility for vehicles arriving by ship, and it looked exactly like the one in Baltimore. The ship size was prototypical, and there were over 100 auto rack cars in the facility.
I always figured that motor miniaturization would benefit Z eventually. I've seen the vibrate motors from pagers and later cell phones used as power.
Very cool! Yeah, those little vibrate motors from phones are obviously highly durable and reliable so probably great to use in model train applications.
How I would use these:
O Scale: Small tracks, christmas trains.
HO Scale: Most setups.
N Scale: Long Japaneese bullet train setups
Z Scale: Very long freight trains.
i can tell you from experience that very long trains and Z scale don't go well together. you have to worry about that physics thing again. not saying it can't be done, but the rolling stock has to be lighter at the far end of the trains- just like in prototype trains. also, grades and curve radii are of the utmost importance when dealing with really long strings of cars- forget about backing and switching such strings. you'll be doing a lot of body-mount coupler conversions and using LONG switches in your yards.
I've got a Trinity Railway Express Z-Scale set but I haven't even had time to take it out of the package and run it.
That Rokuhan stuff is nice. I got the small controller for around the Christmas tree setup.
Like the earthquake at the end with runaway car....that didn´t derail !
When funny goofs can be useful😅😅😅
There is now even smaller with a loop that fit jus right on cowboy hat......
Not sure on my HO layout if a small Z scale would be right to mockup 1 1/2" live steamer scale. It would be cool to have live steamer diesel with peoples sitting in gondolas while the big HO train passes nearby.
Don´t forget that in real life, in 1 1/2" scale, a 40 foot boxcar is 6 feet in lenght. There is also bigger scale where you don´t sit on, but in. Ultimately you arrive to full scale narrow gauge 2 feet track and wider.
There is far more stuff in Z now than 10 years ago. The bad point i find, is i need magnifier to see it. But for small place, imagine just a 4 X 8 or 12, the empire you can do.
Thanks for the show.
During the 80s i made a small HO scale R.R. with a quarry in the center and I used Z scale trucks and dozers and the like for a forced perspective.....it was kinda convincing....
I love everything but the oval Z sticker. Looks like a good apartment set choice
~Enjoyed seeing this little fella-Z...want one but N-scale is pretty small when working things out....but my heart really wants a Z-scale one day.😊😊😊😊
Ladys LIKE it!!! It´s something really pretty cool. LA
That is the first time I have been able to compare OO and O thank you. I tried N scale but it was a nightmare. I gave it away I couldn't do anything with it from trying to join the Peco track to coupling the carriages. I'm too old to see it even. Thanks for showing this.
I love Z scale. The detail is amainf
wish I chose Z for building my 4' by 2' lay out. Great video thanks!
I wish the letter designations for train scales was in aphabetical order. Going by numerical scale is probably better primary nomenclature on that basis. We do numerical in every other modelling realm, so why should trains be different than the rest?
Well done, Pennsylvania on one square feet.
Wow....I've been "playing" with N scale...and doing a "small" layout etc....but Z scale is intriguing
I love seeing this setup. It is a beautiful setup. It is amazing. I do think you have cost me more money. I am looking forward to next week.
I 've heard that some HO scalers will use smaller gauge trains to show back distance. This would work for that as well.
Yes, it is a great way to create a forced perspective and make the layout appear larger if you do it correctly.
very cool concept I haven't seen it in practice yet.
you were lied to.....
Nice scenery and video Steve, this package you have is a great way to start in Z scale too.
Algorythims seem to be working well for you. Videos are coming up for viewing the same day. I am going to build a small N gauge too small for industry switching. Probably scenery in a rural wooded area with a clearing, cabin, carport, shed, dirt access road, picnic table. You could too. About Z scale, the minimum turn radius is not much tighter then N, but because the train is so much smaller, a 2X3foot layout will look so much larger than the equivalent size N layout.
I hope I can get a set like that here in the U.K. I like USA outline models you do things slightly different in the US,we call Z zed,you call it Zee superb 😊,great channel
Mark 😊😊
I have a team member at work in the UK and often do work for UK clients and I have to completely change my spelling and word usage in reports and presentations or people yell at me. LOL
@@StevesTrains 😂😂your doing ok Steve mate
@@StevesTrains Maybe you should yell at them for using UK verbiage when talking to you. It goes both ways.
I know an O scale 2 rail modeler that put a Z scale setup like a garden railroad on his O scale layout. He had figures riding the cars and other scenery..
I THOUGHT you were going to say he had 'trained' mice running the trains.
Was thinking the same but with HO and Z.
Z scale is great for having wide sweeping curves without it taking up the entire room
Very nice Steve but too small for me. I need my reading glasses for my O-gauge.
I fine the Z scale trains quite tiny and cute! not to mention the many possibility you can do with them, like for example, having entrie railroad system inside a coffee or dinner table.😅
Great video and tutorial of the Z Scale train. I'm very impressed with it and how it works so well! Nice job as always on the 18x24 layout. Cheers from Laurel, Delaware USA
That's a small gauge of train I've seen it once here in blenheim a few years ago referd to trains in a match boxes nice one Steve cheers from Bruce .blenheim south island new Zealand
Great video Steve! Nice to see you giving Z a try. I've been in Z since the early 90s (but have also dabbled in HO and N). I always thought that with your focus being on small layouts Z would be a great addition for you.
Yeah, I’ll definitely have to do more with it in the future.
that seems to work pretty well but most of my issues with N-scale are non-kato switches, especially double slips, so I wonder how those would perform in Z-scale
Z-scale goes great built into a glass top coffee table
That is a great idea!
Used to be a local store in one of our malls that sold coffee tables with N or Z scale layouts in them.
Very expensive, but the layouts were finely detailed with buildings, scenery and some had actual working lakes, streams and waterfalls.
I wanted to buy one, but didn't have the funds at the time.
One I was looking at had 3 z scale trains that could run at the same time, had switches to change tracks and had a 3 tier waterfall emptying into a flowing stream that ended at a lake with actual moving boats with people fishing in them and around the lake, included mountain terrain and a beautiful trestle bridge over the stream.
And the entire thing was automated. Of course, it was the most expensive one in the shop too all in a standard glass top coffee table.
Price at the time I was looking at it: $5,999.99 around 1999-2000 era.
It was gorgeous. If I could have afforded it, I'd have definitely purchased it!
Now that I'm legally blind and older, I only do O and G scale trains now. At least I can see them, but still have a little difficulty getting them on the rails 🤣🤣🤣
Fantastic, Z scale rules!
To me where Z scale could really shine is in a layout with a mountain railrooading theme.
I had a Z scale train when I was a kid. It was a steam locomotive and you could pit a couple of drops of oil in it and it would smoke. My dad got a sheet of plywood and mounted the tracks to it so I could just slide it under my bed. I wish I could find something similar. Most z scale locomotives I find today are modern diesels.
There are some steam locomotives occasionally available. It is harder to make them run well in z scale whereas diesels are easier to manufacture so probably why.
TRY A GERMAN HOBBY place like wohlschlegel
Cool video Steve! AZL is doing a great job in Z scale! 🙂
Finally a scale that can actually be usable in my 100m2 two bedroom apartment!
I built/am building an N scale layout in a rectangular electric guitar case, so...where there is a will, there is a way!
@@ryano.5149 ryan: i bet you are a fan of the late carl arendt's 'small layout scrapbook'. check it out online- there are some inspiring little layouts in there- some are even in O or G scales.
Oh there is an even smaller scale T at roughly half Z scale.
I started this hobby recently with my first lay out which was in N scale. it's 11Inches wide by 23 inches long, inside my piano bench. but z scale is calling to me....
Isn't it ironic that as the average home/apt has gotten smaller, prototype rolling stock has gotten bigger with longer trains! I guess that's helped smaller scales. I can't imagine modelling autoracks and 70 foot boxcars in O scale. But you can certainly can model modern trains in Z or N scale. Thanks for the video.
a brief overview of how big the scales are in terms of size reduction would be nice; a 1:whatever type deal.
I plan to have a video very soon showing T, Z, N, TT, HO, S, O, G side by side with some scale data and measurements. I’m just waiting on my s scale diesel to arrive in the mail.
yeah Z is quite fun, have a substantial amount of it myself and have done a few layouts over the years, but focused on HO narrow gauge at the moment (including HOf - mining on Z scale track basically). You have to keep it very tight (the joins) and on my last layout I spent some time soldering track joints to maintain electrical connectivity, as well as jump wires on the switches (I was using Marklin switches with micro trains and peco flex track). Its also good enough to run Nn3 as well, plenty of set track that can be weathered and sceniced up, you can still find Micro trains Nn3 cars, and with 3D printing, easy enough to design and print an engine to fit a AZL mech. And it will fit nicely into a case.. Also if you can hand lay 009/HOn30, you can hand lay Z as well. just tighter tolerances.
Picking up some Nn3 stuff would be fun. Since I don’t have any structures on my little Z scale layout, I could run Nn3 stuff just fine.
Maybe Nn3 with a small section of dual gauge (Nn3 on loop like your earlier traction loop) heh... Love your stuff Steve! if youre ever near Denver chasin’ lmk burgers are on me!
This made me curious what the smallest model railroad scale on the market is, which is apparently "T Scale," which works out to about 1:400 or 1:500 scale. The trains are narrower than your finger and some of the smaller locomotives fit comfortably on a coin. Interestingly, to aid with traction and electrical contact at their miniscule size, the powered wheels are magnetic - which has the strange added effect of making T-scale trains capable of climbing grades of 45 degrees or more! They're a bit pricy though, despite being so small, I imagine the level of precision necessary for it to work plus the niche aspect of it all means they're not cheap to make. Still, watching train cars smaller than your pinky finger pulled by a locomotive the length of a nickel run along a layout you can put just about anywhere certainly has its appeal!
My Friday YT Short this week is on T Gauge and I’ll have two full videos coming up on it, the first on August 29th.
what is the implication behind your finger reference??
Criey it really is small and I sometimes think OO is to small, I hope all the details are factory fitted and there are no Z or even N locos that have detail bags.
I just bought a ZZZ scale layout. It can only be viewed under an electron microscope. The realistic coal cars can be loaded with 1 carbon atom each.
Solid
When I was a lad, I made an HO scale track set that was 3 metres by 2 meters. It had three and a half circuits and a figure 8. The little town had a McDonald's. I still put a water tower by the track for the steamers, A small pile of coal with a bulldozer and backhoe in the mix to shovel it. It had a crane car, a functional rail cleaner, a few F locomotives, some car carriers complete with vintage cars of the 1970s, two tracksters, and lots of crossovers. One day, there was a very heavy rain fall. The basement flooded. The track was ruined. I gave it all to someone that wanted it for parts. I was so proud of the bridge on that layout. It was a drawbridge I could control with the auxiliary AC power. I really miss it. Today. a simple figure 8 with one locomotive, four cars, and a basic power supply, costs as much as I put into the entire set back then. I guess a return to model train hobby is not for me.
Yes, sadly it is not cheap, but few hobbies are these days.
@@StevesTrains The painful tragedy is that it was my first and longest lasting hobby. I think about it a lot. If I did not have to start 100% from nothing, I know I would still be in it. It is heartbreaking. Should I ever restart again, it will be N or Z gauge, DCC control, (which did not exist when I was a kiddo and young adult). Four diesels (one being Conrail), two steamers, two tracksters, one rail cleaner. For rolling stock, I want a 5 wagon long passenger train, a long somewhat modern freight car train, a short vintage freight to go with the steamers, and a few machine type utility wagons. I want a seaside layout with a beach, small aeroport, a seaport with cranes and docked vessels, and mountains. The price was reaching $7500. Of course, not all that is done at once. But just the beginning set was getting close to $1000. At least, I can still admire your work.
@@indridcold8433the main reason I started doing YT videos was to pay for the hobby, which it has done, albeit with a huge amount of extra work that leaves little actual time for the hobby (outside of recording videos). A bit of a catch 22 unfortunately.
was there a liquor store near the mcdonalds?
I purchased an assortment of freight cars at Centerline Hobbies in Hyannis, Ma, for $3.00 each. If you look around, you can find some good stock at bargain prices...the fellows at Centerline are great! The only caveat I would have for used is if you can't hold ot in your hands, be leery!
I didn't know z scale WAS this good
I like the idea of modules. But i dont like the ratio of track to scenery. So im going to try it in z scale
I’m lookinhard atz now
Very nice.thanks for sharing David @LCRR
tiny rc cars and drones are also great.
Are z scail model trains are adorable?
I gather some nanotech or microprocessor lab has built an entire model train layout on a silicon chip somewhere in the world just to prove a point of what can be done with nanometer scale machines. Would make quite a major statement on the state of nanotech engineering
I love the z scale layout a lot, I'm excited to see the tutorial video as I'm curious how you made the ballast, it looks really good
A bit off the Z scale topic, but, can you recommend a substitute for the Scenic Express MEDIUM NATURAL SOIL & DIRT. It seems that they have discontinued it.
Oh, that is sad! I haven’t looked around for another product yet, but I guess I’ll have to see what is available soon once my supply runs out.
Very nice. Thanks.
I was in the Märklin factory in Germany and saw how they made them.
Cool!
Love the outtake ! 😀
Thanks, I’ll need to start doing that in my videos going forward. I’m always bumbling around knocking things over and stuff.
I gotta get me a z sxale set. Theyre so cool and detailex
How do the scales line with die cast and such. for instance what scale railroad works with 1/24th scale die cast? Etc
G scale is the closest to that. I think g scale is 1/32nd but it varies. O scale varies too but is around 1/48 so half the size of your cars.
T gauge: bro thought HE was small
Can you make the tracks bendy...ie...like putting curves in the track ?
This track is section track with fixed radius curves but you can buy flexible track.
Thankyou much appreciated
Thank you.
O, HO, N and Z, what logic does this scale follow? As an outsider, it seems like someone picked 5 letters and had fun.
I’d definitely struggle getting it on the rails
love it!
Just trying to get into this, I wonder if these have any locomotives that use DCC with sound and steam; or is N probably the smallest you can go for all that?
DCC yes, not sure if any have sound.
I have seen that z-scale are magnetized to stay . ?
Z Scale, are you going to be building layouts for sale, if so I would be very interested...
So, I sort of do, but I have a wait list that I’ll probably never get through, or at least not in the next decade. Lol. I’ll slowly work through some of that list, but may also just build layouts and then offer them for sale first to those on the wait list and then put them up for general sale. I plan to make that a retirement job, but for at least another decade while I’m working full time I’ll have a hard time doing more than one layout per year for people and I have like 20 people on my waiting list.
Awesome. But at 50 years old, with presbyopia; I'm thinking of changing to TT or HO rather than a smaller scale. The layout is very nice.
Yeah, my eyesight is not good and hasn’t been since I was in elementary school and I do progressive lenses now, but it is still hard to see stuff in N scale and Z scale for me. On the flip side, I think my projects in smaller scales look better to my eyes sometimes because I can’t see the details so don’t notice what is missing. I turn 50 next year by the way. Time flies.
@@StevesTrains welcome to the club.
Thanks?? Lol
I'd love to do Z but I love steam, and a good (2-8-2) engine is over $200.