The Legendary Battle Royale of ALL DRAGONS - Elden Ring
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- Опубликовано: 1 июн 2024
- In this elden ring video I've placed the 12 most powerful dragon bosses in the game on the same battlefield, with the intent to have them fight each other in a boss vs boss battle to determine which dragon is the strongest in the game.
In the 1st round I kept them with the scale and hp they originally have during story mode, while in the following 2 rounds I've scaled all of them to tier 18 (elden throne) and gave them 28k health.
According to the elden ring lore, ancient dragons ruled the lands between before the age of the erdtree and prior to the coming of the golden order, with their lord being Placidusax.
Timestamps:
Intro 0:00
Round 1 0:42
Round 2 6:53
Round 3 13:59
If you enjoyed this video and would like to see more elden ring related content and boss vs boss battles please subscribe and activate the nofitications.
#bossfight #darksouls #eldenring 
Игры
Did you guys know that Greyoll can actually fight and spit fire and what we see is just an animation being looped over and over until we defeat all the tiny dragons?
Hope you enjoyed, stay tuned for a lot more!
This is great! Can you scale up an Ancient Dragon to the size of Gransaxx's body in the Royal Capital, and then have him be part of the fight too?
@@ZhaoPao we will need a bigger arena for him xd
@@Pyrody greyrol is a she’s I’m pretty sure she’s the mom of most the dragons in the game
@@kadelcomper I'm pretty sure no one said Greyoll is of any gender
@@kadelcomper talking about Gransaxx, not Greyoll.
Elder Dragons: fly and breath flames and lightning
Magma Wurms: walking is better for health
Magma Wyrm: I vored swamp crabs more fearsome than you!
Magma Wyrm are like: Don't skip leg day
IKR. In my one playthrough of ER, I ended up using the Magma Wyrm's Scale sword clear until the end of the game. It's weapon skill had the distinct advantage of being able to dodge certain attacks, deal MASSIVE continuous damage, and most importantly, once the animation started, it couldn't be interrupted.
He's basically just waddling around like a chibi lizard. It's adorable. He probably got so upset towards the end. Could never reach Greyoll cuz she kept flying away. And when he did, he'd always miss
It's because Magma Wyrms are warriors who did a ritual to become dragons. The ritual failed and they look similar to dragons but they walk and fight like humans, they didn't get real dragons agility. This is why they are the only "dragons" that wield swords.
I love how they all have to roar at the start. It's just good dragon manners.
thats not good manners they trash talking to each other
@@fhufhfhjfjfjf9534 "get good bro, your breath smells like rot"
@@ItsVenti "Can it, your jokes are as cold as ur breath"
@@sir_coma60 "call me Agheel because I'm spitting fire"
Greyoll: "shut up you clown, don't make me come down there"
@@fhufhfhjfjfjf9534 I think it's like warriors bowing before fight
Placidusax was personally executing dragons with his lightning claw in the first round
Hail to the king.
@@hellborne7995 the king would be gransax but unfortunately we didn’t have an opportunity to fight that one as a boss
@@blitzcourt5021 I’m just hoping Gransax is in the DLC.
@@blitzcourt5021 wasn't placidusax above gransax lore wise? not sure as i'm a bit rusty on elden ring lore, but he was the elden lord in the age before the erdtree i thought
@@CRO-Palacinke-D.C yes, placidusax only has 2 of his 5 heads and half his wings are ripped off, so what we fight is a super weakened version, in his prime he would have been strongest
Since the giants battle, i noticed that we as players can never see the full wonder of this giant enemies animation, is so beatiful seeing them from a panoramic view.
Yes on my screen it's usually just a giant wing flapping in my face while I panic roll
Paranoic view
>we as players can never see the full wonder of this giant enemies animation
Yes you can if you use ranged options.
Well. You can as long as you stop locking on enemies, which is actually benefical since the camera going nuts due to the enemies wonky movements makes the game much harder.
Elden ring is muuuuch easier without targeting enemies.
You gotta check this video! Sick combos Incantations only helpful ruclips.net/video/qooy8WpYRUk/видео.html
Grandpa and grandmas real fight isn’t with each other.
It’s with dementia.
underrated comment 😂
I gotta say, seeing Magma Wyrm win one made me very happy. What a good man, what a decent chap
Do you think that was Theodorix or Makar?
Not a real dragon technically
@@samuelsheldon7829 Makar is the smaller, darker one I believe
@@VansSkully it's a video game
Magma worms are so fricking adorable
10:23 - Placidusax and Lanseax, waging an epic battle of claw, fire and primordial magic the likes of which the world has not seen in aeons.
Meanwhile, on the other side of the arena, Theodorix and Makar be like:
"YOU WERE THE CHOSEN ONE!"
"I HATE YOOOUU!"
11:07 - and then they got hit with narcolepsy , woke up after a few seconds, And then where like =
(Makar) Where are we?
(Theodorix) Idunno i think we where fighting
(Makar) oh yeah that, thanks bud
And then they continued to fight
Fortissax fan here but I knew he wouldn't stand a chance. Still one of the most magnificent fights in the game imo and he's so highly underrated
I absolutely agree
God tier OST
He came 2nd and 3rd lol could easily win both given bigger sanple size
Easily best dragon fight in series to me.
Still the most badass looking dragon
Aint he just a black ancient dragon tho?
I never noticed it in gameplay before, but when Lanseax uses her lightning glaive, she calls down a lightning bolt to form it. It reminds me of the dragon from the reveal trailer except with red lightning instead of yellow.
the ancient dragon in the trailer is the same as lansseax however the spear was given to fortissax and she got the glaive, both were red lightning
What are you talking about? They always had the red lightning, both in trailer and in game. Besides, the dragon shown in reveal trailer actually WAS Lanseax, so I totally don't understand your point.
What? Every single red lightning incantation does the exact same thing.
@@Mad_racc00n which trailer are y’all talking about
@@kevinmagno5735 Gameplay trailer. The one that was shown in june 2021.
I was so sad about placidusax losing that third round right as he pulled out the lightning nuke. That would've glorious, he still definitely had the highest KD with how he was straight up executing other dragons
Only because Greyoll’s hitboxes are wonky because she’s not meant to be able to fight.
Yup smh he's my favorite but anytime he's in any vid he seems to lose
And still nearly killed his great great great great great grand niece.
I mean, yeah - others are focusing down opponents, while Placidusax not only hitting entire god damn arena, but also going focused assasination strikes
Except for Greyoll - she's supposed to be able to have an extreme AoE, but instead her hitboxes are same size as normal sized dragons of her type...
In the end they ganged up on my Boi.😭
It kinda makes sense that The Wyrms who had to slay dragons to make a communion would fair well against them lmao
Yeah literally, like putting a dragon hunter's soul in a dragon and giving said dragon a big sword, well I can't imagine any dragon really have a good chance against him
And then, when he's not fighting dragons, you have Theodorix being on the brink of death after fighting 3 land octopuses one after the other
Which makes it look like he got cornered at the end of his ravine and was laying down to try to not be seen
7:29 Placidusax: "Behold my mighty lightning lance!" (Massive lance, massive explosion)
Fortissax: "I can do that too!" (pulls out a twig and dribbles some electricity on the ground)
loved the little sound effects from that move
Tbf Fortissax does have stage 50 cancer in this fight
Greyoll is interesting with the regular dragon ai driving it. I'm curious why only in the second round she used her fire breath attacks. But seeing them made me think she needs the fire animation and hit boxes scaled up. It looks like she's even confused at why so little of coming out trying it back to back
She too old, it only sputters out now.
I think the reason her moveset changes is because of the level scaling mentioned in the video. There must be something about her default stats that lock her out of the attack. I also noticed that after the level scaling, placidusax sometimes lost the ability to do a full power laser breath attack too. While it's equally possible that it's the result of a bug from level scaling and not an intentional feature, it at least seems like thats what is causing her change in attacks
@@RuneKatashima very agile for an old Lady though
I think the issue in the first round was that Greyroll's head kept clipping into the floor. I can see that screwing up the collision mechanics and causing the AI to skip the fire breath attack (since it would go nowhere). That might actually be why she doesn't strafe - her head moves out of the 'fire zone'. I also suspect that her hitboxes and animation for the fire is set to 'normal' dragon size, so the distance between her head and the ground is longer than the fire, causing the AI to shortcircuit and skip the move again. As for the normal ground sweep, Greyroll covers a larger patch of ground faster than a 'normal' dragon, so depending on how the fire breath propagates it might not have the time to build up and move out like it would on a smaller scale - its greater spread kept the range down.
@@Aona_Music right I understand that but it's more wishful thinking not a complaint.
I feel bad for Makar in round 2 he had to kill his big brother and then walk all the way across that huge arena just for Lanseaxe to melt him
Time stamp?
Yeah n then makar won the round 3.. fair enough
@@fzo-b2131
11:40 - Makar vs Magma
13:40 - Lansseax puts Makar's foolish ambitions to rest
18:10 - Sweet revenge
@@shaonakolte The best dragons don't need crutches like flight.
@@shaonakolte it was actually Theodorix, that one super tanky wyrm in the blizzard area
As a placidi fan, at first I was heartbroken, but then I remembered that he's the only one here who's missing an entire head. And he was still handing out Ls. That's a flex in itself
missin 2 or 3 heads to be fair, our boy is ragged
Tbf the lore for him basically is that "they don't call me 'Lord' for nothing."
I want to see how strong he was in his prime
In the lore the wyrms are men who tried to make themselves into dragons but failed, now having to live with a hideous not-quite-human-not-quite-dragon form.
I think after this the wyrms can feel pretty good about themselves
Atleast we have renalla's great rune to counter that deformity.... (Lorewise)
You’re thinking of dragonkin. The worms didn’t try to make themselves into dragons, but they used dragon communion too much and got cursed to these forms.
@@desmondcoppin591 Imagine Dragon Communion being a thing in real life? XD
I find the wyrms really fucking adorable despite being “hideous abominations” like they’re just these pudgy lizards who like to roll around and crawl, I couldn’t even get mad at them when I died
@@desmondcoppin591 what would happen if a dragonkin did dragon communion
I love how everyone is just shredding each other and then Ekzykes pulls out the decay and singlehandedly wipes half of them out
If these dragons could get death blighted, death lightning would be insanely strong
True
Doesn't lichdragon have death blight?
@@bryanfan3175 that’s why he said that
@@bryanfan3175 most enemies are immune to deathblight. Just like frenzy.
Considering their size, they would actually get hit by most of it so yeah. Would probably destroy half of them in the first casting. Just delete button.
Crazy that Greyoll's head is basically the size of all of these dragons.
I love how in the last round placi coulda just faded out and swooped back in to finish the last two off, but he instead was like “Nah, I’m just gunna KO both of them at once with big BOOM!” Unfortunately for him he’s miscalculated a little. Regardless they’re all lucky he missed as much as he did with his laser beams.
Side note. I’d love to see a damage counter for these fights to see how much dps each were managing to put out.
Magma Wyrms' smaller profiles definitely helped it in this battle. Also, very funny and kind of cute seeing them waddle after the other dragons.
Makar and theodorix having a sword fight was something pretty underrated
I think it would've been better without Greyoll. She kinda threw everything off. It was cool to see her fight but I just think with her hit boxes and stuff she made it awkward.
Agreed man
Fighting is always awkward with mom around
@@kayden4145 cant unleash full potential
She is big tho omg
Yeah, Grayoll's hitboxes are to large for any of the other dragons to even do anything since their attacks are not made for dealing with such a large target.
Woah is that big ass dragon Greyroll? Can't believe you got her to move and shit 😭
Yep, it is her. She does have a full moveset and can even spit fire
@@BjornTheBear the fire isnt even scaled to her size I think the devs just gave her the standard dragon move set 😭
@@itsofficiallypluto3670 well it's genuine stated a female version of so def deserved that smol adjusted movesets"
Greyoll, mother of all dragons turns into Greyoll, destroyer of all dragons
The fact that the magma worms stand toe to toe with ancient dragons is interesting from a lore stand point like imagine if somebody transformed by dragon communication got turned properly the outcome could be quite terrifying and magnificent
Looking at Greyoll in comparison now......holy fuck thank God she was stationary
Imagine if the lendyell dragon was alive. He's even bigger.
@@mohammadsaleem5990 thank god we didnt ever have to fight Gransax xd
Pretty cool you got Greyoll to work, just her sheer size alone is so badass. If they had dragons that size roaming in ER I would actually be pretty intimidated. The game needs more dragon content imo
She has a full animation set but if you try to activate it the game melts
And she’s not even the biggest
You should try to simulate a battle between greyoll and gransax. Maybe try scaling the normal farum azula dragons up by 9 times the size for gransax.
Is there an arena big enough for that?
@@jackmorrow6846 maybe renalla’s or elden beast’s, but the invisible walls might be too small
@@chasetaylor2988 i think you can remove them I've seen on Garden of Eyes's channel
Gransax is far bigger than Greyoll, thats why Gransax doesnt have a complete in-game model, biggest FromSoft dragon to date
@@kingputzear As according to Zullie. It would be pretty spectacular regardless.
I haven’t watched this yet, but I could tell you that the dragon wins
Nah, I think the dragon will win.
@@karamashour1587 fair point🤔 but I think dragon will win because of the move “tail swipe”
😂
Indeed, but that dragon was close to win tho.
Ok but I have one thing to say aren’t wyverns all dragons in the end
Respect to the wyrm in the first battle. he's trying his best
Greyoll really is so much bigger than she looks lying down. Imagine if Gransax was in that fight, literally taking up all the space in the arena.
Idk if Ik who that is👀
@@IsaacH69that’s the dragon statue in the capital. It’s a full scale replica of him. He’s about the same size, if not bigger, than Greyoll. That’s where the wpn of the same name came from. It’s a massively shrunk down version of his wpn. Also Placid uses a spell version of the wpn.
@@shallowglaive7892 interesting lore👀‼️
@@shallowglaive7892pretty sure that it's not a statue, but Gransax himself, just, dead
It very well could be. I can never get a straight lore answer out of the devs and or searching online to know as to whether it’s him turned to stone or a monument to him. Made more sense to be the latter when I couldn’t get that straight answer.
theodorix vs makar and lansseax vs placidusax at the end of round 2 was like that bit in the pokemon movie where they all start crying as they slap their clones :( siblings pls do not fight
The attack that Placi does where he summons the Bolt of Gransiaxx(can't spell it I know) and slams it for a tactical nuke will always be the coolest attack in the entire game for me. It's so flashy and literally is a tactical nuke
Imagine being a soldier of the Golden Order, having your leader, Godfrey, tell you that you are going to war against the dragons, and seeing this chaos
there's something I noticed in all the times that placids participated, he never aims the double beam at the enemy in front of him like he does against players he always shoots somewhere the target is not. And one more thing, except for the ice-spitting dragon all other dragons seem to have super resistance to electricity and fire and great fragility to crystal magic. very cool video
I love how Mayazaki and George's designers took actual dinosaur anatomy into consideration for some of these; the feathers and stringy texture of thin ones on the wings really add to the designs!
Also lol SpongeBob voice clips
Man seeing greyoll next to placidusax shows just how massive greyoll is
Love how all the dragons roar in unison right when the battle starts. Really epic!
Cool to notice that Adula has a unique model, even amongst the modern dragon specimens. Poor ol'fortissax getting rotted in rnd 2 was unfortunate. The wyrms have some top notch evasion tech I will say that much! lol
Placi is my favourite boss of this game. But, honestly Lanny and Forty both of them has extremely high damage output with fire breath. As for Placi, his poise isn't great and neither his AI. I honestly thought that in 1st round Placidussax would win and Lansseaux the last one after seeing her win with equal stats. Technically Lansseaux won ig... consistently coming at top 3 or was it Theodorix?!
he became like that from killing dragons and eating their hearts so it makes sense he is good at killing them
@@colorpg152 wait what?
@@inabyss magma wyrms are those who did dragon communion to many times, theodorix used to be a troll warrior before
@@colorpg152 Yes. I didn't know that at the time.
@@inabyss The More You Know
I like to imagine this is what happens every time there's a dragon family reunion
The other dragons: on behalf of the senate we arrest you
Greyroll: I AM THE SENATE
Let's be real though, if greyroll's hit boxes weren't wonky she would shred them all
Pretty sure Placidusax is canonically stronger than her because he's the king of the elder Dragon's, his lightning bolts would shred her
Placidusax solos
@@HardReadSerRose Dude, he literally controls time and was Elden Lord before Age of the Erdtree, he is the strongest dragon in the series probably.
@@allmasterofficial Yes, but remember that was with all his heads and not withered. When we fight him, and here, he is withered and missing heads.
@@RuneKatashima True, he was a literal beast when he was in his prime.
as someone who's second favorite boss is placideusax, seeing how poorly he compares to all the other bosses in this game is really disappointing, especially considering that lore wise, he should be stronger than nearly every other boss in the whole game, seeing as he was pretty much the strongest of all the dragons, save perhaps the dragon god.
The thing with placi is that he’s essentially dragon radahn in the sense of the version of him we see/fight isn’t anywhere his hay day. The player might have went back in time to fight placi but it’s certain not like his prime.
his now version is weak he is damaged so much
I wouldn't say all that, at least in this fight, he killed more dragons than anyone else, just putting points up on the board. Now his lack of winning is mostly due to bad luck with the ai not getting the lazers to hit and his easy stagger meter
In fight against other bosses placidusaxx does very well and kill many bosses, I saw a video of him even killing elden beast.
May I ask which is your first favorite boss?
Well of course Greyoll is gonna lose after round 1 when you nerf her greatest strength by nearly 75%,
She has an enormous hit box with improperly scaled attack animations, shes basically a 99 vigor tank build, she was built to endure (Godspeed to her after popping out so many kids and being rotted into the ground).
In the third round when Placi started attacking Lansi again I imagine Lansi going: “Seriously? You’d rather have a MAGMA WYRM win??”
Watching Greyoll just tail swipe the entire arena is hilarious
Greyl's (I don't remember his name) size is just insane to see in this perspective, him actually moving around, he's the size of a mountain
My favorite part is seeing that Salamander walking up with that butter knife like it's gonna commit a War Crime🤣😂
The Magma Dragon was so cute waddling around with the sword
That tag team fight between Agheel, Smarag, and Lanseaxx vs Borealis in round three was fucking awesome
Seeing Lansseax effectively stand up to her own god and win was pretty cool
Wouldn’t it be her brother or something like that since Greyoll is the mother to all dragons.
@@Archdeacon.Krieg. Greyoll is mother to all modern(current elden timeline) dragons, not ancient dragons.
Magma Wyrm since day one in the game had the "Dodogama effect" on me.
It is too freaking adorable and I always root for it.
Unlike Dodogama they don't necessarily look as cute, but they still have this special something that gives me the same feeling and I always shed a small tear when I have to do the unthinkable to them.
Absolutely fist bumped into the air cheering in the second round and celebrated loudly when my boy actually won!
I love your vids man makes me appreciate elden ring even more
Loved how the biggest dragon is also the most agile
Man Placidusax didn't get a win.... But he's still the dragonlord baby. 🔥🔥
100% agree placi fan here.
Hawkwood be licking his lips right now seeing all this unfold. Gives him conniptions.
I feel like Placi's downfall was always it getting double teamed or triple teamed, as well as him being the only one targeting big B, where her movements tended to do tons of damage at the start for some reason.
Hey man love the vid but id like to suggest maybe one or two things that i think would make the vid better? Maybe keeping an overlay up of who is alive because i find myself saying wait when and where did this one die in the big battles. And maybe if you could make another vid of just ancient dragons and another with the regular dragons? This was fun to watch keep it up!
Man, if only gransax was here too.
That dodging sequence near the end was sick , perfectly dodged like 3 attacks and the dragon was even looking around like wtf where'd he go
12:07 I love that final flame clash with everything at stake while lightning strikes the arena in the background :D
Magma wyrm dying to fire damage just feels wrong
Placi was so close to taking it at the end, that's heartbreaking. D:
I was so confused at first, I’m like “which dragon is that much bigger and why didn’t I notice?” Only to realize it’s Greyoll resurrected. Awesome vid
12:40 *Dragons competing for dominance*
13:10 *Beginning of a Fatality-style execution*
Seriously, THAT was a nasty way to end.
Dragoooooons what is your profession?
Imagine actually having greyoll as a boss fight, would've been insane
Just fight darkeater midir in dark souls 3. It's greyoll but an actual fight
@@Kruziik Midir's like...not even a third of the size of Greyoll lmao
Grandma greyoll would say git gud to everyone Tarnished in caelid hitting her
thank Miyazaki for making her sleep and as a glitchy rune farm
I dunno why, but I find Magma Wurm's walking animation quite adorable especially when under Greyoll in 2:38
Makar walks like he pays the bills and doesnt have the time or patience for this
Imagine actually fighting Greyoll in an arena the size of Placidusax's, probably using something like the Serpent hunter for it of course with her size, she would probably be way slower and there would probably be a ton of unbreakable cover spots around the arena due to how big her fire breath would be and her fight would possibly be centered around doing something to her wings or wing to get her down on the ground for good like what happened with Kalameet as her first phase, with the second being the gimmick of using the big giant slaying weapon to even the odds and go toe to toe with her, it could even be a horseback battle to make it easier to evade her attacks with her massive tail or the stomps from her huge talons, maybe even having some kind of event like Radhan's fight where you have multiple people to split aggro with you being the main damage source with the special weapon, that would be so fucking cool
What on earth are your PC specs to have Greyoll to move around like that?
32gb ram, I10850k, RTX 3070. Not crazy specs but it does the job
@@BjornTheBear wtf do you mean not crazy specs, damn i wish i had anything close to that
Not crazy for my job, having a 3090 would really help making these vids lol
I dunno why I always found it fucking cool whenever the dragons battle cried in unison before the battle royale begun. Extremely cinematic.
The Magma Wyrm winning that third battle was like Mr Rogers winning the Ultimate Showdown of Ultimate Destiny.
Placi got hit out of both his laser and nuke when either attack would have won him the match. Truly sad
Yeah so maybe putting two of the most mobile and enduring ennemies against each other would have a predictable ending hahaha
I literally just watched the giants one and wondered when this would come out, fantastic timing
Really surprised how well the Magma Wyrms did.
I was rooting for Placidusaax and Fortisaax. Sad that Fort didn't do so well.
8:52 made me chuckle, Theodorix strutting over to Greyoll thinking it can take the Mother of Dragons. XD
I imagine Greyoll would slap all these dragons away in one tail swipe, if this was more "realistic" xd
In a flight battle she'd probably be slow,placi could probably take her her down with lightning/lasers
Imagine having to fight Greyoll like this. It'd be utterly terrifying
Cooler than i expected!
I did enjoy thank you.
They must be fighting Drax at 12:40. That's the only explanation that makes sense to me.
Magma wyrm is the cutest dragon🥺😍🥰
Bro when that nuke attack went off I was like "damn this shit is sick " good vid
Seeing Greyoll move this fast is Unbelievably horrifying, I mean she’s already almost half as big as the arena and she’s moving as fast as agheel.
My favourite ones:
1: ezkykes dragon
2: fortisax
3: lansseax
4: placidussax
5: greyll or makar
I was cheering for the magma wyrms to win so they can prove that magma wyrms deserve the title of dragons too. I’m glad they won in at least one round
I LOVE DRAGONS so much, thank you for doing this
Смотрел бы и смотрел, как же круто 👍👍👍 В 1 раунде думал что если Грейол против всех, но вижу и так понятно что будет.
You might be the dragon lord but I am your mother
Why did you add the Wyrms but not Dragonkin soldiers
They’d die way too quickly
in round 2 Lansseax's last few moves against that magma wyrm felt really personal lmao
The craziest part of this is how well the game is running during this
Placidusax is getting on in years. Missing a few heads. Kinda crumbly. Might be worth considering passing on the title of dragonlord to one of the.. younger dragons? I dont know how any of this stuff works Elden Ring is weird.
I hope we get a huge dragon like Greyoll as a boss in a DLC
I don't think it's something comfortable to fight, it's combining a dragon with the scales of a fire giant
@@henrryeaeaea She dwarfs the fire giant
The camera is is gonna be the worst and it already is right now so I don't wanna fight a boss like that
@@notthebees2950 And that makes it tremendously worse potentially. Needless to say that a dragon has to have an arena to move lol
I'm 100000000% sure that many huge bosses would be way way cooler if the camera is not dumb cuz those fights are really cool & amazing (yes yes, even you, Fire Giant, you are a good boy, you just need a decent camera to see your goddamn moves).
And this is why PC is master race. Having Greyoll MOVING and doing all her animations speaks volume of the PC you have.
She was intended to be a boss that we could fight. But She is so big that when moving she strains so much machines into crashing the game. And your machine sometimes.
Its good that they decided to not make her actually moving, thanks to that we have a farm. But still its a shame because of the Engine limitations we cant see her in all her glory.
Best video of the day! Well done!
Crazy battle!
Wish we could play this game with 10-30 people pvp