Of note to compare to competitors and for general idea of stiffness other variables aside...la machine has 2 layers of carbon, BMT 109 has 6 layers, and Katana V werks has 11..... La machine also uses Paulownia (lighter weight and less dense core) while BMT and Katana use the denser industry inbounds standards of a mix of poplar and ash. For those asking about the mantra, it uses the same core and carbon, but adds titanal, making it more appropriate for the piste, carving, and rougher harder snow. I also want to shout out specifically the faction agent 4.0 which is not nearly as damp by a long shot but has a very good shape specifically for powder skiing. It isn't the all-arounder that the katana is but the micro camber combined with generally straight shape and heavy rocker plus larger surface area makes a great dedicated pow ski.
The Völkl V.Werks 100 makes the Katana V.Werks easier to understand. Make Ski without any metall/Titanal and 3D-Glass-Frame Just ultrathin woodcore and Carbon. The V.Werks 100 has flax/linum instead oif Carbon Fiber = Katana V.Werks. The Völkl V.Werks 100 2025 is at 1.923,-€ Euros. This makes the Katana V.Werks 2025 a discount-Price Ski, isn't it?!
Have 'em. Luv 'em. Long rocker, damped by tapered beams of wood down the center and maybe a 12" contact patch underfoot, NFW are these skis in any way suited for the groomers.
I still have the 11 year old Katana 112 non v werks. It is still a stout bombproof ripper that loves big mountain turns. They have a few scratches as to be expected, but still as solid as day one.
Thanks for the great and honest review! I really like Volkl skis, for the reason they don't change anything except minor graphics change because they ski so darn well. I ride V-Werks Mantra because I'm small and lightweight and love them (The shortest VW Katana comes in 177 but VW Mantra comes in 170). My ski real-mountaineering favorite is Volkl VTA 88 Lite (carbon version but they did not call it v-werks) which they didn't change the specs for over 5 years, the same as my VW Mantra. I was looking for BMT109 (which comes in 166 length) for a few years for my backcountry powder oriented but could not find them easily like you said,
Nice, my wife skis the BMT 109 166! She loves it. It's very rockered so I definitely wouldn't be concerned sizing up. My wife is 5'2, I know 5'4 people on the 176cm.
Oh man you hyped me up for winter :D just bought a brand new pair for 420€ at a big ski sale because i thought they just look sick, but turns out they are not only good looking they are also sick performers :D
glad I finally found a ski reviewer whose a bondafide thickums like me. Thanks again, was peeping the bmt 109s or K2 dispatch 110s but am definitely gonna go for these now.
Damn, saw a used pair for sale in Tahoe for under 500 and knew it was a crazy deal but didnt grab it at the time and keep thinking about it. Seeing this is definitely making it sting even more.
I am riding a mantra v werks 186 as my only ski and I am loving it(both resort riding and touring/pow/trees) I am looking to get another more pow oriented touring ski for deeper days and have been looking at DPS pagoda 112 RP to try something new. Should I scrap that idea and just get the katana v werks instead? I am 185/6'1 ish and 95kg/109lbs btw. Thanks in advance for input!
Great video! Would you recommend these skis for a backcountry newbie? Currently ski black diamond helio carbon 104s with dynafit radical pros. Only done a handful of tours in Eastern Sierras although I live in PNW.
They are heavier so the mass can be difficult to maneuver for true beginners. However with a more forward mount and decent technique/strength they should b fine
Have you ever tried the mantras v-werks? They seems to be similar contruction, but skinnier wich would be better here in the alps in Europe where we don't get as much snow?
I have not, although I am curious about it. But frankly I do not like that it has camber. If I was going to be getting a ski for not powder I would be looking at the new la machine which I believe has micro camber if any and has 91, 99, 109, 126 widths. I like skis with minimal camber and minimal side cut because I believe they behave the most predictably in the widest range of conditions. Also heritage labs is releasing the c105 and bc90 next year which both have the same rocker profile and much less side cut. I have a current pair of heritage labs and can vouch for their quality. And I will be trying both of those skis next year. If I find a v-werks mantra for the right price I will probably buy it and post my thoughts about it
@THICCC BOYZ TV thank you for the reply! Would be interesting to know your thoughts on the mantra. I have checked the la machine, but they seem to be on the lighter side, and I am not sure how they would cope with chopped up snow. I never heard of the heritage lab, I will give them a look
Oh man after seeing this I’m torn now between the la machine mini and a bmt 109 (not so thickkk at 160) Which do you think would be a better quiver of 1 for a Colorado kid new to the backcountry. Would probably get the other next season or two but I’ve got a line on a 176 bmt 109 and you’ve sold me me on both 😅
Bmt has much higher speed limit, and higher quality build. But it will feel looser on hardpack-i enjoy that feeling, others don't. Bmt is also considerably more damp. To me it's a easy question of bmt for sure with the caveat of that if u prefer a more locked in feel rather than surfy (yet still capable-trusted them many times in no fall zone ice) then the machine has more sweet spot edge underfoot.
Actually, you should totally grab a Heritage Labs C105. It's very similar to the bmt 109. I've skied the prototype. The BMT is more damp, but the HL is close and slightly lighter
Thicker dude but short. 5’6 210lbs. Intermediate/advanced skier. I’ve been considering the V werks. Although 177 is the shortest they sell. Guess my question is would you consider the 4FRNT Ravens in a 170 or katana v. werks 177? I usually wear Lange xt3 130’s for my boot. For bindings I usually mount marker alpinist or duke pt’s.
You could handle either, one thing to consider is that the ravens mount is only -4 so there is not a lot of ski in front of you, whereas the katana is like -14 from center (I usually mount +4, so effective -10 from center). The raven is great, but not nearly as damp. So I would say if you want more playful and maneuverable go raven/hoji or even devastator in something like +5ish cm from your height. If you want to smash everything and don't mind throwing around the extra bit of ski in front of you then go katana.
@@thicccboyztvtook them out today. +4 is aggressive but not terrible. These things definitely want to rip. Buddy and I tried to make it up phantom but every approach was cliffed out. Little low but the pack was fairly stable. Ended up doing Kendall and Big trees. Great skis and thanks for the recommendation on them.
@@thicccboyztv One last question. Do you guide, or can you recommend a local around here. I’m based out of north bend. Idk what happened today maybe I was just soaked and annoyed but basically ended up skinning out of Kendall. Didn’t want to point my skis down hill at all. Wondering if it’s conditioning but something is definitely up. Maybe I just get my hotdogs from weenie hut jr now.
@@Usmc9191 I would recommend my buddy Zack Novak from ibex ascents based locally our any one of Martin's guides at pro ski. Some Days conditions are harder than others and based off of just messing around in the snow yesterday it's pretty heavy taxing snow right now. Skiable for sure, but if you don't have the extra umph to give it the energy it needs, then it's punishing and exhausting
And also it goes without saying that being heavier is just a lot of work. When I used to do uphill racing I was 175-180 at 6'1 And now I'm 200 to 205 with most weight in my legs. Given your height, you are much stockier which is going to add that extra punishment when dealing with vertical based sports. But continually doing it will likely redistribute weight to where it needs to be.
Hey Anthony, I'm considering a pair of these as a soft snow daily driver because I love the Volkl rocker profile and I can get a good deal on them. I know you've skied the Trab bindings a fair amount. Would you mount these with Gara Titans, or step up to the Varios for the elasticity/gapless heel? Trying to save weight as much as possible on the binding to allow for bigger days on the bigger skis. For context I'm not super thicc and I ski aggressively but won't be spinning or airing off anything huge, mostly skiing the way you do in your video i.e. freeride oriented touring
These are beefy, while it is possible to survive on normal trabs I would do a step up to vario for this. However, note that this is not approved-volkl runs air channels thru the skis so using narrower bindings runs the risk of going into air rather than the reinforced area. There are several posts on forums about this and the location of the channels. To my knowledge bindings that work off the top of my head are marker alpinists, g3s, and Salomon/atomic in addition to wider toed atks. Def do some research.
@@thicccboyztv Thank you for the response, yeah that's kind of what I figured. I saw a pair of the 177s come through Skimo the other day with Trab bindings (Varios) and it got me thinking. I chatted with our shop tech about the mounting area and we would definitely double check the mounting zone. If I do spring for the Katanas I will definitely do some more digging on that. I also might be getting on some La Machine Megas this season. I'm gonna be in the Wasatch this season so I probably don't need V werks levels of beef (although the PNW skier in me still wants it). Side note, whatever ATK did to the new Raider Evo toe allows the wings to move independently without releasing the toe, similar to the trab. I have no idea how it works or and have no way to quantify it but it now sets them apart from all the other normal tech toes. I would imagine an improvement re: pre-releases. They also added more lateral elasticity (return to center) in the heel.
@@toastycheese135if they made the heel truly gapless/actually provide forward pressure like the alpinists and made the ramp not the same as a stiletto then I would be interested. But double digit ramp is unacceptable. La machines are good. They aren't legendary like volkls but they are quite nice for the price. Similar turning characteristics without the level of dampening, stiffness and chargability. I have 1 mini (99) for like once a year very long day(s) and some unmounted megas that also might fill a niche use. I've yet to decide. On another note, id highly recommend heritage labs. The carbon series is based upon the katana/bmt profiles and the quality is high without binding compatibility issues and are slightly lighter. They are less damp. But otherwise the ride is close, the price is nice, and they have a closer speed limit to volkls/aren't as soft as the la machines.
@@thicccboyztv Good point about the ramp, and yeah they still aren't a truly gapless binding. It is funny how they sell the elastic travel at the heel when there's still a 4mm gap. Thanks for the recommendation on the heritage labs! I'll check them out. Somebody needed to make a BMT profile ski. I really wish I'd gotten a pair of the bmt 94s while they were still readily available. Also, you've skied the 4frnt ravens right? How do those stack up?
crazy stuff. i was not very familiar with either corvus or la machine, therefore it was a sort of revelation that such manufacturers make skis with that kind of profile. im new to the tech game, so i would be grateful if you made an extensive video on sidecut/profile (ski geometry basically). if there is one on your channel, my apologies, i would be happy to check it out. i do trust your opinion, so, if you could tell what is your take on declivity 108 in general and also its touring capability, that would be absolutely marvelous. cheers ❤
Don't have experience with that one, and I will make a video on that stuff. The declivity seems to be heavy enough and have enough mass to ski well (weighs the same as a katana). However it has a lot of sidecut, relatively, and a lot of camber. I'd also imagine it isn't as stiff. Sidecut means it will want to hook you into a turn faster and camber will pop you out of a turn more. So it will naturally want to make more turns compared to the katana and also provide more energy/bounce. In rough snow that can be more of a liability as the sidecut can cause you to hook up on snow you weren't intending on. Camber is more of a choice on how much rebound you want. I personally don't like it as I believe in weird features or imperfect snow, like sidecut, it can cause the ski to behave unpredictably. Its kind of like, do you want to tell a ski exactly what to do, vs do you want the ski to tell you how it needs to be skied and won't tolerate being skied other ways. Camber and sidecut demand being skied in a very particular way, which can be rewarding in great conditions, or a liability in others. This all being said, the declivity both in terms of mass, relative sidecut and rocker profile, still has more attributes I like vs the rest of the market. In other words, I don't think I would love it, but compared to at least 75 percent of what's out there, I would guess it's a top quarter or third performer (all based on dimensions and conjecture based on skis like it, having never been in it myself).
Great review. I currently have K2 Dispatch 101, skied everything with them including the resorts and I really like them, however the recall makes me think I should consider something else and I was looking to get something great. Would you say that Katana would outperform Diapatch ski everywhere?
Picked up a used pair of 2017s that i will be using for touring and I am thoroughly impressed. It's amazing how they turn backcountry crud and wind affected snow into pure fun. They are noticeably worse at flat, skinless shuffle ski outs due to lack of camber (it is what it is - bears mentioning since no one really talks about the downside of full rocker profile and approaching big faraway objectives) and perhaps also tough slippery skinning due to lack of camber (thank you shitty snowpack year in Canadian Rockies). The latter might be a skin issue - I swapped over 4 year old skins that are near perfect fit, but have many days. Did you consider higher traction skins for these due to full rocker?
Personally, I don't find them more difficult to skin in, however, I'd imagine that just has a lot to do with technique. I am still capable of skinning directly up black terrain. I would say that The Sweet spot is definitely smaller than on a cambered ski and less forgiving in that manner. But if you understand where the grip is and how to position your weight on it then I do not find it has any less absolute grip. I've done a lot of skinning in terrible snow on a wide variety of skis. for me finding the balance point isn't that hard but if you are trained only on cambered relatively forgiving to skin skis than you might find an adjustment.. as far as flattish skin outs, I suggest just working on double poling!
No. I have skinned straight up black diamond slopes in a single riser and 4 buckle boots with more rockered designs. The katana is very subtly fully rockered. Obviously good skinning technique is important and if you lack technique then more fully rockered designs could be more challenging, but in my experience that's totally technique related. But with good technique I don't think it's an issue and the katanas combo of stiffness and subtle rocker would probably provide more ski contact than a cambered heavily rockered ski that is less stiff, such as a Bent chetler.
It depends on your strength size and chosen mount point. I mount this plus three because the mount point is extremely traditional even compared to other volkl skis with the same profile. Plus three on the katana puts you at the same mount point as the BMT 109 and katana 100eight. If you are strong and bigger than definitely go up in size, particularly if you take my advice on mounting. I am 185 cm and I ski the 191. My advice also is speaking about it as a touring ski. It's in a gray area where it is very heavy for a touring, ski or light for a resort ski. So your feelings on how easy it is to manage depends on application. The only people I've heard of commenting it being demanding are light or non-aggressive skiers and people who did not bump the mount point forward
What binding would you reccomend putting on them? I just ordered a pair, and am very excited. Thinking of mainly using them as my back country ski with some resort powder potential. I'm 210lbs
Really just depends on your comfort level with touring bindings. Officially only marker bindings can be mounted on them-they have air channels so some bindings will not fit in the binding reinforced area, there is a wild snow article on this. They require a wide mounting pattern, so for sure bets you have the marker alpinist and cruise or for more resort or safety the kingpin. But I'm pretty sure g3 ions, salmon MTN/atomic backland, and atk raiders all are wide enough. I've mounted mine with alpinists without issue. I also mount them +3-4cm from recommended
I say that he down side is that is not for skiing fast. It feels like the rocker makes the effective ski area short and therefore not rock solid when the speed goes up. I will be looking in to the Katana 108 this winter.
I would encourage you to watch some of Nikolai schirmers videos. One of the fastest if not the fastest current skier in consequential terrain and when you watch almost 50-75 percent of his ski is out of the snow. In fact, using the same logic you would with water, contact=drag. The more ski in the snow, the more you are essentially braking and slowing. The katana v werks is not known for being a slow ski. It's obviously not as fast as a double metal katana 108 in inbounds chop, but I'm talking about performance in pure powder, where the added mass of the 108 is not needed.
@@thicccboyztv well everyone has their own preferences. I feel the v-werk katana gets a bit nervous in deep powder or on groomed snow when the speed goes up. Maybe it is just me…
@@OlaCurtius I agree with you that compared to the old double metal katana circa 2013-2014 and the current 108 are better inbounds for max speed. But not pure powder, where I feel they both have the backbone and stiffness to go as fast as anyone wants. Either way it's good to have options!
Very different. Cheaper construction, loads of sidecut, and camber. Every opposite direction as compared to katana. I have heard that it is a good ski but it's just going to be a very different experience.
Grouse content dude btw...in terms of sizing, how thicc are you and what size you on? I feel like I could get by on a 177 given I'm about that height and not too big...and that mount point looks reasonably far back.
I mount them +3, and my sizing is about +6cm of my height. I could ski -1 of my size but would lose some top end stability. That being said the extra material weight And length Make them a bear to flick around and jump turn. So pick your poison! Also I weigh 190-200
What sort of binding do you think for this or the BMT? I’m a 170lb boyy so curious about your recommendation for those vs a 1500g ski like Fischer or K2
I use marker alpinists on all my skis. Best balance of performance (dampness, forward pressure, minimal ramp) and light enough. People with poor skinning technique struggle however with the single riser and some prefer more ramp. While I've seen breakages, I've also seen every tech bindings break and I haven't had any problems over 6 pairs and probably 50+ hard days on a single pair. For weenie skis I like trab bindings. My buddy loves Fischer Hannibal's mounted +2. They won't be as stable, floaty or pivoty. K2's are soft, and if you are looking at the dispatchs I snapped a pair in 10 days and I've heard others do the same, I wouldn't recommend.
@@thicccboyztv solid! Alpinist is on my list. I’m currently on an MTN but want a different direction and a bit more contact if I can. Was thinking new Fischer Transalp coming 1509g in 105) but also heard about Ferox Freebird before finding these Volkl so highly rated. Makes me rethink the weight thing.
@@rtpcannon I wouldnt recommend the black Crows ferox. It feels terrible on anything but blower. Not damp or composed. Just wants to make short turn radius classic meadow skipping turns. It doesn't have a backbone when the snow isn't great or if you let them run.
@@thicccboyztv okey thanks, it won't be too rigid I've never skied carbon skis so I'm wondering about the reaction of the ski does it pivot easily between the fir trees even in wet snow? because 191 is still long right? regarding the assembly I thought I saw that you advised an assembly at +3 +4
@@TheWiffi123 yes mount forward 3-4 cm. It pivots incredibly easy for the size. Not too rigid, nice solid supportive flex. At 90kg you shouldn't have a problem. I'm 85 kg and 185cm.
no, I would really like it to be similar to the 100 eight that I had in 189, did you put 3 or 4 cm exactly? or 3.5? does it not come out of the mounting area of the binding? and above all the ski at the back does not lift too much and does not become insensitive? because it remains huge as a 3cm adjustment but it is you who have it so I am listening to you 👌
That's just a totally different ski. That is a piste ski for carving. The katana provides that level of performance off piste and in soft snow. If you mainly ski piste, then the rtm is far better. Katana is for big mountain off piste/powder skiing.
Any thoughts on other bindings for it? From what I understand Volkl only advises markers cause of the reinforcement area on the skis? Thanks for the great review video!
copy thanks for the info. i just crushed my beloved bmt 122s 186 on a rock...want to try these next but have only found good deals on the 184s. i'm 6'3 190 lbs so i believe the 191s are worth holding out for....
Freerider Völkl V.Werks 100 2025 The best Ski ever made for the next 100 years. Available in Germany for 1.923,-€....😁....For the North American Market the price is 2.500 US$.
Very. Don't take just my word, blister, backcountry ski Canada, and more. Camber doesn't mean stable at all. And the v werks profile is very subtle, borderline flat mostly with very long subtle lines.
@@thicccboyztv Awesome, this ski has peaked my interest now. Think I would throw the Cast touring system with the Look 18s on them. Thanks for sharing your input.
The problem is that for lighter skiers and terrain with way less powder (5/10 feet of new snow per winter), you have to go lighter and narrower. A 100+ ski wide in the Pyrenees is absurd and almost useless. Additionally, I think technique playa also a massive factor. Yes, everybody can go down almost everything, but if you do not know how to slash through moguls and carve perfect turns in non perfect terrain (chopped up powder or corny), I doubt any ski is going to be enjoyable in the Backcountry.... And this is talking about 99% of the ski mountaneers I've seen/gone with...
For what it's worth, I used to be a skimo racer, having placed at local races and doing over 11k feet in 4 hours. So I understand narrow skis. I think the part that you may have missed is that I ski this ski in summer here, I ski it on ice and in corn. And I can assure you it is absolutely not useless. It would not be my first choice for very long missions but for anything where enjoying the turn is the predominant goal it is. There is nothing absurd about a 100+ ski- It provides better stability when jumping off of things, better stability when carrying a loaded pack, and it does not sink into mush when the snow starts to deteriorate. I am not a good skier and I can manage the ski well. And speaking from experience, no skimo ski is enjoyable in the backcountry... I will agree with you though that you do not need a ski this wide or stiff if you are not big, probably 80kg minimum. But my wife is 158cm and 52kg and she still prefers 95-105 for all conditions. I will concede that if powder didn't exist this wouldn't be my first choice. But for most backcountry skiers, powder is the goal and this is probably the best weapon for that that still performs amazingly everywhere else as well. If I never skied powder, I'd probably be on something like the v werks mantra 99 underfoot.
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
Of note to compare to competitors and for general idea of stiffness other variables aside...la machine has 2 layers of carbon, BMT 109 has 6 layers, and Katana V werks has 11..... La machine also uses Paulownia (lighter weight and less dense core) while BMT and Katana use the denser industry inbounds standards of a mix of poplar and ash. For those asking about the mantra, it uses the same core and carbon, but adds titanal, making it more appropriate for the piste, carving, and rougher harder snow.
I also want to shout out specifically the faction agent 4.0 which is not nearly as damp by a long shot but has a very good shape specifically for powder skiing. It isn't the all-arounder that the katana is but the micro camber combined with generally straight shape and heavy rocker plus larger surface area makes a great dedicated pow ski.
nice review/love letter! I'm kind of a lightweight, 140-50 but I love mantras, I'm thinking maybe I'd like these too?
@@tayloranderson456 if you are a strong skier then go for it! I don't find it to be a super demanding ski if you mount forward a little bit.
The Völkl V.Werks 100 makes the Katana V.Werks easier to understand.
Make Ski without any metall/Titanal and 3D-Glass-Frame Just ultrathin woodcore and Carbon.
The V.Werks 100 has flax/linum instead oif Carbon Fiber = Katana V.Werks.
The Völkl V.Werks 100 2025 is at 1.923,-€ Euros.
This makes the Katana V.Werks 2025 a discount-Price Ski, isn't it?!
finally a real review of a ski. Not having to scour forums or listen to a sales pitch. Inspiring.
also how do you like those super long pole grips haha. I just got suckered into some leki trigger poles but the big grips intrigue me for powder.
@@EggsTeaSea Love them and will put a video out about them soon. They are a back country specific tool.
@@thicccboyztv makes sense to me boss
Have 'em. Luv 'em. Long rocker, damped by tapered beams of wood down the center and maybe a 12" contact patch underfoot, NFW are these skis in any way suited for the groomers.
I still have the 11 year old Katana 112 non v werks. It is still a stout bombproof ripper that loves big mountain turns. They have a few scratches as to be expected, but still as solid as day one.
Thanks for the great and honest review! I really like Volkl skis, for the reason they don't change anything except minor graphics change because they ski so darn well. I ride V-Werks Mantra because I'm small and lightweight and love them (The shortest VW Katana comes in 177 but VW Mantra comes in 170). My ski real-mountaineering favorite is Volkl VTA 88 Lite (carbon version but they did not call it v-werks) which they didn't change the specs for over 5 years, the same as my VW Mantra. I was looking for BMT109 (which comes in 166 length) for a few years for my backcountry powder oriented but could not find them easily like you said,
Nice, my wife skis the BMT 109 166! She loves it. It's very rockered so I definitely wouldn't be concerned sizing up. My wife is 5'2, I know 5'4 people on the 176cm.
Oh man you hyped me up for winter :D just bought a brand new pair for 420€ at a big ski sale because i thought they just look sick, but turns out they are not only good looking they are also sick performers :D
Thanks for the great review! They look really nice, also fun footage to showcase em!
glad I finally found a ski reviewer whose a bondafide thickums like me. Thanks again, was peeping the bmt 109s or K2 dispatch 110s but am definitely gonna go for these now.
Thanks for this great video. You are a good salesman.
Glad it was helpful!
Got 30 days on mine last year at Alta's +900 season. Absolutely the best ski on the market with out a doubt!!!!
Damn, saw a used pair for sale in Tahoe for under 500 and knew it was a crazy deal but didnt grab it at the time and keep thinking about it. Seeing this is definitely making it sting even more.
I am riding a mantra v werks 186 as my only ski and I am loving it(both resort riding and touring/pow/trees) I am looking to get another more pow oriented touring ski for deeper days and have been looking at DPS pagoda 112 RP to try something new. Should I scrap that idea and just get the katana v werks instead? I am 185/6'1 ish and 95kg/109lbs btw. Thanks in advance for input!
I'd get the katana over dps any day. Much higher quality construction and capability
Great video! Would you recommend these skis for a backcountry newbie? Currently ski black diamond helio carbon 104s with dynafit radical pros. Only done a handful of tours in Eastern Sierras although I live in PNW.
They are heavier so the mass can be difficult to maneuver for true beginners. However with a more forward mount and decent technique/strength they should b fine
I completely concur🙌🏻 Katana V.Werks does it all.
Have you ever tried the mantras v-werks? They seems to be similar contruction, but skinnier wich would be better here in the alps in Europe where we don't get as much snow?
I have not, although I am curious about it. But frankly I do not like that it has camber. If I was going to be getting a ski for not powder I would be looking at the new la machine which I believe has micro camber if any and has 91, 99, 109, 126 widths. I like skis with minimal camber and minimal side cut because I believe they behave the most predictably in the widest range of conditions. Also heritage labs is releasing the c105 and bc90 next year which both have the same rocker profile and much less side cut. I have a current pair of heritage labs and can vouch for their quality. And I will be trying both of those skis next year. If I find a v-werks mantra for the right price I will probably buy it and post my thoughts about it
@THICCC BOYZ TV thank you for the reply! Would be interesting to know your thoughts on the mantra. I have checked the la machine, but they seem to be on the lighter side, and I am not sure how they would cope with chopped up snow. I never heard of the heritage lab, I will give them a look
@@Drbulletproof the mantra is certainly going to have more of a backbone and be damper than any of those options.
Oh man after seeing this I’m torn now between the la machine mini and a bmt 109 (not so thickkk at 160) Which do you think would be a better quiver of 1 for a Colorado kid new to the backcountry. Would probably get the other next season or two but I’ve got a line on a 176 bmt 109 and you’ve sold me me on both 😅
Bmt has much higher speed limit, and higher quality build. But it will feel looser on hardpack-i enjoy that feeling, others don't. Bmt is also considerably more damp. To me it's a easy question of bmt for sure with the caveat of that if u prefer a more locked in feel rather than surfy (yet still capable-trusted them many times in no fall zone ice) then the machine has more sweet spot edge underfoot.
Actually, you should totally grab a Heritage Labs C105. It's very similar to the bmt 109. I've skied the prototype. The BMT is more damp, but the HL is close and slightly lighter
Thicker dude but short. 5’6 210lbs. Intermediate/advanced skier. I’ve been considering the V werks. Although 177 is the shortest they sell. Guess my question is would you consider the 4FRNT Ravens in a 170 or katana v. werks 177? I usually wear Lange xt3 130’s for my boot. For bindings I usually mount marker alpinist or duke pt’s.
You could handle either, one thing to consider is that the ravens mount is only -4 so there is not a lot of ski in front of you, whereas the katana is like -14 from center (I usually mount +4, so effective -10 from center). The raven is great, but not nearly as damp. So I would say if you want more playful and maneuverable go raven/hoji or even devastator in something like +5ish cm from your height. If you want to smash everything and don't mind throwing around the extra bit of ski in front of you then go katana.
@@thicccboyztvtook them out today. +4 is aggressive but not terrible. These things definitely want to rip. Buddy and I tried to make it up phantom but every approach was cliffed out. Little low but the pack was fairly stable. Ended up doing Kendall and Big trees. Great skis and thanks for the recommendation on them.
@@thicccboyztv One last question. Do you guide, or can you recommend a local around here. I’m based out of north bend. Idk what happened today maybe I was just soaked and annoyed but basically ended up skinning out of Kendall. Didn’t want to point my skis down hill at all. Wondering if it’s conditioning but something is definitely up. Maybe I just get my hotdogs from weenie hut jr now.
@@Usmc9191 I would recommend my buddy Zack Novak from ibex ascents based locally our any one of Martin's guides at pro ski. Some Days conditions are harder than others and based off of just messing around in the snow yesterday it's pretty heavy taxing snow right now. Skiable for sure, but if you don't have the extra umph to give it the energy it needs, then it's punishing and exhausting
And also it goes without saying that being heavier is just a lot of work. When I used to do uphill racing I was 175-180 at 6'1 And now I'm 200 to 205 with most weight in my legs. Given your height, you are much stockier which is going to add that extra punishment when dealing with vertical based sports. But continually doing it will likely redistribute weight to where it needs to be.
Hey Anthony, I'm considering a pair of these as a soft snow daily driver because I love the Volkl rocker profile and I can get a good deal on them. I know you've skied the Trab bindings a fair amount. Would you mount these with Gara Titans, or step up to the Varios for the elasticity/gapless heel? Trying to save weight as much as possible on the binding to allow for bigger days on the bigger skis. For context I'm not super thicc and I ski aggressively but won't be spinning or airing off anything huge, mostly skiing the way you do in your video i.e. freeride oriented touring
These are beefy, while it is possible to survive on normal trabs I would do a step up to vario for this. However, note that this is not approved-volkl runs air channels thru the skis so using narrower bindings runs the risk of going into air rather than the reinforced area. There are several posts on forums about this and the location of the channels. To my knowledge bindings that work off the top of my head are marker alpinists, g3s, and Salomon/atomic in addition to wider toed atks. Def do some research.
@@thicccboyztv Thank you for the response, yeah that's kind of what I figured. I saw a pair of the 177s come through Skimo the other day with Trab bindings (Varios) and it got me thinking. I chatted with our shop tech about the mounting area and we would definitely double check the mounting zone. If I do spring for the Katanas I will definitely do some more digging on that. I also might be getting on some La Machine Megas this season. I'm gonna be in the Wasatch this season so I probably don't need V werks levels of beef (although the PNW skier in me still wants it). Side note, whatever ATK did to the new Raider Evo toe allows the wings to move independently without releasing the toe, similar to the trab. I have no idea how it works or and have no way to quantify it but it now sets them apart from all the other normal tech toes. I would imagine an improvement re: pre-releases. They also added more lateral elasticity (return to center) in the heel.
@@toastycheese135if they made the heel truly gapless/actually provide forward pressure like the alpinists and made the ramp not the same as a stiletto then I would be interested. But double digit ramp is unacceptable. La machines are good. They aren't legendary like volkls but they are quite nice for the price. Similar turning characteristics without the level of dampening, stiffness and chargability. I have 1 mini (99) for like once a year very long day(s) and some unmounted megas that also might fill a niche use. I've yet to decide. On another note, id highly recommend heritage labs. The carbon series is based upon the katana/bmt profiles and the quality is high without binding compatibility issues and are slightly lighter. They are less damp. But otherwise the ride is close, the price is nice, and they have a closer speed limit to volkls/aren't as soft as the la machines.
@@thicccboyztv Good point about the ramp, and yeah they still aren't a truly gapless binding. It is funny how they sell the elastic travel at the heel when there's still a 4mm gap. Thanks for the recommendation on the heritage labs! I'll check them out. Somebody needed to make a BMT profile ski. I really wish I'd gotten a pair of the bmt 94s while they were still readily available. Also, you've skied the 4frnt ravens right? How do those stack up?
Just snagged a new pair for $700 🎉 now to find some bindings..
crazy stuff. i was not very familiar with either corvus or la machine, therefore it was a sort of revelation that such manufacturers make skis with that kind of profile. im new to the tech game, so i would be grateful if you made an extensive video on sidecut/profile (ski geometry basically). if there is one on your channel, my apologies, i would be happy to check it out. i do trust your opinion, so, if you could tell what is your take on declivity 108 in general and also its touring capability, that would be absolutely marvelous.
cheers ❤
Don't have experience with that one, and I will make a video on that stuff. The declivity seems to be heavy enough and have enough mass to ski well (weighs the same as a katana). However it has a lot of sidecut, relatively, and a lot of camber. I'd also imagine it isn't as stiff. Sidecut means it will want to hook you into a turn faster and camber will pop you out of a turn more. So it will naturally want to make more turns compared to the katana and also provide more energy/bounce. In rough snow that can be more of a liability as the sidecut can cause you to hook up on snow you weren't intending on. Camber is more of a choice on how much rebound you want. I personally don't like it as I believe in weird features or imperfect snow, like sidecut, it can cause the ski to behave unpredictably. Its kind of like, do you want to tell a ski exactly what to do, vs do you want the ski to tell you how it needs to be skied and won't tolerate being skied other ways. Camber and sidecut demand being skied in a very particular way, which can be rewarding in great conditions, or a liability in others. This all being said, the declivity both in terms of mass, relative sidecut and rocker profile, still has more attributes I like vs the rest of the market. In other words, I don't think I would love it, but compared to at least 75 percent of what's out there, I would guess it's a top quarter or third performer (all based on dimensions and conjecture based on skis like it, having never been in it myself).
Great review. I currently have K2 Dispatch 101, skied everything with them including the resorts and I really like them, however the recall makes me think I should consider something else and I was looking to get something great. Would you say that Katana would outperform Diapatch ski everywhere?
Absolutely without question.
Picked up a used pair of 2017s that i will be using for touring and I am thoroughly impressed. It's amazing how they turn backcountry crud and wind affected snow into pure fun. They are noticeably worse at flat, skinless shuffle ski outs due to lack of camber (it is what it is - bears mentioning since no one really talks about the downside of full rocker profile and approaching big faraway objectives) and perhaps also tough slippery skinning due to lack of camber (thank you shitty snowpack year in Canadian Rockies). The latter might be a skin issue - I swapped over 4 year old skins that are near perfect fit, but have many days. Did you consider higher traction skins for these due to full rocker?
Personally, I don't find them more difficult to skin in, however, I'd imagine that just has a lot to do with technique. I am still capable of skinning directly up black terrain. I would say that The Sweet spot is definitely smaller than on a cambered ski and less forgiving in that manner. But if you understand where the grip is and how to position your weight on it then I do not find it has any less absolute grip. I've done a lot of skinning in terrible snow on a wide variety of skis. for me finding the balance point isn't that hard but if you are trained only on cambered relatively forgiving to skin skis than you might find an adjustment.. as far as flattish skin outs, I suggest just working on double poling!
do you find that the reverse camber profile makes it so you have less grip on the skin track? i've heard that of other reverse camber touring skis
No. I have skinned straight up black diamond slopes in a single riser and 4 buckle boots with more rockered designs. The katana is very subtly fully rockered. Obviously good skinning technique is important and if you lack technique then more fully rockered designs could be more challenging, but in my experience that's totally technique related. But with good technique I don't think it's an issue and the katanas combo of stiffness and subtle rocker would probably provide more ski contact than a cambered heavily rockered ski that is less stiff, such as a Bent chetler.
Does the common wisdom of sizing up on pow skiis apply to those ?
or should I take similar size to non-pow skiis ?
It depends on your strength size and chosen mount point. I mount this plus three because the mount point is extremely traditional even compared to other volkl skis with the same profile. Plus three on the katana puts you at the same mount point as the BMT 109 and katana 100eight. If you are strong and bigger than definitely go up in size, particularly if you take my advice on mounting. I am 185 cm and I ski the 191. My advice also is speaking about it as a touring ski. It's in a gray area where it is very heavy for a touring, ski or light for a resort ski. So your feelings on how easy it is to manage depends on application. The only people I've heard of commenting it being demanding are light or non-aggressive skiers and people who did not bump the mount point forward
What binding would you reccomend putting on them? I just ordered a pair, and am very excited. Thinking of mainly using them as my back country ski with some resort powder potential. I'm 210lbs
Really just depends on your comfort level with touring bindings. Officially only marker bindings can be mounted on them-they have air channels so some bindings will not fit in the binding reinforced area, there is a wild snow article on this. They require a wide mounting pattern, so for sure bets you have the marker alpinist and cruise or for more resort or safety the kingpin. But I'm pretty sure g3 ions, salmon MTN/atomic backland, and atk raiders all are wide enough. I've mounted mine with alpinists without issue. I also mount them +3-4cm from recommended
Hello, what size do you recommend for 188cm 90kg?
I say that he down side is that is not for skiing fast. It feels like the rocker makes the effective ski area short and therefore not rock solid when the speed goes up. I will be looking in to the Katana 108 this winter.
I would encourage you to watch some of Nikolai schirmers videos. One of the fastest if not the fastest current skier in consequential terrain and when you watch almost 50-75 percent of his ski is out of the snow. In fact, using the same logic you would with water, contact=drag. The more ski in the snow, the more you are essentially braking and slowing. The katana v werks is not known for being a slow ski. It's obviously not as fast as a double metal katana 108 in inbounds chop, but I'm talking about performance in pure powder, where the added mass of the 108 is not needed.
@@thicccboyztv well everyone has their own preferences. I feel the v-werk katana gets a bit nervous in deep powder or on groomed snow when the speed goes up. Maybe it is just me…
@@OlaCurtius I agree with you that compared to the old double metal katana circa 2013-2014 and the current 108 are better inbounds for max speed. But not pure powder, where I feel they both have the backbone and stiffness to go as fast as anyone wants. Either way it's good to have options!
Do you mount this the recommended -14cm from center?
No, I go +3-4 from recommend. So -10 or -11
Any thoughts on the Blaze 106 as a cheaper and lighter alternative?
Very different. Cheaper construction, loads of sidecut, and camber. Every opposite direction as compared to katana. I have heard that it is a good ski but it's just going to be a very different experience.
Grouse content dude btw...in terms of sizing, how thicc are you and what size you on? I feel like I could get by on a 177 given I'm about that height and not too big...and that mount point looks reasonably far back.
I mount them +3, and my sizing is about +6cm of my height. I could ski -1 of my size but would lose some top end stability. That being said the extra material weight And length Make them a bear to flick around and jump turn. So pick your poison! Also I weigh 190-200
What sort of binding do you think for this or the BMT? I’m a 170lb boyy so curious about your recommendation for those vs a 1500g ski like Fischer or K2
I use marker alpinists on all my skis. Best balance of performance (dampness, forward pressure, minimal ramp) and light enough. People with poor skinning technique struggle however with the single riser and some prefer more ramp. While I've seen breakages, I've also seen every tech bindings break and I haven't had any problems over 6 pairs and probably 50+ hard days on a single pair. For weenie skis I like trab bindings. My buddy loves Fischer Hannibal's mounted +2. They won't be as stable, floaty or pivoty. K2's are soft, and if you are looking at the dispatchs I snapped a pair in 10 days and I've heard others do the same, I wouldn't recommend.
@@thicccboyztv solid! Alpinist is on my list. I’m currently on an MTN but want a different direction and a bit more contact if I can. Was thinking new Fischer Transalp coming 1509g in 105) but also heard about Ferox Freebird before finding these Volkl so highly rated. Makes me rethink the weight thing.
@@rtpcannon I wouldnt recommend the black Crows ferox. It feels terrible on anything but blower. Not damp or composed. Just wants to make short turn radius classic meadow skipping turns. It doesn't have a backbone when the snow isn't great or if you let them run.
What is with those ski poles?
I have a video about long poles if you are interested. They look weird but are a great tool that are a lot more useful than standard poles.
Hello, what size do you recommend for 188cm 90kg?
@@TheWiffi123 absolutely the 191cm.
@@thicccboyztv okey thanks, it won't be too rigid I've never skied carbon skis so I'm wondering about the reaction of the ski does it pivot easily between the fir trees even in wet snow? because 191 is still long right? regarding the assembly I thought I saw that you advised an assembly at +3 +4
@@TheWiffi123 yes mount forward 3-4 cm. It pivots incredibly easy for the size. Not too rigid, nice solid supportive flex. At 90kg you shouldn't have a problem. I'm 85 kg and 185cm.
If you like a more traditional feel then go with recommended mount which is pretty far back and expect a more demanding game on experience.
no, I would really like it to be similar to the 100 eight that I had in 189, did you put 3 or 4 cm exactly? or 3.5? does it not come out of the mounting area of the binding? and above all the ski at the back does not lift too much and does not become insensitive? because it remains huge as a 3cm adjustment but it is you who have it so I am listening to you 👌
Better than my RTM VW
86 under foot?
That's just a totally different ski. That is a piste ski for carving. The katana provides that level of performance off piste and in soft snow. If you mainly ski piste, then the rtm is far better. Katana is for big mountain off piste/powder skiing.
Excellent review!
What binding You use on them?
I use marker alpinists for everything. If I was going to be 90% inbounds then I would use the marker duke PT.
Any thoughts on other bindings for it? From what I understand Volkl only advises markers cause of the reinforcement area on the skis? Thanks for the great review video!
What size are you skiing? Height/Weight?
191cm, I am 6'1 185cm and weigh 200 lbs
copy thanks for the info. i just crushed my beloved bmt 122s 186 on a rock...want to try these next but have only found good deals on the 184s. i'm 6'3 190 lbs so i believe the 191s are worth holding out for....
The Boyzz got it right. Thanks
Freerider
Völkl V.Werks 100 2025
The best Ski ever made for the next 100 years.
Available in Germany for 1.923,-€....😁....For the North American Market the price is 2.500 US$.
thicc boi here..well, better find me a pair!!!
Stable even without any camber?
Very. Don't take just my word, blister, backcountry ski Canada, and more. Camber doesn't mean stable at all. And the v werks profile is very subtle, borderline flat mostly with very long subtle lines.
Pretty sure John Collinson skis em too so if he finds the stability adequate I'm pretty mortals will too.
@@thicccboyztv Awesome, this ski has peaked my interest now. Think I would throw the Cast touring system with the Look 18s on them. Thanks for sharing your input.
The problem is that for lighter skiers and terrain with way less powder (5/10 feet of new snow per winter), you have to go lighter and narrower. A 100+ ski wide in the Pyrenees is absurd and almost useless.
Additionally, I think technique playa also a massive factor. Yes, everybody can go down almost everything, but if you do not know how to slash through moguls and carve perfect turns in non perfect terrain (chopped up powder or corny), I doubt any ski is going to be enjoyable in the Backcountry.... And this is talking about 99% of the ski mountaneers I've seen/gone with...
For what it's worth, I used to be a skimo racer, having placed at local races and doing over 11k feet in 4 hours. So I understand narrow skis. I think the part that you may have missed is that I ski this ski in summer here, I ski it on ice and in corn. And I can assure you it is absolutely not useless. It would not be my first choice for very long missions but for anything where enjoying the turn is the predominant goal it is. There is nothing absurd about a 100+ ski- It provides better stability when jumping off of things, better stability when carrying a loaded pack, and it does not sink into mush when the snow starts to deteriorate. I am not a good skier and I can manage the ski well. And speaking from experience, no skimo ski is enjoyable in the backcountry... I will agree with you though that you do not need a ski this wide or stiff if you are not big, probably 80kg minimum. But my wife is 158cm and 52kg and she still prefers 95-105 for all conditions. I will concede that if powder didn't exist this wouldn't be my first choice. But for most backcountry skiers, powder is the goal and this is probably the best weapon for that that still performs amazingly everywhere else as well. If I never skied powder, I'd probably be on something like the v werks mantra 99 underfoot.