I had a field adjuster come out and deny that I had a claim. Filed an appeal and had a roofer and the adjuster show up at the same time for a re-inspection. All of a sudden, I actually have a valid claim. When the job was done, my insurance company tripled my rate. Changed to another company who was happy to insure me knowing that I just had a brand new roof installed.
My dad's Florida clay tile roof was damaged by a direct hit from a hurricane. The insurance company denied the claim. He was forced to take them to court; they sent their own engineer to inspect the roof. In court, under oath, their expert testified that the roof had clearly been damaged by high winds, consistent with that of the hurricane that passed through the area on thus and such a date, and there was no evidence of incorrect installation or maintenance that might have contributed to the damage. They HAD to know they were going to lose, but never offered to settle. 🤷♂️
I spent almost my entire career as a commercial insurance underwriter. If I had looked at a risk that had its roof destroyed multiple times and replaced with the same style and material I would decline to quote or write. Damage to the roof is no longer fortuitous; it will no doubt be damaged again in the near future. So did the insurer non-renew? I hope so, the insured needs to look at a better roof system.
If you are a roofing contractor and as you've stated you have done this roof 2 times allready then you could understand why I would have suggested another roofing company and maybe even not covered the claim for faulty manufacture product or improper applacation on the geologic specs or just plain improper instalation. Definitely more intention to this which would raise a red flag.
Yes It was for that same house two different times, two years ago from the past time. Two years isn't long for a roof and should look at replacing it with something else and he did so. The homeowner that had it replaced last put the same stuff on the roof and now that they are replacing it yet again, they did go with something different though. I had started that the replacement was for two different house and misheard whatbhe had said later in the video so I was wrong and had to come back to fix my comment.
@@Don-ul6rx i was thinking how do clay tiles not survive 110 mph winds i have roofs i have done with asphalt shingle still with no damage after several huricanes
if your replacing a roof after 2 years, there's a bigger issue going on. And you've replaced it twice already. Maybe there is an issue with how your installing it. Insurance companies, and consumers paying high premiums, shouldn't have to pay for your learning curve on how to install this type of roof.
You apparently didn't watch the whole video. Please tell me how an installation error will cause a roof to be damaged by baseball and tennis ball sized hail. I'll wait.
I’m 2 minutes in and you said you had already replaced the roof 2 times before the insurance claim. Sounds like a shitty product, but I’ll continue the video
@@homesteadroofing If it's that crappy of a product, why are you replacing it with the same crap. No I didn't watch the hole video because I have better things to do. And people wonder why their insurance is so freeking high on their houses. Maybe suggest a better product, or go for a warranty claim from the manufacturer. Putting on the same crap product doesn't resolve the issues in the future.
I watched through 3:18 on my TV and picked up my phone to dislike and say that it past time in the video where you explain why it's being redone for the second time. It's not worth listening for 12 minutes to be told this.
#1 rule with insurance companies is don't back down! Time really is money for them. The longer a claim goes on the more it cost them and the more likely they will pay even more than they owe just to close the claim.
Ty for sharing your battle tested advice. First rate intel that is so practical when dealing with the adjuster, pool hustler grifter mentality. Just 15 mins with an "adjuster" from State Farm over a minor repair was the worst 15 minute business interaction encounter, and your advice clarifies how to view these grifters and "shills" for the supposed ethical CEOs leading these companies advertising as good neighbors, that is if your neighborhood includes Genghis Khan. Your logic about time working against the "grifter adjuster" is spot on. Pacifico beer cheers for sharing.
Well after watching this there are a couple of thought i had. 1 Insurance company's do not care about people only in making money, and paying out as little as they can. 2 There are shady people that will try to over charge because of insurance is involved. 3 It has been replaced twice already and needs to be done a 3rd time? Why? 4 There is something wrong with the metal roof material because it should not need to be replaced this often. 5 You are installing it incorrectly, if those are the pictures of the roof it should not be pulling away like that from the middle of it. People go to metal roofs so they do not have to replace it anytime soon over other types of roofing, Something is just not adding up in the story.
I'm pretty skeptical myself. Sounds overpriced and low quality. Someone would really have to explain to me how a roof for a house that size costs $50k in the first place, and how that makes sense in any universe.
@@homesteadroofing fair enough. So tell me this - if this roofing material can't withstand it even though it's crazy expensive, but it happens every few years - why do it again? If I was their insurance adjuster, I'd turn them down, too.
@@homesteadroofing I think dimension shingle would hold up better than what you’re currently using, also it would be so much cheaper to replace damaged areas, it also comes in like 200 amazing colors.
3:50 - Most independent "Field" adjusters (IA) are either paid based on Time and Expense (T & E) or are paid on a Fee Schedule. The fee schedule type means that the IA makes a certain fee depending on the total loss amount. Basically: The higher the loss amount, the more pay the IA receives. If the IA is paid by way of T & E, the loss amount is irrelevant and the IA bills the Insurance carrier for each service that is provided. Either way, there is no financial incentive for the IA to keep the claim amount low or deny a claim.
Thank you for engaging with our video. I appreciate your comments and the gracious way you communicated. I have been told the opposite by IA's. The information I put in the video came directly from multiple IA's.
Being an IA for over 20 years, I can assure you that we do not get incentives to underpay claims. BUT… here is how the insurance carriers control that dynamic… The IA can be “fired” at any time without consequences to the insurance company because the IA is a 1099 contractor, not an employee. So the carrier has guidelines and practices they make the IA adhere to when they write an estimate, and force the IA to not include certain items, or use certain “approved” pricing from the insurance company. Or else you will not receive any more claims from the insurance company. So believe me when I tell you, the insurance companies are terrible to the IAs, just as they are to the policy holders and contractors. Insurance companies are the largest criminals in business (except for the democrats Ofcourse). But they are protected by government so we can’t do anything about it.
How can you expect an insurance company to pay a claim if you don't give them pricing information they can verify? You can say "No" all day, but they can say "No pay" all day and all night. I didn't bother watching until the end, but your enthusiasm to install a roof for the third time, on a single house, within a short period of time would set off warning bells in my head if I was an adjuster.
How is that his issue? He is a contractor. He quotes jobs. Thats it. He can then walk away until they call him with the money. The insurance company can easily call another roofer or multiple roofers for quotes and compare. He was doing the homeowner a solid by even working with the insurance company for him.
I was an independent adjuster for years. Yes we were paid by commission. We would get paid whether the claim was closed or not. We would get additional commission for reinspection. I was also an Xactimate trainer. One of seven in the country at that time. I spent weeks in Utah being trained by Xactimate. It's not just a line item. Well it is but it goes much deeper than that and cost down to an individual fastener can be viewed if you know how to use a program correctly. Getting the roofing cost should have been simple and your labor is important because courts uphold Xactimate pricing. The pricing is the average of any given labor and any given material for any given zip code in the current month and year. So it seems to me in this situation mistakes were made on both ends. It could have been much quicker if you just offered the material costs, it's not anything that can't be found it's not proprietary in that sense anyone can call the manufacturer and get a retail pricing. sounds like you had a poor desk adjuster as well though. I'm not trying to beat anyone up I'm just looking at it objectively and I'm not an insurance any longer so that's just my two cents.
Agreed! I think if one thing this contractor decided the desk adjuster and admitted he got more than what he should’ve. Which tends to show there are crooked contractors out there as well
@@SomeDumUsrName Certainly it's their business. The only way to reach a fair price is to know the costs, add a burden to materials, allow for overhead and profit. Retail isn't always fair pricing.
@@rockyv180 What this roofer pays for his material is ABSOLUTELY NONE of their business. Determining whether he is charging a "fair" price has NOTHING to do with what his markups are. It's all about the final price and where that stacks up against having it done by anyone else. If I can go drop $500,000 on inventory, then I am going to get a MUCH better price than someone who has to buy material for each job separately and who doesn't buy large amounts frequently. Or, heck; I may have a trick up my sleeve and can get an even BETTER price on the material for that job. In either case, I can mark up WAY more than my competitors who don't have the same resources. So, charging the same "retail" as my not-so-fortunate competitor/s, I can make lots more on the material. Why would a company allow someone else to tell them that they are making too much money on their material? DOESN'T HAPPEN. It is NEVER a customer's job to analyze costs and dictate what and how much a contractor is allowed to markup labor and/or materials. It is the customer's job to shop and compare contractors and compare RETAIL pricing based on comparable quality of materials and workmanship. OUR "COSTS" ARE NONE OF THEIR DAMN BUSINESS! Never have been.
@@SomeDumUsrName You have explained this correctly. There are several tiers for contractors of different sizes. so there are many different cost depending on that tier. Insurance just pays the retail "highest cost" and let it go from there.
Replacing a roof with the same exclusive and extremely expensive materials multiple times makes no sense. His insurance company will probably drop him over this. Still seems kinda shady though.
Read the description under the title. First roof was Spanish tile and damaged by a tornado. They installed a metal roof. That was damaged by hail. Now they are installing a polymer roof.
@@LeahBrooksTowerGardens But a metal roof if it was good quality, and installed correctly would not have been pulling away from the roof like it was in the picture. Something is not adding up.
@@Confused_Philosopher right! If a tornado came it would have knocked down some trees. Even if it was a couple roofs ago and it happened years ago. Everyone knows you can’t just call someone to remove trees it take years to have trees removed. Boom! Case solved!! Your a goddamn genius
I had something similar... During a heavy wet snow event, the roof of my carport (20' x 20'), collapsed. I had bought it during the time the manufacturer was transitioning from round tubing to square. The insurance company faught me for several months, because according to them I had to get the same type of structure. The problem with that was, the manufacturer Didn't make it any more. Eventually they buckled and I was able to get a much stronger structure. Never back down..stick to the principal and always make sure that They Know...You are not going to just except it.
Ty for sharing your battle tested advice. First rate intel that is so practical when dealing with the adjuster, pool hustler grifter mentality. Just 15 mins with an "adjuster" from State Farm over a minor repair was the worst 15 minute business interaction encounter, and your advice clarifies how to view these grifters and "shills" for the supposed ethical CEOs leading these companies advertising as good neighbors, that is if your neighborhood includes Genghis Khan. Your logic about time working against the "grifter adjuster" is spot on. Pacifico beer cheers for sharing.
You are entitled to the same quality, not the same manufacturer. If you wreck your old Chevy Cobalt, you don’t get a new Chevy Camaro just because they don’t make the Cobalt anymore. You now get a Mazda 3 or Ford Focus. Like kind and quality, not like manufacturer and upgrade.
If it keeps getting damaged and needing to be replaced, the insurance company should stop insuring the house and any others with that type of roof product. It's not fair to others who pay insurance and have their rates go up to insure properties that cost them so much. 50Kx 2 or3 times is crazy. Why would a roofer want to put up such frail shingles unless they are just doing it to make lots of money?
@@homesteadroofing That was my question. We have grapefruit sized down here about every 10 year or so. Punched a hole through the shingles and decking. No rot. Did you include the material break down when you sent the prior roof estimate? My adjusters usually need to see what you are replacing and the amount.
What u are talking about ? Let me replace three panels on the front of your house and see how it looks like I bet 10 to 1 u will be crying the loudest cuz u lost value on your property because your curb appeal sucks
I agree, mainly because health insurance is purely personal and directly impacts an individual's well being. Still, insurance companies of any kind exist primarily as for profit businesses. The longer they can delay paying, the longer they retain capital and build on its value. I've dealt with some honorable insurance companies over the years, but just as many dishonorable one's. I found the adjustors the worst of the bunch: A car adjustor who didn't believe my car was hit by a deer, with a clump of deer guts/hair wedged in my headlight...a guy representing the insurance company of a restaurant chain (where I slipped on a glob of spilled salad dressing and cracked my fibula) telling me when I left the restaurant, cameras recorded that I showed no sign of discomfort or difficulty walking-when the truth was my wife and daughter helped me stagger to the car and get to Urgent Care. A good adjustor strives for fairness and just compensation, with the insurance company itself aiming to do the same. My guess is, you're lucky if even 50% of the insurance companies hold to fairness as their top goal...dog eat dog is what I see. If they can get out of paying, they are going to do their darnedest to do so...
The insurance companies make a profit from your illness or injury, it’s a win-win for them. The patient can maybe survive the illness with a manageable bill.
Thank you so much for explaining! Hurricane Ian I’ve had scammers at my door so holes in my roof not covered.. an adjuster comes tomorrow from KIN.. see what happens! No internet or phone coverage makes it hard to get good people and are left to the knock knock scammers! Your info was great!!!
Why is a steel roof failing three times in a short period??? Steel roofs have an underlayment (water barrier) that most likely is not damaged. Independent adjusters are what you want, they do not work for the insurance company and therefore they provide an unbiased estimate. Why not a repair, sounds like the material is still available?
I appreciate this guy looking out for other roofers. The insurance company doesn't have any business asking what you pay for material or labor. They don't like your bid then they can move on to the next guy. If your the only game in town welllllll sorry about your luck. My bids have a clause stating price may change due to cost.
The insurance company has every right to ask what the insured pays for material and labor, they have a right to inspect and they have a right to challenge the prices charged. Read the policy.
I'm dealing with an adjuster who is denying a claim, using a clause, " knew or should have known" regarding a very slow ingress of water, between the two vapour (water) barriers, and we did not detect the leak, in a storage area, until an odor occurred, i asked, am expected to carry out a moisture test on all my walls periodically, still waiting for answer
I managed a vehicle recovery and salvage business that had the contract for police recovery, accident or stolen cars. The insurance assessor's were easy going and reasonable and would often ask me if a car should be repaired or written off. They did pay close attention to owners who had red flags raised for excessive claims though.
My friends son was run over by a drunk driver. The insurance adjuster came to his house. The adjuster started to explain that because his son was dead, my friend would save so much money by not having to buy clothes or feed his son. My friend almost came across the table to grab the adjuster. How can someone be so heartless?
I'm in the roofing business since 1970 and was a field adjuster . This is directed to this fellow. I know this man is glowing with happiness. Sir, nice internet commercial. Nothing more and nothing less.
Insurance companies are all crooks. My grandfather was the Vice President of Claims Adjustments at Prudential Insurance for 15 years, and I know he paid for his giant boat on the suffering of legitimate claimants he figured out how to deny coverage to.
1. There is no such title as "Vice President of Claims Adjustment" at any insurance company. 2. Prudential is a life insurance company. They do not sell Property insurance and therefore have no property claims adjusters. 3. You are a liar.
Hey man, if you dont want to be the only person in the county with the brown metal shingles, then feel free to get a conventional asphalt shingles and be trouble free for 10-20 years. You gotta pay to play.
I typically can't sit through talk videos but you're so easy to listen to. I don't deal with insurance adjusters but should the job ever call for it, I feel more ready now.
If my insurer jerked me around like that for even a week, I'd quit talking to them and just sue them. Companies miraculously get their shit together when they're at risk of getting bitch-slapped by a judge.
Look, I am not a roofer or competitor but if the roof is being damaged due to severe weather, it would be sensible to replace it with a product that will stand up to the weather conditions. We use corrugated iron in long sheets, it stands up to MOST hail, all snow, and rain events. Understandably you pay a bit more upfront on material, ( less than clay tile?), but save on labour costs. Try it and forget about it.
I hope you are working on my roof. The insurance company should not pay for the roof and should cancel the insurance on the house completely. All insurance companies should not use third party inspection and all claims should be prorated to the age of the home. No old roof should be paid by insurance.
If this roof was on its third replacement I might suggest that a different roof covering be considered. Obviously this covering material is inadequate for this area. Independent adjusters are not paid commission based on the claim payment if that were the case then they would be agreeable to your initial cost of repairs. Their pay is based on the invoice of the bill charged to the carrier. Understand too that as an adjuster I am lied or told less than the truth everyday.
Your wrong , they do get a commission .I ran my own company here in Colorado , and dealt with both , desk and field adjusters . A "desk" and "cat"adjuster (catastrophic) who usually came from a different geographical area because of a storm that creates more damage than in a given local that a local office does not have the manpower to cover . Anyway , a "cat" or "field" adjuster DOES get paid on the volume of damage he writes , so naturally , he will look to include EVERYTHING that a hail storm damaged , a desk adjuster will fight tooth and nail to decline things , such as space decking , drip edge , etc . And or not include certain line items on their estimate because they "missed them." I always had to explain to homeowners that , no your insurance company is not looking out for your best interests , they have stockholders to look after , and guess who they will choose 100% of the time ? I didnt convince many homeowners of this , until the dust settled , and they actually saw what I did to get their roof replaced with the required materials just so it passed inspection. I ALWAYS had to supplement insurance claims , what homeowners dont get , is if they can write you a check for $15,000 for a roof that actually costs $25,000 and make you think you just won the lottery , they will be more than happy to do so , they only pretend they are on your side , in actuality , its the roofer that is .
@@adrianojames7903 there is a difference between an independent and a CAT adjuster. As an independent myself the invoice on a T&E file falls between a billing price based on the estimate but my commission itself is not. I have not found a roofer yet that doesn’t see hail damage to any roof I insect with them even if the claim is for wind. Roofers are not the saviors to the homeowners…adjusters are not taught how to cheapen a claim to help the carrier. I have however taken construction classes and Xactimate classes not telling them I’m an adjuster and they show the class all kind of tricks to to add stuff to invoices to get a higher cost on the claim payout.
@@MC-ce2pn You havent been with every roofer . I have had homeowners call me to come out and look at their roof where I did , and after inspecting their roof advised them not to bother calling it in , many times . One time in Denver , it was the same scenario , no damage , told the owner I would'nt bother calling her insurance . I get a call from this same owner 6 months later , for me to come out again . I tell her there has not been any hail this year in her neighborhood . She then tells me she has to move to San Francisco as her company has transfered her , and as part of selling her house she has to put a new roof on it. I get out there , she tells me that after I left her house earlier that year , some other company knocked on her door and asked to do a free inspection , she told them there was no damage based on what I previously told her on my first visit . They insisted I didnt know what I was talking about as there had been hail around the time i visited . She signed a contract , the roofer had her call in the claim while he was there , and told her when the adjuster came he wanted to be there to meet with him . The adjuster came , the roofer was a no-show , and declined the claim . There are bad roofers , there are bad adjusters , and there are bad homeowners . I am not , nor ever have been so desperste to get a signature on a contract where I needed to lie to either a homeowner or an adjuster . I have had homeowners tell me , so and so is going to put me in a lifetime shingle , their price is 2500 less then yours , and they are going to waive my deductible , and put a $1000 bucks in my pocket . My response to him was , "Can I counter that?" He looks at me with pleasure and says sure. I tell him , I will match that offer , but instead of 1500, I will make it 2 grand . He responded by telling me , "Now your talking !" Then I responded , I wouldnt do any work for a crooked homeowner like you ever . It might seem unprofessional , I get it . But why I responded that way was he used me to get his roof bought as I met with the adjuster , but would not sign a contingency contract with me , but promised he would if the the adjuster agreed with my assessment that he had enough damage to warrent full replacement. He lied , and changed his story to "He was getting bids " , after he was cut a check . So when I made that ridiculous counter offer , I had already decided I didn't want his business .
LOL this is another prime example of predatory scumbag roofers using systems that require tons of surrounding material to be removed to replace the small damage which results in YOU GUESSED IT INFLATION due to constant predatory insurance schemes so and the roofer and building supply laugh all the way to the bank not caring about the negetive impact on enviroment of all the wasted resources and asphalt that doesnt get recycled , u know what is in asphalt lol petrolium aka oil aka the stuff that makes gas and is in short supply ! This shit makes me sick i cant blame them for taking advantage of the system not everyone has a conscience and we need better industry regs and policy to prevent this.
I would think the roofing product corporation would be liable for allowing a lightweight product to be installed in a Highwind area knowing that that product does not meet the standards of which the climate in that area requires. That’s why that product was never installed on any other homes in that area. Lol
The time value of money equation used by insurance companies will need to be adjusted for the change in the inflation numbers that we are seeing these days.
if you had installed a product twice already on the same property.... something is going very wrong. either you are installing it incorrectly, or it's a bad product.
@@homesteadroofing nope, divery of message is an important part of video making, to use an analogy I once heard, if the first minute of a song is just a bunch of cats fighting, most people will never hear the lyrics at the end.
@@homesteadroofing I watched it all the way until the end and still didn't see any reason why replacing a $50k roof twice in 2 years is a good way to go and I thought you said it was replaced 3 times? Not saying this to be argumentative - I must have missed something as I heard that you replaced it for a different homeowner, but it sounded like the same house? Did you mean two different homes? It might have been worded funny because it seems a lot of people heard it that way.
Why not just send a sample of the roofing to Itel, a company that will analyze the product and assign a value. Insurance companies and contractors use this source all of the time.
I know I'm late to the party but that's a damn expensive roof. 3rd time replacing, is nobody considering a different type of roof? There's obviously some sort of design flaw if metal tiles are bending with a little bit of wind
I'm an independent adjuster who is a contractor for an insurance company. I want to correct a few things, or at the very least help people understand Insurance claim process a little bit better. 1) I I and every other contract adjuster in the company I work for DOES NOT get paid via commission. We are paid a daily rate and it is drilled into us to not overpay nor underpay, especially not underpay because that drags out the process and upsets customers. Nor is it professional. 2) Policy Holders,unfortunately, RARELY READ THEIR POLICIES and see exactly what is covered. It is really never stated to replace the Construction to 100% of original. Often, it is not possible due to Codes, availability or prudence. 99% of the time, however, the POLICY is to replace and repair tothe same, or equal or to improved industry standards. You can get things specified in a rider or an extended coverage. And yes that is an extra cost usually. Now in the in the policyholders defense, these policies are not easy to read and follow at times. But you have to take the time to make sure you understand what you're paying for. 3) As for the way estimates are calculated, it is true that many companies including mine use Xactimate &pricing tables based on local conditions and material prices. However, if the policyholder, and often along with their contractor can justify a different figure for the estimate. We, most of the time will pay it. 4) I can't speak for other companies, but my approach and that of the company I work with, perhaps the largest one of all, seeks a collaboration with the policyholder and his or her contractor if they have one. That is in our interest, and from personal experience, I don't want to be wasting my time nickel and diming a claim because I have likely 50 more I have to close. It does me and nobody any good to play games. I will pick a bone with many of the contractors I have worked with:. I have seen them turn a 20-30 -year old roof with no hail damage , or less than a handful of shingles damaged due to a non-covered cause into an entire roof replacement just because they got the policy holder fearing the full force of the heavens if they don't replace their roof with them, and them only. Basically when it comes down to it let's be honest:. Insurance companies want to minimize their payout, yes. But we have a lot of rules we have to follow and if we don't there's hell to pay by 50 plus state boards. Contractors, have a vested interest and increasing the value of the claim. That's that's self-interest, capitalism. But it's when they get out of control with that self-interest and don't respect capitalism, that's when things get muddy. The only person that really gets hurt in this process when a contractor goes after something that's not covered, nor is fair or even frivolous, is the policy holder. Finally, it really comes down to this:. The Policy Holder has to take charge of his/her Claim. After all, this is the person who is paying the Premium. If you, as Policy Holder just step back & let the Contractor build expectations, that are outside the scope of your policy, then there will be problems & the process won't be effective for you. Also, the converse is true for the Insurer, who, if not clear about what's damaged, will definitely default to the lowest payout possible. If you work closely with your Adjuster & YES, hold him/her accountable, set Your expectations within the policy & take charge of YOUR Claim, then you will get what is fair.
It may be true that the adjusters in your company don't get paid a commission, but many do. They've told me themselves. And yes, the policy holder must read his policy every year to avoid surprises.
what i'm hearing, correct me if i'm wrong. a roof that you installed failed , you replaced it under insurance claim and now THAT roof has failed ! And the new owners are going to go with the same roof and installer a 3rd time ? ! ? So a total of about $150,000 for a roof !
Based on this presentation, I am very confused about the repeated need to replace this roof. If I were the insurance company, I would want more information as well.
This is why I don't work for Insurance Companies. As a plumbing contractor I work for the Home Owner I don't take direction from Insurance companies. They will screw you after you are already done with the job.
That's the model that we've moved to and are encouraging other roofers to do. There's actually a big push in the roofing industry to do exactly what you're doing.
As an adjuster, we owe what is fair and reasonable. Start using Xactimate and you’ll find you’ll be getting paid whats on your estimate more often. You’ll only be screwing the homeowner over out of pocket by completing the work without getting approval from a DA. We’ll have Homeowners get full roof replacements on repairs because they want the roof to match, which is fine. If they have a matching endorsement and an ITEL indicating no match. Often they don’t and they’re just gonna be $10k+ out of pocket and there is nothing we can do because contractors are unwilling to work with us so I can’t even give the insured extra money with nothing to add to my estimate. Independent adjusters want to pay. Also, throw O&P on everything 10% and 10%. Get a GC license or Dwelling Contractor license and submit it with your estimate.
I didn’t hear you say what caused the damage to begin with, but since you did replace the same roof 2 years earlier, is the material used prone to damage or was this just a fluke? Is this some type of material I should avoid?
I'm starting to wonder do to it being under a new homeowner if they just didn't like the roof and wanted something different. As they didn't replace it with the same thing.
This is from the description: FIRST - this roof had a Spanish Barrel clay tile roof, which got destroyed by 110-mph winds. The owners opted to install a premium metal tile roof instead of clay tile. NEXT - A year later, the metal roof was hit by baseball sized hail, which totaled it. The insurance company paid to replace it and the homeowners had the same material installed. Then they sold the house. THEN - 2 years later, another hail storm with tennis ball sized hail hit the house and after discussing what the new homeowners should do, we advised them to not install a metal roof. Their insurance company paid for the replacement in full, and they installed a polymer composite material instead.
Most storm adjusters are going to get paid MORE based on the amount of damage they write up. So if they say there is no or little damage, they end up making less money. Of course there are unscrupulous adjusters out there who pay for everything, but they do not last long. There are way more unscrupulous roofing contractors in the industry who feel like EVERY roof out there requires replacing. They make an already difficult situation much harder. The idea that adjusters get a bonus for denying roofs is absolute BS. Anyone who says different is an idiot.
exactly I'm an adjuster in the UK, I get a larger fee if the claim is higher. Its not in my interest to decline anything unless is absolutely blindly obvious that is not covered.
I’m a roofing contractor I’m trying to understand why did it need a new roof ? The product you used “ metal .” Should last many many years Storm damage ? Maybe monier concrete tiles with hurricane clips would be better
Many commenters are of the same opinion. When you said near the start that you had already replaced the roof twice before, you should have explained what caused the damage to require replacement. To all those that said maybe this isn't a good product, they obviously don't know what huge hail and wind will do to a roof. I don't believe there is a product out there that can take that punishment, and many roofing materials have wind limitations. The only thing worse would be to have the roof lift off the house. Goat 1, you 0.
I had a similar experience replacing a hail damaged roof. We had to do a supplement because our sheathing wasn’t up to code and would have to be replaced. They dragged their feet on getting it approved and sure enough a rain storm hits and we get water leaking into the living room. Result more damage that they had to pay to repair. And I had been all over them the whole time trying to get it done.
You replaced the roofing twice on that house? That product must be terrible to have to get changed 3 times in total. A roof should last far more than two years!
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If the roof needs replaced that many times in a few years it sounds like a sh**ty product to me and or bad install. Never heard of a roof needing replaced so often. If it was damged by large hail then putting the same product back is stupid plain and simple.
Just because you invoiced for 50K doesn't mean it costs that much to replace. You ripped off the homeowners the first time. Would you fix your damaged truck for a blanket quote for 10K without getting an itemized bill?
Company exposure: $50,000 You accept $22k Adjuster base:$1200/wk. Adjuster commission: $28,000 (the savings to the company) x 20% = $5600. The adjuster has no deadline, you have a damage (health, car, roof, etc.) making life difficult.
If the house needs a new roof every two to three years, the homeowner will eventually have a difficult time renewing his or her insurance policy. I'm just sayin'.
Oh lord, i have had 3 claims and all 3 denied even though there is clear damage and i am stuck without knowing what to do and have swapped insurance companies because of this, It has been a real loss for us. All 3 times i had a roofer here with the adjuster. My roof is about to just give up...
You don't give any info why. Insurance carriers don't pay for every cause of damage but they are required to tell you in writing why they deny your claim and must quote the applicable portion of the policy that is the basis of the denial. are we talking about a roof? You say your roof is about to give up. Wear and tear is not a covered cause. Maintenance is your responsibility. Coverage is provided if a loss happens all at once.
Sounds like it should have been excluded. Most insurance policies (the contract) exclude poor workmanship and or faulty building materials perhaps may be the case. In the interim while coverage is being reviewed the house should have been tarped.
If the metal shingles are destroyed by the weather where you live, why keep replacing the entire roof with new stuff if it’s going to just keep happening? I’m really confused to why you’d do that?
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Sounds to me like you're installing it improperly or the product is not the right product for that area. Either way the insurance company should have refused to pay the claim.
Sorry I have to agree, why would anyone in their right mind replace a Roof every 2 years ? Known to be sub standard and problematic ! With the same Materials ? Time after time ? surely it is time to replace with a known material that will last ! ?
This is the same with the IRS. Everyone is afraid to have their taxes readjusted in fear that they will have to pay more. Every person I know that has challenged their numbers has come out ahead. Same thing with insurance companies, everyone is afraid of them.
Not Me. As a Trial Lawyer I've made a fortune (for my clients and myself) going after low-ball, greed-sucking, dirty goddamn insurance companies. The repeal of Glass-Steagall destroyed ethics in banking and insurance -- Ever since, my family and firms go after every penny we can. We settle a fair amount of cases on favorable terms only. I'm not afraid to trial any of those bastards -- If they screw my clients for $5 bucks or $5-Million they're getting a tort and trial. My life's work going after those scumbags.
People forget that most forms of Insurance are primarily risk and reward profit making industries or services! So many insurers (if they can) will always try to undercut or dispute any claim to reduce their outgoings or potential losses. But equally it has to be said that some people also try to rip off insurance companies... so naturally there are always hoops and loops to jump through.
$60,000 for a metal roof? I've had a couple roofs torn off and completely replaced and currently building a small house. Unless it's a giant house, you're fleecing the insurance co.
It doesn't show anything of the sort. It shows you had them over a barrel because you refused to provide pricing. And the only reason you would do that is if you're overcharging for the product. Not to mention, one would have to question your integrity if you continue to install a substandard roof for that area, which is the only explanation for needing to change it three times in six years.
Enjoyed the video except for one incorrect statement. Adjusters, whether independent or employed by the carrier, are NOT paid a commission. Sometimes they charge a fee based on the size and complexity of the claim. Or, they may charge an hourly/time rate plus expenses. Carrier employee adjusters are salaried. Either way, adjusters sometimes do not get it right. A good contractor, like yourself, or a public adjuster, can be invaluable in settling a claim favorably.
That independent adjuster wanted that roof approved with your higher estimate. Because the greater the loss the more he or she would make. It was the desk adjuster that was the real issue.
Independent adjusters do not work on a commission, they charge a fee for doing an inspection which is paid by the insurance company. There are other factors to an insurance claim. The insured is to be made whole, that is, put back the way it was before the incident. Betterment is also a factor, since a roof cannot be replaced with used material and depending on the age of said materials, there is an adjustment. Also, insurance policy provisions do not automatically allow for an entire roof replacement, only the damaged areas. You as a contractor do not get to dictate what the insurance company pays, yo negotiate!
Not putting anyone down or questioning process, it seems like a new roofing product. If it will not stand up to wind, then it might be reasonable to get a proven roof product. Take a look at your neighbors roofs. Did they suffer less or no damage and if so, you might want to inquire about their roofing product. With three roofing claims, I suspect that the homeowner may be looking for another insurance company come renewal time. Hopefully another insurer will not know their claim history.
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Insurance companies that are traded on the exchanges do disclose their profits. Every state has a regulatory body specifically created to regulate insurance companies. The barriers to entry in the roofing businesses are low compared to most businesses, there are many examples of consumers who have been victims of fraud by roofers. Would you, as a roofer, be willing to open your books and otherwise be regulated to the degree that insurance companies are?
I guess my only question would be if you know the adjuster doesn’t have that material in their program & they don’t know the material why wouldn’t you tell them the material & labor costs. If your an insurance company should you just take the roofer at their word that the roof costs $50k to replace? I guess I’m just playing devils advocate here..
The adjuster even gave him a black eye.
signum of trust amongst other pedofile roofing contractors
Hey now he will get at least double in what he asked for in repairs.
@@thatoneguy5512 😂
You should see the adjuster
@@frenchbully so stupid it's funny 😅
I had a field adjuster come out and deny that I had a claim. Filed an appeal and had a roofer and the adjuster show up at the same time for a re-inspection. All of a sudden, I actually have a valid claim. When the job was done, my insurance company tripled my rate. Changed to another company who was happy to insure me knowing that I just had a brand new roof installed.
My dad's Florida clay tile roof was damaged by a direct hit from a hurricane. The insurance company denied the claim. He was forced to take them to court; they sent their own engineer to inspect the roof. In court, under oath, their expert testified that the roof had clearly been damaged by high winds, consistent with that of the hurricane that passed through the area on thus and such a date, and there was no evidence of incorrect installation or maintenance that might have contributed to the damage. They HAD to know they were going to lose, but never offered to settle. 🤷♂️
I spent almost my entire career as a commercial insurance underwriter. If I had looked at a risk that had its roof destroyed multiple times and replaced with the same style and material I would decline to quote or write. Damage to the roof is no longer fortuitous; it will no doubt be damaged again in the near future.
So did the insurer non-renew? I hope so, the insured needs to look at a better roof system.
Yea I agree with that
We did not install the same system. Installed DaVinci instead.
They didn't have an issue writing the original policy.
@@homesteadroofing interesting...
I would not accept the risk at my insurance office either.
If you are a roofing contractor and as you've stated you have done this roof 2 times allready then you could understand why I would have suggested another roofing company and maybe even not covered the claim for faulty manufacture product or improper applacation on the geologic specs or just plain improper instalation. Definitely more intention to this which would raise a red flag.
Two times already... definitely a red flag!
Yes It was for that same house two different times, two years ago from the past time. Two years isn't long for a roof and should look at replacing it with something else and he did so. The homeowner that had it replaced last put the same stuff on the roof and now that they are replacing it yet again, they did go with something different though. I had started that the replacement was for two different house and misheard whatbhe had said later in the video so I was wrong and had to come back to fix my comment.
What roofing product holds up best for baseball sized hail? Maybe rubber?
Sorry but he said they had installed that same product already two times before this claim. Go to 1:22 to hear him say this.
@@Don-ul6rx i was thinking how do clay tiles not survive 110 mph winds i have roofs i have done with asphalt shingle still with no damage after several huricanes
The insurance company's requests sounded legit to me.
if your replacing a roof after 2 years, there's a bigger issue going on. And you've replaced it twice already. Maybe there is an issue with how your installing it. Insurance companies, and consumers paying high premiums, shouldn't have to pay for your learning curve on how to install this type of roof.
You apparently didn't watch the whole video.
Please tell me how an installation error will cause a roof to be damaged by baseball and tennis ball sized hail.
I'll wait.
I’m 2 minutes in and you said you had already replaced the roof 2 times before the insurance claim. Sounds like a shitty product, but I’ll continue the video
Finished the video. Hopefully you recommended a different product because these roof tiles aren’t holding up.
@@homesteadroofing If it's that crappy of a product, why are you replacing it with the same crap. No I didn't watch the hole video because I have better things to do. And people wonder why their insurance is so freeking high on their houses. Maybe suggest a better product, or go for a warranty claim from the manufacturer. Putting on the same crap product doesn't resolve the issues in the future.
I watched through 3:18 on my TV and picked up my phone to dislike and say that it past time in the video where you explain why it's being redone for the second time. It's not worth listening for 12 minutes to be told this.
#1 rule with insurance companies is don't back down! Time really is money for them. The longer a claim goes on the more it cost them and the more likely they will pay even more than they owe just to close the claim.
Ty for sharing your battle tested advice. First rate intel that is so practical when dealing with the adjuster, pool hustler grifter mentality. Just 15 mins with an "adjuster" from State Farm over a minor repair was the worst 15 minute business interaction encounter, and your advice clarifies how to view these grifters and "shills" for the supposed ethical CEOs leading these companies advertising as good neighbors, that is if your neighborhood includes Genghis Khan. Your logic about time working against the "grifter adjuster" is spot on. Pacifico beer cheers for sharing.
Well after watching this there are a couple of thought i had.
1 Insurance company's do not care about people only in making money, and paying out as little as they can.
2 There are shady people that will try to over charge because of insurance is involved.
3 It has been replaced twice already and needs to be done a 3rd time? Why?
4 There is something wrong with the metal roof material because it should not need to be replaced this often.
5 You are installing it incorrectly, if those are the pictures of the roof it should not be pulling away like that from the middle of it.
People go to metal roofs so they do not have to replace it anytime soon over other types of roofing, Something is just not adding up in the story.
If the homeowner has had this exotic roofing product replaced twice and last after just 2 years, maybe it's not such a great product.
I'm pretty skeptical myself. Sounds overpriced and low quality. Someone would really have to explain to me how a roof for a house that size costs $50k in the first place, and how that makes sense in any universe.
Please tell me what roofing material will withstand baseball and tennis ball sized hail.
I'll wait.
@@homesteadroofing fair enough. So tell me this - if this roofing material can't withstand it even though it's crazy expensive, but it happens every few years - why do it again? If I was their insurance adjuster, I'd turn them down, too.
@@homesteadroofing Details left out of the video.
@@homesteadroofing I think dimension shingle would hold up better than what you’re currently using, also it would be so much cheaper to replace damaged areas, it also comes in like 200 amazing colors.
3:50 - Most independent "Field" adjusters (IA) are either paid based on Time and Expense (T & E) or are paid on a Fee Schedule. The fee schedule type means that the IA makes a certain fee depending on the total loss amount. Basically: The higher the loss amount, the more pay the IA receives. If the IA is paid by way of T & E, the loss amount is irrelevant and the IA bills the Insurance carrier for each service that is provided. Either way, there is no financial incentive for the IA to keep the claim amount low or deny a claim.
Thank you for engaging with our video. I appreciate your comments and the gracious way you communicated. I have been told the opposite by IA's. The information I put in the video came directly from multiple IA's.
Being an IA for over 20 years, I can assure you that we do not get incentives to underpay claims. BUT… here is how the insurance carriers control that dynamic…
The IA can be “fired” at any time without consequences to the insurance company because the IA is a 1099 contractor, not an employee. So the carrier has guidelines and practices they make the IA adhere to when they write an estimate, and force the IA to not include certain items, or use certain “approved” pricing from the insurance company. Or else you will not receive any more claims from the insurance company. So believe me when I tell you, the insurance companies are terrible to the IAs, just as they are to the policy holders and contractors. Insurance companies are the largest criminals in business (except for the democrats Ofcourse). But they are protected by government so we can’t do anything about it.
Tyler is right adjusters do not get paid more to claim less damage
@@homesteadroofing they lied or were pulling your leg! And 3rd roof in 3 years, seems like a great product!
@@dcarvoesdc3314 the adjuster companies are rated by the insurance industry, poor rating equals less work.
Come to Florida and try to be a roofing contractor three quarters couldn't pass the test . The other quarter couldn't handle the heat.😂😂
How can you expect an insurance company to pay a claim if you don't give them pricing information they can verify? You can say "No" all day, but they can say "No pay" all day and all night. I didn't bother watching until the end, but your enthusiasm to install a roof for the third time, on a single house, within a short period of time would set off warning bells in my head if I was an adjuster.
How is that his issue? He is a contractor. He quotes jobs. Thats it. He can then walk away until they call him with the money. The insurance company can easily call another roofer or multiple roofers for quotes and compare. He was doing the homeowner a solid by even working with the insurance company for him.
I was an independent adjuster for years. Yes we were paid by commission. We would get paid whether the claim was closed or not. We would get additional commission for reinspection. I was also an Xactimate trainer. One of seven in the country at that time. I spent weeks in Utah being trained by Xactimate. It's not just a line item. Well it is but it goes much deeper than that and cost down to an individual fastener can be viewed if you know how to use a program correctly. Getting the roofing cost should have been simple and your labor is important because courts uphold Xactimate pricing. The pricing is the average of any given labor and any given material for any given zip code in the current month and year. So it seems to me in this situation mistakes were made on both ends. It could have been much quicker if you just offered the material costs, it's not anything that can't be found it's not proprietary in that sense anyone can call the manufacturer and get a retail pricing. sounds like you had a poor desk adjuster as well though. I'm not trying to beat anyone up I'm just looking at it objectively and I'm not an insurance any longer so that's just my two cents.
Agreed! I think if one thing this contractor decided the desk adjuster and admitted he got more than what he should’ve. Which tends to show there are crooked contractors out there as well
It sounds like they didn't ask for "retail" pricing. They ask for THIS roofer's price. THAT is NONE of their business.
@@SomeDumUsrName Certainly it's their business. The only way to reach a fair price is to know the costs, add a burden to materials, allow for overhead and profit. Retail isn't always fair pricing.
@@rockyv180 What this roofer pays for his material is ABSOLUTELY NONE of their business. Determining whether he is charging a "fair" price has NOTHING to do with what his markups are. It's all about the final price and where that stacks up against having it done by anyone else.
If I can go drop $500,000 on inventory, then I am going to get a MUCH better price than someone who has to buy material for each job separately and who doesn't buy large amounts frequently. Or, heck; I may have a trick up my sleeve and can get an even BETTER price on the material for that job. In either case, I can mark up WAY more than my competitors who don't have the same resources. So, charging the same "retail" as my not-so-fortunate competitor/s, I can make lots more on the material. Why would a company allow someone else to tell them that they are making too much money on their material? DOESN'T HAPPEN.
It is NEVER a customer's job to analyze costs and dictate what and how much a contractor is allowed to markup labor and/or materials. It is the customer's job to shop and compare contractors and compare RETAIL pricing based on comparable quality of materials and workmanship.
OUR "COSTS" ARE NONE OF THEIR DAMN BUSINESS! Never have been.
@@SomeDumUsrName You have explained this correctly. There are several tiers for contractors of different sizes. so there are many different cost depending on that tier. Insurance just pays the retail "highest cost" and let it go from there.
Can't believe the insurance adjuster gave you a black eye and denied the claim, what a jerk
The insurance company often is an owners worst enemy
Replacing a roof with the same exclusive and extremely expensive materials multiple times makes no sense.
His insurance company will probably drop him over this.
Still seems kinda shady though.
Read the description under the title. First roof was Spanish tile and damaged by a tornado. They installed a metal roof. That was damaged by hail. Now they are installing a polymer roof.
This roofer seems shady sounds like he doesn't know how to install the product properly.
@@LeahBrooksTowerGardens I didn't see any downed trees. If the tornado didn't break brances or down trees the roof shouldn't have been damaged.
@@LeahBrooksTowerGardens But a metal roof if it was good quality, and installed correctly would not have been pulling away from the roof like it was in the picture. Something is not adding up.
@@Confused_Philosopher right! If a tornado came it would have knocked down some trees. Even if it was a couple roofs ago and it happened years ago. Everyone knows you can’t just call someone to remove trees it take years to have trees removed. Boom! Case solved!! Your a goddamn genius
I had something similar...
During a heavy wet snow event, the roof of my carport (20' x 20'), collapsed.
I had bought it during the time the manufacturer was transitioning from round tubing to square.
The insurance company faught me for several months, because according to them I had to get the same type of structure. The problem with that was, the manufacturer Didn't make it any more.
Eventually they buckled and I was able to get a much stronger structure.
Never back down..stick to the principal and always make sure that They Know...You are not going to just except it.
Ty for sharing your battle tested advice. First rate intel that is so practical when dealing with the adjuster, pool hustler grifter mentality. Just 15 mins with an "adjuster" from State Farm over a minor repair was the worst 15 minute business interaction encounter, and your advice clarifies how to view these grifters and "shills" for the supposed ethical CEOs leading these companies advertising as good neighbors, that is if your neighborhood includes Genghis Khan. Your logic about time working against the "grifter adjuster" is spot on. Pacifico beer cheers for sharing.
You are entitled to the same quality, not the same manufacturer. If you wreck your old Chevy Cobalt, you don’t get a new Chevy Camaro just because they don’t make the Cobalt anymore. You now get a Mazda 3 or Ford Focus. Like kind and quality, not like manufacturer and upgrade.
If it keeps getting damaged and needing to be replaced, the insurance company should stop insuring the house and any others with that type of roof product. It's not fair to others who pay insurance and have their rates go up to insure properties that cost them so much. 50Kx 2 or3 times is crazy. Why would a roofer want to put up such frail shingles unless they are just doing it to make lots of money?
I was thinking the same thing. Maybe there is a real reason why this is the only house in the area with this style of sheeting.
Please tell me what roofing material will withstand baseball and tennis ball sized hail.
I'll wait.
@@homesteadroofing That was my question. We have grapefruit sized down here about every 10 year or so. Punched a hole through the shingles and decking. No rot. Did you include the material break down when you sent the prior roof estimate? My adjusters usually need to see what you are replacing and the amount.
Not everyone can be as honest as a roofer wanting an entire roof replaced for 2 dings.
What u are talking about ?
Let me replace three panels on the front of your house and see how it looks like I bet 10 to 1 u will be crying the loudest cuz u lost value on your property because your curb appeal sucks
For the 3rd time in 2 years also
It's worse dealing with health insurance. I have to argue coverage with someone on a phone who can't even pronounce the procedures they are denying.
I agree, mainly because health insurance is purely personal and directly impacts an individual's well being. Still, insurance companies of any kind exist primarily as for profit businesses. The longer they can delay paying, the longer they retain capital and build on its value. I've dealt with some honorable insurance companies over the years, but just as many dishonorable one's. I found the adjustors the worst of the bunch: A car adjustor who didn't believe my car was hit by a deer, with a clump of deer guts/hair wedged in my headlight...a guy representing the insurance company of a restaurant chain (where I slipped on a glob of spilled salad dressing and cracked my fibula) telling me when I left the restaurant, cameras recorded that I showed no sign of discomfort or difficulty walking-when the truth was my wife and daughter helped me stagger to the car and get to Urgent Care. A good adjustor strives for fairness and just compensation, with the insurance company itself aiming to do the same. My guess is, you're lucky if even 50% of the insurance companies hold to fairness as their top goal...dog eat dog is what I see. If they can get out of paying, they are going to do their darnedest to do so...
The insurance companies make a profit from your illness or injury, it’s a win-win for them. The patient can maybe survive the illness with a manageable bill.
agreed... my work coverage's "unlimited" dental... has limits.
Thank you so much for explaining! Hurricane Ian I’ve had scammers at my door so holes in my roof not covered.. an adjuster comes tomorrow from KIN.. see what happens! No internet or phone coverage makes it hard to get good people and are left to the knock knock scammers! Your info was great!!!
Thank you so much! I'm so sorry for the devastation that you've experienced. Hopefully our content can give you some guidance.
The fact that this unequal product that had been replaced twice already was allowed is amazing to me!
Right, I hope he recommends a different product, a metal roof should last at least 50yrs and up to 100yrs.
Also, just because you have damage to your roof does not entitle you for a whole roof replacement
Why is a steel roof failing three times in a short period??? Steel roofs have an underlayment (water barrier) that most likely is not damaged. Independent adjusters are what you want, they do not work for the insurance company and therefore they provide an unbiased estimate. Why not a repair, sounds like the material is still available?
I appreciate this guy looking out for other roofers. The insurance company doesn't have any business asking what you pay for material or labor. They don't like your bid then they can move on to the next guy. If your the only game in town welllllll sorry about your luck. My bids have a clause stating price may change due to cost.
Wise move these days.
The insurance company has every right to ask what the insured pays for material and labor, they have a right to inspect and they have a right to challenge the prices charged. Read the policy.
I'm dealing with an adjuster who is denying a claim, using a clause, " knew or should have known" regarding a very slow ingress of water, between the two vapour (water) barriers, and we did not detect the leak, in a storage area, until an odor occurred, i asked, am expected to carry out a moisture test on all my walls periodically, still waiting for answer
I managed a vehicle recovery and salvage business that had the contract for police recovery, accident or stolen cars. The insurance assessor's were easy going and reasonable and would often ask me if a car should be repaired or written off. They did pay close attention to owners who had red flags raised for excessive claims though.
If this is the 3rd time using this roof material and its very expensive - it does not seem any good - i would go for a better material thats cheaper.
Oh and Independent Adjusters absolutely do not get paid a commission on estimates. That is completely false.
My friends son was run over by a drunk driver. The insurance adjuster came to his house. The adjuster started to explain that because his son was dead, my friend would save so much money by not having to buy clothes or feed his son. My friend almost came across the table to grab the adjuster. How can someone be so heartless?
I'm in the roofing business since 1970 and was a field adjuster . This is directed to this fellow. I know this man is glowing with happiness. Sir, nice internet commercial. Nothing more and nothing less.
Thank you for your observation about my emotional state. Hopefully you feel better, too.
Insurance companies are all crooks. My grandfather was the Vice President of Claims Adjustments at Prudential Insurance for 15 years, and I know he paid for his giant boat on the suffering of legitimate claimants he figured out how to deny coverage to.
1. There is no such title as "Vice President of Claims Adjustment" at any insurance company. 2. Prudential is a life insurance company. They do not sell Property insurance and therefore have no property claims adjusters.
3. You are a liar.
I’ve tried to put 3x. Look him up. I just had the wrong department.
no, Ed Martinez is right. you are just a liar. Insurance executives are paid on a salary. they don't make an extra dime for denying losses.
I would use a roofer to do the roof who had already done that same roof twice already! I would go with different roofer and different type of roof!
must be a great product to only need replacing every time the wind blows
Hey man, if you dont want to be the only person in the county with the brown metal shingles, then feel free to get a conventional asphalt shingles and be trouble free for 10-20 years. You gotta pay to play.
The wind didn't have anything to do with the metal roof needing replacing.
@@jontest5718 nah its worth getting eye dotted by hung over field adjustor to be able to install chineese foil roof
@@homesteadroofing no kidding, but why did it need to be replaced? What was the mechanism of damage to it?
🤣😂
I typically can't sit through talk videos but you're so easy to listen to. I don't deal with insurance adjusters but should the job ever call for it, I feel more ready now.
Good grief, it would have been easier to just tell everyone "a sheep tried to jump over me and I got head butted by it"!!!!
If the insurance company was smart they would pay and then cancel that policy.
That's part of what I said lol.
Looks like the adjuster said "If I wanted your opinion, I'd beat it out of you!"
If my insurer jerked me around like that for even a week, I'd quit talking to them and just sue them. Companies miraculously get their shit together when they're at risk of getting bitch-slapped by a judge.
"This old man, he said.... no!" That made me LOL! 😂😂🤣🤣
He sounds 100% correct from his perspective.
True sociopath scammer lol trying to get big on youtube by making this video as essentially an add linking 10 other videos lol what a clown
Look, I am not a roofer or competitor but if the roof is being damaged due to severe weather, it would be sensible to replace it with a product that will stand up to the weather conditions. We use corrugated iron in long sheets, it stands up to MOST hail, all snow, and rain events. Understandably you pay a bit more upfront on material, ( less than clay tile?), but save on labour costs. Try it and forget about it.
I hope you are working on my roof. The insurance company should not pay for the roof and should cancel the insurance on the house completely. All insurance companies should not use third party inspection and all claims should be prorated to the age of the home. No old roof should be paid by insurance.
If this roof was on its third replacement I might suggest that a different roof covering be considered. Obviously this covering material is inadequate for this area.
Independent adjusters are not paid commission based on the claim payment if that were the case then they would be agreeable to your initial cost of repairs. Their pay is based on the invoice of the bill charged to the carrier.
Understand too that as an adjuster I am lied or told less than the truth everyday.
We didn't put the same material back on
Your wrong , they do get a commission .I ran my own company here in Colorado , and dealt with both , desk and field adjusters . A "desk" and "cat"adjuster (catastrophic) who usually came from a different geographical area because of a storm that creates more damage than in a given local that a local office does not have the manpower to cover . Anyway , a "cat" or "field" adjuster DOES get paid on the volume of damage he writes , so naturally , he will look to include EVERYTHING that a hail storm damaged , a desk adjuster will fight tooth and nail to decline things , such as space decking , drip edge , etc . And or not include certain line items on their estimate because they "missed them."
I always had to explain to homeowners that , no your insurance company is not looking out for your best interests , they have stockholders to look after , and guess who they will choose 100% of the time ? I didnt convince many homeowners of this , until the dust settled , and they actually saw what I did to get their roof replaced with the required materials just so it passed inspection. I ALWAYS had to supplement insurance claims , what homeowners dont get , is if they can write you a check for $15,000 for a roof that actually costs $25,000 and make you think you just won the lottery , they will be more than happy to do so , they only pretend they are on your side , in actuality , its the roofer that is .
@@adrianojames7903 there is a difference between an independent and a CAT adjuster. As an independent myself the invoice on a T&E file falls between a billing price based on the estimate but my commission itself is not.
I have not found a roofer yet that doesn’t see hail damage to any roof I insect with them even if the claim is for wind. Roofers are not the saviors to the homeowners…adjusters are not taught how to cheapen a claim to help the carrier. I have however taken construction classes and Xactimate classes not telling them I’m an adjuster and they show the class all kind of tricks to to add stuff to invoices to get a higher cost on the claim payout.
@@MC-ce2pn You havent been with every roofer . I have had homeowners call me to come out and look at their roof where I did , and after inspecting their roof advised them not to bother calling it in , many times .
One time in Denver , it was the same scenario , no damage , told the owner I would'nt bother calling her insurance . I get a call from this same owner 6 months later , for me to come out again . I tell her there has not been any hail this year in her neighborhood . She then tells me she has to move to San Francisco as her company has transfered her , and as part of selling her house she has to put a new roof on it. I get out there , she tells me that after I left her house earlier that year , some other company knocked on her door and asked to do a free inspection , she told them there was no damage based on what I previously told her on my first visit . They insisted I didnt know what I was talking about as there had been hail around the time i visited . She signed a contract , the roofer had her call in the claim while he was there , and told her when the adjuster came he wanted to be there to meet with him . The adjuster came , the roofer was a no-show , and declined the claim . There are bad roofers , there are bad adjusters , and there are bad homeowners . I am not , nor ever have been so desperste to get a signature on a contract where I needed to lie to either a homeowner or an adjuster . I have had homeowners tell me , so and so is going to put me in a lifetime shingle , their price is 2500 less then yours , and they are going to waive my deductible , and put a $1000 bucks in my pocket . My response to him was , "Can I counter that?" He looks at me with pleasure and says sure. I tell him , I will match that offer , but instead of 1500, I will make it 2 grand . He responded by telling me , "Now your talking !"
Then I responded , I wouldnt do any work for a crooked homeowner like you ever .
It might seem unprofessional , I get it . But why I responded that way was he used me to get his roof bought as I met with the adjuster , but would not sign a contingency contract with me , but promised he would if the the adjuster agreed with my assessment that he had enough damage to warrent full replacement. He lied , and changed his story to "He was getting bids " , after he was cut a check . So when I made that ridiculous counter offer , I had already decided I didn't want his business .
LOL this is another prime example of predatory scumbag roofers using systems that require tons of surrounding material to be removed to replace the small damage which results in YOU GUESSED IT INFLATION due to constant predatory insurance schemes so and the roofer and building supply laugh all the way to the bank not caring about the negetive impact on enviroment of all the wasted resources and asphalt that doesnt get recycled , u know what is in asphalt lol petrolium aka oil aka the stuff that makes gas and is in short supply ! This shit makes me sick i cant blame them for taking advantage of the system not everyone has a conscience and we need better industry regs and policy to prevent this.
Would have suggested a different roofing material . Next time
That's what we did. Told the homeowner we weren't going back on with the same. Installed DaVinci instead.
I would think the roofing product corporation would be liable for allowing a lightweight product to be installed in a Highwind area knowing that that product does not meet the standards of which the climate in that area requires.
That’s why that product was never installed on any other homes in that area. Lol
Channel owner says in another comment that the damage wasn't caused by wind. Would be awesome to know what caused it lol.
@Chill Will how do you know?
@Chill Will he added that recently then-it wasn't there a month ago.
The time value of money equation used by insurance companies will need to be adjusted for the change in the inflation numbers that we are seeing these days.
Absolutely! There's another increase coming Aug. 1st. Probably won't be the last one this year.
Tell that at Xactware
Insurance adjusters should get to know people and businesses in the trades and stay current with what things cost.
You think they don't? There are HUGE databases that provide that information.
What's going on there causing a new roof every two years?
if you had installed a product twice already on the same property.... something is going very wrong. either you are installing it incorrectly, or it's a bad product.
RUclips shows me that 50% of the viewers only watch the first 1 minute of this video. I'm guessing you didn't watch all the way.
@@homesteadroofing nope, divery of message is an important part of video making, to use an analogy I once heard, if the first minute of a song is just a bunch of cats fighting, most people will never hear the lyrics at the end.
@@homesteadroofing I watched it all the way until the end and still didn't see any reason why replacing a $50k roof twice in 2 years is a good way to go and I thought you said it was replaced 3 times? Not saying this to be argumentative - I must have missed something as I heard that you replaced it for a different homeowner, but it sounded like the same house? Did you mean two different homes? It might have been worded funny because it seems a lot of people heard it that way.
Crap roof to that is readily subjected to regular weather events. Why would they keep using to the same product???
You think baseball sized hail is "regular?"
Hmmm
Thx 4 keepin an eye out for all the roofers out there!
Thank you very much for the encouraging comments!! That means a lot!
@@homesteadroofing Pun written all over Mike's comment 😉
I'd hate to see what the adjuster looked like!
Why did a $50,000 roof fail after just two years???
It looks like you guys should install a heavier gauge steel roof Specially and heavy winds
Why not just send a sample of the roofing to Itel, a company that will analyze the product and assign a value. Insurance companies and contractors use this source all of the time.
There was no need. The insurance company agreed that they were in the wrong.
I know I'm late to the party but that's a damn expensive roof.
3rd time replacing, is nobody considering a different type of roof?
There's obviously some sort of design flaw if metal tiles are bending with a little bit of wind
I'm an independent adjuster who is a contractor for an insurance company. I want to correct a few things, or at the very least help people understand Insurance claim process a little bit better.
1) I I and every other contract adjuster in the company I work for DOES NOT get paid via commission. We are paid a daily rate and it is drilled into us to not overpay nor underpay, especially not underpay because that drags out the process and upsets customers. Nor is it professional.
2) Policy Holders,unfortunately, RARELY READ THEIR POLICIES and see exactly what is covered. It is really never stated to replace the Construction to 100% of original. Often, it is not possible due to Codes, availability or prudence.
99% of the time, however, the POLICY is to replace and repair tothe same, or equal or to improved industry standards.
You can get things specified in a rider or an extended coverage. And yes that is an extra cost usually.
Now in the in the policyholders defense, these policies are not easy to read and follow at times. But you have to take the time to make sure you understand what you're paying for.
3) As for the way estimates are calculated, it is true that many companies including mine use Xactimate &pricing tables based on local conditions and material prices.
However, if the policyholder, and often along with their contractor can justify a different figure for the estimate. We, most of the time will pay it.
4) I can't speak for other companies, but my approach and that of the company I work with, perhaps the largest one of all, seeks a collaboration with the policyholder and his or her contractor if they have one. That is in our interest, and from personal experience, I don't want to be wasting my time nickel and diming a claim because I have likely 50 more I have to close. It does me and nobody any good to play games.
I will pick a bone with many of the contractors I have worked with:. I have seen them turn a 20-30 -year old roof with no hail damage , or less than a handful of shingles damaged due to a non-covered cause into an entire roof replacement just because they got the policy holder fearing the full force of the heavens if they don't replace their roof with them, and them only.
Basically when it comes down to it let's be honest:. Insurance companies want to minimize their payout, yes. But we have a lot of rules we have to follow and if we don't there's hell to pay by 50 plus state boards.
Contractors, have a vested interest and increasing the value of the claim. That's that's self-interest, capitalism. But it's when they get out of control with that self-interest and don't respect capitalism, that's when things get muddy.
The only person that really gets hurt in this process when a contractor goes after something that's not covered, nor is fair or even frivolous, is the policy holder.
Finally, it really comes down to this:. The Policy Holder has to take charge of his/her Claim. After all, this is the person who is paying the Premium.
If you, as Policy Holder just step back & let the Contractor build expectations, that are outside the scope of your policy, then there will be problems & the process won't be effective for you.
Also, the converse is true for the Insurer, who, if not clear about what's damaged, will definitely default to the lowest payout possible.
If you work closely with your Adjuster & YES, hold him/her accountable, set Your expectations within the policy & take charge of YOUR Claim, then you will get what is fair.
It may be true that the adjusters in your company don't get paid a commission, but many do. They've told me themselves.
And yes, the policy holder must read his policy every year to avoid surprises.
I managed a body shop in the seattle area for 20 years. Insurance is the second dirtiest industry ever...
Funny that big insurance is owned by the other industry.
Great presentation. Couldn’t stop watching.
what i'm hearing, correct me if i'm wrong. a roof that you installed failed , you replaced it under insurance claim and now THAT roof has failed ! And the new owners are going to go with the same roof and installer a 3rd time ? ! ?
So a total of about $150,000 for a roof !
The video description explains what happened. No, they didn't go back on with the same material.
This is an underwriting problem. once issued the policy states that loss is based on "like kind and quality"
Based on this presentation, I am very confused about the repeated need to replace this roof. If I were the insurance company, I would want more information as well.
I'm guessing you didn't watch the whole video.
This is why I don't work for Insurance Companies. As a plumbing contractor I work for the Home Owner I don't take direction from Insurance companies. They will screw you after you are already done with the job.
That's the model that we've moved to and are encouraging other roofers to do. There's actually a big push in the roofing industry to do exactly what you're doing.
As an adjuster, we owe what is fair and reasonable. Start using Xactimate and you’ll find you’ll be getting paid whats on your estimate more often.
You’ll only be screwing the homeowner over out of pocket by completing the work without getting approval from a DA.
We’ll have Homeowners get full roof replacements on repairs because they want the roof to match, which is fine. If they have a matching endorsement and an ITEL indicating no match. Often they don’t and they’re just gonna be $10k+ out of pocket and there is nothing we can do because contractors are unwilling to work with us so I can’t even give the insured extra money with nothing to add to my estimate. Independent adjusters want to pay. Also, throw O&P on everything 10% and 10%. Get a GC license or Dwelling Contractor license and submit it with your estimate.
I didn’t hear you say what caused the damage to begin with, but since you did replace the same roof 2 years earlier, is the material used prone to damage or was this just a fluke? Is this some type of material I should avoid?
I'm starting to wonder do to it being under a new homeowner if they just didn't like the roof and wanted something different. As they didn't replace it with the same thing.
This is from the description:
FIRST - this roof had a Spanish Barrel clay tile roof, which got destroyed by 110-mph winds. The owners opted to install a premium metal tile roof instead of clay tile.
NEXT - A year later, the metal roof was hit by baseball sized hail, which totaled it. The insurance company paid to replace it and the homeowners had the same material installed. Then they sold the house.
THEN - 2 years later, another hail storm with tennis ball sized hail hit the house and after discussing what the new homeowners should do, we advised them to not install a metal roof. Their insurance company paid for the replacement in full, and they installed a polymer composite material instead.
Anything not to pay. I am dealing with this in SW Florida right now with UPC (who just filed to leave Florida). Handed it over to a lawyer!
I have found Mr. Bookman to be honest and friendly. His company did our roof and I will hire his outfit when the time comes again.
Wow! That was a pleasant surprise to find this comment buried amongst all the others. Like a little gem! Thank you!!
lol Colorado yeah been here 5 yrs and seen more scammers here then anywhere else and that’s with all these insurance places pretty sad place
What kind of a roof needs to be replaced three times in a few years?
What kind of a company insures a roof that has had to be replaced twice before?
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Never saw the roof once, thumbs down for talking too much and not doing anything
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Insurance companies like this give the rest a bad name. They are quick to collect their premiums, but slow to pay
It's not "like this." It's all insurance companies.
Most storm adjusters are going to get paid MORE based on the amount of damage they write up. So if they say there is no or little damage, they end up making less money. Of course there are unscrupulous adjusters out there who pay for everything, but they do not last long. There are way more unscrupulous roofing contractors in the industry who feel like EVERY roof out there requires replacing. They make an already difficult situation much harder. The idea that adjusters get a bonus for denying roofs is absolute BS. Anyone who says different is an idiot.
exactly I'm an adjuster in the UK, I get a larger fee if the claim is higher. Its not in my interest to decline anything unless is absolutely blindly obvious that is not covered.
I’m a roofing contractor
I’m trying to understand why did it need a new roof ? The product you used “ metal .” Should last many many years
Storm damage ?
Maybe monier concrete tiles with hurricane clips would be better
The video description has the details. 👍
Many commenters are of the same opinion. When you said near the start that you had already replaced the roof twice before, you should have explained what caused the damage to require replacement. To all those that said maybe this isn't a good product, they obviously don't know what huge hail and wind will do to a roof. I don't believe there is a product out there that can take that punishment, and many roofing materials have wind limitations. The only thing worse would be to have the roof lift off the house. Goat 1, you 0.
It's all written in the video description.
you should have sent in a bill to the insurance company for time wasted
I had a similar experience replacing a hail damaged roof. We had to do a supplement because our sheathing wasn’t up to code and would have to be replaced. They dragged their feet on getting it approved and sure enough a rain storm hits and we get water leaking into the living room. Result more damage that they had to pay to repair. And I had been all over them the whole time trying to get it done.
You're not making a convincing argument. Why would a $50,000 roof need to be replaced twice in two years?
You replaced the roofing twice on that house? That product must be terrible to have to get changed 3 times in total. A roof should last far more than two years!
Not surprised but I somewhat understand since many contractors overcharge when the insurance is the one paying.
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If the roof needs replaced that many times in a few years it sounds like a sh**ty product to me and or bad install. Never heard of a roof needing replaced so often. If it was damged by large hail then putting the same product back is stupid plain and simple.
Just because you invoiced for 50K doesn't mean it costs that much to replace. You ripped off the homeowners the first time. Would you fix your damaged truck for a blanket quote for 10K without getting an itemized bill?
Company exposure: $50,000
You accept $22k
Adjuster base:$1200/wk.
Adjuster commission: $28,000 (the savings to the company) x 20% = $5600.
The adjuster has no deadline, you have a damage (health, car, roof, etc.) making life difficult.
If the house needs a new roof every two to three years, the homeowner will eventually have a difficult time renewing his or her insurance policy. I'm just sayin'.
WTF is WRONG with that crappy roofing?!?
NOBODY should have to replace roofing every 2 years!!!🤣🤣🤣🤣
Oh lord, i have had 3 claims and all 3 denied even though there is clear damage and i am stuck without knowing what to do and have swapped insurance companies because of this, It has been a real loss for us. All 3 times i had a roofer here with the adjuster. My roof is about to just give up...
Your getting ripped off.
Oh my!
You don't give any info why. Insurance carriers don't pay for every cause of damage but they are required to tell you in writing why they deny your claim and must quote the applicable portion of the policy that is the basis of the denial. are we talking about a roof? You say your roof is about to give up. Wear and tear is not a covered cause. Maintenance is your responsibility. Coverage is provided if a loss happens all at once.
Sounds like it should have been excluded. Most insurance policies (the contract) exclude poor workmanship and or faulty building materials perhaps may be the case. In the interim while coverage is being reviewed the house should have been tarped.
If the metal shingles are destroyed by the weather where you live, why keep replacing the entire roof with new stuff if it’s going to just keep happening? I’m really confused to why you’d do that?
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Sounds to me like you're installing it improperly or the product is not the right product for that area. Either way the insurance company should have refused to pay the claim.
Sorry I have to agree, why would anyone in their right mind replace a Roof every 2 years ? Known to be sub standard and problematic ! With the same Materials ? Time after time ? surely it is time to replace with a known material that will last ! ?
Baseball sized hail.
What roofing material do you recommend that will withstand that?
All the DECRA metal roofs in the neighborhood got demo'd.
This is the same with the IRS. Everyone is afraid to have their taxes readjusted in fear that they will have to pay more. Every person I know that has challenged their numbers has come out ahead. Same thing with insurance companies, everyone is afraid of them.
Not Me. As a Trial Lawyer I've made a fortune (for my clients and myself) going after low-ball, greed-sucking, dirty goddamn insurance companies. The repeal of Glass-Steagall destroyed ethics in banking and insurance -- Ever since, my family and firms go after every penny we can. We settle a fair amount of cases on favorable terms only. I'm not afraid to trial any of those bastards -- If they screw my clients for $5 bucks or $5-Million they're getting a tort and trial. My life's work going after those scumbags.
People forget that most forms of Insurance are primarily risk and reward profit making industries or services! So many insurers (if they can) will always try to undercut or dispute any claim to reduce their outgoings or potential losses.
But equally it has to be said that some people also try to rip off insurance companies... so naturally there are always hoops and loops to jump through.
$60,000 for a metal roof? I've had a couple roofs torn off and completely replaced and currently building a small house. Unless it's a giant house, you're fleecing the insurance co.
Here in FL cost to replace a galvalume roof on a 3500 sf house is easily $50k.
It doesn't show anything of the sort. It shows you had them over a barrel because you refused to provide pricing. And the only reason you would do that is if you're overcharging for the product. Not to mention, one would have to question your integrity if you continue to install a substandard roof for that area, which is the only explanation for needing to change it three times in six years.
Enjoyed the video except for one incorrect statement. Adjusters, whether independent or employed by the carrier, are NOT paid a commission. Sometimes they charge a fee based on the size and complexity of the claim. Or, they may charge an hourly/time rate plus expenses. Carrier employee adjusters are salaried.
Either way, adjusters sometimes do not get it right. A good contractor, like yourself, or a public adjuster, can be invaluable in settling a claim favorably.
Another commenter here said that he is an independent adjuster and IS paid on commission.
That independent adjuster wanted that roof approved with your higher estimate. Because the greater the loss the more he or she would make. It was the desk adjuster that was the real issue.
I would agree with you.
Independent adjusters do not work on a commission, they charge a fee for doing an inspection which is paid by the insurance company. There are other factors to an insurance claim. The insured is to be made whole, that is, put back the way it was before the incident. Betterment is also a factor, since a roof cannot be replaced with used material and depending on the age of said materials, there is an adjustment. Also, insurance policy provisions do not automatically allow for an entire roof replacement, only the damaged areas. You as a contractor do not get to dictate what the insurance company pays, yo negotiate!
Roofing contractors are not legally allowed to "negotiate" anything with the insurance companies in Colorado for that violates UPPA laws.
Not putting anyone down or questioning process, it seems like a new roofing product. If it will not stand up to wind, then it might be reasonable to get a proven roof product. Take a look at your neighbors roofs. Did they suffer less or no damage and if so, you might want to inquire about their roofing product. With three roofing claims, I suspect that the homeowner may be looking for another insurance company come renewal time. Hopefully another insurer will not know their claim history.
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Please tell me you had additional damages for the time that the roof was exposed and then the following storm.
If that roof failed more than twice. In all good conscience why are you putting it back on and not looking for another option?
That's exactly what we did.
Insurance companies that are traded on the exchanges do disclose their profits. Every state has a regulatory body specifically created to regulate insurance companies. The barriers to entry in the roofing businesses are low compared to most businesses, there are many examples of consumers who have been victims of fraud by roofers. Would you, as a roofer, be willing to open your books and otherwise be regulated to the degree that insurance companies are?
I'm not sure how that relates to the topic.
I guess my only question would be if you know the adjuster doesn’t have that material in their program & they don’t know the material why wouldn’t you tell them the material & labor costs. If your an insurance company should you just take the roofer at their word that the roof costs $50k to replace? I guess I’m just playing devils advocate here..
If I ask the insurance company what their costs are in doing business, will they tell me?
I think we both know the answer.