Designing 'MARVEL SNAP'
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- Опубликовано: 2 май 2023
- In this GDC 2023 talk, absorb 15 years of collectible card game design experience as Ben Brode (Hearthstone, MARVEL SNAP) blasts card game knowledge direct from his brain into your ears and eyes.
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55:20 for those wondering what the questioner and Brode were saying that sounded like "fatooie", "FTUE" is "first time user experience".
THANK you! I tried closed captions and received a new answer each time I replayed the section.
THANKS! Finding a hard time figuring it out prior.
Literally why I opened the comment section. Thank you!
and here i was, looking at wisps and some famous gacha-game characters. tyvm!
Thank you! That was bothering me what "Fatooy" was
Ben is such a great presenter and energy. I love everything about Marvel Snap. Never been this addicted to any mobile game before.
I bet you love galactus and slow card acquisition
@@queensforever7498 bro go away, this man is just expressing his love for a game and you gotta try be negative
@@queensforever7498 someone just got shitted on by a galactus player and couldnt counter it. What a baby
@@niennunb9139 You could almost say that he's.. Mr. Negative. *ba dum tss*
@@queensforever7498 Skill issue much, never had any issues with Galactus as it's easy to read and counter. Git good bruh
Great presentation. I find Ben to be one of the best spokespersons for any brand, ever. His personality is infectious, you can see his passion for what he does. While I don't play Marvel Snap any more, I stand behind a statement I tell anyone who asks me; it is one of, if not the single best designed card game I have ever played, and I have played a lot over the years.
Same here! 100% agreed 👍
29:20 very interesting that the idea to not reveal all 3 locations at start was a simplicity choice essentially, and has resulted in adding a lot of depth to the snapping mechanic and how to hedge your starting hands even after one good location.
I worked this talk and helped get Ben comfortable as he had just lost his voice traveling to SF because his flight was canceled.
Glad it all worked out! Was great meeting and "chatting" with him. =)
You held him in your arms and told him that everything would be alright?
@@clearsky4049 You a 🤡
Even with his voice lost he talked louder than I ever will! 😂
I could listen to Ben Brode talk all day, really interesting talk and a great game
Great talk and what a trooper to save his voice all day just to not let everyone down.
I love what this man has done. That being said, I suffered piloted shredder for years because he wouldn't nerf digital cards.
I've recently gotten back into Hearthstone, after playing it very consistently pretty much since it came out, and with how regular card changes are now, it has me thinking back a LOT to those earlier years and the infrequency (to some degree, near absence) of nerfs, and wondering why on earth they thought that was actually the way to handle things.
@@turntsnaco824 because they thought it's better for players that don't play often or come back to the game after a break. I think it was also Ben Brode who gave this explenation.
I had the pleasure of interviewing Ben around 2008 at GamesCon in Leipzig, Germany. At the time, the WoW TCG was still in the making and scheduled for a release later the same year (I might mix up the exact date by a year, sorry if that's the case).
He was just as full of energy back then as he is right now. It was a "big deal" for someone from the mighty company Blizzard to interact with us lowly folks from the TCG company Upper Deck or at least that's what everybody told me.
Ben was down to earth, humble, as I said FULL of energy and he had such a passion for the game. It's no surprise to me that he kept climbing the ladder and I think that what he's achieved with Marvel Snap deserves gigantic kudos. As someone that's been playing TCGs for more than 10 years, all the innovation that Snap brought to the table can't be underestimated. It truly is revolutionary in my humble opinion.
Several other card games will benefit because of Marvel Snap as it will draw more people in and have them (eventually) try out other card games. Often those that have more complexity (whether or not that's a good thing is up to everybody's own taste).
I hope he won't stop what he's doing at the moment as he's such an important voice for the entire industry. 🙂
His part about limiting the card descriptions to roughly eight words is brilliant. I've done some billboard designs in the past, and the first piece of advice I got was to never use more than eight words. When people are driving 70mph on the interstate, they need to be able to understand exactly what you need them to as quickly as possible. When there's so much competition in games, it's good to be as clear and concise as possible.
Credit to George Fan, who he was quoting during that part. Great job, all around!
There’s a lot in here than can be applied in some way to other creative spaces. This was an awesome talk.
One of my favourite GDC talks. Great job Ben.
Ben WAS Hearthstone, and since he left, it can never be as great. I eventually rediscovered his skill in SNAP and now I'm a fan of his all over again.
This is one of the best design talks I've seen in a long time. I'm a game designer and hardcore Marvel Snap player myself, so I enjoyed this excellent talk even more.
I really like how this basically also contains other top GDC design talks such as input and output randomness, depth vs complexity, loss aversion etc. Plus Ben is somehow such a captivating speaker
Oh man I missed seeing Ben Brode on stage. I have not much interest in card games but his delivery made it super interesting and fun and I ended up feeling like I want to prototype a card game.
Ben is lovely and the best
And supports mutilating children, absolutely the best
We need an multiple episode in depth style series for this game
I’m surprised air land and sea wasn’t mentioned for inspirations. But this was such a cool presentation. I love this game so much.
Was thinking the same thing but Smash Up makes a lot of sense
Maybe because it wasn't??
@@krikukiks He mentioned in other interviews that air land and sea was indeed an inspiration, and it's much closer to snap than smash up, including the inspiration for the Snap mechanic!
I always explained the game like "It's Smash Up sped up". I'll need to check Air, Land, and Sea.
It's because that game came out a couple years after we designed the core gameplay for Snap!
It’s the best card game I’ve played since Magic as a kid way back when. Truly amazing.
Great talk! It was inspirational, educational, and engaging! ⭐
Great talk Ben. When you're playing snap, a lot of the design decisions seem pretty intuitive but obviously they're not given how many design iterations the team went through. It certainly very interesting to hear about how even a simple game like this can go through such a wide variety of different iterations. Big fan of snap, played everyday and in fact I have every single card unlocked. As an aside I feel like Ben Brode would probably be a really good boss; the fact that he went to every single employee to explain the big pivot that they were doing, very few bosses would do something like this. I just started my own company, so I'll have to keep that in mind.
I agree. But to be fair, it's easier to do so when your head count is low. I just looked it up and it looks like Second Dinner is made of fewer than 40 people
@@peerinward true. I never want to lose that small company feel even if the company ends up employing 100+ people.
Ben Brode and his Marvel Snap ads were so good I literally downloaded and played just because of him. I had no ideas what the game was lol
Ben is just incredible. The positivity, the design philosophy and presentation charm.
We need that 2v2 . Great video
Simple and deep. Two seemingly disparate qualities that Ben Brode somehow married and MASTERED in Marvel Snap.
I've learned so much from all Brode and co. have done in the TCG space. Thanks for this presentation, Ben. I'm adding this to my repository of game design knowledge in Notion. :)
Such a great speaker. I would love to see him have a podcast or made his own videos where he spoke about various game mechanics and the methodology of development across the game genres in the industry
I just watched full hour without me realising that
Good job from ben and hope for the best
00:20 - Introduction of Ben Brode
01:12 - Start of Ben Brode's talk
02:20 - Complexity and depth in games
03:34 - Reducing complexity in Marvel Snap
07:12 - First-time user experience (FTUE) in Plants vs. Zombies
11:47 - Inspiration from Plants vs. Zombies and applying it to Marvel Snap
13:45 - The zero-sum nature of card games
15:55 - Creating positive-sum gameplay in Marvel Snap
17:42 - Using bots to simulate player experience
19:19 - Playtesting and iterating on the design
21:52 - Audience Q&A begins
22:20 - Question on how to balance rules and interactions
26:29 - Question on expanding the Marvel Snap game
30:13 - Question on how to reduce complexity and not lose depth
33:21 - Question on player choice and agency in Marvel Snap
37:07 - Question on the role of randomness in the game
40:28 - Question on the balance between depth and complexity
44:01 - Question on balancing short card text with clarity
48:47 - Question on first-time player experience and design choices
52:32 - Question on keywords and card text balance
55:00 - Question on Marvel IP and game mechanics
58:00 - Question on monetization and player-friendly design
1:00:30 - End of Q&A and conclusion of the talk.
Thanks brother! Very helpful. Cheers!❤
sorry but this does not match the video?
@@voltcorp It was a long talk, I might've lost track
This is awesome!!! thank you so much GDC and Ben Brode. I am currently designing a digital card game and this definitely helping out. Cheers!!!
Ben is the big-head hero we don't deserve but are incredibly lucky to have.
This talk was amazing!!
Very interesting, loved this! ❤
Thank you so much for this 🙏🏾
Absolutely brilliant public speaker. I’m taking notes! Thanks for sharing your thoughts and expertise, Ben.
Hell of a presentation, both entertaining and educational!
The Eye of Judgement showed up and unlocked a childhood memory I had no idea was there. Thanks Benny boy.
Installed it yesterday.. man, Brode, it is the heisenberg of virtual cardboard
Loving marvel snap since launch and what a guy.. could listen to him all day. great talk.
He has really good energy. Nice presentation 😊
Snap is an amazing game.
Team at Second Dinner is top notch. Wonder what they'll make next.
This man is amazing. He is the worthy successor of Richard Garfield's title as master of gamr design. My children (which ill never have because im a millennium) would say "just like ben brode intended" and i think thats pretty cool.
Keep your awesomeness, ben
1:00:33
excellent presentation!
Amazing talk. Thank you so much for sharing.
Wow very cool, thanks Ben for this in depth talk!
Oh my gawd! I love this so much, I wanna work with these people so bad.
Miss the Ben Hearthstone days, always enjoyed his presence and it's nice to see him again :)
Very good talk, i work on a indie game wich mix Cards games and Dice building games (Dice Of Olympus) and it's was so refreshing to listen to him ! Thx Ben, hit me for a steam key haha
The best and most fun CCG. A must try for everyone who enjoys card games! I played almost all other CCG’s but literally can’t stop playing this one. So addictive lol..
someone needs to sit ben down and let him know his son is a fluffy puppy. 5:48
Great to get an update from Ben Hearthstone
So hooked on this. Excited for DC Dual Force coming soon as well.
Never played marvel snap in my life, but i learned a lot in this talk. Loved it.
Awesome talk thanks!
Honestly a great game. I don't have much time to play games lately, and Snap is nice and quick.
These videos are so helpful as a futur game designer
Awesome talk and i hope we see that 2v2! In game some day!
24:20 Rick And Morty's most realistic video game asked why the street fighters were fighting.
Love me some Ben Brode
verry engaging talk
bed brode more like cool guy amiright
2v2 mode would be interesting
That guy has always BEeN such a BRO. DElightful.
This was soo cool!
They need to actually launch the casual queue
42:55 I wish we have the avatar like that
Te quiero mucho ben brode
Thank you Ben
This guy rocks. 😎👌
How I Got My Mom to Play Through Plants vs. Zombies
ruclips.net/video/fbzhHSexzpY/видео.html
Richard Garfield - "Luck in Games" talk at ITU Copenhagen
ruclips.net/video/av5Hf7uOu-o/видео.html
This comment should be SO MUCH HIGHER thanks for the links!
Great talk! I wonder how hard some design decisions were. Like the fact they simplified some cards to prevent the user from needing to target cards. Seems like a somewhat big decision, removing choice from the player, adding randomness, "just" for easier interactions. The way he talks about it, the choice to go that way seemed kinda obvious, but I wonder if in reality it was a tough choice or not, with backpedal from the team and all.
Ben talking about change management somehow comforts me in my daily work.
"Mostly known for having a weird laugh"
A *delightful* laugh, Ben. One that brings people joy to hear it.
one hour of ben talking, sign me up!
Awesome presentation. Ben Brode makes the best games. What I don't like about locations is that they are slightly too powerful and can make you lose the game instantly with RNG. I think that was the downfall of hearthstone: RNG. And I think it started with the card called Yogg, the most RNG card I ever seen. Reynad and Lifecoach, 2 of my favourite streamers, both quit Hearthstone because of RNG. Reynad is actually creating his own game now called Bazaar which be more skill and less luck. 53:10 The card is talking about is 'Shadow Madness' but ya that is a problem, text is not perfectly clear such as "After turn 3, transform all cards here into the Hulk." which my opponents and I didn't know that for every card there, it would create an additional Hulk, so you have to lose a game to find out which is not really cool mechanic.
This shows that Ben brode came up with some really good ideas and have good reasons behind them, the bots idea was pretty cool, where one person wins but there’s nobody on the other side to feel the loss
2:01 I love the analogy of using the same ingredients but making a different product base on how differently you implement them.
Thank you for this talk!
Does anyone know what “fatui” is please? 55:11
So she meant FTUE which stands for "first time user experience"
@@loopingmoon1444 thanks a bunch for this, I've been looking everywhere for an explanation.
@@SolPlaysAnime no worries, glad it helped you
Oh and I am soooo glad you went w the graffics we see
Such a good talk.
You didn't lose!
You escaped, you're a genius!
😂😂
I probably would never have downloaded a game called marvel groot
I'm honestly very torn about this game.
I like the base game (what little there is of it) but absolutely _hate_ the manipulative progression that's built into it. And just how much of it and how blatant it is. Every design decision is made to make sure you come back _tomorrow_ or maybe _later today_ and you'd better hurry because the season is almost over and if you decided to buy in to accelerate the rate of unlocks then that only lasts until the end of the season! Add to that that the rate of rewards decreases as you go and hey, btw: We're using the same progression for card unlocks that we use for cosmetics and it's all random just to further cement the skinner box feedback loop to keep you _grinding_ endlessly.
Now, that's just what freemium is like, but it really does feel like it goes beyond regular monetization to the point that the game itself seems to be apropos to getting you hooked with random rewards, three different currencies, randomized upgrading, randomized collcting, season progression, player rankings and fomo-inducing limited-time offers.
It's a decent game, but it's a _weapon's grade_ narcotic. It feels like something that belongs in a casino.
Yeah there is a lot of 'addiction psychology' edge to the monetisation, more so than most freemium games I'd say.
For example you get a chance at a random card every ten levels. but are guaranteed one of three special cards or a skin every hundred level.
The special cards change every week, and only two of the cards will be good. So if you get the shit card or the skin, it pressures you to grind another hundred levels before they change the cards.
I could normally listen to Ben Brode talk all day but my throat hurts on his behalf. I wish he could've had some honey tea for a few days and tried this again after.
The Brode is on the Road
I always thought the SNAP was the sound as you would play a physical card game.
I'm so glad he mentioned Plants vs. Zombies several times, since it's my favourite game franchise of all time. I really loved watching this as someone trying to make a game
Ben Brode!
Legend
36:47 add 2v2 pls ben. find a way u mad genius
Ben brode is the reason I’m still on the game.
44:10 I have never seen the nexus events. But does that bottom grey corner not look alarmingly like the token shop system
Was not expecting to see urban rivals here and oooooooh I’m happy
When Ben mentioned Eliminate on iOS that brought back memories 😢
what are some card game design papers to read?
i dont like the game that much but i love the way they made it and its uniqueness
their collecting system so unique. Instead of selling the base card, their selling the artwork (except for the season pass card in that season, but this only time exclusive). This system made the F2P players can compete.
its the opposite. F2P players will wait months for a card they want.
F2p players can't really compete. The best cards are either in the season pass or stuck in tier 5 or 4. I hate that when I am playing vs players with broken decks and know what they are going to do but don't have a counter for it. Dracula is one of my most hated cards in the game since he has no counter, this isn't fair.
What is the poetry term he talks about - 'Trocky'? Where you put the emphasis on the first sylabylle?
Trochee
I love how the negative points are basicaly yu gi oh