I love Rachel, but this one doesn’t sit right with me. You can tell by how eliminated players voted that the karma points was a popularity contest. Let’s leave this format in 2024 please
@joejackson7801 Rachel definitely showed a self entitlement complex throughout the season but she did represent her era as the LAST one standing and killed it in eliminations and pulled the biggest move of the season breaking up the "Vacation Alliance" and sending Devin home 👀.....
The only thing about that is that they all had the same chances for karma points wether it was fair to some or not like we all knew bananas and Jenny was going to be last in both I’m just glad it didn’t affect Jenny and Jordan from getting their wins because they was dominating and clearly they had too because if they didn’t they wouldn’t have won most likely so it’s not Rachel’s fault
In a way it did affect Jenny. She had to share that 1 place win and Rachel got the win the same way Kaycee got hers. Losing majority of the time and then having some advantage to win. But a win is a win I guess.
That elimination was something that could have been individual because didn't make sense when 20 people left to not go individual@@jonathanoscategui2678
@@RariShiesty I can’t disagree with this more, respectfully. Most people weren’t basing their votes solely on how well or not they were treated. They were giving 5’s to their friends and 1’s to everyone else. That’s why I call it a popularity contest.
Yeah let’s never do karma points again, the fact that Jordan finished 1st at all checkpoints except 1 but barely beat Derek is crazy. I feel bad for Michele though.
@bigstreezy It's nice that social game did play a big factor with the karma vote and honestly I'm not opposed to that playing a factor in future seasons because some people like Jay tried to skate by in the past season and social game play and how you treat others should play a factor somewhat 😮....
@@jonathanoscategui2678it does play a factor in terms of keeping you out of eliminations or being voted in. But if you manage to get yourself to the final, be it by having a great social game or winning eliminations/dailies, your performance should be all that matters. Not some silly karma points
@@dc-wf4tb Considering Tori technically got third and went home with nothing for finishing the final and winning the most daily challenges for women 😮👀 I agree the karma votes were screwy in that regard 🧐....
The finale needs to bring back biking, swimming, and running to checkpoints. So if you're not that strongest at swimming, maybe at biking and running, you can make it up. But in this final, the strongest swimmers were going to win.
100% agree, last video I said Cara was probably glad that she got eliminated because she hates swimming. This final was in no way fair to everyone! It’s like they made it for Jordan and him alone! I was kinda disappointed.
That's trifling since he has carried him every season. All his so-called friends could have helped him but didn't, even Tony gave Johnny a 5. I would start looking at Leroy and Laurel differently.
That's what makes me hate Karma votes so much. They have had to deal with a combination of Karma and simple popularity all season as its generally a key part of each season in deciding if you end up being thrown in or not, this season especially as we didn't even see tactical moves made to try and get strong player out like we have in the past as the format which is why no-one really took a shot at Jordan so he got to the final without an elimination. Unless you have a season thats completly solo and where there is no votes into elimination, its just the last two going in so the general game has had no popularity elekmets in it, then there is no reason for a karma element
Absolutely nail on. Don’t be mad the concept of karma votes, cause that’s a great way to place the competitors in the eyes of their peers. The idea have potential, it was the use of it that the Challenge absolutely fucked up on. It should help with placing or determining advantage/disadvantage at the beginning. But not to manipulate, influence, and /or sway the results. That’s the worst way to use it
To be fair though she does still come away with significantly more money than Rachel and only just behind Jordan despite having to split it. The UK and US have a tax treaty so so pays no US tax on her winnings and in the UK competition winnings are tax free. So she comes away with $238k, Joran comes away with $256k and Rachel $152k
@@Etsh9 Yep and that's only at federal level, depending on the state you live in you can be hit for more via state taxes. I suspect that might be why so many of the pro reality stars move to florida
@@SimonWakefieldUK US taxes suck, and taxes have so many loopholes. For an American based industry paying out, she might be subject to the tax. Like in states, if I won the lottery of a different state, I'd be subject to their tax. My state wouldn't be like "income tax on that other states lottery". Or they could all bypass since they made the money in the Philippines. Obviously MTV/Paramount bypass a lot of limitations filming in other places along with discretion from fans I'm sure. I learned recently, if my coworkers cross the bridge to live next state over, their remote days work isn't taxed the same. So they get more take home for same work. BS.
I hate that Jenny won. She’s the most irritating, sneaky, thinks she’s the 💩. I like Rachel but tired of hearing how strong woman rule bs. I wanted Michelle or Tori to win.
@@lilyparks8580love jenny winning, i want to see strong competitors and she has proved herself again. 3 seasons and 2 wins. I agree with the rachel comment though, she said all the woman are crushing the men but then Michelle and Rachel both need kyland to help them up on the platform for and he is a male hahah 😂 Like shut up Rachel, we get it. Michelle is annoying but did well this season and final. Tori is overrated and overhyped, i knew she wasn't going to win. She needs a break, tired of her. Jenny, Emily, Evelyn, Cara are my favourite female competitors. Jenny sneaky? Lol are you sure you know what that word means.
So happy for him. After All Stars people were like "yeah, he's fine, but they obviously had him already around and were short on E2 guys". Because they did just keep a lot of AS4 people here. But he's solid and should have been on more seasons sooner.
@bigbuffguu9589 That swimming 🥽 final must have been way more daunting then it looked because of all the mileage and TJ said it was a 30+ hour final 😮! Congrats to everyone for finishing it 🙏....
@@hardvegetable1598 The worst one was Challenge Battle of the Exes when they had that long snow final 🌨️❄️❄️🌨️. Try breathing climbing up a mountain 🏔️ of ice 🥶.... That was a super tough one....
Can we please SHOUT Jordan for becoming a 5 time champion 🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 with one freaking HAND!?? 👌😮 Jordan has never used his disability as an excuse and has been beyond an ultimate competitor and dominated this final 🔥 🥇.... Jordan now ties CT for 5 championships and tied for second most behind Johnny Bananas 😲....
I was just telling my husband how impressive he is to do everything he does. The hammer elim, the tug of war elim etc. There's only one time I can think of where it was a hindrance. He always finds a way. Can't think of the season but they were up in the air and had to move 2 boards and walk across. Which he obviously struggled to do. He's a beast
You might not like the format but don't count Racheal put of her win. Just like Chris is survivor. You might not think deserves a win but he still was the winner.
If Jenny had eliminated Tory I feel Jordan would of rode with her to the final and she may of won over her who shall not be named give ther her 3/3 which would have to put her arguably top5 females
Jenny winning made watching worth it. Loved the drive, heart and competitive edge she brought. Yes she complained but got it done in the end. Emily, jenny, Cara and Evelyn are my favourites females. Amber B is just a good person 😊
Can we start having the conversation about Jordan being the GOAT of the Challenge? He has won multiple seasons that contained heavily stacked casts WITH difficult finals. I think he should now be considered for the GOAT position.
Same, I have Bananas at 1, CT at 2, Jordan at 3 and Landon at 4. I had Landon at three prior to last night, but with that win Jordan moves ahead of Landon.@@eddydcwildmigo90
Jordan is the goat if we go solely of performance but everything involved especially personality and fans they bring bananas is the got either way bananas&jordan>ct stans gonna hate that
Craziest part of the final was Rachael saying "why do I have to only compete against the women, we're beating the men" the the very next scene is her asking Kyland for help to get out of the water... #stopthemadness 😂
Also when on the underwater scooter she talks about how she’s fast on those cause she’s light very next thing talking about all she needs is to beat the men
Thank you! I get what she is saying but it's annoying comparing herself to men. Talking the women need to be fitness models. Made me just want to tell her to shut up. Sometimes women like this just sound like they want to be men
Thank you! I appreciate you watching the entire season and look forward to covering the next season. I really appreciate you leaving a very nice comment!
@@U2BearCat cmon now dude lmao. They’ve been doing that for a couple decades. Everyone can run but everyone can’t swim. I’m not even sure how you’re comparing the 2
@@21tyson55 First of all, not everyone can run well. Look at Big Easy and Aneesa. Second, swimming is something that you can get better at with practice. If a player shows up and doesn't know how to swim well, that's on them.
I was rooting for him so much, especially when he started with that time disadvantage and then passed almost everyone on that first checkpoint. He really showed how strong he is, now everyone knows and will watch out lol
@@hansoloburger2322 Jordan the victim of his own standards. He's clear MVP. Dominated the entire season and didn't see an elimination because of it and his social game. Derek gets dark horse of the season.
@@kristithomas9285 Proud of Michelle for having a breakout season and Derek finally found his ultimate competitor 👍.... But seriously Jordan DOMINATED the final and is a 5 time Challenge champion 🔥 tying CT 👀.....
@@U2BearCatstop comin up with theory’s in your head lil bro ur obsessed Jenny won deal with it ‘don’t know Jenny don’t care for her’ clearly care enough
Michele was the beast for me. Jenny's entire existence is fitness. Her doing well is obvious. It would just be sad if she didn't perform well *cough, Rachel*
@hansoloburger2322 Rachel benefit the twist. She came third in the overall final and the karma vote help her the most. Rachel even pay tribute to her win to Bananas is like ewww.
I'm glad looking at all the comments that people are on the same wavelength. I just hope production knows how bad this was. Thank you for watching an commenting! I really appreciate it!
Michele did her big one! So proud of her she walks the walk and talks the talk! She held her own the entire time with everyone except for Jordan not that she was an underdog going into it but stature wise she held her own! She deserved 2nd in my eyes technically she placed second!!!
@sugaray7435 Very proud of her 🙏. She crushed it this season 🔥! But considering she's dating a genius in Devin 😂 her math skills should have been more on point 😅...
I enjoyed this season as a whole. I enjoyed the final. Great Job to Jordan, Rachel, and Jenny. Derek earned that 2nd place and I am glad that the Karma points didn't give him 1st place. Thanks Angel Cake for all of your videos covering this season.
@@thecamishere4344 Rachel would be 3rd but Derek earned 2nd place outright. TJ and Angel Cake both said the Karma points did not affect the men's side.
@@thecamishere4344 Derek would have won 2nd regardless of karma points. TJ clearly stated there was no change of the final position regarding karma points for the men.
@TheKidsGotTime-dq6rz Wait a second!? 😮 Technically Rachel and Jenny tied for first which meant Michelle got second and Tori should have got THIRD and not fourth 😮🙄 🧐🧐🧐🧐..... Tori should have went home with some money 💰 for finishing.....
@@jonathanoscategui2678yeah, I didn’t understand why Michelle didn’t then get 2nd after Rachel/Jenny were announced as 1st place & then Tori getting 3rd. That sucked.
@@QuanPham-mx6gg I mean honestly, I agree, I used to like when they had curveballs they could throw toward each other, now, it just feels like a popularity contest. I didn’t even watch, I just watched Angelcake’s recaps 😂
Michele has EVERY RIGHT to be upset. I saw people on instagram saying she was being ungrateful. I’d be PISSED if I went from 75k to 25 k bc of a bs popularity contest. Production wanted Rachel to win imo bc why is it worth 2 check points? This final ruined the season for me. Just have a final where the best player wins pls.
It's ironic since Michelle only won survivor because the jury were bitter about Aubrey, even though she played the best game. Now Michelle lost because of a social game twist . Now that is what I call Karma😂
@@mothelomalema7522 But that's the game in Survivor. The entire point Survivor is to make it to the end and convince the jury to vote for you rather than for your opponents. Aubry had major jury management failures. In The Challenge, the final is supposed to be about your performance. If you can win the final, then you win, even if the rest of the house doesn't like you.
If they decided to let Jenny and Rachel split the first place prize pot, it would have been nice for them to at least give Michelle the second place prize since she was in second before the karma points.
Trash way to end a season. Karma votes were the dumbest thing they have added in challenge history. Jordan completely smoking the whole entire final and just barely winning is ridiculous. And Rachel was insufferable towards the end of the season. She kept shitting on the men for some reason then they gifted a 3rd place person a championship and butt loads of money. MTV should be ashamed
And IMHO as the men and women weren't competing with each other you have to take the performance difference with a pinch of salt. Jordan was so far ahead of Derek and Bananas while Kayland was so far back as he is such a poor swimmer that there wasn't that much need for Derek and Bananas to push themselves as much as they only had each other to compete against and it didn't matter if they were 1 second or 1 hour defenece. The womens was much closer, and were pushing each other to find extra gears pushing them more to their limits. If it was a 1 winner with the men and women competing against each other then we would have seen a differnet outcome as Derek and Bananas would have needed to go to the higher gears
Idk what it is, but something about Rachel doesn't sit right with me. I'm happy Derek placed second, such a great come up story. The karma points should have offered some sort of advantage/disadvantage at one checkpoint only.
I really liked her at the beginning but her attitude and confessionals really start to irritate, she acts so superior to everyone. I guess it is just something Champions do.
I'm with you Drew I don't think they should keep adjusting the way the final is won to lesson peoples actual performance. It was nice to see Rachel fight so hard this season and come out on top but it just didn't feel as authentic. Jordan proves over and over what a legend he really is. I don't think there is any format of a final he would not have won. Derek's story this season was so heartwarming to me. Then to see him and Kyland continue to be so kind during the final just made it more so. I think Kyland has a bright future on the challenge. This final was stacked against him but he never once quit and had the very best attitude the entire time. Jenny is a literal queen and I'll be furious if we have to wait 4 seasons again to see her back.
@@thecamishere4344 what's messed is if Jenny and Rachel tied for first shouldn't Tori have gone home with cash for finishing third technically 😮🧐🧐???.
OMG You will not understand the HILARITY in you wearing that hoodie!!!!! I'm literally watching the video game movies of all mortal Kombat before you uploaded this most recent review. GOOD FORM, SIR!!! - BTW I love the karma votes. Be careful how you treat people like TJ said
Michele really got screwed by the karma points. I calculated it and if the karma points had only counted as 1 checkpoint she would have tied for 1st place with Jenny instead of it being Rachel. I was very impressed with her finals performance as well as her resilience this season with all the eliminations. She definitely has proven herself in my eyes.
No. Jenny beat Michele by three points in the actual final (22-19). If it only counted for one checkpoint instead of two, then Jenny would have finished first by herself with 23 points, but Michele would have been second instead of third. Rachel would have been third where she belonged, and Tori would still be fourth. Good season for Michele either way, though.
I was impressed with her ability to maintain a strong swimming performance overall. She struggled a little with some of the checkpoints but stayed strong in the water.
They need to do a Challenge season where they have 4 of the greatest Challenge male and female legends ( CT Johnny Bananas Jordan Darrel Tori Cara Rachel and Laurel) serve as mentors to the next generation of the Challenge and have to coach them through daily Challenges and get to compete with their teams in TJ's crazy final to prove who is the best coach and legend 🔥😮.... What you'll think???
That would be fun. But how big would the teams be? If they did it right, It could be cool. They did something like that with partners a few seasons back I think.
I don't get the Jenny hate train. She seems lovely. I was rooting for her in the final and glad she won fair and square. 2 wins out of 3 seasons, that's some crazy stats in the modern era!
I want someone to cheer to jeer for in the competition. I don't know who Jenny is a person, she has been a blank page the entire season, could have been totally edited out and not missed as she added no entertainment value and is just this person who popped up for the final.
@@U2BearCatsorry she didn’t force beef like other begs she just came to compete stop crying say u don’t care but constantly going on about her cry mroe
@@LeytonWalker-c5u Please take some reading classes and work on your comprehension before responding to peoples comments. The only person I see making beef is you.
I understand and I wasn't trying to make an excuse of why she didn't get 2nd. But in the final she did drop the ball a few times. Jordan competed and performed so the karma points wouldn't be a factor. And good thing he was able to be nearly flawless because even with his performance it was close. Yes, Michele was robbed due to a popularity contest. But it could've been avoided if she could've locked in a few of the checkpoints better than 4th place. Both instances can be true. Thank you for watching and commenting! I really appreciate it!
@ of course!! I totally get what you mean, I have just loved Michele since she won Survivor so I just have a soft spot for her! Thanks for the amazing content you post, keep up the great work :)
Drew, just wanna say, you are awesome. I'm finally going to start your patreon. I don't have anyone in my life that is a huge challenge fan, and I think you have the best personality/content when it comes to that. I always look forward to your videos, but I need more! So I'm gonna join up. Keep it pushing man, I know you work hard
Welcome to the Patreon. I'm so happy to have you on board at the Bakery. I hope you enjoy the exclusive content. More will be on the Patreon very, very soon. Thank you for watching and for the support over at Patreon. I really appreciate it!
I think it's important to critique something you like. The Challenge is a show I will like but it will never be put on a pedestal where it's free from criticism. Thank you for watching and commenting! I really appreciate it!
@ I agree sir. Sometimes I’ll leave a critical response to something & people lose their minds. “Well why watch if you hate it?” “Why are you trolling?”, etc. & it’s like…obviously I’m a fan of some sort or I wouldn’t even be there in the first place. So I feel your pain about the 40 final but I’m still kind of low-key jazzed for this Rivals All-Stars coming up…miss your collabs with Chantelle so I hope we get a chance to see her soon as well. Keep up the great work. I’ve been here from the beginning, before you were even a bearded beauty, & you have done a really amazing job on your channel. It’s been my first stop for Challenge coverage for as long as I can remember!
Jordan's been my fav player since his entrace into The Challenge, BUT I really wish Wes was on this season cause he would have given Jordan a run for his money on an all swim final!
I don't like the fact they don't explain how Karma votes affect the results before they start the final. Does production alter how many check points Karma votes equal to effect the story line by making it 2 rather than 1?
@@QuanPham-mx6gg Yeah, how hard is it to create a graph with how everyone voted. Separately, Rachel finished top 2 twice while Michele top 2 five times at check points yet these karma votes so greatly alter the final results 🤦
I have two theories how the karma votes could be used. Fill free to agree or disagree: 1) Have the karma votes at the beginning of the final where they determine on the order of who can start first and finish last. 2) Make the karma votes determine how many minutes can be deducted from their overall time. For example, if an eliminated player gives someone 1 point, that means 1 minute will be deducted from their time. 2 points equals 2 minutes deducted and up to 5 points equals 5 minutes taken off. But this just my theory because the way the producers have the karma votes affect the game was really stupid.
That sounds better to me, the way the did it was just weird and the final results didn't feel genuine to me idk, it feels better when they run to the finish line
Karma points are the worst. Rachel came in 3rd as far as I'm concerned. It's cringe to see her numerous posts about her 3rd ring. She performed poorly and it is so underdeserved. Besides some coin counting, she basically performed as bad as 4th place. Production is a joke for this one.
@llallana2882 What's messed up is if Rachel and Jenny tied for first doesn't that mean Michelle finished second and Tori third 😮🧐!?? Meaning Tori should have gone home with money for finishing the final 💰......
That's not how it works. Anytime there is a tie for placement they skip the next place. That's the way it is in every competition @@jonathanoscategui2678
It’s pretty standard practice to treat ties like that in certain sports where prize money is combined and split and both people get the 3rd spot, and the next place 4th doesn’t exist as a result and 5th follows up.
Congrats Jordan and Jenny. 🎉 The karma points changed my opinion of Rachel’s season. If she had ended 3rd, I would’ve respected that finish more instead of this BS “1st place”. The final format was okay but thankfully no eating segment. The Challenge has always had a social aspect but the karma points changes the dynamic of the show at its core. What separates The Challenge from other TV shows is that regardless of how good or bad your social skills are, there comes a time where you have to rely solely on YOU- that’s why eliminations exist, that’s why the winner isn’t determined by a Jury or by fans.
You are my favorite challenge review. I don't watch the season until it is done including reunion. But oddly I watch your recap and review. Just wanted to say thank you for the focus and opinion.
That is very kind. I'm so happy you watch and enjoy the reviews. I take it as an honor since you usually wait until the season is done to watch the show. I thank you for the support in watching. I really appreciate it!
I’m glad Michelle got demoted to third place, she better spare some to Kyland for helping her get up on the platform. Same goes to Racheal better spare some money to him
Someone in the comments in your previous video suggested using the karma points for a purge at the end of day one, and I liked that idea. Maybe combine the results of the first day with the karma points or something. But definitely not have at the end. It's insane that you can get to the end and NOT KNOW WHO WON. I wanna root for someone to cross the finish line first and EARN IT. But I do feel like Michelle got robbed a little bit. Shout-out to Kyland for earning good karma in the future by helping Michelle and Rachel out. They owe him some of their cash, for sure.
The change of swimming was interesting, but it should not have just been swimming. I would LOVE to have seen how Kyland would do in a more "normal" final with lots of running. Also Michelle would have LOST a normal finale, she did not deserve first or second compared to how strong Tori and Jenni are. Agreed the karma should not have impacted the winners.
It's time to seriously start considering Jordan as the best man to ever play this game. No one is doing it like he is, in arguably the hardest timeframe to compete, with such few seasons. Sheesh. Just an absolute beast.
I think overall, I agree with you on the karma points, I think the best way they could have used them to determine who would go int he final elimination against the last place finisher for that final daily. My only other big issue was the eliminations, they were just not as much fun to watch and I think they catered to certain players at certain times. Michelle basically got lucky that all her eliminations where mostly non physical, and the same for Derek's against Corey. All the other elims Corey has were physical, they this one was far more forgiving for Derek. And on that same note, with hem being boring, they literally took the 4 most fun eliminations we all love to watch, put them in the first elim night and then we never saw them again! WHY?!?!?!? But as always, great review Drew!
Yeh the excuse of not wanting someone to win who’s won before doesn’t make sense when one is your bestfriend and the ones who haven’t won Leroy has 0 connections too
1st jordan amazes me every time he's on the screen hes really the goat. Sucks bc we may not see him for awhile. 2nd jenny might have to be put in the female goat convo perfect performance in her 2nd final. 3rd love Rachel but karma pts really saved her and also she's got to stop belittling the men just to boost her ego up. 4th Tori and Kyland disappointed me I thought they would kill the final. 5th Michelle just needs to hit the gym and practice math and she will be a champ soon.
I might be an island on my own but I didn’t really enjoy this final. This was really about who is the best swimmer. Would’ve been a better final if everyone was at least on equal levels with their swimming
I also think it was unfair for the final elimination to be such a strenuous swimming event. You could see the fire in Tori go out so fast because she was just so exhausted from that elimination just to swim for 2 days straight afterwards 🥺
I needed Tori to beat Rachel in that final checkpoint. If she did Michele would have tied with Jenny. If Kyland didn't help Rachel, Michele might have beaten her in that checkpoint and then again she might have tied with Jenny. I am CRUSHED for Michele. Coming into this season I wasn't all that excited about her especially because of what happened to Nurys last season but she was my favorite on the female side going into the final. Rachel had the opposite trajectory for me, I was rooting for her HARD in the beginning and then she soured on me. The shit talking about Cara in confessionals really left a bad taste in my mouth. I think Karma should have only been worth one checkpoint.
Yeah there was a lot of things that actually flipped the game overall as a whole and your Michelle point is accurate but I heard Rachel is catching a lot of heat after winning a third challenge championship is that true?🤔
I wouldn't mind Karma point being received for each won elimination. Then, whenever someone repeatedly gets send in, at least can get some compensation for the wins (and rhe house may not want to keep sending only one person anymore)
I’m happy that Derick didn’t give Michelle the win on the math challenge because it wasn’t about her, it was also his to win. He did give her enough time to take it but I was glad he didn’t. I loved that Michelle did amazing this final but I feel that the real Karma came from last season, I wasn’t that disappointed. But to be honest, this Karma vote, was lame. It should always be based on performance
I thought I was going to come in here having to say all the reasons why Michele wasn't 100% screwed by the Karma vote but you made all my points for me, I had a whole speech prepared. It really did come down to the little mistakes especially in Checkpoint 2, if it wasn't for that barrel, she would've got 1st or 2nd and that would've alone had won her the game and there would've been no tie. The Karma vote did her no favor and it is a horrible twist but saying this as probably the #1 Michele fan, her performance cost her the win not the karma vote. Michele did perform well just not well enough, and when not if... when she makes it to another final Michele will become a Champion.
Agreed, but I think most people arguments were she performed better than Rachel, but honestly, they should have known Rachel was going to receive a lot of Karma points. This is why Jordan made sure he did well.
Agreed! Big Michele fan here as well! As much as I was angry for her about the karma vote, I realized that it might be better in the long run knowing that not getting 1st is on you vs on an unfair twist! She did an interview for an Entertainment Weekly article and responds so maturely to this, its awesome! A lot of self-awareness about being a first-time finalist who learned a lot in retrospect! Worth the read!! Mad respect for Michele, especially this season! 💪
Thank you for your reviews! The site I watch the show on locked the final episodes 😭 It's nuts that due to the karma points we got 3 champions out of this season. Those karma points need to never make an appearance again.
You can always count on me having the reviews up. I use CTV sometimes to watch the episodes after they air and they changed everything after January 1st. The replay of this season feels like the network doesn't want to be seen or make it as tough to access the show. Thank you for watching and commenting! I really appreciate it!
I loved this final! I'm glad that we saw something new. Also, visually the final looked gorgeous 😍 Congratulations to Jordan!! He shows that you had to dominate the final in order to avoid the karma points because he was the 2nd lowest for the men. Congratulations to Rachel & Jenny. I feel weird about the tie as well but they let Jenny keep her win and she's happy so I'm not gonna be mad about it.
I would love karma points to be earned when you win in elimination because then the karma would come back to whoever voted you in. Especially with the number of people who volunteered themselves to go in. It would change who you throw into elimination when you know that they could get points to come back and hurt you in a final. I feel like that would be a good mix of being able to get karma points in your own control by winning and also having relationships matter by who gets thrown in.
Thank you so much Drew Brother for your recaps for this entire season. I was rooting for Jordan and Rachel to win but now this will be a controversial win for Rachel, and I did not want that for her. I just wish that they would have had a tie breaker to make it so that we would have 1 clear winner.
Thank you for watching the review and recaps the entire season. I really appreciate it! I will be doing the reunion eps as well but I'm looking forward to covering All Stars Rivals. Thank you for watching and commenting! I really appreciate it!
I honestly hated the karma point thing but if they really wanted to use the karma points they should have made them currency for the final. So if a player got a total of 100 karma points from the combined eliminated players, they would have 100 points to “spend” during the final to buy themselves advances (like 25% of the puzzle done upon arrival, 1 hint from production, or even skip a checkpoint if they had enough points). That way they get to use the points but also still have to be strategic with how they use their points to get ahead.
Okay hear me out... The Karma points could have been advantages that they could have brought at the end. For example , they could have had 3 points let you buy a blanket. 4 points let you get to sit down instead of having to stand and hold that thing whenever they moved. 5 points they could have a pillow... 6 points = make someone start 30 seconds later than everyone. 7 points = 1 clue in 1 of puzzles. 8 = a letter from home or something wholesome like that. But stuff that could help their game if used correctly but not determine the outcome.
I think swimming should’ve been day one, and I wanted to see them do some running. I hate the Karma votes but I’m not mad how it affected the outcome. I’m happy for the Angels taking first place. Tori not getting anything was poetic justice for playing Devin’s game. This final was boring for me and the challenge overall was redundant and way too long. But I’m happy with the casting.
I don't get why everyone feels so bad for Michele when Jenny lost out on over 150k and should absolutely have had a solo win. The karma vote screwed her hard, and she, Michele and Kyland were at a crazy disadvantage with how much time thaey had to make connections with people.
That final checkpoint was genuinely awful. It came down to who could find one coin fastest, they could at least have made it a running portion since we hadn’t had that since the first checkpoint and give more variety
Im so proud of Michelle, Derek & Kyland! I fully believe Kyland will be champ one day. He knows what it feels like to be in a final and even though he’s the weakest swimmer. I think it’ll make him train harder for the next season that he returns.
Looks like the way to win a challenge is to be liked apparently. All those women got screwed. F the Karma vote. Love Rachel but this win did not sit well with me
In my opinion for the challenge 40 being such a big milestone for MTV. This was a terrible final, I’m truly disappointed. Such a great huge cast, and it ended on a popularity contest. Wtf is going on with the challenge. I remember when this show was properly competitive and with amazing drama and conflict between people.
Rachel on the last leg, "The women are doing so much better on the water scooters." Also Rachel, "I'm doing so well because I'm lighter." Like duh you're doing better dummy
Shitting on the guys while kyland helped her get up on that deck, what a slap to the face. She is the two face snake bananas said she was on the Island and Battle of the exes 😂
Is anyone else disappointed that there wasn’t an eating portion to the final? Eating disgusting things is part of a final and I agree with everyone else take away the karma points, at least in the final.
It's CBS influence, they want to family friendly the flagship and add it to their stable of middle of the road reality game shows. All Stars is on Paramount, hopefully they'll do some eating there, but either way the brand is changing. The Challenge we knew is gone.
I love Rachel, but this one doesn’t sit right with me. You can tell by how eliminated players voted that the karma points was a popularity contest. Let’s leave this format in 2024 please
@joejackson7801 Rachel definitely showed a self entitlement complex throughout the season but she did represent her era as the LAST one standing and killed it in eliminations and pulled the biggest move of the season breaking up the "Vacation Alliance" and sending Devin home 👀.....
The only thing about that is that they all had the same chances for karma points wether it was fair to some or not like we all knew bananas and Jenny was going to be last in both I’m just glad it didn’t affect Jenny and Jordan from getting their wins because they was dominating and clearly they had too because if they didn’t they wouldn’t have won most likely so it’s not Rachel’s fault
In a way it did affect Jenny. She had to share that 1 place win and Rachel got the win the same way Kaycee got hers. Losing majority of the time and then having some advantage to win. But a win is a win I guess.
That elimination was something that could have been individual because didn't make sense when 20 people left to not go individual@@jonathanoscategui2678
@@RariShiesty I can’t disagree with this more, respectfully. Most people weren’t basing their votes solely on how well or not they were treated. They were giving 5’s to their friends and 1’s to everyone else. That’s why I call it a popularity contest.
Yeah let’s never do karma points again, the fact that Jordan finished 1st at all checkpoints except 1 but barely beat Derek is crazy. I feel bad for Michele though.
@bigstreezy It's nice that social game did play a big factor with the karma vote and honestly I'm not opposed to that playing a factor in future seasons because some people like Jay tried to skate by in the past season and social game play and how you treat others should play a factor somewhat 😮....
@@jonathanoscategui2678it does play a factor in terms of keeping you out of eliminations or being voted in. But if you manage to get yourself to the final, be it by having a great social game or winning eliminations/dailies, your performance should be all that matters. Not some silly karma points
@@dc-wf4tb Considering Tori technically got third and went home with nothing for finishing the final and winning the most daily challenges for women 😮👀 I agree the karma votes were screwy in that regard 🧐....
She did all that to get fourth in the final. Lol, she was so worried about Johnny instead of getting the strong women out.
I already knew Michelle would have low karma points, just like Amber. All of people don't really care for her, which sucks.
The finale needs to bring back biking, swimming, and running to checkpoints. So if you're not that strongest at swimming, maybe at biking and running, you can make it up. But in this final, the strongest swimmers were going to win.
I agree it sucks to see one as good as kyland and get slowed down by swimming
1000% agree, it was totally unfair, especially to Kyland
Agree. It was essentially a 1 skill final
100% agree, last video I said Cara was probably glad that she got eliminated because she hates swimming. This final was in no way fair to everyone! It’s like they made it for Jordan and him alone! I was kinda disappointed.
And an eating portion.
Lee giving Bananas a 1 will forever be hilarious
@HotRoute7 Lee finally winning a final with Devin in All Stars will be even better 😁.....
That's trifling since he has carried him every season. All his so-called friends could have helped him but didn't, even Tony gave Johnny a 5. I would start looking at Leroy and Laurel differently.
@@deshawnthomas9023the excuse of he won 7 is lame ... And saying I'm your friend after that fall flat
@@alexandrejean-pierre5091exactly
@@jonathanoscategui2678 he doesnt lmao gets eliminated immediately
Rachel really had the most mickey mouse type win possible
“Karma” (popularity) can help you get to the final, but it shouldn’t influence how you do in the final.
That's what makes me hate Karma votes so much. They have had to deal with a combination of Karma and simple popularity all season as its generally a key part of each season in deciding if you end up being thrown in or not, this season especially as we didn't even see tactical moves made to try and get strong player out like we have in the past as the format which is why no-one really took a shot at Jordan so he got to the final without an elimination. Unless you have a season thats completly solo and where there is no votes into elimination, its just the last two going in so the general game has had no popularity elekmets in it, then there is no reason for a karma element
Absolutely nail on. Don’t be mad the concept of karma votes, cause that’s a great way to place the competitors in the eyes of their peers. The idea have potential, it was the use of it that the Challenge absolutely fucked up on. It should help with placing or determining advantage/disadvantage at the beginning. But not to manipulate, influence, and /or sway the results. That’s the worst way to use it
Johnny Bananas enjoying his little vacation on the island 🏝️ and jumping off the ship 🚢 after finishing fourth was hilarious 😮😂😂.....
@@jonathanoscategui2678 I also liked when TJ told him it was nice of him to let Michelle win their math round 😂
Jenny got robbed off $200K because of a popularity contest
To be fair though she does still come away with significantly more money than Rachel and only just behind Jordan despite having to split it. The UK and US have a tax treaty so so pays no US tax on her winnings and in the UK competition winnings are tax free. So she comes away with $238k, Joran comes away with $256k and Rachel $152k
To every 2x-3x champ should feel slight on Rachel’s win too. Like fam, that was no 1st place finish
@@SimonWakefieldUKReally, does tax takes 35% of the money the won?
@@Etsh9 Yep and that's only at federal level, depending on the state you live in you can be hit for more via state taxes. I suspect that might be why so many of the pro reality stars move to florida
@@SimonWakefieldUK US taxes suck, and taxes have so many loopholes.
For an American based industry paying out, she might be subject to the tax. Like in states, if I won the lottery of a different state, I'd be subject to their tax. My state wouldn't be like "income tax on that other states lottery".
Or they could all bypass since they made the money in the Philippines. Obviously MTV/Paramount bypass a lot of limitations filming in other places along with discretion from fans I'm sure.
I learned recently, if my coworkers cross the bridge to live next state over, their remote days work isn't taxed the same. So they get more take home for same work. BS.
Jenny winning despite having the least amount of karma points is the only reason why I’m content.
Same
She might’ve had less karma points than Bananas even.
@@okolo22000 probably so.
I hate that Jenny won. She’s the most irritating, sneaky, thinks she’s the 💩. I like Rachel but tired of hearing how strong woman rule bs. I wanted Michelle or Tori to win.
@@lilyparks8580love jenny winning, i want to see strong competitors and she has proved herself again. 3 seasons and 2 wins. I agree with the rachel comment though, she said all the woman are crushing the men but then Michelle and Rachel both need kyland to help them up on the platform for and he is a male hahah 😂 Like shut up Rachel, we get it. Michelle is annoying but did well this season and final. Tori is overrated and overhyped, i knew she wasn't going to win. She needs a break, tired of her. Jenny, Emily, Evelyn, Cara are my favourite female competitors. Jenny sneaky? Lol are you sure you know what that word means.
I am proud of Derek getting 2nd place because most people felt he wouldn’t be able to make the finals and he proved them wrong
Michele got rightful 2nd place too. Don’t let the karma votes fool you
@@jaimevillegas2418 newsflash, it’s not always about Michele
So happy for him. After All Stars people were like "yeah, he's fine, but they obviously had him already around and were short on E2 guys". Because they did just keep a lot of AS4 people here. But he's solid and should have been on more seasons sooner.
Derek is a beast, he gained my full respect this season.
Congratulations to Jordan and Jenny, two great champions that dominated one of the hardest finals ever.
@bigbuffguu9589 That swimming 🥽 final must have been way more daunting then it looked because of all the mileage and TJ said it was a 30+ hour final 😮!
Congrats to everyone for finishing it 🙏....
@@jonathanoscategui2678They have floaties, but I think running in the heat is the worst type of finals to participate in, not to watch.
@@hardvegetable1598 The worst one was Challenge Battle of the Exes when they had that long snow final 🌨️❄️❄️🌨️. Try breathing climbing up a mountain 🏔️ of ice 🥶.... That was a super tough one....
Jenny is hilarious because she's constantly complaining about the task at hand but somehow always gets the job done
Rachel won first place are you stupid or just racist?
Can we please SHOUT Jordan for becoming a 5 time champion 🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 with one freaking HAND!?? 👌😮
Jordan has never used his disability as an excuse and has been beyond an ultimate competitor and dominated this final 🔥 🥇....
Jordan now ties CT for 5 championships and tied for second most behind Johnny Bananas 😲....
I was just telling my husband how impressive he is to do everything he does. The hammer elim, the tug of war elim etc. There's only one time I can think of where it was a hindrance. He always finds a way. Can't think of the season but they were up in the air and had to move 2 boards and walk across. Which he obviously struggled to do. He's a beast
The reason why Jordan has 1 hand is because he would be too powerful of a human if he didn’t have a disability
If you’re counting Jordan’s spinoff win then you should count CT’s who would be at 7 while Bananas is at 8
@@marcospalomo8361 it was literally world championship, of course it counts.. CT’s doesn’t count for champs vs pros
@@Cosmic_endthat’s deep! Sounds biblical
Jenny won, Michelle second and Rachel third, the real fans will always know the truth.
You might not like the format but don't count Racheal put of her win. Just like Chris is survivor. You might not think deserves a win but he still was the winner.
Well said 👏
Exactly just like we know furniture Clark never won season 38
Love Kyland's disposition. Now he needs to learn to swim😂😂
Honestly he handled this loss like a champ lol but seriously coming in 4th almost every time but not giving up, not angry, just humble…
Jenny having a 100% record in finals show how much of a beast she is 💪🏻
If Jenny had eliminated Tory I feel Jordan would of rode with her to the final and she may of won over her who shall not be named give ther her 3/3 which would have to put her arguably top5 females
@ yall reaching💀just can’t accept someone’s good and can perform at same level of male goat if not better
@ Ofc that’s fair but she is just physically fit same way Rachell is
Jenny winning made watching worth it. Loved the drive, heart and competitive edge she brought. Yes she complained but got it done in the end. Emily, jenny, Cara and Evelyn are my favourites females. Amber B is just a good person 😊
Can we start having the conversation about Jordan being the GOAT of the Challenge? He has won multiple seasons that contained heavily stacked casts WITH difficult finals. I think he should now be considered for the GOAT position.
He is definitely on the Mt Rushmore Male GOAT with Bananas, CT, and I say Darrell.
@@QuanPham-mx6gg i would take darelle out and put in landon
Same, I have Bananas at 1, CT at 2, Jordan at 3 and Landon at 4. I had Landon at three prior to last night, but with that win Jordan moves ahead of Landon.@@eddydcwildmigo90
@@eddydcwildmigo90 Yeah i see you, definitely can make a case for Landon.
Jordan is the goat if we go solely of performance but everything involved especially personality and fans they bring bananas is the got either way bananas&jordan>ct stans gonna hate that
Craziest part of the final was Rachael saying "why do I have to only compete against the women, we're beating the men" the the very next scene is her asking Kyland for help to get out of the water... #stopthemadness 😂
Thats what I was thinking!!! She making herself look bad out here, I can't stand her
Also when on the underwater scooter she talks about how she’s fast on those cause she’s light very next thing talking about all she needs is to beat the men
Thank you! I get what she is saying but it's annoying comparing herself to men. Talking the women need to be fitness models. Made me just want to tell her to shut up. Sometimes women like this just sound like they want to be men
Thank you for a full season of awesome Reviews and Recaps! You are the best
Thank you! I appreciate you watching the entire season and look forward to covering the next season. I really appreciate you leaving a very nice comment!
When Cara Maria was deciding her karma votes and said this one's for Sarah 😮 that one hit deep 🥶......
I thought that was hilarious of her! 😂 Gives me no remorse for Bananas.
sarah didnt even like cara lmaooo
@@desixox wrong is wrong
Yet bananas won 25k and Cara got nothing. 😂
@@Hellstothenaw The irony! lol!
An all swimming final clearly gives certain players an advantage, the final should have been more well rounded
Well all running is unfair advantage to all of the swimmers and the bikers.
@@U2BearCatWell he said "well rounded" so perhaps he meant they should have running, biking, and swimming.
@@U2BearCatright? There have been endless finals where running is 90% of it.
@@U2BearCat cmon now dude lmao. They’ve been doing that for a couple decades. Everyone can run but everyone can’t swim. I’m not even sure how you’re comparing the 2
@@21tyson55 First of all, not everyone can run well. Look at Big Easy and Aneesa. Second, swimming is something that you can get better at with practice. If a player shows up and doesn't know how to swim well, that's on them.
This year mvp is Derrek. He killed it this year
@daj_leo4417 I want to agree but Michelle definitely broke out this season and crushed it in eliminations 🔥.....
I was rooting for him so much, especially when he started with that time disadvantage and then passed almost everyone on that first checkpoint. He really showed how strong he is, now everyone knows and will watch out lol
@@jonathanoscategui2678I was so proud of her and for her.
How? Jordan won 6 daily’s didn’t have to go into elimination and then won the final by a mile.
@@hansoloburger2322 Jordan the victim of his own standards. He's clear MVP. Dominated the entire season and didn't see an elimination because of it and his social game. Derek gets dark horse of the season.
Proud of Derek and Michele’s performances. Jordan is confirmed challenge goat.
I almost hope so tbh
@@thecamishere4344 👍
Jordan fr is the goat. Michelle and Derek did so well proud of them too.
@@kristithomas9285 Proud of Michelle for having a breakout season and Derek finally found his ultimate competitor 👍....
But seriously Jordan DOMINATED the final and is a 5 time Challenge champion 🔥 tying CT 👀.....
Derek killed it. Definitely a qell deserved second place
Rachel “winning” is a joke. Karma points (aka popularity contest) shouldn’t determine a winner.
She didn’t win nothing but money her celebrating being a champion is ridiculous especially for somebody that constantly talks about how good she is
Jordan and Jenny two absolute beasts. The real winners
Yeah, well, if someone hadn't told her to press the two buttons on her water scooter she would still be out to sea.
@@U2BearCatstop comin up with theory’s in your head lil bro ur obsessed Jenny won deal with it ‘don’t know Jenny don’t care for her’ clearly care enough
@@LeytonWalker-c5u Dude what are you smoking coming up with this stuff.
@@LeytonWalker-c5u Jenny, go to bed. 😂
Michele was the beast for me. Jenny's entire existence is fitness. Her doing well is obvious. It would just be sad if she didn't perform well *cough, Rachel*
The Karma Vote twist needs to be buried for Good and never to be used ever again
Rachel celebrating like she’s a champ is disgusting
@hansoloburger2322 Rachel benefit the twist. She came third in the overall final and the karma vote help her the most. Rachel even pay tribute to her win to Bananas is like ewww.
I 100% agree Karma points should have been used for advantages and disadvantages not counting as checkpoints in a final
I'm glad looking at all the comments that people are on the same wavelength. I just hope production knows how bad this was. Thank you for watching an commenting! I really appreciate it!
@ maybe they would have been advantages until they realized they could make Rachel win 🧐
Let’s be done with these stars and karma points and anything that they’re thinking about that’s similar. The final needs to be whoever wins outright.
AMEN! Thank you for watching and leaving this comment! I really appreciate it!
Michele did her big one! So proud of her she walks the walk and talks the talk! She held her own the entire time with everyone except for Jordan not that she was an underdog going into it but stature wise she held her own! She deserved 2nd in my eyes technically she placed second!!!
@sugaray7435 Very proud of her 🙏. She crushed it this season 🔥!
But considering she's dating a genius in Devin 😂 her math skills should have been more on point 😅...
Finally, a season I enjoyed beginning to the end.
I enjoyed this season as a whole. I enjoyed the final. Great Job to Jordan, Rachel, and Jenny. Derek earned that 2nd place and I am glad that the Karma points didn't give him 1st place. Thanks Angel Cake for all of your videos covering this season.
agree with all except Derek and Rachel. I do not dislike them as ppl but they're both 3rd if not for karma points
@@thecamishere4344 Rachel would be 3rd but Derek earned 2nd place outright. TJ and Angel Cake both said the Karma points did not affect the men's side.
As a whole it FUCKING SUCKED!!! Pre-individual was solid but after that it tanked to shit
@@thecamishere4344 Derek would have won 2nd regardless of karma points. TJ clearly stated there was no change of the final position regarding karma points for the men.
well to all disagreeing with me, he STILL should not have been close to Jordan tho. Jordan smoked all the men
Congrats to Michelle on finishing 2nd!🎉
@TheKidsGotTime-dq6rz Wait a second!? 😮 Technically Rachel and Jenny tied for first which meant Michelle got second and Tori should have got THIRD and not fourth 😮🙄 🧐🧐🧐🧐.....
Tori should have went home with some money 💰 for finishing.....
@@jonathanoscategui2678yeah, I didn’t understand why Michelle didn’t then get 2nd after Rachel/Jenny were announced as 1st place & then Tori getting 3rd. That sucked.
That’s one l mama. Don’t forget it!
@@tawnyrobinson3930because she was not second place. First and second place shared the prize while third place got 25k.
@@jonathanoscategui2678 Tori deserved to lose
So here's what we learned about Kyland in final: Calculators can't swim 😮😂😂.....
Just short distances.
Karma points should’ve been done for the next daily challenge. Pick who you want to get an advantage/disadvantage for that next daily challenge.
Why even have it at all.
@@QuanPham-mx6gg I mean honestly, I agree, I used to like when they had curveballs they could throw toward each other, now, it just feels like a popularity contest. I didn’t even watch, I just watched Angelcake’s recaps 😂
Just get rid of the karma points altogether. It would just encourage everyone to be fake nice in fear of retaliation points.
Michele has EVERY RIGHT to be upset. I saw people on instagram saying she was being ungrateful. I’d be PISSED if I went from 75k to 25 k bc of a bs popularity contest. Production wanted Rachel to win imo bc why is it worth 2 check points? This final ruined the season for me. Just have a final where the best player wins pls.
It's ironic since Michelle only won survivor because the jury were bitter about Aubrey, even though she played the best game. Now Michelle lost because of a social game twist . Now that is what I call Karma😂
@ that’s true as well. I hate when survivor juries take the game to personal. Whoever plays the best game should win.
Agree!
@@mothelomalema7522 But that's the game in Survivor. The entire point Survivor is to make it to the end and convince the jury to vote for you rather than for your opponents. Aubry had major jury management failures. In The Challenge, the final is supposed to be about your performance. If you can win the final, then you win, even if the rest of the house doesn't like you.
If they decided to let Jenny and Rachel split the first place prize pot, it would have been nice for them to at least give Michelle the second place prize since she was in second before the karma points.
Trash way to end a season. Karma votes were the dumbest thing they have added in challenge history. Jordan completely smoking the whole entire final and just barely winning is ridiculous.
And Rachel was insufferable towards the end of the season. She kept shitting on the men for some reason then they gifted a 3rd place person a championship and butt loads of money. MTV should be ashamed
Agreed! She made it sound like she beat everyone and like dude jordan wooped your ass hahah
Totally agree, dumb ASFK
And IMHO as the men and women weren't competing with each other you have to take the performance difference with a pinch of salt. Jordan was so far ahead of Derek and Bananas while Kayland was so far back as he is such a poor swimmer that there wasn't that much need for Derek and Bananas to push themselves as much as they only had each other to compete against and it didn't matter if they were 1 second or 1 hour defenece. The womens was much closer, and were pushing each other to find extra gears pushing them more to their limits. If it was a 1 winner with the men and women competing against each other then we would have seen a differnet outcome as Derek and Bananas would have needed to go to the higher gears
@@SimonWakefieldUK Yeah but if it was a 1 winner Jordan would have one over everybody anyways so?
The entire second half of the season was TRASH
Idk what it is, but something about Rachel doesn't sit right with me. I'm happy Derek placed second, such a great come up story.
The karma points should have offered some sort of advantage/disadvantage at one checkpoint only.
I really liked her at the beginning but her attitude and confessionals really start to irritate, she acts so superior to everyone. I guess it is just something Champions do.
@@U2BearCatSame here
Derek in NO way deserved second over Bananas
@thecamishere4344 I like bananas, but apparently, Derek performed better.
It's the constant imaginary competition with the men in her head....at least that was it for me.
I'm with you Drew I don't think they should keep adjusting the way the final is won to lesson peoples actual performance.
It was nice to see Rachel fight so hard this season and come out on top but it just didn't feel as authentic.
Jordan proves over and over what a legend he really is. I don't think there is any format of a final he would not have won.
Derek's story this season was so heartwarming to me. Then to see him and Kyland continue to be so kind during the final just made it more so.
I think Kyland has a bright future on the challenge. This final was stacked against him but he never once quit and had the very best attitude the entire time.
Jenny is a literal queen and I'll be furious if we have to wait 4 seasons again to see her back.
Congratulations Jenny and Jordan
Not congratulating a 3rd place finisher
yes!
@@thecamishere4344 what's messed is if Jenny and Rachel tied for first shouldn't Tori have gone home with cash for finishing third technically 😮🧐🧐???.
Shout to Michele and Derek for both coming in 2nd place. I doubt anybody really had that prediction going in to the season!
OMG You will not understand the HILARITY in you wearing that hoodie!!!!! I'm literally watching the video game movies of all mortal Kombat before you uploaded this most recent review. GOOD FORM, SIR!!! - BTW I love the karma votes. Be careful how you treat people like TJ said
Congratulations to Derrick, Jordan, Michelle and Jenny
Yeah let’s never do the karma thing ever again. That was some nonsense
Michele really got screwed by the karma points. I calculated it and if the karma points had only counted as 1 checkpoint she would have tied for 1st place with Jenny instead of it being Rachel.
I was very impressed with her finals performance as well as her resilience this season with all the eliminations. She definitely has proven herself in my eyes.
No. Jenny beat Michele by three points in the actual final (22-19). If it only counted for one checkpoint instead of two, then Jenny would have finished first by herself with 23 points, but Michele would have been second instead of third. Rachel would have been third where she belonged, and Tori would still be fourth. Good season for Michele either way, though.
I was impressed with her ability to maintain a strong swimming performance overall. She struggled a little with some of the checkpoints but stayed strong in the water.
They need to do a Challenge season where they have 4 of the greatest Challenge male and female legends ( CT Johnny Bananas Jordan Darrel Tori Cara Rachel and Laurel) serve as mentors to the next generation of the Challenge and have to coach them through daily Challenges and get to compete with their teams in TJ's crazy final to prove who is the best coach and legend 🔥😮....
What you'll think???
They did something like that a while ago with the spring break challenge. I think it’s a good ideal
@@kristithomas9285 I remember that but this one would have bigger stakes and be a great way to introduce the next generation 🙏.....
That would be fun. But how big would the teams be? If they did it right,
It could be cool. They did something like that with partners a few seasons back I think.
No. They need to be outright competitors. It is boring otherwise.
I don't get the Jenny hate train. She seems lovely. I was rooting for her in the final and glad she won fair and square. 2 wins out of 3 seasons, that's some crazy stats in the modern era!
I want someone to cheer to jeer for in the competition. I don't know who Jenny is a person, she has been a blank page the entire season, could have been totally edited out and not missed as she added no entertainment value and is just this person who popped up for the final.
Understandable. Jordan was 0% entrainment value wise this season though, probably even less than Jenny since she had the angels
@@U2BearCatsorry she didn’t force beef like other begs she just came to compete stop crying say u don’t care but constantly going on about her cry mroe
@@LeytonWalker-c5u Please take some reading classes and work on your comprehension before responding to peoples comments. The only person I see making beef is you.
@@LeytonWalker-c5u my gosh dude. Sounds like you’re the emotional one here. 😂
I understand analyzing the little ways Michele messed up but that doesn’t correlate to the karma points… she was incredibly robbed
I understand and I wasn't trying to make an excuse of why she didn't get 2nd. But in the final she did drop the ball a few times. Jordan competed and performed so the karma points wouldn't be a factor. And good thing he was able to be nearly flawless because even with his performance it was close. Yes, Michele was robbed due to a popularity contest. But it could've been avoided if she could've locked in a few of the checkpoints better than 4th place. Both instances can be true. Thank you for watching and commenting! I really appreciate it!
@ of course!! I totally get what you mean, I have just loved Michele since she won Survivor so I just have a soft spot for her! Thanks for the amazing content you post, keep up the great work :)
WOOO TEAM JORDAN 🎉🎉🎉SO PROUD OF HIM !
Drew, just wanna say, you are awesome. I'm finally going to start your patreon. I don't have anyone in my life that is a huge challenge fan, and I think you have the best personality/content when it comes to that. I always look forward to your videos, but I need more! So I'm gonna join up. Keep it pushing man, I know you work hard
I love the challenge and WWE, but my friends and family don't which sucks.
Welcome to the Patreon. I'm so happy to have you on board at the Bakery. I hope you enjoy the exclusive content. More will be on the Patreon very, very soon. Thank you for watching and for the support over at Patreon. I really appreciate it!
I could hear your disappointment throughout this whole video Drew & I feel you. It’s OK to be critical of something you love.
I think it's important to critique something you like. The Challenge is a show I will like but it will never be put on a pedestal where it's free from criticism. Thank you for watching and commenting! I really appreciate it!
@ I agree sir. Sometimes I’ll leave a critical response to something & people lose their minds. “Well why watch if you hate it?” “Why are you trolling?”, etc. & it’s like…obviously I’m a fan of some sort or I wouldn’t even be there in the first place. So I feel your pain about the 40 final but I’m still kind of low-key jazzed for this Rivals All-Stars coming up…miss your collabs with Chantelle so I hope we get a chance to see her soon as well. Keep up the great work. I’ve been here from the beginning, before you were even a bearded beauty, & you have done a really amazing job on your channel. It’s been my first stop for Challenge coverage for as long as I can remember!
Jordan's been my fav player since his entrace into The Challenge, BUT I really wish Wes was on this season cause he would have given Jordan a run for his money on an all swim final!
That would’ve been a thing of beauty, imagine him and Jordan had to do the tori/cara elimination🫠🫠
I don't like the fact they don't explain how Karma votes affect the results before they start the final. Does production alter how many check points Karma votes equal to effect the story line by making it 2 rather than 1?
Also, they didn't show all votes.
@@QuanPham-mx6gg Yeah, how hard is it to create a graph with how everyone voted. Separately, Rachel finished top 2 twice while Michele top 2 five times at check points yet these karma votes so greatly alter the final results 🤦
Production has been altering winners since forever.
I still stand by my previous opinion: karma points defeats the purpose of a true challenge winner! They did not need karma points.
I have two theories how the karma votes could be used. Fill free to agree or disagree:
1) Have the karma votes at the beginning of the final where they determine on the order of who can start first and finish last.
2) Make the karma votes determine how many minutes can be deducted from their overall time. For example, if an eliminated player gives someone 1 point, that means 1 minute will be deducted from their time. 2 points equals 2 minutes deducted and up to 5 points equals 5 minutes taken off.
But this just my theory because the way the producers have the karma votes affect the game was really stupid.
Just get rid of them.
That sounds better to me, the way the did it was just weird and the final results didn't feel genuine to me idk, it feels better when they run to the finish line
So proud of Derek and Michele ❤
Karma points are the worst. Rachel came in 3rd as far as I'm concerned. It's cringe to see her numerous posts about her 3rd ring. She performed poorly and it is so underdeserved. Besides some coin counting, she basically performed as bad as 4th place. Production is a joke for this one.
@llallana2882 What's messed up is if Rachel and Jenny tied for first doesn't that mean Michelle finished second and Tori third 😮🧐!?? Meaning Tori should have gone home with money for finishing the final 💰......
@@jonathanoscategui2678my thoughts also! So no one got third? Stupid
@@jonathanoscategui2678I definitely would have preferred that.
That's not how it works. Anytime there is a tie for placement they skip the next place. That's the way it is in every competition @@jonathanoscategui2678
It’s pretty standard practice to treat ties like that in certain sports where prize money is combined and split and both people get the 3rd spot, and the next place 4th doesn’t exist as a result and 5th follows up.
Congrats Jordan and Jenny. 🎉 The karma points changed my opinion of Rachel’s season. If she had ended 3rd, I would’ve respected that finish more instead of this BS “1st place”.
The final format was okay but thankfully no eating segment.
The Challenge has always had a social aspect but the karma points changes the dynamic of the show at its core. What separates The Challenge from other TV shows is that regardless of how good or bad your social skills are, there comes a time where you have to rely solely on YOU- that’s why eliminations exist, that’s why the winner isn’t determined by a Jury or by fans.
You are my favorite challenge review. I don't watch the season until it is done including reunion. But oddly I watch your recap and review. Just wanted to say thank you for the focus and opinion.
That is very kind. I'm so happy you watch and enjoy the reviews. I take it as an honor since you usually wait until the season is done to watch the show. I thank you for the support in watching. I really appreciate it!
I’m glad Michelle got demoted to third place, she better spare some to Kyland for helping her get up on the platform. Same goes to Racheal better spare some money to him
Michelle helped Kyland on one of the puzzles as well, if anything he was repaying her.
Dude.. Jordan needs to be studied lol
Dude is a machine. Thank you for watching and commenting! I really appreciate it!
Someone in the comments in your previous video suggested using the karma points for a purge at the end of day one, and I liked that idea. Maybe combine the results of the first day with the karma points or something. But definitely not have at the end. It's insane that you can get to the end and NOT KNOW WHO WON.
I wanna root for someone to cross the finish line first and EARN IT.
But I do feel like Michelle got robbed a little bit.
Shout-out to Kyland for earning good karma in the future by helping Michelle and Rachel out. They owe him some of their cash, for sure.
honestly, glad there wasn’t an eating portion
I love the eating portion. Remember thats how Fessy went home. It's gross but hilarious
Oh with all the swimming it would’ve been a nightmare
The change of swimming was interesting, but it should not have just been swimming. I would LOVE to have seen how Kyland would do in a more "normal" final with lots of running. Also Michelle would have LOST a normal finale, she did not deserve first or second compared to how strong Tori and Jenni are. Agreed the karma should not have impacted the winners.
It's time to seriously start considering Jordan as the best man to ever play this game. No one is doing it like he is, in arguably the hardest timeframe to compete, with such few seasons. Sheesh. Just an absolute beast.
Jordan up there now because of 5wins. For me FM2 Landon>>>>Dirty 30 Jordan.
Rachel defending production appears all about them giving her money because Karma cannot account for so much
@@joshuaakin4760 kinda wondering now if this contributes at all to how Devin has been talking about Rachel lol
Michelle got 2nd come on. Rachelle got 3rd ill never admit to saying jenny nd Rachelle won no way. Jenny nd Jordan won.
@dontread12 Technically Tori should have gotten third and went home with some money 💰💰💰 for finishing the final 😮😅🧐.....
I think overall, I agree with you on the karma points, I think the best way they could have used them to determine who would go int he final elimination against the last place finisher for that final daily.
My only other big issue was the eliminations, they were just not as much fun to watch and I think they catered to certain players at certain times. Michelle basically got lucky that all her eliminations where mostly non physical, and the same for Derek's against Corey. All the other elims Corey has were physical, they this one was far more forgiving for Derek. And on that same note, with hem being boring, they literally took the 4 most fun eliminations we all love to watch, put them in the first elim night and then we never saw them again! WHY?!?!?!?
But as always, great review Drew!
Rachel does not deserve 1st place at all. I don’t like Jenny either but she deserved 1st place this was a major bummer and disappointing
Absolutely
Leroy giving bananas 1 points is wild...you can't say I'm your friend and backstab me when u are not in the game
Agreed 😒
Yeh the excuse of not wanting someone to win who’s won before doesn’t make sense when one is your bestfriend and the ones who haven’t won Leroy has 0 connections too
So happy for Jordan ❤
1st jordan amazes me every time he's on the screen hes really the goat. Sucks bc we may not see him for awhile.
2nd jenny might have to be put in the female goat convo perfect performance in her 2nd final.
3rd love Rachel but karma pts really saved her and also she's got to stop belittling the men just to boost her ego up.
4th Tori and Kyland disappointed me I thought they would kill the final.
5th Michelle just needs to hit the gym and practice math and she will be a champ soon.
I might be an island on my own but I didn’t really enjoy this final. This was really about who is the best swimmer. Would’ve been a better final if everyone was at least on equal levels with their swimming
I also think it was unfair for the final elimination to be such a strenuous swimming event. You could see the fire in Tori go out so fast because she was just so exhausted from that elimination just to swim for 2 days straight afterwards 🥺
Agree 💯
Loving all the recognition Michele is getting in the comments but y'all need to start spelling it correctly lmao
I needed Tori to beat Rachel in that final checkpoint. If she did Michele would have tied with Jenny. If Kyland didn't help Rachel, Michele might have beaten her in that checkpoint and then again she might have tied with Jenny.
I am CRUSHED for Michele. Coming into this season I wasn't all that excited about her especially because of what happened to Nurys last season but she was my favorite on the female side going into the final.
Rachel had the opposite trajectory for me, I was rooting for her HARD in the beginning and then she soured on me. The shit talking about Cara in confessionals really left a bad taste in my mouth.
I think Karma should have only been worth one checkpoint.
Yeah there was a lot of things that actually flipped the game overall as a whole and your Michelle point is accurate but I heard Rachel is catching a lot of heat after winning a third challenge championship is that true?🤔
💔 I think Kyland was unfairly disadvantaged with all the 🏊♂️. My favorite part was🍌 getting a 4th and stuck waiting 🏝 😂
I wouldn't mind Karma point being received for each won elimination. Then, whenever someone repeatedly gets send in, at least can get some compensation for the wins (and rhe house may not want to keep sending only one person anymore)
That's a good idea then people wouldn't mind going in or being back the skulls.
I’m happy that Derick didn’t give Michelle the win on the math challenge because it wasn’t about her, it was also his to win. He did give her enough time to take it but I was glad he didn’t. I loved that Michelle did amazing this final but I feel that the real Karma came from last season, I wasn’t that disappointed. But to be honest, this Karma vote, was lame. It should always be based on performance
I thought I was going to come in here having to say all the reasons why Michele wasn't 100% screwed by the Karma vote but you made all my points for me, I had a whole speech prepared. It really did come down to the little mistakes especially in Checkpoint 2, if it wasn't for that barrel, she would've got 1st or 2nd and that would've alone had won her the game and there would've been no tie. The Karma vote did her no favor and it is a horrible twist but saying this as probably the #1 Michele fan, her performance cost her the win not the karma vote. Michele did perform well just not well enough, and when not if... when she makes it to another final Michele will become a Champion.
Agreed, but I think most people arguments were she performed better than Rachel, but honestly, they should have known Rachel was going to receive a lot of Karma points. This is why Jordan made sure he did well.
Agreed! Big Michele fan here as well! As much as I was angry for her about the karma vote, I realized that it might be better in the long run knowing that not getting 1st is on you vs on an unfair twist! She did an interview for an Entertainment Weekly article and responds so maturely to this, its awesome! A lot of self-awareness about being a first-time finalist who learned a lot in retrospect! Worth the read!! Mad respect for Michele, especially this season! 💪
Thank you for your reviews! The site I watch the show on locked the final episodes 😭 It's nuts that due to the karma points we got 3 champions out of this season. Those karma points need to never make an appearance again.
You can always count on me having the reviews up. I use CTV sometimes to watch the episodes after they air and they changed everything after January 1st. The replay of this season feels like the network doesn't want to be seen or make it as tough to access the show. Thank you for watching and commenting! I really appreciate it!
Bananas, Kyland and Tori were checked out throughout the finals
I loved this final! I'm glad that we saw something new. Also, visually the final looked gorgeous 😍
Congratulations to Jordan!! He shows that you had to dominate the final in order to avoid the karma points because he was the 2nd lowest for the men.
Congratulations to Rachel & Jenny. I feel weird about the tie as well but they let Jenny keep her win and she's happy so I'm not gonna be mad about it.
I would love karma points to be earned when you win in elimination because then the karma would come back to whoever voted you in. Especially with the number of people who volunteered themselves to go in. It would change who you throw into elimination when you know that they could get points to come back and hurt you in a final. I feel like that would be a good mix of being able to get karma points in your own control by winning and also having relationships matter by who gets thrown in.
Thank you so much Drew Brother for your recaps for this entire season. I was rooting for Jordan and Rachel to win but now this will be a controversial win for Rachel, and I did not want that for her. I just wish that they would have had a tie breaker to make it so that we would have 1 clear winner.
Thank you for watching the review and recaps the entire season. I really appreciate it! I will be doing the reunion eps as well but I'm looking forward to covering All Stars Rivals. Thank you for watching and commenting! I really appreciate it!
I honestly hated the karma point thing but if they really wanted to use the karma points they should have made them currency for the final. So if a player got a total of 100 karma points from the combined eliminated players, they would have 100 points to “spend” during the final to buy themselves advances (like 25% of the puzzle done upon arrival, 1 hint from production, or even skip a checkpoint if they had enough points). That way they get to use the points but also still have to be strategic with how they use their points to get ahead.
Agreed. This is a good idea. They did this in All Stars 4. This is how Laurel won.
Okay hear me out... The Karma points could have been advantages that they could have brought at the end. For example , they could have had 3 points let you buy a blanket. 4 points let you get to sit down instead of having to stand and hold that thing whenever they moved. 5 points they could have a pillow... 6 points = make someone start 30 seconds later than everyone. 7 points = 1 clue in 1 of puzzles. 8 = a letter from home or something wholesome like that. But stuff that could help their game if used correctly but not determine the outcome.
I think swimming should’ve been day one, and I wanted to see them do some running. I hate the Karma votes but I’m not mad how it affected the outcome. I’m happy for the Angels taking first place. Tori not getting anything was poetic justice for playing Devin’s game. This final was boring for me and the challenge overall was redundant and way too long. But I’m happy with the casting.
Yeah, like a swimming day and run day. Kyland would've actually been able to keep up on the run
Michelle and Jenny were robbed!!!
Everyone talking shit on bananas, like you’re not gonna miss him when he finally stops lol
Like west we miss west
Exactly
I don't get why everyone feels so bad for Michele when Jenny lost out on over 150k and should absolutely have had a solo win. The karma vote screwed her hard, and she, Michele and Kyland were at a crazy disadvantage with how much time thaey had to make connections with people.
That final checkpoint was genuinely awful. It came down to who could find one coin fastest, they could at least have made it a running portion since we hadn’t had that since the first checkpoint and give more variety
Exactly I hated the addition of the karma points and I’ve seen every episode every season of this show and I’m a huge fan
I wonder if the challengers are watching Beast Games where the prize money is 5 million dollars, going what!!!???
I was just thinking that too🤣🤣🤣
Im so proud of Michelle, Derek & Kyland! I fully believe Kyland will be champ one day. He knows what it feels like to be in a final and even though he’s the weakest swimmer. I think it’ll make him train harder for the next season that he returns.
Looks like the way to win a challenge is to be liked apparently. All those women got screwed. F the Karma vote. Love Rachel but this win did not sit well with me
Two Takeaways
1. Jordan is the 🐐
2. Rachel didn’t deserve that win
All your thoughts are spot on! You need to go be a producer so they know how to get the best seasons!
In my opinion for the challenge 40 being such a big milestone for MTV. This was a terrible final, I’m truly disappointed. Such a great huge cast, and it ended on a popularity contest. Wtf is going on with the challenge. I remember when this show was properly competitive and with amazing drama and conflict between people.
Karma points should have been more like fire tokens. Use it as currency to gain advantages or things like phone calls home or alcohol in the house.
Rachel on the last leg, "The women are doing so much better on the water scooters."
Also Rachel, "I'm doing so well because I'm lighter." Like duh you're doing better dummy
Shitting on the guys while kyland helped her get up on that deck, what a slap to the face. She is the two face snake bananas said she was on the Island and Battle of the exes 😂
They were literally doing better than the males all Finals. Except for Jordan of course.
@Supre3m3Kai Rachel specifically said the on the water scooters. Then turned around and said she's doing well on the water scooters cause she's light
Is anyone else disappointed that there wasn’t an eating portion to the final? Eating disgusting things is part of a final and I agree with everyone else take away the karma points, at least in the final.
It's CBS influence, they want to family friendly the flagship and add it to their stable of middle of the road reality game shows. All Stars is on Paramount, hopefully they'll do some eating there, but either way the brand is changing. The Challenge we knew is gone.
Thanks for the video’s explaining because I do not watch the whole episodes. I only watch clips on RUclips.
and did anyone notice the fact tj literally gave them COCONUT WATER in the middle of the final???? like are we actually joking.