I have two Hercules mopeds with this engine, both runs perfectly fine. No speedmonster but reliable and really nice workhorses. Nice to see anyone putting some love towards this little engine ! Keep up the good work!!
Hi there. I am struggling to find the transmission fluid level plug on my Sachs 50 Automatic from 1962. The "Saxonette " plate on the engine has 2 screws and comes off revealing a hole in the casting and a view inside the engine. Is the bottom of this hole the level? I can't see anything else to remove! Hope this makes sense and thanks in advance
Hi Kevin, I'm affraid I'm not familiar with the Sachs 50 2 speed auto engine, but both the Sachs 502 and 504 auto gearbox oil levels are to the bottom of the filling hole, so I would imagine your Sachs 50 to be the same. I've seen on one forum a guy in the States saying he can get 3 oil changes out of a quart of ATF oil. Google tells me a quart is almost 950cc of oil, so it's possible there should be around 300cc of auto fluid. If you put around 300cc into what you think might be the filling/level hole that you mentioned and it starts running out a little, then that would probably be it. There's a pdf repair manual for a manual gearbox (so not really for you) Sachs 50 here: www.icenicam.org.uk/library/Sachs/50_(2-speed)_repair_manual_c1960.pdf You can purchase an automatic repair manual for 18 euros from: www.classicseller.com/i/102610/moped/sachs-saxonette-50-automatic-motor-repair-manual-workshop-manual No guarantee it shows the oil level though! Regards Steve..........
@@SJGPOOLMAN Thanks Steve for your remarkably quick response! It's not 2 speed but in fact the single gear auto clutch type that is featured in one of your excellent videos. Filling to the bottom of the filling hole would obviously mean the whole gearbox full of transmission oil oil if I understand you properly. Is this correct?
Hi Kevin, I'm confused as to what engine you have. You said it was the Sachs 50 - which there is one and what I was referring to - but you say it's the same engine in my video which is the Sachs 502/1A automatic. Anyway, well spotted about the oil level, I was a bit confused. No, you must not fill it until it comes out of the decompression cable access hole. In between the screw cover for the decompression cable and the drain plug, you'll see a flat head screw, that's the one you need to take out and when the oil level gets to that and starts draining out, then that's the correct level. You can fill it through the decompression access hole. Hope that helps Steve............
cylinder is completely gone iside i'm sorry but it is sachs that uses very fine piston tolerances. when i was 11 years old i had a green dkw with the same funny engine and what i stil remember is the torq of that crazy thing and it was because of te good cilinder sealing that sachs made great
Is there any oil in the transmission? When the engine warms up, it suddenly shuts down and does not throw a spark. It then goes when the crank cools down.
Yes there’s automatic oil in the transmission but that won’t affect the spark. Sounds like the points need adjusting. Gap’s possibly too small and closing when it gets hot. Not 100% sure but that’s where I’d start looking.
Hi Noel, it's just standard automatic transmission oil (ATF). I don't think its graded. There's no mention of grade in the handbook. I'm in the UK and just buy ATF in 0.5 ltr bottles from Halfords motor store.
Hi John, only 2 o-rings that I know of and I can only see 2 in the engine schematic picture on myrons mopeds: www.myronsmopeds.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Sachs-502-1.jpg Steve
Hi Pedro, you need to check the diameter of the piston to see if it is the original size 38mm, or if it has an oversized piston. If original, then you can get a 38mm piston with 10mm gudgeon pin (you should check this size is the same as well) from: www.puchshop.de which has plenty of size options. Or just search online for more local availability for you.
Hello, the oil level is achieved by the following method: On the right-hand side of the engine, you have the oil drain plug at the bottom, above that is the level plug, and above that is the plug for access to the decompression cable connection. Once drained, you put oil in via the access point for the decompression access hole and fill until it starts coming out of the level hole. Remember to use automatic gearbox oil. There is no mention of the amount of oil in the repair manual, but its not a lot as it's only a small engine. Its probably only about 200ml
Hi, I have this type of engine for a moped from 1971. Unfortunately, the engine is disassembled. Please have a paper manual that shows the individual components of the engine. And one more question. I have a defective engine cylinder. You can get a new, intact onewhere. I'm from Czech Republic. Thank you
Hello Jiri Hac, you can get a parts manual on CD from victoria-oldtimer.de/webshop/Ersatzteilliste-fuer-Motor-Sachs-502-1A-502-1B-Kopie For complete engine or spare engine parts search "sachs 502" on www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de - there is also a paper copy of the parts manual for sale on there at present - or try Austrian or German Ebay sites.
Hi, I have just bought a 1974 moped with this exact model of engine. I'm doing some light restoration to it but would like someone with some knowledge of how to restore/rebuild the engine to have a look at it. Now looking at your other videos (much hadham bypass) it would suggest you're only down the road from me! Is there anyway maybe I could contact you to discuss a rebuild? Thanks so much.
@@SJGPOOLMAN hi, I'm only in hoddesdon. I managed to buy a carnielli Moto graziella. It has the 502/1a X engine, it starts and runs, just need it seeing to as it will let the rest of the moped down after it's all been sorted.
I always think it's best to assume it's not had the best life and if I can get it cleaned up and running well then I've done my bit for it. Just need someone with more expertise than myself!
@@rhysfowler1425 Hi Rhys, happy to help but can't do anything at moment as I simply don't have the room for another project in my garage at present. Do you have an email I can contact you on?
Hi Pedro, there isn't any engine oil in the engine as it is lubricated by the 2-Stroke oil that you add to the petrol in the fuel tank. Only automatic gearbox oil goes inside which is for lubricating the bearings and clutch plates of the transmission. I use normal, non-synthetic automatic transmission fluid (ATF) from my local motor factor.
@@pedroserra725 sorry, I'm not sure when it comes to oil specifications. I use cheap auto gearbox oil. Remember these are 40-50 year old engines/gearboxes, so any ATF oil, even the cheap ATF oils, are going to be better than oil back when these were new.
I have two Hercules mopeds with this engine, both runs perfectly fine. No speedmonster but reliable and really nice workhorses. Nice to see anyone putting some love towards this little engine ! Keep up the good work!!
Sachs were popular and reliable engines fitted in a few different mopeds.
Hi there. I am struggling to find the transmission fluid level plug on my Sachs 50 Automatic from 1962. The "Saxonette " plate on the engine has 2 screws and comes off revealing a hole in the casting and a view inside the engine. Is the bottom of this hole the level? I can't see anything else to remove! Hope this makes sense and thanks in advance
Hi Kevin, I'm affraid I'm not familiar with the Sachs 50 2 speed auto engine, but both the Sachs 502 and 504 auto gearbox oil levels are to the bottom of the filling hole, so I would imagine your Sachs 50 to be the same. I've seen on one forum a guy in the States saying he can get 3 oil changes out of a quart of ATF oil. Google tells me a quart is almost 950cc of oil, so it's possible there should be around 300cc of auto fluid. If you put around 300cc into what you think might be the filling/level hole that you mentioned and it starts running out a little, then that would probably be it.
There's a pdf repair manual for a manual gearbox (so not really for you) Sachs 50 here: www.icenicam.org.uk/library/Sachs/50_(2-speed)_repair_manual_c1960.pdf
You can purchase an automatic repair manual for 18 euros from: www.classicseller.com/i/102610/moped/sachs-saxonette-50-automatic-motor-repair-manual-workshop-manual
No guarantee it shows the oil level though!
Regards
Steve..........
@@SJGPOOLMAN Thanks Steve for your remarkably quick response! It's not 2 speed but in fact the single gear auto clutch type that is featured in one of your excellent videos.
Filling to the bottom of the filling hole would obviously mean the whole gearbox full of transmission oil oil if I understand you properly. Is this correct?
Hi Kevin, I'm confused as to what engine you have. You said it was the Sachs 50 - which there is one and what I was referring to - but you say it's the same engine in my video which is the Sachs 502/1A automatic. Anyway, well spotted about the oil level, I was a bit confused. No, you must not fill it until it comes out of the decompression cable access hole. In between the screw cover for the decompression cable and the drain plug, you'll see a flat head screw, that's the one you need to take out and when the oil level gets to that and starts draining out, then that's the correct level. You can fill it through the decompression access hole.
Hope that helps
Steve............
@@SJGPOOLMAN Hi Steve. Looks like my replies are being blocked. See if this one gets through!
@@kevinconnolly-i7b Hi Kevin, yes this one got through to me.
cylinder is completely gone iside i'm sorry but it is sachs that uses very fine piston tolerances. when i was 11 years old i had a green dkw with the same funny engine and what i stil remember is the torq of that crazy thing and it was because of te good cilinder sealing that sachs made great
That's a shame about the cylinder. You can still get engine parts for these from mainland Europe. Need to search on internet if you're going to repair
Is there any oil in the transmission? When the engine warms up, it suddenly shuts down and does not throw a spark. It then goes when the crank cools down.
Yes there’s automatic oil in the transmission but that won’t affect the spark. Sounds like the points need adjusting. Gap’s possibly too small and closing when it gets hot. Not 100% sure but that’s where I’d start looking.
What grade transmission oil did you use please?
Hi Noel, it's just standard automatic transmission oil (ATF). I don't think its graded. There's no mention of grade in the handbook. I'm in the UK and just buy ATF in 0.5 ltr bottles from Halfords motor store.
Hello! How many oil seal o-rings have this engine?Thank you
Hi John, only 2 o-rings that I know of and I can only see 2 in the engine schematic picture on myrons mopeds: www.myronsmopeds.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Sachs-502-1.jpg
Steve
Hi John, if you need new seals, you can get them from: victoria-oldtimer.de/webshop/Tafel-1_13_s2
Steve...
hello, i'm from portugal and i would like to know where i could buy a piston for that engine, if you have a link to buy that would be great!
thanks.
Hi Pedro, you need to check the diameter of the piston to see if it is the original size 38mm, or if it has an oversized piston. If original, then you can get a 38mm piston with 10mm gudgeon pin (you should check this size is the same as well) from: www.puchshop.de
which has plenty of size options. Or just search online for more local availability for you.
@@SJGPOOLMAN thank you very much, I will see what is the best option
Hey wie viel Öl hast du in den Motor eingefüllt?
Hello, the oil level is achieved by the following method: On the right-hand side of the engine, you have the oil drain plug at the bottom, above that is the level plug, and above that is the plug for access to the decompression cable connection. Once drained, you put oil in via the access point for the decompression access hole and fill until it starts coming out of the level hole. Remember to use automatic gearbox oil. There is no mention of the amount of oil in the repair manual, but its not a lot as it's only a small engine. Its probably only about 200ml
Hi, it does not use a gasket between the head and cylinder?
Hi, no there is not gasket between the cylinder head and cylinder bore.
Hi, I have this type of engine for a moped from 1971. Unfortunately, the engine is disassembled. Please have a paper manual that shows the individual components of the engine. And one more question. I have a defective engine cylinder. You can get a new, intact onewhere. I'm from Czech Republic. Thank you
Hello Jiri Hac, you can get a parts manual on CD from victoria-oldtimer.de/webshop/Ersatzteilliste-fuer-Motor-Sachs-502-1A-502-1B-Kopie
For complete engine or spare engine parts search "sachs 502" on www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de - there is also a paper copy of the parts manual for sale on there at present - or try Austrian or German Ebay sites.
@@SJGPOOLMAN Thank you
Hi, I have just bought a 1974 moped with this exact model of engine. I'm doing some light restoration to it but would like someone with some knowledge of how to restore/rebuild the engine to have a look at it. Now looking at your other videos (much hadham bypass) it would suggest you're only down the road from me! Is there anyway maybe I could contact you to discuss a rebuild? Thanks so much.
Hi Rhys, I’m in Bishop’s Stortford. Where are you? What model moped is it?
@@SJGPOOLMAN hi, I'm only in hoddesdon. I managed to buy a carnielli Moto graziella. It has the 502/1a X engine, it starts and runs, just need it seeing to as it will let the rest of the moped down after it's all been sorted.
I always think it's best to assume it's not had the best life and if I can get it cleaned up and running well then I've done my bit for it. Just need someone with more expertise than myself!
@@SJGPOOLMAN is there anyway I can get in contact with you? If you are happy to of course!
@@rhysfowler1425 Hi Rhys, happy to help but can't do anything at moment as I simply don't have the room for another project in my garage at present. Do you have an email I can contact you on?
what engine oil did you use? thanks
Hi Pedro, there isn't any engine oil in the engine as it is lubricated by the 2-Stroke oil that you add to the petrol in the fuel tank. Only automatic gearbox oil goes inside which is for lubricating the bearings and clutch plates of the transmission. I use normal, non-synthetic automatic transmission fluid (ATF) from my local motor factor.
@@SJGPOOLMAN what is the specification of valvoline? 85w90 api gl5?
@@pedroserra725 sorry, I'm not sure when it comes to oil specifications. I use cheap auto gearbox oil. Remember these are 40-50 year old engines/gearboxes, so any ATF oil, even the cheap ATF oils, are going to be better than oil back when these were new.