Chapters: 00:00 Intro: The 3 Types of Satire 03:03 Origins of Satire 03:47 Horatian Satire: Light in Tone & Milder Critiques 07:40 Juvenalian Satire: Dark in Tone & Harsher Critiques 11:30 Menippean Satire: Targeting Morals & Beliefs 15:05 Satire Example: 3 Steps for Creating Satire
I love this video! Thanks for sharing it. Question: what is a good book about how film is broken down like this? I’m starting to think through all the subgenres in various categories and would love to know where to learn more about these various forms.
Btw, I didn't get the part about fight club and "tOxIc MasCuLiNiTY" - can some non-toxic, non-binary Poc from Studio Binder explain that to me? :-)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
Another fact about the war room: the table is covered in green felt, like you'd find on a pool or gambling table, emphasizing that the whole thing is either a game or a gamble. Yes, the movie is in black and white. Yes, the audience can't actually see the green felt. Yes, Kubrick specifically requested a green felt table in a movie that he intended to shoot in black and white, knowing full well that the audience would never actually appreciate that little touch. But-the actors knew it was green felt and what it represented.
It would be even funnier if the landmass in the maps are red and black, and the compass is the shape of that roollet wheel thing (idk what it's called) to make it truly look like gambling.
That's actually really interesting, and just the atmosphere of sitting around that table must have naturally put them in the right mindset for the film. Kubrick is a damn genius, man.
Satire is essentially holding up a circus mirror to an issue to illustrate your point. The specific distortion that circus mirror creates can vary, as excellently covered in this video ! Great job once again 💪
You can show a girl get stabbed and kids hung but you have to blur out a middle finger to conform to youtube guidelines... On a video about satire. Brilliant.
So I took a Roman Satire class as part of my masters in Classics, and I happened to watch Borat for the first time that semester. It was honestly wild to see how the tradition has carried on. I would say the one element missing from this analysis is the way in which Satire mocks something, but in doing so turns a mirror on its audience. At first, you laugh at the thing being mocked, but the bigger question is: what does your reaction to the target being ridiculed reveal about you?
It's a shame that 'The Boys' wasn't mentioned in this video. It's probably one of the most relevant satirical shows right now with It's depiction of Capitalism and Celebrity culture
It seems like juvenalian and menippean would have a huge overlap - ridiculing institutions or class structures would quickly become tied up with the ridiculing the attitudes and ideas upholding those structures.
The German version of "I want to hold your hand" isnt really a "cover" since it is actually The Beatles themselves, recording an alternate version for the German speaking market (West Germany, Austria, Switzerland). It might seem strange to us now, but this wasn't too unusual back then
I study an MPhil in Modern Philology and one of my courses on poetry of the XVI century started by explaining the three types of satire, like you guys are doing with movies! It's always a pleasure to watch your videos
I went in the comments to see if anybody else brought this up. It’s definitely the actual Beatles. They learned some of their songs in German since they often had gigs in Hamburg, Germany
This turned out useful to help me clarify how could I do a script that targets the ideas that I want. Before I just wanted to shoot everything but now I think reducing the targets would work better. A menipean satire would work, or maybe It could turn Juvenalian during writing
Truth be told mate, I can't wait to be a filmaker, watching all of your videos really helping me, keep doing your own work,. Who knows, maybe one day a fella can say how did he make that, and his answer will be studio binder
Actually, the Beatles got their breakthrough singing in Germany before they got famous in the UK. That was probably their original song in German. They had a limited repertoire of songs that could be easily translated.
Not the original but it was the Beatles recording, Germany was a big pop market , they found it didn't make them any more money so they only made a few German language records
This makes the alternate reality of the Beatles in the Wolfenstein games make a lot more sense (they were forced to sing in German, Yellow Submarine became Das Blue U-boat)
This is amazingly succinct and the outline for how to get started is a great template for creativity. Also, superb editing and sound in this video. It’s evident that you all love the craft of visual storytelling.
"Every satire needs a target". Strangely, this reminds me of The Wild Ones: "So, what are you against?" Brando: "Whaddya got?" After seeing the movie The Sting in the theatere, my dad asked me what I thought the moral of the movie was. I puzzled over this for a few seconds and replied that I didn't think there was a moral to the story. "Sure there is", my dad replied, "the moral of the story is, 'Crime *does* pay!' "
I remember learning about satire for the first time when I was a kid in a language arts class, and I just remember thinking “oh my gosh this is literally all the stuff I like”
My favorite satire is Irresistible. Unlike other satires, it is VERY mild in it's exaggeration. It's so toned down that it feels like a "based on a true story" movie. Looking back on it, I would describe it as a grounded Horatian satire on the American electoral system
Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't Robocop (1987) a satire even though it wasn't laugh out funny but had humor to it and poked fun of the corporate situation of that era.
Yep, we’d say Robocop falls under a Juvenalian style of satire due to its darker tone, and harsher cirques of corporate greed and government corruption.
@@StudioBinder Yes definitely, sure is. When I first watched Robocop as a 12 year old in 1993 I didn't know what satire was and just thought it was a cool action/thriller with humor but as I grew up and started to understand life more I definitely see it in a whole new light at age 39 and seeing how the it pokes fun at corporate greed and stepping on a colleague just to get ahead in the business and corruption, that's why Robocop was needed to clean up the streets and the people higher up in power, which in the sequels was lacking from the original and made them empty hollow films just to have action for action sake.
So in simpler terms: Horatian satire is when you make fun of your target by pushing things to the absurd (Idiocracy), Juvenalian - is when you criticize the subject by drawing parallels to what happened or is happening in real life, and Menippean - is a mix of mockery and absurd? Tell me if I'm wrong.
Juvenalian is more about the tone, it's designed to make us angry about whatever topic is being addressed. Menippean can be either humorous or dark; the unique feature is what it targets- morals and beliefs
Hello Martin! Nice to see you here! Yes, it's definitely helpful for us younger generations to learn about these kinds of things, as it helps a lot of us to not get easily offended and understand the true intentions of a lot of stories, novels, films, and a lot of series they show to the public nowadays.
Kudos for highlighting "Get Out" but there's a couple of African American themed satire that's either been overlooked or done through sketch comedy 1.The 90's Rap Mockumentary "Fear of a Black Hat" which was a Satire of Gangsta Rap and Hip hop 2. or more in sketch comedy:In Living Color, Chappelle's Show and Key & Peele, consistently,played with the notions of what it means to be "BLACK" but ,love the Video
My favorite kind of satire is the kind from Greek mythology that has horns and goat legs, plays pipes and chases nymphs around. Wait, that's a satyr. I used to get the two confused as a kid! XD
I learned what satire was Senior year of HS, thanks to our Film to Lit Professor Mr. Golden. Very important topic in which an informed populace should always be well versed.
On Northrop Frye's Anatomy of Criticism, he explains that the difference between irony and satire, as genres, is that satire is militant, or political, as it makes clear that there is a legitimate moral code of conduct - which is implied as the normal, or the ethical way of seeing things - to which the narrative contrasts its characters and characterization, in general, against an absurd or ridiculous set of beliefs. Satire is closer to comedy than irony is, because it's the clash of a normative/oppressive society against the hero's society (or system of beliefs).
Here are some more great films that could be relevant: The King of Comedy The Heartbreak Kid (1972) In The Company of Men Modern Romance Citizen Ruth Unfaithfully Yours Election Eating Raoul Catch-22 American Psycho Man Bites Dog The Ruling Class Welcome To The Dollhouse Drop Dead Gorgeous Monsieur Verdoux A New Leaf Kind Hearts and Coronets
Recently had my first watch of Don’t Look Up, would that be more Juvenalian than Horatian? I found the commentaries on our online community and society legitimately hilarious, but couldn’t completely ignore the pain I started to feel while watching it.
You can do satire without exaggerating, almost writing a documentary. There's a perfect example of that, the best TV show ever created - Yes, Prime Minister.
Finally,! A deep documentary that combines all three and fulfills the dream of Mr. Farnsworth that TV will be used to educate the world! Bravo 😜 🐑 7 of 5 💫
I have written a screenplay that is a satire of the film noir genre and the tropes and politics within the genre. It takes place in Los Angeles in 1945. It completely goes against the strict rules of censorship within the genre, the slang, the aftermath of World War II as well as the Golden Age of the film noir genre itself. The characters in my screenplay are parodies of the actors and actresses of this particular genre. This video is awesome and really great. I have learned a lot as far as satire. I hope you can do a video on parody in the future! Thanks!!
@@StudioBinderCool! And maybe it can also contain the camera shots as well as the history, different parody movies and how to visually tell a story with the camera shots and writing.
Huh, clearly CinemaSins either a: never even known what Satire is and is trying to make it seem it they do, or b: is trying (and failing) to be all three types of satire... and I don't know which is worse.
11:30 korean dramas and movies are so often comical AND then extremely dark later on, western audiences would say it’s a tonal whiplash but I wonder if cultural difference is at play here
so many comments "internet killed satire" or "modern world can't have satire as everyone gets offended" - yeah.. it is because people get so easily offended satire can grow.. if anything many of the extremes we see happening in real world are satire that the masses have gobbled up in the need for perpetual offense in search for attention.
Two thoughts: First, Poe's Law. Truth is stranger than fiction, and many satirist have found that their exaggerated material that nobody could possibly take seriously, was not only being taken seriously, but was also much less extreme than real life. Secondly, not all satire is at all comedic. So many people think of satire specifically as a form of comedy, but there's so very much that isn't. Comedy is the sugar that hopefully makes the medicine go down (and helps alleviate Poe's Law... a little... less than you'd think...)
Hi there! Big fan of your content as well as an aspiring filmmaker. Thanks to you, I have a ton of information on how to budget, structure, and produce films. Is there any way you could introduce more information on producing animation? Especially since everyone on the internet tells you only how to animate it all yourself. This is also important because animation budgets can vary widely from simple 2d shorts to lifelike 3d films. Thank you for all of your videos. Everyone here truly appreciates them.
can a film manifest all 3 type of satire? i mean like jojo rabbit the biology class scene seems to be horatian but clearly the gestapo scene is menippean, and the dinner table scene is juvenalian?
Best part of this video is how in explaining the "origin" of satire, you present 30 seconds of Greek names and a single quote as if that's more than fuckall.
I'd rather say Menippean satire is different not in target, but in tone also. Whereas Horatian satire is light, and Juvenalian is dark, Menippean satire is burlesque. All three can make fun of beliefs (The Lobster is a Juvenilian take on the idea that everyone has to have their loved one), human imperfections (Gargantua and Pantagruel by Rabelais is the most famous Menippean satire, and its targets are greed, stupidity and all that kind of bad stuff), structures and personalities (in one of his works, Russian writer Vladimir Sorokin wrote about a slightly altered Soviet Union where everything was the same but everyone also had to eat their daily _norm_, i.e. 200g of feces, and everyone did that because they were afraid to resist. In his later work, set in early 2100s, a Putin's sentient ass appears - it has managed to reach immortality unlike the rest of the body, and it lives in a glass jar (actually, not Putin alone, there are several butts of present-day world leaders). All of this seems like Menippean satire to me). As you may have guessed, I'm from Russia myself, and I'm a literature student. My view of satire might be a little different because Mikhail Bakhtin's ideas are kinda common here. So I'd say Idiocracy is rather Menippean than Horatian. Jojo Rabbit is a perfect example of Menippean satire though.
Satire - Moral Outrage transformed into comic art Examples Horatian - Overtly cometic, light in tone Juvenalian- Make you angry, can be funny but is more dramatic Menippean - Attacks beliefs or moral attitudes (Attacks moral beliefs) What the movie sees as morally bad
As a student of Satire, I love this excellent video! Categories always improve Art, and your delivery is very authentic! It's great to finally have a clear example to point to when I have to explain once again that only some satire targets morals and/or beliefs. Your examples were also very good.
Someone needs to create a satirical movie targeting the unhelpful, pretentious and deliberately exclusionary names for forms of satire. Why use self explanatory terms such as "light hearted satire", "dark satire", "belief focused satire" when you can use the names of ancient greek/roman intellectuals? The feeling of superiority you feel when asked to explain the meaning of those to your less "cultured" colleagues is just exquisite.
Not making a lot of sense, here. Movie clips obfuscate the subject. For example, if you introduce Aristophanes, provide a few quotes. The man was screamingly funny. He was forever attacking Socrates and putting words in his mouth. One of his funniest bits was Socrates' opinion on whether a mosquito made its high-pitched noise with its mouth or its asshole. Of course Socrates never said anything of the kind. That's just one example.
Parasite and some other films mentioned in the video explicitly critique Capitalism and labor exploitation and not just simplified version of it which is "have vs have nots."
' The Greeks trademarked, copyrighted, patented,and have design rights to satire. No civilisation could comprehend irony, or self deprecating humour until the Greeks came along. ' - A western critique on humans, and humour
You know you are kind of right on your protest. The first thought that came to my mind when he first mentioned the origins of satire was " Come on. Could't people before the Greeks or from deferrent cultures understand that kind of satire and express it in their every day life? Of course they could"... But you know the thing is that the first WRITTEN SCRIPTS of satire come from the Greeks. How else could we know what people thousand years ago were thinking except if it was from some written theater plays. And you know, first theater plays were written in Greece and people were studying them for centuries later on. This is a fact. Also two of the names mentioned here are Romans, not Greeks.
amazing essay but.... i was kind of hoping to see something about the main differences between satire and parody in movies. Showing work like the one from Mel Brooks for example
I read in the comments that Juvenalian and Menippean is very similar and I find it the case for satire and Irony. If anyone is reading this , please give a explanation. for Juv& Meni ,satire & irony.
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
Chapters:
00:00 Intro: The 3 Types of Satire
03:03 Origins of Satire
03:47 Horatian Satire: Light in Tone & Milder Critiques
07:40 Juvenalian Satire: Dark in Tone & Harsher Critiques
11:30 Menippean Satire: Targeting Morals & Beliefs
15:05 Satire Example: 3 Steps for Creating Satire
I love this video! Thanks for sharing it. Question: what is a good book about how film is broken down like this? I’m starting to think through all the subgenres in various categories and would love to know where to learn more about these various forms.
Btw, I didn't get the part about fight club and "tOxIc MasCuLiNiTY" - can some non-toxic, non-binary Poc from Studio Binder explain that to me? :-)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
Can you post a Table of Contents for the movie clips?
@@Nic7320 seconded
@@Nic7320 The film titles are on the bottom left of the screen while they are shown.
Another fact about the war room: the table is covered in green felt, like you'd find on a pool or gambling table, emphasizing that the whole thing is either a game or a gamble.
Yes, the movie is in black and white. Yes, the audience can't actually see the green felt. Yes, Kubrick specifically requested a green felt table in a movie that he intended to shoot in black and white, knowing full well that the audience would never actually appreciate that little touch.
But-the actors knew it was green felt and what it represented.
It would be even funnier if the landmass in the maps are red and black, and the compass is the shape of that roollet wheel thing (idk what it's called) to make it truly look like gambling.
@@robbieaulia6462 a roulette wheel!
That's actually really interesting, and just the atmosphere of sitting around that table must have naturally put them in the right mindset for the film. Kubrick is a damn genius, man.
@@BeinIan exactly
That's pretty interesting.
Satire is essentially holding up a circus mirror to an issue to illustrate your point. The specific distortion that circus mirror creates can vary, as excellently covered in this video ! Great job once again 💪
Great description!
Reductio ad absurdum
@@chairwood expelliarmus
@@MidnightAssass1n pls u can't b using spells like that on me. I'm not even a frikin wizard.
“Wow, this is so metaphorical!”
But really, I do like this metaphor
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here, this is the war room!"
Classic line 😂
One of the best jokes in SAO Abridged
Translation: Please make a rampage in peace room.
Ah, yes. I should have known that would... Wait! You get my references?
Why did the narrator repeated the joke like we didn't get it lmao kinda ruined it
You can show a girl get stabbed and kids hung but you have to blur out a middle finger to conform to youtube guidelines... On a video about satire. Brilliant.
We should make a video on the different types of irony 🧐
@@StudioBinder Yes, that will be fun! 👍😏
I felt like the Censoring kind of added to the "American-ness" thought
@@StudioBinder Please do! 😃
@@StudioBinder Wow y'all actually went and made s video on irony!! I'm watching it next!!
So I took a Roman Satire class as part of my masters in Classics, and I happened to watch Borat for the first time that semester. It was honestly wild to see how the tradition has carried on. I would say the one element missing from this analysis is the way in which Satire mocks something, but in doing so turns a mirror on its audience. At first, you laugh at the thing being mocked, but the bigger question is: what does your reaction to the target being ridiculed reveal about you?
Borat was just awful.
@@Jianju69 only if you're the type of person they're making fun of lmao
@@Dragoon710 Right, because there's no reason to dislike a comedy save for feeling picked on. Try again.
@@Jianju69 just bad taste I guess
@@Jianju69 coming from someone with a Beverly hills cop 2 vid on their channel that's very rich.
I didn't think I needed this video but Studiobinder is back at it again
Always will be 👍
It's a shame that 'The Boys' wasn't mentioned in this video. It's probably one of the most relevant satirical shows right now with It's depiction of Capitalism and Celebrity culture
Imo it’s less satire and more a commentary on the issues
@@mannamedthumb pretty sure satire is a form of commentary. Did you not watch the video?
@@mannamedthumb is satire not a form of commentary?
After watching the video I'd be inclined to say it's a Juvenalian Satire, right?
And the superhero genre, which is very popular nowadays. Homelander is the best example of Juvenalian satire of Superman I can think of.
It seems like juvenalian and menippean would have a huge overlap - ridiculing institutions or class structures would quickly become tied up with the ridiculing the attitudes and ideas upholding those structures.
right
Menippean satire generally attacks moral types and attitudes, it doesn't get very personal and specific in its jabs like Juvenal does.
The German version of "I want to hold your hand" isnt really a "cover" since it is actually The Beatles themselves, recording an alternate version for the German speaking market (West Germany, Austria, Switzerland). It might seem strange to us now, but this wasn't too unusual back then
Yep, some guys still do that like Ricky Martin, Shakira and some italian and spanish singers.
Tbf, even the Korean singers do Japanese cover of their songs; cuz it's to reach further demographics
You gotta look for the spanish phonetical version films of Laurel and Hardy...
Came here to say that 🤦♀️
It was the only song they did entirely in a foreign language.
Jojo Rabbit: Nazi satire as a satire of "The Wes Anderson Style."
😂that's a good take
@@knifola4128 Pretty sure OP wasn't talking about the color palette
@@oauwneicustastrokeisyaiwk8368can you explain please
I study an MPhil in Modern Philology and one of my courses on poetry of the XVI century started by explaining the three types of satire, like you guys are doing with movies! It's always a pleasure to watch your videos
Literature and cinema are lifelong companions :)
It all translates to expression, the different forms are merely modes.
Idiocracy isn't a satire, it's a true story told 15 years too early.
Haha. It ages like a fine wine.
Camacho = Trump
@@LuisSierra42 I'd sooner have Camacho
educate the left wow that was such a good one man you really got em
@@_Rick___Grimes_ I'm still crying
13:54 I don't think that's a cover. The Beatles did record German versions of a couple of their early songs.
I went in the comments to see if anybody else brought this up. It’s definitely the actual Beatles. They learned some of their songs in German since they often had gigs in Hamburg, Germany
Finally someone said it
Ok, ok, look, I haven't watched Idiocracy, but the line "so you cared whose ass it was, and why its farting" has convinced me to
Interesting ideas. Every upload all the core ideas you've mentioned before just comes together. Keep informing
ruclips.net/video/LG7g3AYPCrg/видео.html
Will keep informing and entertaining :)
Man I wish there was some Four Lions references in here, one of the best satires.
Also a great option 👌
It's an incredible movie!
Thanks for reminding me this amazing film exists
Need to rewatch it!
This turned out useful to help me clarify how could I do a script that targets the ideas that I want. Before I just wanted to shoot everything but now I think reducing the targets would work better. A menipean satire would work, or maybe It could turn Juvenalian during writing
Having a framework to focus your creativity would help!
Truth be told mate, I can't wait to be a filmaker, watching all of your videos really helping me, keep doing your own work,. Who knows, maybe one day a fella can say how did he make that, and his answer will be studio binder
That would be amazing :)
Actually, the Beatles got their breakthrough singing in Germany before they got famous in the UK. That was probably their original song in German. They had a limited repertoire of songs that could be easily translated.
Not the original but it was the Beatles recording, Germany was a big pop market , they found it didn't make them any more money so they only made a few German language records
This makes the alternate reality of the Beatles in the Wolfenstein games make a lot more sense (they were forced to sing in German, Yellow Submarine became Das Blue U-boat)
I don't understand the categories. The first ones are based on tone, but the last is based on the target
The first two are also specifically about societal conventions as opposed to moral conventions, etc.
I squinted at this too. It means the video author never thought about it too much - just quoted what they read on wikipedia.
This is amazingly succinct and the outline for how to get started is a great template for creativity.
Also, superb editing and sound in this video. It’s evident that you all love the craft of visual storytelling.
We do! And we love getting other people to love it too ❤️
I love satire in all forms. This was such a good explanation of each of one.
"Every satire needs a target". Strangely, this reminds me of The Wild Ones: "So, what are you against?" Brando: "Whaddya got?"
After seeing the movie The Sting in the theatere, my dad asked me what I thought the moral of the movie was. I puzzled over this for a few seconds and replied that I didn't think there was a moral to the story. "Sure there is", my dad replied, "the moral of the story is, 'Crime *does* pay!' "
Sometimes I wonder if Team America failed as a satire, considering the most common usage is unironic jingoism
nah
Even the 'merica people get it, at least a little bit.
I thought it failed as humor, satire, or political commentary. I love a lot of Southpark though.
what do you mean, 'failed as satire' .. I'm not familiar with this phrasing?
Same is true of Borat
I remember learning about satire for the first time when I was a kid in a language arts class, and I just remember thinking “oh my gosh this is literally all the stuff I like”
My favorite satire is Irresistible. Unlike other satires, it is VERY mild in it's exaggeration. It's so toned down that it feels like a "based on a true story" movie. Looking back on it, I would describe it as a grounded Horatian satire on the American electoral system
I absolutely love tropic thunder, and believe many people miss the very obvious satire. Thanks for including it.
This is one of the best narrators I've heard on RUclips!
Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't Robocop (1987) a satire even though it wasn't laugh out funny but had humor to it and poked fun of the corporate situation of that era.
Yep, we’d say Robocop falls under a Juvenalian style of satire due to its darker tone, and harsher cirques of corporate greed and government corruption.
@@StudioBinder Yes definitely, sure is. When I first watched Robocop as a 12 year old in 1993 I didn't know what satire was and just thought it was a cool action/thriller with humor but as I grew up and started to understand life more I definitely see it in a whole new light at age 39 and seeing how the it pokes fun at corporate greed and stepping on a colleague just to get ahead in the business and corruption, that's why Robocop was needed to clean up the streets and the people higher up in power, which in the sequels was lacking from the original and made them empty hollow films just to have action for action sake.
@@StudioBinder , what about Judge Dredd? Satire or just plain over the top stupidity?
So in simpler terms: Horatian satire is when you make fun of your target by pushing things to the absurd (Idiocracy), Juvenalian - is when you criticize the subject by drawing parallels to what happened or is happening in real life, and Menippean - is a mix of mockery and absurd? Tell me if I'm wrong.
Juvenalian is more about the tone, it's designed to make us angry about whatever topic is being addressed. Menippean can be either humorous or dark; the unique feature is what it targets- morals and beliefs
As a literature student, i know all these but understanding along with movie references is so awesome 👏😊, keep the good work Sir
Brilliant and valuable reminder to our new generations. Thank you.
Hello Martin! Nice to see you here! Yes, it's definitely helpful for us younger generations to learn about these kinds of things, as it helps a lot of us to not get easily offended and understand the true intentions of a lot of stories, novels, films, and a lot of series they show to the public nowadays.
I wish there were references to Robert Altman's works. My favorite of his is 'The Player'.
Altman's works are always classics 💯
I waited too long to watch Nashville, because I didn’t know is it was a subtle satire. Then it clicked.
This channel is worth it's weight in college film school fees. I love this channel more than I love some people in my own family.
Kudos for highlighting "Get Out" but there's a couple of African American themed satire that's either been overlooked or done through sketch comedy
1.The 90's Rap Mockumentary "Fear of a Black Hat" which was a Satire of Gangsta Rap and Hip hop
2. or more in sketch comedy:In Living Color, Chappelle's Show and Key & Peele, consistently,played with the notions of what it means to be "BLACK" but ,love the Video
My favorite kind of satire is the kind from Greek mythology that has horns and goat legs, plays pipes and chases nymphs around. Wait, that's a satyr. I used to get the two confused as a kid! XD
I learned what satire was Senior year of HS, thanks to our Film to Lit Professor Mr. Golden. Very important topic in which an informed populace should always be well versed.
On Northrop Frye's Anatomy of Criticism, he explains that the difference between irony and satire, as genres, is that satire is militant, or political, as it makes clear that there is a legitimate moral code of conduct - which is implied as the normal, or the ethical way of seeing things - to which the narrative contrasts its characters and characterization, in general, against an absurd or ridiculous set of beliefs. Satire is closer to comedy than irony is, because it's the clash of a normative/oppressive society against the hero's society (or system of beliefs).
Here are some more great films that could be relevant:
The King of Comedy
The Heartbreak Kid (1972)
In The Company of Men
Modern Romance
Citizen Ruth
Unfaithfully Yours
Election
Eating Raoul
Catch-22
American Psycho
Man Bites Dog
The Ruling Class
Welcome To The Dollhouse
Drop Dead Gorgeous
Monsieur Verdoux
A New Leaf
Kind Hearts and Coronets
Great list!
There’s so much Mike Judge here, and I love it!!!
Can always use some Mike Judge!
@@StudioBinder yeaahhh...if we could have more mike judge, that'd be great...
Best narrator voice of all time.
man I haven't started watching and already I know this is good.
We won't disappoint!
@@StudioBinder You have disappointed.
Recently had my first watch of Don’t Look Up, would that be more Juvenalian than Horatian?
I found the commentaries on our online community and society legitimately hilarious, but couldn’t completely ignore the pain I started to feel while watching it.
It's full blown Juvenilian. I barely laughed when I watched it. To me, it was so painful it was hard to watch.
@@kel5037which is why I haven't watched it...I'm just going to get depressed
You can do satire without exaggerating, almost writing a documentary. There's a perfect example of that, the best TV show ever created - Yes, Prime Minister.
I recognize your choice selection of clips and I approve!
Finally,! A deep documentary that combines all three and fulfills the dream of Mr. Farnsworth that TV will be used to educate the world! Bravo 😜
🐑 7 of 5 💫
I have written a screenplay that is a satire of the film noir genre and the tropes and politics within the genre. It takes place in Los Angeles in 1945. It completely goes against the strict rules of censorship within the genre, the slang, the aftermath of World War II as well as the Golden Age of the film noir genre itself. The characters in my screenplay are parodies of the actors and actresses of this particular genre. This video is awesome and really great. I have learned a lot as far as satire. I hope you can do a video on parody in the future! Thanks!!
Parody, not a bad idea!
@@StudioBinderCool! And maybe it can also contain the camera shots as well as the history, different parody movies and how to visually tell a story with the camera shots and writing.
A satirical take on the film noir genre itself?! 😀 I would love to read excerpts if available 🌟 In any case, I sincerely hope it gets picked up 😊
@@StudioBinder Oh, by the way...the screenplay is Horatian! LOL.
Huh, clearly CinemaSins either a: never even known what Satire is and is trying to make it seem it they do, or b: is trying (and failing) to be all three types of satire... and I don't know which is worse.
or c: they’ve descended through too many layers of irony, and the truth is unrecognizable now
@@richardgibson8403 that works too
@@Droidsbane
Cinemasins never really was satire though I think that was just something fans said
@@mikemorro140 and yet they decided to run along with it as a convenient excuse
@@Droidsbane
I don't think so I've seen more fans and detractors call it satire than they do
7:40 South Park perfectly fits the description of Juvenilian satire.
That ending touched me...
Important stuff 👌
11:30 korean dramas and movies are so often comical AND then extremely dark later on, western audiences would say it’s a tonal whiplash but I wonder if cultural difference is at play here
i just found this series, and im enjoying it, nice work guys...............
Excellent, loved this video!!!
I actually make comedy skits pretty often so this is extremely useful
Glad it could help with your art 😉
so many comments "internet killed satire" or "modern world can't have satire as everyone gets offended" - yeah.. it is because people get so easily offended satire can grow.. if anything many of the extremes we see happening in real world are satire that the masses have gobbled up in the need for perpetual offense in search for attention.
Two thoughts:
First, Poe's Law. Truth is stranger than fiction, and many satirist have found that their exaggerated material that nobody could possibly take seriously, was not only being taken seriously, but was also much less extreme than real life.
Secondly, not all satire is at all comedic. So many people think of satire specifically as a form of comedy, but there's so very much that isn't. Comedy is the sugar that hopefully makes the medicine go down (and helps alleviate Poe's Law... a little... less than you'd think...)
Hi there! Big fan of your content as well as an aspiring filmmaker. Thanks to you, I have a ton of information on how to budget, structure, and produce films. Is there any way you could introduce more information on producing animation? Especially since everyone on the internet tells you only how to animate it all yourself. This is also important because animation budgets can vary widely from simple 2d shorts to lifelike 3d films. Thank you for all of your videos. Everyone here truly appreciates them.
We might! Thanks for the suggestion :)
can a film manifest all 3 type of satire? i mean like jojo rabbit the biology class scene seems to be horatian but clearly the gestapo scene is menippean, and the dinner table scene is juvenalian?
Brilliant!
a film can certainly show elements of all three; they just usually focus on one type
Gonna have to watch all of these movies again. Such great examples.
The voice is so soothing...
Jojo rabbit is one of my favorite films I wish there was more like it . If anyone has recommendations pls
One of the best of 2019!
Have you see Death of Stalin? It's brilliant
Satire is meant to mock those in power. To mock those without power is not satire, it's bullying.
(Terry Pratchett)
Best part of this video is how in explaining the "origin" of satire, you present 30 seconds of Greek names and a single quote as if that's more than fuckall.
Great video! I'd counter however that the target of Idiocracy is not politics, but rather Capitalism and Populism.
Never knew there were different kinds, ive googled it before and got nothing, so this video is cool! I've always been a fan of Menippean Satire
I’ve been trying to learn the specific types of satirical representation
This helped
Your profile picture is from one of those chinese cartoons for peeDoeFiles
I'd rather say Menippean satire is different not in target, but in tone also. Whereas Horatian satire is light, and Juvenalian is dark, Menippean satire is burlesque. All three can make fun of beliefs (The Lobster is a Juvenilian take on the idea that everyone has to have their loved one), human imperfections (Gargantua and Pantagruel by Rabelais is the most famous Menippean satire, and its targets are greed, stupidity and all that kind of bad stuff), structures and personalities (in one of his works, Russian writer Vladimir Sorokin wrote about a slightly altered Soviet Union where everything was the same but everyone also had to eat their daily _norm_, i.e. 200g of feces, and everyone did that because they were afraid to resist. In his later work, set in early 2100s, a Putin's sentient ass appears - it has managed to reach immortality unlike the rest of the body, and it lives in a glass jar (actually, not Putin alone, there are several butts of present-day world leaders). All of this seems like Menippean satire to me).
As you may have guessed, I'm from Russia myself, and I'm a literature student. My view of satire might be a little different because Mikhail Bakhtin's ideas are kinda common here.
So I'd say Idiocracy is rather Menippean than Horatian. Jojo Rabbit is a perfect example of Menippean satire though.
Satire - Moral Outrage transformed into comic art
Examples
Horatian - Overtly cometic, light in tone
Juvenalian- Make you angry, can be funny but is more dramatic
Menippean - Attacks beliefs or moral attitudes (Attacks moral beliefs) What the movie sees as morally bad
I love that first soundtrack. Last scene got me rolling.
Thanks for all the movie recommendations!
As a student of Satire, I love this excellent video! Categories always improve Art, and your delivery is very authentic! It's great to finally have a clear example to point to when I have to explain once again that only some satire targets morals and/or beliefs. Your examples were also very good.
You took degree in Satire? Boi, if that wasn't a satire, i would think that you wasted your life's resources into a useless lesson
Came up in my recommended today. You sir have a new subscriber.
Absolute bunch 'a geniuses ❤️
Just well informed cinephiles ;)
Thank you for the amazing video!!!
Someone needs to create a satirical movie targeting the unhelpful, pretentious and deliberately exclusionary names for forms of satire. Why use self explanatory terms such as "light hearted satire", "dark satire", "belief focused satire" when you can use the names of ancient greek/roman intellectuals? The feeling of superiority you feel when asked to explain the meaning of those to your less "cultured" colleagues is just exquisite.
"no fighting in the war room." Stanley Kubrick is the best...haha
I've never heard of Idiocracy but I need to watch it now.
Nice timing with the Fight Club shot ; )
I have previously watched some of these movies but didn't get the nuances.
Now I got it... Great explanation and what an edit! 👏👏👏
Not making a lot of sense, here. Movie clips obfuscate the subject.
For example, if you introduce Aristophanes, provide a few quotes. The man was screamingly funny. He was forever attacking Socrates and putting words in his mouth. One of his funniest bits was Socrates' opinion on whether a mosquito made its high-pitched noise with its mouth or its asshole. Of course Socrates never said anything of the kind.
That's just one example.
At 6:58, that laugh by the narrator *[chef’s kiss]*
People on twitter reeeeeeally need to watch this.
twitter pretty much is satire, one that works too well and people actually believe it to be true
@@StickySauce101 God I wish
Surprised not to see Bulworth in here. Or Blazing Saddles!
I feel like “Don’t Look Up’ is a mix of Horation and Juvenalian. Is that possible or am I just wrong?
Parasite and some other films mentioned in the video explicitly critique Capitalism and labor exploitation and not just simplified version of it which is "have vs have nots."
Capitalism plays a role, but Bong Joon-Ho has always been interested in class inequality and Parasite focuses primarily on it
' The Greeks trademarked, copyrighted, patented,and have design rights to satire.
No civilisation could comprehend irony, or self deprecating humour until the Greeks came along. '
- A western critique on humans, and humour
🤣🤣🤣
You know you are kind of right on your protest. The first thought that came to my mind when he first mentioned the origins of satire was " Come on. Could't people before the Greeks or from deferrent cultures understand that kind of satire and express it in their every day life? Of course they could"...
But you know the thing is that the first WRITTEN SCRIPTS of satire come from the Greeks. How else could we know what people thousand years ago were thinking except if it was from some written theater plays. And you know, first theater plays were written in Greece and people were studying them for centuries later on. This is a fact.
Also two of the names mentioned here are Romans, not Greeks.
amazing essay but.... i was kind of hoping to see something about the main differences between satire and parody in movies. Showing work like the one from Mel Brooks for example
Sir on the grave voice, I miss your amazing voice 😍 good hear you again
This narrator is amazing!
that tropic thunder scene will never stop being funny to me
Thanks for this video ❤️
Thanks for watching!
Aristophanes is honestly amazing. Why do we read Shakespeare and not Aristophanes?!?
Best RUclips Channel !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
🥺😍
This narrator is amazing
14:45. I Finally found the source of the houses with eyes.
StudioBinder is just amazing
I read in the comments that Juvenalian and Menippean is very similar and I find it the case for satire and Irony. If anyone is reading this , please give a explanation. for Juv& Meni ,satire & irony.
Never had a movie take me from laughing to crying like Jojo Rabbit
11/10 video I absolutely Love this video it explained so much to me
Great vid for a stumble onto your channel.