This episode didn't land for me | The Acolyte: Destiny Review
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- Опубликовано: 10 июн 2024
- The acolyte episode 1 and 2 (Lost/ Found and Revenge / Justice) are out, and I have some thoughts!
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I'm really not looking forward to the inevitable reveal that Sol lied to Osha. Sol is quickly becoming one of my favorite jedi in star wars and i just know there's no way he doesn't know what really happened.
After the scene with Torbin, this episode definitely paints the Jedi in a different light
Same thoughts on the episode as yours, I have to admit even if it was The Jedi kill the witches the witches themselves aren't innocent yes compared to them something like The Path of Open Hand they aren't that extreme but still the environment for the twins especially Osha isn't healthy either?
It felt like a story that could've been told in a lot less time and then focused back on the main plot. It wasn't awful but it was not anything special either. The cultist group of witches was interesting but beyond that it did little to actually tell us anything new.
I actually loved this episode. Clearly there are four different versions of the events based on perspective: osha, Mae, sol/jedi, and the truth. I am going to go to speculation mode here about what actually could have happened on Brendoc.
Keep in mind that the show seems to be Rashomon-esque. I think we need explanations for why:
- The Jedi feel guilt and sorrow for what happened on brendoc.
- Why mae thinks the Jedi were responsible for the destruction of her coven.
- Why osha thinks mae was the one responsible for what happened.
I think Episode 3 is OSHA’s perspective. The episode had gaps in continuity, and feels like it’s tailored towards explaining osha’s recollection of events. Now we know that there are more flashback scenes in the trailer! Scenes where the Jedi fight among themselves.
**My bet is that aniseya tells mae and korril to escape brendoc and set up shop elsewhere.**
The witches likely value keeping their knowledge private, and wouldn’t want osha to go with the Jedi. Therefore I think the coven decide to kill osha and commit suicide themselves by ingesting bunta. The way aniseya hugs osha in sorrow and says THE COVEN NEEDS TO DECIDE, tells me this could be a possibility.
The Jedi probably confront korril and mae during the escape, since they’re surveilling the location. They fend off korril while being the target of her magic. This explains why they were fighting each other. Mae probably will attempt to set fire to the coven’s home- to prevent the Jedi from saving osha or getting their hands on other belongings. The Jedi prevail over korril, but find the mass grave while trying to rescue osha. They probably imprinted a false memory in osha to make her think the witches haven’t killed themselves (but rather Mae did it), as that would be their fault. The Jedi probably knew osha is primed to believe this lie. This would likely explain their guilt. Had they not insisted that they take the children, none of this would have ever happened.
I think in the end, sol and indara probably tell themselves that it was good that the coven got destroyed, due to their unnatural practices as a way to cope about what happened and how they were uniquely responsible for something so tragic. Clearly torben and kelnacca weren’t able to get over what happened, and sol/indara are hanging by the thread of that justification. It’s kind of poetic that torben readily took the bunta btw.
Now, I feel other flashback sequences would flesh out the perspectives of the Jedi and Mae. Maybe the Sith Lord will end up being responsible for corrupting korril and mae? Surely Mae needed someone’s help in escaping from the burning fortress. Was the Sith Lord already in contact with aniseya? Did he have a proposal of his own? Only the next episodes will answer these questions, and therefore I’m very excited.
I overall agree with that, howeveer my problem with it mostly comes from the fact that I feel like Osha's perspective was the one we had pretty well fleshed out in the first two episodes. We klnow how she felt about Mae's involvement, the Jedi's, etc so it was largely showing the things we'd already been told. We know her perspective is incomplete, but the hints that that is the case are fundamentally the same ones we had in this episode. To me it felt like they did a good job establishing these things, including that Osha's perspective *was* incomplete, in episodes 1&2, so having the episode right after that be reconfirming those same elements was a bit much.
@@CoreysDatapad maybe we’re going to see a whole lot of flashback sequences in latter part of the acolyte story. The brendoc incident is clearly very important to the plot, with how both the Jedi and the sith are entangled with these witches. But yeah I do agree, maybe they should have majorly cut back on the exposition heavy dialogues because this whole aspect of the story did get repetitive.
I think the events shown would have done better interspersed with the story, rather than dumped out in one go.
I actually enjoyed this episode, as well. But my main concern is pacing. So often, Disney's shows move at a pace like they're going to be 15 episodes, each 45-50 minutes long. Instead, we generally get about 8, and at least one or two are closer to 30-40 minutes long. So much feels left unfulfilled and/or wasted, as a result.
I also agree with the sentiments that this episode represents basically just Osha's perspective, which means we're likely going to spend MORE time on these events, which will further exacerbate the above problem.
Story-wise, Disney has been repeatedly writing checks their durations can't cash.
@@altasilvapuer i wonder why they didnt learn anything with andor’s success. I mean here’s a show with no face VFX, the force, Jedi or the sith, no legacy characters and still was well received by the fanbase and critics alike. I dont think all shows need to have 60 min episodes with 12-16 episode long seasons, but more runtime could definitely help these characters breathe and let the audience connect with them. I mean did they really need to have Mae kill 2 Jedi masters in the first two episodes? Sol was immediately on her trail by the end of episode 2. I guess when character motivations are part of the mystery you’re trying to solve, character growth takes a back seat. In that case, why not just do a single movie? I dunno..
I do like that Osha wants to be independent, and that the strand of fate that the Mother talks about goes both ways.
Also yeah, Sol is carrying the performances, but I REALLY enjoyed the actress of the Mother as well.
I liked it because the stuff about how Mae and Osha were created feels like it could be a setup or the reason Plagueis was so fascinated with creating life. Hearing about it from his master.
Totally agree with your Torbyn take. I wish I felt more confident that the showrunners will stick the landing but that hasn't been the norm these last few years.
Oooo that’s a great theory about this peaking plagueis’a interest
You really think they are that knowledgeable about star wars? They have an actor on this show that thinks Anakin blew up the death star
@@sauriel2014do you think the actors write the show…?
@@sauriel2014 Harrison Ford didn't really gave a damn about the story and no one complained. But somehow we draw the line on new actors not knowing the story? It's a simple mistake; one that can be corrected as easily as a toddler's math question. Just let them be...
If I remember non of the writers haver ever seen Star Wars. That's why they were hired.
I also watched Theory's....reaction to this episode. While I agree with some of the stuff he said, I don't think it was _that_ terrible. To me, I agree with you more. It was more underwhelming than anything. I don't think we needed a full episode to show the differences in Mae and Osha or to build up to the fire.
Oh boy what did Theory say?
@@Flint_Inferno TLDR- He called it a "Leslye Headland therapy session" and basically said nothing (the Witches, the Jedi, etc) was consistent with George's vision, and the writers "don't understand Star Wars."
Theory doesn't like anything that doesn't have Vader in it.
I really liked the little butterfly things in the beginning of the episode, they remind me a lot of sea angels.
I feel like this is the problem with both current social media norms of needing to anylize the crap out of everything, which definitely isnt your fault its the game you have to play on youtube, and disney doing the netflix 8 episode format without releasing it all on the same day.
We'll probably get answers to these questions but itll probably be rushed considering there's not enough time to give everything decent screen time. That's i miss the old 24 episode seasons of network shows. Yes there was a lot of filler crap but there was also time to let things show naturally and not try cram it all into 4-8 hours
I think potentially this will link to Plagueis at some point and even maybe explain how Anakin was created.
This episode was kind of weird, but I agree with you completely Corey. I think it could’ve been done a lot better, but maybe they’re hiding stuff for future twists, but those twists are the primary interest of the story, and I wish that part was coming faster.
After the fire, on their ship, Torbyn is seen in the background, a little blurry but I'm pretty sure his scar is there. Which suggests to me that there was in fact some sort of fight which happened.
Anyway, yeah I find it unfortunate that this episode felt redundant. This feels like something whih they could have done in bits and pieces over 2 or 3 episodes, like the childhood flashbacks in Andor. But that's just how I feel.
I saw that too, he definitely had the scar
You also assumed the fire killed everyone. Do we know that or is that a red herring?
No, I said we're *supposed* to assume that at this point but that there definitely are other things at play.
They weren't burnt like at all. I'm sure it was something else
Interestingly, this was actually my favourite episode thus far. I guess I can see why you felt like we didn't get anything out of it, but for me actually seeing everything and especially Mae and Osha's dynamic really helped me understand it. I guess also part of that is because I also felt like with the Rashomon influences we were getting cases of unreliable narrator, so to see most of what actually happened (at least, from Osha's POV) is well yeah. I also find the moral ambiguity quite interesting and refreshing
I didn't think about it until you brought it up but yeah, I largely agree with your take. I think they could've interspliced the flashback with some present scenes. I'm a little worried about the pacing of the series. Hopefully things start to piece together more next episode but we're almost halfway through the series.
There's also clearly an unreliable narrator aspect with this episode since this is mainly from Osha's perspective. Some things aren't adding up, but I expect that with a mystery series like this.
I will say that I love the additions to lore about the Force (especially with the explanation of the Thread) and theory crafting for this series has been a lot of fun so far!
This one didn’t bother us.
I think this episode should have been split between 6 to 7 parts, and this parts being the first 10 minutes of every episode. Lets us, the audience, experience this flashback in portions, not all at once.
This looks like something what Netflix would do with a series that releases all it's episodes in one day.
We didn't see it all at once the flashbacks aren't done.
What I didn’t like was how they didn’t distinguish whether this was a pov (probably Osha’s) or not, nor why this was important when it’s not really showing us much that we either didn’t already or couldn’t have gleamed. And unless I missed something, the whole episode was spent solely on this.
What I had been hoping for was small glimpses of what happened from different POV’s and nobodies being fully true, except from a point of view. That these Jedi were from different sects and that this was a setup by either a Sith or a Night Sister (as opposed to a regular Witch who are normally more ambiguously aligned, leaning lightside).
This is definitely Osha's perspective because they did not show Mae's perspective. It'll probably be episode 5 when we see Mae's perspective and what the Jedi did.
@@mightheal I hope so. But I also hope that they don’t take up another episode for the other’s accounts. I assume that it will be at least Mae and Master Sol’a pov.
Or maybe this will be a Harry Potter situation where Sol is the bad guy while the Darkside master was the misunderstood good guy in this. lol
the one that bothers me the most is, that in theory anakins birth is not that big of a mistery anymore. When 2 mothers can impregnate each other somehow, can they like impregnate randoms?? is shmi one of them that escaped and hid ??? I always thought, that anakin is like one made by the force with no influence to bring balance and that is kinda ruined for me, because it could now happen on a regular basis. .-.
Well. They wanted gay characters. And they wanted them to be the parents of the main protagonists. Unless they are going adoption they had to find SOME way for them to have children. I don't think a silly little thing such as the chosen one prophecy or "conceived by the force" being very special was going to get in the way of that
oh mein got, lesbians are dark siders, i friggin knew it
In my opinion this should have been the first episode
yeah I actually agree almost entirely. I dont think the story was bad or anything, but the whole presentation felt pretty underwhelming
Yeah, nothing new here and nothing had the impact it should have had. Short of the jedi directly murdering the covenant and burning everything down I don't see why Korbin would possibly have killed himself either
Its backstory. It’s not filler. Its core content
I never said it was filler. The problem I was describing wasn't that none of this was important or something, it's that we're getting a perspective the first two episodes already did a good job of outlining. Osha's perspective on the fire, Mae, and the Jedi's role were what we primarily got in episodes 1&2, so all the elements we learn about her character's perspective (and the hints that it's incomplete) are the same ones we learned in those first two episodes.
@@CoreysDatapad this feels like a setup episode and Jedis being bad is going To drop
Theory pretty much tore into this episode
Theory tears into basically everything.
It will not get better from here. We saw the opening, with is normally the pull.
I actually like this one more than the last two because it was a slow burn and it didn’t feel like we were racing at 1000 miles per hour. And I liked that neither side was good. I still don’t like Mae, but seeing her go full Micheal myers psycho child was fun.
This just screamed that they don’t know how the lore works, and it doesn’t upset me just, depresses me
Get ready to be finger wagged at...
Horrible! 2 insufferable brats! And I liked the 2 first episodes! There's something interesting about the force witches against the Jedi - but not this time. Extremely boring.
Honestly. This wouldn’t have saved the episode. But the whole lesbians create two kids. It could have been solved if they just created a whole new alien species where it’s only female but they can still procreate. Like the Asari from mass effect. Just a solution. But shows writers today are so ignorant they can’t even come up with a concept as good as the Asari.
This episode was pretty bad on all fronts. A lot of bad child acting, and that is hard to watch. Weak dialogue, weak general dynamics, its just an awful 40 minutes. The Jedi seem exceptionally creepy and sketchy.
The witches vs Jedi trope is becoming a bit overused, we’ve had it with TCW, we’ve had it with Ahsoka. What are the chances that they were a clan that was exiled from Dathomir?
I found the episode to be rather bland overall that I just couldn’t invest myself emotionally. Which is a shame because of how positive I found the first two episodes. I will of course continue to watch the series but I’m less excited about waiting for the next episode.
I think it's pretty simple. Disney has a hard time making original star wars content now so they stick to shadows of what was popular. Here was their thinking on the witches "People loved the dathomiri witches! More witches!" Same with the twins one light and one dark. A sad shadow of Jacen and Jaina.
Terrible story, acting and cinematography in this one. Way worse then opening episodes. What was the purpose of this episode even? It can't be truth as nobody would come up with something so dumb and you can spill the beans in episode three. Is it was just Osha's pov, why spend 40 minutes on it. Cutting it down would save us from much dumb dialog. And what last week teaser with Wookie had to do with this episode?
Ha! No, the 3rd episode didn't ruin anything. That was an overreaction, to say the least. To say that this show can ruin cannon or destroy what has been established through cinema over the last 47 years is to give this show way too much credit and power than its due.
**SPOILERS**
So, there were several things worthy of discussion. Here are my thoughts..
1. There are a lot of gaps in the plot of this episode. Was that purposeful or are we - again - left to be 'told' (instead of shown) what happened later?
2. We get to see the Witches perform a full on ritual. It's entirely a flashback episode explaining the bad thing that happened to Mae and Osha and their village 16 years ago. The Witches are not presented as Dark side users or anything pertaining to the Dark side, which is a bit different from the EU, the Ahsoka show, and books or how we have been led in the past about the Night Sisters and how they interpret the Force. They are presented simply as a harmless village, but a village that shuns everything outside of that village. But they clearly have certain ideas about the Jedi, as the Jedi do them.
3. The four Jedi are clearly on the 'path' of Osha & Mae, somehow knowing about them even though they are part of an inclusive tribe that shuns outsiders. Indara, Sol, Tobin and Kelnacca are naturally the four Jedi, and they basically walk right in on the Witches as they are performing their own version of the Catholic Confirmation ritual on Osha and Mae. Osha, like A.J. Soprano before her, doesn't want to go through Confirmation. She wants to become a Jedi, and the witches surprisingly make the mature decision to let both Mae and Osha go with the Jedi to be tested by them without a fight. But their 'test' isn't like the one that Anakin got in The Phantom Menace - this test is more just to see what their willingness level is to go with them, and they realize that one isn't willing while the other, Osha, is willing. And she says it so much herself several times within the episode. I didn't like the dialogue between the Jedi and the witches when the Jedi interrupted their ceremony - I felt that it painted the Jedi as heretical, since they clearly do train children themselves. Perhaps the best line during that whole interaction was when Indara said "With your permission, of course" to the Mother Witch. Other than that, I probably would have rewritten or jettisoned that dialogue or reworked that entire encounter altogether.
4. Tobin is the only one of the four Jedi whose eyes are turned to dark by the Mother Witch. Does this have something to do with why he went to meditate for 10 out of the next 16 years and freely committed suicide? Maybe this will be explained more in forthcoming episodes. *Maybe*
5. Immaculate conception. We are given the hint that Osha & Mae were immaculately conceived by, perhaps, the Force? I don’t really have a problem with this. This doesn’t undermine Anakin Skywalker and him being the Chosen One. Perhaps this type of Witch magic was performed regularly, and it took Darth Plagueis to put two and two together to take this ritual and ‘perfect’ it with his midichlorian manipulation techniques to bring about Anakin Skywalker. Perhaps that whole coven was produced this way, since there are no men? We do know that Palpatine and Plagueis had some association with the Night Sisters or Witches, since that’s how Palpatine found Maul, per the EU. If immaculate conception was something that the Night Sisters or witches did regularly, then I don’t see that as a negative or undermining the Star Wars or Skywalker story. Anakin is the Chosen One because of what he did, not because of how he was conceived.
6. Mae doesn’t like Osha’s decision and decides to use Witch magic to destroy the village by fire. The rest of the witches are somehow dead without a scratch, Mae seems to have fallen down off a cliff, but Sol appears out of nowhere and saves Osha from falling off the cliff, and takes her back to Coruscant. Perhaps the clan died from Oxygen deprivation, and that’s why we see Osha getting Oxygen on her way to Coruscant? If so, then why do we see fire, since fire needs Oxygen too (to burn)? This isn’t explained very well. Anyway, Mae also survives. I presume that this is why Mae is so angry and has a vendetta against the four Jedi - that they intruded on her (and Osha’s) Confirmation ceremony and stole Osha. Although that is interesting, it doesn’t explain why she knew to give poison to Tobin, and why Tobin freely drank it.
Overall, it's an interesting episode, but it falls well short of 'destroying cannon' or changing Star Wars forever.
This trash augered in on episode one.
Just accept that’s it’s a bad show and won’t get better