My Pass was Suspended by Whistler [VAIL] for 30 Days onecutmedia
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 18 фев 2023
- My Pass was Suspended by Whistler [VAIL] for 30 Days
5:32 email from Seamus Frew Patrol Manager WhistlerBlackcomb
On Feb 7th 2023 I received an e-mail from the Patrol Manager at WhistlerBlackcomb informing me that my ski pass has been SUSPENDED for 30 days for skiing in a permanent closed area on Blackcomb.
No signs were seen or passed in this area! NO SIGNS NO SIGNS plus it was from a video. WHAT!!!!!
He also said the video was from Feb 2, I never posted anything on that date!
As I sit at home stewing about this a video's keep popping up from people in the same zone, I really don't know what to think? Just scratching my head.
I had to watch a VAIL safety video before my pass will be reinstated on March 8th 2023
watch it here
Slope Safety Class: vimeo.com/476456607
password: PlayItSafe2021
My Googles
Use code ONECUTMEDIA10
outdoormaster.com/products/ul...
Camera Insta360 get yours here
OneX2
www.insta360.com/sal/one_x2?i...
the NEW X3
www.insta360.com/sal/x3?insrc...
Skis:
www.urbanalpine.com/
Stanley Products:
alnk.to/4MxTkgC
This winter the photo sessions are back and filling up!
Book your shots soon, days are filling up,
Please e-mail me rick@onecutmedia.com
Subscribe Here: / onecutmedia. .
Hope you enjoy!
Please subscribe, like and share!
/ onecutmedia
CONNECT WITH ME ONLINE
Instagram - / rick_meloff.. .
Facebook - / . .
#vailjail #onecutmedia #whistlerblackcomb
#ski #insta360onex2 #insta360 #powderskiing
#whistler #shorts #skiing #whistler #insta360onex2
#2022 #outdoormaster #groomers #powderski #360 #360video
#skireview #sickday #blackcrows #sharkweek #thrillseekers #creeskside
#paralympics #downhill #downhillskiing 
Спорт
Alpental
Operations guy here who also skis in an area with lots of off-piste and permanently closed terrain. This is really bad policy from Vail. Ignoring these guys from the conversation as its ultimately inconsequential. This is largely bad policy by Whistler patrol and will fail in 2 big ways. Frankly I am surprised by this from such a large operations.
A) Cutting their pass does not deter the next guy. Word of mouth gathers, people are clever explorers and will find perma closed zones whether they are aware of it or not. Mountain setup is a very large task for a big hill but particularly important for permanently closed zones. It is extremely important to setup the hill ropping off and adding signs where necessary. Side note, cliff signs are not closure signs and for some "cliff" signs indicate added challenge or feature they might be interested in. A "cliff" sign will not likely hold up in court as a closure.
B) Cutting the pass of rando skier does not indemnify the responsibility of the resort for other injured parties, especially in a negligence case for failing to properly setup the hill. For example if a zone is perma closed due to downhill avalanche risk, skier triggers avalanche and hurts a third party. Cutting the pass of the person who triggered the slide does not indemnify the responsibility of the resort from the 3rd party below. In a suit they won't be able to say "Well we banned those guys" as a defense for another injured guest. Perma closed zones are often closed because they are high risk mountain features of complex nature that might carry consequence down slope to many guests or important mountain equipment. Perma closure is done for a reason. Failing to adequately, close, the zone does not support the desired goal. Especially if its closed because the feature in question puts downslope parties at risk.
Example. Crystal Mountain Rock face is a permanently closed feature. It is entirely roped off all the way from West face to banana chute, getting caught will see your pass cut, and carries risk to high traffic beginner slopes underneath it. Its not enough to simply mark it on a map. It should be adequately protected on hill as many people might not have access to a map or the skills to interpret their location on it.
If the area is permanently closed for a reason then cutting the pass of these two skiers didn't solve the problem. The resort is still unnecessarily putting themselves at risk for the next jamoke that passes through that zone.
Another perma closed example is kite bowl, nick naming a 300-400ft mountain feature at Alpental. Its perma closed for obvious reasons. The entire length of the mountain is roped off and closed signs are everywhere. And for good reason. The top of Kante naturally bowls into it. Without adequate mountain setup intermediate skiers would see them dead ended over a 400 foot cliff. If someone were to fall and live the resort would not be able to claim that the skier failed to read their map properly as a means to indemnify them from responsibility. Not setting up the mountain to actually close closed zones will just be seen as negligence. If that means running rope for a full kilometer so be it. Rope is cheap. Lawsuits are not.
TLDNR cutting passes of random skiers does not address the issue. At best it just frustrates a random guest and spurs a stupid reddit post (See here). If Whistler wants people out of a zone they need to setup their hill to that desired goal. Mountain setup is very important.
Agree how the issue is/was handled leaves more people in confusion rather than in understanding
A simple conversation between resort and skier would resolve everything
Agree the resort has a duty to provide signage if it is to protect public safety, especially if they are to enforce it
And finally I would be careful about naming names
I gotta admit, now I want to find out where that line is
I hope Mountain Safety makes an appearance on the next episode with special geust Bob
that sucks. trail maps not the best in that zone either at least on the website. im guessing its from that run you guys did when i went down the diamond bowl again?
Isn’t the only way to access Ruby Chute by traversing through a permanently closed zone? That’s what it looks like on ULLR.
ULLR is not the legal map of whistler. The app builder saw my videos and told he’s buddies on patrol as he quit and moved
@@onecutmedia understood. Shame the app builder seems like a bit of a dick.
will you get your pass suspended if you go out of bounds? or is it just permanently closed
Just closed. Out of bounds is your just on your own
@@onecutmedia did you ski today? Ruby bowl was all time!
@@Wutaskier don’t have a pass still
You were handed a raw deal indeed. My initial guess was that the incident was somewhere near Poop Chutes. Never would have guessed it was near Spankys. Keep rolling with the great content once you're back to shreddin.
Poop Chutes is just out of bounds. Not closed.
I’ve heard of people who’ve done this run too. And they aren’t the type to cross any lines. Seems like this marking issue has been a problem for a while.
Still no signs there. Pretty sad
Weirdest part about all this is that according to the map, Dominator and all the cliffs in that zone are in the permanently closed zone. Given that tons of people (including the free ride club) hit that cliff through the same route that you took its quite strange that they’re referring to the map as a point of reference.
I bet you have but Have you contacted customer service at all? I was at crystal mtn touring one day and their website said the uphill route we were on was open, and after 2,500’ of climbing a ski patroller came upon us and told us to turn around the area was closed, I showed him the website that said open and he didn’t give a crap, so we turned around and went straight to customer service desk and they called ski patrol and told us that patroller was wrong and they gave me and my friend 2 free passes. It’s a bummer to lose your pass I’m sorry
I have tried. But I just sent an email to the COO
Could you buy another pass or ticket in the mean time?
That was last season. I went mtn biking for the month
@@onecutmedia I know it was last season, I was just wondering if you could have bought a separate pass/ticket and if that would have worked
@@skitimetv4976 too expensive
@@onecutmedia what if you travelled far and were only there for a few days a year, would they even let you buy a separate ticket or pass?
@@skitimetv4976 not at an epic pass anyway
interesting story, i didn't even know that area was permanently closed since there were always tracks marked in it
maybe you already did but thought thought you had so many connections, borrowed another pass and kept going but don't film it and wear a different outfit
they don't seem to ask to remove googles or check too carefully since covid
they seem to have two different set of rules, whistler clubs and the rest, they can go there but no one else can. not worth getting caught, then I would get a full year suspension
@@onecutmedia borrow your friends driver license as well so if they do an ID check then would be ok ;) but guess suspension already over. i've only seen a few videos over the years but when first saw the title, i was thinking what a fool, and the patroller stopped you on the run midway instead of just skiing away really fast, i also assumed maybe you hiked up to some area during dangerous avalanche conditions so was thinking maybe that could warrant a suspension, but when you explained the part about ruby bowl, then i had to side with you, because that was also on my list of things to ski as i've been down every double black and a bunch more unofficial runs on the mountain, but had this run on my list of things to do. I also saw in the master plan before vail bought them, they had a potential lift going to the top of ruby bowl above crystal coming from the blackcomb glacier, maybe you already saw this, and the part you skied down is actually a marked run in the master plan, crazy. the passes are cheap now and can use for other mountains too, only good thing about vail, but need way more free parking and better uploading capacity, since the whole area is a monopoly, still too busy, and they should just blast all those steep rocks there people kill themselves and smooth it out, and they need to stop delaying the opening of upper lifts and making traffic jams below, they gotta pay people to start earlier, before someone cuts a bunch of their lift and gondola lines to teach them a lesson, the weekends are almost unskiable but good if you can go on a weekday, that's all i wanted to say lol
Yo we gotta help you out man, maybe we can figure something out. If there is anything the community can do, we can at least try and help
help its a clear closed zone and skied with a patroller who should know that if anything it should be a season ban for both
I would like thank you all for the comments. I’m still not sure which is PC. The cliff zone or Ruby Chute?
People hit Dominator all the time. People also hike up Ruby Chute from Ruby Bowl.
I think they will be putting a sign up from now on. It’s a shame they didn’t communicate with you and just went for the ban right away. They just assume ur being reckless instead of wanting to explore. I get the part of asking to take the video down to not encourage others.
There’s no sign. People are still hitting Dominator
I know that area as PC but it is dumb they don't have PC/no hiking up hill like they do at the border of CBC toward Grey Matter/Apocalypse, weekend chutes etc.
Apparently there is a sign up at the bottom of Spankys now
That sign was there the day you poached. It's been there all season and before you got your ban patrol checked it was there incase it had blown away or fallen over.
@@robstokes4326 never have I ever seen one
@@robstokes4326 good to know Rob (and obviously 100% believe you), I'm a Whistler guy and haven't been in that area for years besides the normal traverse to Ruby... what's the access to Dominator? Is it before signline or do people go on ridge runner and somehow get up there.
They drop in where I did above Ruby Bowl
I have to say Rick, several times over the years I’ve had to look into “transgressions” by members of a local club I’m on the board of. These transgressions were reported. First step is to get info and talk to all involved prior to issuing, in this case, penalty. Good video
Sorry to hear what happened to you. I hope Vail withdraw/lighten the penalty given you had no intention and Vail not doing their diligence on marking.
It should be tough time for you without mountain access, but I hope you spending your downtime valuable for you. Maybe you still can publish RUclips videos with your old recordings, or catch up with friends who are not skiing, etc. Hope to see you being on the mountain again sooner than expected! 🤞
dang!! That must SUCK!! its full of crap.! (I missed the MTB video and the Ski video i'm not sure if I can pay, but maybe)
Well I'm going to be counting seconds until your next video :)
A T-shirt with the permanently closed with on it could be a hit. I'd buy one and wear it at Whistler.
Hahahaha
Hey Rick, regardless of right or wrong, there is some learning here for us all. When in doubt, don’t do it. Ask SP for advice. On the other end, a 30 day suspension is over the top and just plain harsh. A stern warning and maybe a refresher course would have been adequate. However, I’m thinking that this isn’t your first rodeo with the Vail company? Keep smashing it Rick. Love the videos!
first rodeo, never have done anything like this before, A few years back while skiing West Cirque there is a way to get to Hanging Role, There is usually a sign on the traverse there, I alerted patrol and it was back up the next day
Vail is the worst when it comes to 'judgements'. Even if they're wrong they generally won't relent. I'd say consider yourself lucky to only get a month. Sucks to miss out on part of the season though, and that they're combing social media or someone who watches your channel informed on you which could be a thing as well.
It was Alex Horrdle. The ULLR map guy. Does not even live or work here anymore
My Worst Fear
Sorry Rick, that's really miserable. If you think you have case, try going back to the ski patrol.
They tile me no
I watched your video before it was taken down. Pretty bummed for you. I’m most bothered by how this will affected you as a skier and good guy. Obviously you have a tremendous love for the area. Try to keep this compartmentalized so that frustration doesn’t hurt your mojo after this all blows over. I will be in Whistler on Wednesday and was hoping to catch up with you for some turns. So, it’s now a bummer for me as well! What a bunch of bullshit man.
Pretty much has turned my head against the mtn now. All the negative comments that have been on here are all from patrollers. I have removed most of them.
Plus no one is actually saying which part is PC because the map is so vague
Good job removing all the other sides of the argument 👍🏽👍🏽
@@peteshellshear they were not other sides of the argument, they were just negative comments from trolls
Interesting video. You are just a victim of circumstances. I bet they already put a sign up there. Thanks for sharing your story.
No they did not. People are still skiing there.
Gutted for you. Is there an appeal process in the Big corporate world of Vail Resorts. They can’t be serious about an inaccurate piste map being able to clearly show the no go areas. As you say, you passed no such signs.
The map is ridiculous
@@onecutmedia they should make more detailed map for each zone like the ones for the bike park
That is permanently closed if you have the whistler map book
Just keep it with you when on the mountain, that's what I'd do in every resort
Who carries a book with them?
@@onecutmedia well clearly you know the map is wrong. There's a book of whistler by a patrolled I believe which has each area in depth and I'm sure you own it being a local
I have a hard time believing this was an honest mistake. OP isn't a newb to Whistler Blackcomb and should know that everything North of the two official ways to access Ruby Bowl are officially permanently closed. As is anything north/east from Gray Zone. OP was skiing with a volunteer patrol, right? They also should have known and shared that knowledge. That being said, WB should own the fail for not having it properly signed. 30 days isn't harsh. That chute empties into Ruby Bowl, a bowl that has had fatal avalanches before. Google 'Steve Clark'. He was 37 when he was killed in a class 2 avalanche in Blackcomb’s Ruby Bowl on New Year’s Eve in 2008. Them PC areas are closed for a reason. to keep everyone below safe.
Hopefully they see this post and reduce your pass suspension to 15 days. Vail resorts needs to have the sign shop make a sign saying permanent closure so no one else gets their pass suspended !
I saw the video of the line you and Jen skied. You did a check before hand, and crossed no signs.
I call BS.
Yeah you are getting screwed.
Looking at the map, even knowing there was a closed area, my expectation (based on the route you looked to be taking) would be that if you went further left over the ridge (towards Glacier lift) that you would have come across a closure sign. Without encountering one, I would have thought “I guess I’m further over than that closure,” and proceeded.
Ruby Chute is in the closure marked in Ullr, but that is nothing official. They should have signage at the most likely places skiers could enter the zone, and where possible, ropes closing it off.
I would try and appeal. Ive probably broken many rules during my time exploring around at whistler. You got done dirty cuz I’ve literally taken that line before.
Seamus responded with an there is no appeal process.
That really sucks man.
Vail blows and ruined Park City/The Canyons
Is the mountain watching old youtube videos (1 or 2 years old) and using these videos to suspend people?
No clue
why do you ask? I have never skied in PC ever
@@onecutmedia I only ask because you mentioned in your description you never posted a video on Feb 2. So I put on my internet detective hat and wondered if its actually from a video 1 or 2 years back... so I looked at your videos from 1 year ago and the only video where they could try to argue was the ice cave... but that would be a pretty crummy reason to say you're skiing in a closed area... also them using/watching OLD videos would be a pretty lousy way to start suspending people and it would make content creators want to not keep old videos up. Imagine you have a video from years ago, the mountain fell over and now that run is permanently closed and now any content creator's video is now going to get them suspended.
@@christopherchow7256 it was recent as you will see.
The ice cave used to be inbounds even. Now it’s just out of bounds but has never been a permanent closure
@@onecutmedia maybe they figured out it was filmed on feb 2nd from the ticket scanners?
With how much you promote Whistler for free the least they could do is let you off with a warning ⚠️!
They don’t care
I dunno man. Ruby chute is marked pc. But... If it was me, I would pull this whole thing down. Did you clear this video with your friend Jen before pulling her into it? Your other friend Seamus? It's less than 20 days remaining. If it was me, I'd yank this video and let my friends and acquaintances know I reacted emotionally and that I hope they understand. You are not going to win here. Better to build the relationship than social media outing. Especially reading personal emails man. Think about it.
read the comment I just pinned, Seamus is not my friend
I believe no sign should be a mitigating factor (perhaps just a warning would suffice), however you are in a Kangaroo court situation so you are hooped !
Totally hooped
They were jealous of those silky turns
Best joke of the year goes to this guy
Last Friday I litterally heard Whistler Extreme coaches talking about the lines they hit with their groups. Ruby was the first thing outta the one guys mouth. No wispering, no concerns.
Organizations interested in constructive relationships don't go punative without even a discussuion or request to merely take down your video.
Not like this isn't being skied on the regular and that your error if it was one is unique.
Write a letter take legal action .ski Patrol sometimes go overboard.
I almost got into a fight over me skinning up a cat track with my nephew in Australia . Just because we didn't have passes . VAIL takeover . I remember skiing BLACKCOMB for s season prior INTRAWEST take over was laid back now all I see is lift lines . Don't think will go back to Whistler.
They are legally liable if there is no sign there
People moved and changed there whole lives to live there and JEN there should have been a meeting with SKI PATROL and feel for JEN she basically has to shut up . Like the military
If I was ski patrol and had it well marked and and warned you in prior issues. Yes I would pull your pass . It's a ridge its the easiest place to put a sign
Legal action will cost lots of money. Maybe if everyone shares this video I will have enough 🤷♂️
Fail resorts as usual.
Yep
Thats messed up that that happened, this is why I hate vail.....
If your driving in a speed zone doing 45 with no sign posted and the zone is 25, your speeding regardless of no sign being posted. It could of been knocked down. You’re still responsible to know what is you are doing. I guess, there was a sigh. The sign to me is, wow that looks like a great place to ski or board as is do. The question would be, why are there not any tracks? There’s you sign. You must live by “we will just ask for forgiveness is stead of permission.” I have been boarding for 30 years, I would of just asked, but I think you already knew the answer, that’s why you didn’t. Just my opinion.
Lots of tracks. Lots of them.
Tbh. I don’t think it’s reasonable to expect the public to have a hand drawn map burned into there memory. No permanently closed sign could be grounds for a lawsuit. They’re completely disregarding the safety of their patrons here. Would expect nothing less from Vail tho.
Yes. If something happened while in that zone
Weakest sauce ever! Fail Resorts FTL 🤦🏻♂️
This is why skiing in NOrth America sucks. Go to Europe, ski wherever you want, the risks are yours.
not true you can only ski in designated freeride zones everything else off piste is usually closed
What crap.
Sounds like you got banned for being somewhat famous, and posting it. I watched that video they had you sit through, and what a terribly mashed together load of contradicting crap. Really shows the effort put in. WB had MUCH better production value on their stuff, how is it Vail fails this badly.
I also looked at the PDF map they provide, and it's pretty difficult to tell what they're calling Permanently Closed. They used to have different sections for that area.
Head down to Mt. Baker for a few laps. Don't let Vail get you down.
Very disappointing by Whister. I would hire legal council to review. That seems ridiculous.
that would be very expensive
Completely unfair decision! No signs up to show its a closed zone.