Good for anyone who wants to keep their original motors. I didn’t and wouldn’t go back, Modern motors are just so much better. I know a lot of purist who don’t like that. No way it’s got 300 hp with just a cam though. Stock spec and freshly rebuilt or not really, they make about half that. The torque is in good supply and very low in the rpm band which makes it feel very powerful. It’s typical of the binder community and the estimates of power in their ih motors. I’ve taken a scout club to a dyno day at a race shop and the power was consistent and much lower than many thought it would be(power to the ground probably hurt their expectations too).
phục êwê that day, I dynod about 20 scouts, i would say 1/2 of them thought they had 300 hp, none had 300 hp even the handful of 392’s in the bunch. Ill wait till i see the dyno slip before I believe 300hp on a dyno. I’m not saying its not possible just not as common as the binder community thinks. I do grant however that the motors feel very powerful because of the torque delivery.
phục êwê now to be fair, I’ve been speaking from the context of ‘ to the ground’ if hes talking brake horse power then sure, it could have 300 (with a 20%loss thats 240 at the ground) i saw a lot of 180 hp to the ground that day. Edit: for reference my 1998 LS1 camaro in 2000 when it was stock put down 312 hp to the ground, right down to paper filter. The motor was rated at 305 from the factory. I saw 01 and 02 ls1s put down 320-325 regularly.
Sorry for the multiple posts, piqued by the momory. A quick google search from someone running on a dyno with their binder. 345 with fuel injection ( also, to all the binder folk, no you will not make more power with GM TBI than you did with your carb and no other change, unless you were incorrectly tuned before) This guy put 149 hp to the ground. That horsepower power band is just a little hump on the bottom of the graph, that is rough, the motors dont turn enough RPM to shine on the dyno and the motors top end is inefficient ( the top end of the engine, all of your air and fuel delivery) www.binderplanet.com/forums/index.php?attachments/dyno-chart-jpg.58930/ Edit: meant to include a point on the binder community and horse power estimates. It is a novel thing to dyno your scout and doesn’t have any real impact on your experience driving or wheeling your scout. The Binder community is less exposed to actual power numbers and what the results of changes are (such as how much power is really made with long tubes or an ‘RV cam’) each group is guilty of being optimistic about what each mod does. This is what I call magazine racing, adding up each advertised HP claim for each part and assuming that is your new power level. The more a vehicle community runs on dynamometers, the less susceptible they are to this. The binder community is, in my experience, very susceptible to this because its relatively less likely to be reconciled (with actual numbers like dyno or E.T. and Trap speeds to compare). A .040 overbore is not going to yield much if any power increase. It’s a handful of cu inches. I experienced this dynamic directly with the first days of LS1 performance. First thing everyone did was put an aftermarket air box lid, it reliably made about 10hp to get rid of the bellows and have a more direct flowing lid into the TB. Well then came LT headers, or LT Headers with a Cam. At this point it was interesting to see what combos were making what power, given very similar baselines. You would make it into the 330-340 hp range with a lid and LT’s then a cam would push you to 360-390ish (w/factory heads), depending greatly on the cam(literally everyone was shooting in the dark with custom cam specs, seeing what made power). Anyway, this was the proper order of things, next would come heads and intake, you have been step by step opening up the breathing of the engine, of course been adding fuel all along. Once i had a guy that wanted to put a cam in an otherwise stock motor. Notably he had at least factory cat-forward exhaust, i think it was all factory. Well the cam is just another component of breathing. The restriction is what affects the power. I told him that his cam that he read would make 60 hp or so, would not actually make that power. It would be little to no increase given that there is a significant restriction just following the engine. He didnt listen, then was disappointed that his so-called good cam only made 12 hp. So I convinced him it was simply the exhaust restriction, did long tubes and a lid and it made I think almost 80 hp to the ground more with just the changes made before and after the engine. It also would have been unfair to advertise those headers as an 80 hp increase, they’re all just part of the whole. In the binder community, I’ve never seen any significant top-end work done, in my experience “head work” means a valve job. I also can’t imagine why one would go to the effort unless motivated by the pure fact of doing it to an IH motor. I know it has nothing to do with HP but its also an 800lb engine. My LS1 block was like 75lbs. The IH345 intake is 80lbs i believe, my LS1 and Truck LS intakes are something like 3lbs or less being composite. The big thing is the Modern LS motor do make 300hp with ease and easily push a stock bottom-end 5.3L truck motor to 700-800 on the gen 3 and more on the 4 and 5’s. Plus then you get direct injection in the later generations, basically a factory race fuel system. You can make big power for cheap with junkyard LS motors, people practically give away 4.8L’s; take one of those and use the cost savings relative to a 6.0 and put a eBay turbo on it. Better yet an LSA supercharger, they are dropping in price as the street guys realize their IAT are too high to manage when they push their boost levels. Those super chargers are PERFECT for off-roading. hey, If you want to run on propane the 345 is the way to go.
Two thumbs way up for keeping the 345 Binder engine in it! Great torque and that low revving thump I grew up hearing.
Good for anyone who wants to keep their original motors. I didn’t and wouldn’t go back, Modern motors are just so much better. I know a lot of purist who don’t like that.
No way it’s got 300 hp with just a cam though. Stock spec and freshly rebuilt or not really, they make about half that. The torque is in good supply and very low in the rpm band which makes it feel very powerful. It’s typical of the binder community and the estimates of power in their ih motors. I’ve taken a scout club to a dyno day at a race shop and the power was consistent and much lower than many thought it would be(power to the ground probably hurt their expectations too).
phục êwê that day, I dynod about 20 scouts, i would say 1/2 of them thought they had 300 hp, none had 300 hp even the handful of 392’s in the bunch. Ill wait till i see the dyno slip before I believe 300hp on a dyno. I’m not saying its not possible just not as common as the binder community thinks. I do grant however that the motors feel very powerful because of the torque delivery.
phục êwê now to be fair, I’ve been speaking from the context of ‘ to the ground’ if hes talking brake horse power then sure, it could have 300 (with a 20%loss thats 240 at the ground) i saw a lot of 180 hp to the ground that day.
Edit: for reference my 1998 LS1 camaro in 2000 when it was stock put down 312 hp to the ground, right down to paper filter. The motor was rated at 305 from the factory. I saw 01 and 02 ls1s put down 320-325 regularly.
Sorry for the multiple posts, piqued by the momory.
A quick google search from someone running on a dyno with their binder. 345 with fuel injection ( also, to all the binder folk, no you will not make more power with GM TBI than you did with your carb and no other change, unless you were incorrectly tuned before)
This guy put 149 hp to the ground. That horsepower power band is just a little hump on the bottom of the graph, that is rough, the motors dont turn enough RPM to shine on the dyno and the motors top end is inefficient ( the top end of the engine, all of your air and fuel delivery)
www.binderplanet.com/forums/index.php?attachments/dyno-chart-jpg.58930/
Edit: meant to include a point on the binder community and horse power estimates. It is a novel thing to dyno your scout and doesn’t have any real impact on your experience driving or wheeling your scout. The Binder community is less exposed to actual power numbers and what the results of changes are (such as how much power is really made with long tubes or an ‘RV cam’) each group is guilty of being optimistic about what each mod does. This is what I call magazine racing, adding up each advertised HP claim for each part and assuming that is your new power level. The more a vehicle community runs on dynamometers, the less susceptible they are to this. The binder community is, in my experience, very susceptible to this because its relatively less likely to be reconciled (with actual numbers like dyno or E.T. and Trap speeds to compare). A .040 overbore is not going to yield much if any power increase. It’s a handful of cu inches.
I experienced this dynamic directly with the first days of LS1 performance. First thing everyone did was put an aftermarket air box lid, it reliably made about 10hp to get rid of the bellows and have a more direct flowing lid into the TB. Well then came LT headers, or LT Headers with a Cam. At this point it was interesting to see what combos were making what power, given very similar baselines. You would make it into the 330-340 hp range with a lid and LT’s then a cam would push you to 360-390ish (w/factory heads), depending greatly on the cam(literally everyone was shooting in the dark with custom cam specs, seeing what made power). Anyway, this was the proper order of things, next would come heads and intake, you have been step by step opening up the breathing of the engine, of course been adding fuel all along. Once i had a guy that wanted to put a cam in an otherwise stock motor. Notably he had at least factory cat-forward exhaust, i think it was all factory. Well the cam is just another component of breathing. The restriction is what affects the power. I told him that his cam that he read would make 60 hp or so, would not actually make that power. It would be little to no increase given that there is a significant restriction just following the engine. He didnt listen, then was disappointed that his so-called good cam only made 12 hp. So I convinced him it was simply the exhaust restriction, did long tubes and a lid and it made I think almost 80 hp to the ground more with just the changes made before and after the engine. It also would have been unfair to advertise those headers as an 80 hp increase, they’re all just part of the whole. In the binder community, I’ve never seen any significant top-end work done, in my experience “head work” means a valve job. I also can’t imagine why one would go to the effort unless motivated by the pure fact of doing it to an IH motor.
I know it has nothing to do with HP but its also an 800lb engine. My LS1 block was like 75lbs. The IH345 intake is 80lbs i believe, my LS1 and Truck LS intakes are something like 3lbs or less being composite. The big thing is the Modern LS motor do make 300hp with ease and easily push a stock bottom-end 5.3L truck motor to 700-800 on the gen 3 and more on the 4 and 5’s. Plus then you get direct injection in the later generations, basically a factory race fuel system.
You can make big power for cheap with junkyard LS motors, people practically give away 4.8L’s; take one of those and use the cost savings relative to a 6.0 and put a eBay turbo on it. Better yet an LSA supercharger, they are dropping in price as the street guys realize their IAT are too high to manage when they push their boost levels. Those super chargers are PERFECT for off-roading.
hey, If you want to run on propane the 345 is the way to go.
Did they say how much he was asking for it and if it's still available?
Oh thank God not another LS swap!
Still For sale?