Australians blame wind and solar for surging power bills
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- Australians blame wind and solar for surging power bills
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The money doesn't like distributed power systems. Too hard to exploit😂
That is exactly why they hate it.
The Chinese solar panel manufacturers are exploiting it although still so consumers get an economical better choice.
This is the innovators dilemma, existing energy companies (oil and gas mainly) just neglected the disruption that would happen because of exponentially reduced cost of solar panel manufacturing.
They and their owners are now stuck in lacking skills and the supply source of raw materials for producing solar panels and other clean energy systems (wind power, battery power storage) which is what you need to be competitive in the future.
great point about distributed power systems - another huge advantage is security, there's no single point of failure -- see how Russia crippled Ukraine by targeting a few power plants.
This is a good example of why the West is going down fast. Disinformation promoted by legacy industries that stop progress.
@ComplexKangaroo very good point. But all we hear from our "leaders" are ever more outlandish claims about "national security" while they ignore the obvious problems in our infrastructure and centralized electricity generation.
Had my solar on my home address in south Australia now for 10 years for the first 5years had no power bills, in fact it paid off the gas bills. But with the drop of the feed in tariff has to pay a much reduced power bills. But then I got a battery. Fantastic best thing to do . I'm constantly advising to go solar and battery. . Keep smiling everyone
Yeah I did the sums on that in SA and it's really not worth if now that feed in tariffs have dropped so much imo.
A decent quality system is still very expensive so when you add in the opportunity cost of that money it becomes even less economic imo.
@@oldbloke204You aren’t doing your sums right mate. There is virtually no nowhere in Australia that solar doesn’t make sense unless you live in a cave. Talk to a reputable solar installer and get them to take you through the figure. Sun on a roof without solar is money you are just throwing away.
Yep, could not agree more. Twelve years on 13.2 kW solar PV with two Powerwall-2 batteries installed in 2018, and operate as microgrid for 8+ months of the year in Edmonds, WA, USA. Our average electric bill is $180/year, and we also charge two EVs off our roof, and export excess solar back to grid with net metering. Solar + batteries simply work and I am smiling. ;0)
@@stefankuiper3738 Nope I've done the sums and I'm happy with our decision for our situation.
How much would I spend to have a good quality solar/battery setup and a Tesla?
Not commenting on what I think of the vehicle but for comparison purposes.
North of 100k will be my guess and I've also compromised our roof.
I can easily earn over 5k per year on that in interest and likely a more if I make an effort.
Our power bills are around 3k per year and our fuel bills aren't very high either.
Most people can't drop that sort of money in cash and so there will be extra costs if they finance it all.
This argument is a bit like the one we keep hearing about cheaper renewables and our power bills keep going up.
@@oldbloke204 Dude, HOW.. I'm not from Australia, but I can do math, I don't get how you're saying that the money doesn't math?
I think you're a shill for the oil companies.. Just doing napkin calculations on not even the most efficient situation would bring in the money..
Stop trolling
It’s a battle ground! In the media, politics and finance. Good on you Sam - keep up the fight.
Just filled my EV using solar power and it cost me $2. That's 25kWh (about 150km) at the 8c/kWh feed-in I would have got otherwise. The tariffs are rumored to be going down to 3c/kWh so using my solar will make even more sense than selling it to the grid. It's crazy cheap to run if you have solar panels and off-street parking. I've had $0 electricity bills for years and now I'm basically paying $0 fuel costs for the car. Why would you not do solar if you can?
No feedin tariff for me (had solar 14+yrs) so filling my EV then the power company receives free power they on sell at 30+c/kWh
@@ralphzoombeenie2330 Yikes. 16 cents /kWh here in New York, USA (National Grid).
@@jamesvandamme7786 Hydro may be part of your lower costs.. I'm not familar with NY state energy mix.
They trade on peoples ignorance! Good on you Sam, for keeping us informed and up to date. Basic maths is a problem for many people!🐞🍀
For some unknown reasons, many Australians are happy pumping $150-$300 of petrol in their polluting ICE vehicles each week, and complain about the price of electricity, which is far cheaper than petrol. Owning an EV it has cost me less than $350 to travel 12000km in six months. Doing the maths I have saved a hell of a lot of money in the six months since selling my ICE vehicle. Because electricity is cheap and free when you have renewables.
One of my EVs is charging on free solar as I type. This house is also running entirely from the sun with a 5day buffer fom batteries.
@@scottparrey7851 I bet you still have an ice car...
And he doesn't travel far. And he finds driving a chore, not a joy @@grantbuttenshaw
Agreed 👍🏼
@@thisisnumber0 well sell the ice car...you don't need it right?.
I know it can be frustrating Sam but you are a flag bearer and we need as many as we can get. Thanks for fighting the good fight.
With you all the way Sam. I'm fighting this disinformation on a daily basis with my friends and colleagues. My best trump card - I pay nothing for electricity because I have solar and battery backup at home, how much do you pay? My follow up is I pay nothing for "fuel" for my Tesla, because of the electricity I'm made at my own house and put into my car. How much does a tank of petrol cost again, and do you have an unlimited petrol pump with free fuel in your house??
Even if you need to charge from the grid its cheap as chips.
So what's the opportunity cost of all of this and what will be your total cost over 10 years when it will likely all need replacing?
I did the sums and there's no way we would be in front by dropping that amount of cash on that setup especially when you add in the depreciation on your EV.
Nice try though.
@@markkennard861 Are you in Australia because if so grid electricity is hardly cheap.
We live in the state that's often mentioned on here as being the poster child for solar and our power has always been very expensive.
The fact is that Australia, a decade or so ago, had among the cheapest electricity in the world when we had well maintained coal power plants, since the 'green push' electricity prices have more than quadrupled.
Now we are told that, obviously, wind and solar are cheaper producers of electricity, but what they keep hiding is the fact that another 20,000 or more kilometres of transmission lines, batteries and other infrastructure is required to actually get that cheaply produced power to where it's needed, and it will run into over a trillion dollars to get that set up organised.
So, the mathematics and economics expose the reality that electricity prices will probably NEVER get cheaper by going green, simply due to the infrastructure costs that will have to be met by the Consumer.
Continually spruiking that wind and solar is cheaper, is NOT telling the whole story, it is disinformation by omission.
@@oldbloke204Sorry, they clearly didn’t teach you to use a calculator in primary school. I’ve done the maths on my own system with my own numbers. Solar system and battery completely paid off in under the warranty for both, then free power forever. Tesla is the best car I’ve owned by a long shot, minimal maintenance, depreciation not worse than for ICE with similar specs, and FREE FUEL.
Keep paying for fossil fuels if you want, but I’m going to much richer than the mugs that do that in the long run.
Sam, take a breath. Don’t worry about your muppet detractors, they are beneath notice. You are doing good work, and educating and encouraging people all over the world about renewable energy and EVs. Keep up the good work my friend!
Mate people watch Sky news and other MSM - they believe that they are actual journalists telling them the truth. Keep fighting the good fight. I follow Stop Burning Stuff channel (Stop BS) as well - their whole reason for being is to stop MSM fud. Aus needs an equivalent too!
Thanks I'll add that to my alternative news sources.. One for you to consider is Inside China Business , an American businessman covering the reality of trade with data to back him up.
But The Electric Viking is even worse,so whats your Point?
I wasn’t a big fan of renewables in the beginning, but I’ve been noticing the rate of improvement in technology. It really is accelerating so fast that it is making a believer out of me.
burning resources makes people feel rich, similar to how walking makes people feel poor
How many steps is the proper amount to justify my Hellcat challenger ?
In the UK people protested against low emission zones, they demand the right for their kids to breathe car and HGV pollution 🙄
You know that there is zero difference between the air in the low emission zones and the air outside of the zones?
@@orionbetelgeuse1937 What was it like before the low emission rules?
@@jamesvandamme7786 you mean a year before or 30 years before because the cars over euro 4 are producing a lot more particles due to the wear of the tires than through the tailpipe. A study made on euro 5 cars proved they produced 1850x more particles due to the tires than through te tailpipe. So because all cars have tires if the cars are at least euro 4 which is very close to euro 5 there is practically no difference if they are ev's or ice's.
Seems you have been lapping up the fossil fuel industry propaganda. There most definitely is a difference. I am looking forwards to the time when EVs will be the only cars allowed in the London ULEZ and similar zones in the UK.@@orionbetelgeuse1937
Clearly you do not understand that the most harmful particulates are the very small PM2.5 which are predominately emitted by ICEs. Tyre particulates are much bigger cause much less harm and fall out of the atmosphere much more rapidly.
Thanks Viking.
The Solar and battery system we have installed has REDUCED our home and transport energy bills by a factor of 4.
In UK . Any proposal to install a solar farm always has people against because. They are using food producing farm land. How will we feed ourselves.. etc.. But no complaints about golf courses or house building on farm land. We grow biofuels for adding to petrol and area of 1200 hectare each year.. That are is massive compared with all our solar farms . Madness
Now the Green Party has opposed building the power lines necessary for renewables. They lost a lot of my respect for that.
Great video Sam, keep telling it like it is.
Some think solar panels leach heavy metals and radioactivity. I kid you not. they cry about losing "prime farm land" and I ask why has nobody planted it in years? Oh, it's too rocky/swampy/something.
UK can't do anything right. It's downfall from empire to Gilligan's island is sad.
Have you ever taken a good look at a solar farm.It Seems not because if you did you would have seen that there is just as much grass under the rows of panels as between them. That is perfect for things like sheep grazing. Further the microclimate under the panels is ideal for certain crops such as blackcurrants. Furthermore the microclimate is a good simulation of woodland edges which are particularly biodiverse and very lacking in the UK which has the lowest tree cover in Europe. With proper management the land covered by solar farms will still be productive. In many cases solar farms are built on marginal land and give farmers a far higher return than if it was just used to grow crops
Doesn't Australian states have websites showing wholesale electricity price? In Canada, the provinces show the wholesale electricity price on a real time basis. Everytime the wind picks up, wholesale price heads to zero/negative. Australians need to have similar transparency to see that renewables actually bring down the price of electricity.
It's not that simple. Obviously the price of building a wind farm is not negative. Having intermittent power sources creates more price variability, so yes you get more cheap and negative prices, but also more price spikes.
@@bingxilao9086 and that's what batteries are for. To soak up the excess production and release in times of need to avoid those price hikes. Battery prices are also declining.
We have solar panels installed on our house. While friends were facing a $400 electricity bill in a hot summer month, we not only kept the house cool with central air, charged an EV, and energized the water heater for $9. We've been living with solar since 2016. The idea that renewables cause electricity prices to go up is pure misinformation.
@@northernouthouse We are a very long way away from fully renewable, fully firmed with energy storage. Until we are, we have a segment of fossil capacity which has to be maintained while being used ever less frequently, which is not terribly efficient. It's all very well for renewables to be superficially cheap if they still have to be backed up by fossil fuels anyway. Your house still needs to be backed up by the grid unless you massively overinvest in storage or just accept occasional power cuts when there's a couple of cloudy days.
@@bingxilao9086 that has nothing to do with the misinformation that renewables cause electricity prices to increase. That's just a blatant lie.
Australians have access to all the real information and facts we could want, if we make a tiny effort. There is no excuse for such gullibility other than outright stupidity, at this point.
@cs-lw2pn I'm 57, so I might be an elder. But thank heavens I know how to weed out propaganda. Listen to the science. Check the facts.
You have no idea...lol...😂
@@grantbuttenshaw You're all over all the renewable energy channels. I wonder how you find the time, unless you are being paid for your time. But of course you'll deny, deny, deny. 🙂
@@elephantintheroom5678 its liars like you that need to get a clue...stop talking about shit you don't understand. The government is wasting our money and you are propagating it.
@@elephantintheroom5678 what's you name ?
Mean while, my Australian power supplier is giving away free electricity from 11am to 2pm - capitalising on the over supply of solar. I have never understood how solar and wind is meant to increase power costs. Taking advantage of this, I now have a home battery charged by this free electricity for night time use.
BS
@@robertfonovic3551 You must really hate wind and solar. OVO energy EV plan has free electricity from 11:00am to 2:00pm. Midnight to 6am is only $0.08 a kw. peak times is quite expensive, but the home battery covers this time period on the free electricity i get from 11:00am to 2:00pm. There is so much solar power, the grid often goes into negative cost during that period of time, which is how they can do it.
@@robertfonovic3551 lol, you just got owned
It doesnt matter what people think about prices of solar and electricity, the fact is that the people actually investing in generation capacity know what the reality is,,
Unless fools vote in the Coalition who decide to use our taxes to subsidise coal, gas and nuclear...
Who is investing in capacity?...stop talking about things you know nothing about..
@@grantbuttenshaw Stop abusing people on every renewable energy video you can find. You seem to be a professional spin doctor on the topic of renewable energy. Who's paying you? Of course you'll deny, deny, deny.
@@elephantintheroom5678 what are you talking about?....Sam is so thick he doesn't even understand how the market works and neither do you obviously....do you think there is more demand for solar? Answer this one question...dummy..
@@grantbuttenshaw who cares what you think,, here in New Zealand we are over 80% renewable and building out,, I am 100% renewable off grid with solar , maybe you should take your own advice ,, suck on some coal,,
I think there are many people who are against renewable energy are working in oil, mining, and ICE car industry
What do you think is used to build the windmills, batteries etc. 🤣
@@twitafftwitaff7029shhhh……. We don’t count those costs.
@@twitafftwitaff7029there’s probably minor amount of plastics in solar panels and battery packs. All the other energy can in the future be provided by clean sources (duh). The only non clean energy is the shipping. These are one time costs and over time will probably be innovation that solves these as well.
I don't blame them. It's their livelihoods on the line.
maybe but why are the bills bigger?
Good on you, mate! Keep speaking out! 🎉😊
Yeah we keep hearing how it's making power cheaper whilst prices keep going up?
Ironic eh?
Sam I am from Groningen Nederland. I got mail from Melbourne on my Reaction saying I never leave the City. I did Perth Broome Great Northern Highway from Groningen Nederland. And the Kimberly. He did never the Outback. True Story.❤👍
I bought my solar years ago for 18k AUD in Perth. It's paid for itself a few years ago. That system is about 3k now. Just get solar ASAP it's a no brainer. My bill's are half and i use double electric now. 3 out of four houses in my road have solar.
WTF?? Hey Australia don't they teach you math in your schools, how can you be so naive?
Got Tesla, solar and battery and love it. Save $5000 on fuel/year. The thing is with renewables you need a 100% backup power and this means you need double the infrastructure. Renewables are cheap but the backup makes the total cost expensive. This is just a fact. Saying building renewables is cheap is true but not the whole story. Nuclear is the way to go!!
Getting a new roof this week. Next solar and batteries. Might go with emphasis or tesla?
Not any more, in a few short years storage batteries will be as cheap as chips. Do some research on the cost of nuclear, you will be shocked, I recently visited the UK and they are presently building one in Somerset, huge cost over-runs, huge completion date delays, and to top it off the price they will need to charge is 3x that of local offshore renewable wind power. Battery storage prices are dropping fast right now (Sulphur tec). Things are moving very fast in this whole renewable generation area, I could not believe how many off shore wind farms there were over there, and on shore too. Nuclear still has the long term disposal problem that renewables can and will overcome much much sooner..
We have had solar for over five years in SOCAL. We have not had to pump gas for two cars. Every day we have full batteries/tanks. The solar panels were paid off after three years because of our super high electricity rates. Best decision we ever made.
Besides air pollution causing lung cancer, radon also causes the disease. I have solar and drive a EV and it’s a rare occurrence to talk to someone here that would take the same path as I have.
I wonder what he believes are the causes for brain cancer for instance or bone cancer.
Sam....do you know the difference between cost and price?
Are the high power bills due to the Australian domestic price of coal and natural gas (methane) is the same as the exported price? Perhaps there should be a cap on the domestic prices.
you mightnt like what you hear.Most of them got caught out with the big hike in all fossil fuel energy prices because of energy being used as a weapon by the Russians against Ukraine and Europe for supporting them(there's a lesson here-be as energy independent as possible). The electricity companies were locked in long term contracts with customers(us).Now they are regaining profits lost last year!!! Simple as that!!
The cost of back-up batteries for unreliable wind and solar power = A$10 TRIILION. How cheap will that make electricity?
What is the source if that A$10 trillion amount? Will deliver a lot of jobs !
@@bagheera32 Between one's cheeks I suspect.
$10 trillion dollars would purchase most homes in Australia.
If we need 200,000MWh of storage (25000MW * 8 hours), and batteries are $1000 per KWh that'd be $200 billion...and we all know that battery cells are much cheaper than that. At $200 per KWh it's cheaper than the NBN...and a lot cheaper than a certain set of submarines.
@@bagheera32 where will deliver those jobs? in china?
Rubbish, data please!
A Famos quote I've heard and fully believe " IT IS MUCH EASIER TO FOOL SOMEONE THAN MAKE THEM BELIEVE THAT THEY HAVE BEEN FOOLED"
Hi Sam, glad your vocal about Fossil Fuel BS. However, self deception is LNP, ideology. There are learned people amongst us, like Saul Griffiths, who are well informed and educated , that have very workable plans for the energy transition , used by foreign governments, (USA) inspite of fossil fuel stupidity. When our major parties are captured by fossil fuel interests in coal and gas we are up against it ! There are numerous Australians taking part in the transition I hope this movement continues. If we didn't by a Nuclear Submarine, we could pay every Australians power bill permanently, another hidden fact. Goodluck to you and your family Sam.
If I were younger, I would immediately buy solar for our house. But at the age of nearly 80, we are among a large group of oldies for whom such an investment at this stage of life is not justified. My point being that, though the justification for solar is easy, as you age your criteria for expenditures inevitably change.
If you own your home, the investment could increase it's value in case you need to reverse mortgage at some point.
6.30 pm going dowhill
Wind generation total for all eastern states
944 mW
System relying on coal and gas
It’s a failure of investment in and reliability of coal and gas, especially peaking plants. Solar and wind are here to help fix this, but blaming the cure is apparently easier than acknowledging the current electricity setup is failing.
Most Aussies have their head in the clouds.
As opposed to have their heads up their arses.
having lived there for half my life, it is more like a US type scenario, plenty of land, plenty of potential to do whatever you like. no need to worry, just crack another stubby (beer) watch the footy and so on. Jump into your 'ute' and go fishin' for the weekend (with a couple dozen beers) . I have just visited Singapore, and I can tell you. their life style could not be more opposite to ours. ($10,000 fine for vaping) and everybody lives in an apartment. So choose?
Hi Sam, Really good to see you addressing the disinformation about renewables in Australia. There has been a coordinated campaign for more than a decade from fossil fuel invested corporate media to create fear/uncertainty/doubt around wind, solar, batteries and EVs. For one reason...the tech advancements in renewables and Evs are the death knell of the fossil fuel industry.
It still amazes me though, to have people actually make comments about EVs being worse for the environment than ICE vehicles. Even the staff at a car hire company that hire out EVs, have made comments to me that they 'just don't like EVs' or 'they're worse for the environment that normal cars'.
I have even had the experience of pulling up at a destination in an EV and having someone come up to me really upset and ranting to me about how people think they're helping the environment by driving an EV but 'what you people don't know is how much worse for the environment EVs are' and then continued the confrontation by going on about my supporting child labour in the Congo because of all the cobalt in the EV battery, when actually an EV with a LiFePO4 battery, like I was driving, has zero cobalt in the battery.
All this disinformation spewed at me, was an exact repeat of the fossil fuel industry driven propaganda against renewable energy and EVs that has been circulating for a decade now on social media in Australia and around the world, in large part thanks to fossil fuel invested media billionaires.
The coal, oil and gas industries are preventing Australia from the much faster transition to renewables that we should be focused on & implementing asap. And we now have a coal/gas industry driven ridiculous 'debate' about nuclear being worthwhile, when it's just another delay tactic.
EVs, V2G and home battery storage are the end of the oil/coal/gas industries and their mega profits and they know it.
As Andrew Forrest (who has a PhD in marine biology and understands the dire need for global warming mitigation by ending fossil fuel burning) said in his National Press Club address earlier this year..."We have to get the boot of the fossil fuel industry off the neck of Australia" and get on with the transition to renewable energy.
The Great Barrier Reef is already more than half dead, at 2 degrees C global warming it would be 99% gone. But the fossil fuel industry continues to hold us back, and we are paying every which way for their continuation....not only through damage to ecosystems, but through $14 billion per year record subsidies, and the increasing $$billions for the impacts of global warming driven megafires/floods/droughts & the damages caused. Soon much of Australia's housing will be uninsurable, as is happening in the US due to climate impacts.
But so many Australians say this is being 'alarmist'. The same people will repeat more fossil fuel industry word bites, saying 'the climate has always changed' & that CO2 is just 'plant food and good for the trees' , 'a trace gas can't change the climate' and that 'we need more CO2, not less'.
Climate scientists worldwide have been sounding the alarm for decades now. And because they know we are fast running out of time to avoid an unlivable climate, they now resort to activism to get the public to listen, but instead of being listened to, they get arrested.
The best thing is that it now makes economic sense to put solar on your roof & back it up with a battery. We can power all household electricity needs and drive solar powered EVs charged from rooftop solar that has a 30 year warranty. Good riddance to fossil fuels.
1/3 the cost of coal ???, that is after the farms are installed & doesn't take into account for the installation costs.
so it cost nothing to buy and install the coal plants I take it?
@TerryHickey-xt4mf it has been there for years & paid for ages ago.
The solar farms need thousands of kms of transmission lines installed yet & if there is a major hailstorm, bye bye solar panels & their power supplies
In QLD they are pushing ads about how coal royalties are given to Queenslanders & we owe them a debt of loyalty. Funny, I don't remember ever getting a royalty cheque from QLD Coal.
Shut up and and enjoy your cheap energy prices. SA residents are not so lucky.
30% of Australians cant install solar as they rent. Then add those that live in apartments.
Yep it should be mandatory to install solar on any new builds, that way renters can benfefit from it, solar is very cheap so doesnt add much cost to the build.
That is the short thinking of their landlords who in many cases could install solar and provide cheaper and more attractive investments for themselves
@@griffinsgarage2023the cost will be added to the rental fee. Do you think what you suggest is free? Welcome to the real world.
@@robertfonovic3551 I am a homeowner by the way (have also had multiple rental properties), also have solar and large battery bank on my house. Well aware of how much it all costs. I also mentioned costing in my comment. All good though if you disagree.
Solar is not for everyone bro. Solar only works while we are not at home. How are you going to install pv panels while living in a unit in sydney?
If the solar from homes was stored in a community battery everyone could take advantage not just those who have it but unfortunately people are not allowed to work together as it is a threat to profits. There are plenty of ways around the problems. I wanted to put our excess to a battery at the neighbours house because they cold not get solar on the roof cause of a beautiful tree. I was told no.
@@jasonrhl it is a yes if you install an ats between your main and the rest of the system.
Something Sandy Munro sawed to Robert Llewelyn recently, when talking about opposition to EV's and the transition to renewable energy, 'If you watch enough television, they'll brainwash you.'
Unfortunately for the people in many countries, that's so true. Thanks Sam.
Our thoughts about, prayers for, and love to Shanna. She's a hero!
sawed? a cutting remark. 😃
Can't wait for the day when battery is so cheap everyone can go off grid and give the coal and gas companies a big middle finger.
100% with you!!! I have solar and can’t understand why more people don’t have them. Thanks for creating and posting!!!!
I have solar too, installed this year, and the savings are not nearly as great as advertised. Given that I have to pay the cost of the installation and the panels, it will be years before I even reach parity.
@@simongross3122 You need to get a battery, then during peak you can sell back to the Grid and get paid for having a battery. Solar without a Battery is your problem.
@@user-ty5wm2dl3g Batteries are still too expensive. Getting a battery would just lengthen the time for the whole thing to pay itself off. But sure, it's my problem. In the meantime, keep drinking that kool-aid.
@@simongross3122 Mate I have a battery, they are coming down, plus u get gov rebate, you have to do research, my power bills are nothing now. Without a battery solar wont help u lower your bills. During peak there is no sun so you’re paying big time. All the best!
@@simongross3122I’ve produced a number of commercials for solar companies, when I have a quite word with them all bar one told me to wait another 3-4 years for battery and panel technology to improve enough to be really cost effective.
i think most aussies agree all future power installation needs to be renewables + battery. Where you are getting confused about the cost of electricity is shutting down already running coal / gas plants. shutting these down and then re installing new renewable sources to make up the difference are going to be more expensive in the short - medium term. The plants already exist, the only cost is the fuel and maintenance.
why do you think that everybody agrees with you?
the viking says there does not exist lung cancer without pollution. I wonder what he thinks brain cancer or bone cancer is caused by?
@@orionbetelgeuse1937Various pollutions in many combinations cause many types of cancers and other disease. Particulates can cross blood/brain barrier. But don't trust me, look it up yourself. Pollutions cost society a fortune.
Fuel in a power plant is a massive expense. As is maintenance, along with a small army of employees
For a 1 GW power plant, it burns *9000 tons* of coal per *DAY*.
At current pricing, thats over $1 Million USD per day.
Then there's the waste treatment costs...
Solar farms consume no fuel, and only need a small maintenance crew. Solar farms, including utility scale batterys, are also significantly cheaper to install then a thermal power plant.
@@jeffl4810 then why are the prices increasing? I think you miscalculated the price of the batteries.
@@orionbetelgeuse1937
Ummm, no.
Investments are NOT free, and in the case of capital equipment used by utilities, are expected to last many decades.
Ripping out a functioning FF power plant before it's amortization lifespan period is over has serious cost implications.
Solar farms + utility batterys cost on the order of 20% the cost of a FF fired thermal plant to install. That still amounts to around $1B USD per 1 GWavg
A 1GW FF plant costs around $5B USD to install. $400-500 million to fuel, staff + maintain annually
Retiring it early, could mean, say $2B amortization hasn't been paid off. That money has to come from somewhere...
A 1 GWavg solar farm is in the order of $1B, and is on the order of $5-20 million annual staffing and maintenance.
No comparison...
That, and that market is probably highly manipulated...
Thank you for the informative video, I like the idea of combining of 30% offshore Wind turbine farm, 30% Geothermal, 30% Thorium nuclear reactors for Australian energy needs. IMO solar panels/lithium iron batteries are bad at the end of their life in terms of rare earth minerals being used that are not recyclable, thus damage to the soil eventually. Not to mention solar panels are susceptible to hale damage as well as weather changing effects which a few countries have the capability of!
The whole world is going through a once in 100 year disruptive revolution. All my life everything has been the same as far as power generation is concerned. Now we have roof-top solar, battery storage, wind farms and solar farms and so on. When evs become the norm in the future, they have the capacity to provide a huge amount of power to the grid during the peak times, and get paid well for it. All future vehicles must have V to G as do school buses in other countries do now. It still will take another decade to sort itself out but as time goes by the quicker things will happen.
In my lifetime (70 years) I have seen just about everything else change dramatically, from propellers to jets, sputnik to starlink, the invention then the demise of the VHS almost overnight, and 35mm film, and then computers and mobile phones that are now not just for the rich. The bulky tube tv was invented, and now they are all paper thin, and in colour too, and as big as a house! Money? what is that, everything is online now. Everyone has a bank card, air conditioning, a microwave, and modern cars can nag you more than any spouse. It WILL happen the world is a changin.
If you produce power, you are the grid. It requires no thought.
💯 and the same with electric vehicles. I talked to a work mate the other day who needs a runabout for his wife to drop the kids to school etc. We have access to 100% tax deductible leases on EVs and he can plug it in at home every night and he won’t even consider it due to the brainwashing and negatively around them.
I’m getting mine in a couple of months, can’t wait!
I have been wondering, if the government subsidised 50% of the cost of solar and battery for a home, how many homes could they make energy independent for the price of a new coal or nuclear power plant and how much power would that add to the grid compared to a power plant.
Considering that the home owners will foot half of the bill, it may be far better value for money than building a power plant.
A solar system is $ 10k so $ 5k per house and we have 7m without solar. The cost is $ 35billion. Not a bad return and 70GW of Solar on roofs.
@@TimMountjoy-zy2fd No good without batteries to store surplus. Taxes are used to subsidize renewables and Politicians Super schemes invest in renewables. If we get solar we pay for it, if we don't get solar we still pay for it. So why are service charges so high? If 11million homes have solar aren't they providing a service? Every one with solar should charge a service charge to the big providers.
@@TimMountjoy-zy2fd what of cost the transmission lines? Estimated at around a trillion.
@@robertfonovic3551 if you install solar on roofs you don't need to spend money on transmission lines. The infrastructure is already there
@@FlintStone-c3s the point is subsidise systems with solar and batteries. If the government was to subsidise 7M systems I am sure they will get an amazing price for the batteries.
In US state of California electric rates have exploded with increased wind and solar. The rates would be even higher if not for keeping the state's last nuclear power plant going. A big cause of the increased power costs are shutting down another nuclear power plant. While wind and solar electricity is cheap the intermittency and seasonality of this power has been requiring very expensive back-up power. A solution to this problem is the nuclear power plant being built by Terrapower in the state of Wyoming. This plant is a high temperature reactor that also stores power as heat in molten salt tanks. This enables the plant to produce extra power when the renewables can't. What it does is it enables greater use of low cost renewable power with a reliable back up. Another benifit is this nuclear plant replaces the use of coal in a coal burning plant.
Well, who do you think is paying for all those windmills and solar farms? Government borrowing or private equity firms. It's common sense when you shut down a system that has been built over many years and try and replace it with a new one in just a few years. What is so unbelievable about that? The consumer always pays.
Australian state and federal governments subsidised fossil fuels to the tune of AUD $14.5 billion in the previous financial year.
SA electricity with highest solar - most expensive retail in Aus. Coal is crap and dangerous even though we have a lot of it. Coal power stations are becoming unreliable because they have ceased maintenance - closing in a couple of years. Battery storage is by far the most expensive way to provide electricity which is the negative for renewables.
Agreed
If a majority of people get solar, then the grid cost will go up massively. You can't eat the cake and have it left. You can't expect the be self sufficient 10 months and expect 2 months be free. The grid costs are there every day every week and year. So the new economy is, energy will be cheaper but the grid costs will explode.
…but the grid can work both ways
@@markthomasson5077 Yes, but the solar production during daytime will be higher than the demand in most grids. Then add wind production in the equation and we will have challenges with grid balancing and revenues/profitability in energy production and distribution.
Sam, I still do not understand what the reason for higher power bills in Australia is. What is the reason?
Incompetent government over many yrs. We basically allow multinational companies to export our gas at zero or little in the form of taxes or royalties. Little is reserved for our own use. We are now entering the point whereby some of the exported gas will be
Resold back to us at inflated prices.The state of Sth Australia has the highest energy costs due to their rush to renewables.
Sam, your figures are based on an estimate of the cost of electricity. If renewable are cheaper then the cost of electricity will come down & therefore the savings will be more marginal. When I bought my solar system 10 years ago, it did not look like it would pay itself back, but it was the best decision for the planet because previous governments were climate sceptics. Because prices have risen dramatically, it has paid for itself.
10.00 pm and according to NEMWATCH we are using 16 percent renewable energy
Wind has picked up slightly
Wind gen 1445mw
Tonight yet again batteries will be charged with mostly coal and gas
If we had another 100,000mw of wind towers producing at the same percentage as the existing ones and no fossil fuels or alternative baseload power we would still be short of power by around 5,000mw
We are screwed once the coal plants close if we don't have alternative power
Fossil fuels make money, "alternative' energy costs money. Or does anyone seriously believe saudi arabia and norway fund their oil projects with their excess solar and wind wealth??
Precisely
I encourage every Aussie to do a back of the napkin assessment of how many houses in Oz we could equip with a home battery and complete solar panel setup instead of the Snowy River 2.0 scheme. The answer is about 800,000.
I like hydro. But not on a famously dry continent.
19million registered vehicles, cost to replace and infrastructure to charge them? Who pays for it?
800,000 homes with 10 kWh batteries would be 8 GWh storage depth. Snowy Hydro will be 350 GWh.
@@FlintStone-c3sthe taxpayer?
Do I win?
@@bingxilao9086Dispatchable capacity will be an additional 2.2 gigawatts. All for a mere 15 billion. 😅😅
@@robertfonovic3551 well the home batteries would be about 3 GW, so not that different, and the storage depth is also important, especially in future decades as we get more renewables.
People don't want to change....... there was a time when people did not want to give up their oil burning lamps for electric light bulbs. Among their fears was electrocution and electrical fires but the world still moved forward
Electrical fires and fear of electrocution were valid. The initial systems wires lacked any form of insulating material. Homes did burn, and people did die.
@@robertfonovic3551 WOW...... The point was the world still moved forward with the electric world. And it is still electrical fires and electrocution to this day so make a point of a point to a point wow smh
Have induction stove tops been highlighted on this forum? Induction is a great way to lower bills, while reducing daily releases of carbon streams.
It shouldn't be so confusing to you. Roughly a third of Australian houses are owned and paid for, another third are subject to finance and are being paid off, and the other third are rentals. It's very difficult for people who are renting to get solar installations, so when everyone else has solar and are self sufficient, there are less people paying for coal fired power, so the price has to go up. Simple economics, but a complex problem to solve. Somehow we have to figure out how to get solar onto rental properties AND build more affordable homes which are already in short supply.
Australia is not the birthplace of Rupert Murdoch for nothing 😅
What I dont understand is why most large manufacturing companies and transport companies who tend to have large under cover areas are not making use of the real estate by fitting them with solar panels.
Most of them don't own the property but rent it. We need the Gov to push the landlords whether commercial or houses to put Solar Systems on their properties.
They are doing that in China.
@@TimMountjoy-zy2fd It should be a requirement on all new builds to have solar water heaters, solar panels and wiring provision for future EV charging in the garage, if there is one. Obviously if a contractor is building a new development they should be able to do this cheaper than an individual.
@horsebee1 I suspect that a possible reason is that modern factories / warehouses and big box stores are built to just satisfy minimum building standards - and the additional loading on the roof might exceed that. But there was a 2021 study of Walmart in the US that reckoned if they put panels on the roofs of their stores they could power provide 50% of their electricity costs (equivalent to 800,000 American homes) - and I completely agree with you that it makes much more sense to put large installations on roofs in urban areas than to build huge farms in the middle of nowhere.
@@TimMountjoy-zy2fdwhich would increase rents. Great idea😅
As if businesses aren't suffering enough already.
@@ralphzoombeenie2330don't believe it. It's BS.
By the way, Radon gas has been found to be the number one cause of lung cancer in nonsmokers, of course generally in the areas where radon gas is prevalent. Now in some areas, you cant sell a house until you get radon levels done and disclose this information.
I just wish my seven year old asphalt shingle roof would last that long. I can't imagine how much it would cost to remove the solar to redo the roof.
Surging prices are common effect solar and wind once over 30% of the grid. One way to deal with this is fossil fuel peaker plant which are very expensive ways to produce electricity. A climate comparable way to deal with this problem is high temperature nuclear with heat storage. Doing this results in the lowest price electric prices.
I did the math. I don't drive much, about 1-2K miles/yr. So, why buy an EV? With a PV roof a big cost is the battery. An EV can be my house battery. Backup is the grid.
People identify with the manipulative thoughts. One has to search for answers to get answers.
There's wisdom in just hiring somebody licensed to install solar at your residence. But for me, just x5 100W solar panels, a lead acid car battery and an inverter is enough to run a window AC unit off grid. All in, it might be $700 USD.
Perhaps they could complain about the money being spent on nuclear submarines. Perhaps they could stop promoting vastly more expensive nuclear power generation. As if !.
Sky Noise after dark doesn't do that either.
'They', are not the present government. I could not think of a more expensive and dumb idea re nuclear power. Elon once said that if you made a solar array 25km x 25km in the middle of the Australian desert, you could power the whole world during sunlight hours. Get a map of Ausi and plot an array this size on it, you would be flat out seeing it. His point being that a few of these solar farms spread around the globe could save the world etc, and then just add plenty of super cheap Sulphur batteries.............................
Let's jsut say those of us who do not read the Murdoch press or other mainstream media know better than to believe anything they print.
Everyone needs to know solar is the cheapest source of energy. They don't care about air quality but everyone likes to save money.
And I blame you for the high prices on unbuttoned white shirts and blond hair dye😂
I think a class action is in order 😄😁
If solar farms were good, they would grow naturally on the planet. We should not be adding to our environmental footprint by building cheap solar farms while increasing global emissions to manufacture them. We have gone past the tipping point & increasing emissions is not acceptable. The problem is that investors dont care as long as they are getting returns.
One day soon we will be hitting the tipping point where traditional power generation can't make enough revenue to operate and maintain the infrastructure before solar and wind take over, especially if they have to buy back power from solar customers. Even with the majority of users on renewables , we will need the grid to be available to fill in and to back up for a while until one day all power is local and no grid needed. The industry has been trying for many years to use its power and influence to halt, impede, or tax renewables in order to maintain its monopolies. They will eventually fail altogether but expect them to fight hard and use tactics like misinformation coupled with price increases to hold on a bit longer. Bottom line: fear is a great tactic for getting what you want and sadly too many people respond more to fear than facts.
One Hectare Solar Park produces 1 Million kWh in Groningen Nederland. Solar Radiation Index,
SRI 1. In Australia 2 Million kWh per hectare. SRI 2. Every year. A EV Car goes 6 km per kWh. 12 Million km per Hectare in Australia. Thank You Again Sam for this video. ❤👍
Politically, much of these complaints come from the right. I find this strange as self reliance and taking responsibility for ones circumstances is a conservative value.
I have always looked for opportunity to improve my house's energy performance. When I remodel, I add insulation. The goal is not only to reduce costs, but also to improve utility. The comfort is much improved. These same people while complaining about the up front costs, think nothing about laying out 30 k for a new kitchen, even though it doesn't improve the structural performance of the house.
Even though the cost of electricity is relatively low, we have installed panels in anticipation of increased electricity use with an EV and heat pumps. It is also a hedge against inflation. The same rational for buying a house. It may not be completely rational compared to renting in the present moment, but rents tend to go up, while the mortgage payment stays the same. Its also a hedge against bad decisions on the part of government and corporate greed. While we will get a heat pump at some point, it will be tied into a central heat gas furnace. If one party or another gets greedy, we can switch energy systems, while producing as much as possible by ourselves.
Keep with it mate. You are very much on point. We bought a solar system 13yrs ago when they were really expensive it still paid itself off in under 5yrs. We have since installed a Tesla Battery - since then we are running our fully electric 4x2 home and EV on solar 92% of the time on average over a full year. Our system is only a 4.4kw system with Electric SolaHart hot water system! It really is a no brainer. But you can keeping paying oil company’s and oil states for oil and gas at ridiculous prices that fluctuate by the day or harvest free sun and wind and store it… you don’t need a high IQ to work out which is better for Australia and the planet…
Well Sky News Australia, should be sure for all their lies. Why does Australia not have a code of conduct so you can't tell lies?
Squirrel eyes babbling in a irritating voice, EVs this Renewables that
@@drttgb4955 squirrel eyes....😅😅😅😅
Yes comrade 😅😅😅
You believe everything you hear on here then?
Priceless.
my concern is that the grid $kWh supply rate is set at 100% 'support' from all the customers on the grid.
If the combination of rooftop PV and BV with OVERSIZED battery that is free to store excess electricity from any building carpark space means that customers do not need grid electricity when the sunshines 🌞 😀 😉
The grid investment must have cash flow,
adequate cash flow.
$kWh rates must increase for the remaining customers.
Mining industrial processes, burning waste & bush fires can also cause lung cancers. It's not just fossil fuels.
Large mining companies are investing heavily in solar power in WA.
@ralphzoombeenie2330 This will not stop people's exposure to dust which can cause lung disease & cancer.
Sam let Shana know we are hoping she can keep pushing! Cheers from nj, usa to your fam Sam.
Great content keep it up
Coal is the cheapest form of energy. Especially for Australia. Because it can run 24/24 and coal is cheap.
It's NOT propaganda that solar and wind result in higher power bills. IT'S FACTS. Because they are intermittent, solar and wind require DUPLICATE backup generation facilities that have to operate very inefficiently on permanent standby.
“. . . a naïve observer might conclude that the rising share of new renewables (solar and wind) will usher in an era of falling electricity prices. But in reality, the opposite has been true.” Vaclav Smil, Numbers Don’t Lie, p.172
In my case solar + battery was a great investment. I pay no power or gas bills and only remain connected to the grid for backup I'm considering providing that from my EV
5:03 "37% of Australians think that closing" coal and building green has already raised prices. Technically its probably true. Although loans are taken and costs amortized, there are sundry integration, inspection, and management costs to switching, or for that matter doing anything at all different. And these sorts of costs may add 2-5% to the bills so long as the changes are ongoing. However using solar or wind is like locking in a contract fixed price for the source used, technically zero for wind and sunlight, but the land costs something. Try getting a fixed 20 year cost for coal or oil today. If the true cost of burning carbon is included, the coal is going to go up 5x, with 90% of that cost offsetting recapture to prevent global catastrophe. 5% now or 500% later?
I don't know how gas prices have moved in AU since 2020 but if those went up 30% and power went up 30% a sane person would see that as being correlated, and not due to going green. Markets for energy supplies are intertwined. If Oil goes up, producers shift the load to nuclear or other fossil fuel and the price will rise across the board. Exception if you are 100% green and isolated, but that is quite a ways off in the future. Most of the price increases are due to fuel cost rising, but probably a little is from integration of new Green power integration.
Imagine though, how smug the trickster is, who doubles his fee to sell you dirty fuel oil energy, and blames it on the green sources that are threatening (and soon ending) his business. And being rich, and in charge, they control the media you hear. So you hear this a lot. In America 100% of people are saying that "nobody wants EVs" and "they can't sell 'em" meanwhile sales of EVs are up again in 2024, while cars sales overall are dropping. Big news locally is a "Chrysler" dealer who was soaking up inventory as "fleet sales" wants to cancel his dealership and send 14,000 vehicles back. I don't think a single one is an EV. Its unreal how they get Boomers to agree to all tell the same lie at the same time.
It's funny Melbourne West had blackout on Saturday morning as got a text messages from powercor stating this
High capital cost and high inflation are not your friends. Fuel cost is essentially zero but wind, solar and required battery storage are multiples more expensive in terms of capital recovery than legacy generation there replacing. On-going maintenance and capital replacement cost of wind turbines is also high relative to annualized KwHr output. All installed MWs are not equal. Availability of wind solar significantly less than traditional base load generation.
Here in Australia we have a generation that is poorly educated and resistant to change. I am part of this generation. I know many people who are like this. All of them do not have wifi or a computer. Vote conservative. But they do have a low end mobile, strange eh.
So let me get this straight. The more power sources there are the more expensive it is? But the fossil fuel power generation that was there before is still there. So how did fossil fuel get MORE expensive then? And how is renewable power being sold if it's more expensive than fossil fuels?
We aren't all as fantastic like you mr vicking
It’s called trapped by tradition, we are all guilty of it in some way.
Are we supposed to pretend that Australia isn't selling its oil, coal, and LNG to China? 👈
Energy should be VERY CHEAP in Australia and everyone knows it. Solar and wind energy is expensive!
And solar panels are not universally free for all Australian citizens. It's just not true.
Australia resumed coal exports to China after a nearly two-year ban was lifted in early 2022.
By April 2023, China had overtaken Japan as Australia's top coal market, with exports reaching 6.87 million metric tons of coal to China in that month alone.
Energy was cheap until we linked our Gas to overseas markets and now we pay 3 X the price else the gas owner will sell it abroad. Coal has become expensive since the Chinese became massive buyers. Solar and Wind is actually very cheap but they lack reliability.
thay may have trouble understanding as the price in all the states are priced within $
renewable may be keeping coal profitable
Solar panels are black, they absorb light and emmit large amounts of infrared radiation. Luckily they also produce electricity, which you can use for your AC and electric wheeled incinerator.
I love my EV, solar power is my next step. People complain about the cost of EV’s but that’s so short sighted. Not only are there incentives, but how much a week does someone spend to fuel their ICE vehicle? In the US it as costing me $75 PER vehicle PER week. If you take out the cost to fuel even one vehicle that’s $300/month you can shave directly off the monthly payment, that buys a lot more car then you can get in an ICE vehicle.
Go for it brother. It's a no brainer and you will never look back.
I'm in Sydney. I want to install roof solar but my wife against because she saw many ppl got bad roof leaking issue after install 5 years which cost more to repair. Can anyone give any suggestion about it? Also, any suggestion if I need the battery or not base on the cost?
As ever a portion of the energy argument is missed out. Wind and solar are sources of energy; ELECTRICITY IS THE TRANSMISSION MEDIUM NOT THE ENERGY SOURCE . If you want 24 hour energy then you require storage or backup. Since wind and sun are available about 40% of the time and AVAILABLITY DOES NOT COINCIDE WITH THE DEMAND PROFILE there is aproblem. From 9am to 3 pm cheap power is available to all not just roof top panel owners.
Between 3pm and 9pm, the peak demand time, price is increased 5-7 times and applies to all users including roof top panel owners
I asked Sam about what size battery he got for his 23 kwh system. Very strange no response.
Sam, please let us know if you got batteries
Most homes will need a battery to make this all viable.
@@tireddad6541don't hold your breath. 😊
@@liamgross7217at 20k au. No thanks