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Please do a followup! What about a bottle with a 1 inch opening, you can drop the liquid in your mouth in a single motion, or take of the cork with your teeth, if you only got one hand free. You should try a belt pouch, as taking something from your pack should take one round, IMO. Sidearms are kept at your belt for fast draw, why not potions, for instance? In a critical hit, I let players choose to break one piece of equipment or take 2x damage, this could do it. Imagine breaking a fire potion, for instance!
My feeling about old-school rounds (at the time, and I remember lots of arguments about this) was that during that one minute of combat, you're feinting, parrying, manouevering for position, and at some point during it, there's a moment where you might actually land a blow. (AD&D 1e also had a unit of time called a "segment", which was 1/.10 of a round, or....hey, 6 seconds!). Spell casting times were often in segments, and weapons had speeds wihich could influence your weapons speeds -- though I admit I don't recal anyone ever actually *caring* about eitther of these or actually enforcing them into their combats. I think both came from much more fiddly wargame rulesets, where that sort of minute bookkeeping was a huge part of the game.) That still makes more sense to me, intuitively, as a way of dealing with time passing, but some people got really hung up on how long it took to swing their sword. Anyway, all this to say that, in D&D, time, like hit points, is an abstraction. :)
@@autographedcat I used segments. As I recall, spellcasters would declare what they were casting at the start of the round, but the spells wouldn't fire until after all the attacks had occurred, and if they took any damage at all while casting the spells would fizzle. We figured the casting time told us how much time was necessary to cast, and thus how much was left for movement. Longer casting times permitted less movement during the round. I still think 1 minute rounds make more sense. This 6-second thing is just weird. I blame Baldur's Gate (which used a 6-second round, though the manual explicitly said this was not rule-accurate, and simply sped up to make the computer game more fun).
@@autographedcat I think the segment/round stuff was gygax's specific standardised convention rules he added to AD&D, which yeah sounds wargamey. Basic D&D used slightly different definitions of have 10 minute turns (used as 'time units' for dungeon exploration and stuff) and 10 second rounds (for combat or more "zoomed in" actions). for Basic, drinking takes one 10 second round which actually seems like a good round-off based on this video LOL
Indoor or outdoor combat? Outdoor was a full minute round but indoor was 6 seconds per round. A turn is 10 rounds either way. Although that's AD&D 2nd... Not sure about 1st...
I always imagined health potions being little test tube sized amount of liquid that get set into leather loops on the belt and that's why it only takes 6 seconds
That's because they are, but even smaller than a test tube! D&D potions are 1oz / 30mL, listed in both the PHB and DMG. I had a super hardcore DM who wanted us to account for all weight and where things were on our bodies, and he got a bit miffed when I informed him it would be 16 potions to a pound :P
@@NightEyes042The book says "most", not "all". If rarity is taken into consideration, most could just be common potions because they are ecactly that, common. However, it does not specify when or why potions are more or less than 1 oz. so it is wide open for personal interpretation at each table.
This is absolutely wonderful! Bob your videos are great entertainment, I like the way you test things Mythbusters-style and you and your friends seem like you really enjoy what you’re doing, that’s great! Thank you for putting in so much effort to make this neat video!
6:30 The Jug of Health. It's a full action to drink from the jug. Each time you drink you decide between 1 and 3 gulps. Heal 1d6+1 per gulp, each gulp expends one charge. Contains 50 charges. Any appropriately sized filled bottle will become a potion of minor healing (2d4+2) and consume 1 charge when filled
Love the idea, though I think a poured-out portion should either heal the same as a single gulp or cost more than a single gulp (preferably the former since it makes a bit more sense, though the latter could create more cost-reward factor-do you spread out your gulps to bottles to aid your party at diminished effect, or hold it all in the jug to maximize benefit while limiting it to one user?).
If you want to drink faster, give the bottle a little spin. Here it's called the "tornado". Don't attempt with any sparkly liquid tho unless you want it all over! After playing some Dark and Darker, I've started to imagine potions on the belt or at least a very close to grab belt pouch. Not actually in the backpack. Something I've wondered in general. Do we assume our heroes are fighting with all of their equipment on their back? Or do they put it down somewhere?
That depends on how much encumbrance you are cool with having in and out of combat, I guess I normally have my characters leave heavy or less used stuff in a vehicle or at camp, carry general gear in a bag that can be either fastened or not for secure traversal or easy dropping and keep combat gear on their person
Great points! A bunch of other folks in the comments seem to agree that adventurers basically need a quick-release holster, maybe a cork/cap that you can flick off with your thumb, and only a tiny volume of liquid! The other awesome suggestion I heard was to use one of those goofy helmets that hold drinks with straws attached to them xD
@@ADT1995 Oh, OR we have a cartoon Back-bag, where we can just put our hand behind the back and get it from there. Like any Looney Tunes character can summon hammers, pies and pianos.
According to the Merriam-Webster Dictionary, though most the definitions for Liquor are alcoholic, one is "Watery solution of a drug" which would be appropriate for a health potion.
@@BobWorldBuilder That's pretty much expected of Gygax's writing from what I've seen of it. He'd rarely go for a common word if he could use an obscure synonym instead.
Probably need your potion to be in an easily accessible belt pouch, which incidentally would mean having a limited supply available to you during combat.
@@Tysto Worn items rule. Unless targeted, they don't take damage unless there is a specified ability to do so. Example would be rust monster. Could do away with that rule but then you are opening yourself to a whole mess of item HP tracking. Do not recommend.
@@TheSteam02 Funnily enough, I really don't mind that argument when there isn't rules covering for an action you want to take or trying to rule of cool things. I really don't like it when GMs use it to punish players for petty reasons. It should be realistic to the setting but a little touch of realism helps ground games alot more than people think.
It's also important to remember that an action IS LESS THAN 6 seconds because an action does not take an entire round but is only a chunky portion of it.
Makes you think of how stressed a spell caster must be trying to remember all their spells, read the combat, and successfully cast all in real time for them
First time hearing “Steve the animal” I wondered how they got the name and was given an immediate reason lol that chug might as well be a bonus action 😂
We had an NPC we had to escort for a bit that was addicted to health potions, drank most he could steal or buy. It was pretty funny… I guess you had to be there!
I used to make explicit that all of my potions were in metal vials, of the 1 ounce size, because I was always afraid of breaking a bunch of glass potions over my character's spellbook in his backpack in case he ever fell over or worse. If you want to have more realistic speeds for using a potion either you could turn them into tiles that the user just has to break to make the spell work or another magic item like Pathfinder's Sipping Vest; where you spill the potion on the vest beforehand and just need to sip the neck of the vest.
For Pathfinder 1e specifically, all potions are 1 oz anyway. Though the metal vials is a specific item that you can put your potions into (1 sp, weighs 1lb... which is a little high).
We house rule that drinking a "readied" potion (carried in the hand, stored in a belt pouch, tied to a belt etc.) is a bonus action. Retrieving one from a backpack or bag of holding (or similar) EDIT: and drinking it is a full round action.
We are generally doing something similar, but I like the idea of it taking two combat rounds , and taking a free attack against. Still feels like chugging the prepped potion and dropping the bottle is still a a 6 second full action.
@@BobWorldBuilder started watching you years ago, think it was Dragon of Icespire Peak, with just you as DM and Grace the player. Just drink the flagon, let's see that. I liked this vid so much that I'm putting this on my tumblr.
Yeah...when you see potions of health in a lot of manga, my prime example being Goblin Slayer...which is VERY D&D in how things work as spell casters have a limited amount of spells they can cast per day and must rest a full day to get a recharge..if they use components then they have a limited amount and when they run out they are done casting. Anyway, when you see potions in Goblin Slayer they are usually in bottles...not round bottom bottles like the iconic potion but something more cylindrical with a cork. In the spin-off "Year One" which is all about Goblin Slayer's early years, his health potion BREAKS in his pouch when he lands wrong...what does he do? He wrings the cloth it soaked into and sucks it out of the cloth...not as effective but it does help heal his wounds and he lives another day.
This is why I always specify my character has some sort of belt pouch, potion bandolier, or tactical vest. I don't like the idea of whipping out a backpack or burlap sack mid-fight. Also, that bottle shape is really slowing you down, I've always imagined the vials to be rectangularly shaped with a gentle slope towards the rim.
100% these bottles needed to be completely inverted to empty them, and the tiny neck on them really doesn't help. At this point I'm imagining potions to be like wide mouth cylindrical jars, but the whole jar is about the size of a shot glass, and like you said, strapped somewhere for easy reach
Usually at a LARP I'd have a belt with pouches, where I'd store healing potions for quick access. Makes them easier to access quickly. The backpack is for things you can sit down and take time to access. (Like a journal or ritual kit)
Just imagine the alternate timeline where they decide they need to go with the AD&D wording and get progressively destroyed by booze potions during the shoot.
My home rules for health potions is you can use a full action to restore by dice roll, or use it out of combat to use the full 10 hp, since; especially after this video, you can’t get the whole bottle in six seconds
@@benvoliothefirst i mean, first off, the type of bottle they used is not conducive to chugging like one would have to for a potion. second, 2 of them didnt drink it in one round, the other did, and id put basically every adventurer above 66% of the youtuber population lmao. i do also like the dual ruling, but i have it downshifted to action VS BA because A dnd's not a physics engine, and B, the duality of the system gives players in combat more options
Mine's similar but a bit more powerful, I usually say that they can either use a bonus action and roll the dice, or use an action to get the max. Giving someone else a potion always takes one action and a dice roll, but it can be done out of combat to get the max.
I've heard it said (In a dragon magazine I think) that the potion activates when the liquid touches you. In the older editions of the game the potions were given a different description "See Below". I think the current image of potions comes from video game design where a larger bottle is easier to place in the world and collect (Imagine Skyrim with tiny bottles it could be annoying to grab them off tables, and less visually appealing). If we use the smaller description it's a little closer to the game mechanic. I personally home rule that a bandolier or similar holster could allow you to grab the potion as part of a move action and if you have the quick draw feat you can do it as a free action (if you have it stored away it takes a move action to retrieve it). Physical Description 3rd/3.5 edition A typical potion or oil consists of 1 ounce of liquid held in a ceramic or glass vial fitted with a tight stopper. The stoppered container is usually no more than 1 inch wide and 2 inches high. The vial has AC 13, 1 hit point, hardness 1, and a break DC of 12. Vials hold 1 ounce of liquid. Additionally it took a standard action to drink and provoked an attack of opportunity.
@@BobWorldBuilder very good point. I’d also add that most adventure should be well equipped, and the potion probably needs to touch the skin at the very least. Think of an open wound where the armour was ripped off in the attack. Given that, I think it’s more reliable to drink the potion then to dump it on yourself. Finally I can’t remember where this is from but something like the potion loses its potency quickly when exposed. Check out the anime Overlord: Brain vs Cocytus fight for a good show of potion use (overlord is heavily influenced by D&D).
Yep that makes the most sense to me now. Basically needing a quick-release holster, maybe a cork/cap that you can flick off with your thumb, and only a tiny volume of liquid!
@Bob World Builder I use the optional potion is a bonus action rule. So I also offer my players cheaper, larger potions that do take a full action. Same healing power, cheaper price and you support low level clerics that may not be that good at brewing.
I agree. My group uses the 3-slot quick item pouch rule from the Baldur's Gate games. Also, potion vials are 4 oz. maximum--and they don't have to be full. A vial can be a tube with a large mouth and a long cork that can be popped off with a thumb. Who has two hands free anyways. The bottles you guys have look more like Diablo style potion bottles, not vials. I would also suggest that a free action takes no actual time from your round. You do it in parallel with an action or start it during the prior round.
This is absolutely my favorite D&D video out of all D&D videos ever made by anyone, even though we didn't even get into how silly it is for potions to immediately take effect the moment they are swallowed. "Magic" isn't going to enter your bloodstream that quickly, let alone be delivered to the wounded areas in a single beat of the heart. But you can't go down that rabbit hole without tackling the monster that is 'what are hitpoints and how are you able to carry on when taking damage from all of the deadly attacks that nearly every stat block suggests?'
I've recently imagined the use of potions as combat compatible, with a The Witcher vibe. I have nothing against the minibar shield, or the gnome camelback or hat tank with straws, and generally allow the following rule : Drinking a potion is a bonus action. Make someone else drink your potion without drowning him is a complete action (Or two actions if the target is awake and doesn't consent One for the grapple action, the other for the saving throw). But it's great to have a video on it, and not trying this at home. You guys are professionals. Especially Steve.
Yeah witcher style minibottles within easy reach is the only way to go while maintaining a fantasy aesthetic for me. Beer can helmet fits the time constraint, but probably not great in combat!
3e detailed the size of potions: "A typical potion or oil consists of 1 ounce of liquid held in a ceramic or glass vial fitted with a tight stopper. The stoppered container is usually no more than 1 inch wide and 2 inches high." 5e uses the same economy and mundane equipment costs/weights as 3e and PF1e, so we use airplane bottles as examples (1.7 fl oz. with 1oz of liquid). The "liquor" callback from 1e helps further reinforce that potions were shots of medicine instead of beverages. We sometimes bring airplane bottles with custom labels printed on them just to make sure that we have a little "medicine" at the table.
The definition of a 'vial' is "small glass or plastic vessel or bottle....". While admittedly subjective, I wouldn't consider the volume of roughly half a can of soda to be "small", so I find it weird that this is the standard volume of a healing potion. Another issue with these bottles is the shape. Due to it having a very round shape and a clearly shaped neck, the liquid will be sloshing and blocking airflow, making it take longer to flow out. Flagons don't have this issue which is why some can chug one in 6 seconds. Smaller vials will also be easier to eat once they are emptied out. In the end I definitely agree with Crawford. It's a game rule, and while it's fun to experiment with some of them in real life to see if they make sense, for a game they need to make sense in a different context. Which means balancing the cost vs benefit of using it. And from what I heard, the general consensus is already that healing potions are lacking.
@@BobWorldBuilder i think for sure there would be some sort of quick-access thing for potions. if adventurers knew they were getting into a fight, they wouldnt chuck their potions into the bottom of their bag.
@@turquoise7817 They also would not drink it _during_ a fight other than after putting significant distance or an obstacle between them and their assailant. You would have something similar to the Incapacitated condition during the process, besides the likelihood of messing up the process under pressure.
@@IamsTokiWartooth I was speaking about realistic simulation, not prescribing anyone necessarily do that. If you want to hand-waive the practical concerns of taking your attention off of your opponent to retrieve a container, open it, and drink it in the middle of while they are attempting to kill you (which most games do to some extent), then that is what suits your game. If you want to talk verisimilitude, drinking potions would take a significant amount of time and be extremely dangerous (before even considering how long it takes the potion to take effect and whether it would help in within the timeframe of the fight in the first place). The entire premise of drinking potions in the middle of combat where the determining factors of permanent to fatal injury occur in fractions of a second is nonsensical in the first place if you place much emphasis on realism or internal logic.
I let a player who is playing an alchemist artificer in one of my games cast certain potions as a bonus actions via injection. He has a syringe gun which felt appropriate. Healing potions still cost an action.
Please do another video of potion drinking with the following tests ... 1. A potion belt/sash for faster potion retrieving. 2. A more viscus potion. Gravy potions anyone? 3. Giving someone else a healing potion when they are injured or unconscious.
Bob and crew, you guys are just wonderful. Quote of the day: - World Builder: "I think that counts" - World Destroyer: "AH, YOU'RE DEAD!" Thanks for doing these videos, they are so much fun!
I kind of meet the PHB & DMG halfway, where a 1 oz "dose" of potion heals for 2d4+2, but since a vial can contain 4 oz a vial can have up to 4 doses. A player may hastily down the entire vial as a Bonus Action or take a measured amount as an Action, being careful to save some for later. So if there's 4 doses, you better either want that whole 8d4+2, or slow down & take an Action.
Love it! We have no real concept of how long things take. Regardless of semantic details of how an adventurer ight have a different pack, or where they would keep a vial, or whatever else some might say, it is still silly to think one could do all those things in 6 seconds. Good going Bob!
Well, having the potion in a side pocket or belt pouch would make it a lot faster then a modern drawstring sack. However, I've always thought it should be a full action to drink a health potion. Just because it falls under the eat/drink umbrella. You have to hold it over your face and swallow. It would be the same as cramming a handful of food and chewing it while at a half run, and as a restaurant worker who has eaten standing up at work for over a decade I can say that if you try to quickly eat a couple bites quickly while breathing hard you're going to choke
@@BouncingTribbles Yes but the average modern restaurant worker also isn't capable of backflipping above a dragon while stabbing it two times in the face in the same movement or isn't capable of doing 10 full force swings with a great maul right after running in just 6 seconds.
@@tetsudo6934 maybe not, but walking thirty feet and making an attack? Why go to higher level? You can drink a potion at level 1. Though you do bring up an interesting point, your characters don't necessarily represent average beings in the world; however, your point is invalid in this discussion. We ARE working with average humans as our baseline, Bob and co are hardly Olympians
@@BouncingTribbles Which is why using their test as a discussion of physical capability or plausability of a feat for adventurer makes no sense. I go to higher levels because the ruling don't change, whatever the level may be and it illustrates better why it's a bit ridiculous to compare adventurers to average (and in the case of bob, i'd argue possibly physically lower than average) human beings. Adventurers at level 1 are also capable of running a baseline of 60 feet, whatever their fitness level may be, from a standing start, in full combat gear (which may weigh upwards of 80 pounds for some classes) in about 4 seconds (given that they have a bonus action to take, it's not their full turn to dash). The average martial class can take a full on greatsword strike to the face at level 1 and be fine. The average adventurer can lift their entire weight above their head, even when factoring their equipment (10 strength is 300 pound max lift) which is a hell of a physical feat.
I feel like the largest barrier to success on some of these is the shape of the bottles. Vials are typically strait sided unlike bottles, which changes the fluid dynamics involved and let's the fluids move faster
Yeah these bottles were probably the least functional shape for fast drinking, but they look cool! Tiny bottles and potion-ready belts or pouches is definitely the way to go!
Any character who keeps their health potions at the bottom of their pack, deserves a Darwin award. I value a little realism, so I imagine a metal 1 oz test-tube like vial (metal so it doesn't break during a fall or in combat) with a slightly oversized stopper (easily removed with the thumb of one hand), being held to the outside of a pack or even belt or sash with a strap for quick access. However, if you want the high fantasy video game image of a glass vial I'm not going to complain - you do you.
See, this is why engineers and alchemists need to redesign the potion bottle to be a two cork device so you can essentially shotgun your potions. That or get one of those helmets with the beer can holders and straws for on the go potion consumption.
Beer can helmet is the only way this works lol, also someone commented that Pathfinder potions are only 1oz? Good for those designers taking this seriously!!
Fun and entertaining video. I think all players need to watch this series so that they have better context when a GM says something they want to do in the 6sec round is a no.
For getting them out of the pack, I suspect that adventurer packs are compartmentalized, and stuff that might be wanted in combat such as health potions are in easy to access parts if they're not actually stored in pockets or on belts. Outside of the belt option, I don't think that's going to save getting it out of the pack being free, but it's probably going to halve the time. Or, in other words, adventurers aren't students. Their bags are organized.
My rules: 1) A healing potion takes 1 action to consume. You may take the defensive action, if not moving. 2) If you take time to consume a healing potion, i.e. when resting/travelling, a healing potion provides maximum hit points and no roll is required. I always assume 1oz vials of potions and players may wear one around their necks, if they specify, meaning that all players have easy access and can also help downed players using their own necklace vial. Depending on how players use potions, I make them more or less easily available but tend to favour encouraging players to use them, unless a player particularly loves playing healer/is RPing passive/non-aggressive.
I always ruled a little differently: Firstly, you need a free hand. Secondly, it's a bonus action to fish a potion out, and a bonus action to drink it, or a standard action to do both at once. It also provokes an attack of opportunity since you're making yourself vulnerable in the action of drinking the potion (exposing your neck and obscuring vision). It's important to remember that adventurers are superhuman(at least in 5e), and likely have a certain way they organize their packs to help them find potions. Of course, belt pouches and bandoliers are probably also popular choices for obvious reasons. There's also a bit of technique to drinking things quickly.
Free hand is definitely the key! Then if you did have a belt pouch for example, it would be much easier to pull this off in time. Not easy if you're wearing a helmet or something, but easier at least!
Fun video. These styles are probably my favorite type on this channel. As for my take-away on the potions...as a GM it makes me want to turn potions into shots instead of vials. From a verisimilitude aspect, that would make a little more narrative sense given the 6 second window. Fishing it out from a backpack would still be an issue though. But the real fun out of a shot-sized potion would be treating it like liquor shots. I'd be tempted to make players roll Con checks every time they drink just to see what sort of bitter face they make. Stronger potions would be the same size but incur a greater save on shot faces (No idea what the proper name is so I'm going with shot faces).
Totally! My real conclusion for making this work in-game is that adventurers need a quick-release holster, maybe a cork/cap that you can flick off with your thumb, and only a tiny volume of liquid!
these practical videos are the best (especially with guest stars). we've always bonus action'd potions and i wouldn't want to mess with that, but this is just more proof to me that a round should be ~15-18 seconds, not 6. maybe someday.
I find this amusing. I've described health potions in my games as about a shotglass worth of liquid; 0.75-1.5 oz. I also generally assume that healing potions are not stored in an adventurer's bag, but is in a potionbelt on their person; I've always been surprised this isn't described as an official item, as we see it in a lot of artwork.
Fun video. I usually house rule that potions can be used as a bonus action, if they're stored on your person and not in a bag (on a belt or bandolier). Leaves them vulnerable to breaking at inopportune times, but I loved this video showing how hard it really is to use them.
Dunno if anyone said it here yet, but you also gotta consider the neck of the bottle. Steven could possibly drink the 4oz faster with a bottle with a wider neck, like a large test tube or something. That way it can't bubble. BTW, 4oz is a half cup. Assuming it was a liquor, you'd probably be able to down 2 before needing help standing and 3 would be a doctor visit. The more realistic scenario is some form of lacto ferment, in which the bacteria ferment sugars into healing juice, which would also explain why it doesn't have specific materials to make, just a decent knowledge of what plants are sugary and not poison.
Clearly the steps to retrieving a potion from your pack are 1) pause the game to open your inventory 2) navigate to where in your inventory the potion is stored 3) Equip the potion 4) unpause
This means D&D 3.5 had the most accurate rules on potions - 1 oz liquid and took a standard action to drink. They also had a potion belt you could wear that held several vials you could grab as a free action 1/turn. The shape of just a cylinder likely has a helping hand in making it faster to drink too. I imagine its better using your thumb of the hand holding the vial to pop the cork off cause in the heat of combat I doubt you care about the cork. Awesome tests as usual!
I've always been a potions as a BA person, but this genuinely changed my perspective. Seeing it in person I think it totally makes sense that drinking a potion would be the main thing you can do that round, it takes time! (obviously differently shaped bottles would have an effect as well, but still).
Yeah these round bottles with long narrow necks were probably the least functional option xD And like many others are saying in the comments, having a specially designed belt pouch for the potion would make it much faster!
LOVE when Grace and Stephen make an appearance! I think I"m with a large group here that imagine a belt holster specific pouches on the outside of a bag for easy potion access. One of my party members canonically has a Jansport backpack, so she could just put the potion in the water bottle holder XD
Thanks for stuff like this. I used to measure out distances of spells outside to see how distances would look in real life and other stuff like you do on the channel. I always felt 1 action to get an item from a pack, and one action to drink a potion was reasonable. Back in the early 1990s we had a game where health potions were about the size of a soda can and found the 1 minute round made sense, but we never tried with 4 oz in 6 seconds. Good to know my guestimate was reasonable.
2:50 "...inspired by ancient greek poetry" I must admit as soon as you said space spiders I was reminded of that one greek guy that got so annoyed of his contemporary writers and their "travalogues" that were just made up stories that he just took it to a whole new level. Such an fantastic tale
Haha everyone's talking about side pouches that are easy to reach, but I agree that goofy helmet with potion holsters and straws is the best way to make this work!
I always say that using a health potion as a bonus action is just splashing the potion over your wounds. Use an action to drink it and get the full amount or bonus action to splash and roll for healing. (Think resident evil 7)
Hehe, that could work. Though my initial thought to making a bonus action plausible was just have bottles/vials designed to allow air to get behind the liquid you are chugging* in more accessible pouches - so then that potion can be chugged rather more rapidly. *you can get similar effect with a drinking straw in any bottle with the narrow neck, but it doesn't actually have to an extra part - if you form a narrow air channel into the wall of the bottle then it can't leak while the stopper is on as that would pull a vacuum inside the bottle but as soon as you pull the top off there is that passage for air to get behind the liquid you are chugging, so it will flow really really fast... Which obviously means the glass blowers are suddenly more highly paid than the herbalist that brewed the potion and the vial is really worth that bottle deposit scheme...
The way I run it is a full action potioning is max healing from the potion. The bonus action potioning is the rolled healing, because you're just dumping it and spilling some. I treat them as a very specific formula, so they're always the same, unless you spill.
Thanks for the video, Bob. This gives me a good idea for a drinking game involving grenadine, tequila, and clear potion bottles (with loose-fitted corks). Heading out now with my friends to find a park to start this little experiment of our own. 🍷😏 Partial kidding aside, great video!
I usually assume the potions are in a separate pocket that the character can reach without even looking, like the mesh side pocket on modern backpacks, or a bandalier, or just a phanny pack exclusively for potions.
@@BouncingTribbles Well I don't wanna punish my players with mechanics because they didn't draw their character a certain way or didn't describe them having something they obviously have to have in order to function in the world. It's like the idea of "why don't we make our characters wash their hands without tying mechanics to it" I rather bend the logic around the mechanics than the other way around because otherwise the game can become unfun for the majority of players.
@@cjoneill6971 i was speaking as a player, but I get what you're saying. Just because I have 6 belt pouches written on my character sheet doesn't mean someone should be punished for not doing the same. Even then though, it depends on the game. If it's survival and you didn't write down WHICH pouch and where on your body that pouch is then we're going to have problems
Great test! This is really helpful for more gritty campaigns, it might even help players think about their teamwork to guard one person for a round or two while recovering. For most games, I'm gonna probably stick to the normal rules, but I might consider letting players use a bonus action to withdraw and drink the 1 oz, but it takes more time to drink larger potions. More than likely, they'll find a way to keep the potion more handy than buried in the bottom of the pack. This was fun!
Steven consistently had the speed of a real adventurer, one action to pull something out of a bag (what I always assumed made sense and go with), and one action to drink the potion
May help if you use vented bottles to empty the container faster. When you pour out a bottle with only one opening you are not only waiting for the liquid to drain out, but also for the same volume of air to go in through the same opening. A simple tube or straw to allow the air an alternate passage would cut the empty time in half. Not saying that makes it all valid but could help.
I've really enjoyed the vids where you explore how realistic some of the rules are. Also, if you haven't already, check out Shadiversity's video on drinking potions in combat. It takes a different look at how it can work.
I know Stephen spilling the potion on himself was a joke... but that's honestly that's how it would make the most sense for a potion of healing to work. Rather than drinking it, you pour it directly onto the wounds. Hence why a larger, more concentrated potion heals more; it literally covers and gets into more wounds and then stays there longer.
Yeah actually that's reminiscent of some movies/shows where the characters use alcohol to clean a wound as well as drink some to dull the pain. Makes more sense why Gygax said health potions were a "liquor" in AD&D
@@BobWorldBuilder Reminds me of something an old army medic once told me about his job on the battle field. "We're not there to make them better, we're just making them *feel* better" (the idea being that you're not in a situation for any kind of proper treatment, but the hope can make them hold on just long enough to get to safety). Which also corresponds with the idea that in D&D hitpoints aren't just a representation of physical health, but also things like morale.
This reminded me of my favorite "house rule" the "eating and drinking proficiencies" the explanation for the house rule is eating and drinking is granted to most being as basic levels of proficiency an everything and everyone can invest towards getting better at those with the results of being able to potentially eat or drink more in less time with less difficulty and fewer risks such as poisoning, parasites, diseases, etc. It's a interesting rule for hard core to power games
I saw a house rule once where the reason you had to roll for healing potions was that in the heat of battle you’re not being careful and it would spill, so if you drank one out of combat you got max healing from it.
Bob, I appreciate the science behind this. If you had to do it a second time, I would suggest a 4oz and a 1oz vial. Containers matter. Also, of course a character can drink a whole flagon of ale as a Free Action. They just Stone Cold it!
Personal house rule: You can drink a healing potion as a bonus action and roll as normal. Or you can use your action to drink it and get the full healing effect. It's an action to pour it into the mouth of another character and you have to roll. If you take 2 rounds the charater can get the full health benefits of the potion.
@@BobWorldBuilder so far my group has found it to be a decent balance of action economy based upon the relatively low amount of health most potions offer.
@@BobWorldBuilderas a follow up to this video it could be interesting to do a DnD IRL on accessing items from bags/belts/packs. Would probably show why exactly a bag of holding would be so useful during combat!
One ruling I like is to make it so that if you use a full action you take the max amount of health, but a bonus action needs you to roll for the health potion To keep the potion drinking contained to 6 seconds, we need to assume a few things 1. The flask is more cylindrical than round so that liquid gets out faster 2. Potions are kept in a side pouch (whether in a belt or in the bag) for a secure and fast access.
1 oz of potion is the perfect measurement. Especially when you take into consideration that the moment after you finish drinking said potion the rogue you are fighting is going to sneak attack you and completely negate the fact that you drank anything at all.
Very cool experiment once again Bob, Grace, and The Animal! For my part, I require adventurers to use an Object Interaction in order to remove and open a pack. If they want to avoid spending this Interaction with their pack to instead grab a Potion, these must be readily available (on their belt or wherever else that's practical). Also, contrary to yours, my Potions usually come in very small (1-2oz?) metallic flasks with almost no bottle neck; quicker to dink and less fragile than big glass ones while on an adventure.
I always liked the notion of having "quick access" items, like a certain number of options, wands, weapons, or whatever, that aren't deep stowed in your pack.
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Just gonna say bottle is wrong shape. I'd go with a test tube shape less glue. More slide
Lol Bob. I had the origional game came in a zip lock with wierd dice. I was 15.
Please do a followup! What about a bottle with a 1 inch opening, you can drop the liquid in your mouth in a single motion, or take of the cork with your teeth, if you only got one hand free. You should try a belt pouch, as taking something from your pack should take one round, IMO. Sidearms are kept at your belt for fast draw, why not potions, for instance? In a critical hit, I let players choose to break one piece of equipment or take 2x damage, this could do it. Imagine breaking a fire potion, for instance!
Grace is just an old school character and uses full minute rounds :)
Hahah now it makes sense!!
My feeling about old-school rounds (at the time, and I remember lots of arguments about this) was that during that one minute of combat, you're feinting, parrying, manouevering for position, and at some point during it, there's a moment where you might actually land a blow.
(AD&D 1e also had a unit of time called a "segment", which was 1/.10 of a round, or....hey, 6 seconds!). Spell casting times were often in segments, and weapons had speeds wihich could influence your weapons speeds -- though I admit I don't recal anyone ever actually *caring* about eitther of these or actually enforcing them into their combats. I think both came from much more fiddly wargame rulesets, where that sort of minute bookkeeping was a huge part of the game.)
That still makes more sense to me, intuitively, as a way of dealing with time passing, but some people got really hung up on how long it took to swing their sword.
Anyway, all this to say that, in D&D, time, like hit points, is an abstraction. :)
@@autographedcat I used segments. As I recall, spellcasters would declare what they were casting at the start of the round, but the spells wouldn't fire until after all the attacks had occurred, and if they took any damage at all while casting the spells would fizzle. We figured the casting time told us how much time was necessary to cast, and thus how much was left for movement. Longer casting times permitted less movement during the round.
I still think 1 minute rounds make more sense. This 6-second thing is just weird. I blame Baldur's Gate (which used a 6-second round, though the manual explicitly said this was not rule-accurate, and simply sped up to make the computer game more fun).
@@autographedcat I think the segment/round stuff was gygax's specific standardised convention rules he added to AD&D, which yeah sounds wargamey.
Basic D&D used slightly different definitions of have 10 minute turns (used as 'time units' for dungeon exploration and stuff) and 10 second rounds (for combat or more "zoomed in" actions). for Basic, drinking takes one 10 second round which actually seems like a good round-off based on this video LOL
Indoor or outdoor combat? Outdoor was a full minute round but indoor was 6 seconds per round. A turn is 10 rounds either way.
Although that's AD&D 2nd... Not sure about 1st...
I always imagined health potions being little test tube sized amount of liquid that get set into leather loops on the belt and that's why it only takes 6 seconds
I worked on seeing how much each vial weighed, 30 ml each vial. Just a bit bigger than tablespoon.
Same. Like The Witcher's potion belt for battle potions. Swigging a tablespoon of potion out of a vial from a belt is a lot more reasonable.
Plus with tube shaped bottles you can knock it back like a shot easier, those round bottles may look nice but they're bad for drinking quickly
That's because they are, but even smaller than a test tube! D&D potions are 1oz / 30mL, listed in both the PHB and DMG.
I had a super hardcore DM who wanted us to account for all weight and where things were on our bodies, and he got a bit miffed when I informed him it would be 16 potions to a pound :P
@@NightEyes042The book says "most", not "all". If rarity is taken into consideration, most could just be common potions because they are ecactly that, common. However, it does not specify when or why potions are more or less than 1 oz. so it is wide open for personal interpretation at each table.
Been chugging drinks my whole life to prepare to be a D&D adventurer.
Train hard xD 🍻
This is absolutely wonderful! Bob your videos are great entertainment, I like the way you test things Mythbusters-style and you and your friends seem like you really enjoy what you’re doing, that’s great! Thank you for putting in so much effort to make this neat video!
Proficiency in chugging.
😂😂😂
6:30 The Jug of Health.
It's a full action to drink from the jug. Each time you drink you decide between 1 and 3 gulps. Heal 1d6+1 per gulp, each gulp expends one charge. Contains 50 charges. Any appropriately sized filled bottle will become a potion of minor healing (2d4+2) and consume 1 charge when filled
👏👏👏
Love the idea, though I think a poured-out portion should either heal the same as a single gulp or cost more than a single gulp (preferably the former since it makes a bit more sense, though the latter could create more cost-reward factor-do you spread out your gulps to bottles to aid your party at diminished effect, or hold it all in the jug to maximize benefit while limiting it to one user?).
@@BobWorldBuilder This is a good idea as well.
@@vurrunna Go over to your teammate and make them chug lmfao.
The chug jug of eternal life
If you want to drink faster, give the bottle a little spin. Here it's called the "tornado". Don't attempt with any sparkly liquid tho unless you want it all over!
After playing some Dark and Darker, I've started to imagine potions on the belt or at least a very close to grab belt pouch. Not actually in the backpack.
Something I've wondered in general. Do we assume our heroes are fighting with all of their equipment on their back? Or do they put it down somewhere?
That depends on how much encumbrance you are cool with having in and out of combat, I guess
I normally have my characters leave heavy or less used stuff in a vehicle or at camp, carry general gear in a bag that can be either fastened or not for secure traversal or easy dropping and keep combat gear on their person
Great points! A bunch of other folks in the comments seem to agree that adventurers basically need a quick-release holster, maybe a cork/cap that you can flick off with your thumb, and only a tiny volume of liquid! The other awesome suggestion I heard was to use one of those goofy helmets that hold drinks with straws attached to them xD
Nah it just magically is conjured into our hands, (in all seriousness, never thought about it. It's just always been a *camera pan* "oh, there it is"
@@ADT1995 Oh, OR we have a cartoon Back-bag, where we can just put our hand behind the back and get it from there. Like any Looney Tunes character can summon hammers, pies and pianos.
what about pills or candies instead of potions
The most TTRPG thing in the whole video is finding a random item in your pack that you forgot about 😂
Hahah great point! xD
They tend to neglect one of the biggest advantages to a potion is you can throw the empty bottle at them.
Improvised weapons for the win!!
Break it for glass shards and throw it on the ground for difficult terrain or just through the glass in the enemies eyes
Wrong. You eat the bottle.
@htapocysp1 we know the barbarian in the group is 😂
It IS a healing potion, right? It'll just heal the cuts from teh broken glass in your stomach, right? RIGHT?!
According to the Merriam-Webster Dictionary, though most the definitions for Liquor are alcoholic, one is "Watery solution of a drug" which would be appropriate for a health potion.
Knowing Gygax's writing, he very well may have went for the least common use of a word when using it haha
@@BobWorldBuilder That's pretty much expected of Gygax's writing from what I've seen of it. He'd rarely go for a common word if he could use an obscure synonym instead.
@@BobWorldBuilder In that case, it would mean a liquid produced by boiling soilds. Dosnt have to be a drug or alchoholic.
Note: Alcoholic beverages are also just a "watery solution of a drug".
Probably need your potion to be in an easily accessible belt pouch, which incidentally would mean having a limited supply available to you during combat.
Yeah tiny cylindrical bottles and potion-ready pouches are definitely the way to go!
My druid has access to three vials at a time off his belt. Worked out okay so far!
@@Tysto Worn items rule. Unless targeted, they don't take damage unless there is a specified ability to do so. Example would be rust monster. Could do away with that rule but then you are opening yourself to a whole mess of item HP tracking. Do not recommend.
@@puddingpoppalpatine-6070but muh realism!!11
@@TheSteam02 Funnily enough, I really don't mind that argument when there isn't rules covering for an action you want to take or trying to rule of cool things. I really don't like it when GMs use it to punish players for petty reasons. It should be realistic to the setting but a little touch of realism helps ground games alot more than people think.
It's also important to remember that an action IS LESS THAN 6 seconds because an action does not take an entire round but is only a chunky portion of it.
I was sitting around wondering, “How do nerds play drinking games?” And then I found this video.
Happy to answer your question lol
@@BobWorldBuilder 😂 Thanks, Bob! Always appreciate your content! 💪👊
Makes you think of how stressed a spell caster must be trying to remember all their spells, read the combat, and successfully cast all in real time for them
as a retired combat soldier, no, no i do not find thinking in combat is stressful (not sarcasm) its why we train
@@IamsTokiWartooth Very few spellcaster characters I've made have had any sort of formal training though.
@@ansatheatrocious6083the War Caster feat makes more sense now
@@IamsTokiWartooth A wizard is probably not a combat soldier unless they are a warmage. Most wizards are students or researchers
@@phony1551 if you are lvl 2, you have combat experience
Bob and Grace are a healing potion for the soul .
Haha thank you!
I believe the three of you should do more team ups
And Ste(v/ph)en the Animal!
What I get from this is Bob has really great friends.
First time hearing “Steve the animal” I wondered how they got the name and was given an immediate reason lol that chug might as well be a bonus action 😂
We had an NPC we had to escort for a bit that was addicted to health potions, drank most he could steal or buy. It was pretty funny…
I guess you had to be there!
I’m imagining Chris Traeger from Parks & Rec 😂
That's funny without being there!
"so we figured it was worth a shot" -about the 1 oz potion
Well said 🥃
🍻
I used to make explicit that all of my potions were in metal vials, of the 1 ounce size, because I was always afraid of breaking a bunch of glass potions over my character's spellbook in his backpack in case he ever fell over or worse. If you want to have more realistic speeds for using a potion either you could turn them into tiles that the user just has to break to make the spell work or another magic item like Pathfinder's Sipping Vest; where you spill the potion on the vest beforehand and just need to sip the neck of the vest.
All great ideas!
For Pathfinder 1e specifically, all potions are 1 oz anyway. Though the metal vials is a specific item that you can put your potions into (1 sp, weighs 1lb... which is a little high).
We house rule that drinking a "readied" potion (carried in the hand, stored in a belt pouch, tied to a belt etc.) is a bonus action. Retrieving one from a backpack or bag of holding (or similar) EDIT: and drinking it is a full round action.
That's a good distinction!
We use a similar house rule, it fun
That's what I do too. Each player is allowed to have a bandolier that holds a max of 3 potions.
We are generally doing something similar, but I like the idea of it taking two combat rounds , and taking a free attack against. Still feels like chugging the prepped potion and dropping the bottle is still a a 6 second full action.
this is the first time I've seen Grace in one of your videos and her sitting on that rock that way immediately stole my heart
Haha then you'll love our other D&D IRL videos! :)
@@BobWorldBuilder started watching you years ago, think it was Dragon of Icespire Peak, with just you as DM and Grace the player. Just drink the flagon, let's see that. I liked this vid so much that I'm putting this on my tumblr.
This content here is exactly why I love this channel.
Glad you enjoyed this one! :)
D&D irl is such a brilliant series
Thank you! :)
I think despite round bottles being fun, an actual vial would be a bit faster to drink cause it can flow out easily.
Yep these bottles looked cool but they were basically the least functional option xD
Yeah...when you see potions of health in a lot of manga, my prime example being Goblin Slayer...which is VERY D&D in how things work as spell casters have a limited amount of spells they can cast per day and must rest a full day to get a recharge..if they use components then they have a limited amount and when they run out they are done casting. Anyway, when you see potions in Goblin Slayer they are usually in bottles...not round bottom bottles like the iconic potion but something more cylindrical with a cork. In the spin-off "Year One" which is all about Goblin Slayer's early years, his health potion BREAKS in his pouch when he lands wrong...what does he do? He wrings the cloth it soaked into and sucks it out of the cloth...not as effective but it does help heal his wounds and he lives another day.
Just need a vent hole somewhere.
This is why I always specify my character has some sort of belt pouch, potion bandolier, or tactical vest. I don't like the idea of whipping out a backpack or burlap sack mid-fight.
Also, that bottle shape is really slowing you down, I've always imagined the vials to be rectangularly shaped with a gentle slope towards the rim.
100% these bottles needed to be completely inverted to empty them, and the tiny neck on them really doesn't help. At this point I'm imagining potions to be like wide mouth cylindrical jars, but the whole jar is about the size of a shot glass, and like you said, strapped somewhere for easy reach
Until you get hit and those exposed potion vials break
@@BobWorldBuilder Add a pull tab to the cork for even faster results.
Usually at a LARP I'd have a belt with pouches, where I'd store healing potions for quick access. Makes them easier to access quickly. The backpack is for things you can sit down and take time to access. (Like a journal or ritual kit)
@@BobWorldBuilder Or just a large test tube with a long cork or other type of lid that can be opened with the thumb of the hand holding it.
Just imagine the alternate timeline where they decide they need to go with the AD&D wording and get progressively destroyed by booze potions during the shoot.
The lost recording lol
My home rules for health potions is you can use a full action to restore by dice roll, or use it out of combat to use the full 10 hp, since; especially after this video, you can’t get the whole bottle in six seconds
That's a good adjustment!!
Check out DMG pg 139. You absolutely can drain a potion in 6 seconds or less.
@@arcxjo Did... did you even watch the video?
@@benvoliothefirst i mean, first off, the type of bottle they used is not conducive to chugging like one would have to for a potion. second, 2 of them didnt drink it in one round, the other did, and id put basically every adventurer above 66% of the youtuber population lmao.
i do also like the dual ruling, but i have it downshifted to action VS BA because A dnd's not a physics engine, and B, the duality of the system gives players in combat more options
Mine's similar but a bit more powerful, I usually say that they can either use a bonus action and roll the dice, or use an action to get the max. Giving someone else a potion always takes one action and a dice roll, but it can be done out of combat to get the max.
A good night's sleep is the greatest health potion in DnD.
Best way to heal from stab wounds, acid/fire/freeze burns, and of course don't forget the wounds one gain from vicious mockery.
I've heard it said (In a dragon magazine I think) that the potion activates when the liquid touches you. In the older editions of the game the potions were given a different description "See Below". I think the current image of potions comes from video game design where a larger bottle is easier to place in the world and collect (Imagine Skyrim with tiny bottles it could be annoying to grab them off tables, and less visually appealing). If we use the smaller description it's a little closer to the game mechanic. I personally home rule that a bandolier or similar holster could allow you to grab the potion as part of a move action and if you have the quick draw feat you can do it as a free action (if you have it stored away it takes a move action to retrieve it).
Physical Description 3rd/3.5 edition
A typical potion or oil consists of 1 ounce of liquid held in a ceramic or glass vial fitted with a tight stopper. The stoppered container is usually no more than 1 inch wide and 2 inches high. The vial has AC 13, 1 hit point, hardness 1, and a break DC of 12. Vials hold 1 ounce of liquid.
Additionally it took a standard action to drink and provoked an attack of opportunity.
Splashing a health potion on would certainly be faster, but it was way too cold out to do that for this video! Haha, maybe for a part 2
@@BobWorldBuilder very good point. I’d also add that most adventure should be well equipped, and the potion probably needs to touch the skin at the very least. Think of an open wound where the armour was ripped off in the attack. Given that, I think it’s more reliable to drink the potion then to dump it on yourself. Finally I can’t remember where this is from but something like the potion loses its potency quickly when exposed. Check out the anime Overlord: Brain vs Cocytus fight for a good show of potion use (overlord is heavily influenced by D&D).
I have always ruled that potions are 1-3 flOz In volume can be kept in a belt pouch and is fast to drink.
Yep that makes the most sense to me now. Basically needing a quick-release holster, maybe a cork/cap that you can flick off with your thumb, and only a tiny volume of liquid!
@Bob World Builder I use the optional potion is a bonus action rule. So I also offer my players cheaper, larger potions that do take a full action. Same healing power, cheaper price and you support low level clerics that may not be that good at brewing.
I agree. My group uses the 3-slot quick item pouch rule from the Baldur's Gate games. Also, potion vials are 4 oz. maximum--and they don't have to be full. A vial can be a tube with a large mouth and a long cork that can be popped off with a thumb. Who has two hands free anyways. The bottles you guys have look more like Diablo style potion bottles, not vials. I would also suggest that a free action takes no actual time from your round. You do it in parallel with an action or start it during the prior round.
You don't even need to rule that. DMG says specifically that 1 oz is the standard size.
Yeah, I've always played tham as witcher style vials, drunk like a shot, probably not a glass container either.
This is absolutely my favorite D&D video out of all D&D videos ever made by anyone, even though we didn't even get into how silly it is for potions to immediately take effect the moment they are swallowed.
"Magic" isn't going to enter your bloodstream that quickly, let alone be delivered to the wounded areas in a single beat of the heart. But you can't go down that rabbit hole without tackling the monster that is 'what are hitpoints and how are you able to carry on when taking damage from all of the deadly attacks that nearly every stat block suggests?'
I've recently imagined the use of potions as combat compatible, with a The Witcher vibe. I have nothing against the minibar shield, or the gnome camelback or hat tank with straws, and generally allow the following rule : Drinking a potion is a bonus action. Make someone else drink your potion without drowning him is a complete action (Or two actions if the target is awake and doesn't consent One for the grapple action, the other for the saving throw).
But it's great to have a video on it, and not trying this at home. You guys are professionals. Especially Steve.
Yeah witcher style minibottles within easy reach is the only way to go while maintaining a fantasy aesthetic for me. Beer can helmet fits the time constraint, but probably not great in combat!
3e detailed the size of potions: "A typical potion or oil consists of 1 ounce of liquid held in a ceramic or glass vial fitted with a tight stopper. The stoppered container is usually no more than 1 inch wide and 2 inches high."
5e uses the same economy and mundane equipment costs/weights as 3e and PF1e, so we use airplane bottles as examples (1.7 fl oz. with 1oz of liquid). The "liquor" callback from 1e helps further reinforce that potions were shots of medicine instead of beverages. We sometimes bring airplane bottles with custom labels printed on them just to make sure that we have a little "medicine" at the table.
Sounds like 3e got it right!
The definition of a 'vial' is "small glass or plastic vessel or bottle....". While admittedly subjective, I wouldn't consider the volume of roughly half a can of soda to be "small", so I find it weird that this is the standard volume of a healing potion. Another issue with these bottles is the shape. Due to it having a very round shape and a clearly shaped neck, the liquid will be sloshing and blocking airflow, making it take longer to flow out. Flagons don't have this issue which is why some can chug one in 6 seconds. Smaller vials will also be easier to eat once they are emptied out.
In the end I definitely agree with Crawford. It's a game rule, and while it's fun to experiment with some of them in real life to see if they make sense, for a game they need to make sense in a different context. Which means balancing the cost vs benefit of using it. And from what I heard, the general consensus is already that healing potions are lacking.
Definitely should be a full round option, with the potion ready.
Yep, that or adventurers need a quick-release holster, maybe a cork/cap that you can flick off with your thumb, and only a tiny volume of liquid!
@@BobWorldBuilder i think for sure there would be some sort of quick-access thing for potions. if adventurers knew they were getting into a fight, they wouldnt chuck their potions into the bottom of their bag.
@@turquoise7817 They also would not drink it _during_ a fight other than after putting significant distance or an obstacle between them and their assailant. You would have something similar to the Incapacitated condition during the process, besides the likelihood of messing up the process under pressure.
@@NevisYsbryd no, only in your game
@@IamsTokiWartooth I was speaking about realistic simulation, not prescribing anyone necessarily do that. If you want to hand-waive the practical concerns of taking your attention off of your opponent to retrieve a container, open it, and drink it in the middle of while they are attempting to kill you (which most games do to some extent), then that is what suits your game. If you want to talk verisimilitude, drinking potions would take a significant amount of time and be extremely dangerous (before even considering how long it takes the potion to take effect and whether it would help in within the timeframe of the fight in the first place). The entire premise of drinking potions in the middle of combat where the determining factors of permanent to fatal injury occur in fractions of a second is nonsensical in the first place if you place much emphasis on realism or internal logic.
0:26 Should've been "Loose corks save dorks."
I let a player who is playing an alchemist artificer in one of my games cast certain potions as a bonus actions via injection. He has a syringe gun which felt appropriate. Healing potions still cost an action.
Heck yeah, that sounds awesome!
The hurting is as rewarding as the healing. TF2 Medic.
@@theofficerfactory2625 OMG the rolls to hit must be so intense, haha
"Hi-ya! I'm a monk!" is now my spirit animal.
Please do another video of potion drinking with the following tests ...
1. A potion belt/sash for faster potion retrieving.
2. A more viscus potion. Gravy potions anyone?
3. Giving someone else a healing potion when they are injured or unconscious.
How I imagine adventurers easily get their potions ready to drink is by wearing the flasks on their belt, and of course, loose corks.
Yeah adventurers definitely need potion-ready packs to make this work!
@@BobWorldBuilder "Loose corks, beat orcs!"
Get some gelatin and make jello potions so you can eat it instead of drinking it!
Bob and crew, you guys are just wonderful. Quote of the day:
- World Builder: "I think that counts"
- World Destroyer: "AH, YOU'RE DEAD!"
Thanks for doing these videos, they are so much fun!
Haha yep I didn't even notice that while filming, but I got a good laugh from it while editing! Thanks very much! :)
This type of video was how I originally found your channel, I’m really happy to see the format still making the occasional appearance ❤
Thanks! :) Yeah these are tough to make so I can't do many of them, but they're always fun!
I kind of meet the PHB & DMG halfway, where a 1 oz "dose" of potion heals for 2d4+2, but since a vial can contain 4 oz a vial can have up to 4 doses.
A player may hastily down the entire vial as a Bonus Action or take a measured amount as an Action, being careful to save some for later.
So if there's 4 doses, you better either want that whole 8d4+2, or slow down & take an Action.
Love it! We have no real concept of how long things take. Regardless of semantic details of how an adventurer ight have a different pack, or where they would keep a vial, or whatever else some might say, it is still silly to think one could do all those things in 6 seconds. Good going Bob!
Well, having the potion in a side pocket or belt pouch would make it a lot faster then a modern drawstring sack. However, I've always thought it should be a full action to drink a health potion. Just because it falls under the eat/drink umbrella. You have to hold it over your face and swallow. It would be the same as cramming a handful of food and chewing it while at a half run, and as a restaurant worker who has eaten standing up at work for over a decade I can say that if you try to quickly eat a couple bites quickly while breathing hard you're going to choke
Glad you enjoyed it! And yes, all adventurers must have holsters for their potions or something! xD
@@BouncingTribbles Yes but the average modern restaurant worker also isn't capable of backflipping above a dragon while stabbing it two times in the face in the same movement or isn't capable of doing 10 full force swings with a great maul right after running in just 6 seconds.
@@tetsudo6934 maybe not, but walking thirty feet and making an attack? Why go to higher level? You can drink a potion at level 1.
Though you do bring up an interesting point, your characters don't necessarily represent average beings in the world; however, your point is invalid in this discussion. We ARE working with average humans as our baseline, Bob and co are hardly Olympians
@@BouncingTribbles Which is why using their test as a discussion of physical capability or plausability of a feat for adventurer makes no sense. I go to higher levels because the ruling don't change, whatever the level may be and it illustrates better why it's a bit ridiculous to compare adventurers to average (and in the case of bob, i'd argue possibly physically lower than average) human beings.
Adventurers at level 1 are also capable of
running a baseline of 60 feet, whatever their fitness level may be, from a standing start, in full combat gear (which may weigh upwards of 80 pounds for some classes) in about 4 seconds (given that they have a bonus action to take, it's not their full turn to dash). The average martial class can take a full on greatsword strike to the face at level 1 and be fine. The average adventurer can lift their entire weight above their head, even when factoring their equipment (10 strength is 300 pound max lift) which is a hell of a physical feat.
I feel like the largest barrier to success on some of these is the shape of the bottles. Vials are typically strait sided unlike bottles, which changes the fluid dynamics involved and let's the fluids move faster
Yeah these bottles were probably the least functional shape for fast drinking, but they look cool! Tiny bottles and potion-ready belts or pouches is definitely the way to go!
Any character who keeps their health potions at the bottom of their pack, deserves a Darwin award. I value a little realism, so I imagine a metal 1 oz test-tube like vial (metal so it doesn't break during a fall or in combat) with a slightly oversized stopper (easily removed with the thumb of one hand), being held to the outside of a pack or even belt or sash with a strap for quick access. However, if you want the high fantasy video game image of a glass vial I'm not going to complain - you do you.
Might need to do a part 2 video where we test out different methods to actually make the time!
Liquid pours out much faster from a strait vial than a narrow neck bottle.
See, this is why engineers and alchemists need to redesign the potion bottle to be a two cork device so you can essentially shotgun your potions.
That or get one of those helmets with the beer can holders and straws for on the go potion consumption.
Beer can helmet is the only way this works lol, also someone commented that Pathfinder potions are only 1oz? Good for those designers taking this seriously!!
Fun and entertaining video. I think all players need to watch this series so that they have better context when a GM says something they want to do in the 6sec round is a no.
I appreciate that! A little reality check never hurt haha
That vial is huge! When I picture a vial, I'm thinking a flask roughly larger than a thumb that's filled top with a liquid and sealed with a cork.
All this fuss and what solves everything is two potions in a beer guzzler hat- trendy, hands free, and it comes as a helmet! Artificers chop chop!
This is like when people tell me fantasy worlds don't have pizza. A fantasy world without pizza (or in this case beer helmets) is no fantasy of mine!
For getting them out of the pack, I suspect that adventurer packs are compartmentalized, and stuff that might be wanted in combat such as health potions are in easy to access parts if they're not actually stored in pockets or on belts. Outside of the belt option, I don't think that's going to save getting it out of the pack being free, but it's probably going to halve the time.
Or, in other words, adventurers aren't students. Their bags are organized.
Tiny bottles and potion-ready belts or pouches is definitely the way to go!
The 1 ounce potion was worth a shot. LOL. Nice!
😎
5:55 If one wanted to rules-lawyer that, I could argue it only says they're _kept_ in vials, not that the vial is full.
I feel so sorry for you guys it looks freezing out there that day. Very Fun messing with the physics of DnD.
Haha it was! I really appreciate that
My rules:
1) A healing potion takes 1 action to consume. You may take the defensive action, if not moving.
2) If you take time to consume a healing potion, i.e. when resting/travelling, a healing potion provides maximum hit points and no roll is required.
I always assume 1oz vials of potions and players may wear one around their necks, if they specify, meaning that all players have easy access and can also help downed players using their own necklace vial. Depending on how players use potions, I make them more or less easily available but tend to favour encouraging players to use them, unless a player particularly loves playing healer/is RPing passive/non-aggressive.
Oooh around the neck is a great idea
Thank you for the fantastic video. The drama going around at almost put me off d&d videos, this kind of video restores my interest.
There's always some fun to be had!
I always ruled a little differently: Firstly, you need a free hand. Secondly, it's a bonus action to fish a potion out, and a bonus action to drink it, or a standard action to do both at once. It also provokes an attack of opportunity since you're making yourself vulnerable in the action of drinking the potion (exposing your neck and obscuring vision).
It's important to remember that adventurers are superhuman(at least in 5e), and likely have a certain way they organize their packs to help them find potions. Of course, belt pouches and bandoliers are probably also popular choices for obvious reasons. There's also a bit of technique to drinking things quickly.
Free hand is definitely the key! Then if you did have a belt pouch for example, it would be much easier to pull this off in time. Not easy if you're wearing a helmet or something, but easier at least!
Fun video. These styles are probably my favorite type on this channel. As for my take-away on the potions...as a GM it makes me want to turn potions into shots instead of vials. From a verisimilitude aspect, that would make a little more narrative sense given the 6 second window. Fishing it out from a backpack would still be an issue though.
But the real fun out of a shot-sized potion would be treating it like liquor shots. I'd be tempted to make players roll Con checks every time they drink just to see what sort of bitter face they make. Stronger potions would be the same size but incur a greater save on shot faces (No idea what the proper name is so I'm going with shot faces).
Totally! My real conclusion for making this work in-game is that adventurers need a quick-release holster, maybe a cork/cap that you can flick off with your thumb, and only a tiny volume of liquid!
Awesome video and a great feather in my "No, potions are not now, never were, and never will be, a free/bonus action" cap.
Happy to help with that case haha
The rules in real life videos are great. Good job on the research and breaking down the rules into realistic actions.
Thanks very much!
these practical videos are the best (especially with guest stars).
we've always bonus action'd potions and i wouldn't want to mess with that, but this is just more proof to me that a round should be ~15-18 seconds, not 6. maybe someday.
I find this amusing. I've described health potions in my games as about a shotglass worth of liquid; 0.75-1.5 oz. I also generally assume that healing potions are not stored in an adventurer's bag, but is in a potionbelt on their person; I've always been surprised this isn't described as an official item, as we see it in a lot of artwork.
Not filmed: the impact craters from where Grace's gloves fell.
Dang I wish I put an explosion sound there or something
Fun video. I usually house rule that potions can be used as a bonus action, if they're stored on your person and not in a bag (on a belt or bandolier). Leaves them vulnerable to breaking at inopportune times, but I loved this video showing how hard it really is to use them.
Yeah tiny cylindrical bottles and potion-ready pouches are definitely the way to go!
These "real world" D&D videos are wonderful!
Thank you!
Dunno if anyone said it here yet, but you also gotta consider the neck of the bottle. Steven could possibly drink the 4oz faster with a bottle with a wider neck, like a large test tube or something. That way it can't bubble.
BTW, 4oz is a half cup. Assuming it was a liquor, you'd probably be able to down 2 before needing help standing and 3 would be a doctor visit.
The more realistic scenario is some form of lacto ferment, in which the bacteria ferment sugars into healing juice, which would also explain why it doesn't have specific materials to make, just a decent knowledge of what plants are sugary and not poison.
Yeah these narrow necked, round bottles were probably the worst shape we could've tried. But they look cool!
Oh man, I've missed these 'real life TTRPG' videos. Great job Bob (and Team)
Thank you! :)
Clearly the steps to retrieving a potion from your pack are
1) pause the game to open your inventory
2) navigate to where in your inventory the potion is stored
3) Equip the potion
4) unpause
Now that makes sense!!
if i need to adventure, im definitely taking Steven with me
This means D&D 3.5 had the most accurate rules on potions - 1 oz liquid and took a standard action to drink. They also had a potion belt you could wear that held several vials you could grab as a free action 1/turn. The shape of just a cylinder likely has a helping hand in making it faster to drink too. I imagine its better using your thumb of the hand holding the vial to pop the cork off cause in the heat of combat I doubt you care about the cork. Awesome tests as usual!
Love these irl testing videos Bob, keep it up
Thanks very much! :)
I've always been a potions as a BA person, but this genuinely changed my perspective. Seeing it in person I think it totally makes sense that drinking a potion would be the main thing you can do that round, it takes time! (obviously differently shaped bottles would have an effect as well, but still).
Yeah these round bottles with long narrow necks were probably the least functional option xD And like many others are saying in the comments, having a specially designed belt pouch for the potion would make it much faster!
Love these videos! It's so fun to see what would really be happening to our dnd characters!
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed this one :)
LOVE when Grace and Stephen make an appearance! I think I"m with a large group here that imagine a belt holster specific pouches on the outside of a bag for easy potion access. One of my party members canonically has a Jansport backpack, so she could just put the potion in the water bottle holder XD
I love all of these goofy videos, they are so much fun to watch.
Thank you! :)
Thanks for stuff like this. I used to measure out distances of spells outside to see how distances would look in real life and other stuff like you do on the channel. I always felt 1 action to get an item from a pack, and one action to drink a potion was reasonable. Back in the early 1990s we had a game where health potions were about the size of a soda can and found the 1 minute round made sense, but we never tried with 4 oz in 6 seconds. Good to know my guestimate was reasonable.
It's always fun to see how these things play out!
2:50 "...inspired by ancient greek poetry" I must admit as soon as you said space spiders I was reminded of that one greek guy that got so annoyed of his contemporary writers and their "travalogues" that were just made up stories that he just took it to a whole new level. Such an fantastic tale
Lucian! The first sci-fi story in the world, and the reason why so many modern stories have space spiders! (Doctor Who did it twice!)
Well now the bonus action rule is a little silly unless you got one of those goofy drinking helmets
Haha everyone's talking about side pouches that are easy to reach, but I agree that goofy helmet with potion holsters and straws is the best way to make this work!
I always say that using a health potion as a bonus action is just splashing the potion over your wounds.
Use an action to drink it and get the full amount or bonus action to splash and roll for healing. (Think resident evil 7)
Hehe, that could work. Though my initial thought to making a bonus action plausible was just have bottles/vials designed to allow air to get behind the liquid you are chugging* in more accessible pouches - so then that potion can be chugged rather more rapidly.
*you can get similar effect with a drinking straw in any bottle with the narrow neck, but it doesn't actually have to an extra part - if you form a narrow air channel into the wall of the bottle then it can't leak while the stopper is on as that would pull a vacuum inside the bottle but as soon as you pull the top off there is that passage for air to get behind the liquid you are chugging, so it will flow really really fast... Which obviously means the glass blowers are suddenly more highly paid than the herbalist that brewed the potion and the vial is really worth that bottle deposit scheme...
@@patrickhobing8785 I always used to use that same rule
The way I run it is a full action potioning is max healing from the potion. The bonus action potioning is the rolled healing, because you're just dumping it and spilling some. I treat them as a very specific formula, so they're always the same, unless you spill.
Thanks for the video, Bob. This gives me a good idea for a drinking game involving grenadine, tequila, and clear potion bottles (with loose-fitted corks). Heading out now with my friends to find a park to start this little experiment of our own. 🍷😏 Partial kidding aside, great video!
Glad you got some inspiration from this video! :D
We do a hybrid at my table. Drinking as a bonus action, you roll for health. Drinking as an action gets you the full potential.
I usually assume the potions are in a separate pocket that the character can reach without even looking, like the mesh side pocket on modern backpacks, or a bandalier, or just a phanny pack exclusively for potions.
Did you include that in your character design? I always buy an extra belt and some pouches to include in my design
@@BouncingTribbles Well I don't wanna punish my players with mechanics because they didn't draw their character a certain way or didn't describe them having something they obviously have to have in order to function in the world. It's like the idea of "why don't we make our characters wash their hands without tying mechanics to it" I rather bend the logic around the mechanics than the other way around because otherwise the game can become unfun for the majority of players.
@@cjoneill6971 i was speaking as a player, but I get what you're saying. Just because I have 6 belt pouches written on my character sheet doesn't mean someone should be punished for not doing the same.
Even then though, it depends on the game. If it's survival and you didn't write down WHICH pouch and where on your body that pouch is then we're going to have problems
Yeah adventurers definitely need potion-ready gear to make this work!
Great test! This is really helpful for more gritty campaigns, it might even help players think about their teamwork to guard one person for a round or two while recovering. For most games, I'm gonna probably stick to the normal rules, but I might consider letting players use a bonus action to withdraw and drink the 1 oz, but it takes more time to drink larger potions. More than likely, they'll find a way to keep the potion more handy than buried in the bottom of the pack. This was fun!
Glad you got some ideas from it! :)
this is why i like the Genesys system as a round is no specific time as it's a more narrative system
That's good design!
Steven consistently had the speed of a real adventurer, one action to pull something out of a bag (what I always assumed made sense and go with), and one action to drink the potion
I don't even play D&D (I play other systems), but it seems like the easiest change here is how much time is represented by one round.
Bingo!
Based on the data from the video I would say that 15-20 seconds would be more reasonable. And meaning a minute of of combat is 3-4 rounds
May help if you use vented bottles to empty the container faster. When you pour out a bottle with only one opening you are not only waiting for the liquid to drain out, but also for the same volume of air to go in through the same opening. A simple tube or straw to allow the air an alternate passage would cut the empty time in half. Not saying that makes it all valid but could help.
Compared to folks suggesting beer-can helmets, this is valid lol
I've really enjoyed the vids where you explore how realistic some of the rules are. Also, if you haven't already, check out Shadiversity's video on drinking potions in combat. It takes a different look at how it can work.
Thanks, will do!
Thanks for the video, it was the one I was waiting for since you started this series.
Hope you liked it!!
@@BobWorldBuilder I did yes. And it conforted me in my thinking, so +1 for you again 😆
I know Stephen spilling the potion on himself was a joke... but that's honestly that's how it would make the most sense for a potion of healing to work. Rather than drinking it, you pour it directly onto the wounds. Hence why a larger, more concentrated potion heals more; it literally covers and gets into more wounds and then stays there longer.
Yeah, I've always imagined it as just cracking the bottle over my own head and then somehow the liquid works and wounds are healed.
Yeah actually that's reminiscent of some movies/shows where the characters use alcohol to clean a wound as well as drink some to dull the pain. Makes more sense why Gygax said health potions were a "liquor" in AD&D
@@BobWorldBuilder Reminds me of something an old army medic once told me about his job on the battle field. "We're not there to make them better, we're just making them *feel* better" (the idea being that you're not in a situation for any kind of proper treatment, but the hope can make them hold on just long enough to get to safety). Which also corresponds with the idea that in D&D hitpoints aren't just a representation of physical health, but also things like morale.
I came to the comments to make this same point. The potion should be more of a salve or something to help close and heal the wounds.
This reminded me of my favorite "house rule" the "eating and drinking proficiencies"
the explanation for the house rule is eating and drinking is granted to most being as basic levels of proficiency an everything and everyone can invest towards getting better at those with the results of being able to potentially eat or drink more in less time with less difficulty and fewer risks such as poisoning, parasites, diseases, etc.
It's a interesting rule for hard core to power games
Thanks Bob and crew. Now we need vial bandoliers like in the Witcher. That would save time and look cool.
Yeah tiny cylindrical bottles and potion-ready pouches are definitely the way to go!
I saw a house rule once where the reason you had to roll for healing potions was that in the heat of battle you’re not being careful and it would spill, so if you drank one out of combat you got max healing from it.
Bob, I appreciate the science behind this.
If you had to do it a second time, I would suggest a 4oz and a 1oz vial. Containers matter.
Also, of course a character can drink a whole flagon of ale as a Free Action. They just Stone Cold it!
Personal house rule:
You can drink a healing potion as a bonus action and roll as normal. Or you can use your action to drink it and get the full healing effect. It's an action to pour it into the mouth of another character and you have to roll. If you take 2 rounds the charater can get the full health benefits of the potion.
I like that!
@@BobWorldBuilder so far my group has found it to be a decent balance of action economy based upon the relatively low amount of health most potions offer.
I feel like the real lesson in this video is the treachery of bags.
The true enemy of adventurers!
@@BobWorldBuilderas a follow up to this video it could be interesting to do a DnD IRL on accessing items from bags/belts/packs. Would probably show why exactly a bag of holding would be so useful during combat!
One ruling I like is to make it so that if you use a full action you take the max amount of health, but a bonus action needs you to roll for the health potion
To keep the potion drinking contained to 6 seconds, we need to assume a few things
1. The flask is more cylindrical than round so that liquid gets out faster
2. Potions are kept in a side pouch (whether in a belt or in the bag) for a secure and fast access.
1 oz of potion is the perfect measurement. Especially when you take into consideration that the moment after you finish drinking said potion the rogue you are fighting is going to sneak attack you and completely negate the fact that you drank anything at all.
Tiny bottles and potion-ready belts or pouches is definitely the way to go!
Very cool experiment once again Bob, Grace, and The Animal! For my part, I require adventurers to use an Object Interaction in order to remove and open a pack. If they want to avoid spending this Interaction with their pack to instead grab a Potion, these must be readily available (on their belt or wherever else that's practical). Also, contrary to yours, my Potions usually come in very small (1-2oz?) metallic flasks with almost no bottle neck; quicker to dink and less fragile than big glass ones while on an adventure.
Can't wait for the crazy combos video where you see if it's actually possible for a lvl 2 rouge lvl 2 fighter to triple dash in 6 seconds
--while drinking a potion
I always liked the notion of having "quick access" items, like a certain number of options, wands, weapons, or whatever, that aren't deep stowed in your pack.