Do you think the Eliminator is the beginner cruiser we've been waiting for? Can it take down bikes like the upcoming Royal Enfield Super Meteor or is it dead on arrival?
Any competition is good for the consumer. After Rebel there's Meteor and after Meteor there's new Eliminator. More choices for everyone, driving improvements.
Weell, back in the day, us old codgers started with 250CC two stroke, drum brakes, and trials tires. We sometimes rode on dirt. You learned quickly to think about what you were doing, or you could end up with road rash or other misfortunes. Moral: There were bold motorcycle riders. There were old motorcycle riders. BUT there were very few Old and Bold motorcycle riders.
Lol, I started on a Honda 700lb V2 cruiser, then 465 lb Suzuki I-4 naked, latest is a KLX230SM 'supermoto' it only has 20hp and weighs like 293lbs soaking wet. I ride the light bike the most bc it is like CoverGirl; easy breezy beautiful haha
I had a Z400 last year, just bought it to spend a year learning stuff. It's a fantastic bike and I would recommend it for any beginner. Ninja 400 is the same bike with slight changes, and with this it's cool that they've extended the platform to almost all street bikes.
Increasing the stroke is the best way to increase torque lower in the rev range, generally while not spinning up as quickly. EDIT; I think it's likely that they added stroke length for torque and kept the A-2 compliant 47 horsepower, but at lower RPM with more low and midrange grunt.
Yes, I wanted to call out Spite on that one. If they increase just stroke to 450, the torque output would be the same as increasing bore, while also promoting a low rev low down torque personality to the engine. Oversquare engines is what they tend to use for peaky, sporty engines because avg piston speed is lower and therefore can rev higher
Stroke improvement is way harder than boring out. Suzuki basically used the same crankshaft assembly and transmission from 150-300cc with different bore kit. For Honda, they did it for the smaller air cooled in Asia (125, 150, and 185cc) as well as small bike of 250 and 300cc single (CBR, Rebel, CRF). Kawasaki used to have that with 250cc and 300cc Ninja/Z as well.
400cc with 47bhp would put the bike on the limit for a2 license requirements in europe. My guess this is where they are targeting the bike. 450cc is probably the limit they could increase the capasity without haveing to change major components.
@@ellwoodwolf 270 twins have the positives of a V twin aside from narrower shape and not drawbacks of heat and exhaust. 270 are also way cheaper to produce and easier to comply wirh emissions.
I like these small and medium sized cruisers with mid pegs, just put on a taller custom seat if you are taller to get rid of that gargoyle hip bend and they can make a comfortable standard motorcycle. This bike looks a bit odd though, the Rebel is cleaner.
Im really liking the looks of that SE Eliminator. I feel like they are more of a "neo cruiser". Same with the Rebel. Both are a more sporty design of a cruiser, and I love it!
If only Kawasaki was producing a nice torquey, reliable engine that made about 47 hp Oh wait they do, it’s a shame they don’t use the w800s engine in other bikes, it’s a lovely engine looks wise and it’s completely air cooled
i think there’s like two sections of cruisers: the kind that are more modern, usually liquid cooled, and don’t really have that “rumble” of a harley (regardless of displacement). then there’s the more traditional air-cooled cruisers, the kind that aren’t really performance driven but feel and sound cool. HD could really sell a lot of beginner bikes in either category, but i think there’s really no good “raw” beginner cruiser aside from the new RE super meteor.
@@Cleanandgood I had the ZL600A. Loved that bike. Couldn't stop or turn worth a hill of beans but was lightweight, fast & fun. Really surprised me when they made the Vulcan-S a Vulcan & not an Eliminator. Maybe they were looking at the lineage as more of a Vulcan 450 & 500 thing. IF Kawasaki had a better dealer network here I would have kept buying Kawasakis based on that bike but I instead went to Suzuki & now to Harley.
You've got the bore/stroke thing backwards. A cylinder with a longer stroke will be torquey than one with a bigger bore, all other things equal. The longer stoke means the lever from the center of the crank shaft to the crank pin is longer, meaning a longer lever that the con rod is pushing on
In Ireland 🇮🇪 the top spec Royal Enfield Interceptor costs €9.695 and the top spec Royal Enfield Super Meteor costs €10.295. Only €600 between the two. I hope this might give you an idea of the price difference between the two. Of course the American 🇺🇸 market will be totally different due to shipping costs etc, etc. Love the show, keep it up Spite 👍
“Kinda wonder why they’re not just going straight for 500…” Widening the bore on a 400 twin to get a 12.5% displacement increase, especially on one like this that already works so well for what it is, is going to be a big change in performance. If the weight and gear ratios of the motorcycle is the same as the unchanged 400, you’ll most definitely notice the additional power.
In my humble opinion many cruiser riders will be drawn more to the "agricultural" old school appeal of the super meteor than those new bikes such as the eliminator etc. I totally agree we need a new option from Harley, but I also hope in a parallel resurgence of old style japanese cruisers that had that beautiful American aesthetic, simple mechanics, japanese reliability and affordable price for the more classically inclined rider I still remember when you could buy shadows from 125 to 1000+ CC's, same with the Dragstar, Vulcans and Marauders.
My starter (and only still) motorcycle is a 2001 Honda Shadow 750 in the blue/silver ACE trim. Looks great, sounds great, handles well enough and makes just enough power to do the thing. Plus I got it cheap and in great condition. Love the indestructibility of the classic Japanese cruisers
In all honesty, anyone looking for a beginner cruiser is likely to get a late 90s japanese cruiser. All of them, even a tiny 250 virago are sportier than the majority of things on offer new, are cheap, reliable and, disposable. And, majority of cruiser-bros are planning to upgrade to a mastodon of a land barge as soon as they could)
My mate literally dropped off his '06 Kawasaki Eliminator 250 to my place today. Now that's a full size cruiser with a mini sized engine. While I'd love a modern 400 or 450 V Twin version of it, I understand the direction Kawasaki has taken, after all they've been doing it for almost 2 decades. Developing a single platform & turning it into as many motorcycle variants as possible makes more economic sense & is a cheap way of increasing your model range. Judging by what's on the road here in Australia, if it handles & rides like a mini Vulcan & is priced competitively against the Duke 390 it'll do very well indeed.
I had the Vn900 Custom, great bike for a beginner, im not a beginner by the way, been riding since i was 16, now 53. Swapped it for an Indian Scout and by god what a difference, the Scout is all the bike you will ever need. Still going to get a Challenger next year though.😂
I've had two shadow 750's, I think they're great bikes. The Vulcan 900 is also a fantastic bike actually. It's big enough with enough power to function like a "real" bike, but forgiving enough to be good to learn on and actually sounds fantastic. The 750 can start to feel anemic at times if you're doing highway speeds above 75 (sometimes here the "flow of traffic" hits 90-100 mph, it can hang but it ain't happy lol).
For the 750, I had the older, bigger version. You will want to swap the 42t rear sprocket to 38t. I swapped it out to 35t, but 38t is really the sweet spot. Also the front 16t with a 17t. Much better highway revs all the way up to 100mph.
@@ProDigit80 Yeah I had both a 98 and a 2019, it was pretty funny how the 98 felt so much more substantial but they were both absolutely fantastic bikes. I probably wouldn't have changed the gearing personally, though I can see why you would most of my riding was not and is not highway
There are so many great "beginner" cruisers. But those same cruisers are also great cruisers for experienced riders. V-Star 250... I had a huge Road Star 1700 but chose the V-Star 250 as weapon of choice for mountain runs. This little cruiser is so much fun on mountain roads and outpaces the big boys in this kind of riding. The trade-off of course is that it is buzzy on the interstate. But all 300+ pounds of me had nooooo problem doing 75MPH literally all day long. I've gone touring on that thing for *weeks* at a time and it worked great. Americans have developed some kind of messed up ideas about motorcycles and I'm glad to see Indian influence challenging our beliefs.
I've always wanted a Vstar 250 but I thought being 265lbs would make it struggle too much. Glad to hear that it could handle it. I'm looking for a commuter bike hopefully next year. My F4i is getting old and needs alot of love.
I'm heavily leaning towards a sport bike as my first one because the feel and look are normally my preference. But the V Star has me tempted because of how good it looks tbh. Appreciate this write up 🙏🏽
The Eliminator 400 is the exact same cost as the Ninja 400 here in Japan ($5600) unless you get the SE version which is an extra 750 dollars. For 750 you get a nicer seat; a black exhaust instead of silver; USB socket; drive recorder.
I just started on my first bike ever, a Triumph Bonneville Bobber. I definitely went above what I should have for a first bike. But because of my age, 51, I didn't want to get a bike that I would trade in quickly. I am looking at bikes that are less than mine, to have for riding around town, and my back road route to and from work
This Eliminator looks interesting--the engine is kind of the "436" to the 400s as the "636" was to the 600 world. However, we're still waiting for the Versys 400, Kawasaki...lol
In Indonesia it's 450cc. And just currently we start to categorize motorcycle license into 3 level. This bike goes to level 2, while 500cc or more goes to level 3
I dunno, how it sounds never really made me prefer a bike over another, on the contrary, If I could make a gas bike silent I would, and I do actually believe, the vulcan S 650 is straigh up the best looking cruiser on the market hands down, no competiotion for a mile, the vulcan is a full 10, with the second best being a 2. The engine....yes, I owned a z650 and I can attest it's a viby engine, that bothered me most of all
The part you didn't mention on the Harley mid year release is the variable valve timing on the new m8 motors, this is something I wasn't expecting to see
I just got my first bike and it is the eliminator! I got it at just under $7k with ABS and within a week am just short of 400 miles. I love it a lot so far
I will say my first bike is a Honda Shadow Aero 750. I love this bike you might not like it but I love it. This being said I have been shocked when looking at Harley that they refuse to make a starter cruiser in the price range of a beginner starter bikes from the Japanese companies.
I saw one at a dealer and found it very comfortable probably because it doesn't have the cruiser riding position. More like a relaxed neutral position. I liked it but I have absolutely no need or desire for the amount of power it can output and especially not if it costs more than more efficient bikes both to buy and run.
Bought the Eliminator 451 a few weeks ago. I am 71 andhavent rode for 45 years. Wanted a light bike with enough power and for me this fits the ticket. It would be a great beginner bike. Got mine with abs. Unfortunately price was 6995 which is a bit high in my opinion. Very happy with it so far
I think this is going to give some big competition to the new CL500 scrambler thing from Honda. The Super Meteor to me seems like a big cruiser for a good price. This Eliminator seems to be a lightweight cruiser for beginners and others looking for a lighter option. Probably cheaper to just bore it out, they did the same thing for the KLX 300 from the KLX 250. I so wish they would come out with a Versys 450x to replace the Versys 300x.
I'd like to see a Z400RS SE. Use that new in-line four engine in the ZX-4R and put it in the same (or similar) package to the Z900RS SE, including the gold wheels and suspension with black and yellow color scheme.
Increasing the bore isn't better for higher RPM, and thus higher power at the expense of low rev torque? I might be wrong, but my gut tells me that increasing the stroke is better for low rev torque (just see how tall are the cylinders in v-twin cruisers).
Stroke improvement is way harder than boring out. Suzuki basically used the same crankshaft assembly and transmission from 150-300cc with different bore kit. For Honda, they did it for the smaller air cooled in Asia (125, 150, and 185cc) as well as small bike of 250 and 300cc single (CBR, Rebel, CRF). Likewise, what you know as Honda 500cc is actually 400cc in Japan. Kawasaki used to have that with 250cc and 300cc Ninja/Z as well.
One important aspect here is that for engines larger than 400 CC in Japan (where this bike is made) you need to do extra driving school / exam for the “heavy motorcycle” category of driving license. So this bike aims at a being “as much cruiser as you can get with normal license” on Japanese market
@@TheBaldDog32 All bike over 400cc belong to the same class of "Large motorcycle". Standard motorcycle license cover everything smaller to 400cc. And that's what most Japanese ever need. Also, there's an old regulation where anything less than 250cc doesn't require an inspection. That's why you see them with 250cc motor when everyone else use 300cc.
Spite-ster, we're truly living in remarkable times. It's seems that most manufacturers, excluding HD, are bringing technology forward, performant, safe and inexpensive machines to the market. They're seeing the opportunities in the lower cc classes, with RE and some Japanese manufacturers, leading the way. The question I always have when I see these lower cc models is: Does it feel like it has a rubber band for an engine or does it have some character, like the larger displacement machines? In other words, is it really fun to ride? BTW, love the content and keep up the great work!
From my experience, 250s, 300s and the like are nowhere near the 'punch' of a 600 or modern middleweight, but you adapt to them really quick!! If I ride my virago 250 for a few days, all of the sudden my 'scale' of perceiving power shifts lower and then the bike feels fast again, (until I get back on the 600!) Small little engines are so much fun to ride though, go see and if you can test ride a small-cc twin, that 400-500cc range is the best IMO but they are most definitely fun and feel fast after you've taken a break from the felony-spec bikes for a bit😉
@@slow_bike_show @TCR I agree 100% on riding a small displacement bike fast, it's a lot of fun. I ride Triumph 660 and 1200 cc machines and also have a 250cc quad. I think there's a great opportunity in this lower cc class today, especially for new riders. I also think if they can squeeze some more performance, like 60hp or more, then they'll get guys like me interested. My current bikes are 80hp and that's plenty for the street.
80’s and 90’s sportster/knightster Harley’s are pretty good starts. My first cruiser was a Kawasaki Vulcan 900, I’m wayyy to big for the seating position even though I’m only 5’10” rode my buddies knightster 1200 and I really enjoyed it, Hondas XL 200r from 84 is my favorite bike to ride currently just because it’s a 4 stroke street legal dirt bike.
You were wrong about the price by $1,100+. It starts at $6,649, not $5,500. I’m looking for a cheap motorcycle with enough power for freeway commuting. However, I’m still interested in the Eliminator. Going to a Kawasaki demo event tomorrow.
The only issue I have is using the name eliminator. The bike was originally "what happens if we put a race engine in a cruiser?" And I'd like to see that agaib.
Going on looks, it comes across as a 450cc Vulcan S. I have nothing particularly against that model or platform, aside from my general inability to fit comfortably on a parallel-twin bike due to the frame length versus my size (I'm 6'2" and over 300 pounds with approximately 33" inseam), but the power figures would be great for a smaller, lighter-weight beginning rider. Also, it begs the question of whether or not Kawasaki will include the Ergo-Fit option for the bike, given the similarities
rode the rebel 250 in my MSF course, loved it, honda shadow was my first bike loved it, then bought a 2006 harley night train as my current bike, love it. had i not found my Harley i prob would have went with the rebel 1100. thinking about a ninja 400 for a second bike
I have a Ninja 300, I ride it to work, very economical and fun (when you rev it). Downside is the 300 is very modestly powered compared to bigger bikes. 400 is more powerful but I suspect it's still underpowered. I accept my 300's limitations and am thankful of it's many good points
For the record, I used to use my Ninja 300 as my second bike but it's now my main bike as I sold my big fuel thirsty touring bike. The more I ride the 300 the more I'm bonding with it
They rebel 1100 is the single most uncomfortable bike I’ve ever sat on. I was all over the release and specs on it , and I sat on it and knew in like 17 seconds..... hell no.
I appreciate the great videos, Spite. I just got my first motorcycle on Monday (5/1/23) thanks to you and YN. You were also the main reason why I got my particular bike. It is absolutely your favorite bike... Kawasaki Vulcan S. 😂😂😂
I do agree. It's pretty odd to come out with a little beginner cruiser and name it 'The Eliminator' Like, who are you planning to eliminate in what kind of racing on your 450 cruiser?
I had seen your interview with the RevMax guy. A sleeved-down RevMax would still weigh about the same as it's bigger brothers. It would be a lot like the 1200 and 883 Sportsters, they weighed the same. Then again, I saw a report that the Royal Enfield Super Meteor weighs 531 lbs, so maybe there would be a demand for it?
My guess is they can fit the 400cc into euro emissions and it's a stocker that someone with an A2 license can get and not have to do any modifications to be legal.
I can see it, a new green 400. They did a great job with the Vulcan S, but it's not for every beginner, as it can really get up and go if you're not careful. My wife has one and won't let me ride it because she knows I'll get stupid on it.
Harley Davidson actually started selling the bike you are talking about in India calling the the “X-440.” The thing is, and I don’t mean to say this like it’s a bad thing, it’s completely made by Hero Motorcycles, a long-standing motorcycle manufacturer in India. The bike is just badged, marketed, and distributed as Harley Davidson.
The funny thing is he's praising this thing, that he hasn't ridden or seen in person.... but it's just a smaller Vulcan S, the thing he hates left and right.
What about tha Yamaha bolt? I have one, and I’m saving for a stage 1, but I think it deserves a spot in the beginner cruiser category. I know, I know, it’s not a Harley, but I don’t have Harley money… yet.
You've got it backwards with the bore versus stroke thing. Also, it's not that simple to hire a 400 to a 450. That's a lot of increase. You start to get really thon on your sleeves and run out of coolant passage space.
The factory don't "Bore out" like some peasant. They just produce different engine head assembly while keeping same crankshaft assembly and transmission and keep the cost down. All Japanese manufacturer did it to their smaller offering. Honda, for example, have 250 and 300 single vs 400 and 500 Ptwins. Which you can see in their Rebel, CBR, and CRF.
What I have a problem with is calling this bike a "cruiser" when really it's just a standard / naked bike. Cruisers, by definition, are going to have forward controls. The riding position on this is more of a standard position.
Would be cool if you did japanese muscle bike like yamaha xjr1300 or gxr1400 ,notice none of the big RUclipsrs have covered these , plus I would like one of these like to hear your thoughts
Do you think the Eliminator is the beginner cruiser we've been waiting for? Can it take down bikes like the upcoming Royal Enfield Super Meteor or is it dead on arrival?
It has a place... if Kawasaki markets it, Honda hates the N.A. Market- they could sweep in and grab market share if they marketed it.
RE also has the 650 Shotgun about to drop on us, cafe, cruiser bobber styling. Add the 860 big bore kit, its gonna be an awesome bike imho.
eliminator 1000 next
Whats the title of that metal rift in the beginning?
Any competition is good for the consumer. After Rebel there's Meteor and after Meteor there's new Eliminator. More choices for everyone, driving improvements.
Bro where is the H2 powered cruiser?!?!?
Exactly!!! I’d buy one no doubt!
Well they made a "touring" version........ only a small jump to making a H2 cruiser
H2 powered KLR/Versys/KLX when?
Now that's a real eliminator.
We need a H2 powered Grom 😂…. I don’t care that those aren’t even the same company. We need it.
Weell, back in the day, us old codgers started with 250CC two stroke, drum brakes, and trials tires. We sometimes rode on dirt. You learned quickly to think about what you were doing, or you could end up with road rash or other misfortunes. Moral: There were bold motorcycle riders. There were old motorcycle riders. BUT there were very few Old and Bold motorcycle riders.
Lol, I started on a Honda 700lb V2 cruiser, then 465 lb Suzuki I-4 naked, latest is a KLX230SM 'supermoto' it only has 20hp and weighs like 293lbs soaking wet. I ride the light bike the most bc it is like CoverGirl; easy breezy beautiful haha
I had a Z400 last year, just bought it to spend a year learning stuff. It's a fantastic bike and I would recommend it for any beginner. Ninja 400 is the same bike with slight changes, and with this it's cool that they've extended the platform to almost all street bikes.
I sold a couple of bikes but kept my little Ninja 300, great little commuter bike
Got a Z400 this past Saturday. Already 180 miles on it!
I started on an Eliminator 125. It was so much fun and a huge confidence builder for this scardy cat.
Increasing the stroke is the best way to increase torque lower in the rev range, generally while not spinning up as quickly.
EDIT; I think it's likely that they added stroke length for torque and kept the A-2 compliant 47 horsepower, but at lower RPM with more low and midrange grunt.
Yes, I wanted to call out Spite on that one. If they increase just stroke to 450, the torque output would be the same as increasing bore, while also promoting a low rev low down torque personality to the engine. Oversquare engines is what they tend to use for peaky, sporty engines because avg piston speed is lower and therefore can rev higher
I was about to say the same.
Stroke improvement is way harder than boring out. Suzuki basically used the same crankshaft assembly and transmission from 150-300cc with different bore kit. For Honda, they did it for the smaller air cooled in Asia (125, 150, and 185cc) as well as small bike of 250 and 300cc single (CBR, Rebel, CRF). Kawasaki used to have that with 250cc and 300cc Ninja/Z as well.
agreed. i think he has the terms "bore" and "stroke" reversed/mixed up here. either way, love the videos spite. unfollowed yammie and followed you :-)
YEP.
400cc with 47bhp would put the bike on the limit for a2 license requirements in europe. My guess this is where they are targeting the bike. 450cc is probably the limit they could increase the capasity without haveing to change major components.
Nice to see someone bring up European licenses
Its the exact number of a A2 - 35kw license. That has to be deliberate and i wonder if the bike isnt somehow limited a bit to get there.
@bart h if theyre going to restrict they might as well make it a 600 so its future proof
F those a2 license suckers... what ? They have money... oh uh.... we have something for them and their wallets
270 crank is a big seller, Kawi should absolutely switch to that in all their twins.
270 is internet meme , keyboard warriors battle cry.
@@ellwoodwolf 270 twins have the positives of a V twin aside from narrower shape and not drawbacks of heat and exhaust. 270 are also way cheaper to produce and easier to comply wirh emissions.
@@protosh1124Bro can’t think straight with all the V-Twin cope
I like these small and medium sized cruisers with mid pegs, just put on a taller custom seat if you are taller to get rid of that gargoyle hip bend and they can make a comfortable standard motorcycle. This bike looks a bit odd though, the Rebel is cleaner.
Im really liking the looks of that SE Eliminator. I feel like they are more of a "neo cruiser". Same with the Rebel. Both are a more sporty design of a cruiser, and I love it!
basically a modern standard sporty cruiser-style bike
i consider them a hybrid but these types of bikes have been around in the past
(edit spelling)
Hurry up Royal Enfield, Harley's dinner will be getting cold by the time you get there to eat it.
If only Kawasaki was producing a nice torquey, reliable engine that made about 47 hp
Oh wait they do, it’s a shame they don’t use the w800s engine in other bikes, it’s a lovely engine looks wise and it’s completely air cooled
And a gear driven camshaft too!
@@veegoesvroom6685 yeah it’s honestly a really nice looking engine, the bevel drive looks lovely on it, I love my w800 lol
I still have never seen one in my dealers in my area so I went with Vulcan s now I want a Vulcan s with 4 cylinder engine and shaft drive
Don’t forget about the goofy tire size... that’s what turned me off the cb1100
That is not a cheap motor. It is cool though.
i think there’s like two sections of cruisers: the kind that are more modern, usually liquid cooled, and don’t really have that “rumble” of a harley (regardless of displacement). then there’s the more traditional air-cooled cruisers, the kind that aren’t really performance driven but feel and sound cool. HD could really sell a lot of beginner bikes in either category, but i think there’s really no good “raw” beginner cruiser aside from the new RE super meteor.
I am one of the few that can leave it in “rain” mode. My MT09 has been in mode 4 since I bought it a couple weeks ago. It’s my first bike.
and that's okay.
until you are ready, no need to push over your limit :)
I had the real eliminator, the 900, and also the ZL1000, it's successor. They were pretty great cruisers, with shaft drive.
i had the 600 and loved it. I might even get this new one.
@@Cleanandgood I had the ZL600A. Loved that bike. Couldn't stop or turn worth a hill of beans but was lightweight, fast & fun. Really surprised me when they made the Vulcan-S a Vulcan & not an Eliminator. Maybe they were looking at the lineage as more of a Vulcan 450 & 500 thing. IF Kawasaki had a better dealer network here I would have kept buying Kawasakis based on that bike but I instead went to Suzuki & now to Harley.
I have Eliminator ZL 400 1993 year. Never failed.
You've got the bore/stroke thing backwards. A cylinder with a longer stroke will be torquey than one with a bigger bore, all other things equal. The longer stoke means the lever from the center of the crank shaft to the crank pin is longer, meaning a longer lever that the con rod is pushing on
Vulcan 900: Am I a joke to you?!?
In Ireland 🇮🇪 the top spec Royal Enfield Interceptor costs €9.695 and the top spec Royal Enfield Super Meteor costs €10.295. Only €600 between the two. I hope this might give you an idea of the price difference between the two. Of course the American 🇺🇸 market will be totally different due to shipping costs etc, etc. Love the show, keep it up Spite 👍
“Kinda wonder why they’re not just going straight for 500…”
Widening the bore on a 400 twin to get a 12.5% displacement increase, especially on one like this that already works so well for what it is, is going to be a big change in performance. If the weight and gear ratios of the motorcycle is the same as the unchanged 400, you’ll most definitely notice the additional power.
In my humble opinion many cruiser riders will be drawn more to the "agricultural" old school appeal of the super meteor than those new bikes such as the eliminator etc.
I totally agree we need a new option from Harley, but I also hope in a parallel resurgence of old style japanese cruisers that had that beautiful American aesthetic, simple mechanics, japanese reliability and affordable price for the more classically inclined rider
I still remember when you could buy shadows from 125 to 1000+ CC's, same with the Dragstar, Vulcans and Marauders.
What about the Vulcan 650 and Vulcan 900 both great beginner cruisers.
Oh no. Another Vulcan boy
@@metalmoto3275 I be doggin my vulcan s. I LOVE IT!
@@metalmoto3275
Go ride one before you present your opinion
Vulcans are still damn good (aside from the 650’s absolutely horrible sound)
@@reisakashiya I owned one for 2 years. They are nothing special
My starter (and only still) motorcycle is a 2001 Honda Shadow 750 in the blue/silver ACE trim. Looks great, sounds great, handles well enough and makes just enough power to do the thing.
Plus I got it cheap and in great condition.
Love the indestructibility of the classic Japanese cruisers
In all honesty, anyone looking for a beginner cruiser is likely to get a late 90s japanese cruiser. All of them, even a tiny 250 virago are sportier than the majority of things on offer new, are cheap, reliable and, disposable. And, majority of cruiser-bros are planning to upgrade to a mastodon of a land barge as soon as they could)
I just completed my M licence class and this is the bike we road a Kawasaki Eleminator 124cc. Honestly it was a blast to ride
My mate literally dropped off his '06 Kawasaki Eliminator 250 to my place today. Now that's a full size cruiser with a mini sized engine. While I'd love a modern 400 or 450 V Twin version of it, I understand the direction Kawasaki has taken, after all they've been doing it for almost 2 decades. Developing a single platform & turning it into as many motorcycle variants as possible makes more economic sense & is a cheap way of increasing your model range. Judging by what's on the road here in Australia, if it handles & rides like a mini Vulcan & is priced competitively against the Duke 390 it'll do very well indeed.
I had the Vn900 Custom, great bike for a beginner, im not a beginner by the way, been riding since i was 16, now 53. Swapped it for an Indian Scout and by god what a difference, the Scout is all the bike you will ever need. Still going to get a Challenger next year though.😂
You're gonna love it. I love my Challenger through and through, smile everytime i twist the throttle
A workmate is treating himself to a motorcycle, has his eye on an Indian. Workmate is a unit, I suggested he bought a Suzuki Bandit 1200 first
@@littlefishy6316 I'm over 20st and the Scout nearly pulls your arms off with the acceleration.👍🏼
Now all we need is a Vulcan H2, although not exactly a beginner bike.
I've had two shadow 750's, I think they're great bikes. The Vulcan 900 is also a fantastic bike actually. It's big enough with enough power to function like a "real" bike, but forgiving enough to be good to learn on and actually sounds fantastic. The 750 can start to feel anemic at times if you're doing highway speeds above 75 (sometimes here the "flow of traffic" hits 90-100 mph, it can hang but it ain't happy lol).
For the 750, I had the older, bigger version. You will want to swap the 42t rear sprocket to 38t. I swapped it out to 35t, but 38t is really the sweet spot. Also the front 16t with a 17t. Much better highway revs all the way up to 100mph.
@@ProDigit80 Yeah I had both a 98 and a 2019, it was pretty funny how the 98 felt so much more substantial but they were both absolutely fantastic bikes. I probably wouldn't have changed the gearing personally, though I can see why you would most of my riding was not and is not highway
The old school Eliminator 900 was hella fast and could take almost any bike in the quarter mile.
There are so many great "beginner" cruisers. But those same cruisers are also great cruisers for experienced riders. V-Star 250... I had a huge Road Star 1700 but chose the V-Star 250 as weapon of choice for mountain runs. This little cruiser is so much fun on mountain roads and outpaces the big boys in this kind of riding. The trade-off of course is that it is buzzy on the interstate. But all 300+ pounds of me had nooooo problem doing 75MPH literally all day long. I've gone touring on that thing for *weeks* at a time and it worked great. Americans have developed some kind of messed up ideas about motorcycles and I'm glad to see Indian influence challenging our beliefs.
I've always wanted a Vstar 250 but I thought being 265lbs would make it struggle too much. Glad to hear that it could handle it. I'm looking for a commuter bike hopefully next year. My F4i is getting old and needs alot of love.
I'm heavily leaning towards a sport bike as my first one because the feel and look are normally my preference. But the V Star has me tempted because of how good it looks tbh. Appreciate this write up 🙏🏽
The Eliminator 400 is the exact same cost as the Ninja 400 here in Japan ($5600) unless you get the SE version which is an extra 750 dollars. For 750 you get a nicer seat; a black exhaust instead of silver; USB socket; drive recorder.
NGL, had this been available last year when I bought my Z400, I'd probably be riding an Eliminator instead.
I just started on my first bike ever, a Triumph Bonneville Bobber. I definitely went above what I should have for a first bike. But because of my age, 51, I didn't want to get a bike that I would trade in quickly. I am looking at bikes that are less than mine, to have for riding around town, and my back road route to and from work
This Eliminator looks interesting--the engine is kind of the "436" to the 400s as the "636" was to the 600 world. However, we're still waiting for the Versys 400, Kawasaki...lol
In Indonesia it's 450cc. And just currently we start to categorize motorcycle license into 3 level. This bike goes to level 2, while 500cc or more goes to level 3
Let me know when they make a sport cruiser using the ZX-14 or Ninja H2 platform.
Did you not like the ninja 1000sx
I have no idea if Spite’s pronunciation of “Kawasaki,” is satire or ignorance. But it’s, “ka-wah-saw-kee.” Goddamn Hardly Ableson riders smh…
I hope they'll bring it to Europe, a buddy of mine might take his license and he loves cruisers.
Of all the beginner cruisers out there....this one looks cooler then the others too imho.
So what happens with the Vulcan S?
Japanese stop producing it. Most likely will be replaced by Eliminator 650.
I dunno, how it sounds never really made me prefer a bike over another, on the contrary, If I could make a gas bike silent I would, and I do actually believe, the vulcan S 650 is straigh up the best looking cruiser on the market hands down, no competiotion for a mile, the vulcan is a full 10, with the second best being a 2.
The engine....yes, I owned a z650 and I can attest it's a viby engine, that bothered me most of all
Got an mt-07 , had a cb500f .... NEVER BUYING ANOTHER PARALLEL TWIN AGAIN.
The part you didn't mention on the Harley mid year release is the variable valve timing on the new m8 motors, this is something I wasn't expecting to see
Why not Triumph if we’re talking 8-10g?
IMO the Super Meteor 650 is going to be best cruiser under 800cc.
I just got my first bike and it is the eliminator! I got it at just under $7k with ABS and within a week am just short of 400 miles. I love it a lot so far
My dad has the old kawazaki eliminator 600, its a freaking beast and sounds great
I will say my first bike is a Honda Shadow Aero 750. I love this bike you might not like it but I love it. This being said I have been shocked when looking at Harley that they refuse to make a starter cruiser in the price range of a beginner starter bikes from the Japanese companies.
I saw one at a dealer and found it very comfortable probably because it doesn't have the cruiser riding position. More like a relaxed neutral position. I liked it but I have absolutely no need or desire for the amount of power it can output and especially not if it costs more than more efficient bikes both to buy and run.
Bought the Eliminator 451 a few weeks ago. I am 71 andhavent rode for 45 years. Wanted a light bike with enough power and for me this fits the ticket. It would be a great beginner bike. Got mine with abs. Unfortunately price was 6995 which is a bit high in my opinion. Very happy with it so far
You been hanging out with Eric again? There is no "sack" in Kawasaki! It's cow-ah-sock-ee, like the drink Saki, not cow-ah-sack-ee.
Can't wait for the Eliminator to hit the dealerships.
Just for giggles, I'll ride my 1982 KZ440 to the dealership to do a head-to-head.
Haven’t checked in on this channel in a while, glad to see you’re doing well!
I think this is going to give some big competition to the new CL500 scrambler thing from Honda. The Super Meteor to me seems like a big cruiser for a good price. This Eliminator seems to be a lightweight cruiser for beginners and others looking for a lighter option. Probably cheaper to just bore it out, they did the same thing for the KLX 300 from the KLX 250. I so wish they would come out with a Versys 450x to replace the Versys 300x.
Would be interesting to see this and how it'll turn out. Great that they do so, for sure!
Could the H-D Revolution Max engine engine be turned into a single cylinder beginner bike?
I'd like to see a Z400RS SE. Use that new in-line four engine in the ZX-4R and put it in the same (or similar) package to the Z900RS SE, including the gold wheels and suspension with black and yellow color scheme.
Increasing the bore isn't better for higher RPM, and thus higher power at the expense of low rev torque?
I might be wrong, but my gut tells me that increasing the stroke is better for low rev torque (just see how tall are the cylinders in v-twin cruisers).
Stroke improvement is way harder than boring out. Suzuki basically used the same crankshaft assembly and transmission from 150-300cc with different bore kit. For Honda, they did it for the smaller air cooled in Asia (125, 150, and 185cc) as well as small bike of 250 and 300cc single (CBR, Rebel, CRF). Likewise, what you know as Honda 500cc is actually 400cc in Japan. Kawasaki used to have that with 250cc and 300cc Ninja/Z as well.
One important aspect here is that for engines larger than 400 CC in Japan (where this bike is made) you need to do extra driving school / exam for the “heavy motorcycle” category of driving license. So this bike aims at a being “as much cruiser as you can get with normal license” on Japanese market
"Heavy".
Wonder where a Road Glide (1900cc+) fits into their classification schedule.
@@TheBaldDog32 All bike over 400cc belong to the same class of "Large motorcycle".
Standard motorcycle license cover everything smaller to 400cc. And that's what most Japanese ever need. Also, there's an old regulation where anything less than 250cc doesn't require an inspection. That's why you see them with 250cc motor when everyone else use 300cc.
Love the content! But bro, you need some cable management! That thing flopping around your clutch lever is making me nervous!
I got the same jacket 😊 it looks cool the Eliminator on par with Honda rebel but gotta see how it’s going to be reviewed. Can’t wait!
Spite-ster, we're truly living in remarkable times. It's seems that most manufacturers, excluding HD, are bringing technology forward, performant, safe and inexpensive machines to the market. They're seeing the opportunities in the lower cc classes, with RE and some Japanese manufacturers, leading the way. The question I always have when I see these lower cc models is: Does it feel like it has a rubber band for an engine or does it have some character, like the larger displacement machines? In other words, is it really fun to ride?
BTW, love the content and keep up the great work!
From my experience, 250s, 300s and the like are nowhere near the 'punch' of a 600 or modern middleweight, but you adapt to them really quick!! If I ride my virago 250 for a few days, all of the sudden my 'scale' of perceiving power shifts lower and then the bike feels fast again, (until I get back on the 600!)
Small little engines are so much fun to ride though, go see and if you can test ride a small-cc twin, that 400-500cc range is the best IMO but they are most definitely fun and feel fast after you've taken a break from the felony-spec bikes for a bit😉
@@slow_bike_show @TCR I agree 100% on riding a small displacement bike fast, it's a lot of fun. I ride Triumph 660 and 1200 cc machines and also have a 250cc quad. I think there's a great opportunity in this lower cc class today, especially for new riders. I also think if they can squeeze some more performance, like 60hp or more, then they'll get guys like me interested. My current bikes are 80hp and that's plenty for the street.
80’s and 90’s sportster/knightster Harley’s are pretty good starts. My first cruiser was a Kawasaki Vulcan 900, I’m wayyy to big for the seating position even though I’m only 5’10” rode my buddies knightster 1200 and I really enjoyed it, Hondas XL 200r from 84 is my favorite bike to ride currently just because it’s a 4 stroke street legal dirt bike.
will they finally make a litre cruiser like the rebel 1100??
Bought a new 86 Eliminator 600...
Loved it (!)
We got the A1, and the plastic cup chemical taste was something we could not get rid of. How did you do it?
You were wrong about the price by $1,100+. It starts at $6,649, not $5,500. I’m looking for a cheap motorcycle with enough power for freeway commuting. However, I’m still interested in the Eliminator. Going to a Kawasaki demo event tomorrow.
The only issue I have is using the name eliminator. The bike was originally "what happens if we put a race engine in a cruiser?" And I'd like to see that agaib.
I mean... it is technically Ninja Engine.
Technically humans are doughnut shaped. It should have an H2 engine in it.
Going on looks, it comes across as a 450cc Vulcan S. I have nothing particularly against that model or platform, aside from my general inability to fit comfortably on a parallel-twin bike due to the frame length versus my size (I'm 6'2" and over 300 pounds with approximately 33" inseam), but the power figures would be great for a smaller, lighter-weight beginning rider. Also, it begs the question of whether or not Kawasaki will include the Ergo-Fit option for the bike, given the similarities
Kawi should make an entire line with that 450 motor, Ninja 450, Eliminator 450, Z450 and Versys 450.
rode the rebel 250 in my MSF course, loved it, honda shadow was my first bike loved it, then bought a 2006 harley night train as my current bike, love it. had i not found my Harley i prob would have went with the rebel 1100. thinking about a ninja 400 for a second bike
I have a Ninja 300, I ride it to work, very economical and fun (when you rev it). Downside is the 300 is very modestly powered compared to bigger bikes. 400 is more powerful but I suspect it's still underpowered. I accept my 300's limitations and am thankful of it's many good points
For the record, I used to use my Ninja 300 as my second bike but it's now my main bike as I sold my big fuel thirsty touring bike. The more I ride the 300 the more I'm bonding with it
They rebel 1100 is the single most uncomfortable bike I’ve ever sat on. I was all over the release and specs on it , and I sat on it and knew in like 17 seconds..... hell no.
I test rodé a z-400 and loved the engine but hated the siting position. Looking forward for the interceptor as an option comfy option!
Do you not get the Kawasaki Vulcan 650 in the US?
We do, Spite just hates it with some sort of weird passion. It's called the Vulcan S here.
I really hope they make a version that's bright kawasaki green
I appreciate the great videos, Spite. I just got my first motorcycle on Monday (5/1/23) thanks to you and YN. You were also the main reason why I got my particular bike. It is absolutely your favorite bike... Kawasaki Vulcan S. 😂😂😂
That's not an eliminator. A real eliminator should have the h2 motor
Boomer alert !!!!!!
@@ellwoodwolf wanting a supercharged inline 4 makes me a boomer?
I do agree. It's pretty odd to come out with a little beginner cruiser and name it 'The Eliminator' Like, who are you planning to eliminate in what kind of racing on your 450 cruiser?
Can they just give me a h2 in cruiser form thats what i really want
If only Kawasaki had just made the vulcan 650 a 270 degree that sounds like an MT07....
I miss the macho power of the classic bikes from the 70’s, 89’s
Awesome video as always sir! I do hope this Kawi comes out swinging!
Great review!! Never took you for a Hank 3 fan.😆
I had seen your interview with the RevMax guy. A sleeved-down RevMax would still weigh about the same as it's bigger brothers. It would be a lot like the 1200 and 883 Sportsters, they weighed the same. Then again, I saw a report that the Royal Enfield Super Meteor weighs 531 lbs, so maybe there would be a demand for it?
My guess is they can fit the 400cc into euro emissions and it's a stocker that someone with an A2 license can get and not have to do any modifications to be legal.
Still waiting for you to check out a snow track dirt bike!?
I can see it, a new green 400. They did a great job with the Vulcan S, but it's not for every beginner, as it can really get up and go if you're not careful. My wife has one and won't let me ride it because she knows I'll get stupid on it.
*Laughs in Royal Enfield Super Meteor 650*
Harley Davidson actually started selling the bike you are talking about in India calling the the “X-440.” The thing is, and I don’t mean to say this like it’s a bad thing, it’s completely made by Hero Motorcycles, a long-standing motorcycle manufacturer in India. The bike is just badged, marketed, and distributed as Harley Davidson.
Not trying the 975 Harley nightster at my Harley dealership are marked up to 18k same as the Sportster s
I went in to buy a Honda 500 wapked out with a Eliminator! Honestly the best bike ive ever riden!
That AG1 looks nice ... does it come in green?
I swear... if you call this bike more boring than the Vulcan S.... lmao
The funny thing is he's praising this thing, that he hasn't ridden or seen in person.... but it's just a smaller Vulcan S, the thing he hates left and right.
What about tha Yamaha bolt? I have one, and I’m saving for a stage 1, but I think it deserves a spot in the beginner cruiser category. I know, I know, it’s not a Harley, but I don’t have Harley money… yet.
You've got it backwards with the bore versus stroke thing. Also, it's not that simple to hire a 400 to a 450. That's a lot of increase. You start to get really thon on your sleeves and run out of coolant passage space.
The factory don't "Bore out" like some peasant. They just produce different engine head assembly while keeping same crankshaft assembly and transmission and keep the cost down. All Japanese manufacturer did it to their smaller offering. Honda, for example, have 250 and 300 single vs 400 and 500 Ptwins. Which you can see in their Rebel, CBR, and CRF.
My legend continues
IIRC, the 400-450 is coming from a longer stroke. But I agree that waiting for the 450 was a good call for the US market.
What I have a problem with is calling this bike a "cruiser" when really it's just a standard / naked bike. Cruisers, by definition, are going to have forward controls. The riding position on this is more of a standard position.
Needs a separated exhaust it would sound awesome.
Would be cool if you did japanese muscle bike like yamaha xjr1300 or gxr1400 ,notice none of the big RUclipsrs have covered these , plus I would like one of these like to hear your thoughts
Longer stroke. Great thoughts, Spite!
They should make a modern day Eliminator 900/1000. Imagine a Vulcan S but with a 4 cylinder instead of a parallel twin.