The WORST ENGINE BRITISH LEYLAND MADE SHOULD HAVE BEEN THE BEST! - SABOTAGED! The Rover Triumph 6.
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- Опубликовано: 17 май 2024
- In this video we cover one of the most controversial Rover engines ever made. Engineered with Triumph this engine was supposed to be the next chapter for the British Straight 6 engine but due to supposed sabotage and detuning so it didn't shadow the V8 the Rover 3500 SD1 lead this engine to be cast by the wayside by many enthusiasts, I hope to demistify this engine, cover it's many issues and announce my plans to help even a small bit rebuild it's reputation with an incredibly amazing project announcement.
To see my Rover 2600 project click here: • Rover SD1 2600S - Project
Thanks to AROnline the most incredible source for British car information; www.aronline.co.uk/
Videos used: • Rover: Two More For Th...
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I was given a 2600 in the early 80's with a blown head gasket.
It was simple to work on and drove beautifully.
I had an SD1 2600. I sold it at 140.000 miles and never had any problems with it.
My parents had a 79 2600 and i drank more oil than petrol. Black smoke so bad the police couldnt read the license plate. It was a hit or miss engine. Some got lucky, others did not
Do you believe that?
I had two 2.6 SD1s and a 3.5 V8. All absolutely perfect, never any problems. I changed the cam belt on the 2.6 every 12000 miles, unnecessary I know but having owned Fords with the 2.0 OHC I learned the hard way for not changing rubber bands. I can only say that if I could I would have a 2.6 SD1 now. Perfect car and those that complained about poor engines is in my opinion down to poor engine servicing. I had more trouble with the handbrake levers on the back plates than anything else.
proud owner of a 1981 2300 . done over 150,000 miles last owner had it 42 years I’ve had it 3 months and love it ! Good to see someone doing this as I’ve been thinking about tweaking mine . Also have a p5b coupe undergoing restoration
Hi Tom
I bought a 1986 SD1 2300, I bought it from a Hartwells forecourt in 1988 with just 12,000 miles on it as the first car I actually chose.
It was absolutely brilliant, (modest) pace, space and a great car to learn how to drive a RWD car, skinny tyres and solid front disks.
I think it would do about six roundabouts of wide open to heavy braking cycles before the brakes didnt work very well.
It did get tinkered with though and before children I had time to tinker properly.
A valve spring broke so I fixed it.
When I say fixed it I did the following
Head stripped and checked for warping, the bad news doom goblins were always saying it was going to warp the head and explode.
A couple of thousands were taken off to clean the face of the head, no visible warping.
12 new valves
24 new springs
New pallet shims to get the valve clearances absolutely right, back when a man would fetch them from the stores at Hartwells.
Oh yes, I almost forgot, having read an article by Dave Vizard on head porting, I decided while the head was stripped to "Port the head"
This was mostly removing casting seams that should have been sorted during manufacture but also increasing the exhaust port capacity after the valve guide.
It looked constrictive so a Black&Decker with a flexidrive and a selection of round grind stones were used.
Bigger was better in my book.
The car was transformed from wafting to very willing.
I had to fetch a passport at short notice, an urgent trip to an overseas customer was arranged but my passport was stolen during a burglary and back then you could drive to Bristol and get a replacement on the spot.
So I joined the M4 and tucked in behind a Porsche in lane three and flashed him to move over, he decided to make progress instead.
This worked well as he caught up with cars in front and harrased them to move over just as I caught up with him.
In summary, I didnt drop below the top speed of a Vitesse for over 50 miles, collected a passport and made my flight by doing much the same on the way back.
I will be watching this channel with interest.
PS: I still have the same car, if you locate a source for the tubular exhaust manifold I would like to know more.
Calm down, 007.
We did a 2600 back in the early 90s as a track day car for a customer. Using a very similar set up to what you have got. Using a luminition electronic ignition lucas oil cooled coil and a pretty aggressive cam shaft made by kent it was making 240 bhp at wheels.
Cooling needed to be vastly uprated and he soon found the rear diff did not like it.
Dont know where you are. I am in lincolnshire but would be happy to donate some time to help if you are not a million miles away.
I think you mean final drive, DIFF’S never had a problem ever, if you ever knew what a diff was like most people don’t derrr 😅 Did it have a front diff? Derrr?.
Do you actually know what a DIFF is?
So many people don’t.
A final drive is a gear reduction and turns the drive through 90 degrees. There you go! The differential varies the drive to the inner and outer wheels on cornering! Simples! 😅
@@goffthomas2554 everyone I have ever known call them diffs. We know its purpose.
@@paulallen6915 It is still incorrect terminology, A final drive which is what it is, primarily a GEAR reduction, then turns the drive 90 degrees. The differential action is a MINOR function. That is what I was taught as an apprentice and at technical college, where I passed my national craftsman exam and technicians certificate. What qualifications do you have? Calling it a diff is incorrect!
@@goffthomas2554 I have a City & Guilds in mechanical engineering for four years and a master tech certificate from Ford. The qualifications are a moot point.
People say hoover, but we know its a vacuum. Its just easier than the long winded version. Lock the diff and get it on a greasy road and tell me it's a minor function.
The only time I have referred to a final drive was on a planetary type drive on Cat motor scrapers and earth movers.
@@paulallen6915 master tech in ford big deal I served my apprenticeship with a Rolls Royce dealership. A diff is not a final drive period
I loved my 2600S, it was owned by Dunlop Tyres as a company car so had the substantial rubber spoiler and lowered suspension. It galloped along I seem to remember at a supremely comfortable 94mph on the motorway at 4000 revs in top (4th of the Automatic box or perhaps it only had 3 in the GM unit?) for thousands of miles and I even managed to jump it 50ft over a humpback bridge in the Dales. It’s downfall was the legendary crank mounted oil pump failures all of them were apparently fated with. Everyone I spoke to at the time said it was an engine out job and not worth doing and you couldn’t get a guaranteed engine from a scrapyard. The fault was that the engine apparently started to seize after about 30 seconds with the orange low oil pressure warning light displaying. After twelve months off road, I got a cheap engine, changed it with no difference at all! It turns out the oil warning light circuit shared a fuse with the electric fuel pump and it was actually just fuel starvation once the gravity accumulated fuel has been used but not replenished. A 5p fuse would have sorted it but the oil pump hysteria condemned it to the scrapper. 😎😇
My dad brought a used SD1 with the 2600 in it.He ran it daily for around 3 years and it never gave any trouble at all.The end of the car was when it burst the heater matrix,a job that no one wanted to do back then.
BMEP: Brake Mean Effective Pressure. A very accurate way of defining an engines efficiency. I have owned and driven all Triumph (2000, 2500, PI) with gear knob mounted overdrive and Rover P6 3500, SD1 2300, 2600 and VDP 3500. I was always impressed by the smoothness of the Triumph 2000 and the 2600 SD1 both ecanomic if driven like a vicar with O/D on the 2000 and 5 speed box on the SD1. Favourite was the P6 3500, fabulous distance car, never an issue, unlike the Triumph PI which needed the fuel pump pressure tweaked up for it to (mostly) start when it was warm!
I had a ex Police 2.5PI with the overdrive switch on the gear knob. Complete Police motorway spec, better rear suspension zip pockets in the roof lining and the rear of the front seats. This car went like the proverbial of a shovel, i was around 19 years old and it was my 2nd car.
I had a 3500SE when they were just a used car and it was the best car I ever owned. Good luck with your dream car and keep the updates coming.
It’s not the worst engine they made, because the truly unfit-for-purpose Triumph Stag existed.
I owned a 2.3 straight 6 Rover SD1 in fire red and I thought it was a fantasrltic car. It was so smooth and silent running that I would think it hadn't started. It reminded my of a highly strung thoroughbred race horse, very flighty and fast. It would fly along eating up the miles and as smoith as silk, a truly great but underappreciated car.
Mines 2.3 in red still used daily kept in garage . I totally agree fantastic cars
Had an old 2600. Was smooth as butter, and pulled like a train, at least compared to any of the other old bangers I'd had before. Absolutely loved it and never had any problems. Shame, but understandable that was throttled, so as not to compete with the V8. Very much looking forward to see how you get on. Excellent project 👍
Thank you Peter!
I have a 2600, lovely car, it was like driving while sitting in you're arm car! Never had engine problems, but the body work was appalling, the car was 6 years old and you could poke your finger through various rust holes!
Leyland Australia did the same stunt here. The 1500 Marina went as well as the 1750 so they dropped a washer with a smaller hole under the 1 3/4” SU. Ford in Australia developed a overhead cam injected set up for the old falcon engine, I still drive one today not as much fun as my V6 Crapi but quicker on the dirt.
@@tomdrivesI thought I’d just let you know this mate - Export models featured the triumph 2600 engine rather that the rover 2600 engine and the rover 2600 engine was also used in the “Rover Freight” also janspeed made a turbo 2600 but they are very very rare if any exist anymore
@@thatroverguy1937thanks, I can’t seem to find much on a 2.6 freight rover though. Do you have anything I can search for?
As a young enthusiast who is both a fan of old straight 6s and rover SD1s i will be keeping a close eye on this. Will it ever be at any shows, would love to see the sd1 in person
I had three SD1s. A 2litre four and two 2.6 sixes. Never had a single problem with any of em.
i had a couple of 2.6's. loved em. took one to Spain and back. averaged 20 mpg. awesome
I worked as the Warranty Claims Manager for a large BL dealer in the West Midlands. I remember the introduction of the 2600 and 2300. I remember clearly there were problems with the 2600/2300 but NOT with the engine.
Good feature, this was the last of the modern era OHC engines fully developed by BL / Triumph (okay the later ‘O’ series was an upgraded OHC ‘B’ series) and overall it was a success despite the power strangulation and daft cheapening like giving the base 2300 s a 4-speed gearbox. The Triumph 2000 / 2500 range with its old pushrod 6 could have been made for another year or so before their delayed replacement by the SD1 6 cyl models (kits were sent to Australia / New Zealand for a while) but the decision to retool the Canley factory for TR7s had been made. And the ‘O’ series of course later went into the SD1 to reinvent the “Rover 2000” model.
A friend worked as an apprentice mechanic in a Chester Leyland franchise, he said that doing the valve clearances was very tricky, I think there was similarity to the Dolomite Sprint setup.
Good for you! I've always thought there was potential in that engine - I'll look forward to you finding it!
Had a 2600se was a good car just service regularly, gave engine a light overhaul and gas flowed head alot of material removed around exhaust valve guide as was very restricted at this point . Still had standard carbs and exhaust just tuned mixture and found it had power when revv'd past 4,000rpm where before it just revv'd up to red line also did 32mpg on trip from Swindon to Leeds to work for the week .
When I was about 14 years old I used take my dad's Rover SDI Rover for a drive around Dagenham it was a 2 l manual in Silver Stratos I love that car 🚗
My dad had a 2600..brilliant engine.. Always wanted to find one to tune
In 1977, I attended a Leyland course on Sprints and Stags in Coventry. At that time, BL were testing a new car intended for release called the Lynx and I'm fairly sure the 2600 was referred to as the Lynx engine and was the power unit in the new car. It was being driven around the midlands with a box over it to disguise it and at that time, BL seemed to be pleased with the tests so far. I seem to remember that the cam lobes at the back of the head (No.6) were prone to breaking off between the two rear caps. I always thought the SD1, especially the V8, was a lovely car to drive fast and felt a lot more stable and safer in corners than the P6 but it never felt as good build and quality wise as the P6. The other thing I'll never forget is when a small group of us managed to sneak into one of the design drawing rooms and saw a drawing on a board for a TR8 2+2. We got caught and I thought we were going to be slung of off the course. Two guys from the plant went absolutely crazy at us but luckily, one of our group had the nerve to say to them "So which one of you forgot to lock the door, then?" and they calmed down a bit then. Fun times.
I do believe that the TR8 2 plus 2 was the Lynx.
Hell yeah! Glad someone else is looking at the 2600 engines. I've been stockpiling a few blocks and parts to have a go myself, with the idea of fitting one to my Spitfire. I had a brief chat with Bruno who made the Grp4 2600. Glad to see his parts living on! He mentioned that the camshaft he had in his engine was done to 'an Austin Healey 3000 race profile', which I'm assuming is the factory '1622' race cam (Newman PH4 for a Healey is this same grind). Where abouts did you get your cam from? I've measured the standard cam and the lift is good, but the duration is terrible. Taking 1mm off the base circle diameter gives you a valve lift not entirely dissimilar to a Schrick 288 cam for a BMW M20, which I'm using as somewhat of a benchmark engine.
I've also had a poke around with potential porting and valves. The valves are relatively generously sized as standard, but the ports could do with a little bit of work for higher rpm. I've checked the port wall thickness as far as I can get to with calipers and I reckon there's enough material to get a 42mm port which is way too big, but should mean it's safe to get a 34-35mm port which would be ideal for a fast road engine. I haven't sectioned my scrap head yet to check for any strange geometry, but it seems promising. Oh, and early Datsun L24 valves should fit with different shims and a hone of the guides, which give you 44mm options over the standard 42mm if you wanted.
I've also looked at boring it out. There's a procedure in the service manual for fitting sleeves which involve boring out the block to 84.5mm so I'm assuming that's a safe overbore. There's a fair bit of meat in the cylinder walls, though you wouldn't want to go much past 85-86.5mm depending on how much core drift your block and head have. For an 84.5mm bore you'd get a 2.8l which is a reasonable increase. MG Montego/Maestro Turbo pistons should be a direct fit as the compression height is right, the pin diameter is the same and the dish gives a good compression ratio. Unfortunately they're like rocking horse poo! Other options are standard O-Series pistons decked by 0.2mm with rebushed rods, or for a fully forged setup Focus ST Mk2 2.5 pistons and Maserati Biturbo rods with a little tickle of the big ends.
I've got most of my research written up on the Sideways Technologies Triumph forum if you're interested. It's on the Unibody Spitfire thread, starts about page 7.
I never came across a troublesome 2600. I liked it a lot. I only got to drive them occasionally (company fleet) but one thing I did notice was what sweetheart the SD1 2600 was to drive on snow and ice. So smooth and controllable and a perfect complement to the long-nosed axle rear which allowed good traction but which could be overwhelmed by the V8's brutality.
The main problem was the camshaft seizing in the cam carrier due to lubrication failure. That was due to the oil restrictor valve in the head (or the block - can't recall) so during a rebuild, the valve would be removed and thrown away. Either that or punch the centre out of it. Then you'd have an uninterrupted oil supply and as long as the valve stem seals were good it would use no more oil than normal. They also liked a head gasket but that wasn't so common. It wasn't a bad engine but they were quite lazy due to the tractor spec camshaft. With a 260 or 270 degree cam I bet a 2600 would do 150 bhp easily. I think the end game was a 3.0 24 valve version that would have made the V8 obsolete. I guess we'll never know!
Just found your channel and looking forward to your build. I had a 2300 company car 1978-1980, had to return it as I moved abroad. The 2600 was above my pay grade! I remember it fondly as comfortable to drive, nice manual and clutch, and spacious but I had to reverse the driver seat mounts to suit my 6’4” frame, (which introduced me to the then new use of Torx fasteners). What it could have become with fuel injection, which was on my next Volvo.
Wrote my original comment during the first quarter of the video, those engine parts look huge! Good luck with the project and Merry Christmas!
I have subscribed purely from a nostalgic point of view. I have owned in the past no less than NINE Rover SD1 2600 S and SE. I never had one single problem with any of them apart from a snapped hand brake cable on a steep hill in an automatic and a head gasket on another.Sadly I am not driving anything now, but after the Rovers my last car was a Volvo V70R highly tuned and modified. How I miss the Rovers.
Back in 2000 my friend rebuilt his straight 6 Rover engine from the ground up with top quality modern internal parts ,he also had the head ported ,polished and gas flowed and had a tuned stainless steel system made from the exhaust manifold right through to the tail pipe.
He replaced the carbs with an injector system (i don't know which) and topped it all off with a 5 speed auto box that had a stall speed of 2.5k revs.
Once it was gently run in he took it for a dyno test and it turned out 175bhp which proved everything that the engineers had said about the engine was spot on!!.
When he road tested it -the 0-60 time was very impressive 0-60 of 7 secs. It would have eaten the 3.5 V8 for breakfast.
If Leyland weren't so blinkered then they would have developed both engines and ended up with BMW killers !!.
Great project, I'll be following. Happy New year!
Thanks Tom, what you have done you will also reduce the pumping losses at the inlet manifold and carburetor using the Webber setup, but please observe the oil pressure at the top end
My uncle had a sd 2600 back in 1991 and let me have a go. I was newly passed my test and was driving a mini 850. My god did that car move and so comfy ❤
I've just come across this channel and you have a new subscriber! I'm really looking forward to seeing the development of your old SD1. Keep up the good work.
Have fun with those carbs! I fitted 3 x 36 DCOEs to a triumph 2.5PI and a TR6 exhaust manifold after removing the injection system. It was a monster!
I had a 2600 in the early 80s and found it an interesting drive as despite the odd starting problem I found the car a good drive especially with the slightly vintage feel from the gear box .
In for the build 👌🤘...Love to see the unsung ones get some much needed upgrades...
Loving your enthusiasm and choice of content. All the best of luck with the 2600, I hope you can make the car BL should have made!!
Great idea and interested to see how you do. I had a SAH tuned triumph 2000 with extraction manifold it went like a rocket but fuel vaporized when stationary and not easy to start to start as the engine bay was so hot.
Get a good oil cooler and larger core radiator.
Keep us posted to show that BLs restrictions actually happened with the underrated PE-166 engine...BTW was in a 1979 Manual Rover 2600S that showed its tear lights to an Auto 3500 with ease in 1988 so will follow this Channel 👍🏻
Tom, that’s a great project. I owned a 2600 for years and have an NG kit car with the 2600 engine but with a triple carb conversion. It was tuned on a dyno to get the SU needles set up. Still have the dyno sheet……somewhere! The tubular manifold should make a big difference. Thanks for sharing your project passion.
As an upper sixth student, I did one day a week in a garage helping work on cars. At the age of I think 16 in 1983 in the garage, a British Leyland dealership, a Black Rover SD1 V8 with cruse control and what looked like black leather seats, to this day I think it is a amazing car it was brand knew I think, anyone around at the time would be gob smacked at the quality and design of such a car.
I had a 2600S as a company car for and it was very reliable. When it was due for change I bought it for my dad who ran it for years afterwards. The only issue he had was the ignition but it was an easy fix.
Good luck with the project Tom. Very interesting and I like your approach of making it the best it should have been for the road. New subscriber.
Thank you for your interesting video. I had a Rover 2600 bought virtually new from a BL employee. It was a superb car to drive with quick, accurate steering a lovely rifle bolt accuracy gearshift and a good ride. It was virtually impossible to get the rear end to step out because of the excellent axle location having a full Watt linkage. The engine though........................no one seems to mention the repeated head gasket failures - mine was re-done three times by the local BL main agent and I just decided to get rid of the car after that. Build quality was dire with failures of the heater, windscreen seal, door locks, power steering rack (twice), clutch cylinders (three times), and rear self -levelling struts (twice) and finally totally dangerous rear brakes following a change of shoes to a newer material. Thereafter the rear brakes would lock-up with the slightest provocation and massive axle tramp set in. I was truly glad to get rid of the car, which could have been so good. I bought a German Senator next and it did 100,000 hard driven miles with the only fault being a loose connection in the ignition circuit which took ten minutes to fix
I served my time on those back in the 80s, The only problem with the cylinder heads was the oil restrictor in the cylinder block. It was designed with a one-way valve to retain some oil in the cylinder head. But used to carbon up very easily usually down to incorrect service intervals usually by the owner after a while, as a routine, we used to remove the pin out of the middle of the restrictor. After that, there were no more issues with them. They were a good engine. But a bit of a pain in the arse to set up on the bench, using all the individual shims taking the cam carrier on and off repeatedly
Had a few of these through my works in the late seventies and early eighties with head gasket issues. Due to over heating the heads would warp badly. So badly in fact, that if they were just re-faced, the camshafts would bind in the journals when the head was re-fitted to the block. To overcome this it was vital that they were re-faced on a vertical milling machine, once the head was pulled down flat to the mill bed, to ensure the cam journals stayed inline.
After watching this video boxing day evening I have had to subscribe! If you are going to do all the things you said in this video to a Rover SD1 2600 engine then I just have to follow along and watch your progress. I am an avid SD1 fan, so much so I own 5 2600's and 2 V8's! Only 1 V8 is currently road legal and only 1 2600 is road legal and needless to say I'm not short on spare parts!!!
I hope you can find a kit to increase the oil feed to the rockers/head. Would be good to bore it out too, if you have the means. Better make sure you can cool it, too! Wishing you all the best of luck from Australia - we only have a handful of SD1 6's down here, but lots of V8s (although they're all low-compression and detuned fuel injection). We have some later high-compression Land Rover units we can use, but generally the SD1 gets a bad rap in Aus.
Sounds fun, Happy Christmas . would love to see a modern brake upgrade project for older cars ie brake pipes disks pads calipers . The cortina looks amazing.
I'd be looking for a bump in compression if your going down the route of an upgraded camshaft. Matched to a good flowing head, itll really wake it up. If your not to bothered about originalty, id go wasted spark igntion only ecu control using some thing like a Mondeo v6 coilpack with appropriate leads.
Looking forward to seeing your progress.
Always go the way you want. And lets face it , itll he interesting and make some great content 👌
Good luck with developing the Rover - hope it turns out lots of fun..
Apart from the engines we in Rover Service had to replace in and out of warranty due to the seized camshafts, the other major issue I recall were the dropped liners that used to smash into the crankshafts.
Rover Triumph engineers came up with either interference fit or ‘glued’ cylinder liners, which dropped and wrote the unit off.
Someone can’t recall who adapted a Japanese “top hat” liner which required the block to be machined to accommodate the “lip”.
Suggest you do likewise if your unit has any liners - good luck 👍🏼
Did many head jobs on these due to seized camshafts also viscous cooling fan hubs falling off.
Good advice on the top hat liners.
I also worked in a Rover dealership for many years, the one thing I recall early in the usage of the 2300/2600 engines was a recall to fit a large bolt with a washer attached to the water pump boss, to stop the cooling fan/viscous coupling assembly from unscrewing itself and scything through the radiator, which I saw happen on several occasions
The SD1 was before my time so I never really saw many on the road growing up,now after watching this video I’m intrigued and I’ve subscribed for more content,cheers fella happy new year to ya 👍😉💪
Go for it Tom, looks like a great project. Looking forward to your videos. 😎
“Every day is a school day” !!! I thought these were only made with a v8.
Sat here in Leyland watching this. I remember the entrance to the car factory, it’s now a Morrisons supermarket. We had “Station Garage” who were a BL dealer about 1/2 a mile from the factory. That’s now a small Tesco.
Can't wait to see how she runs, and looks. Lotsa luck to you, hope it goes super smooth. I bet it'll be beastly. What hp do you expect. I subscribed thats about all i can do at this point but i hope it helps.
This sounds like a superb plan. What a great idea for a project. Having driven both, I actually prefer the six to the V8. Foibles aside, I think it's a much nicer engine, and it would always be my choice of the two. Best of luck with your endeavours, and Merry Christmas 🎄
I had a pair of side-draught Weber 40 DCOEs on my 2-litre full-rally-engined Fiat 131 - it was bonkers! You'll almost certainly need to get it on a dyno to get them jetted right, and invest in a set of vacuum gauges to keep them balanced. But the result - with the right cam - will have you grinning like a loon all day long! |Brakes and suspension will need to be upgraded next. Looking forward to seeing the progress...
You've just reminded me of my old 1.6 twin-cam mirafiori (spelling?). Used as a rallycross car in the late 80's & at the time I had free access to AvGas, so ran it 50/50 with pump fuel. Omg that thing used to rev like crazy, well past the red line!
@@wirdy1 - Yes! My 4-door Supermirafiori 1600TC began unmodified, but I too fell in love with that wonderful engine and decided I wanted more! I found a tuning company which ralleyed Fiats and they offered seriously breathed-on versions of either the 1800 TC or the 2000. I figured that because the Mirafiori Sport used the 2000 I’d go for that, but my, it was an animal! I later thought that less stroke and more revs could have been better for what was a daily driver, but I decided to accommodate the mad vibrations for the sake of the sheer power! It broke 2 competition clutches and 3 diffs, and I once had an indicated 140 mph out of it! It was also very thirsty and noisy, but I loved it!
My dad had a 2600 manual, custard yellow, in launch year 1976 (R reg). Curiously, it had all round electric windows but no power steering and even at over 4 turns lock to lock was still heavy, especially manoeuvring / parking.
I liked the car, but not as much as the dark blue Triumph 2.5 PI Mk II auto (P reg) it replaced - I absolutely loved that car!
I had a Triumph 2.5 PI MK II overdrive as well in the past ... It was my BEST CAR EVER !!
@@robferwerda4376
It was a beautiful, stylish car inside and out!
Good informative video.
What about the straight six lump that was used in the Land Rover series 3 109 ?
It was an absolute slug.
Here's the thing. So Leyland Australia introduced the Leyland P76. It had 2 engine choices: 2.6 ohc 6 derived from the k series and a 4.4 v8 derived from the Rover v8. Now the P76 was a failure for a range of reasons but here were 2 motors available in 1973 that BL could have used in the SD1.
Yes indeed. My brother had a P76 Executive. If it had wings it would have flown. Of course it would have looked like it was going backwards but that's another story.
Sad to say that I broke four of them as a young guy. Floor shift Super that I converted to 4 speed was my favourite. My mate has one that he drives in the UK. Brings his family British home to OZ for most Christmases though.
cant wait to see the car running with the new mods, got me excited now
Fantastic.
What a great idea for a project, modding the car with period possibilities.
This raises a question about the TR7. Would it be possible to fit this 6-pot into one? If so, there would be some interesting performance possibilities. Is the 6 lighter than the 8?
You see what I’m thinking here?
What a great looking car that SD1 was but that GM ally V8 is also incredibly tunable in its own right as many a hot rodder will testify,the only limit to the power is your bank account, I suppose you could say the same for a flat 4 Vee Dub or many other power plants.
Love your project, exciting times.
Good to hear Tom I had a 2.6VDP back in the day and always thought it could do more. Go for it fella i will be watching 👍
Had a 2600 SE. With the carbs set up right it was a dream to drive. I Was told the Cast block was originally designed for a 6 cylinder truck engine
I owned one in the late 80's and had a string of problems with it including pulling up to a set of traffic lights after a 200 mile drive only to find it had a major misfire. It was only running properly on 2 cylinders because 4 cam lobes were completely round. I had to rebuilt the top end on the street to drive the 200 miles home using parts from a scrap yard.
Also had issues with the wiring loom causing it not to start. I had to wire in a new ballast resistor.
All in all, you putting a lot of work into a flawed engine. IE. It uses ONE cam lobe to operate BOTH the inlet and the exhaust valves so the valve timing will always be a compromise.
awsome, go go go, this is going to be a fantasic build and all yours to enjoy.
Thanks, I had a 2600 rover in the early 80s as a company car, it did over 100000 miles and I do not recall any real problems, maybe the engine had been partially sorted by then. It was quick enough but nothing special,very spacious and comfortable, but the back end bounced around a bit if you were too enthusiastic.
136BHP sadly though because of the neutering it was a bit gutless over 4000 RPM. Even in my short drives i noticed that.
@@tomdrives That is almost the same HP rating as my old 3l v6 capri I had back in my single days.
"Why not just fit a V8?" Because the straight six is a beautiful, silky smooth configuration that whooshes along (it will by the time youve fitted that intake and extractor, so well done for taking it on!
BTW, it's "death knell" not "death nail"; known as an Eggcorn I believe 😊
I had a 2600 in 1990, it was a 1982 car, so 8 years old and even then rotten as a pear, with large holes in the bodywork in some places. That said I loved it, and the engine was probably the only good bit of it (well apart from the interior, those were great too)!
Good luck with the build, can't wait to see how you get on! ;-)
The important thing will be to sort the poor oiling to the cam issue!
My Dad had a 2600S lovely car we both loved it. But 1st engine replaced on warranty " Luckily" 2nd engine cam n head job twice. On the 3rd cam knock she was getting bit old n my Dad reluctantly cut her loose.
We found out in later years there was a ball bearing in the oil passage to stop oil running back n creating smokey start ups.? But this one way oil value would be a bottle neck for sludge! n cause oil to cam starvation!! Rover guys in the know would remove the ball bearing n change oil filters regularly.
I've seen a video somewhere of a guy knocking out the ball bearing saying " that can go for starters"
Great channel, l have lots of fond memories in the silver SD1.
My Dad had 2600, I've got a P62000 and 2x 75s, a diesel auto and a very early V6 manual, turns out I'm a Rover man! (Ex M3 & Audi S8) and I'm sold on them. Good luck with your project, I will watch with baited breath. Based in NW Cumbria, shout if you need anything!
Thanks Frederick, appreciate it
Tom, don't listen to others, always go your own way.
Good luck, just subscribed.
Thanks Michael!
My Dad bought a Rover 2300 in 1979 it blew a cam cover gasket on its drive home from the dealership ! But i actually don't recall many engine issues after that (metal moth was another story though )
Different engine but my father had a SDI 2400D(B-1985, which had beautiful engine which run and run(but when it did go wrong-IT WAS SERIOUS/knackered) father loved em(previously had P5B/Daimler sovereign) 1st he had GTU 335T a 3500 in green which we towed a caravan to South of France &back then after some dubious cars(including a Austin Princess in brown with vinyl roof)b4 he had the diesel Rover❤
I built a 2600 from a brand new painted works shell and a front end damaged write off. Had endless problems with it keeping on randomly stalling. Turned out camshaft front pulley had been hit and moved badk breaking piece off centr cam retainer so timing was moving. Sorted by a brave and very skilled welder with engine in car and only cam cover removed! Soon after bought spare factory head so no problems after that😊.Head sold many years later to a chap looking at an early 2600 at Beaulieu Automart who bought it after I told him 2600 was much less complex than V8. Car will have survived as it was concours
This engine was also used in the South African built Land Rover series III (R6 variant) if I recall....
I had a 2.6 in blue. a smart looking car that delivered 14 mpg struggled to reverse and had cylinder head issues with carbon build up on the back of the valves that once I figured out and managed to set the valve clearances it then knocked the bottom end out. Not my best week.😢
I really like that you are making a proper 2600. I had a vitesse & briefly a 3500S and although the sound was great on the latter, it wasn't proper fast. Best SD1 I drove had a 5.0 v8 swap, only problem being traction! They are beautiful cars...enjoy
I had a sd1 2600 had head skimmed race valves. Gearbox done loved that car only car I would have today if I had room
A lot can be said for keeping the original engine. I have an 03 Civic with D17 engine, everyone says swap for B or K series but I want to explore the stock D series.
Go for it. A Vitesse 2600 would be really great to see.
Very gud vid, i have always known the 2600 was strangled from the get go, i think i recall something written by Ljk setright?
More power to you Tom. There's a pair of little books by John Passini on Weber carbs. Book 1 is the operational theory, book 2 is on tuning and maintenance (which I have, and was a component of
my winning 2 club championships in an Australian Valiant Charger) Anyway I reckon book 2 is the "ducks guts". Having said that, both books'd be good... not that I've read the first one. Godspeed mate!
When I started my first job as an engineer at Hoborn Eaton after leaving Uni in '79 I was fascinated by BMW's. With my first paycheck I bought an E12 528i auto on the never never. Well, everyone in managment at Hobourn drove Rover SD1's, that was the car that said you had arrived at the top, at least where I worked. On the first day driving my BMW into the works car park our chief executive was parking up his Blue SD1 Vitesse and watched me park. He came over to me and put his arm around me and I will never forget his words ' You're not going to get very far here driving a kraut wagon you know, get yourself a Rover, this German crap is never going to catch on.'
More power to ya Tom... Godspeed mate.
Brilliant plan the 2600R, Yes, show us the real potential of the engine! My Rover 2600S was a money pit. Loved the shape of the car however dearly! Light-Blue Metallic. She was gorgeous!
I loved the 2.6 engine... Had a couple- including an auto- which curiously went like stink- more so than the manual !
Well maintained- a nice, smooth lump...
Had 2 rover sd1,s a 1983 gold 2.6 and an 85 2.6 vdp loved them the 1983 had a head gasket fail but apart from that no problems.still the best looking car ever made
I’m excited for the build. 👏👏👏👏
Same here Nick, it’s one I’ve always wanted to do.
dear tom, i would be interested in lift and timing you have specified for what i assume will be a fast road/rally cam. obviously, there is nothing available off the shelf.
good luck with the 2600! i had one and i loved it.also had a 2l model,4 banger from the 1.8 tc marina,guyless wasnt the word, still liked it as it was one of the last.
I own an SD1 Vitesse that is in bits just now and have owned many SD1 v8's, I've also driven a few 2600 and they are all great drives, what everyone forgets is that the V8 was tuned for economy on the SD1 at least prior to the vitesse, so it does stand to reason the 6's were held back in the same way, there were the documented 6 issues but then again the V8 was heavily altered for the european market from the original Buick design and was very servicing sensitive. All 6 and v8 sd1 are good in my book.
You're doing a brilliant job Tom, really got me into all of the BL, Rover, MG Rover history, of which I had little previous knowledge. I was born and brought up 4 miles from Longbridge 76 years ago, and most of my relatives, neighbours, schoolfiends etc. worked theres, so it's in the blood really. Half of me finds the fall of MG Rover intensely depressing and the other half finds it extremely interesting. I'm at present mid way through Mike Gould's book about Rover, and it contains so much relevant content that, when I've finished it, I think I'm going to have to go back to the beginning. Keep it going mate, essentially viewing. Congrats about saving the prototypes too.👍👍
I bought a SD1 2600 with a blown engine. Fixed her up and drove it for a year. Then the uni body didn't meet MOT standards and bought another body. We relocated the engine and gearbox and i drove for another year. At that moment there was a slightly short in the headlight wires due to wear. A waterhose leak cracked the head again and that was that.
Back in the day, my father bought(new) a 2300, then a 2600S, and then another year later a 3500 Vitesse in red.
Great cars, super comfortable and well specced, especially the Vitesse.....
He then went to trade the Vitesse for a Lotus Esprit Turbo(in white a la James Bond fame), but he was too short to see comfortably over the steering wheel!!!!
Needless to say I was gutted, and we ended up with a Toyota Celica Supra(still a great car).
Happy memories - Thx.
❤😁👍