After watching your video, I started playing around with the Melee Combat a bit. While it can be frustrating at times with machines simply not allowing you to get great combos, it is incredibly satisfying when you manage to take down a group of machines with only your spear and warrior bow. Also, it is REALLY resource efficient. I surely improved my Combat with your tips! All in all, your video definitely helped me to admire Guerilla's work with their Melee Combat System a lot more, thank you for that!
That is all great but the game does not allow Aloy to stab with spear when melee figthting and that is just nonsense and terrible. That is like having a dagger and not being able to stab, a knife and not being able to cut, a scimutar and not being able to slab... I could go on.
I like the combos, but Aloy needs a block/parry. Obviously, you shouldn't be able to parry/block mid/heavy machines, or certain attacks from light machines, but that is something that was missing against humans in particular. It would be cool to parry a lightweight machine's melee attacks, and maybe if you missed the timing, you get staggered, but if you hit it, you can do a critical strike. Great video.
I think a parry could be cool if it's implemented well and like you said only useful against certain machine attacks and not all of them. It might get tricky with the existing controls but I'm sure guerrilla could implement it if they wanted to. I'd love to see something like that in the next game :)
My thoughts exactly, she even has a shield already! Which she used as a glider, when I saw her pick up that shield for the first time I was so sure we'd get a parry/ block but no. xOx also not being able to lock on is a bit annoying, especially when facing a tanky human boss
@@allandm When Aloy picks up the Shield Wing she mentions it's broken and can't be used for defense but will definitely work as a glider. Overall I just dont see a block/party system working. These Machines are hefty, even the smaller ones are probably pretty heavy. All I see is Aloy getting a broken arm or something trying to block an coming tail swipe from a Clawstrider. Or Trying to parry a Tremortusk when they're trying to swipe you with their tusks would definitely not be realistic. What I've liked about Horizon is it's pretty realistic when it comes to what Humans can physically handle against Machines. Sure block and parry would work against humans, I just dont see it being viable or realistic against machines.
@@Soul-HunterVIII i forgor the shield was broken, and yes I agree with you. I don't think a parry/ shield should work against the machines, it would be mainly for human combat. I really enjoy the machine combat and wouldn't really change much if anything, it's when it comes to humans that i don't like it as much, a parry, block and lock on system could make it more fun i think.
Personally, I think that melee still needs more work for the inevitable sequel. I'd say that they should make melee at least an option for dealing with smaller machines. Seriously, enemies like the Leaplasher seemed to have been made with melee in mind!
I'm sure it will be made EVEN better in the next game, but I love what we've been given in Forbidden West. I think if you understand the melee system/playstyle you can take on really any machine... it just may be more difficult for the large ones
@@ahtano I think that, for melee to truly work, Aloy will need to be given a shield to block and parry attacks. Apparently, the developers considered giving her one but dropped it since they thought it would "overcomplicate controls". To ensure melee does not overshadow ranged combat, have the shield consume weapon stamina and be ineffective against larger machines. Also, to not interrupt combat, include a skill that lets Aloy get up quicker when knocked down by consuming stamina. Finally, allow Aloy to zip up to larger machines with her new grappling hook to wail on them after having exposed their weak spot.
@@daanduijkers4845 A Short Dodge (like last minute dodge in other games) would also help a lot, to get back at counter attacking. And yes Leaplashers are light machine (means every body part count) and very vulnarble to knockdown, their treshold is only 113
@@paristeta5483 yeah you’re on the right track. It’s all about a quick r2 charge to knock them down. Then you crit and their done. E Z. Im only on hard though so maybe it’s different on UH
I'm crazy for "The Destroyer" and try to incorporate it into my every battle regardless human or machine. It doesn't works as well for machines but I don't care LOL.. seeing Aloy go berserk and pummel on onto my enemies just feels awesome 😅
I always forget all the different combos so I usually don’t go the melee route, but I absolutely love all the animations. Aloy subtly swapping her spear between hands is a neat detail, and she does it so often. My favorite is when you start walking after a melee attack, she sometimes tosses her spear behind her back to her other hand. Thank you for mentioning how awesome the fighting animations are!
It is not just the battle. Aloy's animation is the best of any game I've played. I think it was Horizon Zero Dawn that made me stop playing 1st person perspective games.
Aloy made me stop playing World of Warcraft ( what i played like 10 Years before) and i never returned back 🥳I missed so much Great Single Player Games at my WoW Time.Aloy saved me from the Evil CashGrab Mechanics 😂
I had a really tough time with the advanced melee. I just wound up button smashing and using ranged weapons most of the time. Maybe I’ll go back and use this info to give it another try.
Good vid! Thanks for uploading!! My one problem with melee combat in HFW is there are no defense options other than dodge roll, slide or run away. No block, no parry... Doesn't mean melee isn't fun - it is, but it will always be incomplete without these fundamental mechanics. 😞
That is not true. The Listed book values should be in my melee sheet: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ZsxDK4R9YgWmD8NFf6zIalwoNfkZ_0rg/edit?usp=share_link&ouid=111918939703848430091&rtpof=true&sd=true And it seems to scale with Melee Damage, and higher then the raw damage would.
Great video. You're probably the first guy I've seen sharing about HFW's melee system. Most opinions I've read online either ignore the melee system or hate it because they didn't spend enough time learning the combos. The improvements from HZD are great but I still think they can be slightly more refined with animation cancels etc. I mainly use melee when dealing with rebels but have yet to try this playstyle on heavyweight machines. Might try it when Burning Shores gets released!
Start with Shield Breaker (R1+R1+R2) Power Attack (R2Hold) and Half-Moon Slash. Low Health Defense and Low Health Regen Rank 4 help greatly with survival.
I'm about halfway thru the game and just discovered that resonator works on machines. I thought it was a melee pit human/human only thing. Found that out getting ROFL stomped in the arena 😊
Finally someone who shows the meele playstyle some love! Great and detailed analysis :) A fun tip about power attacks that the game doesn’t tell you about: 1 power attack is enough to knock down smaller machines while 2 knock down medium ones.
@@paristeta5483 that is true, but power attacks are a quicker and more manageable way of doing it in my opinion, especially since you can cancel out of a power attack during the charge animation.
Combat does look and feel real good, I think if there was some type of parry/counter/block when fighting other humans or ligth attacks from machines would make it much more complete
Wow. Great video dude. I’ve never seen anyone compliment the melee in this game. It is certainly not my favorite aspect but I love that they improved it and made it a viable play style.
to be fair i think it's really meant for human enemies... i just wish we had more of them to fight in the post game after completing all the rebel camps
That would be cool in a Horizon Zero Dawn RPG where you can chose other Tribes and Chars ..or a MMO Action Adventure with all these potential Chars.But Aloy with the Story of her hmm more Hunter Style Tribe would just destroy the feeling of her Person is Autentik in her Story.
The melee feels satisfying when you're fighting anything but machines because Aloy's spear hits as hard as a pool noodle. The melee pits, namely Bulwark and Thornmarsh were aids because the melee system falls apart when you fight an enemy that's resistant to stun, namely heavies like champions with their instant tracking kick that has no warning and chunks HP on harder difficulties.
I definitely love the improvements, her attacks are so strong now. Don't even get me started with the valors. Also thanks for making a video around HFW melee attacks
@@ahtano Yeah, those things are like a Mid-Level weapon between Light and Heavy. They are a regular bow with a much heavier ammo type. Incredibly powerful, but easy to move around with, they do piss me off though with how slow they reload until you get Kuo's version.
Pre-ordered the DLC and I'm hyped. Got all the trophies including the new game plus and ultra hard trophies. I love that the game gives you so many options on how to take down enemies
As someone who prefers melee to ranged combat in games, I was disappoitned to find the melee combat in FW amost impossible to use on machines as they knock you down way too much and you get punished too much being close to them. It could be that I didn't completely nail the combat mechanics like getting off the ground, but Aloy would sometimes stay on the ground way too long no matter what I pressed and sometimes she would knock back on her feet instantly. Melee was great against human enemies though
Im 200+hrs in and i too cant stand the melee mechanics. I just use my bows to one shot them from range and try not to engage in close combat. Its too frustrating 😅
@@dantesos7564 I thought the mechanics were decent apart from the fact that machines can knock you down so much, Aloy spends too much time laying on the ground and so the melee combat doesn't feel smoth when you keep being interrupted so much. You can't swing the spear more than 2 times without being floored lol
If you learn how to cancel/chain combos, melee becomes drastically more effective against smaller machines. I mailed a melee build for awhile in Ultra Hard and it was really fun.
Frozen Wilds added a whole new skill tree to Zero Dawn. Here's hoping we get either a new skill tree or additional skills for each tree in Burning Shores.
Someone found a new Valor Surge in the newest Burning Shores trailer. When they show the weapon wheel, there’s one called Minefield. Pretty much a guarantee that we’re getting either additional skill trees or expansions to the current ones 😊
Melee combat in HZD was pretty simple, dodge, light attack and heavy attack and you're done. HFW added a complexity that while at first it seems trivial and unnecessary, the more you do fight with it and the more you use the various combos you notice how satisfying combat actually is, and even though there's no way to parry an attack (would be amazing for a third installment) you can actually go toe to toe with pretty much every enemy.
my favorite unofficial combo is light>heavy>light-heavy (the second two in quick succession in the air causes both attacks to happen on your way down.)
For me I was ok with the light attack and then having R2 as a heavy. I enjoyed melee how it was, but they surprised me in "Forbidden West. I really enjoyed the new attacks and combos. Great video man. I can't wait for "Burning Shores. 👍🏼
Melee can be difficult but when you pull it off it's great fun. I've always played from a distance but there are some beautiful moves and it's satisfying when you pull off a great finish. Another great video. Thanks.
Thank you for this video, this game is amazing and it gets too much hate, seeing these types of videos is reasuring. I personally suck at melée in HFW but you made me wanna try it more!
Nice that you good at it. But it's buggy in general - long arcs, no clear direction when you attack (basically just swinging the spear), no block/parry, make it just unpalatable. Worst of all are the human opponents: lunges of several feet forward to attack you (that Alloy can't make) just kills the melee vibe.
I think in the 3rd installment they should utilize the shield wing like Hogwarts Protego in some way. Maybe add a long dash thrust that can build stagger or stun damage. Have counters like a spear bash or throw something to link combos together.
Not the pinnacle of game combat, but it's amazing how Guerrilla expanded since the first game. I can see Aloy wielding more wapons in the third game or even on the DLC this month.
@@ahtano yeah, people think is un limited or at least way more arrows but its not, thats why is not that good vs machines, on humans on the other hand its way better
Interesting. I didn't use melee at all during my playthrough. Just a hit her and a hit there, mostly on smaller enemies. It felt underpowered. But after watching your video I might do another playthrough and try it out.
I really enjoyed melee for the first 40 hrs of my playtime. The problems with melee are a) not enough damage b) no weapon variety Imagine more melee weapons like heavier ones or faster two handed melee weapons. I've always said that the horizon franchise at its core is a polished monster hunter game. What it lacks are weapons and build variety. Ranged weapons are varied enough but melee weapons aren't. And armours don't make meaningful differences like those in monster hunter games. Forbidden west is a huge step above zero dawn especially in enemy variety and enemy design, side activities and puzzles. I really hope for more Action-RPG elements and monster hunter-ish gameplay systems in the next game
Hey I just found your channel and I'm geeking out with your encyclopedic knowledge of and attention to the details of Horizon melee combat and machines. It reminds me of the yellow shirt discombobulated kid video. I have an observation. Consider creating 30 to 120 second "discombonulate" style shorts with Aloy? Ending with an Aloy saying. The 3D Ken Burns pauses. The transitions. The attack combo breakdown. All compressed into a short, move by move breakdown of a single kill sequence. That would make for great replay value.
this might've been my first melee combat system that is actually harder to make full use of if you are bad at twitch aiming (like me) relative to actually staying at range...
Never saw on in like that. Good to see that there are some people out there, which actually appreciate the work and love that the developers have put inside the game. Should have been game of the year, but unfortunately the reviewers to blind to recognise a masterpiece. I hope the DLC will provide the comeback for the game, that it diserved
I do really like the animations of melee like the way she spins her spear in her hand after a standard heavy attack. All of the stealth strike animations on human enemies are great too! 👌 As a lover of warrior bows I don't know why I've never bothered much with melee (probably to used to the hunter playstyle) but your video has definitely persuaded me to give it a proper go. I liked how you took the time at the start to appreciate the work GG put in to all the animations and stuff too. Great vid anyway dude! I look forward to more ✌️
I liked how much they worked on Melee combat but i never got around to use it that much so i quickly forgot the combos and such . But when i get the dlc and play the new game plus save , I'm gonna pay more attention to it
Great video! I really struggle in combat and was needing exactly this advice. Thank you. I wish there was an option to slow the game down. I end up panicking when things turn sour and I learn nothing from that.
The melee combat in HFW evolved exponentially compared to HZD gameplay. The melee approach doesn’t work all that well on Ultra Hard - the enemies have too much HP and too much one-shot potential to kill Aloy. However, on any of the other difficulty settings, the melee approach is definitely viable and very rewarding for those who plan out attacks well. One really cannot use Aloy as a “hack and slash” melee hero - if you try that above the “easy” difficulty setting, the enemies will punish your recklessness. But if you thoughtfully apply melee combos with intermixed slides, Warrior Bow attacks, dodges, vaults, Resonators, and (surprised this wasn’t mentioned in this video) the Blastsling technique that bombs opponents while Aloy simultaneously evades and creates space… and yeah, one *can* play HFW with primarily melee offense.
Can I ask, do you play on Resolution, Balanced or Performance mode? P.s. just got the game and I'm loving melee combat, even though it's risky Vs machines it just feels and looks so good
Given how much they improved melee combat in this game makes me wonder what they’ll do for a third game personally I’d like them to improve what you can do with overridden machines like giving orders and directing them and maybe riding some of the larger combat units and use their weapons and abilities.
Broooooooooooo I had no idea about how wrong I was using that play style so fat until this video. You totally renewed my interest in the melee in this game by making me want to try all that stuff. But I can't deny that I still miss a parry option tho.
The DLC adds elemental damage to your spear but yea i think there should be variety of spears you could switch between and it would make melee as good as range
Rare game can fight machine with melee combat, I don’t know any one except this one. I like Elden Ring or God of War type of game, which can fight with large size boss. Melee in HFW is definitely unique.
I think the melee skill floor is too high to bother with both in terms of inputs and knowledge on when to use it. On top of that, the other playstyles are faster and safer. I had a much easier time learning Sekiro's gameplay loop than HFW's melee system.
Melee in ZD was just sometimes free damage in the form of silent or critical strike... in forbidden west it's the same, plus resonator blasts and a few extra moves. Melee doesn't still do a whole lot of damage and pulling off long combos usually costs you more life than the damage you do, at least on ultra hard. My most used real melee combo is jump off, cos it's the only one that's fast enough to pull off before another machine comes to body slam me. That said, once a player can get skilled enough at the game it starts to look like machines are dodging Aloy, and that player can start applying resonator blasts left right and center, it's a whole another ballgame. Not there yet myself, I'm only trying to unlearn how to dodge like in ZD, cos apparently it doesn't work like that in FW. I always tried to dodge so the enemy doesn't hit me, but it's borderline impossible. Now dodging is all about abusing i-frames, let the enemy hit you but time dodge so well it just nullifies the attack.
i really started appreciating the melee in this game when i realized it's the only practical way to manage those goddamn kangaroo jacks. i hate leapslashers 😭
Melee in this game is divisive for me, on the one hand, I think the expanded set of moves and Aloy's animations are excellent, but the impact they have on enemies and their reactions can be very underwhelming.. whereas with the ranged weapons, explosives and traps, the damage you do feels more tangible, so I tend to stick to a mainly ranged build, only throwing in charged melee attacks for finishers or stuns. Overall though I still greatly appreciate the improvements they made from the first game, but there's still a lot of room before it becomes a great melee system
I did a run on UH speccing into the melee tree, and I'd say it is absolutely not a viable playstyle in 70% of battles in UH. The issue is groups of enemies will attack all at once, not one by one. So any time you face a group of machines or humans, if you try do deal any ammount of damage to one, the rest will just snipe you with ranged or dash attacks. The melee combos are also all completely useless, since they take so long to perform that you are virtually guaranteed to be interrupted by an attacking machine before you finish your combo. The Nora Warrior combo also literally never knocks down enemies like it is supposed to. The only useful moves are short combos like aerial slash or halfmoon slash, which are purposely built to be more movement- focused. In general, melee is only useful for one on one battles with medium or small machines. I find 99% of the time, it is faster to just spam the warrior bow, spike throwers or shredder gauntlets, than to kill a machine with melee attacks. If I am actually going for melee in a fight, the most effective strategy is really just to unlock the skill that increases your knockdown power, charge up the resonator, then I wait for the enemy to attack, dodge it, and follow up with a power attack while the enemy is in "endlag" from its attack. Next shoot the resonator, and if the machine is knocked down go for a critical attack, or just spam its components with the warrior bow to tear them off. if it is not knocked down, just repeat this cycle. This is pretty safe and easy, and deals much more damage than any of the melee combos, but it doesn't work on large machines that don't get knocked down. As to the fights I think melee is actually good for, I would say it is really useful for dealing with human "Conqueror" or "Leader" enemies who are built to be fought using melee combat. The block breaker combo is actually useful here, and once the enemy is stunned you can use any combo you'd like, but the power attack-> resonator-> critical hit tactic is really the best. The issue is again, you can only fight them one on one, meaning you first have to stealth kill all other enemies, and by that point you might as well stealth kill the last one too.
I'm currently in a play through on ultra hard. The melee pits are challenging , sometimes they're annoying and sometimes they're fun. I have found one problem though. I might literally not have dps enough to defeat the ring masters. I've tried the block breaker challenge in Chainscrape, but constantly hitting the enemy for a min (the time limit) I can't defeat them. I don't know if I have a dps problem with the mountain and lowland masters, since I've barely survived to the time limit, it might be possible to defeat them by playing more agressive, idk. My current solution is getting the damage weave from the legendary armor and put it on another armor with melee damage perks. Any tips?
you can get different outfit dyes at scalding spear, plainsong, thornmarsh… basically any of the larger settlements. just speak to a dye person they can be found on the map
Youve convinced me to buy the game. Im planning to get a ps5 with my first few paychecks so im gonna be buying the ps4 version of Forbidden West that gives a free ps5 upgrade
I found melee super frustrating due to the constant interrupts, lack of a block/parry, and lack of upgrade/scaling with the melee weapon. 1v1 it does ok... but 1v1 against a meleeable machine is pretty rare...
There's a reason, I don't use Melee with machines, other than for silent strikes. Because machines are prey to be hunted, so I will hunt them as they are. The many many humans on the other hand. I've gone through rebel outposts without even touching my bow. Each time so satisfying. I'm going through a challenge of taking on Regalla with only my spear.
The problem I have is that there is no dodge cancel. If you attack, dodging will not be possible unless Aloy stops the attack animation which prevents from being fluid and reactive.
I was disappointed when I killed every human enemy on the map, because it feels like Horizon’s combat was very designed with the idea of “Spear Melee = Humans” and “Every other weapon = Machines” The melee combat felt absolutely incredible but when you run out of targets that are the most fun to fight, there’s no reason to use melee ever again.
The short spear moveset is under-utilized in games. Guerilla really did an amazing job fleshing it out with all the handling swapping and the momentum of attacks.
How useful is this for ultra hard? I've noticed that enemies don't stagger as easily from melee attack on ultra hard. Even without melee, I've always thought the Horizon games had some of the best combat. That's why I really wish they would fix some of the more atrocious bugs. I can't count the number of times I've died due to terrain because I crouched instead of sliding.
Let me lock on, let me parry or block weak attacks with the glider (its basically a shield, missed opportunity to not use it at all). If they added that I think it'd be much better
I always found it odd that people want melee combat in a game that's all about using literally everything else besides melee combat. The only time I use the spear is for silent strikes and the melee pits. Other than that it seems completely useless when you can just shoot stuff from a distance
Only think I wished they added to Melee is a legit block/parry option And a SIDESTEP Dodge/Backflip Agile dodge!! Like EVERY other enemy in game has .. and ALOY is the best fighter in universe, but can't block/parry and looks like a child rolling and wailing around 🤦🏿♀️
After watching your video, I started playing around with the Melee Combat a bit.
While it can be frustrating at times with machines simply not allowing you to get great combos, it is incredibly satisfying when you manage to take down a group of machines with only your spear and warrior bow. Also, it is REALLY resource efficient. I surely improved my Combat with your tips!
All in all, your video definitely helped me to admire Guerilla's work with their Melee Combat System a lot more, thank you for that!
glad i could help out and give some tips :)
That is all great but the game does not allow Aloy to stab with spear when melee figthting and that is just nonsense and terrible. That is like having a dagger and not being able to stab, a knife and not being able to cut, a scimutar and not being able to slab... I could go on.
I like the combos, but Aloy needs a block/parry. Obviously, you shouldn't be able to parry/block mid/heavy machines, or certain attacks from light machines, but that is something that was missing against humans in particular. It would be cool to parry a lightweight machine's melee attacks, and maybe if you missed the timing, you get staggered, but if you hit it, you can do a critical strike.
Great video.
I think a parry could be cool if it's implemented well and like you said only useful against certain machine attacks and not all of them. It might get tricky with the existing controls but I'm sure guerrilla could implement it if they wanted to. I'd love to see something like that in the next game :)
My thoughts exactly, she even has a shield already! Which she used as a glider, when I saw her pick up that shield for the first time I was so sure we'd get a parry/ block but no. xOx also not being able to lock on is a bit annoying, especially when facing a tanky human boss
@@allandm When Aloy picks up the Shield Wing she mentions it's broken and can't be used for defense but will definitely work as a glider.
Overall I just dont see a block/party system working. These Machines are hefty, even the smaller ones are probably pretty heavy. All I see is Aloy getting a broken arm or something trying to block an coming tail swipe from a Clawstrider. Or Trying to parry a Tremortusk when they're trying to swipe you with their tusks would definitely not be realistic.
What I've liked about Horizon is it's pretty realistic when it comes to what Humans can physically handle against Machines.
Sure block and parry would work against humans, I just dont see it being viable or realistic against machines.
@@Soul-HunterVIII i forgor the shield was broken, and yes I agree with you. I don't think a parry/ shield should work against the machines, it would be mainly for human combat. I really enjoy the machine combat and wouldn't really change much if anything, it's when it comes to humans that i don't like it as much, a parry, block and lock on system could make it more fun i think.
I’m a few hours in so far and yeah, I feel naked without some kind of parry.
Personally, I think that melee still needs more work for the inevitable sequel.
I'd say that they should make melee at least an option for dealing with smaller machines.
Seriously, enemies like the Leaplasher seemed to have been made with melee in mind!
I'm sure it will be made EVEN better in the next game, but I love what we've been given in Forbidden West. I think if you understand the melee system/playstyle you can take on really any machine... it just may be more difficult for the large ones
@@ahtano I think that, for melee to truly work, Aloy will need to be given a shield to block and parry attacks.
Apparently, the developers considered giving her one but dropped it since they thought it would "overcomplicate controls".
To ensure melee does not overshadow ranged combat, have the shield consume weapon stamina and be ineffective against larger machines.
Also, to not interrupt combat, include a skill that lets Aloy get up quicker when knocked down by consuming stamina.
Finally, allow Aloy to zip up to larger machines with her new grappling hook to wail on them after having exposed their weak spot.
And I think that is the best part, there are so many ways test you know they are going to improve in the next game
@@daanduijkers4845 A Short Dodge (like last minute dodge in other games) would also help a lot, to get back at counter attacking. And yes Leaplashers are light machine (means every body part count) and very vulnarble to knockdown, their treshold is only 113
@@paristeta5483 yeah you’re on the right track. It’s all about a quick r2 charge to knock them down. Then you crit and their done. E Z. Im only on hard though so maybe it’s different on UH
I'm crazy for "The Destroyer" and try to incorporate it into my every battle regardless human or machine. It doesn't works as well for machines but I don't care LOL.. seeing Aloy go berserk and pummel on onto my enemies just feels awesome 😅
that combo is pretty satisfying and feels like overkill on human enemies LOL
I always forget all the different combos so I usually don’t go the melee route, but I absolutely love all the animations. Aloy subtly swapping her spear between hands is a neat detail, and she does it so often. My favorite is when you start walking after a melee attack, she sometimes tosses her spear behind her back to her other hand. Thank you for mentioning how awesome the fighting animations are!
I agree that’s a cool little animation!
Do the melee pits, if you're half as competitive as you gotta be to get through Ultra hard, you're not gonna be able to take the beating lying down
It is not just the battle. Aloy's animation is the best of any game I've played. I think it was Horizon Zero Dawn that made me stop playing 1st person perspective games.
her animations are very impressive in this game i agree
@@ahtano other animations look like you are dragging a rag doll by the neck. They also seem like I can count the number of moves on one hand.
Aloy made me stop playing World of Warcraft ( what i played like 10 Years before) and i never returned back 🥳I missed so much Great Single Player Games at my WoW Time.Aloy saved me from the Evil CashGrab Mechanics 😂
I had a really tough time with the advanced melee. I just wound up button smashing and using ranged weapons most of the time. Maybe I’ll go back and use this info to give it another try.
i had a tough time getting good at it but with practice i got better, i think I was too used to hack n slash melee games from back in the day haha
Try the bulwark melee pit challenges... Sustained Breaker
Practice in the melee rings
It's because it's trash
@Berry Mckockiner I'll admit it still could be improved..but did you actually practice with it? Or did you just think of it as a other hack n slash?
Good vid! Thanks for uploading!!
My one problem with melee combat in HFW is there are no defense options other than dodge roll, slide or run away. No block, no parry... Doesn't mean melee isn't fun - it is, but it will always be incomplete without these fundamental mechanics. 😞
i agree with you there, maybe that will be in the inevitable sequel :)
@@ahtano Maybe in Burning Shores...? 🙏
@@3mileisland516 we'll have to wait and see i guess :)
The only problem with mele is it has no tear damage to remove valuable component.
That is not true. The Listed book values should be in my melee sheet: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ZsxDK4R9YgWmD8NFf6zIalwoNfkZ_0rg/edit?usp=share_link&ouid=111918939703848430091&rtpof=true&sd=true And it seems to scale with Melee Damage, and higher then the raw damage would.
It def has a tear component to it
@@zsuira Easy loot doesn’t work on higher difficulties, I wanna say very hard or above but certainly not on ultra hard
@@j3en534 You could do custom difficulty and set everything to very hard and enable easy loot...but why would one do it.
@@paristeta5483 idk man I’ve been playing set ultra hard since I got the game, after awhile it’s fun
Great video. You're probably the first guy I've seen sharing about HFW's melee system. Most opinions I've read online either ignore the melee system or hate it because they didn't spend enough time learning the combos. The improvements from HZD are great but I still think they can be slightly more refined with animation cancels etc. I mainly use melee when dealing with rebels but have yet to try this playstyle on heavyweight machines. Might try it when Burning Shores gets released!
Totally agree with you, I love it and wish more people spent time with it!
Start with Shield Breaker (R1+R1+R2) Power Attack (R2Hold) and Half-Moon Slash. Low Health Defense and Low Health Regen Rank 4 help greatly with survival.
I'm about halfway thru the game and just discovered that resonator works on machines. I thought it was a melee pit human/human only thing.
Found that out getting ROFL stomped in the arena 😊
Finally someone who shows the meele playstyle some love! Great and detailed analysis :)
A fun tip about power attacks that the game doesn’t tell you about:
1 power attack is enough to knock down smaller machines while 2 knock down medium ones.
Shield Breaker and Nora Warrior Combo Ender (the R2 part) can knockdown medium machines as well, so does the application of resonator blast.
@@paristeta5483 that is true, but power attacks are a quicker and more manageable way of doing it in my opinion, especially since you can cancel out of a power attack during the charge animation.
@@aronm3771 Depends, i don´t want to miss either ;-)
Spinning Scythe can also reliably knock down small machines.
Combat does look and feel real good, I think if there was some type of parry/counter/block when fighting other humans or ligth attacks from machines would make it much more complete
yeah, a deflect even would be great
Wow I never realized just how awesome these animations are.
I know, they really are!
Detailed analysis and examples, well made video 🏹
Good luck with your channel 👍
Wow. Great video dude. I’ve never seen anyone compliment the melee in this game. It is certainly not my favorite aspect but I love that they improved it and made it a viable play style.
I definitely love the improvements that were made in melee, but I mainly use it for human targets. Maybe its just me and my combat style.
to be fair i think it's really meant for human enemies... i just wish we had more of them to fight in the post game after completing all the rebel camps
This is a very good analysis. Awesome stuff man really appreciate this 👏
thanks, glad you enjoyed it!
I hope the next game incorporates swords and war hammers, since they seem to be the most common weapons used by other tribes
That would be cool in a Horizon Zero Dawn RPG where you can chose other Tribes and Chars ..or a MMO Action Adventure with all these potential Chars.But Aloy with the Story of her hmm more Hunter Style Tribe would just destroy the feeling of her Person is Autentik in her Story.
Totally agree. I think this combat system has a great depths that is seldom recognized.
The melee feels satisfying when you're fighting anything but machines because Aloy's spear hits as hard as a pool noodle. The melee pits, namely Bulwark and Thornmarsh were aids because the melee system falls apart when you fight an enemy that's resistant to stun, namely heavies like champions with their instant tracking kick that has no warning and chunks HP on harder difficulties.
I definitely love the improvements, her attacks are so strong now. Don't even get me started with the valors. Also thanks for making a video around HFW melee attacks
The valors are super fun to use, thanks for watching the vid :)
I just started playing this game for the first time 2 days ago.
The Sharpshoot is my go to bow much of the time.
I love those bows too, especially good for using them in stealth if you have some increased stealth damage coils equipped!!
@@ahtano Yeah, those things are like a Mid-Level weapon between Light and Heavy. They are a regular bow with a much heavier ammo type.
Incredibly powerful, but easy to move around with, they do piss me off though with how slow they reload until you get Kuo's version.
@@savirianwinter1656 faster reload coil helps
Get the legendary weapons
I just found a Wizard of Oz reference and mission in Horizon apparently.
Pre-ordered the DLC and I'm hyped. Got all the trophies including the new game plus and ultra hard trophies. I love that the game gives you so many options on how to take down enemies
I've recently finished the game and never really paid much attention to the melee stuff. After watching your video I really wish I had!
As someone who prefers melee to ranged combat in games, I was disappoitned to find the melee combat in FW amost impossible to use on machines as they knock you down way too much and you get punished too much being close to them. It could be that I didn't completely nail the combat mechanics like getting off the ground, but Aloy would sometimes stay on the ground way too long no matter what I pressed and sometimes she would knock back on her feet instantly. Melee was great against human enemies though
Im 200+hrs in and i too cant stand the melee mechanics. I just use my bows to one shot them from range and try not to engage in close combat. Its too frustrating 😅
@@dantesos7564 I thought the mechanics were decent apart from the fact that machines can knock you down so much, Aloy spends too much time laying on the ground and so the melee combat doesn't feel smoth when you keep being interrupted so much. You can't swing the spear more than 2 times without being floored lol
If you learn how to cancel/chain combos, melee becomes drastically more effective against smaller machines. I mailed a melee build for awhile in Ultra Hard and it was really fun.
Frozen Wilds added a whole new skill tree to Zero Dawn. Here's hoping we get either a new skill tree or additional skills for each tree in Burning Shores.
totally agree with you that would be cool
Someone found a new Valor Surge in the newest Burning Shores trailer. When they show the weapon wheel, there’s one called Minefield. Pretty much a guarantee that we’re getting either additional skill trees or expansions to the current ones 😊
😁 The tutorial video Guerrilla should have made.
I have 800 hours in Horizon Forbidden West but still didn’t understand Warrior Bows. Until now.
Melee combat in HZD was pretty simple, dodge, light attack and heavy attack and you're done. HFW added a complexity that while at first it seems trivial and unnecessary, the more you do fight with it and the more you use the various combos you notice how satisfying combat actually is, and even though there's no way to parry an attack (would be amazing for a third installment) you can actually go toe to toe with pretty much every enemy.
😢 how bro
Keep up the great work! 1mil subs inc!
thanks much appreciated!! fingers crossed haha
@@ahtano pump out content once Burning Shores is out!:) will be interesting to follow up on all of it 🔥💃🔥
my favorite unofficial combo is light>heavy>light-heavy (the second two in quick succession in the air causes both attacks to happen on your way down.)
For me I was ok with the light attack and then having R2 as a heavy. I enjoyed melee how it was, but they surprised me in "Forbidden West. I really enjoyed the new attacks and combos. Great video man. I can't wait for "Burning Shores. 👍🏼
thanks :)
Melee can be difficult but when you pull it off it's great fun. I've always played from a distance but there are some beautiful moves and it's satisfying when you pull off a great finish. Another great video. Thanks.
I do combat at this level too. It can be fun. Just takes practice
agreed
Just waiting for this game to come to PC.
Horizon Zero Dawn is simply one of my favorite games of all time.
Thank you for this video, this game is amazing and it gets too much hate, seeing these types of videos is reasuring. I personally suck at melée in HFW but you made me wanna try it more!
you're welcome, glad you enjoyed the vid :)
Nice breakdown vid, keep up the work
hey thanks, much appreciated :)
Nice that you good at it. But it's buggy in general - long arcs, no clear direction when you attack (basically just swinging the spear), no block/parry, make it just unpalatable. Worst of all are the human opponents: lunges of several feet forward to attack you (that Alloy can't make) just kills the melee vibe.
I think in the 3rd installment they should utilize the shield wing like Hogwarts Protego in some way. Maybe add a long dash thrust that can build stagger or stun damage. Have counters like a spear bash or throw something to link combos together.
totally agree, I think the shield wing could have combat functions in the sequel and would work well
I only wished you could upgrade the spear or add coils to it. Maybe the next game could provide a system to make the spear deal elemental damage.
i agree that would have been a cool addition
Spoiler alert: new mechanics were added in the DLC to enhance spear attacks
@@RH-yz6ir Yeah, I was pleasantly surprised. Even though it relies on that god awful item wheel
Not the pinnacle of game combat, but it's amazing how Guerrilla expanded since the first game. I can see Aloy wielding more wapons in the third game or even on the DLC this month.
quick tip mele detonator stacks up to 4 times, after that the 1rst arrow refreshes
nice tip i didn't know this
@@ahtano yeah, people think is un limited or at least way more arrows but its not, thats why is not that good vs machines, on humans on the other hand its way better
alright man. youve convinced me to try more melee. lovely presentation.
Dang this looks really cool and fun. Gonna try this playstyle out.
It’s nice glad you’re gonna try it out :)
You put in so much work on your play style. Thanks for sharing.
Interesting. I didn't use melee at all during my playthrough. Just a hit her and a hit there, mostly on smaller enemies. It felt underpowered. But after watching your video I might do another playthrough and try it out.
Your masterful use of the melee combat inspires me to try to make use of it ingame.
I want to see a full spear playthrough using these techniques
hmm may not be possible to use only melee, but a melee focused play through (like 85% melee, 15% ranged) could be fun actually
I really enjoyed melee for the first 40 hrs of my playtime. The problems with melee are a) not enough damage
b) no weapon variety
Imagine more melee weapons like heavier ones or faster two handed melee weapons. I've always said that the horizon franchise at its core is a polished monster hunter game. What it lacks are weapons and build variety. Ranged weapons are varied enough but melee weapons aren't.
And armours don't make meaningful differences like those in monster hunter games. Forbidden west is a huge step above zero dawn especially in enemy variety and enemy design, side activities and puzzles. I really hope for more Action-RPG elements and monster hunter-ish gameplay systems in the next game
Thanks for the explanation! Just started to play Horizon Forbidden West. The melee system looks pretty much upgraded since Zero Dawn.
Havnt realized how detailed the melee animations are
Hey I just found your channel and I'm geeking out with your encyclopedic knowledge of and attention to the details of Horizon melee combat and machines. It reminds me of the yellow shirt discombobulated kid video. I have an observation. Consider creating 30 to 120 second "discombonulate" style shorts with Aloy? Ending with an Aloy saying.
The 3D Ken Burns pauses. The transitions. The attack combo breakdown. All compressed into a short, move by move breakdown of a single kill sequence. That would make for great replay value.
i love this idea… will definitely consider it🤔 thank you!
I really hope the rumoured PS5 version of Zero Dawn will utilise this new melee combat system.
That would be pretty nice, I’d definitely enjoy replaying it with the new melee
Great vid man, very helpfull info and tips.
thanks :)
this might've been my first melee combat system that is actually harder to make full use of if you are bad at twitch aiming (like me) relative to actually staying at range...
I know you put a lot of effort into this Video, great work. I'm looking forward to getting this game.
Never saw on in like that. Good to see that there are some people out there, which actually appreciate the work and love that the developers have put inside the game. Should have been game of the year, but unfortunately the reviewers to blind to recognise a masterpiece. I hope the DLC will provide the comeback for the game, that it diserved
Yeah, horizon fans time is coming
I do really like the animations of melee like the way she spins her spear in her hand after a standard heavy attack. All of the stealth strike animations on human enemies are great too! 👌
As a lover of warrior bows I don't know why I've never bothered much with melee (probably to used to the hunter playstyle) but your video has definitely persuaded me to give it a proper go.
I liked how you took the time at the start to appreciate the work GG put in to all the animations and stuff too. Great vid anyway dude! I look forward to more ✌️
thank you glad you liked the vid!
I liked how much they worked on Melee combat but i never got around to use it that much so i quickly forgot the combos and such . But when i get the dlc and play the new game plus save , I'm gonna pay more attention to it
Well done video that is also exceptionally helpful. Thanks for the time and effort that went intot his.
Nah take a slaughterspine with melee only on UH. Would like to see that.
will do
Very cool. Can't wait for this game to come to PC. The first game is one of the best games I have ever played.
Great video! I really struggle in combat and was needing exactly this advice. Thank you.
I wish there was an option to slow the game down. I end up panicking when things turn sour and I learn nothing from that.
Thanks, I'm glad the video was helpful for you!
The melee combat in HFW evolved exponentially compared to HZD gameplay. The melee approach doesn’t work all that well on Ultra Hard - the enemies have too much HP and too much one-shot potential to kill Aloy. However, on any of the other difficulty settings, the melee approach is definitely viable and very rewarding for those who plan out attacks well. One really cannot use Aloy as a “hack and slash” melee hero - if you try that above the “easy” difficulty setting, the enemies will punish your recklessness. But if you thoughtfully apply melee combos with intermixed slides, Warrior Bow attacks, dodges, vaults, Resonators, and (surprised this wasn’t mentioned in this video) the Blastsling technique that bombs opponents while Aloy simultaneously evades and creates space… and yeah, one *can* play HFW with primarily melee offense.
Can I ask, do you play on Resolution, Balanced or Performance mode? P.s. just got the game and I'm loving melee combat, even though it's risky Vs machines it just feels and looks so good
i always play on performance with vrr and 120hz mode on my tv enabled!
@@ahtano cheers :) after switching settings an unhealthy amount I think I've settled on Balanced
Wow didn’t know there was so much depth to the animations 😮
Fantastic video. I really appreciate the effort and knowledge
thanks, glad you enjoyed it!
Given how much they improved melee combat in this game makes me wonder what they’ll do for a third game personally I’d like them to improve what you can do with overridden machines like giving orders and directing them and maybe riding some of the larger combat units and use their weapons and abilities.
Broooooooooooo I had no idea about how wrong I was using that play style so fat until this video. You totally renewed my interest in the melee in this game by making me want to try all that stuff. But I can't deny that I still miss a parry option tho.
lol glad the video helped, def wish there was a parry too
The DLC adds elemental damage to your spear but yea i think there should be variety of spears you could switch between and it would make melee as good as range
Rare game can fight machine with melee combat, I don’t know any one except this one. I like Elden Ring or God of War type of game, which can fight with large size boss. Melee in HFW is definitely unique.
I think the melee skill floor is too high to bother with both in terms of inputs and knowledge on when to use it. On top of that, the other playstyles are faster and safer. I had a much easier time learning Sekiro's gameplay loop than HFW's melee system.
Melee in ZD was just sometimes free damage in the form of silent or critical strike... in forbidden west it's the same, plus resonator blasts and a few extra moves. Melee doesn't still do a whole lot of damage and pulling off long combos usually costs you more life than the damage you do, at least on ultra hard. My most used real melee combo is jump off, cos it's the only one that's fast enough to pull off before another machine comes to body slam me.
That said, once a player can get skilled enough at the game it starts to look like machines are dodging Aloy, and that player can start applying resonator blasts left right and center, it's a whole another ballgame. Not there yet myself, I'm only trying to unlearn how to dodge like in ZD, cos apparently it doesn't work like that in FW. I always tried to dodge so the enemy doesn't hit me, but it's borderline impossible. Now dodging is all about abusing i-frames, let the enemy hit you but time dodge so well it just nullifies the attack.
i really started appreciating the melee in this game when i realized it's the only practical way to manage those goddamn kangaroo jacks. i hate leapslashers 😭
Melee in this game is divisive for me, on the one hand, I think the expanded set of moves and Aloy's animations are excellent, but the impact they have on enemies and their reactions can be very underwhelming.. whereas with the ranged weapons, explosives and traps, the damage you do feels more tangible, so I tend to stick to a mainly ranged build, only throwing in charged melee attacks for finishers or stuns. Overall though I still greatly appreciate the improvements they made from the first game, but there's still a lot of room before it becomes a great melee system
I did a run on UH speccing into the melee tree, and I'd say it is absolutely not a viable playstyle in 70% of battles in UH.
The issue is groups of enemies will attack all at once, not one by one. So any time you face a group of machines or humans, if you try do deal any ammount of damage to one, the rest will just snipe you with ranged or dash attacks. The melee combos are also all completely useless, since they take so long to perform that you are virtually guaranteed to be interrupted by an attacking machine before you finish your combo. The Nora Warrior combo also literally never knocks down enemies like it is supposed to. The only useful moves are short combos like aerial slash or halfmoon slash, which are purposely built to be more movement- focused. In general, melee is only useful for one on one battles with medium or small machines.
I find 99% of the time, it is faster to just spam the warrior bow, spike throwers or shredder gauntlets, than to kill a machine with melee attacks.
If I am actually going for melee in a fight, the most effective strategy is really just to unlock the skill that increases your knockdown power, charge up the resonator,
then I wait for the enemy to attack, dodge it, and follow up with a power attack while the enemy is in "endlag" from its attack. Next shoot the resonator, and if the machine is knocked down go for a critical attack, or just spam its components with the warrior bow to tear them off.
if it is not knocked down, just repeat this cycle. This is pretty safe and easy, and deals much more damage than any of the melee combos, but it doesn't work on large machines that don't get knocked down.
As to the fights I think melee is actually good for, I would say it is really useful for dealing with human "Conqueror" or "Leader" enemies who are built to be fought using melee combat. The block breaker combo is actually useful here, and once the enemy is stunned you can use any combo you'd like, but the power attack-> resonator-> critical hit tactic is really the best. The issue is again, you can only fight them one on one, meaning you first have to stealth kill all other enemies, and by that point you might as well stealth kill the last one too.
The first time playing HFW melee my fingers intuitively pressed Monster Hunter World long sword combos 🤣
I'm currently in a play through on ultra hard. The melee pits are challenging , sometimes they're annoying and sometimes they're fun. I have found one problem though. I might literally not have dps enough to defeat the ring masters. I've tried the block breaker challenge in Chainscrape, but constantly hitting the enemy for a min (the time limit) I can't defeat them. I don't know if I have a dps problem with the mountain and lowland masters, since I've barely survived to the time limit, it might be possible to defeat them by playing more agressive, idk. My current solution is getting the damage weave from the legendary armor and put it on another armor with melee damage perks. Any tips?
Hey! I love your armor. Got it in another color but I would love to have yours. Where can I get it?
you can get different outfit dyes at scalding spear, plainsong, thornmarsh… basically any of the larger settlements. just speak to a dye person they can be found on the map
@@ahtano thanks! I don't think this specific dye is available in plainsong but I'll look for it in other settlements. Have a great day!
Youve convinced me to buy the game. Im planning to get a ps5 with my first few paychecks so im gonna be buying the ps4 version of Forbidden West that gives a free ps5 upgrade
Everything about this game is perfection. Most people sleep on it though.
very true
how do you handle auto-targeting? I play on PC and I charge forward, Aloy turn 360 and hit the machine behind her
wished i can play melee with heavyweight machine. but it stops for me at midweight cause i cant knockthem anymore :(
Even though i hate this game its nice to see people pointing out its cool features
to me it felt worse than it did in the first game, but I'm happy you liked it
Most of the times i get the timing for the half moon slash wrong though 😅
Haven't played HFW yet, but you can remap the controls right? Like replace R1 melee button with square or something right? And R2 with triangle
yes you can re map the controls if you'd like to
@@ahtano nice, thanks blud
I found melee super frustrating due to the constant interrupts, lack of a block/parry, and lack of upgrade/scaling with the melee weapon. 1v1 it does ok... but 1v1 against a meleeable machine is pretty rare...
There's a reason, I don't use Melee with machines, other than for silent strikes. Because machines are prey to be hunted, so I will hunt them as they are. The many many humans on the other hand. I've gone through rebel outposts without even touching my bow. Each time so satisfying. I'm going through a challenge of taking on Regalla with only my spear.
Did they change how much energy you get from power attack? In this video you get two per charge, I'm only getting one.
you get two per charge when resonator buildup skill is at the max of lvl 4. i believe you only get one charge otherwise.
The problem I have is that there is no dodge cancel. If you attack, dodging will not be possible unless Aloy stops the attack animation which prevents from being fluid and reactive.
I like melee combos design,but I hate machines are easily interrupt your combos
I was disappointed when I killed every human enemy on the map, because it feels like Horizon’s combat was very designed with the idea of “Spear Melee = Humans” and “Every other weapon = Machines”
The melee combat felt absolutely incredible but when you run out of targets that are the most fun to fight, there’s no reason to use melee ever again.
yeah i do wish we could have more human enemies to fight in the post game for sure
There are clumps of Rebels that will occasionally respawn in certain areas of the map (like outside of the High Turning).
The short spear moveset is under-utilized in games. Guerilla really did an amazing job fleshing it out with all the handling swapping and the momentum of attacks.
That's because making spears short takes out most of the benefits of using a spear
How useful is this for ultra hard? I've noticed that enemies don't stagger as easily from melee attack on ultra hard.
Even without melee, I've always thought the Horizon games had some of the best combat. That's why I really wish they would fix some of the more atrocious bugs. I can't count the number of times I've died due to terrain because I crouched instead of sliding.
melee is far less of a viable option in ultra hard yes, but you can still get away with some attacks if you time correctly and be more cautious
Let me lock on, let me parry or block weak attacks with the glider (its basically a shield, missed opportunity to not use it at all). If they added that I think it'd be much better
I always found it odd that people want melee combat in a game that's all about using literally everything else besides melee combat. The only time I use the spear is for silent strikes and the melee pits. Other than that it seems completely useless when you can just shoot stuff from a distance
Awesome
Only think I wished they added to Melee is a legit block/parry option
And a SIDESTEP Dodge/Backflip Agile dodge!! Like EVERY other enemy in game has .. and ALOY is the best fighter in universe, but can't block/parry and looks like a child rolling and wailing around 🤦🏿♀️
So how do you jump over enemies using aerial slash set up?
when you're holding R2 to perform an aerial slash just push forward on the left stick instead of pulling back then Aloy will jump over the enemy
@@ahtano do you still have to hold R2 while doing that? Cause I find it ain’t working for me unless it only works on some machines
@@citizenchris2455 it works best on smaller machines not really useable for larger ones, but yeah hold R2 while pushing the left sick forward