Necrotic Nick- Honestly, there's some truth to that. Generally it seems like it's done mostly for the optics or to avert a larger PR disaster but most of the time it just ends up making things worse.
I disagree with your assessment of cancel culture. Sure some people have said dumb shit and deserve consequences for it, but at the same time plenty of political factions (on both sides) have also tried to cancel people who 100% don't deserve it. It's a very sharp, very dangerous double edged sword. Politics is beyond divisive at this point and I am absolutely disheartened it has leeched this far into music which used to be my escape from all that.
Necrotic Nick- Unfortunately in a "culture war", much like any kind of war, there's going to be bystanders that get hit too. Often in cases like this where people say off-color remarks or stuff that could be considered hate speech people do forget to consider the context of what they said. In this case there's definitely context and CJ definitely fucked up. Could it have been handled differently? Maybe, but honestly I think he was on his way out anyway. Politics have always been a part of metal though. People are just more aware of it.
Thats the thing, Nick. Sure politics have always been there under the surface. But this current white hot culture war is getting very old and tiresome especially in the realms of entertainment and art.
This is gonna be a very spicy meatball for you to talk about. I’ve commented on The Metal Meltdown’s review of this album that as far as the situation goes, they really shouldn’t of let CJ go in the way that they did it. As a band, telling your fan base that you rerecorded vocals on the day of a new album with a different singer behind the other singer’s back is just despicable, no matter how much of a contentious person the now ex-singer was. It just makes everybody in this whole situation look like the biggest assholes imaginable and I can only feel sorry for the division in the fanbase that this has already created.
@@SolarAdriftI never said that I supported CJ, dude. I actually don’t even like the band all that much anyways. I’ll give you a one-up to what you said: Screw CJ and the whole rest of the band; both parties are huge scumbags in this situation.
Necrotic Nick- Oh, it was spicey but I wasn't going to just not talk about it. I think stuff like this needs to be talked about more so we understand it more. Personally, I don't like the way the band handled CJ's dismissal but we don't know all the details. This might have been a long time coming, there might have been pressure from distributers. Who knows? I'm sure more will come out as this continues to unravel. It's a shit sandwich and everyone involved is taking a bite.
Shout out to you for having the balls to flatly address the controversy and take a solid, thoughtful stance. No pussyfooting around the issue. There will definitely be some dipshit metalheads whining at you "Thralls gone woke!" somewhere along the line. But fuck em. You're absolutely right about this.
I find it fucked up! The fact that a band whose entire career of music has been about killing women and hating them are all of a sudden upset about a comment about saying a woman should be burned alive!! Whatvhappened to a band that doesnt guve a fuck. If they kicked out CJ cause of that post. Then they shouldnt keep playing " whore to a chainsaw" and purest strain of hate then. I thought CJ post was hilarious, I think it was just a post to stir shit up while keeling tja dark " toungue in cheek" humor
Necrotic Nick- Dude, do you think just maybe context plays a part in this? There's a suspension of disbelief with extreme metal wherein as fans we know they're not serious. It's just the tropes of extreme metal. His comment wasn't a song so it didn't have that context and if he was joking he certainly didn't let anyone know he was. Your missing a lot of key variables here, bro.
@@thrallsofmetal I took his comment as the disbelief. From the few times I met and hung out with CJ he had that dark twisted sense of humor. What sucks about text, is that you can show sarcasm or the tone of voice used when messing around. If that makes any sense
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, with text it's a lot harder to tell when someone is joking. I love dark, twisted humor as well but even when I type it out I make sure people know I'm joking just in case someone takes it the wrong way. You've gotta be clear these days.
Whole thing would’ve gone over better with fans if they would have just released the album with CJs vocals and then parted ways. Feel like we’ll never have the OG album digitally unfortunately.
Necrotic Nick- Maybe? I don't know if there was a way to avoid the fan ridicule here. This whole thing really hasn't been handled the best but I will say we still don't know everything that went on behind the scenes. Judging by the band's post I'd say this was coming to a boil for awhile.
@@thrallsofmetal I know, I’m just fooling around. It’s just wild that nowadays a band born from arguably the most purposefully offensive genre of music, born in the spirit of shock, aggression and pushing limits of “good taste”, feels the need to fire someone for posting something stupid.
Necrotic Nick- I can see that. For me, the thing that maybe CJ forgot here is that with being in the limelight you become a role model and people will hang on your every word so you've gotta be careful sometimes. That and while his comments were his own they also reflect on the band too. It's such a difficult tightrope to walk these days.
Necrotic Nick- Yeah this whole thing could have been handled so much better. It’s a PR nightmare right now and both sides are going to feel the brunt of it.
I didn't even notice the vocal difference and just found out about the drama. They handled it like jerks honestly, and seems like they put no effort into finding a new guy? Like why not change up the style at this point, seeing as this band has evolved a lot since their inception. I mean we'll have to see when it comes to the next one I guess. I can kinda get down with Godlike, but it is more of the same generic deathcore sound they've had post-Hate in 2013. I'm not even mad about the vocalist change. But it's a good opportunity to mix it up. Tracks from The Adversary and Hate just seemed a lot more intricate yaknow? And their best songs since then also have this quality. They have some bangers here and there over the years but seems like most of their songs land right in the middle of the safe zone on the deathcore bell curve.
I seen them back in 2016 when cj quit the band and the molotov solution vocalist filled in. He did pretty good. I do hate what happened to cj but the music is good
Necrotic Nick- The only times I saw them was with CJ and they were decent. I am curious to see who the new official singer for the band after all the heat dies down.
@@thrallsofmetal I am willing to bet it's the guy I saw which is good because I actually thought he sounded better up against the live videos I've seen of cj. He loses all enunciation like he's not even trying to be somewhat legible lol
As a 100% anti-political I couldn’t care less who others like or agree with. That’s to me childish, I’m in my 30s with enough to think of myself outside of others opinions, but myself have friends from any walk of life be it family man, military vets or religious of any type, not just Christian (right leaning) & friends who are gay, feminist, athiest, or generally say nerdy outsiders (overall left) are all good in my book. I’m an anti-establishment of any variety classic anarchist myself, if I’m allowed to be me, so is the other person. As a parent, I don’t find it responsible to allow non-adults to decide lifelong reckless decisions they’ll regret & in turn hate me for. When they’re an adult & pay bills, as I do, they can do whatever they like, as lifelong changes come but I won’t be a part of hurting my own child or anyone else’s, as a responsible accountable adult.
Necrotic Nick- I agree with kids needing to fully understand the concepts of gender, sex and human sexuality when they're old enough to process the information. Kids are smart and intuitive as hell but there's a limit to their understanding even if you explained it all to a kid.
I do understand that some of these kids might have issues and questions concerning gender and sexuality. But i've seen first hand how some of these parents kind of force feed a choice onto a kid that shouldn't be thinking about that stuff at that age. I'm not saying that goes for all parents and kids. But kids that age don't think about these things unless it's stimulated by their surroundings. So i'm sorry Nick but i don't agree that educating young children about these things is the way to go if we're talking free will and self evolvement. Rather have a place these kids can go to be informed and educated, if and when they want, instead of trying to stimulate a choices. Here in the Netherlands children now get sexual education concerning these topics in pre school(around the age of 4). To me that's just absurd.
Necrotic Nick- I'm not saying young children here. I'm saying kids learn about this around the age most of us in the US had to take sex ed in school which is around 12. At that point their brains are more developed and they can process the information better.
It was a lot easier (seemingly) when we were lads & I send positivity to the generations & hope for a mature generation of understanding non-judgemental folks.
I don’t know the details about the controversy, but they seem to have fired CJ for saying something other people might not like. What?!!! I don’t even care what the subject matter was. Their name is f’n thy art is murder. They bowed down to bullshit. Get the F outta here with that.
Necrotic Nick- I think context is very important here. Yeah, you can say whatever you want but that doesn't make you immune to people calling you out on it. He rolled the dice on that comment and came up craps.
@@thrallsofmetal Yes, actions have consequences… and he should’ve known his band mates would sell him out so they weren’t cancelled by the internet mob right before a big tour. But there’s also a good chance he was grating on them from other differences, maybe axel rose style.
Necrotic Nick- Oh, there's definitely more that went on before CJ's dismissal and I'm sure we'll hear more from both camps as this continues to unfurl.
Interesting video Nick. I have no interest at all in this band, but good to get a breakdown of the forces at play. Cheers for treating all this stuff with some common sense
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! While I haven't been the biggest fan of the band I wanted to go over this one even before the controversy. Honestly, the controversy with it made it more appealing since I got a chance to discuss some larger issues outside of the music. I definitely seem to have triggered a few here.
@@spencergrady5501 nah man people dont like to be triggered. at least not us non-americans that are not part of this butthurt sensitive culture you seem to have there. I have an outsider's perspective and I enjoy common sense in general.
Really enjoyed the album, haven't listened to much TAIM because they're not that much of my cup of tea, I'm a big Whitechapel fan though, but this one is quite cool
Big fan of this channel. Love all the underground metal reviews. Discovered a lot of good stuff here. Anyways I'm right wing leaning in my political views. Well done Nick for being diplomatic in your takes on this CJ Mcmahon / LGBTQ issues even though your views maybe different from mine. Respect brother 🤘🏾 Very hard topic to discuss because it can be quite devisive and divide people
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! I really appreciate that. I knew I'd catch some flack on this one but I think it's something worth discussing. We don't all have to agree but I think achieving some level of understanding is still important. Thanks again, man.
@Samoan_Metalhead, On the contrary, I’m left wing leaning in my political views. Therefore, we almost certainly have different opinions. However, this is a brilliant comment!! It’s a pity that there aren’t more people with your views (I’m sure you’ve seen some of the other comments on this video) who can articulate a response in such a respectful manner. Big respect 🤘🏻🤘🏻
I don't comment often, but I wanted to jump in, this time, to thank you for openly sharing your views on this matter. I appreciate your content, and I now further appreciate you as a person.
Necrotic Nick- I mean, people can change. We grow out of things and get into new stuff all the time. Yeah, I do think the band could have handled this more gracefully but again, we don't fully know all the factors in the equation at this point. We just know the optics look bad all around here.
Solid review. But, not why I listened. I came for your thoughts on Matt Walsh, who I absolutely despise down to the fluid in my spinal column and out through every pore. You made me smile, BIG. Thank you Nick. \m/
Thanks for being an awesome reviewer and channel and taking the drama on in a very good way. Don’t give credence to the people giving you shit in the comments cuz what the fuck ever. Hopefully you’re doing quite well
I love the album it's a great successor to Human Target, great riffs and melodies and breakdowns indeed. I saw them live with Spite, whitechapel and Fit For an Autopsy and I don't know if the new singer is a temporary singer for the tour or a definitive one, anyway he nailed it. Some idiots were screaming " CJ, CJ" between some songs but yeah... Drama apart they definitely shoot a bullet in their foot three days before the released if it would have been 3 months before I'm sure it wouldn't have had the same impact. Dave Mustaine, re-record all bass part from the sick the dying and the dead but it was weeks before the release. But bad or good "commercials " talking about your band is always good in the end I guess. I'm gonna continue to follow this guys, and if CJ make a new band I'm sure it's Gonna be also a killer one. Peace music first 🤘🔥
@16:00 Also, people who are online, especially terminally online, really need to develop some freaking critical media literacy. You wouldn't do something dangerous without protection or even training. So don't go on to social media to take everything that makes you feel good (or mad) at total face-value and then share it to everyone you know (and a fk tonne of people you don't know). Media literacy man. Why is it so freaking lacking in an age of ubiquitous and pervasive media? Who knows where that clip came from besides the fact that it's been obviously weaponised by an infamously dishonest actor? And even if it wasn't, you can't watch 20 seconds of someone's life and make absolute judgements about their character, values and behaviour. Critical media literacy is probably the most important survival and life skill you can have. And I don't mean some bogus "free thinker", "intellectual sceptic" rubbish, either. That's typically just the same ignorance under a contradictory label.
Necrotic Nick- I totally agree with that. I think people lose the filter or tact they have in maybe a face to face conversation when they're commenting online. People are prone to emotionally driven responses before they consider all the variables and there are definitely people that prey on that sort of behavior to stir up people.
Band is bland as fuck. But I applaud how they handled this honestly. I thought it was refreshing. And Nick's "The Clitoris is a liberal conspiracy." jab almost had me spitting my Count Chocula out.
Necrotic Nick- I don't mind them overall and I do think this one is pretty decent. I still don't know all the extenuating circumstances around CJ's abrupt dismissal but it might have been the only choice they had to make there. I'm sure this isn't the end of it. Glad you dug the Walsh barb lol
Oooooh the controversy Yeahhh The album was just…. Fine, never been huge on these guys. To me, I think yeah for me honestly you definitely shouldn’t force a child to be a certain gender/sexuality at all. More so because a Kid sometimes says something just to say it or doesn’t really understand. To me most kids don’t give a fuck about Gender (I for sure didn’t) and just cared about being a kid and doing kid things. So I can see where CJ’s opinion comes from. But you know sending Death threats like that is very Scummy and flat out Wrong. And yeah the apologies and the statements CJ said after really didn’t add up and almost made things even worse. Do I think that TAIM should have let CJ know he was kicked out of the band instead of doing it online? Yes. Do I think that CJ should be held responsible? Yes. Do I hope that CJ can grow and learn from this? Yes Anyways this is just the way I view this whole entire Shitshow. I want to know the other details on what led to this.
Necrotic Nick- I thought the album was pretty good overall. Yeah, kids don't have the full understanding all that shit. Let them be a kid and when they're old enough then cross that bridge. CJ's heart might have been in the right place (maybe, I'm not sure but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt for now) but posting that comment was incredibly stupid and definitely scummy. I do think the dismissal was handled pretty poorly overall but there may have been some extenuating circumstances that we don't know about that forced there hand. They definitely alluded to there being more going on so I guess we'll see when more comes out about this whole thing.
Sure, CJ made his point clumsily. And gender warriors / identity politics zealots can shoot the messenger all they want. But the message itself is one of concern about a cult-like ideology and the damage it does to kids and youth.
Necrotic Nick- With his comment he didn't make a point. He just posted something stupid and got called on it. You don't make a point by simply saying someone should be burned to death. As for his stance, I do agree with the age thing about talking about this sort of thing with kids but it's a gross mischaracterization of the scenario as a whole. Walsh took the most extreme example he could find and used it to say "this is how they all are" which is hardly fair. That's like me saying all Christians are pedos simply because there's been a lot of them in past. I don't think that would be fair either though I do find it odd that when it comes down protecting the youth from gun violence like school shootings those same people of "moral fiber" seems oddly quiet. Seems to me there's a lack of consistency here.
@@thrallsofmetal If CJ had said something along the lines of "anyone who abuses kids deserves to burn in hell", then perhaps the public's reaction would have been different. Mind you, metal lyrics are full of this kind of language anyway (references to death, burning, gore, destruction, hate, etc.; often for hyperbolic effect) - but surely nobody in their right mind would think that the vocalist singing/screaming these lyrics actually wishes to carry out acts of violence. CJ had an outburst, it was unfiltered, and that's poor form - fine. However, there is still a point underlying this - which he elaborated on in his second apology video (the one he intended to be aired, but the band never did). He should have done this in his original post, to save himself all the hassle (and the consequences). Oh well - live and learn I guess. Gun control is an issue quite specific to America. As a Kiwi now residing in the UK, it's not an issue for us, and neither is it for CJ (he's Australian) - but on the trans debate he speaks for many concerned individuals around the world. Also, I sense a bit of "whataboutism" there (as in, if people care so much about kids, what about all the gun violence). The matter of gun control - important as it is (certainly for Americans) - is a separate one. Let's give CJ the benefit of the doubt that he genuinely cares about what kids are exposed to in schools - he is a father himself after all (and he does speak to this in his second apology video). You can mount an argument that kids being exposed to trans ideology is happening on a small scale, and isn't representative of the entire community. But how do you account for the tail wagging the dog? For a tiny fraction of the population, trans ideologues impose themselves on half the population (women), demanding they be allowed into their spaces and sports. They insist that everyone adopts pronouns as a show of solidarity. And they expect everyone to acquiesce to their new terminology (e.g., "front hole" instead of vagina, "birthing person" instead of mother, "non-man" instead of woman, etc.). As an academic, I see trans ideology seeping into all aspects of our professional lives. We are encouraged (nay, expected) to use pronouns in our email signatures and in the way we introduce ourselves. This goes beyond the indoctrination of kids. It's also about protecting other vulnerable individuals (like impressionable youth suffering mental illnesses). And it's ultimately about free speech versus compelled speech. This is textbook authoritarianism. As members of the metal community, we ought to be pushing back against this sort of thing. CJ touched a nerve, and he tapped into something that resonates far and wide.
Necrotic Nick- If he had said that it would have been more vague and he wanted to make his stance clear that it was specifically about the video in question. As for metal lyrics, yeah we know they're not serious and it's a trope of extreme metal in general to talk about extreme subject matter but with a twitter comment you remove the context of a song. It just becomes a statement and with that can be subject to a different kind of scrutiny. The point of me bringing up gun control is more about this "moral high ground" that people like Walsh think they have championing their "we're saving the children" rhetoric. It's never been consistent and makes me think it's less about the children and more about going after a group of people he doesn't like. Trust me, if kids were getting killed all the time in school shootings in the UK he wouldn't speak out against it either. I don't think CJ is necessarily a bad person here. I just think he's misguided in the want to protect and provide for his children. As for "trans ideology" I really don't see how this is a detriment to society. What's wrong with giving them their spaces or sports? We have ours after all. I don't care about pronouns because I generally call people by their name and generally if you're respectful to people when you talk them that will rarely come up. I honestly can't even think of a time where a trans person demanded I call them by there pronouns. I'd even say that it's never happened to me. I've never heard someone say "front hole" (maybe as a joke) or "birthing person". A vagina is a vagina and a penis is a penis. Those are the textbook names of the organs so that's what I call them (among other fun names because I still love crude humor) but if they want to call it something else I don't care. I say all this and I know trans people and they're generally nice people that just want to feel accepted which is kinda the same thing we all want. I think you're pressing the panic button on this and (just a hunch) it seems it goes deeper than your comment here.
@@thrallsofmetal: Misguided, sure. Is that a cancellable/dismissable offence though? Is it really in the realm of serious misconduct to misspeak despite having good intentions? And what's with announcing CJ's firing via social media, and removing his vocal tracks without telling him? That's a real cunty thing to do. Does the punishment fit the (perceived) crime? It is certainly possible for both things to be true: that gun violence is a problem to be addressed, AND the behaviors of the most vocal, virulent, vehement, and vitriolic elements of the trans community are overbearing, authoritarian, and ultimately counter-productive (e.g., feeding the narratives of the likes of Matt Walsh whom you rally against). Of course the trans community can have their own spaces and sports. That is the whole point. They can have their own thing. The dilemma is that, (some) trans women insist on entering women's-only spaces and sports, despite the obvious concerns women may have of personal safety and physical disadvantage respectively. Women have a right to feel safe, and to compete fairly; and in the case of those living with rape trauma, this is a matter of utmost importance - even if it means the feelings of some trans women are hurt in the process. Remember, trans women can have their own spaces (i.e., trans-women-only spaces as well), but for women all they have is women's-only spaces.
Necrotic Nick- Again, the band's statement alluded to there being more going on behind the scenes and the comment was "the straw that broke the camel's back" so all we can do is speculate at this point. They may have been left with no other choice to what they did. Again, we don't know the full story there. Sorry if I don't think that the trans community represents a larger threat than something that's actually killing kids, man. I don't think they're remotely on the same level as a threat to people. As for sports, I don't know the fix there but fielding team sports with all trans athletes seems pretty needless if there isn't a real demand for it so we're left with what we got. In terms of restrooms and dressing rooms etc. well, what do you think trans woman are there to do outside of use the restroom or change clothes? Do we just assume they're all potential rapists or something? That seems far-fetched and again, based on a lot of paranoia. Are there a lot of instances of trans women raping women were you're from? Seriously, this has to be based on something other than a "what if" here. As I said, I think there's something underlying to your fears here.
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, vocally I really didn't think he brought something that made him stand out. Not saying he's bad but he's a bit generic in terms of deathcore vocalists.
Despite all the drama poisoning young minds with all the worldviews/propaganda forced through parents is so fucking malicious coz most children will just please their parents so using them as tools is so wrong and harmful, does he overreact yes. And he was guilty of it I'm not denying it. Does it sounded transphobic to some degree yes? To me more strange was how quickly they replaced him as they were looking for circumstances to occur. Regardless this was a better album than the previous one
Necrotic Nick- Sadly it's the world we live in right now. Hopefully it changes for the better but that'll take time. Yeah, talking to kids about this kinda stuff is best left for when they're old enough to have some grasp on it. CJ definitely fucked up with the comment but, as you noted, with as quickly as they replaced him, I think this was a pot that was boiling over. They did say this was the straw that broke the camel's back so there's definitely more about this that'll come out in the future. I didn't listen to much of the last album but I do think this one was pretty solid. Still iffy on the production though.
Excellent navigation of the controversy. Thank you for not dancing around stuff like this. I've tried to get into a little more deathcore, but I have so many experiences where I hear the worst shit come out of the mouths of deathcore musicians. I hope my experiences have been just super unlucky and not indicative of a larger problem with that element of the subculture. I'm more of a death thrash and trad - centric metalhead. For me, metal music is community and when people say hateful shit, they deserve to face the consaquences. When they don't like the blowback and act like the victim, its like...hey man don't start none, won't get none...
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! This was one I was going to do anyway before everything went down so when it did I was even more intrigued because I got to talk on even more points than just the music. I used to be a bigger deathcore fan but outside of a handful of bands I've kinda outgrown the style. I've heard more questionable stuff from the fans but I don't doubt some of the bands have said some questionable shit as well. Totally agree with you on the metal community. People need to own up to their fuck ups and don't bitch about it.
It's probably very personal for them/him, and perhaps I can understand why he's upset -- but personally, I think most singer guys in bands are pretty replaceable. It's not like we're talking about Bruce Dickinson or anything. So many "singer guys" think theyr'e hot sh*t because they happen to shout and scream in a reasonably accomplished band, when they don't really play anything else or even have that much of a stake in the songwriting.
Necrotic Nick- Oh, I can imagine they're all upset it all came to this. I imagine they were all friends at one point so this couldn't have been easy. Based on what I heard on this one versus the one I own (Holy War) the difference is really negligible. You can barely tell the difference so I don't think he was the most vital cog in the songwriting but rather just the face of the band in away. We'll see where it all goes from here. I wish the new guy luck winning over CJ's fans.
yeah, as someone who was in a band that broke up because the guitarist and I had the nastiest falling-out imaginable after twenty years of friendship, I can sympathise. no comment ont he band itself as I haven't heard them and suspect I wouldn't like them 9deathcore's generally not my thing at all)@@thrallsofmetal
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, I think we're only getting started on the drama here honestly. It's great having Rin back though. I'm looking forward to doing more videos with him. He's a blast to work with.
I've been a fan of the channel for some time, but this made me an even bigger one. You described your view of the situation in a very level headed manner that unfortunately doesn't seem to be very common on the internet. I find the number of people who watched CJ's instagram video and then instantly decided he was free of blame concerning, though it's not surprising. Even his decision to film that second video with the audible shouts of his children, followed by him then mentioning them, is a clear extra pull to try to steer the viewer in the direction of his claims in the first.
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! Admittedly I'm not super vested in the band itself so there was no big emotional reaction but I wanted to break down the whole thing and give my opinion on the situation and the album. There does seem to be a lot of people caught up in idol worship and looking through rose colored glasses at those idols. Yeah, the sincerity of his apology video seems questionable but at least on him screwing up with how he worded his post I'll give him that but the hole "it's about defending the kids" angle... I'm not buying that one yet.
@@thrallsofmetal you guys are definitely afraid of pissing certain crowds off. Just like Banger TV. Your opinions are only as strong as untested they go.
@@thrallsofmetal Yup, Im pretty sure it’s Tyler Miller, he has a similar vocalist style to CJ. Tyler Miller is from Aversions Crown. Aside from all the political crap going on with the band, i’m excited for the new vocalist, he was an excellent choice.
A few of the songs really hit the spot for me but there’s just something about deathcore production that doesn’t particular age well for me sometimes even with the songs I do end up liking but the vocals are good and I like the blast beats and death metal they incorporated in it. My fav songs are Blood Throne and Everything Unwanted. Now to address the controversy… I take issue with the way they did it. Buttt it’s not like cj wrote the songs or had a primary role in the writing or instrumentation. From my understanding he is more of a performer lead singer not a song writer. So the music isn’t really his vision and I don’t have much of a problem with there being a different lead singer. I just think that the way they handled it was wrong and even CJ deserves better that that. I don’t know any of them personally so I won’t comment any further but I wish the best for both parties
Necrotic Nick- I am really hit or miss on Will Putney's production in general. There's always something that's just too compressed for me. Usually it's the drums that really feel off for me in his mixes. The last 2 Misery Index albums he did really put me off sound wise too. Yeah, there might have been a way to handle this better as far as CJ's dismissal but there's still a lot we don't know. This might have been the only way. We won't know until more comes out about it though. Me personally, I'd rather it be a face to face thing but that may not have been an option. We'll see where it goes from here I guess.
Completely agree with you about the CJ stuff. He's just another victim of Matt Walsh's propaganda, that dude is a real piece of work who deserves the worst for the kind of vitriol he has stirred up and the people he has affected with his nonsense.
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, apparently Walsh's post got to him and now it's cost him. Now he's got Ronnie Radke and Tommy Vext to back him up which might be even more cringe lol.
Extremely well handled, man. Reviewed the music, analyzed the situation like an adult, called out the bullshit hate-peddlers, and acknowledged the nuances. Much respect
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! I knew I was gonna get some shit doing this one but honestly it was worth it. I wanted to analyze the situation and break it down as best I could before throwing in my 2 cents in. We still don't know everything that went down but I'm sure more will come out about it. When it does I might just piss off the bigots once again for good measure lol.
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! Yeah, I knew this was going to be like kicking a hornets nest but that's not stopped me from speaking my opinion in the past. Oh well. Change takes time and there will always be opposition in society to change. That's human nature sadly.
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! Yeah, I figured this was going to be like kicking a hornet's nest but that's never kept me from speaking my opinion before so why would it now. People generally fear change. That's human nature. People get fed a lot of fear based dogmatic shit these days and it can be hard to break out of that.
I can respect your music opinions, but you talk about Matt Walsh as if you’ve never actually listened to one of his shows. It’s very out of character, because you’re so logical and intelligent and descriptive about music, but (I hate to say it) you sound like you’re parroting what one of his haters would say about him. I’m an atheist and I still like Matt Walsh. I don’t agree with everything he says, but he’s still an important voice , and he definitely is NOT a piece of shit. Come at me! LOL Don’t worry, we can still be friends while disagreeing. I like your channel probly more than I like his.
Respectfully, Nick did list the premises on which he has based his judgment. Would it not make sense for you to argue against his actual argument, than just argue based on assumptions about Nick?
@@julian_hicks You’re right. I should object to his actual arguments. Maybe I missed some of his arguments. I just heard him say Matt Walsh wa a Christian nationalist and he had a cult and he was a POS. Did I miss something? He doesn’t have a cult, but even if he did, that doesn’t necessarily make his a POS, unless he’s abusing someone in some way. Christiana nationalism also does not make one a POS unless he’s abusing someone. But maybe he said something I didn’t hear. Apologies if I misinterpreted him.
Necrotic Nick- For clarity I call Walsh a piece of shit since marginalizes groups of people and stirs up people with fear-based propaganda and the cult I'm referring to here isn't one he started. It's Christianity. I know that's harsh but the only difference between a religion and a cult is the size of the congregation and this is a cult I have an axe to grind with and people that promote the idea of a theocracy based around it drive me nuts.
Saw them live on their "a decade of hate" tour, which is their best album in my opinion. I feel like they got a little stale after a while tbh and they don't really know what to do anymore. That being said, they are one of the most creative and best deathcore bands out there with some very thought-provocing songs and lyrics. The CJ situation is very unfortunate. What CJ said was not ok, especially for a guy with a following like he does but just backstabing your singer like that and not even having the balls to tell him after all those years that he gave what he had for the band is fucked up. Haven't listened to the entire album yet but I will.
Necrotic Nick- The last time I saw them was with Dying Fetus and they were alright. The stage banter honestly stood out more than the songs but they weren't bad. You brought up a good point with the CJ thing. Being in the limelight is tough because some people will take anything you say to heart because they look up to you. Whether he wanted the job of role model in this band or not he got it. Celebrities seem to forget that too often these days. Yeah, I imagine everything with the band hit a boiling point and the comment he made was just the point where it all boiled over. I feel like they could have handled his dismissal better but there may have been some extenuating circumstances we don't know about. I'm sure we'll hear more about this in the future though because I doubt it just ends with this.
Hate is a good album, love the title track from Holy War, but started sounding a little stale from then on. Haven't listened to the new one. In regards to his sacking I don't know why people can't have a different opinion, this opinion is not black & white (why do drag queens need to read books to little kids?) but whether you agree with him or not his sacking was done very poorly considering how long he has been in the band for.
Necrotic Nick- I thought Holy War was pretty good but I really haven't delved that far into their discography honestly. This one was pretty solid though minus a couple of tracks. As for the firing, I think there's more to it than just his comment and it may have just been a toxic relationship the band had with him. As for drag queens reading books to kids, it's more about showing kids that they're not the vilified people that some make drag queens (and by extension the LGBTQ) out to be. It's more for the publicity in a lot of ways but it doesn't bother me in the least. Hell, if it gets kids to read then I'm all for it.
@@thrallsofmetaldon't forget 3 years ago, dairy products, cartoon puppies and pancake syrup got cancelled. That was the day the culture war jumped the shark, in my opinion.
Cheers Nick for this whole video. So, as I've previously mentioned on other videos in the past, Thy Art are pretty much my favourite band. I've been waiting for this LP to drop all year, so everything that has happened on day of release has smacked me right between the eyes. To get the boring bit over with, I love the record, but as a heavily biased fan, it was always going to be a 4 at least. So, to the firing and CJ comments etc. I was initially totally unaware to anything he posted etc as I only do Facebook on social media and nothing popped up on my feed- I literally just get friends and ads for exercise for middle aged men.. such is life.. So when the news broke that he had been sacked I was totally and completely gobsmacked.. on day of release? It had to be something fucking terrible that he had done.. and then reading on and finding out why, well I wasn't surprised by the move nu the band. So, as it goes, I thought what he said and the context in which he said it, appalled me. To suggest anyone should be burned to death is horrendous.. it's so extreme.. like fundamentalist extreme in it's suggestion. The fact he has a huge following, then it amplifies how awful his comment was. In regards to the content of what he was commenting on. Jesus Christ.. ok, I'm a father to a 4 year old girl.. if tomorrow she turns to me and says she wants to known as a boy, so be it. The next day she might want to be a squirrel, or her favourite right now, Dust, from the same named PS4 game.. I'm never going to tell her she can't or it's wrong to think or feel who she is.. Not because I don't have the right to, even as a parent.. but because it about building trust with your child, so she knows, whatever it may be, she can come to her parents and tell us what she feels and that we will listen without judgement. Holy shit, there are way more important things to worry about than what gender your child feels they are at what ever age they are. Just love them and hold them dear in your heart. That's what parental care looks like. As for CJ.. fuck me, am I disappointed. I loved him as a frontman, liked his vocals and stage presence. I've seen the band a number of times in the last 10 years and the gigs have always been some of the best I've attended.. we all have that band that fills the spot musically and live. Thy Art are that for me. I totally thought better of him, and to be honest, even though I've met and spoken with him one time, if he'd said to me I should be burned to death for allowing my child to feel comfortable in her own personality- regardless of age, I'd have broken his fucking nose with the headbutt of the gods and given him a sound kicking on the floor. What a piece of shit. Fuck him. I was so angry with his weak ass apology and the fact that he was sharing that Nazi Christian shit in the first place. I'm so against those wankers and all their ilk. The band statement said it was the straw that broke the camel's back and said that he was pressurizing to move closer to certain ideologies in the lyrics [sic] and that he was losing his judgement and his character was flawed.. I'm paraphrasing, so I'm going to make the leap in saying that the fact he was sharing that twat's video link is a big hint at where he been heading in terms of personal ideologies, otherwise why share his shit? The reasons behind not telling him and my thoughts on that are pretty much as you touched on. It will be legal for sure and financial. Lawyers for the label and management would have advised from the get go.. there is no way that this hasn't passed through legal teams with a fine toothed comb and the entirety of the band and management, legal and distribution were not in the loop and injunctions in place. It just doesn't happen these days without all that in place.. they are big band and have some good representation and connections through Nuclear Blast. The fact that they rerecorded the vocals for release on digital gives you a strong indication on how they felt as a band about his comments and behaviour.. accusations of threats to destroy the band from within if his way was not met.. a rampant ego and dangerous cult of personality syndrome by all accounts. Fuck me, even his original apology was just a non apology.. "The band made me say sorry".. What the actual fuck? that's just the exact same tactics and thoughts as Joe Rogan and all those conspiracy pricks and their "We are the victims" mentality.. Hate it. Grow a fucking pair or better still, just don't be a complete cunt in the first place! It's not hard.. And as you say, it's not getting cancelled, it's having consequences for your words and actions. Say something totally cunty, get told you are a cunt. That's the equation. His second "apology" is worse. It just doubles down on his reasoning and totally disregards that he said someone should be burned to death.. and all that shit about burlesque shows? Jesus, he's just parroting all those conspiracy Far Right fundamentalist Christian podcasts and tweets.. He's in the same realm as Marjorie Taylor Greene and her mad as fuck compatriots. So, yeah I'm pretty bummed at all of this cos the LP is rocking and I have tour tickets for the UK. I'm bummed CJ fucked up so bad, or rather showed the world what he was like and it lead him to get fired.. and incidentally, all those moaning about any aspect of his firing, you try saying what he did and see how quickly HR can your bigoted ass from any fucking form of employment worth it's salt these days.. and rightly so. Just cos he's the singer in a big band doesn't get him a free pass. I see that piece of shit Ronnie Radke has jumped to his defence and offered him support and 20 grand.. shit attracts shit it seems. I'm still jamming the record.. weirdly, as soon as I found out McMahon wasn't singing, I listened again and it was totally obvious it wasn't him.. little cadences he has with his voice were different. Apparently it's Tyler Miller from fellow Aussies Aversion's Crown, who I was already a fan of. Oh yeah, and before I forget, in his second non apology video, CJ said that he told the band to fire him etc.. so I don't know what the daft cunt is going off on.. Y'got your wish mate! So to summarise, great LP, as a fan it's what I wanted, the same but different, the controversy sucks, the band did the right thing.. (he's quit before if you don't know, saying it wasn't worth doing financially and that his drinking and drug intake were getting out of hand). It has split the fanbase and it is totally viscous out there- I made one comment on supporting the band on FB and got threats of death and called every name under the sun. Fuck those guys with a big stick. Sure going to be interesting in the pit! Anyway, thanks for your totally balanced view, it's nothing more than what I expected from you personally, Nick. You guys have the best Metal channel on social media, not just cos you do the most intricate and knowledgeable reviews, and boy do you guys know your shit, or the fact to a man you are some of the most witty and humorous guys on YT, but also cos you are balanced and fair minded people who are truly flying the flag for inclusion in this huge Metal community. We are all outsiders outside of metal, but put on a black tee with any band on it and you are instantly family. Everyone has the right to themselves and grow into whoever they choose, nobody has the right to victimise another on any issue, gender, sexuality, ethnicity or physical appearance and disability. We have to call out such abhorrent behaviour regardless of where it comes from, and especially if that point of origin is in your favourite band, Set the standard and be the better person. Cheers Nick, you've made my day.. And now I sit back and wait for the haters to pick everything I've said apart and give me shit hahah ps. Really really pleased to see the lesser spotted Rin back. His wit and sharpness is always missed and it's great to dee him looking well and on fire again. Give him my regards when you see him next. Peace and love fuckers \m/
Necrotic Nick- Honestly this was a lot to read but from what I glanced over I agree with you. You never want to see the people you look up to shown in an unfavorable light and this whole situation was pretty messed up and probably could have been handled better. That being said, we don't know all the details at this point so this might have been the only recourse. I'm glad you liked the review and we're stoked to have Rin back.
@thrallsofmetal Vinyl, tapes, CD's and streams are about the music. Makes it easy to separate art from artist. I don't have to agree on a "favourite colour" with any artist to still enjoy their music. Too much backstory and side shit in this review for my personal liking. I'd buy Hitler's music if he played HM2 death metal. :)
You clearly did not do your homework on Matt Walsh if that's your impression of him. But I enjoy some conservative thinkers such as him and Ben Shapiro even though I don't agree with everything they stand for.
Necrotic Nick- Matt Walsh’s depth of character could be measured in a teaspoon. He just likes to push buttons because he feels threatened by everything but likes to make his weaknesses and insecurities seem like his strengths. Ben Shapiro is a fragile little chandelier of human being as well too. Seriously, the dude felt threatened by Barbie 😂.
@@thrallsofmetal sorry but your views could not be more distorted on this. That is the duty of the press. of a political and social commentator and critic. to be uncomfortable and push buttons. He does not feel threatened. I watched many of his shows and he is very logical and with common sense. Threatened by Barbie is not what he was. Disgusted by the tropes the movie pushes in society and rightfully so. If you think 2 of the most acclaimed and sharp thinkers in America are weak and insecure its clear you have bought into the leftist lies that are so abundant in your country. They both are accomplished family men and have successful businesses. Where is that insecurity exactly cause I've missed it. :)) seriously dude how can your views be so distorted? :))
I've always liked your videos, even if I disagree with you in some things. But seeing you being another leftist woke NPC metal youtuber is more disappointing than any time I disagreed with you over a record.
Necrotic Nick- Well, I appreciated the first part of your comment but if I'm being honest here I'm kinda laughing at the second part. The second someone calls someone or something "woke" I start laughing lol. Anyway, I hate bigots and that honestly should be no secret at this point so naturally I'm gonna call them out this whole "free speech without consequences" thing far-right loonies seem to rally around is just dumb.
@@thrallsofmetal you start laughing when someone says "woke", I start laughing when someone says "bigot" or "far right lunatic", when they're actually describing normal people from 10 years ago... Oh well, Razorfist is the best metal RUclipsr anyway.
Necrotic Nick- Last time I checked the side of the isle that I lean more toward doesn't have Qanon, creationists and other chuckleheads being the loudest voices in the movement so you guys are far from "normal people" right now. Have fun with that lol.
@@thrallsofmetal Qanon? Lmfao. My dude, I'm not even American. But yeah, you keeping being the "normal one" whilst chopping off the children's genitals and allowing groomers in schools.
Necrotic Nick- LOL! Qanon isn't just an American thing anymore. Stupid spreads like wildfire with them and wherever there are conspiracy theories they will thrive. Looks like they'll be right at home where you are if this comment is any indication. Have a nice day, kid.
Im convinced people are more-so upset about the *reason* he got booted rather than him being gone in general. CJ built up a legendary deathcore act, but hes so easily replaceable its impossible to be mad that his voice is gone. Great review as always
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! Honestly, if didn't know about the drama I would have assumed it was just CJ on vocals on this one. Yeah, I have noticed no one is shitting on the mystery vocalist for being a scab or anything so I think the reasoning behind the firing is the main issue with some of the more irate fans here.
I don't like the term 'cancel culture' either but if we are going to talk about consequences for doing bad things - the band kicking him out in the way they did could also be perceived as a bad thing. CJ got a lot of flack for what he did, but also some support, and the same can be said for what the band has done now. 'Cancel culture' isn't the right word because both sides are free to have their own careers, but it just feels weird that Metal is going to have such a divided fanbase. With left-wing fans supporting Thy Art Is Murder and right-wing fans supporting whatever band CJ fronts next. Why should the political opinions of the musicians effect what you listen to?
Exactly! I go all over the political spectrum with black metal anyways, from left-wing bands like Dawn Ray'd and Trespasser to apolitical ones like Immortal to right-wing bands like Hate Forest and Nokturnal Mortum. It's all black metal to me.
@@wheelsofmercury Nokturnal Mortum and Hate Forest are hardly right wing. more like pagan and patriotic. if you want extreme right wing you should go for bands like Frangar or Baise Ma Hache.
@@tibicostea2029 I mean... I've heard of Baise Ma Hache, and I'll try both at some point, but if the instrumentation around the vocals happen to suck (like they do with early Absurd, Grand Belial's Key and early Graveland IMHO), then I won't like it. With those bands, the instrumentation for me has to have at least some thought put into it to distract me from their abhorrent lyrics, or else they're not worth listening to IMHO.
Necrotic Nick- I think how they fired CJ might have been a mistake. I'll definitely agree to that but I'll also state that we don't know the entire story about what all was going on that the band alluded to in their post. There's going to be more that comes out about this I'm sure. These are divisive times where neither side is willing to budge and arguably more focused on fucking over the other side than they are fixing any of the problems.
I think people hating on thy arts decision are being quite nieve, yeah maybe they didnt deal with it in an ideal way in terms of letting Cj know promptly and him even promoting the album the same day he was fired without knowing it had been entirely rerecorded vocally, but on the other side of things, we as consumers dont know the ins and outs behind the decision, Thy art stated themselves that those comments arent the only reason behind him being fired, bands change members all the time because of problems, this is just another case of that, we will probably never know the full reasons behind it, its just the way it is. Also this will probably benefit the band in the long run, Cj was a great studio vocalist, but live he had a tendancy to forget lyrics, mispronounciate and sometimes straight up mumble through performances, live this will benefit the band big time
Necrotic Nick- I think the more diehard fans of CJ are just upset and kinda lashing out right now. That's only natural I guess but there's probably still a bunch of stuff we don't know about concerning this split. We can only base our opinions on what little we know at this point. Granted I still think this could have been handled differently because both parties end up looking bad here. I think more is going to come out of this soon. Yeah, I only saw Thy Art is Murder a couple of times and CJ was alright. I got the impression of him focusing on being more showy than performing well. His stage banter was funny but I definitely got some of the mumbles as well.
If anyone doesn't know, but most of you will. CJ was fired because he commented on a Instagram video of a woman saying to her kid "are you a boy or a girl?" The child answers back with "both" the mother says "ok, you're both." CJ responds with "burn the mother to death."
He felt sorry for that remark if you read his extended rant about the issue. But rightly so, not sorry for standing against the grooming of young kids by child abusers posing as liberated post-modern parents.
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, it's possibly a little too on the nose with Broken Cog lol. Honestly, I think they'll be fine and the fact that someone could just do CJ's vocal style to a tee shows how generic CJ's vocals are.
@thrallsofmetal Yeah once I hit play on the record I stopped it after noticing such a blatant ripoff 💀 Glad I finished it, it actually wasn't terrible.
Consequence culture is always what it’s been, none of these people being “canceled” are loosing any money or fame for that matter, it’s not a real actual thing that happens lol, I don’t get it.
Necrotic Nick- I think people just hate accountability. I've always said just because you can say something doesn't mean you should especially if what you say effects the people you work with.
Really? Then look at what is happening to Russell Brand! The Rumble executives are being threated with PRISON if they don't ban him. Open your eyes you trve kvnt!
you're such a champ for not defending cj🤘🤘🤘 its been so disheartening seeing the comments section of his post full of so much homophobia/transpbobia. as a gay metalhead it really means a lot that there's some people in the scene that are enlightened like you🙏🙏🙏
Necrotic Nick- Thanks! Yeah, I knew I get some shit for it but I wanted to make my stance clear. I hate bigots and I have no problem calling them out on their shit. To me, it just comes down to being a decent person to others. Don't listen to the haters.
Thy Art Is Murder has a good right to fire CJ. for a comment the band doesn't agree with. It's the Same Reason why STAIND is HATED here in their hometown of Springfield, Mass. where I live. Aaron Lewis grew up in nearby Longmeadow. A very Rich community to very well off family. Staind was a Seattle - Alice in Chains, Nirvana, Stone Temple Pilots cover band for 4 years before they wrote an original song. Aaron's NOT COUNTRY, NOT Hardcore or Metal, just a spoiled rich kid with the mouth of a cult follower. The same crap happened with Phil from All That Remains. Weak minded people looking for attention, pretending to be something they're not.
Necrotic Nick- Tim is the reason why everyone is leaving As I Lay Dying right now. I had a problem with that dude getting a pass almost immediately by fans as well.
That's why you never apologize, It will never matter to a certain group.
Necrotic Nick- Honestly, there's some truth to that. Generally it seems like it's done mostly for the optics or to avert a larger PR disaster but most of the time it just ends up making things worse.
I disagree with your assessment of cancel culture. Sure some people have said dumb shit and deserve consequences for it, but at the same time plenty of political factions (on both sides) have also tried to cancel people who 100% don't deserve it. It's a very sharp, very dangerous double edged sword. Politics is beyond divisive at this point and I am absolutely disheartened it has leeched this far into music which used to be my escape from all that.
Necrotic Nick- Unfortunately in a "culture war", much like any kind of war, there's going to be bystanders that get hit too. Often in cases like this where people say off-color remarks or stuff that could be considered hate speech people do forget to consider the context of what they said. In this case there's definitely context and CJ definitely fucked up. Could it have been handled differently? Maybe, but honestly I think he was on his way out anyway. Politics have always been a part of metal though. People are just more aware of it.
Thats the thing, Nick. Sure politics have always been there under the surface. But this current white hot culture war is getting very old and tiresome especially in the realms of entertainment and art.
look what Tim Lambesis did, and he still returned in ‘as I lay dying’ nobody seems to have an issue about that lol. Let that sink in…💀
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, pretty much everyone has been leaving that band ever since he returned too. People did take issue with it.
@@thrallsofmetal I agree! but it’s not like they left right away when he joined 💀 they still played shows and made an album together… so yeah 🤔
Necrotic Nick- Sometimes it takes time to realize you've made a mistake.
This is gonna be a very spicy meatball for you to talk about. I’ve commented on The Metal Meltdown’s review of this album that as far as the situation goes, they really shouldn’t of let CJ go in the way that they did it. As a band, telling your fan base that you rerecorded vocals on the day of a new album with a different singer behind the other singer’s back is just despicable, no matter how much of a contentious person the now ex-singer was. It just makes everybody in this whole situation look like the biggest assholes imaginable and I can only feel sorry for the division in the fanbase that this has already created.
Nah, fuck CJ. The band doesn't owe him anything after what he said. you reap what you sow
@@SolarAdriftI never said that I supported CJ, dude. I actually don’t even like the band all that much anyways. I’ll give you a one-up to what you said: Screw CJ and the whole rest of the band; both parties are huge scumbags in this situation.
Necrotic Nick- Oh, it was spicey but I wasn't going to just not talk about it. I think stuff like this needs to be talked about more so we understand it more. Personally, I don't like the way the band handled CJ's dismissal but we don't know all the details. This might have been a long time coming, there might have been pressure from distributers. Who knows? I'm sure more will come out as this continues to unravel. It's a shit sandwich and everyone involved is taking a bite.
Shout out to you for having the balls to flatly address the controversy and take a solid, thoughtful stance. No pussyfooting around the issue. There will definitely be some dipshit metalheads whining at you "Thralls gone woke!" somewhere along the line. But fuck em. You're absolutely right about this.
Imma stick with new cannibal corpse
Necrotic Nick- I mean... it's the better release of the two.
No CJ in Thy Art Is Murder? Nah, they’re done.
Necrotic Nick- Time will tell on that one.
I find it fucked up! The fact that a band whose entire career of music has been about killing women and hating them are all of a sudden upset about a comment about saying a woman should be burned alive!! Whatvhappened to a band that doesnt guve a fuck. If they kicked out CJ cause of that post. Then they shouldnt keep playing " whore to a chainsaw" and purest strain of hate then. I thought CJ post was hilarious, I think it was just a post to stir shit up while keeling tja dark " toungue in cheek" humor
Necrotic Nick- Dude, do you think just maybe context plays a part in this? There's a suspension of disbelief with extreme metal wherein as fans we know they're not serious. It's just the tropes of extreme metal. His comment wasn't a song so it didn't have that context and if he was joking he certainly didn't let anyone know he was. Your missing a lot of key variables here, bro.
@@thrallsofmetal I took his comment as the disbelief. From the few times I met and hung out with CJ he had that dark twisted sense of humor. What sucks about text, is that you can show sarcasm or the tone of voice used when messing around. If that makes any sense
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, with text it's a lot harder to tell when someone is joking. I love dark, twisted humor as well but even when I type it out I make sure people know I'm joking just in case someone takes it the wrong way. You've gotta be clear these days.
Whole thing would’ve gone over better with fans if they would have just released the album with CJs vocals and then parted ways. Feel like we’ll never have the OG album digitally unfortunately.
Necrotic Nick- Maybe? I don't know if there was a way to avoid the fan ridicule here. This whole thing really hasn't been handled the best but I will say we still don't know everything that went on behind the scenes. Judging by the band's post I'd say this was coming to a boil for awhile.
"dry humped to death" is going to live in my head rent free...
Necrotic Nick- Glad you dug that one lol
If there is one thing extreme Metal cares about, it’s about safety and avoiding taboo subjects. No steppin’ on toes in this pit, bubba.
Necrotic Nick- Maybe not in the context of violent lyrics but we generally know they're not serious about all of it.
@@thrallsofmetal I know, I’m just fooling around. It’s just wild that nowadays a band born from arguably the most purposefully offensive genre of music, born in the spirit of shock, aggression and pushing limits of “good taste”, feels the need to fire someone for posting something stupid.
Necrotic Nick- I can see that. For me, the thing that maybe CJ forgot here is that with being in the limelight you become a role model and people will hang on your every word so you've gotta be careful sometimes. That and while his comments were his own they also reflect on the band too. It's such a difficult tightrope to walk these days.
Good video. The whole situation is a dumpster fire and no one looks good coming out of this.
Necrotic Nick- Yeah this whole thing could have been handled so much better. It’s a PR nightmare right now and both sides are going to feel the brunt of it.
@@thrallsofmetalTrue dat!
I didn't even notice the vocal difference and just found out about the drama. They handled it like jerks honestly, and seems like they put no effort into finding a new guy? Like why not change up the style at this point, seeing as this band has evolved a lot since their inception. I mean we'll have to see when it comes to the next one I guess. I can kinda get down with Godlike, but it is more of the same generic deathcore sound they've had post-Hate in 2013. I'm not even mad about the vocalist change. But it's a good opportunity to mix it up. Tracks from The Adversary and Hate just seemed a lot more intricate yaknow? And their best songs since then also have this quality. They have some bangers here and there over the years but seems like most of their songs land right in the middle of the safe zone on the deathcore bell curve.
I seen them back in 2016 when cj quit the band and the molotov solution vocalist filled in. He did pretty good. I do hate what happened to cj but the music is good
Necrotic Nick- The only times I saw them was with CJ and they were decent. I am curious to see who the new official singer for the band after all the heat dies down.
@@thrallsofmetal I am willing to bet it's the guy I saw which is good because I actually thought he sounded better up against the live videos I've seen of cj. He loses all enunciation like he's not even trying to be somewhat legible lol
As a 100% anti-political I couldn’t care less who others like or agree with. That’s to me childish, I’m in my 30s with enough to think of myself outside of others opinions, but myself have friends from any walk of life be it family man, military vets or religious of any type, not just Christian (right leaning) & friends who are gay, feminist, athiest, or generally say nerdy outsiders (overall left) are all good in my book. I’m an anti-establishment of any variety classic anarchist myself, if I’m allowed to be me, so is the other person. As a parent, I don’t find it responsible to allow non-adults to decide lifelong reckless decisions they’ll regret & in turn hate me for. When they’re an adult & pay bills, as I do, they can do whatever they like, as lifelong changes come but I won’t be a part of hurting my own child or anyone else’s, as a responsible accountable adult.
Necrotic Nick- I agree with kids needing to fully understand the concepts of gender, sex and human sexuality when they're old enough to process the information. Kids are smart and intuitive as hell but there's a limit to their understanding even if you explained it all to a kid.
I do understand that some of these kids might have issues and questions concerning gender and sexuality. But i've seen first hand how some of these parents kind of force feed a choice onto a kid that shouldn't be thinking about that stuff at that age. I'm not saying that goes for all parents and kids. But kids that age don't think about these things unless it's stimulated by their surroundings. So i'm sorry Nick but i don't agree that educating young children about these things is the way to go if we're talking free will and self evolvement. Rather have a place these kids can go to be informed and educated, if and when they want, instead of trying to stimulate a choices. Here in the Netherlands children now get sexual education concerning these topics in pre school(around the age of 4). To me that's just absurd.
Necrotic Nick- I'm not saying young children here. I'm saying kids learn about this around the age most of us in the US had to take sex ed in school which is around 12. At that point their brains are more developed and they can process the information better.
It was a lot easier (seemingly) when we were lads & I send positivity to the generations & hope for a mature generation of understanding non-judgemental folks.
I don’t know the details about the controversy, but they seem to have fired CJ for saying something other people might not like.
What?!!!
I don’t even care what the subject matter was.
Their name is f’n thy art is murder.
They bowed down to bullshit. Get the F outta here with that.
Necrotic Nick- I think context is very important here. Yeah, you can say whatever you want but that doesn't make you immune to people calling you out on it. He rolled the dice on that comment and came up craps.
@@thrallsofmetal Yes, actions have consequences… and he should’ve known his band mates would sell him out so they weren’t cancelled by the internet mob right before a big tour.
But there’s also a good chance he was grating on them from other differences, maybe axel rose style.
Necrotic Nick- Oh, there's definitely more that went on before CJ's dismissal and I'm sure we'll hear more from both camps as this continues to unfurl.
Interesting video Nick. I have no interest at all in this band, but good to get a breakdown of the forces at play. Cheers for treating all this stuff with some common sense
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! While I haven't been the biggest fan of the band I wanted to go over this one even before the controversy. Honestly, the controversy with it made it more appealing since I got a chance to discuss some larger issues outside of the music. I definitely seem to have triggered a few here.
@@thrallsofmetal People like to be triggered I think. Your take is pretty sensible, diplomatic even. Good on you.
@@spencergrady5501 nah man people dont like to be triggered. at least not us non-americans that are not part of this butthurt sensitive culture you seem to have there. I have an outsider's perspective and I enjoy common sense in general.
@@tibicostea2029 I'm English
Really enjoyed the album, haven't listened to much TAIM because they're not that much of my cup of tea, I'm a big Whitechapel fan though, but this one is quite cool
Necrotic Nick- I thought it was pretty good. There were definitely some filler tracks for me but overall it was solid.
Big fan of this channel. Love all the underground metal reviews. Discovered a lot of good stuff here. Anyways I'm right wing leaning in my political views. Well done Nick for being diplomatic in your takes on this CJ Mcmahon / LGBTQ issues even though your views maybe different from mine. Respect brother 🤘🏾 Very hard topic to discuss because it can be quite devisive and divide people
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! I really appreciate that. I knew I'd catch some flack on this one but I think it's something worth discussing. We don't all have to agree but I think achieving some level of understanding is still important. Thanks again, man.
@Samoan_Metalhead, On the contrary, I’m left wing leaning in my political views. Therefore, we almost certainly have different opinions. However, this is a brilliant comment!! It’s a pity that there aren’t more people with your views (I’m sure you’ve seen some of the other comments on this video) who can articulate a response in such a respectful manner. Big respect 🤘🏻🤘🏻
As a moderate I agree with you on Matt walsh, I'm sure th dude has bodies in the basement
All these extremists zealots on all sides fucking up humanity
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, zealotry and self-righteousness seem to be the preferred koolaid for some people here lately.
I don't comment often, but I wanted to jump in, this time, to thank you for openly sharing your views on this matter. I appreciate your content, and I now further appreciate you as a person.
Necrotic Nick- Thank you! That does mean a lot. I knew this one was going to be a divisive one but I think it was something worth discussing.
Weird thing is CJ has always seemed very liberal lol. I hate this controversy tho. Pretty weak to just record over his vocals and not even tell him.
Necrotic Nick- I mean, people can change. We grow out of things and get into new stuff all the time. Yeah, I do think the band could have handled this more gracefully but again, we don't fully know all the factors in the equation at this point. We just know the optics look bad all around here.
So liberal he hates women who accept people’s gender of identity
Solid review. But, not why I listened. I came for your thoughts on Matt Walsh, who I absolutely despise down to the fluid in my spinal column and out through every pore. You made me smile, BIG. Thank you Nick. \m/
Thy Art Is Virtue-Signalling
#wokecore
Necrotic Nick- Should they be "vice signaling" then?
@@thrallsofmetal
Neither. Don't play into the hands of any mob.
Thanks for being an awesome reviewer and channel and taking the drama on in a very good way. Don’t give credence to the people giving you shit in the comments cuz what the fuck ever. Hopefully you’re doing quite well
I love the album it's a great successor to Human Target, great riffs and melodies and breakdowns indeed. I saw them live with Spite, whitechapel and Fit For an Autopsy and I don't know if the new singer is a temporary singer for the tour or a definitive one, anyway he nailed it.
Some idiots were screaming " CJ, CJ" between some songs but yeah...
Drama apart they definitely shoot a bullet in their foot three days before the released if it would have been 3 months before I'm sure it wouldn't have had the same impact.
Dave Mustaine, re-record all bass part from the sick the dying and the dead but it was weeks before the release. But bad or good "commercials " talking about your band is always good in the end I guess.
I'm gonna continue to follow this guys, and if CJ make a new band I'm sure it's Gonna be also a killer one. Peace music first 🤘🔥
I’m surprised you guys haven’t reviewed the new Whitechapel album KIN
Necrotic Nick- I did review that one. There's a new one coming though.
@16:00 Also, people who are online, especially terminally online, really need to develop some freaking critical media literacy. You wouldn't do something dangerous without protection or even training. So don't go on to social media to take everything that makes you feel good (or mad) at total face-value and then share it to everyone you know (and a fk tonne of people you don't know). Media literacy man. Why is it so freaking lacking in an age of ubiquitous and pervasive media?
Who knows where that clip came from besides the fact that it's been obviously weaponised by an infamously dishonest actor? And even if it wasn't, you can't watch 20 seconds of someone's life and make absolute judgements about their character, values and behaviour.
Critical media literacy is probably the most important survival and life skill you can have. And I don't mean some bogus "free thinker", "intellectual sceptic" rubbish, either. That's typically just the same ignorance under a contradictory label.
Necrotic Nick- I totally agree with that. I think people lose the filter or tact they have in maybe a face to face conversation when they're commenting online. People are prone to emotionally driven responses before they consider all the variables and there are definitely people that prey on that sort of behavior to stir up people.
Not a one dimensional issue unlike this band who are as one dimensional as they come.😊
Necrotic Nick- There are a ton of variables with the discussion. Honestly, not a bad album though at all.
2/5 for me honestly I take anything from Friday over this album Cannibal Corpse Wormhole or new band Gridlink
Necrotic Nick- Musically I thought it was pretty solid minus a few songs. It might be one of the stronger deathcore albums I've heard this year.
Nick, I saw the video and you gave it the FFDP treatment by giving it no stars!
Necrotic Nick- I gave this 3 1/2 stars though.
Band is bland as fuck. But I applaud how they handled this honestly. I thought it was refreshing. And Nick's "The Clitoris is a liberal conspiracy." jab almost had me spitting my Count Chocula out.
Necrotic Nick- I don't mind them overall and I do think this one is pretty decent. I still don't know all the extenuating circumstances around CJ's abrupt dismissal but it might have been the only choice they had to make there. I'm sure this isn't the end of it. Glad you dug the Walsh barb lol
Sick shirt! Mutilation Barbecue is awesome!!
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! Just got to see them again at Full Terror Assault. Killer show!
They/Them Art is Mid.
Lol
Infinite Death and The Adversary are the only thing you need from Thy Art is Mid 🤣
Based
@@horrorking1000 sorry I don’t understand your young kid lingo
@@braindeadrichardme neither
Oooooh the controversy Yeahhh
The album was just…. Fine, never been huge on these guys.
To me, I think yeah for me honestly you definitely shouldn’t force a child to be a certain gender/sexuality at all. More so because a Kid sometimes says something just to say it or doesn’t really understand. To me most kids don’t give a fuck about Gender (I for sure didn’t) and just cared about being a kid and doing kid things. So I can see where CJ’s opinion comes from. But you know sending Death threats like that is very Scummy and flat out Wrong. And yeah the apologies and the statements CJ said after really didn’t add up and almost made things even worse. Do I think that TAIM should have let CJ know he was kicked out of the band instead of doing it online? Yes. Do I think that CJ should be held responsible? Yes. Do I hope that CJ can grow and learn from this? Yes
Anyways this is just the way I view this whole entire Shitshow. I want to know the other details on what led to this.
Necrotic Nick- I thought the album was pretty good overall. Yeah, kids don't have the full understanding all that shit. Let them be a kid and when they're old enough then cross that bridge. CJ's heart might have been in the right place (maybe, I'm not sure but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt for now) but posting that comment was incredibly stupid and definitely scummy. I do think the dismissal was handled pretty poorly overall but there may have been some extenuating circumstances that we don't know about that forced there hand. They definitely alluded to there being more going on so I guess we'll see when more comes out about this whole thing.
Sure, CJ made his point clumsily. And gender warriors / identity politics zealots can shoot the messenger all they want. But the message itself is one of concern about a cult-like ideology and the damage it does to kids and youth.
Necrotic Nick- With his comment he didn't make a point. He just posted something stupid and got called on it. You don't make a point by simply saying someone should be burned to death. As for his stance, I do agree with the age thing about talking about this sort of thing with kids but it's a gross mischaracterization of the scenario as a whole. Walsh took the most extreme example he could find and used it to say "this is how they all are" which is hardly fair. That's like me saying all Christians are pedos simply because there's been a lot of them in past. I don't think that would be fair either though I do find it odd that when it comes down protecting the youth from gun violence like school shootings those same people of "moral fiber" seems oddly quiet. Seems to me there's a lack of consistency here.
@@thrallsofmetal
If CJ had said something along the lines of "anyone who abuses kids deserves to burn in hell", then perhaps the public's reaction would have been different. Mind you, metal lyrics are full of this kind of language anyway (references to death, burning, gore, destruction, hate, etc.; often for hyperbolic effect) - but surely nobody in their right mind would think that the vocalist singing/screaming these lyrics actually wishes to carry out acts of violence. CJ had an outburst, it was unfiltered, and that's poor form - fine. However, there is still a point underlying this - which he elaborated on in his second apology video (the one he intended to be aired, but the band never did). He should have done this in his original post, to save himself all the hassle (and the consequences). Oh well - live and learn I guess.
Gun control is an issue quite specific to America. As a Kiwi now residing in the UK, it's not an issue for us, and neither is it for CJ (he's Australian) - but on the trans debate he speaks for many concerned individuals around the world. Also, I sense a bit of "whataboutism" there (as in, if people care so much about kids, what about all the gun violence). The matter of gun control - important as it is (certainly for Americans) - is a separate one. Let's give CJ the benefit of the doubt that he genuinely cares about what kids are exposed to in schools - he is a father himself after all (and he does speak to this in his second apology video).
You can mount an argument that kids being exposed to trans ideology is happening on a small scale, and isn't representative of the entire community. But how do you account for the tail wagging the dog? For a tiny fraction of the population, trans ideologues impose themselves on half the population (women), demanding they be allowed into their spaces and sports. They insist that everyone adopts pronouns as a show of solidarity. And they expect everyone to acquiesce to their new terminology (e.g., "front hole" instead of vagina, "birthing person" instead of mother, "non-man" instead of woman, etc.). As an academic, I see trans ideology seeping into all aspects of our professional lives. We are encouraged (nay, expected) to use pronouns in our email signatures and in the way we introduce ourselves. This goes beyond the indoctrination of kids. It's also about protecting other vulnerable individuals (like impressionable youth suffering mental illnesses). And it's ultimately about free speech versus compelled speech. This is textbook authoritarianism. As members of the metal community, we ought to be pushing back against this sort of thing. CJ touched a nerve, and he tapped into something that resonates far and wide.
Necrotic Nick- If he had said that it would have been more vague and he wanted to make his stance clear that it was specifically about the video in question. As for metal lyrics, yeah we know they're not serious and it's a trope of extreme metal in general to talk about extreme subject matter but with a twitter comment you remove the context of a song. It just becomes a statement and with that can be subject to a different kind of scrutiny.
The point of me bringing up gun control is more about this "moral high ground" that people like Walsh think they have championing their "we're saving the children" rhetoric. It's never been consistent and makes me think it's less about the children and more about going after a group of people he doesn't like. Trust me, if kids were getting killed all the time in school shootings in the UK he wouldn't speak out against it either. I don't think CJ is necessarily a bad person here. I just think he's misguided in the want to protect and provide for his children.
As for "trans ideology" I really don't see how this is a detriment to society. What's wrong with giving them their spaces or sports? We have ours after all. I don't care about pronouns because I generally call people by their name and generally if you're respectful to people when you talk them that will rarely come up. I honestly can't even think of a time where a trans person demanded I call them by there pronouns. I'd even say that it's never happened to me. I've never heard someone say "front hole" (maybe as a joke) or "birthing person". A vagina is a vagina and a penis is a penis. Those are the textbook names of the organs so that's what I call them (among other fun names because I still love crude humor) but if they want to call it something else I don't care. I say all this and I know trans people and they're generally nice people that just want to feel accepted which is kinda the same thing we all want. I think you're pressing the panic button on this and (just a hunch) it seems it goes deeper than your comment here.
@@thrallsofmetal:
Misguided, sure. Is that a cancellable/dismissable offence though? Is it really in the realm of serious misconduct to misspeak despite having good intentions? And what's with announcing CJ's firing via social media, and removing his vocal tracks without telling him? That's a real cunty thing to do. Does the punishment fit the (perceived) crime?
It is certainly possible for both things to be true: that gun violence is a problem to be addressed, AND the behaviors of the most vocal, virulent, vehement, and vitriolic elements of the trans community are overbearing, authoritarian, and ultimately counter-productive (e.g., feeding the narratives of the likes of Matt Walsh whom you rally against).
Of course the trans community can have their own spaces and sports. That is the whole point. They can have their own thing. The dilemma is that, (some) trans women insist on entering women's-only spaces and sports, despite the obvious concerns women may have of personal safety and physical disadvantage respectively. Women have a right to feel safe, and to compete fairly; and in the case of those living with rape trauma, this is a matter of utmost importance - even if it means the feelings of some trans women are hurt in the process. Remember, trans women can have their own spaces (i.e., trans-women-only spaces as well), but for women all they have is women's-only spaces.
Necrotic Nick- Again, the band's statement alluded to there being more going on behind the scenes and the comment was "the straw that broke the camel's back" so all we can do is speculate at this point. They may have been left with no other choice to what they did. Again, we don't know the full story there.
Sorry if I don't think that the trans community represents a larger threat than something that's actually killing kids, man. I don't think they're remotely on the same level as a threat to people.
As for sports, I don't know the fix there but fielding team sports with all trans athletes seems pretty needless if there isn't a real demand for it so we're left with what we got. In terms of restrooms and dressing rooms etc. well, what do you think trans woman are there to do outside of use the restroom or change clothes? Do we just assume they're all potential rapists or something? That seems far-fetched and again, based on a lot of paranoia. Are there a lot of instances of trans women raping women were you're from? Seriously, this has to be based on something other than a "what if" here. As I said, I think there's something underlying to your fears here.
2:36 very good point.
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, vocally I really didn't think he brought something that made him stand out. Not saying he's bad but he's a bit generic in terms of deathcore vocalists.
Despite all the drama poisoning young minds with all the worldviews/propaganda forced through parents is so fucking malicious coz most children will just please their parents so using them as tools is so wrong and harmful, does he overreact yes. And he was guilty of it I'm not denying it. Does it sounded transphobic to some degree yes? To me more strange was how quickly they replaced him as they were looking for circumstances to occur. Regardless this was a better album than the previous one
Necrotic Nick- Sadly it's the world we live in right now. Hopefully it changes for the better but that'll take time. Yeah, talking to kids about this kinda stuff is best left for when they're old enough to have some grasp on it. CJ definitely fucked up with the comment but, as you noted, with as quickly as they replaced him, I think this was a pot that was boiling over. They did say this was the straw that broke the camel's back so there's definitely more about this that'll come out in the future. I didn't listen to much of the last album but I do think this one was pretty solid. Still iffy on the production though.
Excellent navigation of the controversy. Thank you for not dancing around stuff like this. I've tried to get into a little more deathcore, but I have so many experiences where I hear the worst shit come out of the mouths of deathcore musicians. I hope my experiences have been just super unlucky and not indicative of a larger problem with that element of the subculture. I'm more of a death thrash and trad - centric metalhead.
For me, metal music is community and when people say hateful shit, they deserve to face the consaquences. When they don't like the blowback and act like the victim, its like...hey man don't start none, won't get none...
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! This was one I was going to do anyway before everything went down so when it did I was even more intrigued because I got to talk on even more points than just the music. I used to be a bigger deathcore fan but outside of a handful of bands I've kinda outgrown the style. I've heard more questionable stuff from the fans but I don't doubt some of the bands have said some questionable shit as well. Totally agree with you on the metal community. People need to own up to their fuck ups and don't bitch about it.
It's probably very personal for them/him, and perhaps I can understand why he's upset -- but personally, I think most singer guys in bands are pretty replaceable. It's not like we're talking about Bruce Dickinson or anything. So many "singer guys" think theyr'e hot sh*t because they happen to shout and scream in a reasonably accomplished band, when they don't really play anything else or even have that much of a stake in the songwriting.
Necrotic Nick- Oh, I can imagine they're all upset it all came to this. I imagine they were all friends at one point so this couldn't have been easy. Based on what I heard on this one versus the one I own (Holy War) the difference is really negligible. You can barely tell the difference so I don't think he was the most vital cog in the songwriting but rather just the face of the band in away. We'll see where it all goes from here. I wish the new guy luck winning over CJ's fans.
yeah, as someone who was in a band that broke up because the guitarist and I had the nastiest falling-out imaginable after twenty years of friendship, I can sympathise.
no comment ont he band itself as I haven't heard them and suspect I wouldn't like them 9deathcore's generally not my thing at all)@@thrallsofmetal
Yeah this was a wild release/drama.
Yeah I love seeing Rin back. More would be nice, I just missed that dude!!
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, I think we're only getting started on the drama here honestly. It's great having Rin back though. I'm looking forward to doing more videos with him. He's a blast to work with.
I've been a fan of the channel for some time, but this made me an even bigger one. You described your view of the situation in a very level headed manner that unfortunately doesn't seem to be very common on the internet.
I find the number of people who watched CJ's instagram video and then instantly decided he was free of blame concerning, though it's not surprising. Even his decision to film that second video with the audible shouts of his children, followed by him then mentioning them, is a clear extra pull to try to steer the viewer in the direction of his claims in the first.
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! Admittedly I'm not super vested in the band itself so there was no big emotional reaction but I wanted to break down the whole thing and give my opinion on the situation and the album. There does seem to be a lot of people caught up in idol worship and looking through rose colored glasses at those idols. Yeah, the sincerity of his apology video seems questionable but at least on him screwing up with how he worded his post I'll give him that but the hole "it's about defending the kids" angle... I'm not buying that one yet.
And now I'm unsubscribed. Bad slanted take. Leave your politics out of it.
Necrotic Nick- No need for an exit speech, bro.
Are you pandering to a certain crowd? Because thy art is murder surely are.
We're all pandering to someone.
Necrotic Nick- Nope. I don't pander anyone. I just give my opinion and that's it.
@@thrallsofmetal you guys are definitely afraid of pissing certain crowds off. Just like Banger TV.
Your opinions are only as strong as untested they go.
@@richardwarner8648True. These guys in the channel are broke, trying to be woke, but ultimately will croak
Necrotic Nick- LOL! I'm sure if I slanted the other way you be championing my stance. Love the rhyme scheme, Jesus. I'd say you "nailed" it.
Even with the new vocalist, this was a great album! Easily one of their best to date.
Necrotic Nick- I don't want to spoil the review but honestly as far as the vocals go it was hard for me to tell it was a different vocalist.
@@thrallsofmetal Yup, Im pretty sure it’s Tyler Miller, he has a similar vocalist style to CJ. Tyler Miller is from Aversions Crown. Aside from all the political crap going on with the band, i’m excited for the new vocalist, he was an excellent choice.
It's definitely Tyler from AC
A few of the songs really hit the spot for me but there’s just something about deathcore production that doesn’t particular age well for me sometimes even with the songs I do end up liking but the vocals are good and I like the blast beats and death metal they incorporated in it. My fav songs are Blood Throne and Everything Unwanted. Now to address the controversy… I take issue with the way they did it. Buttt it’s not like cj wrote the songs or had a primary role in the writing or instrumentation. From my understanding he is more of a performer lead singer not a song writer. So the music isn’t really his vision and I don’t have much of a problem with there being a different lead singer. I just think that the way they handled it was wrong and even CJ deserves better that that. I don’t know any of them personally so I won’t comment any further but I wish the best for both parties
Necrotic Nick- I am really hit or miss on Will Putney's production in general. There's always something that's just too compressed for me. Usually it's the drums that really feel off for me in his mixes. The last 2 Misery Index albums he did really put me off sound wise too. Yeah, there might have been a way to handle this better as far as CJ's dismissal but there's still a lot we don't know. This might have been the only way. We won't know until more comes out about it though. Me personally, I'd rather it be a face to face thing but that may not have been an option. We'll see where it goes from here I guess.
cancel culture is killing every entertainment nowadays
Necrotic Nick- I don’t think it’s as big of an issue as it seems honestly.
Completely agree with you about the CJ stuff. He's just another victim of Matt Walsh's propaganda, that dude is a real piece of work who deserves the worst for the kind of vitriol he has stirred up and the people he has affected with his nonsense.
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, apparently Walsh's post got to him and now it's cost him. Now he's got Ronnie Radke and Tommy Vext to back him up which might be even more cringe lol.
@@thrallsofmetal Without a doubt 🤢
Extremely well handled, man.
Reviewed the music, analyzed the situation like an adult, called out the bullshit hate-peddlers, and acknowledged the nuances.
Much respect
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! I knew I was gonna get some shit doing this one but honestly it was worth it. I wanted to analyze the situation and break it down as best I could before throwing in my 2 cents in. We still don't know everything that went down but I'm sure more will come out about it. When it does I might just piss off the bigots once again for good measure lol.
Appreciate your thoughts at the end Nick. It’s sad to read a lot of the comments surrounding this. People are so misinformed on the topic it’s wild
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! Yeah, I knew this was going to be like kicking a hornets nest but that's not stopped me from speaking my opinion in the past. Oh well. Change takes time and there will always be opposition in society to change. That's human nature sadly.
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! Yeah, I figured this was going to be like kicking a hornet's nest but that's never kept me from speaking my opinion before so why would it now. People generally fear change. That's human nature. People get fed a lot of fear based dogmatic shit these days and it can be hard to break out of that.
Necrotic Nick- Shit. I thought it deleted my first comment. My bad lol
@@thrallsofmetal it did the same thing for me when trying to post. RUclips is trying to censor us on controversial topics 😂
I honestly never cared for this band
I really don't either but the "culture war" angle makes them a bit more relevant to me. But yeah, this really isn't my kind of metal.
Necrotic Nick- As far as deathcore goes they're decent and I do think this album is pretty good despite the controversy around it.
I can respect your music opinions, but you talk about Matt Walsh as if you’ve never actually listened to one of his shows.
It’s very out of character, because you’re so logical and intelligent and descriptive about music, but (I hate to say it) you sound like you’re parroting what one of his haters would say about him.
I’m an atheist and I still like Matt Walsh. I don’t agree with everything he says, but he’s still an important voice , and he definitely is NOT a piece of shit. Come at me! LOL
Don’t worry, we can still be friends while disagreeing. I like your channel probly more than I like his.
Respectfully, Nick did list the premises on which he has based his judgment. Would it not make sense for you to argue against his actual argument, than just argue based on assumptions about Nick?
@@julian_hicks You’re right. I should object to his actual arguments. Maybe I missed some of his arguments. I just heard him say Matt Walsh wa a Christian nationalist and he had a cult and he was a POS. Did I miss something?
He doesn’t have a cult, but even if he did, that doesn’t necessarily make his a POS, unless he’s abusing someone in some way. Christiana nationalism also does not make one a POS unless he’s abusing someone. But maybe he said something I didn’t hear.
Apologies if I misinterpreted him.
Necrotic Nick- For clarity I call Walsh a piece of shit since marginalizes groups of people and stirs up people with fear-based propaganda and the cult I'm referring to here isn't one he started. It's Christianity. I know that's harsh but the only difference between a religion and a cult is the size of the congregation and this is a cult I have an axe to grind with and people that promote the idea of a theocracy based around it drive me nuts.
Saw them live on their "a decade of hate" tour, which is their best album in my opinion. I feel like they got a little stale after a while tbh and they don't really know what to do anymore. That being said, they are one of the most creative and best deathcore bands out there with some very thought-provocing songs and lyrics. The CJ situation is very unfortunate. What CJ said was not ok, especially for a guy with a following like he does but just backstabing your singer like that and not even having the balls to tell him after all those years that he gave what he had for the band is fucked up. Haven't listened to the entire album yet but I will.
Necrotic Nick- The last time I saw them was with Dying Fetus and they were alright. The stage banter honestly stood out more than the songs but they weren't bad. You brought up a good point with the CJ thing. Being in the limelight is tough because some people will take anything you say to heart because they look up to you. Whether he wanted the job of role model in this band or not he got it. Celebrities seem to forget that too often these days. Yeah, I imagine everything with the band hit a boiling point and the comment he made was just the point where it all boiled over. I feel like they could have handled his dismissal better but there may have been some extenuating circumstances we don't know about. I'm sure we'll hear more about this in the future though because I doubt it just ends with this.
Hate is a good album, love the title track from Holy War, but started sounding a little stale from then on. Haven't listened to the new one.
In regards to his sacking I don't know why people can't have a different opinion, this opinion is not black & white (why do drag queens need to read books to little kids?) but whether you agree with him or not his sacking was done very poorly considering how long he has been in the band for.
Necrotic Nick- I thought Holy War was pretty good but I really haven't delved that far into their discography honestly. This one was pretty solid though minus a couple of tracks. As for the firing, I think there's more to it than just his comment and it may have just been a toxic relationship the band had with him. As for drag queens reading books to kids, it's more about showing kids that they're not the vilified people that some make drag queens (and by extension the LGBTQ) out to be. It's more for the publicity in a lot of ways but it doesn't bother me in the least. Hell, if it gets kids to read then I'm all for it.
Thy Art Dead to Me…breaks my heart, they were one of my favorite bands but, I boycott cancel culture.
Necrotic Nick- So you're canceling the band because of something they did then, right?
@@thrallsofmetaldon't forget 3 years ago, dairy products, cartoon puppies and pancake syrup got cancelled. That was the day the culture war jumped the shark, in my opinion.
Cheers Nick for this whole video. So, as I've previously mentioned on other videos in the past, Thy Art are pretty much my favourite band. I've been waiting for this LP to drop all year, so everything that has happened on day of release has smacked me right between the eyes. To get the boring bit over with, I love the record, but as a heavily biased fan, it was always going to be a 4 at least.
So, to the firing and CJ comments etc. I was initially totally unaware to anything he posted etc as I only do Facebook on social media and nothing popped up on my feed- I literally just get friends and ads for exercise for middle aged men.. such is life.. So when the news broke that he had been sacked I was totally and completely gobsmacked.. on day of release? It had to be something fucking terrible that he had done.. and then reading on and finding out why, well I wasn't surprised by the move nu the band.
So, as it goes, I thought what he said and the context in which he said it, appalled me. To suggest anyone should be burned to death is horrendous.. it's so extreme.. like fundamentalist extreme in it's suggestion. The fact he has a huge following, then it amplifies how awful his comment was.
In regards to the content of what he was commenting on. Jesus Christ.. ok, I'm a father to a 4 year old girl.. if tomorrow she turns to me and says she wants to known as a boy, so be it. The next day she might want to be a squirrel, or her favourite right now, Dust, from the same named PS4 game.. I'm never going to tell her she can't or it's wrong to think or feel who she is.. Not because I don't have the right to, even as a parent.. but because it about building trust with your child, so she knows, whatever it may be, she can come to her parents and tell us what she feels and that we will listen without judgement. Holy shit, there are way more important things to worry about than what gender your child feels they are at what ever age they are. Just love them and hold them dear in your heart. That's what parental care looks like.
As for CJ.. fuck me, am I disappointed. I loved him as a frontman, liked his vocals and stage presence. I've seen the band a number of times in the last 10 years and the gigs have always been some of the best I've attended.. we all have that band that fills the spot musically and live. Thy Art are that for me. I totally thought better of him, and to be honest, even though I've met and spoken with him one time, if he'd said to me I should be burned to death for allowing my child to feel comfortable in her own personality- regardless of age, I'd have broken his fucking nose with the headbutt of the gods and given him a sound kicking on the floor. What a piece of shit. Fuck him. I was so angry with his weak ass apology and the fact that he was sharing that Nazi Christian shit in the first place. I'm so against those wankers and all their ilk.
The band statement said it was the straw that broke the camel's back and said that he was pressurizing to move closer to certain ideologies in the lyrics [sic] and that he was losing his judgement and his character was flawed.. I'm paraphrasing, so I'm going to make the leap in saying that the fact he was sharing that twat's video link is a big hint at where he been heading in terms of personal ideologies, otherwise why share his shit?
The reasons behind not telling him and my thoughts on that are pretty much as you touched on. It will be legal for sure and financial. Lawyers for the label and management would have advised from the get go.. there is no way that this hasn't passed through legal teams with a fine toothed comb and the entirety of the band and management, legal and distribution were not in the loop and injunctions in place. It just doesn't happen these days without all that in place.. they are big band and have some good representation and connections through Nuclear Blast. The fact that they rerecorded the vocals for release on digital gives you a strong indication on how they felt as a band about his comments and behaviour.. accusations of threats to destroy the band from within if his way was not met.. a rampant ego and dangerous cult of personality syndrome by all accounts. Fuck me, even his original apology was just a non apology.. "The band made me say sorry".. What the actual fuck? that's just the exact same tactics and thoughts as Joe Rogan and all those conspiracy pricks and their "We are the victims" mentality.. Hate it. Grow a fucking pair or better still, just don't be a complete cunt in the first place! It's not hard.. And as you say, it's not getting cancelled, it's having consequences for your words and actions. Say something totally cunty, get told you are a cunt. That's the equation. His second "apology" is worse. It just doubles down on his reasoning and totally disregards that he said someone should be burned to death.. and all that shit about burlesque shows? Jesus, he's just parroting all those conspiracy Far Right fundamentalist Christian podcasts and tweets.. He's in the same realm as Marjorie Taylor Greene and her mad as fuck compatriots.
So, yeah I'm pretty bummed at all of this cos the LP is rocking and I have tour tickets for the UK. I'm bummed CJ fucked up so bad, or rather showed the world what he was like and it lead him to get fired.. and incidentally, all those moaning about any aspect of his firing, you try saying what he did and see how quickly HR can your bigoted ass from any fucking form of employment worth it's salt these days.. and rightly so. Just cos he's the singer in a big band doesn't get him a free pass. I see that piece of shit Ronnie Radke has jumped to his defence and offered him support and 20 grand.. shit attracts shit it seems.
I'm still jamming the record.. weirdly, as soon as I found out McMahon wasn't singing, I listened again and it was totally obvious it wasn't him.. little cadences he has with his voice were different. Apparently it's Tyler Miller from fellow Aussies Aversion's Crown, who I was already a fan of. Oh yeah, and before I forget, in his second non apology video, CJ said that he told the band to fire him etc.. so I don't know what the daft cunt is going off on.. Y'got your wish mate!
So to summarise, great LP, as a fan it's what I wanted, the same but different, the controversy sucks, the band did the right thing.. (he's quit before if you don't know, saying it wasn't worth doing financially and that his drinking and drug intake were getting out of hand). It has split the fanbase and it is totally viscous out there- I made one comment on supporting the band on FB and got threats of death and called every name under the sun. Fuck those guys with a big stick. Sure going to be interesting in the pit!
Anyway, thanks for your totally balanced view, it's nothing more than what I expected from you personally, Nick. You guys have the best Metal channel on social media, not just cos you do the most intricate and knowledgeable reviews, and boy do you guys know your shit, or the fact to a man you are some of the most witty and humorous guys on YT, but also cos you are balanced and fair minded people who are truly flying the flag for inclusion in this huge Metal community. We are all outsiders outside of metal, but put on a black tee with any band on it and you are instantly family. Everyone has the right to themselves and grow into whoever they choose, nobody has the right to victimise another on any issue, gender, sexuality, ethnicity or physical appearance and disability. We have to call out such abhorrent behaviour regardless of where it comes from, and especially if that point of origin is in your favourite band, Set the standard and be the better person.
Cheers Nick, you've made my day..
And now I sit back and wait for the haters to pick everything I've said apart and give me shit hahah
ps. Really really pleased to see the lesser spotted Rin back. His wit and sharpness is always missed and it's great to dee him looking well and on fire again. Give him my regards when you see him next.
Peace and love fuckers \m/
Too long; didn't read
@@joeylummox7330 TLDR
Necrotic Nick- Honestly this was a lot to read but from what I glanced over I agree with you. You never want to see the people you look up to shown in an unfavorable light and this whole situation was pretty messed up and probably could have been handled better. That being said, we don't know all the details at this point so this might have been the only recourse. I'm glad you liked the review and we're stoked to have Rin back.
I was hoping to see this one get reviewed. Its gonna be a tough topic 😂
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, I wanted to cover this one even before the controversy. Now it's become an even more interesting topic.
@thrallsofmetal Vinyl, tapes, CD's and streams are about the music. Makes it easy to separate art from artist. I don't have to agree on a "favourite colour" with any artist to still enjoy their music. Too much backstory and side shit in this review for my personal liking. I'd buy Hitler's music if he played HM2 death metal. :)
You clearly did not do your homework on Matt Walsh if that's your impression of him. But I enjoy some conservative thinkers such as him and Ben Shapiro even though I don't agree with everything they stand for.
Necrotic Nick- Matt Walsh’s depth of character could be measured in a teaspoon. He just likes to push buttons because he feels threatened by everything but likes to make his weaknesses and insecurities seem like his strengths. Ben Shapiro is a fragile little chandelier of human being as well too. Seriously, the dude felt threatened by Barbie 😂.
@@thrallsofmetal sorry but your views could not be more distorted on this. That is the duty of the press. of a political and social commentator and critic. to be uncomfortable and push buttons. He does not feel threatened. I watched many of his shows and he is very logical and with common sense. Threatened by Barbie is not what he was. Disgusted by the tropes the movie pushes in society and rightfully so. If you think 2 of the most acclaimed and sharp thinkers in America are weak and insecure its clear you have bought into the leftist lies that are so abundant in your country. They both are accomplished family men and have successful businesses. Where is that insecurity exactly cause I've missed it. :)) seriously dude how can your views be so distorted? :))
Matt Walsh is a fucking muppet. He’s stupid and makes other dumb people feel smart, which always sucks for the rest of us.
@@thrallsofmetal1000% Matt Walsh is fucking awful.
“Conservative thinkers” literally all they do is just spread hate and attack people. They don’t do any thinking or reporting
Thy Art is Transylvania
Necrotic Nick- Clever
The/Thy Art is Pronouns
Necrotic Nick- You’re late. That joke’s already been made.
Great review as usual. Going to see thy art is murder in Manchester so looking forward to it
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! Enjoy the show!
I've always liked your videos, even if I disagree with you in some things. But seeing you being another leftist woke NPC metal youtuber is more disappointing than any time I disagreed with you over a record.
Necrotic Nick- Well, I appreciated the first part of your comment but if I'm being honest here I'm kinda laughing at the second part. The second someone calls someone or something "woke" I start laughing lol. Anyway, I hate bigots and that honestly should be no secret at this point so naturally I'm gonna call them out this whole "free speech without consequences" thing far-right loonies seem to rally around is just dumb.
@@thrallsofmetal you start laughing when someone says "woke", I start laughing when someone says "bigot" or "far right lunatic", when they're actually describing normal people from 10 years ago... Oh well, Razorfist is the best metal RUclipsr anyway.
Necrotic Nick- Last time I checked the side of the isle that I lean more toward doesn't have Qanon, creationists and other chuckleheads being the loudest voices in the movement so you guys are far from "normal people" right now. Have fun with that lol.
@@thrallsofmetal Qanon? Lmfao. My dude, I'm not even American. But yeah, you keeping being the "normal one" whilst chopping off the children's genitals and allowing groomers in schools.
Necrotic Nick- LOL! Qanon isn't just an American thing anymore. Stupid spreads like wildfire with them and wherever there are conspiracy theories they will thrive. Looks like they'll be right at home where you are if this comment is any indication. Have a nice day, kid.
Im convinced people are more-so upset about the *reason* he got booted rather than him being gone in general. CJ built up a legendary deathcore act, but hes so easily replaceable its impossible to be mad that his voice is gone. Great review as always
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man! Honestly, if didn't know about the drama I would have assumed it was just CJ on vocals on this one. Yeah, I have noticed no one is shitting on the mystery vocalist for being a scab or anything so I think the reasoning behind the firing is the main issue with some of the more irate fans here.
I’ve never been a fan of this band….but I looooove this channel….good review necrotic nick 🔥🔥👍🔥👍
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man!
I don't like the term 'cancel culture' either but if we are going to talk about consequences for doing bad things - the band kicking him out in the way they did could also be perceived as a bad thing.
CJ got a lot of flack for what he did, but also some support, and the same can be said for what the band has done now.
'Cancel culture' isn't the right word because both sides are free to have their own careers, but it just feels weird that Metal is going to have such a divided fanbase. With left-wing fans supporting Thy Art Is Murder and right-wing fans supporting whatever band CJ fronts next.
Why should the political opinions of the musicians effect what you listen to?
🎯 💯 🎯 💯
Exactly! I go all over the political spectrum with black metal anyways, from left-wing bands like Dawn Ray'd and Trespasser to apolitical ones like Immortal to right-wing bands like Hate Forest and Nokturnal Mortum. It's all black metal to me.
@@wheelsofmercury Nokturnal Mortum and Hate Forest are hardly right wing. more like pagan and patriotic. if you want extreme right wing you should go for bands like Frangar or Baise Ma Hache.
@@tibicostea2029 I mean... I've heard of Baise Ma Hache, and I'll try both at some point, but if the instrumentation around the vocals happen to suck (like they do with early Absurd, Grand Belial's Key and early Graveland IMHO), then I won't like it. With those bands, the instrumentation for me has to have at least some thought put into it to distract me from their abhorrent lyrics, or else they're not worth listening to IMHO.
Necrotic Nick- I think how they fired CJ might have been a mistake. I'll definitely agree to that but I'll also state that we don't know the entire story about what all was going on that the band alluded to in their post. There's going to be more that comes out about this I'm sure. These are divisive times where neither side is willing to budge and arguably more focused on fucking over the other side than they are fixing any of the problems.
All I have to say is thank you.
that was really a nice take on it! really like it :) keep heavy dude!
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man!
Great review Nick. Very articulate and well said.
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man!
I think people hating on thy arts decision are being quite nieve, yeah maybe they didnt deal with it in an ideal way in terms of letting Cj know promptly and him even promoting the album the same day he was fired without knowing it had been entirely rerecorded vocally, but on the other side of things, we as consumers dont know the ins and outs behind the decision, Thy art stated themselves that those comments arent the only reason behind him being fired, bands change members all the time because of problems, this is just another case of that, we will probably never know the full reasons behind it, its just the way it is. Also this will probably benefit the band in the long run, Cj was a great studio vocalist, but live he had a tendancy to forget lyrics, mispronounciate and sometimes straight up mumble through performances, live this will benefit the band big time
Necrotic Nick- I think the more diehard fans of CJ are just upset and kinda lashing out right now. That's only natural I guess but there's probably still a bunch of stuff we don't know about concerning this split. We can only base our opinions on what little we know at this point. Granted I still think this could have been handled differently because both parties end up looking bad here. I think more is going to come out of this soon. Yeah, I only saw Thy Art is Murder a couple of times and CJ was alright. I got the impression of him focusing on being more showy than performing well. His stage banter was funny but I definitely got some of the mumbles as well.
I listened to that hole album yesterday it’s up there with my favorite thy art is murder album
Necrotic Nick- I thought it was pretty solid.
Great discussion after the album review
Necrotic Nick- Thanks, man!
If anyone doesn't know, but most of you will. CJ was fired because he commented on a Instagram video of a woman saying to her kid "are you a boy or a girl?" The child answers back with "both" the mother says "ok, you're both." CJ responds with "burn the mother to death."
He felt sorry for that remark if you read his extended rant about the issue. But rightly so, not sorry for standing against the grooming of young kids by child abusers posing as liberated post-modern parents.
@@tibicostea2029 I can understand where your opinion comes from, even if I very strongly disagree with it.
CJ really should’ve left the whole video alone… But oh well, it happened, and there’s nothing we can do about it now.
@@tibicostea2029He can apologise all he likes, but he can't escape his actions.
@@drakoathergoth4846This!^
I thought the EXACT SAME THING about the first track lol
I thought this a solid record, they'll be fine without CJ.
Necrotic Nick- Yeah, it's possibly a little too on the nose with Broken Cog lol. Honestly, I think they'll be fine and the fact that someone could just do CJ's vocal style to a tee shows how generic CJ's vocals are.
@thrallsofmetal Yeah once I hit play on the record I stopped it after noticing such a blatant ripoff 💀 Glad I finished it, it actually wasn't terrible.
Consequence culture is always what it’s been, none of these people being “canceled” are loosing any money or fame for that matter, it’s not a real actual thing that happens lol, I don’t get it.
Necrotic Nick- I think people just hate accountability. I've always said just because you can say something doesn't mean you should especially if what you say effects the people you work with.
Really? Then look at what is happening to Russell Brand! The Rumble executives are being threated with PRISON if they don't ban him. Open your eyes you trve kvnt!
you're such a champ for not defending cj🤘🤘🤘 its been so disheartening seeing the comments section of his post full of so much homophobia/transpbobia. as a gay metalhead it really means a lot that there's some people in the scene that are enlightened like you🙏🙏🙏
Necrotic Nick- Thanks! Yeah, I knew I get some shit for it but I wanted to make my stance clear. I hate bigots and I have no problem calling them out on their shit. To me, it just comes down to being a decent person to others. Don't listen to the haters.
You aren't qualified to review this band
Necrotic Nick- LOL How so? Please... elaborate.
Thy Art Is Murder has a good right to fire CJ. for a comment the band doesn't agree with. It's the Same Reason why STAIND is HATED here in their hometown of Springfield, Mass. where I live. Aaron Lewis grew up in nearby Longmeadow. A very Rich community to very well off family. Staind was a Seattle - Alice in Chains, Nirvana, Stone Temple Pilots cover band for 4 years before they wrote an original song. Aaron's NOT COUNTRY, NOT Hardcore or Metal, just a spoiled rich kid with the mouth of a cult follower. The same crap happened with Phil from All That Remains. Weak minded people looking for attention, pretending to be something they're not.
stfu then why ya’ll not tripping when Tim Lambesis rejoined As I lay dying?? 💀 you probably go to their shows lmao. Let that sink in..
Why is Staind hated their music is complete garbage new album my opinion the worst and buttrock I've heard just like Buckcherry and Puddle of Mid
Necrotic Nick- Tim is the reason why everyone is leaving As I Lay Dying right now. I had a problem with that dude getting a pass almost immediately by fans as well.