Technically GT7 still has it. They only appear if the tires are way, way outside normal ranges (i.e. sitting on the track for 5 minutes or spinning out). Why? No one knows! Just another PD moment.
I think the reason they don't show the tyre temps is due to them not simulating it properly and they have bundled it in with the tyre wear. So instead of tyres 'burning up' they just wear more and we already see that info in the UI. Most people soon learn that you need to be careful on the first couple of corners on new tyres. Handy to know they have no effect on quali times though. I agree that a colour indicator would be good, but maybe just blue to say 'go easy on corners' and red for 'your tyres will wear more now'.
Yeah we definitely need that tire temp not to mention the VR HUD because in Nurburgring manufacturers cup I didn't know the split if I was catching the guy or not no HUD for that in VR is a joke
Tyre temps have been a little nugget of gold for getting faster with my lap times. Especially on the qualifying laps for manufacturers series. I’ll give an example. At the last round at Nordschleiffe Endurance I expected tyre temps to be up in a good range by the end of the first lap on a practice session but they weren’t. I struggled to make apexes on turns in the shortened GP layout before heading into nord. On the next practice stint I found myself scrubbing the tyres by weaving around on dottingher straight before starting a proper flying lap and there was a clear improvement. Turn in was easier, I was hitting apexes, and I found myself way higher up on the practice leaderboards than I normally would be.
One thing I haven't seen anyone mention is that what you see here is obviously tracking the surface tire temperature, but there must be some kind of hidden carcass tire temperature that isn't being shown here, because whenever a car skids you can see the temperatures shoot up and then return to something close to the previous values.
Cheers Tidge, a very much appreciated information share. Thanks for taking the time on our behalf, ✨️. I loved that you gave Womble a shout, he has been a long-time advocate of realistic tire wear and, like yourself, is an asset to both game and community, 😊. Like deployed 👍 😎🎙🏎✅️
Thanks for all the hard work. My wife has been bitching that I don't stay out enough during practice/qualifying for daily races.....saying she thinks temps may not be optimal on that first lap each time I restart. I told her, "TIDGNEY WILL TELL ME IF I NEED TO WORRY ABOUT IT!" WAS SHE RIGHT? I'm watching now....she better not be. She also keeps asking about track temperatures and if they matter....if they effect the cars, and I told her that in ACC and other games, yes, it matters but I didnt think so here.
great video tidgney very informitive and great to see our team mrl being shown on one of your videos. i missed the race but the guys had a blast racing with tcr during ctc.
Thanks Tidg - mate, the amount of work you put in for this video is very much appreciated and answered the anecdotal experience I’ve certainly had - especially with the medium vs soft tires post update. Personally I’d like it if they had the numbers AND the colour coding you’ve recommended as it would add to the strategy of how we all choose to race and risk. It would make it more fun for sure. And considering the amount of data used in real life for decision making, it would add that extra element to the game play of GT7. Thanks again for your channel and the work you put in for us viewers. Love it 🙏 cheers mate
High quality content ❤ crazy amount of time, effort and passion put into this video. I currently don’t even play anymore. However, this is no reason to stop watching your content. Thank you
Keep in mind that the amount of fuel you have in the tank will play a roll as well. Since a heavier car would create fore friction leading to a faster tire temp. Yes?
Ever since I learned that tyre temps were a hidden mechanic back in GTSport, I kept wondering why, if they do have an effect on grip, there is no indicator of how cold or hot your tyres are. Even the older GTs, ACC, and even some irl racers have them. This would throw some new players who don't really know about tyre temps off. My guess is that PD doesn't include a graphic tyre temp indicator because most race cars don't really allow drivers to monitor tyre temps and that the driver usually has to figure out if they are hot or cold by feel. If someone wants to play it like that, why don't they just add tyre temp indicators that can be turned off or on depending on what the player wants?
The difference between qually and race is (I think) tyre wear on Vs off. It's off in qually, and I think if you turn it off on a race (ie race a or b sometimes), the cold tyre thing isnt an issue.
Thanks for the analysis Tidgney. Can I ask you, if you haven't already, to use your contacts to get this information to PD? That we need this information ingame. And they actually have hot tyres information when you spin the car, all they need to do is to get the hot tyre information threshold down if they don't want to show the temperatures.
Thanks for the insight Tidgney! Great video! One thing I noticed was some drivers avoiding grass like the plague, but some people using the grass a lot. On the last Manufacturers round for example, the likes of DannyR and CRV were using the grass a lot with two wheels, and it didn't seem to impact their pace. I still have no idea how it affects grip, and for how long, and what we can get away with off track. From my knowledge, dipping two tires in to cut a corner quickly is negligable, but 4 wheels on grass for 5 seconds will be very noticeable.
basically, as long as you keep a minimum of 1 wheel within the white lines or on curb then you'll never get dirty tyres. As soon as you go beyond the curb or track with all 4 wheels, you will immediately get the dirty tyre effect. I have no idea how long the effect lasts, it feels like it lasts till a pre determined zone after you get dirty tyres. it could be a combination of time / distance. Weaving definitely doesn't remove the dirty tyres effect.
@FILOEngineering That's what I always thought, however I do feel dirty tire effect from 2 wheels off track sometimes, alas only for a couple corners after, and Kie25 also mentions he thinks it's 2 wheels now. But then again what is real vs placebo
I think the hot vs cold tests would be a fairer test with tyre wear off in both scenarios, since you're comparing the hot tyre performance in a lobby with rather accelerated wear against the cold TT tyres with no wear. A wild thought that occurred to me while watching is, "what if tyre temps only affect the car when tyre wear is on?", or, "what if tyre temp effects are specifically disabled for TTs?"
You should redo the wet test on a track during the day. It would be logical to me that a cold wet track at night would lead to colder tires throughout the race regardless. A drying out track during the day is completely different from a drying out track in a cold night.
The temps aren't perfect but at least they fixed the temps for IM/W since the physics update. The temps of the wet weather tyres just used to drop no matter what. Even if you were driving on a dry track they would be dropping and eventually get under 45º which is why long wet races became so horrible to drive
I mean, tires *should* get extremely cold on a wet track. It's just that wet tires should be designed to deal with that, they're extremely soft for a reason.
Great investigation Tidge, it seems to line up with what I expected although the temperatures for inters and wets is very odd, you'd think they'd adjust the time it takes for the tyres to overheat rather than presumably setting the threshold for overheating much lower. 100% agree with you about showing this info in the hud with actual numbers, or have a visual colour change for the tyre icons similar to what existed in earlier games, either way, something that shows how the tyres are behaving can help with making them last or getting the most out of them. One thing that I am curious about though is when the car goes off the track and you get dirty tyres, does weaving sharply side to side help speed up cleaning the tyres or not? Cause for me, it *feels* like it does, but I would like to hear a more talented and experienced players take on this.
Honestly we wouldn't even need the exact number of the tire temps. As you mentioned color coding the different states of the tires would be perfect. I dont care if my inters aren't burning up at 65degrees, I'm only using it more in the dry, just put a red circle around it so i know they aren't in their opt operating window.
There is one question i still have: You lose grip above 90°. Is this the case for all tyre compounds, so also for Mediums and Hard or do they maybe only suffer at a higher temps?
The irony of Tidge complaining about hidden tyre temperatures after spending the last three months answering questions about the tyre temp display with "I add them in later".
maybe im going crazy, but on this weeks time trial i really felt like i had to do a "crap lap" to work up some extra grip for a good lap..... but who knows :P
The wet weather makes me wonder something. With a drying track I can conserve my wet tires by driving over the still wet part of the track. Is me doing this keeping the tire temps below whatever the magical temp number that Polyphony has set where wet and intermediate tires fall off the proverbial cliff wear wise? Or are the tires just programmed to wear faster driving over the dry track whereas they wear slower on wet surfaces?
Firstly thank you for this videos I do think you missed a trick with the way that you ran the tests. The QT times could have been done with manu free practice, manu QT and Manu race as everything is fixed condition wise. There is also very odd tire temperature behaviour in TTs in that a restart will take the previous temps and run them down to the defined start temp or almost. I use a different app to you but have mentioned this on GTP in that a restart can start you with slightly higher (but cooling) temps as you start your lap. I don't think the tire modelling is actually that complex currently in GT although it's a bit better since the Michelin update. For most players consistency is more of an issue than grip, for top players like your self it's more of an issue but still a relative one as everyone is in the same boat so to speak. The main take away is keep lapping till you are getting more consistent and quicker. Lap 1 in any but the scripted races is to be conscious you won't have QT grip. With regard to the wet tire stuff I don't have loads of experience in the game so that is all super useful. But something to bear in mind is in real life the grip in the dry is 1g and in the wet only drops to 0.9/0.8g wet weather is not as dramatic as the game makes out especially in transitional phases and not aquaplaning (when the tire isn't in contact with the road, wet tires by their nature have channels to move the water to stay in contact with the road) Great video and it's all a black box but there is some significance to tire temps and tire wear but probably not enough. And this is why we have single stop/no fuel required races because either the multiplier is wrong or the tire models just aren't right.
Remove the sound from the jarring transition if possible, bud....or scrap that one. Too jarring. Not a fan. Believe me, I've been trying to find better ones for racing that don't suck. They all suck, right? Just thought I'd let you know
Bro were all just playing a game just like the rest of them "sims". You think if some one standing behind you watching thinks....."that guy must be a race car driver".... No. No one cares buddy. At the end of the day they all take great skill to reach the top. The only ones that complain are the ones stuck at the bottom.
I remember that we had this kind of information in GT3 A-Spec (blue/cold, green/nice, red/hot) and I wonder why they do not display it anymore.
Red was for worn tires but yes, blue was cold and green was perfect.
Maybe so they can add it in gr8 and call it inovation…
Tyre temperature was not indicated in GT3.
They still have the red and blue colors but it’s not as prominent as the old games
Technically GT7 still has it. They only appear if the tires are way, way outside normal ranges (i.e. sitting on the track for 5 minutes or spinning out). Why? No one knows! Just another PD moment.
I think the reason they don't show the tyre temps is due to them not simulating it properly and they have bundled it in with the tyre wear. So instead of tyres 'burning up' they just wear more and we already see that info in the UI. Most people soon learn that you need to be careful on the first couple of corners on new tyres. Handy to know they have no effect on quali times though. I agree that a colour indicator would be good, but maybe just blue to say 'go easy on corners' and red for 'your tyres will wear more now'.
Yeah we definitely need that tire temp not to mention the VR HUD because in Nurburgring manufacturers cup I didn't know the split if I was catching the guy or not no HUD for that in VR is a joke
Tyre temps have been a little nugget of gold for getting faster with my lap times. Especially on the qualifying laps for manufacturers series.
I’ll give an example. At the last round at Nordschleiffe Endurance I expected tyre temps to be up in a good range by the end of the first lap on a practice session but they weren’t. I struggled to make apexes on turns in the shortened GP layout before heading into nord.
On the next practice stint I found myself scrubbing the tyres by weaving around on dottingher straight before starting a proper flying lap and there was a clear improvement. Turn in was easier, I was hitting apexes, and I found myself way higher up on the practice leaderboards than I normally would be.
This is great for the A+ pro's - but for me, getting round Nurb on RH's & no TC without crashing is a win!
Hahahah actual mate 😂
One thing I haven't seen anyone mention is that what you see here is obviously tracking the surface tire temperature, but there must be some kind of hidden carcass tire temperature that isn't being shown here, because whenever a car skids you can see the temperatures shoot up and then return to something close to the previous values.
Cheers Tidge, a very much appreciated information share. Thanks for taking the time on our behalf, ✨️. I loved that you gave Womble a shout, he has been a long-time advocate of realistic tire wear and, like yourself, is an asset to both game and community, 😊.
Like deployed 👍
😎🎙🏎✅️
Super helpful video Tidge… many thanks for all the time put into this
The coloured square around the tyre indicators would be awesome and is an excellent idea.
Excellent info my man 👍🏼👍🏼
another awesome video Tidge 👏
Thanks for all the hard work. My wife has been bitching that I don't stay out enough during practice/qualifying for daily races.....saying she thinks temps may not be optimal on that first lap each time I restart.
I told her, "TIDGNEY WILL TELL ME IF I NEED TO WORRY ABOUT IT!"
WAS SHE RIGHT? I'm watching now....she better not be.
She also keeps asking about track temperatures and if they matter....if they effect the cars, and I told her that in ACC and other games, yes, it matters but I didnt think so here.
Mate where do I get one of those types of woman? Hahah I'm impressed. I tell my Mrs all about my races and I'm pretty sure she isn't listening 😂
Super helpful content as always.
great video tidgney very informitive and great to see our team mrl being shown on one of your videos. i missed the race but the guys had a blast racing with tcr during ctc.
Amazing vid with plenty of great information, thank you for your efforts and hard work Tidge!
Great work mate. Thank you.
Thanks Tidg - mate, the amount of work you put in for this video is very much appreciated and answered the anecdotal experience I’ve certainly had - especially with the medium vs soft tires post update. Personally I’d like it if they had the numbers AND the colour coding you’ve recommended as it would add to the strategy of how we all choose to race and risk. It would make it more fun for sure. And considering the amount of data used in real life for decision making, it would add that extra element to the game play of GT7.
Thanks again for your channel and the work you put in for us viewers. Love it 🙏 cheers mate
Informative video as ever. Nicely presented and good clear information with links provided. Always nice to see this content. Thank you sir.
We got tyre temps video before GTA VI
We'll get WW3 before GTA VI
High quality content ❤ crazy amount of time, effort and passion put into this video.
I currently don’t even play anymore. However, this is no reason to stop watching your content. Thank you
Keep in mind that the amount of fuel you have in the tank will play a roll as well. Since a heavier car would create fore friction leading to a faster tire temp. Yes?
Ever since I learned that tyre temps were a hidden mechanic back in GTSport, I kept wondering why, if they do have an effect on grip, there is no indicator of how cold or hot your tyres are. Even the older GTs, ACC, and even some irl racers have them. This would throw some new players who don't really know about tyre temps off.
My guess is that PD doesn't include a graphic tyre temp indicator because most race cars don't really allow drivers to monitor tyre temps and that the driver usually has to figure out if they are hot or cold by feel. If someone wants to play it like that, why don't they just add tyre temp indicators that can be turned off or on depending on what the player wants?
100% need more clarity on live data about tyre temps, and also what is actully going on with the physics/BOP changes when they decide to change it up
Great video. Appreciate effort and info. Makes me feel stupid for some of the things I did to warm up / cool down tyres :D
The difference between qually and race is (I think) tyre wear on Vs off. It's off in qually, and I think if you turn it off on a race (ie race a or b sometimes), the cold tyre thing isnt an issue.
Thanks for the analysis Tidgney. Can I ask you, if you haven't already, to use your contacts to get this information to PD? That we need this information ingame. And they actually have hot tyres information when you spin the car, all they need to do is to get the hot tyre information threshold down if they don't want to show the temperatures.
10:36 OMG I just bought a new screen man, don't scare me like that! 🤣
I was really hoping that I could set it up on my in game data. I use VR2 and I can't see a secondary screen.
Thanks for the insight Tidgney! Great video! One thing I noticed was some drivers avoiding grass like the plague, but some people using the grass a lot. On the last Manufacturers round for example, the likes of DannyR and CRV were using the grass a lot with two wheels, and it didn't seem to impact their pace. I still have no idea how it affects grip, and for how long, and what we can get away with off track. From my knowledge, dipping two tires in to cut a corner quickly is negligable, but 4 wheels on grass for 5 seconds will be very noticeable.
basically, as long as you keep a minimum of 1 wheel within the white lines or on curb then you'll never get dirty tyres. As soon as you go beyond the curb or track with all 4 wheels, you will immediately get the dirty tyre effect. I have no idea how long the effect lasts, it feels like it lasts till a pre determined zone after you get dirty tyres. it could be a combination of time / distance. Weaving definitely doesn't remove the dirty tyres effect.
@FILOEngineering That's what I always thought, however I do feel dirty tire effect from 2 wheels off track sometimes, alas only for a couple corners after, and Kie25 also mentions he thinks it's 2 wheels now. But then again what is real vs placebo
In the open wheel cars (IE old honda F1) you can see when the tyres are dirty. I'd assume this matches the physics?
@@X_BILSON it's always been 1, i only feel it for up to 1 corner, braking zone regardless of distance
@@5lab no
So useful thanks
I saw the brown coming right before you said it. Great thinking.
I've had one question since seeing this app used.
Does the 20-30 second warm up before a daily race starts change the tyre temps for the race at all.
Nope, the race is restarted and you always start at 60 or 70 degrees depending on daytime
Pretty sure the only time you're on cold tires is when you exit the pits.
Thanks for this video and take my comments into your consideration.
Great stuff! The question now: how to keep the temperature low
I think the hot vs cold tests would be a fairer test with tyre wear off in both scenarios, since you're comparing the hot tyre performance in a lobby with rather accelerated wear against the cold TT tyres with no wear. A wild thought that occurred to me while watching is, "what if tyre temps only affect the car when tyre wear is on?", or, "what if tyre temp effects are specifically disabled for TTs?"
You should redo the wet test on a track during the day. It would be logical to me that a cold wet track at night would lead to colder tires throughout the race regardless. A drying out track during the day is completely different from a drying out track in a cold night.
The temps aren't perfect but at least they fixed the temps for IM/W since the physics update. The temps of the wet weather tyres just used to drop no matter what. Even if you were driving on a dry track they would be dropping and eventually get under 45º which is why long wet races became so horrible to drive
I mean, tires *should* get extremely cold on a wet track. It's just that wet tires should be designed to deal with that, they're extremely soft for a reason.
The Gran Turismo identity crisis continues... sim/simcade/arcade?? racing game/driving game/car collection game?? Nobody knows - least not PD!
yeah a lot of times, tires feels like cooked at the start of 2nd lap, BUT sometimes, I do get best laps at later laps :D but thats rarely id say.
Great investigation Tidge, it seems to line up with what I expected although the temperatures for inters and wets is very odd, you'd think they'd adjust the time it takes for the tyres to overheat rather than presumably setting the threshold for overheating much lower.
100% agree with you about showing this info in the hud with actual numbers, or have a visual colour change for the tyre icons similar to what existed in earlier games, either way, something that shows how the tyres are behaving can help with making them last or getting the most out of them.
One thing that I am curious about though is when the car goes off the track and you get dirty tyres, does weaving sharply side to side help speed up cleaning the tyres or not? Cause for me, it *feels* like it does, but I would like to hear a more talented and experienced players take on this.
Honestly we wouldn't even need the exact number of the tire temps. As you mentioned color coding the different states of the tires would be perfect. I dont care if my inters aren't burning up at 65degrees, I'm only using it more in the dry, just put a red circle around it so i know they aren't in their opt operating window.
There is one question i still have:
You lose grip above 90°. Is this the case for all tyre compounds, so also for Mediums and Hard or do they maybe only suffer at a higher temps?
The irony of Tidge complaining about hidden tyre temperatures after spending the last three months answering questions about the tyre temp display with "I add them in later".
maybe im going crazy, but on this weeks time trial i really felt like i had to do a "crap lap" to work up some extra grip for a good lap..... but who knows :P
Should be a one lap attempt at quali with tyre/fuel on same as in the race.
The wet weather makes me wonder something. With a drying track I can conserve my wet tires by driving over the still wet part of the track. Is me doing this keeping the tire temps below whatever the magical temp number that Polyphony has set where wet and intermediate tires fall off the proverbial cliff wear wise? Or are the tires just programmed to wear faster driving over the dry track whereas they wear slower on wet surfaces?
Firstly thank you for this videos
I do think you missed a trick with the way that you ran the tests.
The QT times could have been done with manu free practice, manu QT and Manu race as everything is fixed condition wise.
There is also very odd tire temperature behaviour in TTs in that a restart will take the previous temps and run them down to the defined start temp or almost. I use a different app to you but have mentioned this on GTP in that a restart can start you with slightly higher (but cooling) temps as you start your lap.
I don't think the tire modelling is actually that complex currently in GT although it's a bit better since the Michelin update.
For most players consistency is more of an issue than grip, for top players like your self it's more of an issue but still a relative one as everyone is in the same boat so to speak.
The main take away is keep lapping till you are getting more consistent and quicker.
Lap 1 in any but the scripted races is to be conscious you won't have QT grip.
With regard to the wet tire stuff I don't have loads of experience in the game so that is all super useful. But something to bear in mind is in real life the grip in the dry is 1g and in the wet only drops to 0.9/0.8g wet weather is not as dramatic as the game makes out especially in transitional phases and not aquaplaning (when the tire isn't in contact with the road, wet tires by their nature have channels to move the water to stay in contact with the road)
Great video and it's all a black box but there is some significance to tire temps and tire wear but probably not enough.
And this is why we have single stop/no fuel required races because either the multiplier is wrong or the tire models just aren't right.
Thxs grate info. Wen i spin out and do a burn out i do SEE red arraund they tire display
Just realised I can't watch a side by side lap without hearing karun chandock in my head😂
It make sense, the hotter the softer, more wear.. Or am i wrong?
Surely pd could just make the tyres blue, green or red 🤦🏻 also still waiting for a delta in mfd for vr users sooo not holding my breath for either 😤
Gran Turismo the real simulator, but we will withhold the simulation stuff
Is there tire wear info in telemetry?
💯💯💯💯👍🏾
Is it worth using the telemetry for a controller player like me? I've got SIM Dashboard, I don't know if it is worth using actually...
As a Pad player myself I've found it very useful.
Got hit with 7 ads during this.
Man, I'd rather be hit by rammers on the game
This lets the game down project cars shows tyres as blue and until the reach temperature then they are green.
Lets the game down.
1st 🙀😻 thanks Tidge 👍 👊
Not first. Damn it 😅
Remove the sound from the jarring transition if possible, bud....or scrap that one. Too jarring. Not a fan. Believe me, I've been trying to find better ones for racing that don't suck. They all suck, right?
Just thought I'd let you know
It's an arcade game, end off day
Bro were all just playing a game just like the rest of them "sims". You think if some one standing behind you watching thinks....."that guy must be a race car driver".... No. No one cares buddy. At the end of the day they all take great skill to reach the top. The only ones that complain are the ones stuck at the bottom.
@@nocap7778 you miss my point. It's not a simulator and never will be
@@saveroftheuniverse
YOU missed the point.
*They're all GAMES* !!