Offbeat Triplets (the "un-performable" rhythm)
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- Опубликовано: 5 июл 2024
- Quarter note triplets starting from the + of 1 are tricky and weird, and studying them can give great insight into the subtle psychology of how music is written.
Isaac Delgado - La Sandunguita (offbeat triplets occur roughly at :20)
• La Sandunguita - Issac...
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Might hate this guy more than anyone in the world
I know right, fucker even insulted classical musicians. What a piece of uncultured swine. /s
Am I not in on some joke?
just admit you thought you were clicking a video about actual triplets and not triplets the rest of us know about.
Umm I hate texassssss sorry I hatereee it
George David What does that have to do with Texas? I hope that’s not supposed to be an insult... our community is much like other states in the USA
"Here's the unplayable rhythm": dum, dum, dum
Wow I can't believe he played it.
It's not the rhythm itself that's hard, that's one of the most basic rhythms ever, but it's the timing of where the rhythm starts that's so complicated. In other words, it's the length of the silence before the rhythm that knocks the rhythm off-beat with the other instruments.
Bad Account Lol uhm did you miss the joke?
@@respawnbug no, I get the joke, but it's not very funny when he's completely wrong
Cringeeee
Bad Account Lol bruh
You just gotta like FEEL IT, man...
78deathface exactly. Theory is not needed if you can just play/feel it. It's impressive and all, but what's the use.
Theory allows music to be written and performed with focused purpose rather than with vague expression. Also theory allows for a set of rules by which to communicate. Also it allows for exploration through the theory itself. And many other reasons. It's kind of like asking "If I can eyeball this measurement why do I need math?"
DoesNot Apply you are god damn right
And if you can't feel it instinctively, what then? Either you're fucked, or you look at the theory of it and figure out what's going on. I've never understood players who ignore the incredibly useful tool that is theory.
[edited to add] I'm replying to DWINC, not 78deathface. I could see the invisible sarcasm tags in the OP.
+DoesNot Apply Agreed. I will say, though.
When you get into outlandish rhythms from South America and the Middle East, to me the priority is to feel them, then understand them from a theoretical standpoint. Especially since those rhythms worked in a framework that never bore the western music notation system in mind.
Think about how ragas don't have a direct translation in the western system.
For folks who can't feel them instinctively (I deal with that on a daily basis), strive for feeling those tough rhythms. You can absolutely get to that point. Naturally, don't fall in the pitfall of foregoing theory, but always remember how crucial it is to feel what you're playing.
As a percussionist who has played this rhythm. Yes, you just have to not think about it
It made me mad when he said “ummm, that’s not helpful” It’s the most helpful part of this video
Same with winds.
I it's basically just a bass drum hand to hand. Just a triplet offset by a sixtuplet.
@@cactusfishy1596 difference between competition and musicianship. If you're just trying to play, dont bother overthinking it, just feel the music and go with the rhythm as it appears. Of course it's a different story when you're being scored
Jason Lima isnt that the point of playing music ?
I dont know why i always watch this guy when i never understand what he's talking about
@Mahin Ahmed i have a midi and daw. Still dont know poop... lol still cool tho
It actually doesn't make any sense. Source: I'm a violinist. Not to go into too much detail, you play a note every beat 3 times. Simple as that. No clue why he thinks it's unplayable
SAME
Yeah. It's like being taught science and having no clue what math is.
@@alexsandoval4248 I'mma guess you didn't watch this video
I don't understand enough about music theory to even understand why this would be hard to understand.
I am right there with you.
music performance is a struggle between the clean simplicity of theory and the resistance the mind has to learning patterns that conflict with existing ones. triplets are awkward if you're not practicing them with the same regularity as halves/quarters/eighths, doubly so if they're in assorted offset combinations.
it's easy to say "ah yes 2/8 + 3/6 = 3/4" but less easy to kinesthetically "know", which is necessary to play it "without thinking too much". it's about tricking your lower brain.
Joseph Kohn I've played this perfectly in band just by hearing my conductor do it this never crossed my mind lol
But at least you understand _that_
Same, I don't even understand why I clicked on this.
Just play the normal quarter note triplets, but come in a little late
vid demo pls. thanks in adv.
Nah I'll just over think it
you sound like my jazz director in high school lol
LOL that’s literally what I was thinking the whooooole time
This guy just made it sound harder than what it actually is.
How do you play this rhythm
Drummers: With ease
Guitarists: See drummers
Bassists: See video
MY bassist: Ask guitarist to play it on the album recording
I cried
Need different guitarists...
Yeah basically. I laugh when non-drummers need to visualize where are the downbeat is in the music. Like learn to fucking count. If you think this is complicated read Percussion music
Justin Wright
not everyone is a musical genius and can properly keep tempo or count really hard beats, Wright. take your ego elsewhere.
Protoka what about pianists? The piano is a percussion instrument that stole all the music from some of the other percussion instruments.
The most important thing I learned in college: subdivide, subdivide, subdivide!!
Ooh, Adam is sticking a bow into the hornets nest again.
his penis *
Knowing a handful of classical musicians, I've found that to be both true and not true depending on what their focus was. Some were strictly focused on mastering their instrument to become performers so they know how to play and read with the best of them but only really the basics of theory. Some studied composition more and their playing was more just a way to explore that theory. Those understand theory very well and usually still play and read well enough to get playing gigs.
I had a conversation with this affable retired orchestral percussionist that just made me want to pop him in the mouth ;) We were talking about the Rite of Spring, and he went off on how totally nuts the parts were he had to play. And he *bragged* about faking it ...
Of course, this is why Frank Zappa got himself a Synclavier ;)
fudgesauce sorry for being off topic but this video was uploaded today how was this comment 3 days ago??
I think his Patreon supporters get early access.
Watching this on the 3rd of september at 3:33 pm. Damn the triplets got me good
Should have watched it on the 3rd of March 3333 at 3:33 PM.
3 months ago
Wesley mango imagine watching this on March 3, 2003 at 3:33
Everyone saying it should be in March but September is the 9th month meaning it's a triplet of 3's
@@obscurist2468 exactly! Thank you! I worry about this generation
"What does the rhythm actually sound like?"
*plays three evenly spaced notes*
"Well, there it is. That's the rhythm."
I always enjoy these videos.
But can you play it with a click🤷🏼♂️😂
@@brendanb2517 We don't actually even know if he did that, if you play 3 evenly spaced notes, you can literally do the math and fit the metronome later. Of course, I find no reason why he'd need to do that, as, after the preparation, the rhythm is fairly simple, but yeah, the only thing he has shown us with the demo is that he can play 3 evenly spaced notes.
It’s really cool how you broke that down in different ways. Reminds me of math when you do transformations and put functions into a different coordinate systems.
negative triplets
Negative offbeats over tripet harmony.
The musical wanking never ends!
lol - If I didn't have to sleep soon I'd whip up some negative harmonic run over this offbeat triplet.
Underrated comment.
What next, imaginary triplets?
Neutriplets
*looks at sheet music for smoke on the water*
“I am convinced this piece of music is unplayable”
looking at sheet music in 5th grade be like
Looking at sheet music as a metal guitarist be like
Be a violist and try to come in on beat 1. That way you’ll be on time for the offbeat
Sunset Gao REKT
LMAO
Jajajajaja
why am i here.
cong TV I understand I was just watching mo bamba and landed here
WTF CONG GINAGAWA MO DITO?
Di ko maimagine comment ni cong na 2 comments lang hahahahaha and didnt expect to see u here hwhahahwhahwhah
@@lorenzcalzado7587 ako nga rin eh gulat ako
Hahahahaha pati ba naman dito
Lesson of the day: SUBDIVIDE!!!
divide and conquer...
Subconquer.
feel it
subdivisions-rush
Exactly. It's a style thing. Cuban music, especially timba, is difficult to write since it is really 3 over 4 or vice versa.
Why the fuck am I watching a video about this complicated stuff. I barely remember where middle C is on the piano
I know how you feel... My musical knowledge doesn't go much farther that 'beats' 'offbeats' and 'triplets'...
XD
C4
Middle c is the middle c 😂just think about it😂
Uhm. It's in the middle.
And it's a C.
When this triple shows up, tempo, beat and all the other technical stuff doesn't matter anymore, just play with your memory and feel
that's the way I play 95% of things that aren't in 4/4
Exactly. Music doesn't need to be written down anyways. If you don't have any concept of that you still have all of the information you will ever need to perform it properly because of how it sounds. It's exactly like language. No one is breaking down the grammar and thinking about rules when speaking in their native language. It just flows naturally. This is how everyone learns it as children, they know they're doing it right or wrong because of the way it sounds.
@@michaelbarker6460but if you give yourself one beat per bar on a metronome, walk the pulse or tap it in one hand, count the subdivisions and learn to tap the rhythm you want to learn until you can start it at any point and stay perfectly on the metronome.. if you do this for a couple of weeks or months per single difficult rhythm, 10 mins a day.. when it comes to "just feeling it", you are going to feel it 1000x tighter than if you just had some vague idea about how it is going to sound. So the counting and all the stuff is for the practice. You dont want to do this on stage, maybe not even for an individual song, but in preparation, so that you can play those things accurately.
All those "just feel it" commentators here just don't feel the main purpose of this video.
no, but they do feel “it”
If you're going to make fun of classical musicians at least give props to classical percussionists. We're the ones who have to take all the fake nonsense we're hearing and make it sound like its in time.
Yeah, man, I don't know how you guys do it!
Preach! And there's no snare drum section to hide in - every note's a solo.
Andrew Bell Jazz drummers too lol
Andrew Bell Too true!!!
Adam Neely - Classical percussionist here: in order to play "in time" with the brass, you have to breath when they do (and delay your stroke a few milliseconds to account for the time it takes to get a column of air vibrating).
The VSauce of music
Without the sexiness
Your Mother
With extra sexiness*
Adam is nowhere near the levels of sexy that Michael has achieved
Hey! VSauce, Michael here. Where are your fingers?
Vsauce just poses unanswerable questions and just adds more thought experiments to show why. This guy actually has some dam answers.
Proof as to why piano roll is the best gift to the musical world
I could do this just by pressing ctrl + 3 in ableton
Conlon Nancarrow used to write standard notation then "compile" it to piano roll. Eventually he started just composing directly on the piano roll with a pencil.
thank you
What's that?
“Worst” it bastardizes the shit out of everything
6:11 THANK ME LATER
Thank you. 7 minutes of waisted fucking time because he couldn't just tell us how to play it.
Thanks for now
Thank you
I think you're missing the point. He purposefully showed the process he used to deconstruct the rhythm, so if you run into a rhythm that you can't play you know how to approach it.
@@yeetus_the_feetus-_-9324 the video wasn't exactly titled "how to play offbeat triplets" 🤷♀️🙄 (you can check the description of the video as well)
i swear this happens every time i try to make music
Why does this have a lot of like
Why am I seeing you comment on all of the same videos I've watched
This whole video is useless
DrewPerrot Records I'm useless. Hah I won wait what?..
yeah its so annoying
This seems analogous to those ‘bet you can’t figure out the math” facebook posts that are intentionally poorly written to get people to arguing over pemdas. Like a poorly written sentence
accurate
Idk why everyone doesn't use GEMS instead of PEMDAS
The type of posts that make you want to say "Bet op didn't figure out either what he was trying to say"
What on Earth is “PEMDAS”, and does it have anything to do with BEDMAS?
The Finkie It's an acronym for the order to solve equations. It stands for Parenthesis Exponents Multiplication/Division Addition/Subtraction.
I really don’t count time for any triplet. Just feel it out no ones caught me yet lol
Agreed. Or even better, listen to someone else do it and then just copy it.
Same. I just play what feels right and it's usually fine. Kinda do that for all music even tho I shouldn't. Dont ever think about rhythm unless its really fucky
Weird flex
That's called the "correct way." I get that he's trying to be super academic for this video but even at slow speeds there's gonna be a "feel" to it.
I mean that's what a triplet is... take a beat and divide it into 3 equal parts... many non musicians can do it just clapping their hands, it's sense of rhythm, not having to exactly have it written down on the sheet music
No one:
Villagers: 0:42
Bruhh Man omg it's perfect
Wow
Lmaoooo
Lol
🔥🔥🔥🤣🤣🤣
I watched the whole thing but have no idea about music theory, i understood none of this
same. I M LOST
Whims me too
SAME. I have no idea why I ended up watching this video, nor did I understand any of it.
as a musical illiterate guitarist, struggling to write riffs in guitar pro taught me enough to understand some of this
i'm blind and deaf to notes
Huh?
Raul Saavedra yes
Same
Same, I understood basically nothing
Exactly! 😂😂
7th grade percussionists: Hold my grape juice
I BARELY UNDERSTAND ANYTHING YOU TALK ABOUT IN VIDEOS LIKE THIS, but I still find myself watching them all and every one to the end! YOU MAKE LEARNING MUSIC SO FUN!
Awesome video. You're like a musical Vsauce.
Rowan A So is Vsauce some kind of standard now ? I find it to be a weird compliment to give to someone. I'm sorry I had to say it.
Yeah, I see what you mean, I guess it's just because Vsauce is widely regarded as being one of the most interesting channels around. Seems that way anyway. Also, the style of this video was just generally very Vsauce-esque.
Adam and Vsauce both have a habit of taking a seemingly easy, or even silly question and then discussing it in a WAY deeper fashion than you'd expect at first glance. Good examples for this are Adam's "Which key is the saddest?" and Vsauce's "What if the sun disappeared?" videos.
So, I agree, Adam is kind of the "Vsauce of music". That being said, I wouldn't mind if people called Vsauce the "Adam Neely of everything" instead, but unfortunately that's not gonna happen very soon xD
Rowan A not as Adhd though lol
6:35
hey, vsauce, Michael here
Me, the absolute madman:
*pretends to read sheet music and plays it from memory after learning it by ear*
SAME THO
Same
This is really similar to how I break down and learn polyrythms! You have to enough notes "behind the scenes" to equal the least common multiple between the two numbers. For 3 over 7 (which actually appears in a Liszt piece I can kindof play) you need 21 notes -- three 7-tuplets with the notes grouped into new groups of three, OR seven triplets with the notes grouped into new groups of 7. This is how to write that out!
I don't understand the folks who claim this can't be intellectually understood. Music happens in time, time can be quantified. Come on!
(I"m totally going to work this rhythm into my warmups, somehow. I already do those metronome games.)
Sure, because it IS a polyrhythm - in relation to even upbeat.
I don't think anything is actually harder to play accurately slow, it's just easier to get away with inaccuracy when it's fast. (It might be harder due to lack of practice at that tempo)
Challenge: play anything slow, even if it sounds inaccurate (practice a bit though, as you probably practised fast too! ;) ), then record yourself playing the same thing fast, then slow it down. You may find yourself surprised! ;)
Few things in life annoy me more than when I try to practice something slowly I have a good grip on at a moderate/fast tempo and I can't do it. Haha.
Szabolcs Mate that's deep af bro.
When I was in high school my band director compared mistakes at different tempos to driving past roadkill. If you go slow, you get to take in all the little mistakes you are making, or the smell of the dead animal. But if you drive quickly you hardly notice a thing. It seems like an easy way to think about it.
adamgtrap most definitely
Szabolcs Mate nah there's more space and all that space is room for error. It's harder to keep a longer distance consistent. An exaggeration would be playing a drum beat at 3 bpm.
0:40 my reaction exactly 🤔
Edit: fascinating video. Never thought about this rhythm to much as I’ve never encountered it, save for some stuff like it from a composition major in undergrad.
I feel like I totally understood in the begging when you first showed me the sheet music, got totally lost in the middle, and then when I heard it at the end I understood it again.
I'm happy I found this channel, I'm sad to say I haven't played music in over a decade and I miss thinking about this kind of stuff.
The shit is easy if you just eat, breathe and sleep DJENT 24/7
I don't understand and it hurts my brain
*Mentally moves the entire piece one eighth note forwards*
Done.
Close to 1 million subs. CONGRATS!!!
Once he broke it down into 16th triplets, I just played the triplets on my lap and accented the quarter note triplets. This is a great video!
In mathematics, we'd call this rationalisation :)
Darius Alexander, I thought we call it reductionism?
Darius Alexander found a comment by mathematician and realized im in a wrong part of youtube and should go away
Do you have a distaste for math? Tell us about it from your mathematically realized computer!
Thank you so much! This is the answer to my question that I have been pondering over for so long. Even my music tutor was able to explain this to me fully.
You remind me of the YouYube channel "Practical Engineering" but for music. Found your channel a couple days ago and i've been binge watching your videos and i've learned a lot. Keep up the informative, entertaining work!
I've never come across this rhythm before! But thanks for the lesson anyhow! Fascinating.
breaking news: man discovers common denominators
auddybod thank you
Mood for the whole vid
He needed some clickbait
Vinícius Salazar 6:12
Haha yeah I thought the same thing. The parts of the video about playing the rhythm are still relevant, but all the explanations about what the rhythm means could really be simplified using common denominators.
holy cow this was the very 1st video of yours I watched. It's freaking mind-blowing how you understand music so well at so many levels that you're able to explain so clearly. I am no musician/artist at all but I still find this mesmerizing. I've always heard how music is so related to math and so on but I was never able to see it so clearly until now. How you break down a note into others and so on reminds me on how one re-interprets a number (even 'imaginary' numbers) or an equation in order to see it more clearly or solve it more easily. Totally hooked to your channel now, and one of these days I will pursue my artistic/musical side and will know how to tackle thanks to your videos. Keep up the amazing work.
Psytrance producers be like: " hmm, so that's what the machine is doing when I write it ".
Couldn’t you just start counting on the eighth note so that everything else feels somewhat on beat. From there it works like a regular triplet.
Yes lol
you should have turned this comment into a 7 minute video
How does this make sense in practice?
@@diabl2master It makes total sense. Get familiar with the length of a triplet in the tempo you're playing at. Once you've done that, just count one eighth note before playing the triple.
lol thought the same thing... way too overcomplicated.
Tap your foot twice as fast and start the triplets on the second tap.
Make sure you keep the same original tempo for the triplets.
Then once your done playing the triples, get back to the normal beat as quickly as possible.
This method is probably best used for practice, once the rhythm and timing of the notes are in your head, then it'd probably be easier to just play the piece
You're thinking of the first 8th rest being grouped with a triplet, but it is a *straight* 8th rest
I came here to learn something and I learned that I can’t learn this, thanks and have a nice day.
I think I can hear my way through it but feels good to geek out at times
I think you mean "the 'unreadable' rhythm."
Backless Chaps Did you watch the whole video? He didn't call it an "unperformable rythm", some random guy did it on a forum and that's why he uses it for the video's title.
I'm sorry if my English is crap.
The title says it though
Joe Troutt also in quotations
My teacher and I were looking at Frank Zappa's "The Black Page" yesterday with a score we had found on Google Images. Every time we listened to Zappa and his band perform it, they were doing simplified versions of the rhythms. However, Ensemble MusikFabrik's performance was doing all the difficult rhythms as Zappa had originally notated. So that would be a case where pop musicians were "approximating" and classical musicians weren't.
Hey, the best are the best ;)
Frank said that the Ensemble Modern was the group of live musicians who got closest to what he put in his scores ...
I love learning about music theory. This was really cool, and made me think, "Hey, this would be really djenty if the triplets were galloping."
I remember being handed the sheet music for 'Claire de Lune' by my piano teacher. I'd never heard nor heard of this piece before (a little surprising). I looked at it and went, uh...really?? It, for one thing, was in 9/8 but has a number of doublets in it. I had NO idea how to count it out, so I just played the doublets slower and by gawd, I got it right. Of course the thing is also in the most flats you can have without returning to C and for some reason in all the sharps also, which turns out to be, for all pracitcal purposes, the same scale. The damn thing was daunting, but well worth the time I had to put into getting it (more or less) right.
I'm pretty damn sure debussy was just an asshole.
Thank you Latin jazz teacher for making us always play this in class!!!
An equivalent solution is use arithmetic, specifically fractions. A 3/4 bar 18 24th notes (or 16th note triplets, but I'm stressing the math here: 3/4=18/24). The bar in question has a 3/24 silence, then three 4/24 notes and a 3/24 silence again, so a pattern of (3)-4-4-4-(3). In principle, any polyrithm can similarly be simplified by finding the relevant common denominator.
Well said. It really bugs me that music notation allows for things like triplets and writing 18/24 as 3/4. That being said it's not obvious how to better incorporate the beat/timing into music notation. It may even be that the rhythmic lexicon of the average musician is currently too small to work with such a system. _mumbles something about gaussian primes_
you got the (3) 4 4 4 (3) right but this is 3/18ths and 4/18ths respectively not 24ths.
kayosiiii It is 24ths. 18 is not divisible by 4, let alone 8. You forget it is a 3/4 bar, not a 4/4 one. But you're right that for most practical musical purposes it's the 34443 pattern that really matters. Then again, a division by 18 won't let you see where the beats fall (4½/18 is not a very useful point in the bar).
count up 4 4 4 3 and 3.
you don't need to divide by four. 3/4 as a time signature strictly speaking is not a fraction.
Me, a non-musician, watching this video:
**Insert confused math lady meme here**
Are you talking about Nazaré?
@@kIQ21
I don't know, am I?
@@bri5033 I think so. She's from a Brazilian soap opera and a famous meme here in Brazil
How to perform it at a slow tempo:
Set BPM to Crotchet = 10
Look at a clock
Clap on the 3rd, 7th, and 11th second.
This channel is like VSauce for music
The longer you look at Vsauce the more you know that's an illusion.
Tool albums look like Woke memes. That's a good thing.
Ted Williams Oddly, although I am more interested in VSauce's subject matter, I find Adam Neely more interesting.
This is literally the second comment with "vsauce" on it that I saw in this video.
Adam is better at thinking about his subject.
I always knew triplets would be the death of me
Samazon Well.. if triplets are death, go see some quintiplets...
Adam, you are a master of your craft! Hats off to you!
Made my brain melt. Thank you
To be fair to classical musicians, they do tend to be better at tuning, particularly at tuning third-related intervals, than a lot of jazz musicians.
+Andrew Meronek very true!
Like all problems in life, this one can also be solved with math.
If you assign each quarter note an arbitrary value, say 1, then each eight note will be 0.5. A quarter note triplet assigns 3 notes equally spaced over 2 quarter notes, so a single note will have the length 2/3=0.6666. So now add 0.5, for your eight note rest, to 0.66, for the first note in the triplet, to get the starting point for the second note. We get 1.1666. That's slightly after the second beat, but how much exactly? Well, 0.16666, but I don't really know what that feels like and it's still too abstract. However, .1666 is half of .3333, which is half 0.6666. 0.666 is a quarter note triplet, so 0.333 is an eight note triplet, meaning that .1666 is a sixteenth note triplet. This means that the second note comes at a quarter note and a sixteenth note triplet after the one, which is exactly the same value that you found. Yay math!
I always find these weird subdivisions more comprehensible if I assign values to them, because that way if I still can't visualize it I could just draw a timeline of the bar and fill in blocks of notes at their proper lengths. This is a different way of visualizing rhythm to standard notation. This way, the amount of space each note takes is directly proportional to its relative length to the bar. Drawing all the subdivisions below each other in this way is a fun way of visualizing them.
Pasha van Bijlert 0.16 was my intuitive answer.... Not that it would help me play it really.
There's already rhythmic math, no need to reinvent the wheel. Sixteenth note triplets are 24th notes. Here your hits are on the 4th, 8th and 12th notes of the grid (with the quarter note pulse being 1st, 7th and 13th for reference).
Cyan Light Figuring this stuff out for myself might be interpreted as reinventing the wheel, but I've found that to make complex concepts second nature (not just in music), you need to play around with it and find your own way of explaining it to yourself (and others). If there is more than one way to understand something, studying them all will improve your insight further.
That's fair. I just think it would be more intuitive to gravitate towards an explanation that is already in use with the target audience. Note stems already indicate cell subdivisions, so it's just a simple matter to clarify which stems we should actually be looking at for the given problem.
Using the stem values makes denominators larger, which makes it harder to add the fractions. We already inherently think of quarter notes as 1 in most music, so it's easier to keep with that, IMO.
I can add 1/2 + 2/3 a lot easier than 1/8 + 1/6, and I can much more easily subtract 1 from the answer than I can subtract 1/4.
And I find it much more intuitive to work out what is 1/6 of a quarter note: half twice, then a triplet. But, if you find the numbers easier, then multiply the denominator by 4, and realize it's half way between 16 and 32, and so must be a triplet 16th note.
Your channel is amazing sir.
Everybody's brain works different. I really appreciate these videos because you can dissect all of the different ways to arrive. Because I've been playing quarter note triplets for 38 years, it's easy for me to TAP a quarter note with my foot, then play the quarter note triplet against it starting on the upbeat based on being able to know how it sounds against the downbeat. Similar to being able to play a simple 2 and 4 pocket, shifting to the upbeats then back to the downbeat.
OVER THOUGHT THE HELL OUTTA THAT ONE
How i came to the conclusion my crush hates me without even meeting me
It should take a classical percussionist about one minute to figure out that sextuplets are the largest common rhythmic denominator and then sing out the rhythm slowly (like at 40bpm).
Adam, can you do a follow-up video to this where you do the same thing, but instead of using an eighth-note rest before and after the quarter note triplets, could you use a dotted eighth-note rest before, and a sixteenth note rest after?
Ganondorf Dragmire as a classical percussionist. Yep
yes, this is easily sight read and 6 as a common denominator (3 against 2) has its own name: HEMIOLA.
Well sort of...it's hemiola (in the usual sense) relative to up-beats. The subject of this video is about how it relates to down beats, which is not as trivial.
This is a lesson I feel that all new musicians should learn early in their studies.
My first few years learning songs on guitar were a wreck, there was no curve to my learning. Eventually, I figured out a few methods to, as you call it, 'prepare' the sheet music.
The methods I came up with are almost exactly the same as was done here, an it really helped me understand some pretty complex patterns quite quickly.
seeing adam with hair is so much better cant get used to this
Hi Adam, et al. Anyone interested in such rhythmic challenges should really take a look at the book *"Applying Karnatic Rhythmical Techniques to Western Music"* by Rafael Reina. It offers great insight on poly-pulses, poly-rhythms and all sorts of complex rhythmical structures and suggests studying techniques to internalize such devices (including all sorts of tuplets and beyond) in a very natural way. Strong recommend to all musicians but I would especially suggest it to folks interested in prog stuff :) If you google the title you ill get links to online stores that have the book, as well Refael's website.
Trilok Gurtu plays on the insanely advanced jazz metal band Panzerballett's most recent album Breaking Brain. He's doing Konnokol drum talk right along with the math metal. And it works brilliantly ;)
Ah, yes the ta-ke-di-mi counting :) Beautiful! Thanks for sharing!
The tune's called Shunyai. You should check it out ;)
I am listening right now, brilliant!
;)
1:09 reading along and I don't see anything remotely unnatural about that pattern. It's played exactly as written and I'm sure none of the musicians gave it a second thought after reading the notation.
yeah same, but then try it at like half the speed. the second note of the triplet starts feeling really weird. atleast for me though
I think the point that's not being emphasized enough here is that this is very difficult at a low tempo.
Adam is the hero we don't deserve but needed.
I unintentionally did this rhythm on my ride cymbal.
My solution for tempo an beats in don't understand : plug it into a music software (IE Guitar pro ect) and listen to it over the metronome and play along.
Simple, noob proof (for people like me) and doesn't require a degree in music theory, but it's a lot less elegant :)
But this people will always think that is cheating, same thing with tabs.
Why would that be cheating? It's a great method to practice, hearing how something "should be" and then emulating it is also the oldest way to learn music in history so it's not even like you're defying tradition or anything. You're just using new tools to do what people have always done.
Exactly! My point is that there will be always some "elitists" or "purists" criticizing it because whatever "reason" -_-
Oh yeah it's definetly a lot less reliable, and even for intermediate rythm or time signatures i can't just get used to it on the top of my head like a trained musician does.
Basicly i learn how to play each parts i wanna play every times, while they learn how to learn them all (i dunno if i make a lot of sense here, sry for bad english)
Now I don't feel so bad because this is exactly what I do lol. The first thing I do is I learn what notes need to be played. Then if it's a rhythm I can't get at first, I put it in Guitar Pro or I use a metronome to just "feel" where the first note should be and let the rest of the notes take care of themselves. It generally works pretty well overall.
For some reason, music theory makes me feel physically ill.
Thene Music isn't for everyone
Jose Aldo's Translator actually, it is lol
Personally, I find it very comforting. It makes me feel like life makes sense.
Thene, why do you say that?
Thene Hey,that's what Math does to me!
I love this guy. When it comes to music, I'm just an amateur, though with over 10 years of cumulative practice, still I haven't been schooled seriously and I'm doing everything by ear. It is what it is, a hobby for my soul. I'm actually a programmer and a game and graphic designer, but my parents had a band when they were young and 80's kinda got stuck in my veins. Anyway this guy opens it up for me like Neil deGrasse Tyson, and I just wanted to share my excitement because I've found such an knowledgeable and well-narrated content on RUclips for anyone who's developing a better music intuition.
Adam, thank you very much for helping shed some light on the 3rd measure of the second A section in 'Have you met Miss Jones' on the Oscar Peterson Trio 'We Get Requests' album. Playing Ray Brown's line there is not hard, but notating it right? Damn.. that's been driving me up the wall. Much obliged. (and subscribed)
Hey VSauce, Adam here!
So how do you play this rythm?
Break. It. Down. Great video. Incisive rhythm is overlooked as one of the biggest challenges of string playing; intonation and beauty of sound being the areas that tend to dominate our focus, especially in music schools where we spend so much of our time on concerti that we mostly practice alone. (Sad.)
Those Strad lists always seem a bit contrived, don't they? Anyhow, 'faking it' is usually concerned with especially pregnant runs, basically too many notes to conceptualize as separate entities. The advice is basically good, presuming that the attack of the bow stroke is rhythmically coordinated. The left hand has the ability to fill the notes in brilliantly as long as the endpoints are matched to the bow stroke.
Orchestral string sections rarely see that complex level of syncopation, but it would be impossible to 'fake' without looking and sounding like a complete mess. Been there, done that. In the case of youth orchestras, it's up to the conductor, or a loud-mouthed, rhythmically pedantic, know-it-all violinist, to break it down the way you have here.
This is a fantastic video Adam as always. I am humbly going to suggest an alternative approach, however, which is easier in my mind for me personally at least, and perhaps might be to others. So my way to conceptualize this rhythm is to surround it with “fake” odd time signatures so you can get the triplet back on the beat in your mind. For example, if we change the bar of 3/4 to 3 bars of 1/8 2/4 1/8 respectively, then the triplet neatly begins on and spans the length of the 2/4 bar and you just have to count an 8th rest on either side of it. I don’t know, it just seems a lot easier for me thinking of it that way rather than breaking down the triplet into 16ths and feeling the ties.
Adam Neely it's confusing enough for fucks sake with your tadpoles and telegraph wires oh my God my brain has melted. Thanks for that.
...and yet, Glenn Fricker, wonders how a bass player could make use of a music degree
This is one of these (few?) cases where tabs come to our help: subdivide each pulse into sextuplets and you'll get
· · · X · · · X · · · X · · · · · ·
Ir you were trained into the Takadimi system it is as simple (!) as saying "Di Vada -". It is not more difficult if you use the Turkish account or, I suppose, many other non-western systems like those for indian tabla.
Man, I didn't understand a bit of that theory, but this video convinced me to subscribe
Awesome Explanation !! Thanks for that.
Q&A: Hey Adam, greetings from Australia.
When I was at uni studying jazz guitar I found "time feel" an elusive concept. I would learn by playing along with recordings but always longed to quantify something rather than just "feel it."
I toyed with a few exercises like trying to play straight quavers with the on beats behind and the off beats on the third quaver triplet. I also practised playing on the 1st and 4th of a 5:4 subdivision.
Accenting is a whole other can of worms which I explored too (Jim Hall's technique of matching picking to tonguing on a sax helped here.)
Have you given much thought to the time feel of melodic instruments and how to communicate and practice this in a meaningful way? Is there an answer to how to practice shifting where one sits on the beat to invoke emotion? Or is playing along with the greats and trying to match their feel the only way forward in this area?
Peace and kindness.
Yall make this shit way more complicated than it needs to be lmao
jior6 that's kinda the point lol
Actually hearing it played on bass, I know this beat. You're stressing over how to write it, thank God, there's an apt for that.
Mark Foster ever tried playing it in time with other performers
try actually performing it in a choral work or orchestral piece. And this stuff is super interesting for music theory nerds like myself, so things like this does not overly complicate it, its actually fascinating and helpful, since without knowing where the actual beat is, you are just plain guessing and when you are performing a choral work, guessing doesn't cut it. And then when you add in lyrics, and notes, and where to put accents and so many other factors, this in fact does not complicate the matter, it breaks it down into what is the off beat triplet. And if you think this is overly complicated try having someone explain the concept of a hemiola to you.
rachel tramel If you really are a musician this is not difficult at all. Musicians don’t read rhythms based on a beat. They read rhythms based on duration of the notes and rests. The beat comes later so we know where to stress and unstress but that only comes after the rhythm is figured out. From a theoretical standpoint this may be interesting (not really) but not impossible to perform at all.
Dude, your informational speaking skills are off the charts.
I just love it that Adam had a short clip of Alexi Laiho in his video 🤘
the second quarter note triplet just comes in exactly on the second sextuplet on beat 2.
and the 3rd one comes in on the last sextuplet of beat 2
What's missing here for me is a good solid musical context for all the fun geeky breakdown. Could we hear a few more real musical applications, to give us a better understanding of why (other than the math) this is good to know?
listen to Murder by Numbers by The Police. Drum track is based on this whole idea.
When I first saw this I thought it was so cool I put it in my second composition I have ever written. It metrically modulates and the off-beat super triplets happen over bar lines. So, good luck trying to learn my piece.
Dude this was super interesting :D thanks for breaking that down