Have you seen this video? I would think if the breather bypass needed vacuum he would have mentioned it. Good job on your videos. 👍 ruclips.net/video/LoVuOuhFvDs/видео.html
@@justinpoleski9292 sorry for the delay - RUclips held this comment for review and I just saw it. Yes, I had seen Doc's video as well. It probably boils down to no oil without vacuum better than oil with a vacuum. Maybe? I'm about to publish the catch can video where I use the crankcase breather, external breather mod, and vacuum all at the same time. I got some interesting and promising results.
Did an impulse buy from a dealer in Chilliwack BC of a used 17 Street Glide Special with 3900 km. Had bike shipped and upon arrival noted oil level was down a quart. Found 14 oz oil after pulling crank sensor.
@@RonsWorkshop Removed bike from shipping crate and went 20 ft in first gear into my garage. Wanted to check fluids first, before first ride, - noticed the low oil level. Did a google search. Found your video and removed sensor to which 14 oz plus poured out. Will be contacting Harley Canada. Has only been started once in my possession.
I have a new to me 2017 CVO Limited. I just changed the stock crankcase sump screw to the Feuling short sump screw. I did this immediately after a 40 minute ride on the freeway. It drained 150ml or 5.1 ounces. I’m going to check this again when I change the oil to see if the shorter screw made an improvement. 😊Changing the oil pump out to the 2020 is one of the first upgrades I plan to make.
When I first got my used 2018 fatboy with the 114 there was oil under the air cleaner than thanks to this channel i put the trans cover breather on and it worked but I used to get a small puddle of oil under the breather filter after every ride This winter I put a S&S 128 big bore and ss 475 cam and oil pump with lifters what a difference!!!! I've only did 400 miles breaking in the eng and no oil at all coming out the breather or air cleaner
Hey Ron, Check for sumping with the crank sensor is very interesting. This gives me ideas on some of the things I can do after I get the 2018 Limited out of winter storage. Thanks for your output on maintaining the M8 engine.
I haven't check to see if my 2018 fatboy was sumping but am putting a ss 475 cam in it with a new oil pump so hopefully I won't have that problem But I've done the breather mod that I've learned on your channel and works flawless My air cleaner isn't oily any more thank you
Hi Ron, Wifey has a 2020FXLR. Open air cleaner, short shots, Vance tuner. When she is hard on the throttle and I am behind her I can smell oil. I suspect the breather tubes putting too much oil into the intake but I haven't looked at it yet. I think I will be doing your trans cover vent either way. I was just gonna buy the Trask. But 350$? Na. Any way on the current awesome vid with the crank sensor, why does the engine have to be hot? I mean if you run it blast around, watch some Ron's workshop vids then check it won't the oil still be in the crank sump? Maybe I am missing something. Thanks. you da man.
Hey again brianlampman - first off, thanks for the kind words! For the bike being hot - you want to catch it as close to operating conditions as possible. If it sits for a while I believe oil will gradually drain back down into the sump, which could throw off the results.
Thanks for the update, just changed my 2018 heritage to the 8 lope , had to upgrade the cam while I was in the cam chest .had over 6 0z in the drain pan
Thanks for the info! 44% increase in scavenging is definintely significant between the old and new pumps! What cam did you go with? I love it - "had to" upgrade the cam while you were in there. I'd do the same!
Great, I look forward to other videos. My adult step son (45) just bought his second twin cam and I currently own a Vrod, a 65 Pan on a rigid frame and an 883 Sportster low for his Mother. He's not really familiar with motorcycles mechanically so I've been boning up on their known problems and major week spots. He just bought his second twin cam (a 2009 I believe) and I don't want him to be at the mercy of some of the local shops though some of the friends he rides with are very knowledgeable I have seen him get 2 bearings replaced on his front wheel and pay 40.00 a piece and 120.00 dollars to install them and they screwed one of those by pulling it with the chine past the bearing and damaging the retaining cup, they returned the wheel with the bearing 1/4 inch out from flush with the hub and noted this on the invoice and still charged him as if there wasn't an issue. I have a bearing puller kit and we extracted it and used a punch and a dremel tool to repair and clean up the bearing cup. I look forward to to every thing you have now and in the future. I'm retired now (a licensed industrial master electrician) 68 years old. and most of the old friends that showed me the ropes since the late 70's have died or moved 100 and more miles away. So I will be an avid viewer especially this winter. The wife and I have many summer interests so I'll be doing my research in the winter. And since the last grandchild moved out, in the living room (the garage has no heat) I'll be changing the triple tree on the v-rod from a 4 degree to a 2 degree to increase the effective trail and allow it to be more stable at higher speeds and not tend to flop at very slow speeds getting out of the neighborhood. If I'm ambitious enough I want to install an 04 Deuce front end on our Pan-head and have a real disk brake on the front. It gets a bit dangerous out hear in Maryland not far from Washington Thanks again and maybe see you on the road some day. Mike
The garage is full! It’s unfortunate that there are shops that do shoddy work and won’t make good on it. Like you said - it’s good motivation to keep learning and tackle those things ourselves.
I did this exact same check after I got done with a weekend trip which was roughly 550 miles. Check my oil level ( cold check) and it was on the bottom dimples of the side stand check. When I pulled my crank sensor out I got exactly 4 ounces. Before my trip I asked my local mechanic about the M8 problems and he talked about the oil pump issue, he sold me a feuling Vented dip stick a year ago . about two months ago I installed a DK customs external breather kit which he told me to take off immediately because It would do more harm to my engine. I’ve been asking around and nobody else has said the external breather kit is a bad thing. I will say I think I am getting a lot of blow by though because my catch can does collect a good amount of moisture and the nasty oil mist after about 100 miles. My bike is an 18 FLHXS with 11,500 miles with a stage one kit only
Hey HR Slick - yeah I’m curious why he said to remove the external breather mod. I’m aware of the notion that those ports that vent into the throttle body supposedly allow for crankcase vacuum but I haven’t been able to detect any vacuum from that.
My m8 sumped last sunday. 19 electraglide standard. Just turned 10k miles. Did 200 miles that day, On the way home i took the highway and set the cruise at 70. Went 10 exits down and started losing power and also noticed an oil burning smell. Pulled over she was in parade mode so it was active, Pulled the stick on with bike on the "jiffy stand" and i was missing a quart of oil and was also burnt smelling. I always do pre ride checks and i check oil before and when the bike is hot at a gas up stop always use amsoil in everything i drive specially all my bikes oil, primary, trans. Not many miles on the bike and I was excited this year because i was going to be able to seriously ride this year. I was a few weeks away from doing the popular cam chest upgrade. But now the motor is hurt ive yet to.pull compression and leakdown tests on it but it runs rough and I changed the oil theres little pieces of shiny metal in there guessing thats the cam ground down to the babbitt metal and fresh ground lifter. Was going to try to go for a ride after the oil change but the oil immediately gets aerated. Just sharing my experience here. I already have all the cam chest parts so im gonna open her up and take a look hopefully the leak down test is not shown to be excessive .
@@RonsWorkshop Hi Ron heres an update on my m8 sumping. I pulled the crank sensor and 2 quarts of oil approximately came out . So I changed the oil as well started the bike and it ran good but the camchest was a little ticky. So it smoked a little and cleared up, I had a hunch that it sumping plus me adding oil to replaced the missing oil just washed the rings out in the front cylinder? I replaced every thing in the camchest with a Redshift cam kit from fuel moto that i had and installed the m8 drag specialties pump with a new harley camplate. So i finished the bike today, did another oil and filter change before firing it up and noted at least 6 quarts of oil filled the pan. It was chock full of oil. It was running rough because of all the oil sloshing around in the crankcase. Im thinking i lucked out, took it for a 137 mile test ride today and it ran great. Im sure in the future maybe winter time that the top end will need attention as ive seen many stories of oil consumption problems at 9 to 10 k. We shall see. The camplate journals where the cam and crank rides got scored up and the lifter bores looked a little worn but nothing major. Hopefully it wil keep running good ill post another update.
Hey Mark - thanks for sharing that update! Sounds like she has a few battle scars but I’m glad to hear she’s running well now. I hope you can log some great miles this riding season. And if you want a sticker send me a DM on Telegram, Instagram or Signal with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
Guess I’m going to have to check mine now lol I may be a hypochondriac or paranoid when it comes to this stuff, but I do feel like not getting passed the 200 miles on a tank mark even when not “hot dogging” it, this may be the next thing to check since I already verified the tune was good to go, plugs were fine, no intake leaks, and no codes. Much appreciated on the content!!!
I’ve got an 18 FLSB that has recently started using a boat load of oil, almost doubling its consumption from about 1/2qt every 1000 miles to 1/2qt every 450 miles. Seeing oil getting into air cleaner and on the right side of the bike. After hitting up a mechanic on RUclips (Doc Harley) who suggested pulling the CKP I did. After riding for about 30 minutes I got the sensor out within about 90 seconds of shutting bike off with it secured in my Condor chock. Only got 2 drops out. So I don’t think sumping is the issue. Hoping that it’s something silly, like just the breathers are over saturated and are allowing excess oil of of them.
I have a 2018 Heritage Softail Classic, bought it used with 2K miles in June 2022. It has some light mods, V&H shotguns and S&S air filter mod, nothing else as far as I am aware. I have no idea if this has been addressed. My local HD shops can’t be trusted. I’ve gone in with a simple oil change and walk out with a fkn laundry list of sh!t that needs to be “fixed” on the bike. Sorry to tell you, the dude I bought it from put about 500 miles per year on the bike.. it has zero issues. At any rate, so, I’ll be doing this check myself. Can you recommend a good work stand for the bike.
Hey Looper Trooper - I don't have any good work stand recommendations. The one I have is a cheap one that is just "ok". But let me know what you find and let me know how the check goes!
Did that same crank sensor check on my 19rg last yr. Only got a couple of drops of oil. Have the older pump also, but have an s&s 475c cam chest kit to put in this winter. That will give me some more punch, and upgrade the pump at the same time.
@@RonsWorkshop Yes, some added peace of mind. Bike is a stage 1 now, have a krome werks aggressor header to go with the cam. Just haven’t done the work yet. Live in Fl. Too hot in my garage during the summer. Waitin til fall/winter when it’s a bit cooler.
I have a 2024 TRI Glide Ultra, will venting the Crank case void my warranty? Do I need to install a one way valve on a crank case breather system?? Thanks man for your time.
I think the warranty question varies by dealer I have no idea what the MoCo says. I’ll also say that the newer bikes should have these issues mostly or completely addressed. I’ve also heard that the newer bikes have a crankcase vent from the factory but I haven’t seen it firsthand.
Heh Ron I messaged you a while ago got almost 8 oz was running Red Line 20-50 changed to conventional Harley 20-50 have since rode the bike 200 miles checked the crank sensor again got maybe a teaspoon I might have been running the oil a little full .its running good and I believe a little quieter .Will keep an eye on it thanks a lot for the videos .
Damn. Have not had an issue with this until now. Just changed all my fluids to red line (about 2-3 months ago) and now my Arlen Ness air filter is dripping oil. Do you think I should switch back to harley conventional before drilling into my transmission cover?
Hey Jesse - Tough call. Those fluids aren’t cheap! It does make me wonder though, since it didn’t start until you switched. And it sounds like Ken had issues after switching as well. Might just be worth it to switch back and see how it goes. Let me know what you decide and how it goes.
Ron can you confirm why all pre May 2019 don't have sumping issues? If the oil pump design is the cause, I would expect that sumping would be on all older oil pumps.
Hey Gary - no it’s not all bikes. Some have it and some don’t. There are different causes so there no one single answer or solution. If you don’t have any of the symptoms I listed you might be just fine. It’s an easy check though, just to be sure.
Hey Michael - thanks for the kind words and for the suggestions! I’ll add leak-down test to the list. So far all of my projects are with the M8 and my Softail, but I’m up for projects on non-M8 engines as well - just need more bikes! Maybe as time progresses… :) If you want a channel sticker send me a DM on Telegram or Instagram with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
Just got a 2018 fatboy and am loving the videos. I recently noticed the bike will be dripping fuel from a fuel vent in the rear when sitting still. If I take off the gas cap completely it seems to almost stop immediately. Also Briefly read up that it’s possibly The fuel pressure regulator in those years were put in the wrong direction and have to be rotated 180 degrees. Any videos on that would be great!
Hey steviefranchize21 - thanks for the kind words and the suggestion! If you want a channel sticker send me a DM on Telegram or Instagram with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
If you're in the "Green" does that mean you never have to check it again? What I'm getting at is if you're bike is good now, can your bike out of nowhere start to have sumping issues if no other work is done on the bike? I have a 2017 to early April 2019 oil pump. Gas mileage on my bike always sucked it runs hot (by feel, not by any gauge warning) but not sure if that's due to the cat in stock header. Bike sometimes bogs down when opening it up but not sure if that's due to the generic tune I got in it. Just looking for peace of mind each time I go out on a ride and not have to worry if my bike is going to develop a sump issue at some point if it's ok now after crank sensor check. Was going to upgrade the oil pump this month just for the peace of mind. The mechanic labor rate is crazy though since the job requires all those hours to complete the pump swap. Fullsac header will be put on this week and auto tune will be done to be sure cat and tune not contributing to any felt issues.
Hey militaryminded - good question. The reality is that a sumping problem could develop at some point even if nothing is done. For example, if a piston oil jet fails. How likely is that? Hard to say, but probably / maybe not that likely? If you’re in the green, and none of the symptoms arise or worsen over time, you’re probably stable. If you’re in the green, and six months from now there’s a new symptom that develops, it’s worth checking again. Hope that helps - just my 2¢ worth. Let me know how the new exhaust and tune work out! And if you want a channel sticker send me a DM on Telegram or Instagram with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
Hey Expendable4 H00 - without a specific date, I’d say the next best thing is the sumping check. If you don’t have any sumping symptoms and you get good results with the crank sensor check, you should be good.
Hi Ron, thanks for sharing your research with us. I don't have a jack stand to get my bike vertical for this check. Do you think putting a couple boards under the jiffy stand would still be fairly accurate? Or maybe just shutting down holding bike upright and then placing on jiffy stand? Thanks!
Hey Toddao d - I had to do a similar thing. I couldn't get it 100% vertical but I got it very close. Of course, safety is the major concern with that, so make sure the bike is strapped down or somehow secure so you're not putting yourself at risk! And thanks for the encouragement!
@@RonsWorkshop Thanks Ron! I've been looking at that Drag Specialties center jack lift stand for $190...just haven't pulled the trigger on it yet. Thanks again!
I just checked my bike that i haven't rode in 5+ days, and got 7 oz of oil out of the crank sensor. My bike is a 2019 Road Glide Special....Stage IV...all HD parts. It has 11,500 miles on it. I purchased the bike in June 2019...so I assume that I have the older oil pump. Also I have the 7 yr warranty....so i don't really want to lose that. I had already ordered the parts to vent my transmission cover as per your other video. So I guess I''ll speak to my dealer and see what they have to say before I vent my trans case. I'll need it sorted before going to Sturgis as it's a 3-4000 mile trip. But in a perfect world I'd like the updated 2020 oil pump and my trans case vented before goin on a big trip. Thoughts??
Hey F1 Watcher - I believe it’s worth doing the check again after riding for 30 minutes to an hour. With the bike sitting for a while it’s likely that oil gradually drained down into the sump, so there’s a chance you got a skewed result.
Thanks I’ll do that. On my last ride it blew the o-ring on one of my air cleaner breather bolts and sprayed oil down the side of my bike….so it must be building up some pressure. I’ll change the o-ring tomorrow and then take it for a ride and check the amount of oil I get out. Thanks again 👍🏻
@@RonsWorkshop Well I took it for a 30 mile ride with a new o-ring on my air cleaner breather bolt. Popped the sensor out asap when back...and no oil came out. And my o-ring is holding up....so I'll monitor it...but looks good. I have the 7 yr extended HD warranty....so I'm not sure if I vent my transmission case what they would think of that?? Maybe I don't need to? All the parts will be in tomorrow for the DIY trans cover vent with the check valve as per your video. Guess I'll think about it. Thanks Again!!!
@@f1watcher445 That's great news!! Since you have the extended warranty you may just want to leave it as-is. If there's a problem you'd expect them to take care of it, and I've heard that it varies from dealer to dealer whether they like or don't like a crankcase venting mod. Enjoy :)
On my '2018 M8 107, I experience that oil migrates to the primary (and it seems to migrate from there to the transmission), and I sense that the bike has lost some performance, but it's hard to tell. Anyway, did this check twice and in both cases about 50 ml came out (1.7 oz.).
Hey Mark. Thanks for sharing that. That’s good news on the sumping check. I’ve heard about that oil migration issue - I think there are a couple of ways to address that. Do a bit of research and see what you can find. Please let me know what you come up with.
@@RonsWorkshop Hi Ron, thank you for reaching out. I have been researching this issue on and off for the past couple of months, and I haven't been able to find much mention of this specific migration problem. I've only found a thread on hdforums and in one of your videos on crankcase pressure and vacuum. I've also watched Kevin Baxters videos on the topic of sumping, but I haven't found the golden solution. I have measured that about 1 liter of oil transfers per 1000 km (approx. 1 qt / 600 mi), and recently it has gotten worse. So I was actually hoping that somebody here, could provide me with some insight. ;)
Hey Moha - not at all stupid! Sumping is not anything new but it’s gotten a lot of attention with the M8 motors. I haven’t worked with twin cams but I’m sure there’s a similar process for them. Regardless, the symptoms I mention at the beginning would be the same. Hope that helps!
If you don’t catch the damage in time, would it be more expensive to take corrective measures at the first sign of trouble or just wait until problems start to surface and do the mods one at a time? What is the worst that could happen if you do watchful waiting? Sorry 8f that sounds like a dumb question. I’ve already done the primary vent tube and the breather catch can and still have fluid transfer into the primary but no blow by into the air filter. Thank you.
Hey Robert - have you done the sumping check from this video or have you experienced any of the other sumping symptoms? If you’re having symptoms and you mitigate them with venting you may be ok - but then again you may not. It’s so hard to say. If the sumping gets severe it can cause significant damage. Not sure if that helps…
I have 20 fxlrs I have external breather! I'm thinking of buying Feuling dipstick or Trask trans cover! Which one should I buy (which one produces best results? if you know) I'm also about to put a 475 cam in with cam plate and pump!
Hey Joshua - I’ve heard good things about the Fueling vented dipstick and the Trask CheckM8 vented transmission top cover, so I think it comes down to preference. Be sure to check the fine print, as there is some requirement with a Trask for an oil pump that has an o-ring seal or something like that. I have heard some say they get oil blowing out the Fueling dipstick and I think their docs say to run the oil level lower than normal - but again, check their docs for details. Not sure if that helps, but that’s I’ve heard from people leaving comments. You could also do your own like I covered here: ruclips.net/video/U6gOhbRQrwE/видео.html Let me know what you decide!
Ron "Street Bob" Thornton 😂 I hear that frequently. I haven't been able to identify a pattern with which bikes have the issues, but the "old" style pump was definitely problematic, and there have been other issues with stick piston oilers, etc.
Hey RidersUnited - thanks for the kind words! I’m in sunny Florida ☀️ Stay warm up there! And if you want a sticker send me a DM on Telegram, Instagram or Signal with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
I have a question for you. Did you get a service manual from the harley store or from a different store and what kind no one will answer this question.
Hey Ron went on a binge watching all ur videos fantastic channel hey just wandering how did u attach the valve on the top transmission plate tap or just with red lock tite Cheer Dav 🇦🇺
Hey Dave - I’m so glad you’ve found the videos useful! For the transmission too cover fitting I just drilled the hole and secured it with the nut and red loctite. Another viewer tapped it with good results, but I didn’t trust my plastic cover for that. If you want a channel sticker send me a DM on Telegram or Instagram with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop (international is no problem 👍🏼)
Hi Ron , I love your channel mate . Just wanted to know if you pulled you crank sensor after you had done the transmission top cover mod / external breather mod or before ? From your other videos on both of those mods they were to help with excessive crank case pressure and limit sumping ? Thanks Darren From Australia
Hey Darren - thanks for the kind words! Yes, I had already done the transmission top cover vent before pulling the crank sensor. But I don’t believe I’ve ever had a sumping issue. I’ve never had any symptoms and the crank sensor check removed any concerns. Let me know how it goes if you give it a shot. And if you want a sticker send me a DM on Telegram, Instagram or Signal with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop (international isn’t a problem)
Thanks for the reply Ron , I will do the crank sensor in the near future and let you know the results . I have a 2018 Fat Bob 114 with stage 1 upgrade only , low mileage ( 6500 kilometres) so should be interesting to see what come out of a pretty much stock 1st generation M8 . Thanks Darren
Oh and also , the transmission top cover on my bike is cast aluminium not plastic so I was wondering what are your thoughts on me doing an external breather mod including a check valve installed before the filter/catch can ? Thanks
Hey Darren - that’s a good option. Just know that if you do the external breather mod (to divert the oil away from the throttle body) you also remove the potential for vacuum in the crankcase …but I haven’t been able to measure any vacuum generated by that. For me the crankcase vent is a definite, and the external breather mod is still worth considering because it keeps that gunk out of the throttle body. Let me know what you decide, and how it goes!
Hey Ron , yes mate I am aware of the so called vacuum created by the crankcase breathers . I am a Refrigeration mechanic and don't see how a venturi effect on 2 x ¼ inch diameter hoses would create any measurable vacuum if any . The fact that the breather pipes are also generally under positive pressure from the crank case would also negate a vacuum. For the crank case to create any significant vacuum it would need to be sealed air tight and if that was the case there would be no positive pressure build up ? Well that's my point of view anyway . I may have it all wrong but there are a lot of previous Harley engine that vented crankcase to atmosphere and no talk of vacuum issues ?
Im looking for answers, I don't know if what happened is normal and I should allow all the oil to come out or not, for now I just laid it back down and closed it up. So I have a 2020 fatboy, I've been having trouble reading the oil levels on this bike I changed the oil and put exactly 4 quarts of oil and new filter, later that day I went for a ride and checked levels, showed low on dipstik. I was frustrated and just said it can't be low I just added 4 quarts of oil and left it alone. I been riding here and there and checking level and always marks low and by that I mean like barely and oil on the bottom of dipstik. So a day ago I added more oil about 8 oz more and it marked good cold which is about half way. Went for a short drive came back and marked low again, at this point I'm pissed and baffled. Where's the oil going? So this morning I decided to run this test, I got everything ready, drive into town and back about 30 minutes total and some traffic where bike got good and hot, too hot I think, drive into garage and shut off bike took out the sensor and a small stream started coming out not even 2 oz so I'm thinking ok not bad, so then it stopped dropping and I said I wonder what would happen if I sit the bike up straight, it's on the jiffy leaning towards the jiffy, and omfg, a huge stream started coming out and I got scared and laid it back down and put sensor back on. I didn't even let it all come out because I didn't know if that was the oil from the engine and I'm just emptying it out or what the hell Is happening. So I need help, should I let all the oil empty out? Is it supposed to be coming out like that? Is that normal? Wtf is happening? Please any help would be greatly appreciated!
Ron, why not remove the crank case plug instead..and maybe grind the plug shorter while its out (it tends to extend too deep into the engine case and blocks/dams up the crank case oil level, holding addition oil depth the pump isnt able to reach to pull out..see Fueling's Shortly Plug for more detail on the problem and solution)..i simply grinded mine shorter by 2mm while checking oil retention in my case.
Hey ut1004bp - that's worth considering! I'm not sure if the expected results would be different when pulling the crankcase plug, but the modification to the crankcase plug seems to be simple and very beneficial. Have you done that mod?
@@RonsWorkshop yes sir, I measure mine, and I determined it extended about 2 threads deeper than the case thickness.. This sump plug I believe sits lower in the case than the crank position sensor..i guessing I drained 5-6 ounces but didn't get to it quickly after shutdown..just did it while doing an oil change..
Hi, if 10 minutes have gone by before you get the sensor out does that area fill with oil or should it remain virtually empty? I pulled the sensor and had at least 8 ounces of oil. I had just done a successful compression and leak down test one week prior after an over heating issue.
Hey FunHumanUSA - How long did it take? The 10 minutes is a guideline, but I'm not sure of a hard cutoff for the time. At some point oil will drain back down into the sump, but again, I'm not sure how long that would take. It took me a little bit more than 10 minutes too.
@@RonsWorkshop I got an easy 8oz after 20 minutes. This is a 2021, I have suspected this issue. I've had the symptoms multiple times after 45-60 minute high speed runs. All noise (exhaust) no acceleration. Engine running about 250 degrees.
@@RonsWorkshop Questionable, did a SE 131 kit plus after market cam, tune, exhaust. 159hp 162tq if I have to pay for a oil pump and install I am OK with it. I just want the bike right. Just replaced faulty water pump last week (warranty). The bike had gotten hot so I had them do a leak down and compression test. Perfect results, bike has been running perfect. Maybe the oil pump gasket was not installed correctly during my build? HD's newest, not talk of them being faulty. I'll ride it tomorrow and see how it feels.
I’m with you on that - wanting it right! Maybe it is something simple like that. I’d expect your bike to have the updated oil pump. If so, the pump itself should be fine. Let me know how it goes!
Hey Zach - quite possibly. The reason it should be done immediately after shutting it down is so that no oil drains back down into the sump. The idea is to measure what’s left in the sump with normal oil pump operation.
Good to know, I am an idiot and just pulled it cold while on the jiffy stand…. And oil started pouring out. Haha next time I will actually listen to the instructions. 😂
What year is your bike? I have a 2020 fatboy 114 and I'm getting mixed readings on the dip stick when checking oil levels, yesterday I changed the oil, took it out for a ride came back and oil level was good or I'm not sure. On the manual it says when hot oil will be to top of dip stick, when cold oil will be in the middle and you need to add if it's at the bottom. Well when it's hot I'm getting readings in the middle of dipstick, I had just changed oil and I know I out 4 quarts so I figure we'll that's a good level, but today I drive it around a bit cause I'm trying to get my clutch where I like it and checked the oil and it's a little less than half the dip stick and I'm like wtf man, why am I getting readings all over the place. So now I'm thinking we'll maybe I got this sumping issue? I've never owned a Harley before so idk how this oil thing is supposed to mark on a motorcycle. Need help please!
Hey Val - mine is 2019. It does seem strange that you’re getting erratic readings, but your bike should have the upgraded oil pump. Have you done the sumping check yet? It’s easy and probably worth doing. Let me know!
@@RonsWorkshop I just did this to my bike and I don't know if i should be pissed or confused or both. So I followed your rules came back and took out the sensor and it started leaking oil while leaned on the jiffy once it stopped I straightened the bike and omfg a whole lot of oil came out
@@RonsWorkshop once I saw all that oil coming out I immediately put it back on jiffy and it stopped. I'm so worried right now, I just bought this bike, I'm pissed man. I need answers
@@RonsWorkshop It seems to run out of power at highway speeds and MPG goes down a lot. I've already put in the A1 breather dipstick and done a breather mod inside the A/C to help, but now this seems to be getting worse. It's a 2019 FLHTK and according to HD, it doesn't have the 2020 model pump. Born on date is Feb 19 vs all after June 2019 for the new oil pump.
Just stumbled on ur channel it’s great just like to ask u I’ve got a 2021 114 streetbob do u think I should vent the crank case even though I’ve got the updated pump 🇦🇺
Hey Dave - thanks for the kind words! I’m a fan of crankcase venting in general, based on what I’ve learned. Even without sumping these M8 motors can have significant crankcase pressure. In the video I did where I tried to measure crankcase vacuum, I used a plastic bag over the vent hose and you can see how it inflates - and I don’t have a sumping problem. It’s worth considering but don’t sweat it. You can find that video in the playlist I linked to in this video description. Hope that helps! And if you want a channel sticker send me a DM on Telegram or Instagram with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
My 2018 ran fine oil light came on then off next day it would fire but wont run and its throwing oil pressure switch code for high pressure put new filter and oil still wont run will that switch not let your bike run
Hey Ken - I’m not sure - unfortunately I haven’t worked with that trouble code. If I come across anything I will add a new reply. Let me know if you learn anything.
I'm honestly surprised there isn't a drain plug built into the crank case. Even if sumping wasn't an issue, that seems like a massive oversight on Harleys part.
I believe the reason the crank sensor is a good indicator is because it's higher up. I guess there will always be some amount of oil behind the sump plug, but if gets high enough to come out of the crank sensor hole there could be a problem.
Hey Ron so u put a nut on the inside of the tranny cover to tighten down the breather with red locktite pity it’s plastic if it was metal I could have tapped it cheers
Hey Tom rebel - thanks for the suggestion! I’ll put that on the list. You can see it in detail and hear it on my Stage III video if you want to check it out, but I like your suggestion of a a separate video for that. The Stage III video was only my second one ever, so you’ll have to put up with the “early days” 🤪 ruclips.net/video/Vp9SMTqZOBA/видео.html
@@RonsWorkshop Oh yes, I still have your stickers all over my toolbox. 😎 I’m a bit afraid to check my sumping state on my bike, it’s a 2018 - the worst year possible for an M8. I’ll definitely get a new oil pump in the future.
Yeah I hear you. Sometimes “ignorance is bliss” but if there is sumping, it can really cause damage. And be encouraged that’s it’s not all of the bikes. It’s just when there is a combination of factors that come together - like a bad piston oiler, etc.
As I understand it, it has to do with how high up the check point is and how quickly the oil drains. Checking at a higher level accounts for all of that.
I haven't heard any definitive reports. One challenge is if there was a sumping problem before getting the new pump., there could be engine damage that can cause sumping even after the pump swap.
Hey NK Bobcat - front-right corner of the oil pan facing forward. The part number is 32700048 - you can probably do as a diagram if you search with that. Let me know if that helps!
Total Seal Top Ring just about eliminates Crankcase Pressure on a new build... So if you rebuild often... No puke can needed!!! (Industrial Engineering, BS, BC, AC, ASE Master Mechanic... Retired!!!) If you do use a Vacuum in your Crankcase you DO NEED the Total Seal top or second ring (The Vacuum helps with Cylinder Lubrication & a longer lasting ring endurance profile)... ;-) Happy Race Day!!!
@@RonsWorkshop I'm just a ole tool left on the Bench and Love to see guys still out there building relationships with todays Kids!!! (I adopted 3 Girls, had 3 Girls Biologically and finished raising 2 twin Girls until they graduated High School) That was 8 Girls and not a Boy in the bunch to Go Kart or do Mini Bikes with... But I built a ton of Engines for Race & Street Rods!!! Out of everything I did I miss those Kids the most!!! ;-) Keep up the Good work, you lucky dog!!!
Thanks Lonnie, and good work raising all those kids. Blessed is the man whose quiver is full of them! And if you want a sticker send me a DM on Telegram, Instagram or Signal with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
Dude no you’re wrong if any oil comes out of there at all a year already in the red with the plug out you can have 4 to 6 ounces of oil in the crankcase still and nothing coming out of the crank case sensor
@@RonsWorkshop I've had 2 Twin Cams. A Softail and a Street Glide over the last 20 years. They're dry sump to create compactness, and it just doesn't work. The M8 is just as troublesome. HD buyers accept this and throw thousands of dollars to correct what cannot be corrected with defective HD components and a multi piece crank. My solution is now a DCT Wing, and I can't be more pleased as it's incredible.
Hey Dan - yeah it’s annoying. I wish HD would have done a recall & replacement on those early oil pumps. There have also been issues with failing piston jets from what I’ve heard and seen.
That I don't know...but...I believe the reason the crank sensor is a good indicator is because it's higher up. I guess there will always be some amount of oil behind the sump plug, but if gets high enough to come out of the crank sensor hole there could be a problem. DK Custom says 4-8 oz. from the sump plug, but I can't attest to the accuracy of that.
I got a 2018 with glide had a 107 in it and I mean it would get up to 350° according to Power Vision I have a 131 I put in about a year and a half ago and it’s the same thing about 350° in 85° weather 70° weather 90° weather it’s 320 to 360° according to Power Vision… but yet when I take a physical reading from a temp, it reads in the 200 range on the heads on that clutch side spark plugs
Does sumping have impact on heat? Both my 107 and 130 heat up as high as 350 to 370 get while driving it will get up to about 320-330 sitting in traffic it gets up to like I said 352 370… this is on the engine temperature PowerVision reading… yet when I take a thermal temp gun pull the trigger it shows me @194-297front - rear… this is at the clutch side plugs
Hey Heavy Metal - the hose barb is some weird thread pitch but pretty close to 1/8 NPT. I think I used 3/16” ID tubing but if I do it again I’ll use at least 1/4”.
What about the: Milwaukee-Eight Shorty Feuling Sump Plug? The Shorty Plug is 0.265 Tall vs. OEM 0.465. Unblocks Scavenge Port Reduces Chance of Sumping Better Oil Level Readings
@@RonsWorkshop I ordered it I’ll play the MLB a few weeks then I’ll take the stock one and I might put it down to .250… And see what that one will do, but I think that would be cutting it to the edge …
@@RonsWorkshop give me some time on it and we will see also I did a 2” tank lift and 5/8” rear tank lift so more air would come over the heads and replacing the rear tank lift with either 3/4” or 1” lift see how that works as well.
Have you pulled the crank sensor on your Milwaukee Eight? How much oil did you get? Do you have any other sumping symptoms? Let me know!
Have you seen this video? I would think if the breather bypass needed vacuum he would have mentioned it.
Good job on your videos. 👍
ruclips.net/video/LoVuOuhFvDs/видео.html
@@justinpoleski9292 sorry for the delay - RUclips held this comment for review and I just saw it. Yes, I had seen Doc's video as well. It probably boils down to no oil without vacuum better than oil with a vacuum. Maybe? I'm about to publish the catch can video where I use the crankcase breather, external breather mod, and vacuum all at the same time. I got some interesting and promising results.
Did an impulse buy from a dealer in Chilliwack BC of a used 17 Street Glide Special with 3900 km. Had bike shipped and upon arrival noted oil level was down a quart. Found 14 oz oil after pulling crank sensor.
Hey David - was the 14 oz. after riding for a little while? That’s quite a bit. Does the bike have any other sumping symptoms?
@@RonsWorkshop Removed bike from shipping crate and went 20 ft in first gear into my garage. Wanted to check fluids first, before first ride, - noticed the low oil level. Did a google search. Found your video and removed sensor to which 14 oz plus poured out. Will be contacting Harley Canada. Has only been started once in my possession.
I have a new to me 2017 CVO Limited. I just changed the stock crankcase sump screw to the Feuling short sump screw. I did this immediately after a 40 minute ride on the freeway. It drained 150ml or 5.1 ounces. I’m going to check this again when I change the oil to see if the shorter screw made an improvement. 😊Changing the oil pump out to the 2020 is one of the first upgrades I plan to make.
Thanks for sharing that info! Let me know how the second check goes.
thanks for the tips gonna do a 2nd ride today and pull again when i get back and measure
When I first got my used 2018 fatboy with the 114 there was oil under the air cleaner than thanks to this channel i put the trans cover breather on and it worked but I used to get a small puddle of oil under the breather filter after every ride
This winter I put a S&S 128 big bore and ss 475 cam and oil pump with lifters what a difference!!!!
I've only did 400 miles breaking in the eng and no oil at all coming out the breather or air cleaner
Hey Metalmachine467 - it sounds like a beast! Thanks for sharing that! Did you keep the transmission top cover vent with the new motor?
Hey Ron, Check for sumping with the crank sensor is very interesting. This gives me ideas on some of the things I can do after I get the 2018 Limited out of winter storage. Thanks for your output on maintaining the M8 engine.
I’m so glad it was helpful! Let me know how it goes…
"Sumping in the way she moves..."
I haven't check to see if my 2018 fatboy was sumping but am putting a ss 475 cam in it with a new oil pump so hopefully I won't have that problem
But I've done the breather mod that I've learned on your channel and works flawless
My air cleaner isn't oily any more thank you
Nice! Let me know how it goes and how you like it. I’m glad the breather worked out!
Hi Ron, Wifey has a 2020FXLR. Open air cleaner, short shots, Vance tuner. When she is hard on the throttle
and I am behind her I can smell oil. I suspect the breather tubes putting too much oil into the intake but I haven't looked at it yet. I think I will be doing your trans cover vent either way. I was just gonna buy the Trask. But 350$? Na. Any way on the current awesome vid with the crank sensor, why does the engine have to be hot? I mean if you run it blast around, watch some Ron's workshop vids then check it won't the oil still be in the crank sump? Maybe I am missing something. Thanks. you da man.
Hey again brianlampman - first off, thanks for the kind words! For the bike being hot - you want to catch it as close to operating conditions as possible. If it sits for a while I believe oil will gradually drain back down into the sump, which could throw off the results.
Thanks for the update, just changed my 2018 heritage to the 8 lope , had to upgrade the cam while I was in the cam chest .had over 6 0z in the drain pan
Thanks for the info! 44% increase in scavenging is definintely significant between the old and new pumps! What cam did you go with? I love it - "had to" upgrade the cam while you were in there. I'd do the same!
@@RonsWorkshop I did the woods 22x and bassani road rage . waiting on the parts to do the trans vent like you did .
Nice! I’ve heard good things about Bassani exhaust for the M8s. Let me know how the crankcase vent goes.
@@RonsWorkshop I also "had to" upgrade the cam (SE Torque) when I replaced the oild pump (did that "just in case") ;-)
Right on!
Great, I look forward to other videos. My adult step son (45) just bought his second twin cam and I currently own a Vrod, a 65 Pan on a rigid frame and an 883 Sportster low for his Mother. He's not really familiar with motorcycles mechanically so I've been boning up on their known problems and major week spots. He just bought his second twin cam (a 2009 I believe) and I don't want him to be at the mercy of some of the local shops though some of the friends he rides with are very knowledgeable I have seen him get 2 bearings replaced on his front wheel and pay 40.00 a piece and 120.00 dollars to install them and they screwed one of those by pulling it with the chine past the bearing and damaging the retaining cup, they returned the wheel with the bearing 1/4 inch out from flush with the hub and noted this on the invoice and still charged him as if there wasn't an issue. I have a bearing puller kit and we extracted it and used a punch and a dremel tool to repair and clean up the bearing cup. I look forward to to every thing you have now and in the future. I'm retired now (a licensed industrial master electrician) 68 years old. and most of the old friends that showed me the ropes since the late 70's have died or moved 100 and more miles away. So I will be an avid viewer especially this winter. The wife and I have many summer interests so I'll be doing my research in the winter. And since the last grandchild moved out, in the living room (the garage has no heat) I'll be changing the triple tree on the v-rod from a 4 degree to a 2 degree to increase the effective trail and allow it to be more stable at higher speeds and not tend to flop at very slow speeds getting out of the neighborhood. If I'm ambitious enough I want to install an 04 Deuce front end on our Pan-head and have a real disk brake on the front. It gets a bit dangerous out hear in Maryland not far from Washington Thanks again and maybe see you on the road some day. Mike
The garage is full! It’s unfortunate that there are shops that do shoddy work and won’t make good on it. Like you said - it’s good motivation to keep learning and tackle those things ourselves.
Great video! Is the rush to complete this in one minute to keep oil from leaking into the sump?
Yes, you essentially want it to be as close to running conditions as possible, without oil draining down.
I did this exact same check after I got done with a weekend trip which was roughly 550 miles. Check my oil level ( cold check) and it was on the bottom dimples of the side stand check. When I pulled my crank sensor out I got exactly 4 ounces. Before my trip I asked my local mechanic about the M8 problems and he talked about the oil pump issue, he sold me a feuling Vented dip stick a year ago . about two months ago I installed a DK customs external breather kit which he told me to take off immediately because It would do more harm to my engine. I’ve been asking around and nobody else has said the external breather kit is a bad thing. I will say I think I am getting a lot of blow by though because my catch can does collect a good amount of moisture and the nasty oil mist after about 100 miles. My bike is an 18 FLHXS with 11,500 miles with a stage one kit only
Hey HR Slick - yeah I’m curious why he said to remove the external breather mod. I’m aware of the notion that those ports that vent into the throttle body supposedly allow for crankcase vacuum but I haven’t been able to detect any vacuum from that.
@@RonsWorkshop the vacume is so minimal.
Hey Steven - I agree. I haven’t been able to measure any.
@@RonsWorkshop the m8 tubes is rediculously small
My m8 sumped last sunday. 19 electraglide standard. Just turned 10k miles. Did 200 miles that day, On the way home i took the highway and set the cruise at 70. Went 10 exits down and started losing power and also noticed an oil burning smell. Pulled over she was in parade mode so it was active, Pulled the stick on with bike on the "jiffy stand" and i was missing a quart of oil and was also burnt smelling. I always do pre ride checks and i check oil before and when the bike is hot at a gas up stop always use amsoil in everything i drive specially all my bikes oil, primary, trans. Not many miles on the bike and I was excited this year because i was going to be able to seriously ride this year. I was a few weeks away from doing the popular cam chest upgrade. But now the motor is hurt ive yet to.pull compression and leakdown tests on it but it runs rough and I changed the oil theres little pieces of shiny metal in there guessing thats the cam ground down to the babbitt metal and fresh ground lifter. Was going to try to go for a ride after the oil change but the oil immediately gets aerated. Just sharing my experience here. I already have all the cam chest parts so im gonna open her up and take a look hopefully the leak down test is not shown to be excessive .
Hey Mark - that’s rough! Thanks for sharing that, and please do give an update once you dove in. I wish you the best as you tackle it!
@@RonsWorkshop Hi Ron heres an update on my m8 sumping. I pulled the crank sensor and 2 quarts of oil approximately came out . So I changed the oil as well started the bike and it ran good but the camchest was a little ticky. So it smoked a little and cleared up, I had a hunch that it sumping plus me adding oil to replaced the missing oil just washed the rings out in the front cylinder? I replaced every thing in the camchest with a Redshift cam kit from fuel moto that i had and installed the m8 drag specialties pump with a new harley camplate. So i finished the bike today, did another oil and filter change before firing it up and noted at least 6 quarts of oil filled the pan. It was chock full of oil. It was running rough because of all the oil sloshing around in the crankcase. Im thinking i lucked out, took it for a 137 mile test ride today and it ran great. Im sure in the future maybe winter time that the top end will need attention as ive seen many stories of oil consumption problems at 9 to 10 k. We shall see. The camplate journals where the cam and crank rides got scored up and the lifter bores looked a little worn but nothing major. Hopefully it wil keep running good ill post another update.
Hey Mark - thanks for sharing that update! Sounds like she has a few battle scars but I’m glad to hear she’s running well now. I hope you can log some great miles this riding season.
And if you want a sticker send me a DM on Telegram, Instagram or Signal with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
Guess I’m going to have to check mine now lol I may be a hypochondriac or paranoid when it comes to this stuff, but I do feel like not getting passed the 200 miles on a tank mark even when not “hot dogging” it, this may be the next thing to check since I already verified the tune was good to go, plugs were fine, no intake leaks, and no codes. Much appreciated on the content!!!
Hey Ron - yeah, I get it. Fortunately this is a simple check to do. Let me know how it goes, and thanks for the kind words!
Hey bro, I did it and had the same like you, almost spend the $370 on the trans cover.
Mine is a 2020 Road Glide special
Hey George - that’s great! Glad it worked out.
I’ve got an 18 FLSB that has recently started using a boat load of oil, almost doubling its consumption from about 1/2qt every 1000 miles to 1/2qt every 450 miles. Seeing oil getting into air cleaner and on the right side of the bike. After hitting up a mechanic on RUclips (Doc Harley) who suggested pulling the CKP I did. After riding for about 30 minutes I got the sensor out within about 90 seconds of shutting bike off with it secured in my Condor chock. Only got 2 drops out. So I don’t think sumping is the issue. Hoping that it’s something silly, like just the breathers are over saturated and are allowing excess oil of of them.
Yeah that’s a lot of oil consumption - I hope it’s an easy fix!
I have a 2018 Heritage Softail Classic, bought it used with 2K miles in June 2022. It has some light mods, V&H shotguns and S&S air filter mod, nothing else as far as I am aware. I have no idea if this has been addressed. My local HD shops can’t be trusted. I’ve gone in with a simple oil change and walk out with a fkn laundry list of sh!t that needs to be “fixed” on the bike. Sorry to tell you, the dude I bought it from put about 500 miles per year on the bike.. it has zero issues. At any rate, so, I’ll be doing this check myself. Can you recommend a good work stand for the bike.
Hey Looper Trooper - I don't have any good work stand recommendations. The one I have is a cheap one that is just "ok". But let me know what you find and let me know how the check goes!
Did that same crank sensor check on my 19rg last yr. Only got a couple of drops of oil. Have the older pump also, but have an s&s 475c cam chest kit to put in this winter. That will give me some more punch, and upgrade the pump at the same time.
Hey Fltrx19rider - that’s great! I bet that cam swap will be nice and the oil pump upgrade will be the cherry on top!
@@RonsWorkshop Yes, some added peace of mind. Bike is a stage 1 now, have a krome werks aggressor header to go with the cam. Just haven’t done the work yet. Live in Fl. Too hot in my garage during the summer. Waitin til fall/winter when it’s a bit cooler.
@@fltrx19rider14 I'm up in Jacksonville ☀
@@RonsWorkshop St. Augustine.
We’re neighbors!
What is your manufacture date on the frame?
Thanks Ron luv the way u walk us through ur projects ur channel is brilliant I can see this hobby of urs exploding when people jump on ur channel
My pleasure - so glad you find it helpful!
I have a 2024 TRI Glide Ultra, will venting the Crank case void my warranty? Do I need to install a one way valve on a crank case breather system??
Thanks man for your time.
I think the warranty question varies by dealer I have no idea what the MoCo says. I’ll also say that the newer bikes should have these issues mostly or completely addressed. I’ve also heard that the newer bikes have a crankcase vent from the factory but I haven’t seen it firsthand.
I hope anyone considering buying a Harley sees this video before they buy.
Buying a 2018,19 Harley
Heh Ron I messaged you a while ago got almost 8 oz was running Red Line 20-50 changed to conventional Harley 20-50 have since rode the bike 200 miles checked the crank sensor again got maybe a teaspoon I might have been running the oil a little full .its running good and I believe a little quieter .Will keep an eye on it thanks a lot for the videos .
Hey Ken - yeah I remember the 8 oz. Glad to hear it’s looking better. Thanks for the info and the kind words!
Damn. Have not had an issue with this until now. Just changed all my fluids to red line (about 2-3 months ago) and now my Arlen Ness air filter is dripping oil. Do you think I should switch back to harley conventional before drilling into my transmission cover?
Hey Jesse - Tough call. Those fluids aren’t cheap! It does make me wonder though, since it didn’t start until you switched. And it sounds like Ken had issues after switching as well. Might just be worth it to switch back and see how it goes. Let me know what you decide and how it goes.
Ron can you confirm why all pre May 2019 don't have sumping issues? If the oil pump design is the cause, I would expect that sumping would be on all older oil pumps.
Hey Jeff - no, I don’t know why it’s not an issue on every one of the bikes. If you come across anything, please let me know.
Oh also meant to add a big thanks for doing these videos!!
Very informative!!
Thanks!!
Thanks for the kind words! And if you want a sticker send me a DM on Telegram, Instagram or Signal with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
Hay does this happen to all or just some of have 28000 on my 2018 ultra limited just wondering if it's going to let me sit some where
Hey Gary - no it’s not all bikes. Some have it and some don’t. There are different causes so there no one single answer or solution. If you don’t have any of the symptoms I listed you might be just fine. It’s an easy check though, just to be sure.
Just found you I like this stuff already. Could you show a leak down test and do you have any videos or planing on any for other engines?
Hey Michael - thanks for the kind words and for the suggestions! I’ll add leak-down test to the list. So far all of my projects are with the M8 and my Softail, but I’m up for projects on non-M8 engines as well - just need more bikes! Maybe as time progresses… :)
If you want a channel sticker send me a DM on Telegram or Instagram with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
Just got a 2018 fatboy and am loving the videos. I recently noticed the bike will be dripping fuel from a fuel vent in the rear when sitting still. If I take off the gas cap completely it seems to almost stop immediately. Also Briefly read up that it’s possibly The fuel pressure regulator in those years were put in the wrong direction and have to be rotated 180 degrees. Any videos on that would be great!
Hey steviefranchize21 - thanks for the kind words and the suggestion!
If you want a channel sticker send me a DM on Telegram or Instagram with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
@@RonsWorkshop will do 👍🏼
If you're in the "Green" does that mean you never have to check it again? What I'm getting at is if you're bike is good now, can your bike out of nowhere start to have sumping issues if no other work is done on the bike? I have a 2017 to early April 2019 oil pump. Gas mileage on my bike always sucked it runs hot (by feel, not by any gauge warning) but not sure if that's due to the cat in stock header. Bike sometimes bogs down when opening it up but not sure if that's due to the generic tune I got in it. Just looking for peace of mind each time I go out on a ride and not have to worry if my bike is going to develop a sump issue at some point if it's ok now after crank sensor check. Was going to upgrade the oil pump this month just for the peace of mind. The mechanic labor rate is crazy though since the job requires all those hours to complete the pump swap. Fullsac header will be put on this week and auto tune will be done to be sure cat and tune not contributing to any felt issues.
Hey militaryminded - good question. The reality is that a sumping problem could develop at some point even if nothing is done. For example, if a piston oil jet fails. How likely is that? Hard to say, but probably / maybe not that likely? If you’re in the green, and none of the symptoms arise or worsen over time, you’re probably stable. If you’re in the green, and six months from now there’s a new symptom that develops, it’s worth checking again. Hope that helps - just my 2¢ worth.
Let me know how the new exhaust and tune work out!
And if you want a channel sticker send me a DM on Telegram or Instagram with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
Thank you for the video. My manufacture date says 5/19. Is there any way to know if that is after the 5/22/19 date?
Hey Expendable4 H00 - without a specific date, I’d say the next best thing is the sumping check. If you don’t have any sumping symptoms and you get good results with the crank sensor check, you should be good.
Hi Ron, thanks for sharing your research with us. I don't have a jack stand to get my bike vertical for this check. Do you think putting a couple boards under the jiffy stand would still be fairly accurate? Or maybe just shutting down holding bike upright and then placing on jiffy stand? Thanks!
Hey Toddao d - I had to do a similar thing. I couldn't get it 100% vertical but I got it very close. Of course, safety is the major concern with that, so make sure the bike is strapped down or somehow secure so you're not putting yourself at risk!
And thanks for the encouragement!
@@RonsWorkshop Thanks Ron! I've been looking at that Drag Specialties center jack lift stand for $190...just haven't pulled the trigger on it yet. Thanks again!
I just checked my bike that i haven't rode in 5+ days, and got 7 oz of oil out of the crank sensor.
My bike is a 2019 Road Glide Special....Stage IV...all HD parts.
It has 11,500 miles on it.
I purchased the bike in June 2019...so I assume that I have the older oil pump.
Also I have the 7 yr warranty....so i don't really want to lose that.
I had already ordered the parts to vent my transmission cover as per your other video.
So I guess I''ll speak to my dealer and see what they have to say before I vent my trans case.
I'll need it sorted before going to Sturgis as it's a 3-4000 mile trip.
But in a perfect world I'd like the updated 2020 oil pump and my trans case vented before goin on a big trip.
Thoughts??
Hey F1 Watcher - I believe it’s worth doing the check again after riding for 30 minutes to an hour. With the bike sitting for a while it’s likely that oil gradually drained down into the sump, so there’s a chance you got a skewed result.
Thanks
I’ll do that. On my last ride it blew the o-ring on one of my air cleaner breather bolts and sprayed oil down the side of my bike….so it must be building up some pressure.
I’ll change the o-ring tomorrow and then take it for a ride and check the amount of oil I get out.
Thanks again 👍🏻
@@RonsWorkshop Well I took it for a 30 mile ride with a new o-ring on my air cleaner breather bolt.
Popped the sensor out asap when back...and no oil came out.
And my o-ring is holding up....so I'll monitor it...but looks good.
I have the 7 yr extended HD warranty....so I'm not sure if I vent my transmission case what they would think of that??
Maybe I don't need to?
All the parts will be in tomorrow for the DIY trans cover vent with the check valve as per your video.
Guess I'll think about it.
Thanks Again!!!
@@f1watcher445 That's great news!! Since you have the extended warranty you may just want to leave it as-is. If there's a problem you'd expect them to take care of it, and I've heard that it varies from dealer to dealer whether they like or don't like a crankcase venting mod. Enjoy :)
@@RonsWorkshop Thanks will do!
Another amazing video. Thank you!!
Thanks for the feedback, Nathan!
On my '2018 M8 107, I experience that oil migrates to the primary (and it seems to migrate from there to the transmission), and I sense that the bike has lost some performance, but it's hard to tell.
Anyway, did this check twice and in both cases about 50 ml came out (1.7 oz.).
Hey Mark. Thanks for sharing that. That’s good news on the sumping check. I’ve heard about that oil migration issue - I think there are a couple of ways to address that. Do a bit of research and see what you can find. Please let me know what you come up with.
@@RonsWorkshop Hi Ron, thank you for reaching out.
I have been researching this issue on and off for the past couple of months, and I haven't been able to find much mention of this specific migration problem. I've only found a thread on hdforums and in one of your videos on crankcase pressure and vacuum.
I've also watched Kevin Baxters videos on the topic of sumping, but I haven't found the golden solution.
I have measured that about 1 liter of oil transfers per 1000 km (approx. 1 qt / 600 mi), and recently it has gotten worse.
So I was actually hoping that somebody here, could provide me with some insight. ;)
Hey Mark - there may be some useful info in this Doc Harley video: ruclips.net/video/QolhZGpFULQ/видео.html
2022 rg st pulled my sump plug two months ago and got a lot of oil out of it but didnt measure, im going to do again this time i will measure
Let me know how the second time goes…
@@RonsWorkshop 8 oz after 2000 miles
@timnevitt2993 yeah, that’s on the high side.
@@RonsWorkshop the first time im pretty sure there was more
Do you have any other sumping symptoms?
Good info- Thanks.
I’m so glad this was helpful! Here’s a playlist with all the videos related to crankcase venting: bit.ly/softail_sumping_playlist
This might sound stupid, is the sumping issue only happens on M8. I have a twin cam 2017 Softail.
Hey Moha - not at all stupid! Sumping is not anything new but it’s gotten a lot of attention with the M8 motors. I haven’t worked with twin cams but I’m sure there’s a similar process for them. Regardless, the symptoms I mention at the beginning would be the same. Hope that helps!
If you don’t catch the damage in time, would it be more expensive to take corrective measures at the first sign of trouble or just wait until problems start to surface and do the mods one at a time? What is the worst that could happen if you do watchful waiting? Sorry 8f that sounds like a dumb question. I’ve already done the primary vent tube and the breather catch can and still have fluid transfer into the primary but no blow by into the air filter. Thank you.
Hey Robert - have you done the sumping check from this video or have you experienced any of the other sumping symptoms? If you’re having symptoms and you mitigate them with venting you may be ok - but then again you may not. It’s so hard to say. If the sumping gets severe it can cause significant damage. Not sure if that helps…
I have 20 fxlrs I have external breather! I'm thinking of buying Feuling dipstick or Trask trans cover! Which one should I buy (which one produces best results? if you know) I'm also about to put a 475 cam in with cam plate and pump!
Hey Joshua - I’ve heard good things about the Fueling vented dipstick and the Trask CheckM8 vented transmission top cover, so I think it comes down to preference. Be sure to check the fine print, as there is some requirement with a Trask for an oil pump that has an o-ring seal or something like that. I have heard some say they get oil blowing out the Fueling dipstick and I think their docs say to run the oil level lower than normal - but again, check their docs for details. Not sure if that helps, but that’s I’ve heard from people leaving comments. You could also do your own like I covered here: ruclips.net/video/U6gOhbRQrwE/видео.html
Let me know what you decide!
@Ron's Workshop thanks for quick response! An will do thanks!
Dude you could be a stunt double for Billy Bob Thornton 😂 Great video as always but I don’t think Soft Tails have a sumping issues.
Ron "Street Bob" Thornton 😂
I hear that frequently. I haven't been able to identify a pattern with which bikes have the issues, but the "old" style pump was definitely problematic, and there have been other issues with stick piston oilers, etc.
I dig your videos, really well done. Glad you tried my dipstick vent :) where are you located? i am in Chicagoland area
Hey RidersUnited - thanks for the kind words! I’m in sunny Florida ☀️ Stay warm up there!
And if you want a sticker send me a DM on Telegram, Instagram or Signal with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
I think to get an in depth understanding you could do this but then pull sump plug and measure quantity.
Wouldn’t hurt! But I don’t the what volume to expect when pulling the sump plug. Let me know if you try it.
I have a question for you. Did you get a service manual from the harley store or from a different store and what kind no one will answer this question.
I found a PDF version of the official Harley service manual on eBay.
Great stuff.. Thanks
Next Ride MTB - thanks for the encouragement! Let me know how it goes if you do the check.
Hey Ron went on a binge watching all ur videos fantastic channel hey just wandering how did u attach the valve on the top transmission plate tap or just with red lock tite
Cheer Dav 🇦🇺
Hey Dave - I’m so glad you’ve found the videos useful! For the transmission too cover fitting I just drilled the hole and secured it with the nut and red loctite. Another viewer tapped it with good results, but I didn’t trust my plastic cover for that.
If you want a channel sticker send me a DM on Telegram or Instagram with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop (international is no problem 👍🏼)
Hey Ron so put a nut on the inside of the cover to hold the breather ?
Yep - the bulkhead fitting has a jamnut and washer. I just added the red loctite. The check valve is separate and it’s further up the line.
Hi Ron , I love your channel mate . Just wanted to know if you pulled you crank sensor after you had done the transmission top cover mod / external breather mod or before ? From your other videos on both of those mods they were to help with excessive crank case pressure and limit sumping ? Thanks Darren From Australia
Hey Darren - thanks for the kind words! Yes, I had already done the transmission top cover vent before pulling the crank sensor. But I don’t believe I’ve ever had a sumping issue. I’ve never had any symptoms and the crank sensor check removed any concerns. Let me know how it goes if you give it a shot.
And if you want a sticker send me a DM on Telegram, Instagram or Signal with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop (international isn’t a problem)
Thanks for the reply Ron , I will do the crank sensor in the near future and let you know the results . I have a 2018 Fat Bob 114 with stage 1 upgrade only , low mileage ( 6500 kilometres) so should be interesting to see what come out of a pretty much stock 1st generation M8 . Thanks Darren
Oh and also , the transmission top cover on my bike is cast aluminium not plastic so I was wondering what are your thoughts on me doing an external breather mod including a check valve installed before the filter/catch can ? Thanks
Hey Darren - that’s a good option. Just know that if you do the external breather mod (to divert the oil away from the throttle body) you also remove the potential for vacuum in the crankcase …but I haven’t been able to measure any vacuum generated by that. For me the crankcase vent is a definite, and the external breather mod is still worth considering because it keeps that gunk out of the throttle body.
Let me know what you decide, and how it goes!
Hey Ron , yes mate I am aware of the so called vacuum created by the crankcase breathers . I am a Refrigeration mechanic and don't see how a venturi effect on 2 x ¼ inch diameter hoses would create any measurable vacuum if any . The fact that the breather pipes are also generally under positive pressure from the crank case would also negate a vacuum. For the crank case to create any significant vacuum it would need to be sealed air tight and if that was the case there would be no positive pressure build up ? Well that's my point of view anyway . I may have it all wrong but there are a lot of previous Harley engine that vented crankcase to atmosphere and no talk of vacuum issues ?
Do you think I need to add that transmission plate ?
Which transmission plate?
It’s my understanding between 4 to 8 oz. Is normal. Anything above that you have a problem.
Im looking for answers, I don't know if what happened is normal and I should allow all the oil to come out or not, for now I just laid it back down and closed it up.
So I have a 2020 fatboy, I've been having trouble reading the oil levels on this bike I changed the oil and put exactly 4 quarts of oil and new filter, later that day I went for a ride and checked levels, showed low on dipstik. I was frustrated and just said it can't be low I just added 4 quarts of oil and left it alone. I been riding here and there and checking level and always marks low and by that I mean like barely and oil on the bottom of dipstik. So a day ago I added more oil about 8 oz more and it marked good cold which is about half way. Went for a short drive came back and marked low again, at this point I'm pissed and baffled. Where's the oil going? So this morning I decided to run this test, I got everything ready, drive into town and back about 30 minutes total and some traffic where bike got good and hot, too hot I think, drive into garage and shut off bike took out the sensor and a small stream started coming out not even 2 oz so I'm thinking ok not bad, so then it stopped dropping and I said I wonder what would happen if I sit the bike up straight, it's on the jiffy leaning towards the jiffy, and omfg, a huge stream started coming out and I got scared and laid it back down and put sensor back on. I didn't even let it all come out because I didn't know if that was the oil from the engine and I'm just emptying it out or what the hell Is happening.
So I need help, should I let all the oil empty out? Is it supposed to be coming out like that? Is that normal? Wtf is happening? Please any help would be greatly appreciated!
Hey Val - did you see my other reply about getting a solid baseline for the dipstick readings?
Can you provide a link to the TSB?
Hey Johnny - let me know if you can get to it with this link: bit.ly/397PF2x
I've also added it to the video description.
Good job
Thanks for the kind words! Let me know how it goes if you do the check.
Ron, why not remove the crank case plug instead..and maybe grind the plug shorter while its out (it tends to extend too deep into the engine case and blocks/dams up the crank case oil level, holding addition oil depth the pump isnt able to reach to pull out..see Fueling's Shortly Plug for more detail on the problem and solution)..i simply grinded mine shorter by 2mm while checking oil retention in my case.
Hey ut1004bp - that's worth considering! I'm not sure if the expected results would be different when pulling the crankcase plug, but the modification to the crankcase plug seems to be simple and very beneficial. Have you done that mod?
@@RonsWorkshop yes sir, I measure mine, and I determined it extended about 2 threads deeper than the case thickness.. This sump plug I believe sits lower in the case than the crank position sensor..i guessing I drained 5-6 ounces but didn't get to it quickly after shutdown..just did it while doing an oil change..
@@ut1004bp thanks for sharing that!
Hi, if 10 minutes have gone by before you get the sensor out does that area fill with oil or should it remain virtually empty? I pulled the sensor and had at least 8 ounces of oil. I had just done a successful compression and leak down test one week prior after an over heating issue.
Hey FunHumanUSA - How long did it take? The 10 minutes is a guideline, but I'm not sure of a hard cutoff for the time. At some point oil will drain back down into the sump, but again, I'm not sure how long that would take. It took me a little bit more than 10 minutes too.
@@RonsWorkshop I got an easy 8oz after 20 minutes. This is a 2021, I have suspected this issue. I've had the symptoms multiple times after 45-60 minute high speed runs. All noise (exhaust) no acceleration. Engine running about 250 degrees.
Yeah that sounds like you’ve got a sumping problem, especially with the other symptoms added to the mix. Under warranty?
@@RonsWorkshop Questionable, did a SE 131 kit plus after market cam, tune, exhaust. 159hp 162tq if I have to pay for a oil pump and install I am OK with it. I just want the bike right. Just replaced faulty water pump last week (warranty). The bike had gotten hot so I had them do a leak down and compression test. Perfect results, bike has been running perfect. Maybe the oil pump gasket was not installed correctly during my build? HD's newest, not talk of them being faulty. I'll ride it tomorrow and see how it feels.
I’m with you on that - wanting it right! Maybe it is something simple like that. I’d expect your bike to have the updated oil pump. If so, the pump itself should be fine. Let me know how it goes!
Will this work for 2017 trike free wheeler ?also
Hey Wolf Horvath - I don’t think yours has the M8 motor, and this check is specific to the M8.
If you pull this while the engine is cold will oil drain out?
Hey Zach - quite possibly. The reason it should be done immediately after shutting it down is so that no oil drains back down into the sump. The idea is to measure what’s left in the sump with normal oil pump operation.
Good to know, I am an idiot and just pulled it cold while on the jiffy stand…. And oil started pouring out. Haha next time I will actually listen to the instructions. 😂
Don’t be hard on yourself. We’re all learning!
What year is your bike? I have a 2020 fatboy 114 and I'm getting mixed readings on the dip stick when checking oil levels, yesterday I changed the oil, took it out for a ride came back and oil level was good or I'm not sure.
On the manual it says when hot oil will be to top of dip stick, when cold oil will be in the middle and you need to add if it's at the bottom. Well when it's hot I'm getting readings in the middle of dipstick, I had just changed oil and I know I out 4 quarts so I figure we'll that's a good level, but today I drive it around a bit cause I'm trying to get my clutch where I like it and checked the oil and it's a little less than half the dip stick and I'm like wtf man, why am I getting readings all over the place. So now I'm thinking we'll maybe I got this sumping issue? I've never owned a Harley before so idk how this oil thing is supposed to mark on a motorcycle. Need help please!
Hey Val - mine is 2019. It does seem strange that you’re getting erratic readings, but your bike should have the upgraded oil pump. Have you done the sumping check yet? It’s easy and probably worth doing. Let me know!
@@RonsWorkshop I just did this to my bike and I don't know if i should be pissed or confused or both. So I followed your rules came back and took out the sensor and it started leaking oil while leaned on the jiffy once it stopped I straightened the bike and omfg a whole lot of oil came out
@@RonsWorkshop should there be oil at all inside the crank case? Should I straightened it up and see how much comes out?
@@RonsWorkshop once I saw all that oil coming out I immediately put it back on jiffy and it stopped. I'm so worried right now, I just bought this bike, I'm pissed man. I need answers
Hey Val - yeah you might have something going on there.
When I put in the fueling plug, is 20oz of oil that drained, "bad" ?
That’s a lot of oil. Do you have any sumping symptoms? But I’m not sure what the guideline is with the Fueling plug.
@@RonsWorkshop It seems to run out of power at highway speeds and MPG goes down a lot. I've already put in the A1 breather dipstick and done a breather mod inside the A/C to help, but now this seems to be getting worse. It's a 2019 FLHTK and according to HD, it doesn't have the 2020 model pump. Born on date is Feb 19 vs all after June 2019 for the new oil pump.
That’s definitely suspect. If indeed it is sumping that will cause damage eventually :/
@@RonsWorkshop Thanks, I hope I caught it soon enough.
@MR_P03 let me know what you find out and how it goes. Hoping for the best!
Just stumbled on ur channel it’s great just like to ask u I’ve got a 2021 114 streetbob do u think I should vent the crank case even though I’ve got the updated pump 🇦🇺
Hey Dave - thanks for the kind words! I’m a fan of crankcase venting in general, based on what I’ve learned. Even without sumping these M8 motors can have significant crankcase pressure. In the video I did where I tried to measure crankcase vacuum, I used a plastic bag over the vent hose and you can see how it inflates - and I don’t have a sumping problem. It’s worth considering but don’t sweat it. You can find that video in the playlist I linked to in this video description. Hope that helps!
And if you want a channel sticker send me a DM on Telegram or Instagram with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
How many miles when slumping can occur?
I haven’t heard any consistent numbers. I’m at about 7700 miles with no issues.
My 2018 ran fine oil light came on then off next day it would fire but wont run and its throwing oil pressure switch code for high pressure put new filter and oil still wont run will that switch not let your bike run
Hey Ken - I’m not sure - unfortunately I haven’t worked with that trouble code. If I come across anything I will add a new reply. Let me know if you learn anything.
@@RonsWorkshop thanks just trying to figure it out before I let the dealer rape me for something simple
I'm honestly surprised there isn't a drain plug built into the crank case. Even if sumping wasn't an issue, that seems like a massive oversight on Harleys part.
Agreed!
Are these sumping issues still going on with the 2024 m8’s
I don’t believe so - they’ve made several improvements to address it. If you see any symptoms you could check further.
@@RonsWorkshopother than the redesigned oil pump what else has been changed?
@JayyBird93 I believe the newest M8 engines have crankcase ventilation from the factory, but I haven’t seen it firsthand.
You have to pull the sump plug.Its lower in the case.
I believe the reason the crank sensor is a good indicator is because it's higher up. I guess there will always be some amount of oil behind the sump plug, but if gets high enough to come out of the crank sensor hole there could be a problem.
Hey Ron so u put a nut on the inside of the tranny cover to tighten down the breather with red locktite pity it’s plastic if it was metal I could have tapped it cheers
Hey Dave - I agree completely! I was so bummed to learn it was plastic. Tapping the metal cover would be 👌🏼
Ron, you should do a walkaround of your bike. :)
Hey Tom rebel - thanks for the suggestion! I’ll put that on the list. You can see it in detail and hear it on my Stage III video if you want to check it out, but I like your suggestion of a a separate video for that.
The Stage III video was only my second one ever, so you’ll have to put up with the “early days” 🤪
ruclips.net/video/Vp9SMTqZOBA/видео.html
@@RonsWorkshop Your video/audio quality progressed so much since, I wish you many more subscribers!
@@rebel_ltz Thanks so much! And I forgot you had commented on the Stage III previsouly. But I definitely like the idea of a new walkaround vid.
@@RonsWorkshop Oh yes, I still have your stickers all over my toolbox. 😎 I’m a bit afraid to check my sumping state on my bike, it’s a 2018 - the worst year possible for an M8. I’ll definitely get a new oil pump in the future.
Yeah I hear you. Sometimes “ignorance is bliss” but if there is sumping, it can really cause damage. And be encouraged that’s it’s not all of the bikes. It’s just when there is a combination of factors that come together - like a bad piston oiler, etc.
Why not just pull the 1/4" Allen plug on the very bottom of the crankcase? I believe that's what its there for.
As I understand it, it has to do with how high up the check point is and how quickly the oil drains. Checking at a higher level accounts for all of that.
Has anyone found their bike sumps even after an aftermarket oil pump?
I haven't heard any definitive reports. One challenge is if there was a sumping problem before getting the new pump., there could be engine damage that can cause sumping even after the pump swap.
Great video but for the life of me I can't find a drawing that shows where that darn sensor is.
Hey NK Bobcat - front-right corner of the oil pan facing forward. The part number is 32700048 - you can probably do as a diagram if you search with that. Let me know if that helps!
So many issues. Does the M8 suck?
Hey Juan - lol good question. Mine is rock solid and I love it. But the sumping issue has been a real problem for some.
Sounds like Harley should recall and fix this issue. Thanks for the info!
Just tested my 2019 and got 4oz
Good news!
You showed the cps for like a second and no clear indication of where it is. I had to do further research.
Hey MrGbustamante - sorry I didn’t make that more clear. Let me know how the check goes!
Total Seal Top Ring just about eliminates Crankcase Pressure on a new build... So if you rebuild often... No puke can needed!!! (Industrial Engineering, BS, BC, AC, ASE Master Mechanic... Retired!!!) If you do use a Vacuum in your Crankcase you DO NEED the Total Seal top or second ring (The Vacuum helps with Cylinder Lubrication & a longer lasting ring endurance profile)... ;-) Happy Race Day!!!
Hey Lonnie - thanks for sharing that info!
@@RonsWorkshop I'm just a ole tool left on the Bench and Love to see guys still out there building relationships with todays Kids!!! (I adopted 3 Girls, had 3 Girls Biologically and finished raising 2 twin Girls until they graduated High School) That was 8 Girls and not a Boy in the bunch to Go Kart or do Mini Bikes with... But I built a ton of Engines for Race & Street Rods!!! Out of everything I did I miss those Kids the most!!! ;-) Keep up the Good work, you lucky dog!!!
Thanks Lonnie, and good work raising all those kids. Blessed is the man whose quiver is full of them!
And if you want a sticker send me a DM on Telegram, Instagram or Signal with the mailing info @RonsWorkshop
Dude no you’re wrong if any oil comes out of there at all a year already in the red with the plug out you can have 4 to 6 ounces of oil in the crankcase still and nothing coming out of the crank case sensor
Hey Scott - thanks for the input on this. It can be difficult to get solid info. One this is for sure - less is better in this case!
Harley using their customers for validation. Piss poor engine design, but their customers insist on buying junk, so that's what HD sells them.
Hey Mark - what bikes / engines do you prefer?
@@RonsWorkshop I've had 2 Twin Cams. A Softail and a Street Glide over the last 20 years. They're dry sump to create compactness, and it just doesn't work. The M8 is just as troublesome. HD buyers accept this and throw thousands of dollars to correct what cannot be corrected with defective HD components and a multi piece crank. My solution is now a DCT Wing, and I can't be more pleased as it's incredible.
@@markman7 Honda precision & reliability!
I can tell you a sure way to avoid
Do tell…
@@RonsWorkshop Buy an Indian. Only jokes, just being full of crap. Your videos are helpful 😎
Spend $20k to $45k for a motorcycle and deal with this bs; ridiculous !
Hey Dan - yeah it’s annoying. I wish HD would have done a recall & replacement on those early oil pumps. There have also been issues with failing piston jets from what I’ve heard and seen.
M
Hey John - your comment didn’t come through. Please try again.
@@RonsWorkshop sorry was a mistake but keep up the great videos etc. I own a 2020 Street Bob and enjoy your work. Thanks
Thanks John, will do!
Harley Davidson should be responsible for manufacturing junk selling it to the public and shrugging their shoulders if even that.
Hey ML Greer - Yeah it seems like a factory recall is warranted for something as widespread as the sumping problems.
I get 300-316 Engine temps VIA power vision readings
Thanks for sharing that info! I’d like to get something for reading the engine temps. Add it to the list!
Same and in SoCal
How about removing the sump plug it? What would you get out of that if you’re not sumping or if you are sumping
That I don't know...but...I believe the reason the crank sensor is a good indicator is because it's higher up. I guess there will always be some amount of oil behind the sump plug, but if gets high enough to come out of the crank sensor hole there could be a problem. DK Custom says 4-8 oz. from the sump plug, but I can't attest to the accuracy of that.
I got a 2018 with glide had a 107 in it and I mean it would get up to 350° according to Power Vision I have a 131 I put in about a year and a half ago and it’s the same thing about 350° in 85° weather 70° weather 90° weather it’s 320 to 360° according to Power Vision… but yet when I take a physical reading from a temp, it reads in the 200 range on the heads on that clutch side spark plugs
That is puzzling. It seems like PowerVision would be reliable but that’s a big difference. Let me know what you find out.
Does sumping have impact on heat? Both my 107 and 130 heat up as high as 350 to 370 get while driving it will get up to about 320-330 sitting in traffic it gets up to like I said 352 370… this is on the engine temperature PowerVision reading… yet when I take a thermal temp gun pull the trigger it shows me @194-297front - rear… this is at the clutch side plugs
Yes, sumping can indeed contribute to higher engine temperatures.
that why i think im sumping because my head temps are getting up to 375
What is the size NPT used in trans cover? Both sides as in 1/4” goes into cover with 1/8” rubber hose goes onto…
Hey Heavy Metal - the hose barb is some weird thread pitch but pretty close to 1/8 NPT. I think I used 3/16” ID tubing but if I do it again I’ll use at least 1/4”.
What about the:
Milwaukee-Eight Shorty Feuling Sump Plug?
The Shorty Plug is 0.265 Tall vs. OEM 0.465.
Unblocks Scavenge Port
Reduces Chance of Sumping
Better Oil Level Readings
I’ve heard about that and it seems like a good solution. I haven’t tried it but I’d definitely be open to it.
@@RonsWorkshop I ordered it I’ll play the MLB a few weeks then I’ll take the stock one and I might put it down to .250…
And see what that one will do, but I think that would be cutting it to the edge …
@@Heavy69Metal ok - please give me an update after your tests...
@@RonsWorkshop give me some time on it and we will see also I did a 2” tank lift and 5/8” rear tank lift so more air would come over the heads and replacing the rear tank lift with either 3/4” or 1” lift see how that works as well.
@Heavy69Metal excellent!