What Is the RALI 220 | A Hand Plane For The New World Order
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- Опубликовано: 13 сен 2024
- Find Rali planes here: rali-shop.com/...
Today we are looking at the Rali 220 hand plane
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0:31 - I love how your wood plane passed out from the shock of you admitting that plastic functions well.
I have family members who are kinda handy and need a plane for something every once in a while. They come from power tool backgrounds and no matter what I do, I CANNOT convince them that they need to learn to sharpen their planes. I think sharpening must seem like some mystic art that only skilled craftspeople do... or something. I recently had one of them tell me they went to the hardware store to get a new blade because their block plane was dull!! In this situation, I could see the utility of the RALI. It's a plane for people who have no business owning a plane.
I found sharpening daunting when i started with handtools too. I had no idea what a burr even was, I just thought that you scratch the iron on the stone until both sides are scratched the same a then I'm done, it took me a while to get it right. Also I remember being surprised when choosing planes that there exists a tool that you have "break in" before use, since everything I had up to that point was plug and play. Now I wouldnt go back though.
It's amazing how intimidating sharpening can be for people. Before I learned to do it, I was borderline terrified that I was going to ruin my blades if I missed on my angle. I always had my grandpa do it (Dad had the same attitude I had) because I just assumed he knew some weird mystical secret that I could never learn. Whoever sold society the idea that sharpening was too difficult to do yourself was a hell of a salesman!
I know a bunch of people who never even sharpen their kitchen knives. RALI planes make sense for some people, but they'll unfortunately have to pay for a better model than the one in this video.
@@AllanMacMillan I bet that some of those who never sharpen their kitchen knives think a dull knife is safer to use because I know a few like that.
@@AllanMacMillan"a bunch of people who never sharpen their kitchen knives"
You mean 99.9% of the population? Heck, I have some expensive German quality knives that definitely need sharpening, and even I am too paranoid that I'll ruin them.
I buy all my Stanley planes at garage sales for a few dollars.
I refurbish them and they work beautifully.
This is the way!
this is nice if you are in the US, in the rest of the world that is basically not an option :/
I've always been kind of intrigued by these planes. I hate tools I can't sharpen easily, but I also really like the idea of having a disposable blade for times where I might hit surprise fasteners...
You can sharpen the blades. I do all the time. Sharpen them the way you would sharpen carbide blades for wood turning tools or for helical planer.
@PistonHonda87 Glad to hear you found a way to make that work! How do you do it? That's been my final hang-up from buying one for sketchy planing.
I have one and I like it, here's the kind of person I am: a) I never learned to sharpen irons well b) I dislike power tools c) I've had a lot of struggles getting traditional planes to work and its prevented from getting into hand tool wood working d) I have money for the more expensive thing. I also like their chisels too.
Was the sole flat out of the box?
Thanks a bunch for the testing and review, James! 😊
Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
It's weird to say this but the japanese planes I bought from amazon (Kakuri) were basically ready to use right out of the box.
Love those!
ehh, I find that they come very very tight and need fitment of the bed and blade. The soles on japanese planes are easy to manage though, every once in a while I'll scrape the center and front (behind the blade) and use some winding sticks to check the flats. Overall though, they do need remarkably little set up compared to western planes.
That's fascinating, everything I know about japanese planes suggests that they require a bunch of setup to the body to work correctly. I'll look into that
@@tarbucktransom I was surprised too. Granted, I haven't tried using any of them for super fine finishes yet. And you still need to learn the basics.. I found getting the chip breaker close enough to be very finicky.
@@toshn4151 You use wooden planes much? I wonder if trying to adjust the chipbreaker is like trying to adjust a tricky wooden plane, or if it's worse than that
There’s a market for everything, maybe i will help folks to do something on a budget, in some places (mainly outside England and the US) there are no too many used Stanley planes. Also, maybe for teaching woodworking on the cheap, if I wanted you to teach kids on woodworking, I would buy a bunch of these planes and tune them out till they perform the way I like. And there may be many other use cases. Great video James, I love the honesty and integrity
i think they are a better fit for businesses that want to standardize on a platform. they are good planes, but they have all required at least a bit of setup for me. i sharpen mine on a regular old 3x21 belt sander with a jig and then finish it on a fine stone with a jig and then strop. i have 12 blades, so 24 cutting edges. i can sharpen them all in around 30 minutes and be set for quite a while. the blades don't camber so i made a magnetic fence/guide to stick to the plane based on the veritas jointing guide.
if i were to recommend a similar price point and close to ready to go plane, the Jorgensen 10" is an excellent value for money if you are going the new tool route. i've setup more than 50 so far and i am more than satisfied with the amount of effort and quality of the tool for the money spent.
How much work do the Jorgensens need before they are entirely flat etc?
Great review, which shows that you also have your limits when it comes to assessing the usability of tools, even if they are relatively cheap. And how far you will go to still be able to say something positive about it. It reaffirms your integrity and knowledge of all the fun, beautiful and ingenious things you share with us. Thank you for all of that!
glad you tested it, I hope you will also take a look at the higher end model :)
Thanks James, thinking I'll stick to my cheapo #5's and block plane. And diamond plate with the whetstones and strop. There is something about the sharpening ritual that is calming and zen like, for me. Take care & stay safe.
I agree Doug! It's woodworking zen!
What brand of diamond stones do you use?
@@Lennart1995 No brand just some 400- 1000 grit plate bought off Amazon.
I found a strange plane at a Restore about 10 years ago, it had a press metal body similar to that one but better made with steel and a forward wood knob and adjustment levers, its from a company called Twix. LOL made about mid last century. The sole was uneven in the same place as yours but not quite as bad. I carefully dented it down a tiny bit to flatten it then used sand paper to really flatten it, took about 10 mins. It is about the size of a large block plane and i love it. That one you tried made me want to cry.
That's the sort of tool that I see on the shelf and mostly ignore. Plastic exists in my shop, but not in quantity.
I have an Infinity scrub plane. I absolutely love that plane and I've used it a bunch. It wasn't very expensive at all. And I have Worth planes and two Buck Brothers planes that work surprisingly good. The Worth plane was like 10 bucks at a Thirft Store and I bought the Buck Brother's planes at Home Depot years ago for 17 bucks each. I did have to do some work on them but at least they look decent and I can resharpen the blades. I don't think I'd touch that monstrosity with a 10 ft pole lol.
If you're interested in checking out other Rali stuff I would love to see a review of their vise. As far as I can find the only videos about it are from Rali themselves, so I've been interested in one but I don't know if I want to buy one without seeing if it actually works well. I like that it seems light and unobtrusive and would work well for a portable bench, but it can still do a lot of the work holding that a tail vise with dog holes could do.
I would love to. Unfortunately my tool budget is tapped for the next 6 months to a year. This one was actually purchased by a fan and I got it up and working for him and he let me do the video.
The Simpsons did it! But seriously Rex K reviewed the pricier smothing plane version and they can't get that flat either 😂. 10 minutes flattening and its was better. Loved the video and I was hoping it was better than the other model. Thanks for your efforts in reviews. Maybe they will get the message.
I think that in terms of flattening it might be better to start by tapping its concavity out and then finish by sanding
It would be worth a try but unfortunately you can't get to the front of the mouth very well on this one to push it back out flat
I’m afraid I’m going to have nightmares seeing that thing. It took me years to finally learn how to use real hand planes. I could never consider using something like that. Maybe it would be better if it was blue
Great video Thanks for sharing
Bailey's have been around for over 120 years and are still going strong...where will that tool be in 120 years? I get the grab and go idea but it still just rankles me. We have lost so much in our society as mfg cater to the whims of men that don't know which end of a screwdriver to hold and are PROUD of that fact. Young drivers can't fathom using a stick shift. If it doesn't involve a phone and social media they are totally lost.
I get more from my Indian made #6 and my Jorgensen #4 planes after flattening and adjusting them to work properly. Being cheaper traditional style planes it only makes sense that they weren't perfect out of the box, but man do they make curls now! That disposable blade might seem useful, but the other aspects that cannot be tweaked just make the unit less useful overall.
Useful review, appreciated.
Is that plastic or rubber grip going to get sticky as the years go by? Kind of like how certain rubber handled kitchen utensils become sticky/slimy.
No, it is hard plastic.
I feel the same way. I REALLY want to love these.
They should consider making the sole out of pot metal or something, really tough to make sheet stock flat while integrating it into a larger assembly (as a prominent EV manufacturer)
They do sell a version, where the body is made of laminated steel "plates" - it's way more expensive tho
Thank you for your content
Interesting. I have an unrelated question do you think it would be possible to make some extensions from wood or metal to bolt on the sides of a smother to make it longer and function like a jointer plane
possible... maybe. practical and functional... it would be VERY difficult. you would be better off making a wooden jointer that is not that difficult.
Hope you will have a look on their RALI 220 Evolution or RALI 220 Evolution N, they have much, much better sole.
I would love to, but I don't have the money for them. I did this one as someone let me borrow it.
Would you consider doing a video about when it's okay to use different types of epoxies? For instance, Total Boat has their high performance epoxy, and then the tabletop epoxy for like half the price per volume. I'm not building a boat, so do I need to get the high performance? Or can I get away with using tabletop epoxy for joinery?
That might be an idea. but in that case the table top is not great at being an adhesive. It is durable but fragile when it is thin like in a glue joint. but it would be more woater prof then a PVA.
I wonder if there is a type of already existing blade that you can get easily at a hardware store that would work passably as a plane blade. Something like a razor blade..I mean not something that is as thin as a razor blade but rather as widely available. It'd be really neat to reimagine an affordable hand plane that uses something like that as its blade. Again...I don't mean an actual razor blade. Cuz it sounds like if this thing didn't require special blades and came with a sole that was flat enough, it'd be an amazing find.
unfortunately no. it has a proprietary connection.
it's not being negative. That's being truthfully to what you do. Practical.
May the algorithm be ever in your favor.
If they get the sole flat theyd probavly find a home in the construction industry. But if they cant get that right its a paperweight
What about camber- for the size of plane I would expect a slight camber for scrub purposes...
This isn't for scrubbing it's a smoothing plane. So there's no camera in the iron
I think the target buyer would get quickly frustrated. Yup Tattoo be hollering "Da plane da plane" as it flew out of the door
I bought the more expensive one. Also, not flat. Not at all.
Reminds me of the Stanley Rb plane range with the replacement blades.
My Gillette razor is also very functional
Commenting below 😊
This is one of those "buy in to the ecosystem" tools. Pay $80 for a bad tool? It doesn't works so you could get the one for $40 extra and get a better tool. Then again, your low range wasn't great so maybe an extra $40-$50 won't hurt for the next step up. This *is* the tool for the modern age, or the age where people don't need to maintain anything anymore. You get it? This likely exists so the better ones look even better.
Great video!!!
I'd be a bit worried about the different thermal properties causing that sheet metal to bend again and come out of level
I am a french Professional woodworker, i just want corect you about one thing, you said that we dont use metal plane in Europe, it is wrong. Today we use more brithish or amercan tool than actual european tools .
If I were to have to buy a new plane For that price I'd buy a Jorgensen from Lowes or a Taytools plane.
That blade looks like a shavette style straight razor blade. I wonder if that's what is actually being used.
Unfortunately no. They are specialty blades with a proprietary interlocking connection.
In a workshop i agree with you these ar trash. But where they shine is on the construction site. Not evry body can handle a plane and they are so simpel. And is you hit a nail or something great just change the blade.
And bosses would get a fit if you suddenly start sharpening blades but paying for a few replacable blades? No problems.
Really give planes a chance to do some of the jobs they are superior at even at a modern workplace
Remember the little old ladies on late night cable? The ones with the sex toy show? This looks like it came from there. Needs some random LEDs.
That's how they'll get ya, pay more for replaceable blades then the plastic is made of like razor companies!
Lol
Could you retro fit a Stanley frog iron etc bolt into body 🤔?
Not without rebuilding the whole plane.
@@WoodByWrightHowTo or even retro 🤔 into a wooden plan insurt a block of wood and use iron hybrid
Thanks James
I’ve own a couple of years now. Wouldn’t consider going back to a traditional hand plane, especially with the carbide blades they offer, they last for months. They are way more common in Europe and have seen them on a number of job sites and a number of Euro woodworkers on RUclips.
They have been in business for about 40 years now.
Yes you can sharpen the blades.
RALI could have made the plane with a flat sole, that they took the corporate , save a couple bucks in manufacturing, way out pretty much means I'll never give them a second glance. I've bought far too many old planes, from Stanley, Miller Falls, Sargent, all the little sub-brands that Stanley marketed them to. I have a Co-Mar from New York, yeah, never heard of it either. All that to say I've never spent more than $40 for any of them. All got tuned and fettled, all became usable. A rather substantial time investment for some of them. As you state, none of them had a sole that took long to flatten, a few needed new totes which I made. Now I limit, severely, which planes I'll refurbish. I should have saved my money and gone after the good ones from the beginning, but then, I'd not have learned how to take an old garage sale relic and turn it into a real user.
😳🤔💁 With all that diving maybe it was mislabeled "Plane" and was supposed to be labeled "Sub"??? 🙈🙈🙈
We appreciate the negativity sometimes: we desire honesty the most.
Finally, I am early enough once.
nice first!
And what happens when you can't buy the blades anymore?
Shit ya not i seen the plane he's holding and read the name as RAZZLEDAZZLE lmao had to reread but looked like a cartoon...
Seems like it might be useful in a class where people are prone to dropping things.
Metalwork, woodwork and now we've plasticwork.
The lack of sharpening the blade and inclusion of a QR code on that thing leads me to believe this is a modern “subscription” device. A noob would be best off avoiding this unless more money than sense applies.
And as with all subscription devices, if the company ever goes out of business, or just changes the blade pattern so you can’t get the old ones, you just got a very expensive paperweight!
@@techheck3358 Exactly… and just wait until all of these newer cars start needing “repairs” that will sway people towards buying a replacement due to an overzealous estimate. All any of this takes is a well placed firmware update and a gradual decline to convince the consumer.
Apple pulled that stunt with iPhone batteries and was caught throttling the cpu…. Just wait for it.
1) i think you got a especially bad one. The sole on the ones i tested were quite OK.
2) i don't think this is really meant to be a smoothing plane. This is a plane for a construction site where you need to take down a bit of a frame (or even a floor board) faster than with sandpaper. Or quickly remove paint stains from somewhere. Or quickly chamfer something. This is a plane for someone who owns just powertools and one badly sharpend chisel. I think of it more as a fore plane; even when the adjustment suggests otherwise.
3) my daugther is 5 and likes to woodwork with me. She wants her own plane. She will get this monobloc 220 b/c it will be enough to scrub a crooked board good enough so that she can nail it; it won't rust (metal body) or bend (wooden body) if she leaves it outside overnight (we work on the patio). And when she's a grownup and into DIY she might use it to do some basic tasks. If she takes up serious woodworking she might sell it or use it as a foreplane.
I've talked to two other people who tested them and found them to be about the same. Rex even did a video on the higher quality one and found it was out of flat by about the same amount. With it being this far out you couldn't even use it for carpentry work. It would only touch the first couple inches of the board in the last couple inches of the board and then just start to round it you couldn't do anything flat.
Snide remarks
I'll be honest, I kind of hate this plane. I think the 2 main reasons for my dislike is disposable blade and plastic. That being said, for 70 bucks, I would go with Jorgensen. I have both the smoother (no.4 style) and the block plane (60 1/2 style) Both of them worked for me right out of the box and didnt disappoint me...except the orange color. I know some have reviewed them with a mix of their impressions, but my own personal impressions were, that they worked better than expected and for the price, I was willing to do a little fiddling with them.
I didn't see u use it
00:59 and 5:10
@@WoodByWrightHowTo ok cool.
Sounds great as it slices through timber
Comment down below
You didn't really sound all that negative to me.
In fact, you seemed pretty positive that plane isn't a great choice for anyone. ;-)
Comment down below.
The Rali planes aren't ment for Hobby hand tool woodworkers but for professionals.
The Rali planes are very common in Europe. Not for hobby woodworkers but with professional carpenters. I assume they get the better quality ones. But pretty much every professional carpenter has one. And professionals don't use them in the shop. They are used on construction sites or generally at the customer. And there its a big advantage that you don't need to sharpen. It always is sharp and when it gets dull you just change the blade.
To me the process of sharpening and the feel of a nice plane are all part of the joy of woodworking so I wouldn't a
Be interested in a Rali.
There is no “better” quality in Rali. They do have two types, one with a laminated sole (heavy plane) and the other with a steel plate (light).
Then they have two types of blades. Chrome and tungsten carbide which last for ever.
You can sharpen them the same you would sharpen tungsten carbide bits for wood turning.
In what counties do professional carpenters use these planes?? I'm genuinely curious. I have experience in working as a carpenter in the UK and Finland and have never seen one. In the uk 99% of carpenters shoot the edges of doors etc. with electric planes. I have met a couple of old-school guys still using bailey pattern planes. In Finland the idea of shooting edges of doors is long gone (it's all standardized pre-hung crap). Sometimes people use electric planes to relieve the back of architrave. I sometimes use hand planes for very detailed work but I'm 'the weird english guy' and I probably wouldn't if I didn't use hand tools as a hobby.
In Germany they are very common for installation work.
Disposable blades = nope. If it weren't for that, I'd be intrigued. As a new approach to a pragmatic tool if nothing else.
I wouldn't pay $80 for it with $3.5 blades.
Sew, knot 4 da cereals would werker?
Great review, good,bad, and ugly. Ill just move along over hear to the table full of usable planes...
CDB
I threw up in my mouth a little seeing this. 😂
I won't gate keep...i won't gate keep...i won't gate keep 😂
Cdb
"it even has the mark of the beast!"
Comment
My initial impression was exactly the same as yours - PLASTIC! 😵💫
I would argue that the Rali planes aren't designed for fine wood working. More like a tool for carpenters and builders to throw into a tool bag for trimming doors etc
That would be true if it would even work for that. But it would only touch the first couple inches of the board due to the soul being so far on flat. You couldn't even trim up a door edge with that.
Definitely a tool for someone that doesn't want to learn how to use a regular plane. Its a hard pass for me.
NO, NO, NO! JUST NO!
THAT IS A TOY, NOT A TOOL!
Even If somebody gift me such a piece of junk i wouldnt use it, right in the bin.
Rather i would chew the wood with my teeth!
Dont feel bad, youre just telling the PLANE truth
They put a lot of effort in letting the plane look as cheap as possible - to me it looks like a children's toy.
I would never pay 80 bucks for that even if it was of great quality.
So what's the intended audience I wonder.....
No. Just no.
Rali is just a trash company, many European woodworker have try it and none of then want to used it for fourniture making
Only carpenter can use it, but the price convince them to find a cheaper one
looking at your last scrub and looking at this....
Why do you even make a video about it.
because I get a lot of requests for it. and if it would work out of the box I could see uses for it on the construction site.
@@WoodByWrightHowTo A shame the sole was so bad. I would also see this as a perfect tool for a carpenter/handyman to have on hand for rough quick tasks like fixing doors that stick. I guess that until RALI comes up with a better offering at a decent price point, these use cases will be filled with a belt sander or some other needlessly messy approach.
@@WoodByWrightHowTo But.. doesn't it make you angry ? You're smiling and talking with ease about something that is an abomination.
Doesnt require brain.
Doesnt require hands.
Plastic/ alluminium, non sharpenable blades.
NO character, no identity, no soul.
This is the exact opposite of what i see around you.
And thinking a decent plane is already 300 dollars, and soon even more, this plastic garbage is probably the future of handworking.
Are you ok with this ?
Idk.
I feel something wrong.
It scares me to see that you look fine about this.
It's not a problem tho.
Its all yours.
But had to tell ya.
The problem is that the future is not one thing. It is a wide spectrum with things even worse with this at one end and things like Sauer and Steiner at the other end. There has always been trash for sale, and it has always been high-quality. Different people have different needs. If the sole were flat on here, it would make a great place for a carpenter to throw in a toolbox for the job site. Some tools are meant for honor, and some are meant to be beaten up and replaced.
@@WoodByWrightHowTo Sounds wise and reasonable.
But i rather listen to you talking facts about wood rather than anthropology.
The day this sell for 20$, even with a non-flat sole, this is the end of handplanes.
This is it, and this is all.
Maybe i'm dumb and irrational.
And there's no point beeing angry or scared about this.
Future is more and more one thing.
and it started even before religions made peoples behave the same way.
We're talking from dozens of thousands kilometers away from eachother.
Talking the same language.
Sharing knowledge, to make it one.
The world is competitive.
The most effective tactic availlable take it all.
And in a lot of ways, i'm working wood as you told me to do so.
Because, in fact, this is the most effective tactic.
And our works kinda make one.
Most of your viewers, me included...
We don't even have a workshop.
I got to eat pasta for a month, to get myself a trash german plane for 150$, that isnt even functional, that i rather use my selfmade wood plane in my bedroom.
What happen if we can get this for 20 bucks?
Because this is designed to be sold, not to be functional.
And so, it will sell for 20 bucks sooner or later.
There was no lovers who went to out-compete commercials.
Music, cars, food, video games.
Anything human make.
The one who make it to sell it, sell it.
The one who make it with love of work or love of art, just disapear.
And future become one.
This is made to be sold.
This is a serious treat for people that make stuff to be functional or beautiful.
Feel free to ignore my childish warning.
We already look at handcraft men as they belong in a museum.
And that's the reason you have such an audience.
But it's ugly. Life is too short to own ugly tools.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Thanks James