1) WOW! Doug is a master salesman. Just incredible how much he externalized what matters, and can teach it. 2) You don't need to do two WyrmLife's a week, one is easily enough to keep us engaged.
Doug explaining how a sales pitch works while also selling me on now wanting a prophecy is WILD! It's like Penn & Teller explaining how a Magic Trick works while doing the trick and still fooling me. Brilliant!
Sales gets shit on a lot, but good sales isn't scummy, it's just presenting the product in the best light and letting the customer imagine why they would want it.
Yeah my dad was a sales rep for a while and I helped him out in some of his shows. It always amazed me how much he knew about the thousands of different products he was presenting and all the details comparing his stuff to his competitors. He taught me a lot about public speaking and how to understand the needs of the people you are talking to.
@@knewbod When I worked retail I didnt try to sell anything. What I did was give people the option to buy something. Number one thing is keep the customer happy and people arent happy when you are trying to sell them something. So you give them the option to buy it. Buy it now or buy it later, it doesnt matter to me. By keeping it light and happy they will remember WHO gave them that option to buy. So they come back to me and ask about the product again.
@@knewbod This feels scummy though....I mean, thoughts are the enemy of action? Make a deposit now, worry about the money later? Yikes. Somehow made me want this table less.
I got so excited to see your booth at Dragoncon last week, and then instantly disappointed when there wasn't an example of the MGT. Not even a Liliput. I understand why it wouldn't be there from a sales standpoint but that table is literally what got me and my friends into Wyrmwood and got us to purchase tables. I was so disappointed I walked away from the dice vault I was considering.
Sounds like media needs a formal in take process like a front door where all other departments submit a standardized request for exactly what they need. Those requests are then prioritized by a central governance and that priority list is published for the entire company to see so there is no question what is being worked when. That way you don’t have to say NO to requests, it’s all based on the priority assigned to the request.
I just watched a family on RUclips playing on their table top they got from these guys and I've been a wyrmling for a while now. I don't sadly own anything cause poor man no spend sadly but it was awesome seeing a family enjoy their amazing craft.
I was the same for a while. My wife got me a dice vault from them for Christmas one year and I was so happy to have something of theirs and the hexy time Kickstarter will be my first backing for them. I did the math where if I put aside $25 a month until the Kickstarter ends that is my allowance for the hexes
Quick sales tip to Doug: Anchoring high has been a very popular technique for a long time, but although it works, it also loses deals. You are losing sales on people who are willing to spend 5k, hear 15k, and are out the door.
Too many options can also not be good either. Apple purposely doesn't have as many products as they could because consumers don't feel as good about their purchase if there were many options available.
oooohhhh Johnny, that strap idea -chef kiss- cause leather...ya know...it gets weird after a lot of wear and tear, that's nice to switch out and replace if needed. LOVE IT.
For the deck box: make sure you have a size that fits 100 card MTG Commander decks that are double sleeved with Dragon Shield sealable inner sleeves and matte outer sleeves. It's about the thickest combination of sleeving options, and most of the more compact box designs can't fit it. Get that down, and you'll get a great review from the prof at Tolarian Community College - who you should also probably send a review copy to and/or work with as a sponsorship to promote it, since he has the single largest MTG channel on youtube. An additional option for an 80 card deck would also be really good, since while Commander is the most _popular_ format, most other formats use 60 card decks + a 15 card sideboard. Extra space for about 5 cards would allow for thicker sleeves like the above case, or be space for token cards.
I don't think they need a smaller option. I can't stand Commander, but deck boxes that accommodate commander are great for everything else. There's always something else to throw in there. Heck, I could fit four or five unsleeved keyforge decks in there.
A standard deck with only plastic sleeves and no sideboard still benefits. I use bigger deck boxes to also slide in about 20 token cards, a few nondescript counters, and a die or two. The extra space is ALWAYS appreciated.
First off, as someone who recently left his job to do something else and was eviscerated by my boss, I was happy to see Bobby's comments on Fabrice leaving as being "hey, best of luck to him. I'm happy for him" As for Doug's sales training...yeah. Doug and I do completely different types of sales I think...
For sure that convo is what a functional team is supposed to look like. Unfortunately too many dysfunctional teams out there and often it starts with the person in charge who shouldn't be in charge
I once had a boss (a complete asshole) who told an employee who was leaving that the store she was going to would go out of business and shut down, and that she'll be back asking for a job. Years later, she's still there doing just fine.
As someone who is also currently working in a strapped Marketing Department, find a great Project Manager in addition to hiring more creative crew. If you have someone solely dedicated to herding you cats, your lives will be sooooo much better.
When I start my new job and have enough saved up I want a Prophecy for the house my fiancee and I plan on getting. I just think it's a beautiful table, with so many functions and is a great conversation piece. Doug is a great salesman, he understands how to reel people back in from what is (worth it) a hefty price. Understanding the installments and having some say in something that has the love and care that Johnny and the team put into the product they make in my mind is 1000% worth it.
Please make sure the deck box is setup for the Commander format with space for 100 double sleeved cards. It’s the most popular format with some of the most expensive attainable decks
100 double sleeved cards using Dragon Shield sealable inner sleeves and matte outer sleeves. This alone will get them an A+ grade from the professor over at Tolarian Community College.
For the deck boxes, if you use Ian's diagram with just the center protruding, you could cut a Wyrmwood crest into the surface with the undercut so the leather fits underneath. You could also add a wet-molding process to stiffen the leather straps using a pretty simple jig to make them fit the profile a bit better and prevent it from looking "floppy".
@bobby @dimitriy - the product side of the company is working in an agile methodology, why don't you guys give it a shot? it may help alleviate the overwhelming and burnout.
I have to agree with the dovetail idea, if you can run double dovetails in the molding machine that would take care of that problem real quick. Run 10 foot boards through it and then cut your lids one board length at a time compensating for blade kerf. Easy peasy
agreed use magnets in the lid of the box and rivet a metal plate on the strap laser engrave the strap or a metal plate sandwich with the engraving on the top plate and fix it to the leather strap with 2 rivets this would be stronger and only needs to be thin and the blanks could be made on your neighbours turret press in seconds ! :) as nice as the full wood looks, its alot of spindle time which I believe is a bottle neck you want to avoid
Find a way to do remote with the media team. Sure, some stuff has to be there, on site. But editing? That doesn't need to be there. Figure out a pipeline to allow for remote, and suddenly, you open up your potential hires to a much broader, wider audience. Just keep photography, videography there, they toss it to a server that the editors can access remotely, and blammo. You're not limited to people who are local or able to relocate.
The title opening with the lazy Susan spin shots! Dayum! That looked so snappy! Every time I see those kinds of shots I'm like! That's mah boiiii JV!! Let's go! 👊 Keep up the good work media team, hang in there! 💪
My mind was blown with Johnny's idea - I would have never thought about that in a million years. Would that be considered thinking outside the box or inside - but slightly out? 🤣
Good luck with hiring, team! Been understaffed at my work for over year but slowly creeping back up. The hours it takes to get the right folks in makes it all worth it!
Loose the leather strap, go with magnets for the Deck box lid. Reduces the Sku's no over complications of leather wearing and tearing down over time. Keeps it clean and simple. But need to make sure those inside dimensions can fit double sleeved commander decks. About 100-120 of these double sleeved cards. (100 is the main deck, extra 20 is for tokens and cards used outside the game. )
@@Andrew_Head Double-sleeved capacity requirements are a mainstay of existing deck boxes, especially given the cost of MTG decks nowadays. Commander is also one of MTG's most popular formats, it's not a ridiculous request for a Commander sized deck box be developed in tandem with a standard sized one.
@@Andrew_Head - If you follow Tolarian Community College, the biggest reviewer of card game accessories on RUclips, his biggest ask is for a deck box that can fit a 100 card deck that's been sleeved with Dragon Shield's matte outer sleeves with their sealable inner sleeves as well. Most compact deck boxes can't fit this combination, so it's a good niche to target. For people with a 100 card deck that uses thinner sleeving options, it would still be a good choice because it could then fit some token cards as well. For people who play non-100 card formats, an 80 card box is pretty much the standard, since it fits a 60 card deck + 15 card sideboard with a little extra room for thicker sleeves or tokens as well. This isn't really "insist on my specific use case", this is "what the market is demanding". I don't even like Commander as a format for the most part, but if I were making deck boxes it would be one of my core target demographics. Especially the thick-sleeve people, because people using that combination are going to be doing so because they have more expensive cards, which probably means they'll have more to spend on deck boxes. If you're selling what is essentially a luxury item, you shouldn't alienate the group most likely to be able and willing to afford it by insisting on a size that doesn't fit their needs.
@@sjokkoladehjerte i thought i did. Haven't actually looked on their website yet. Judging by this video though it seems like they have final choices for the position.
@@elizabethsimon3783 i would shoot in an application anyway, they may like yours better, or hire two people, or have you in mind for the next hire they need. Shoot your shot missy😄💁♀️
That Kelly face set needs to be a raffle. $100 per entry means you only have to sell 470 entries to break even at that price given in the video. $100 for the chance at almost 1,400 tiles seems like one hell of a steal.
I should have put this on the previous episode, if you are going to do a KDM themed table, can you also reach out to Red Raven games for some other design options?
Doug, as a dude in sales, you missed my need behind the need! Also, what are the benefits to these features my man. See you all at GENCON! Your booth is my fist stop.
How often would that leather need to come out of top on the deck box? If its every time you use the deck box that will wear down quick with active use. Like an overused belt the hole will stretch out overtime.
I think the leather strap is meant to be semi-permanently attached to the top, so you'd only remove it from the top when replacing the strap. The strap goes down on each side of the box and attaches to something there, and that's the main open/close functionality
I don't think I am the only one thinking this, but if you guys are overworked going back to one time a week until you can "get those wheels turning" it would be understandable. Don't force yourselves into a meat grinder that wrecks your souls just to put out two shows a week, we all want you guys to be healthy and happy.
I think hunk I’m choking in the number that 1 percent of the people at gen con are potential customers for a 15 k table. I’m my (40 year) experience gaming I’d peg that lower. Maybe an example number for the talk but it has to be lower….
I like the idea of an engraved wooden logo on top of the deckbox, but I'm not sure about making the leather swappable. If it's about options, we need to see said options and figure out if they're worth the trouble. If it's about simply losing the glue and/or making it replaceable over time, sure, why not?
I know a bit about leather and YES, you want to have options. You can go from a 10$ piece of leather to a 100$+ one, so there is a price point for everyone.
Why the strap? Why not just grove out the top part of the box and have the lid slide into place instead of sit on top? Is the woods to thin to support this?
Make the dovetail cut in a table router, measurement is from edge of the workpiece to the opposite side, then do a climbing cut. The cut will compress against the fence and you should be able to mill it out with 2 passes on the same machine. You can also set the bit height to be away from the bottom of the dato so you do not get swirl marks.
they know how to get the cut, but theyre trying to figure out the best way to mass produce the part. table router is an easy answer but its a lot more labor than setting up a machine to cut it automatically
W.r.t. selling the prophecy, when I'm on the showroom floor looking at expensive wyrmwood tables, the thing that most justifies the price to me is the exclusivity. If you say "this is a $15k table because we hand-make a handful each year", now my brain doesn't think " holy shit $15k for a gaming table?!" It thinks, "holy shit, ONLY $15k for a sweet gaming table that almost no one else has!" Regardless of whether I can afford it, the price now seems completely justified.
Depends. To me sales pitches based on rarity often make me think ”Oh so it’s just expensive cause the manufacturing hasn’t been optimized for scale - it’s not actually inherently expensive due to materials etc”
You still want to weed out the people that completely balk at the price. If they don't leave right away, that's when you continue to justify the cost. However, you're not going to convince someone that is thinking 3k to 15k, as likely as you can someone that thinks 8-10k, but you can bring to accepting 15k with things like that. It really is a numbers game, and spending time with people that aren't anywhere near the same ballpark will waste time trying to sell to those that are. It's very different selling at a con or market type venue, than a storefront where people come in already looking for what you sell. You have to catch people that want what you have when they aren't there particularly for you or what you have, and then sell them on yours.
@@BenRangel as they've shown on wyrmlife, not everything is worth scaling up. Sometimes it just makes more sense to hand make something in small batches due to the complexity of what would be necessary to mass produce it. And for those things, the price is easy to justify.
@@heroclix0rz oh I'm not arguing against that. Some things aren't worth scaling and then require a higher price. Just saying that maybe that's not always the most alluring sales pitch for customers. (But hey I'm not the target market so might be wrong)
I have a pre order for a prophecy but with covid and the current hurricanes I'm not sure il be able to pay the first payment. Hoping I can figure it out
Omg, Doug could sell me damn near anything. Hell, he sold me a Modular Game Table and Accessories. And pretty much everything that I've purchased from Wyrmwood, now that I think about it. 🤔
For the strapped deck box, could you have the lid, strap and plug be separate pieces? have the oval cut out with the beveled edges magnet to the top of the lid through the oval hole in the leather strap. While the lid has those mortised edges to hold down the edges.
Is the wooden part in the middle of the top needed? Why not just have a channel running through the middle, maybe with two "belt loops" of wood bridging across the top so that from above it is square with a cut out in the middle. Just pull the strap through the channel and snap the top down to the bottom.
Now im not saying I'm a high school graduate who's very passionate about film and editing who lives in the new England area... but what I am is available
Still hoping for the deck boxes to have a Xl variant which supports 200 double sleeved cards so that my Commander deck actually fits since I never fitted them in any 100card box before.
I would always assume vendors will be there the entire convention unless they say otherwise. Booth space is too expensive and hard to come by (especially at GenCon) to let it sit fallow. Plus you're not really allowed to set up your booth once the convention is under way, especially one like Wyrmwoods' that is going to require the heavy equipment.
Why not just pressure/friction fit the leather onto the box lid rather than having the undercut? Make the leather and the wood slightly thicker so it grips better and then you can do it the way Doug drew it.
I think they are trying to avoid the inevitable stretch of the leather. Even with medium use the strap would get loose over time. That will still happen with their design with the bevel but the leather won’t slip off since it wouldn’t stretch that much.
Are you in the market for a Prophecy Gaming Table?
I wish. I want one BADLY!
I'd love one, but the lowest costed one is 6 months pay for me.
I certainly am after THAT picth!
I would love one, kinda dream budget item.
$15,000 better come with 24k gold inlays… >.>
Doug saying “Thoughts are the enemy of action” is some of the wisest shit I’ve heard in a while. 👏🏼
They way doug walks around makes hike looks like a stick trader in a tv show lol
I'm usually pretty tough on the guys but Doug deserves some coffee, he's a closer.
I loved seeing Doug teach the sales people. The psychology of selling is very interesting, what a good segment!
1) WOW! Doug is a master salesman. Just incredible how much he externalized what matters, and can teach it.
2) You don't need to do two WyrmLife's a week, one is easily enough to keep us engaged.
Doug explaining how a sales pitch works while also selling me on now wanting a prophecy is WILD! It's like Penn & Teller explaining how a Magic Trick works while doing the trick and still fooling me. Brilliant!
Sales gets shit on a lot, but good sales isn't scummy, it's just presenting the product in the best light and letting the customer imagine why they would want it.
Yeah my dad was a sales rep for a while and I helped him out in some of his shows. It always amazed me how much he knew about the thousands of different products he was presenting and all the details comparing his stuff to his competitors. He taught me a lot about public speaking and how to understand the needs of the people you are talking to.
The best part is Doug WAS this salesperson in the early days of wyrmwood, it shows that this worked to get them to where they are today. so sick
@@knewbod When I worked retail I didnt try to sell anything. What I did was give people the option to buy something. Number one thing is keep the customer happy and people arent happy when you are trying to sell them something. So you give them the option to buy it. Buy it now or buy it later, it doesnt matter to me. By keeping it light and happy they will remember WHO gave them that option to buy. So they come back to me and ask about the product again.
@@knewbod This feels scummy though....I mean, thoughts are the enemy of action? Make a deposit now, worry about the money later? Yikes. Somehow made me want this table less.
Ian breaking into the chorus of "I Wish" is easily my Wyrmwood Highlight of the month thus far.
Mostly made me feel old :)
1000 “Whose Line” points to the editor.
That was a legit IMPRESSIVE sales display/routine by Doug. 👏🏻
Never mind anything else, the 'Whose Line...' clip made me very happy. Good timing.
I got so excited to see your booth at Dragoncon last week, and then instantly disappointed when there wasn't an example of the MGT. Not even a Liliput. I understand why it wouldn't be there from a sales standpoint but that table is literally what got me and my friends into Wyrmwood and got us to purchase tables.
I was so disappointed I walked away from the dice vault I was considering.
Sounds like media needs a formal in take process like a front door where all other departments submit a standardized request for exactly what they need. Those requests are then prioritized by a central governance and that priority list is published for the entire company to see so there is no question what is being worked when. That way you don’t have to say NO to requests, it’s all based on the priority assigned to the request.
The group thinktank at the end makes me miss working in a woodshop so much. All the brainstorming to make things that shouldn't work..work, is so fun.
I just watched a family on RUclips playing on their table top they got from these guys and I've been a wyrmling for a while now. I don't sadly own anything cause poor man no spend sadly but it was awesome seeing a family enjoy their amazing craft.
link the video?
I think I saw that video, too. Was it the one with the little kids playing D&D and the dad DMing? It was really sweet. :-)
I was the same for a while. My wife got me a dice vault from them for Christmas one year and I was so happy to have something of theirs and the hexy time Kickstarter will be my first backing for them. I did the math where if I put aside $25 a month until the Kickstarter ends that is my allowance for the hexes
Video link?
Had to go digging a bit to find it again, but here it is. 😊
ruclips.net/video/4CWnSfXK76I/видео.html
4:36 missed opportunity. "The philosophy of the Prophecy."
Quick sales tip to Doug: Anchoring high has been a very popular technique for a long time, but although it works, it also loses deals. You are losing sales on people who are willing to spend 5k, hear 15k, and are out the door.
I imagine once the MGT is available through non-Kickstarter means, they’ll be able to pivot those customers to that table.
Too many options can also not be good either. Apple purposely doesn't have as many products as they could because consumers don't feel as good about their purchase if there were many options available.
“First rule of sales club!”
“…don’t talk about sales club.”
“Don’t talk about sales club!”
Am in in the market for a prophecy? I do have a pauduke modular table but sure I could make myself one
oooohhhh Johnny, that strap idea -chef kiss- cause leather...ya know...it gets weird after a lot of wear and tear, that's nice to switch out and replace if needed. LOVE IT.
For the deck box: make sure you have a size that fits 100 card MTG Commander decks that are double sleeved with Dragon Shield sealable inner sleeves and matte outer sleeves. It's about the thickest combination of sleeving options, and most of the more compact box designs can't fit it. Get that down, and you'll get a great review from the prof at Tolarian Community College - who you should also probably send a review copy to and/or work with as a sponsorship to promote it, since he has the single largest MTG channel on youtube.
An additional option for an 80 card deck would also be really good, since while Commander is the most _popular_ format, most other formats use 60 card decks + a 15 card sideboard. Extra space for about 5 cards would allow for thicker sleeves like the above case, or be space for token cards.
This. This. This.
I don't think they need a smaller option. I can't stand Commander, but deck boxes that accommodate commander are great for everything else. There's always something else to throw in there. Heck, I could fit four or five unsleeved keyforge decks in there.
This right here
A standard deck with only plastic sleeves and no sideboard still benefits. I use bigger deck boxes to also slide in about 20 token cards, a few nondescript counters, and a die or two. The extra space is ALWAYS appreciated.
1000% this!
First off, as someone who recently left his job to do something else and was eviscerated by my boss, I was happy to see Bobby's comments on Fabrice leaving as being "hey, best of luck to him. I'm happy for him" As for Doug's sales training...yeah. Doug and I do completely different types of sales I think...
For sure that convo is what a functional team is supposed to look like. Unfortunately too many dysfunctional teams out there and often it starts with the person in charge who shouldn't be in charge
I once had a boss (a complete asshole) who told an employee who was leaving that the store she was going to would go out of business and shut down, and that she'll be back asking for a job. Years later, she's still there doing just fine.
what ever the content, i love Wyrmwood. I would likley watch anything you guys are doing
As someone who is also currently working in a strapped Marketing Department, find a great Project Manager in addition to hiring more creative crew. If you have someone solely dedicated to herding you cats, your lives will be sooooo much better.
When I start my new job and have enough saved up I want a Prophecy for the house my fiancee and I plan on getting. I just think it's a beautiful table, with so many functions and is a great conversation piece. Doug is a great salesman, he understands how to reel people back in from what is (worth it) a hefty price. Understanding the installments and having some say in something that has the love and care that Johnny and the team put into the product they make in my mind is 1000% worth it.
If you were open to remote work I'd apply to your media team in a heartbeat!
Please make sure the deck box is setup for the Commander format with space for 100 double sleeved cards. It’s the most popular format with some of the most expensive attainable decks
100 double sleeved cards using Dragon Shield sealable inner sleeves and matte outer sleeves. This alone will get them an A+ grade from the professor over at Tolarian Community College.
For the deck boxes, if you use Ian's diagram with just the center protruding, you could cut a Wyrmwood crest into the surface with the undercut so the leather fits underneath.
You could also add a wet-molding process to stiffen the leather straps using a pretty simple jig to make them fit the profile a bit better and prevent it from looking "floppy".
P. T. Barnum would be proud…
@bobby @dimitriy - the product side of the company is working in an agile methodology, why don't you guys give it a shot? it may help alleviate the overwhelming and burnout.
I have to agree with the dovetail idea, if you can run double dovetails in the molding machine that would take care of that problem real quick. Run 10 foot boards through it and then cut your lids one board length at a time compensating for blade kerf. Easy peasy
Super neat stuff this week; illuminating sales pitch and Johnny coming in clutch again!
Pretty hyped for that deck box
The deck box clearly needs magnets
agreed use magnets in the lid of the box and rivet a metal plate on the strap laser engrave the strap or a metal plate sandwich with the engraving on the top plate and fix it to the leather strap with 2 rivets this would be stronger and only needs to be thin and the blanks could be made on your neighbours turret press in seconds ! :) as nice as the full wood looks, its alot of spindle time which I believe is a bottle neck you want to avoid
I think they would hold off on that for the extra costs. But magnets are awesome.
Can't see the bottom row, but I think you guys want #9. The full gamut of product photography, graphic design, and layout.
Find a way to do remote with the media team. Sure, some stuff has to be there, on site. But editing? That doesn't need to be there. Figure out a pipeline to allow for remote, and suddenly, you open up your potential hires to a much broader, wider audience. Just keep photography, videography there, they toss it to a server that the editors can access remotely, and blammo. You're not limited to people who are local or able to relocate.
One question, and I think it would be beneficial for your sales team as well.
Why should I get a prophecy over a modular gaming table?
The title opening with the lazy Susan spin shots! Dayum! That looked so snappy! Every time I see those kinds of shots I'm like! That's mah boiiii JV!! Let's go! 👊 Keep up the good work media team, hang in there! 💪
Feels like a lot of wolf of wall street
Can confirm, I greatly relate to a trex.
We are but the prophecy dimensions are too damn long to fit in our dining room. Which is why the wait for the modular is so painful
You guys always snap with the end music
And now you know why their Kickstarters initial pledge cost to get in are so low...
i'm watching every bit of deck box info i can get to see if it will fit Commander decks or just Standard.
Their last deck boxes fit sleeved commander decks with no problem, so i imagine they would still work
Having "a big hole" in your department is better then having a "big a hole".
My mind was blown with Johnny's idea - I would have never thought about that in a million years. Would that be considered thinking outside the box or inside - but slightly out? 🤣
how does the lifting mechanism work? if thats not super top secret lol
Good luck with hiring, team! Been understaffed at my work for over year but slowly creeping back up. The hours it takes to get the right folks in makes it all worth it!
Doug's pitch made me realize that sales people end up on the same level of hell as lawyers. LOL
Loose the leather strap, go with magnets for the Deck box lid. Reduces the Sku's no over complications of leather wearing and tearing down over time. Keeps it clean and simple.
But need to make sure those inside dimensions can fit double sleeved commander decks. About 100-120 of these double sleeved cards. (100 is the main deck, extra 20 is for tokens and cards used outside the game. )
^^^^^^^This!^^^^^^^^
So you recommend simplifying the design to reduce SKUs, but then insist that the item meet your specific use case? Right....
@@Andrew_Head Double-sleeved capacity requirements are a mainstay of existing deck boxes, especially given the cost of MTG decks nowadays. Commander is also one of MTG's most popular formats, it's not a ridiculous request for a Commander sized deck box be developed in tandem with a standard sized one.
As an MTG player, I'd say keep the strap. I trust magnets to hold in my expensive cardboard a lot less than I do a strap with firm lateral snaps.
@@Andrew_Head - If you follow Tolarian Community College, the biggest reviewer of card game accessories on RUclips, his biggest ask is for a deck box that can fit a 100 card deck that's been sleeved with Dragon Shield's matte outer sleeves with their sealable inner sleeves as well. Most compact deck boxes can't fit this combination, so it's a good niche to target. For people with a 100 card deck that uses thinner sleeving options, it would still be a good choice because it could then fit some token cards as well. For people who play non-100 card formats, an 80 card box is pretty much the standard, since it fits a 60 card deck + 15 card sideboard with a little extra room for thicker sleeves or tokens as well.
This isn't really "insist on my specific use case", this is "what the market is demanding". I don't even like Commander as a format for the most part, but if I were making deck boxes it would be one of my core target demographics. Especially the thick-sleeve people, because people using that combination are going to be doing so because they have more expensive cards, which probably means they'll have more to spend on deck boxes. If you're selling what is essentially a luxury item, you shouldn't alienate the group most likely to be able and willing to afford it by insisting on a size that doesn't fit their needs.
Dinger, missed my chance to apply for wyrmwood again.
You did? Did they already hire?
@@sjokkoladehjerte i thought i did. Haven't actually looked on their website yet. Judging by this video though it seems like they have final choices for the position.
@@elizabethsimon3783 i would shoot in an application anyway, they may like yours better, or hire two people, or have you in mind for the next hire they need. Shoot your shot missy😄💁♀️
@@sjokkoladehjerte i think i will. Thank you for this. Keep being amazing.
at first glance i like 2,3,4,12 and then 17,18 for first round
They really sell themselves - I'm planning to once I solve the little issue of where to put it, aka: "having a house"...
That Kelly face set needs to be a raffle. $100 per entry means you only have to sell 470 entries to break even at that price given in the video. $100 for the chance at almost 1,400 tiles seems like one hell of a steal.
Oh wow, a Prophecy exists that's only $3,000? Wow what a deal... Time to make a few calls
I should have put this on the previous episode, if you are going to do a KDM themed table, can you also reach out to Red Raven games for some other design options?
Doug, as a dude in sales, you missed my need behind the need! Also, what are the benefits to these features my man. See you all at GENCON! Your booth is my fist stop.
How's that Kickstarter going?
Just a thought, but Tarot sized deck boxes?
You don't want people to think "IT'S 15K!?" you want them to be like "only 15k, huh aight"
How often would that leather need to come out of top on the deck box? If its every time you use the deck box that will wear down quick with active use. Like an overused belt the hole will stretch out overtime.
I think the leather strap is meant to be semi-permanently attached to the top, so you'd only remove it from the top when replacing the strap.
The strap goes down on each side of the box and attaches to something there, and that's the main open/close functionality
So... any chance of a Wyrmwood office desk?
Um.... at the beginning Paulie dressed like a mini Doug...
I don't think I am the only one thinking this, but if you guys are overworked going back to one time a week until you can "get those wheels turning" it would be understandable. Don't force yourselves into a meat grinder that wrecks your souls just to put out two shows a week, we all want you guys to be healthy and happy.
I think hunk I’m choking in the number that 1 percent of the people at gen con are potential customers for a 15 k table. I’m my (40 year) experience gaming I’d peg that lower. Maybe an example number for the talk but it has to be lower….
2:00 - Bobby's editing is so dumb, I love it.
It's fun to some amount.
Congrats to Febrece (I have absolutely no idea how to spell his name) on getting to go and do freelance.
Maaaan, now I want Fogo. Thanks Bobby.
I like the idea of an engraved wooden logo on top of the deckbox, but I'm not sure about making the leather swappable. If it's about options, we need to see said options and figure out if they're worth the trouble. If it's about simply losing the glue and/or making it replaceable over time, sure, why not?
I know a bit about leather and YES, you want to have options. You can go from a 10$ piece of leather to a 100$+ one, so there is a price point for everyone.
Why the strap? Why not just grove out the top part of the box and have the lid slide into place instead of sit on top? Is the woods to thin to support this?
Make the dovetail cut in a table router, measurement is from edge of the workpiece to the opposite side, then do a climbing cut. The cut will compress against the fence and you should be able to mill it out with 2 passes on the same machine. You can also set the bit height to be away from the bottom of the dato so you do not get swirl marks.
they know how to get the cut, but theyre trying to figure out the best way to mass produce the part. table router is an easy answer but its a lot more labor than setting up a machine to cut it automatically
A leather strap like that means interchangeable parts. So the leather warps and stretches with age: New one to fix it without buy a whole new unit.
W.r.t. selling the prophecy, when I'm on the showroom floor looking at expensive wyrmwood tables, the thing that most justifies the price to me is the exclusivity. If you say "this is a $15k table because we hand-make a handful each year", now my brain doesn't think " holy shit $15k for a gaming table?!" It thinks, "holy shit, ONLY $15k for a sweet gaming table that almost no one else has!" Regardless of whether I can afford it, the price now seems completely justified.
Depends. To me sales pitches based on rarity often make me think ”Oh so it’s just expensive cause the manufacturing hasn’t been optimized for scale - it’s not actually inherently expensive due to materials etc”
You still want to weed out the people that completely balk at the price. If they don't leave right away, that's when you continue to justify the cost. However, you're not going to convince someone that is thinking 3k to 15k, as likely as you can someone that thinks 8-10k, but you can bring to accepting 15k with things like that.
It really is a numbers game, and spending time with people that aren't anywhere near the same ballpark will waste time trying to sell to those that are.
It's very different selling at a con or market type venue, than a storefront where people come in already looking for what you sell. You have to catch people that want what you have when they aren't there particularly for you or what you have, and then sell them on yours.
@@BenRangel as they've shown on wyrmlife, not everything is worth scaling up. Sometimes it just makes more sense to hand make something in small batches due to the complexity of what would be necessary to mass produce it. And for those things, the price is easy to justify.
@@heroclix0rz oh I'm not arguing against that. Some things aren't worth scaling and then require a higher price.
Just saying that maybe that's not always the most alluring sales pitch for customers.
(But hey I'm not the target market so might be wrong)
Will you have MGT tables at GenCon?
Yes!
I have a pre order for a prophecy but with covid and the current hurricanes I'm not sure il be able to pay the first payment. Hoping I can figure it out
Is that a wild Paulie K i see????
im in taunton. ill come for an interview right now.
"qualified buyers"
Omg, Doug could sell me damn near anything. Hell, he sold me a Modular Game Table and Accessories. And pretty much everything that I've purchased from Wyrmwood, now that I think about it. 🤔
For the strapped deck box, could you have the lid, strap and plug be separate pieces? have the oval cut out with the beveled edges magnet to the top of the lid through the oval hole in the leather strap. While the lid has those mortised edges to hold down the edges.
Awesome sales training!
Is the wooden part in the middle of the top needed? Why not just have a channel running through the middle, maybe with two "belt loops" of wood bridging across the top so that from above it is square with a cut out in the middle. Just pull the strap through the channel and snap the top down to the bottom.
Now im not saying I'm a high school graduate who's very passionate about film and editing who lives in the new England area... but what I am is available
Lol, Whose Line!
Why not make the top slide into frame for the Deck box along with the leather strap. that way you won't have to worry about "flappy sides"
Figure out what you can outsource in the media department and then hire Febreeze to do it.
lol his name is Fabrice. I think pronouncing it as Febreeze is just how they mess with him as a friend
Still hoping for the deck boxes to have a Xl variant which supports 200 double sleeved cards so that my Commander deck actually fits since I never fitted them in any 100card box before.
I was in the market for a prophecy, until MGT came out
I loved the sales bit with Doug, also, long time fan from Indianapolis, does wyrmwood know which days they’ll be at gencon for?
I would always assume vendors will be there the entire convention unless they say otherwise. Booth space is too expensive and hard to come by (especially at GenCon) to let it sit fallow. Plus you're not really allowed to set up your booth once the convention is under way, especially one like Wyrmwoods' that is going to require the heavy equipment.
The alternate idea would work well - it would essentially be two passes with a dovetail router bit.
Either gonna go MGT when that reopens, or look and see if I can stretch for the prophecy. ME WANT!!!
How do I get a job on Wyrmlife?
Why not just pressure/friction fit the leather onto the box lid rather than having the undercut? Make the leather and the wood slightly thicker so it grips better and then you can do it the way Doug drew it.
I think they are trying to avoid the inevitable stretch of the leather. Even with medium use the strap would get loose over time. That will still happen with their design with the bevel but the leather won’t slip off since it wouldn’t stretch that much.
Doug's prophecy pitch would win me over... I better stay away from gencon LOL
Can another piece of wood just be laminated on top with a slight overhang? Is that too much work?
GM Screen when?
Need to get a home first before I even think about a table at that price.
Glenwyrmwood Glen Doug. Hated that movie. Icky.
Not in the market for a prophecy table at the moment but I would love to get one some day.
I can’t wait to waste one of the sales team’s time at GenCon 😛