My 12 year old son, who is our main pitcher on the 12u team, throws almost exclusively fastballs. I've taught him the circle change, the grip I used in high school. I've taught him the curveball, but explained to him to only throw it occasionally...meaning, if he throws 50-65 pitches, sprinkle in the curve maybe 10 times against the better hitters. Mainly I've taught him to just try and change speeds and location, read how the hitter is in the box, is he late, is he early, does he like high junk he can't lay off of etc. I think there should be less focus on little leaguers throwing curves and more focus on pitching IQ, knowing how to keep a hitter off balance. Great vid coach.
sounds like youre doing the right things - I agree that curveballs are not evil, I just dont want parents allowing their kids to throw a million of them on the false pretense that they're throwing some so-called "safe" version
Always a continuous topic. The study Dan is linking and ANSI studies prove what he is saying. My 12 year old son is a southpaw. He throws a 4, 2 seam, change and curve. His pitching coach started the curve when he was 11 but he never threw it in games. Not to mention unless you have a nasty change up his pitching coach will not teach anyone a curve. For example my son pitched this past weekend in AZ. 55 pitches over 5 innings, 9’ks, no walks and gave up 1 hit. My son only threw 5 curves during that outing. Primary pitches were 4/2 seams and his change up. His coaches limit it well and don’t abuse these kids. I’ve seen some ridiculous pitch calling with some teams and kids just throwing fast balls and curve balls, nothing else. It’s bad coaching.
Same here my 11 year old is learning his curveball and change up. He throws them well but I only let him throw it when he’s up on a hitter 0-2 or three hitter is swinging and missing at everything and at most 8-10 times a game.
Another great video Dan! Out here in Hawaii, my 12 year old son started a LL scrimmage game at catcher, and finished at pitcher, 3 innings at each. This is after they just finished a "winter" league where he kind of does the same thing except they had a stable of pitchers on that team. Has me concerned since I watched his last game and I counted about 15 breaking balls out of about 45 pitches. They have a former pro pitcher coaching and calling pitches. Not sure why he has him throwing breaking balls at some kids that are barely standing in the batters box, not swinging and just looking to walk. Either way it worked out, and he's finally showing good command of a second pitch. From my experience pitching in college, I understand how stressful the breaking ball can be on your elbow, especially the UCL. Just want to have fun, but I'm also enjoying the compliments from other fans when he buckles a batter's knees or swords them. What are you're thoughts?
So me and my uncle were playing catch in our backyard and he was showing me this pitch called the “football curve” your grip it like you are holding a football, with your hand grasped within booth horseshoes. but you throw it like a fastball, the way it acts like a curve is it slips out of your hand and gets front spin. When I throw this I am still pronating my arm. IS this a “safe Curveball”?
Hi Dan! I love your content and currently going through your Pitching isnt complicated book, which is great. My question is, what would be your 3 tips for a new pitcher who struggles at the mound. IE, i have been pitching for a year alone indoor, my velo sits around 65-70 which is more then enough for my amateur league. But when I face a real batter, my velo drops and so does my command. Need help! My friends told me not to care about the batters, and to throw harder but that doesnt seem to help. Kinda stuck rn. Thank you, Remi
What pitch would you recommend for a 11/12 year old who struggles with the changeup? I have a couple boys on my team who can't throw a changeup for a strike to save their lives, and both have been working on the pitch for at least 2 seasons. Both have good fastballs (4 seam). One is starting to learn a 2 seam/sinker but hasn't perfected it. The other is working on a "cutter" which looks like a slider grip but he releases it like a fastball and it only drops 4-5 mph compared to his 4 seam.
definitely not a cutter - I have videos explaining why it's wildly inappropriate and never thrown properly at young ages. They need to find a new coach to teach them the changeup. If they cant learn it in 2 years, it's the instructor's fault. There's no pitch in existence that can't be at least decent after two years.
@@DanBlewett Thanks for the feedback. I think that may be part of the problem. One kid has seen 3 different pitching coaches and they all teach him a different grip. Will tell him to scrap the cutter tho. Thanks!
@@deepzone31 when I see this video, one of the main points I’m getting from it is that it is unnecessary to give a youth player tools that their maturity level can’t use properly. My son is 10 and he’s working with a fastball and a change up. Proper mechanics is already difficult to achieve on a consistent basis at this age.
So I saw your video on the pitches to not throw, and I noticed that you had a slurve. I throw a spike-curveball (Like Charlie Morton or AJ Burnett) but it has sweep+spin that makes it look like a sliding-curveball. I mix it with a changeup or a two-seam that both have solid movement. I also HAD a good slider, so should I throw that instead of the spike curve, and learn a different curveball? I don’t know if this makes a difference, but I’m a 5’8 Freshman in highschool. If I can’t throw these due to the fact that I haven’t grown into them, should I throw them in the future after I’ve grown/gotten more durable?
Q: I'm in high school (junior), and one of my teammates (freshmen) that I'm helping out with is arsenal. I have him working on a cutter to get familiar with supination (he does not use it in a game, just flat ground) do you think this in a valid coaching method to learn a curveball and/or a slider?
Not really. Cutters are very hard to throw properly, much harder than either of the other two. The supination is very subtle and it’s rare to see any high schooler throw them correctly.
i forgot to mention, look at all the football plyrs , a curvball is thrown so similar to a football, but no one tells football players to stop throwin, once again OVERUSE is the enemy
footballs weigh drastically more and are thrown drastically slower because of it. comparing the two is largely irrelevant because of this fact - it's apples to oranges.
Why is a changeup better to learn before a curve? With a curve, the wrist/arm needs to stay as neutral as possible. But with a change, it works best if there is a little extra pronation. Shouldn't the wrist being neutral be the safest possible way to throw a baseball?
changeups are proven through research to be less stressful: pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28968139/ also, you need a changeup AND a breaking ball - I'm not advocating people don't throw curves or sliders. I'm simply trying to help people stop believing this idea that their 12 year old can throw a "safe" version.
yeah - it's a problem in youth baseball because then parents dont think its a problem if their 12 year old throws 50 curveballs in a 90-pitch game, because it's "safe." Like eating a whole pizza thinking its health food - that was what I was trying to disprove here. I dont think curveballs in the general sense are to blame for arm injuries.
I tell my son to use the curveball to just show the other team he has one, maybe when he faces the lineup a second time around. And just to have fun while competing. Otherwise fastball, change up.
No pitch is "safe" per say. If you over throw, you will always get hurt. Having said that, young pitchers should be taught mechanics and arm car first. My philosophy, Coaches shouldnt teach any pitches until mechanics are sound and you can control a 4 seamer. Most kids cant, so even bother teaching a curve
@@DanBlewett i know, sorry that was kinda my own take as a PT. But it makes sense biomechanically - the fully supinated position on a curveball sets up the elbow for trouble, the fast armspeed and deceleration on a fastball the rotator cuff.. wouldn't you agree?
the reason kids who throw more offspeed pitches have more arm pain or injuries is cus they are usually the better pitchers and coaches use them more, its OVERUSE that is the main issue NOT offspeed pitches, the study you reference is very flawed, also when you throw a curveball your body compensates by having you throw it slower wich puts less stress on arm, OVERUSE is the enemy not any individual pitch
@@DanBlewett well that study was useless, anyway i appreciate and love your videos, my son is 9yrs old and is a freakin beast because of you and tread athletics, thnx for all the great info you put out
@@DanBlewett its just a study Dan, some flaws are that 18 is a small sample size, not exactly going into each of the individual kinematic body differences, varying degrees of different arm slots from body types and builds, ages of the group....its just another study to me that reflects that there is no perfect way for any single group of throwers and coaches to teach proper throwing. (BTW, I really enjoy your content so do get me wrong here, I'm just venting somewhat)....but the change up is just one of the hardest pitches for development of youth due to varying levels of growth and maturity. Anything other than teaching control of the fastball and the different ways to hold the baseball seams for throwing fastballs is the mistake from my pov. One of the best pitches, and underutilized pitches for youth is the "1 seam" fastball, and learning how to hold it to create sinker like movement on a standard fastball release like any other 4 seam or 2 seam (there are some great videos showing people holding this and varying degrees of natural ball movement). Some kids may have just have bigger hands at 10-11-12, and introducing varying change up grips and teaching proper curves will at least keep them from doing it wrong amongst their peer group and screw up their arms when coaches and parents aren't watching. Looking forward to more content from you on this Hot Topic 💪⚾️
Curveballs are extremely dangerous to young kids, because it puts your arm in a very strange position compared to a fastball. The study is very useful because it was done by people who have a much better idea about baseball than you. Dan should know bc he pitched in pro ball. Questioning verified research is pretty stupid if you ask me. The Curveball is harmful, period.
My 12 year old son, who is our main pitcher on the 12u team, throws almost exclusively fastballs. I've taught him the circle change, the grip I used in high school. I've taught him the curveball, but explained to him to only throw it occasionally...meaning, if he throws 50-65 pitches, sprinkle in the curve maybe 10 times against the better hitters. Mainly I've taught him to just try and change speeds and location, read how the hitter is in the box, is he late, is he early, does he like high junk he can't lay off of etc. I think there should be less focus on little leaguers throwing curves and more focus on pitching IQ, knowing how to keep a hitter off balance. Great vid coach.
sounds like youre doing the right things - I agree that curveballs are not evil, I just dont want parents allowing their kids to throw a million of them on the false pretense that they're throwing some so-called "safe" version
Thanks for this information. I've heard that the 12-6 was safe, but listening to you I now know better. We'll wait until 14.
Thank you for help.
❤
Always a continuous topic. The study Dan is linking and ANSI studies prove what he is saying.
My 12 year old son is a southpaw. He throws a 4, 2 seam, change and curve.
His pitching coach started the curve when he was 11 but he never threw it in games. Not to mention unless you have a nasty change up his pitching coach will not teach anyone a curve.
For example my son pitched this past weekend in AZ. 55 pitches over 5 innings, 9’ks, no walks and gave up 1 hit. My son only threw 5 curves during that outing. Primary pitches were 4/2 seams and his change up.
His coaches limit it well and don’t abuse these kids. I’ve seen some ridiculous pitch calling with some teams and kids just throwing fast balls and curve balls, nothing else.
It’s bad coaching.
Same here my 11 year old is learning his curveball and change up. He throws them well but I only let him throw it when he’s up on a hitter 0-2 or three hitter is swinging and missing at everything and at most 8-10 times a game.
Another great video Dan! Out here in Hawaii, my 12 year old son started a LL scrimmage game at catcher, and finished at pitcher, 3 innings at each. This is after they just finished a "winter" league where he kind of does the same thing except they had a stable of pitchers on that team. Has me concerned since I watched his last game and I counted about 15 breaking balls out of about 45 pitches. They have a former pro pitcher coaching and calling pitches. Not sure why he has him throwing breaking balls at some kids that are barely standing in the batters box, not swinging and just looking to walk. Either way it worked out, and he's finally showing good command of a second pitch. From my experience pitching in college, I understand how stressful the breaking ball can be on your elbow, especially the UCL. Just want to have fun, but I'm also enjoying the compliments from other fans when he buckles a batter's knees or swords them. What are you're thoughts?
So me and my uncle were playing catch in our backyard and he was showing me this pitch called the “football curve” your grip it like you are holding a football, with your hand grasped within booth horseshoes. but you throw it like a fastball, the way it acts like a curve is it slips out of your hand and gets front spin. When I throw this I am still pronating my arm. IS this a “safe Curveball”?
its the same junk pitch they call the safe curveball, yes
I agree there's plenty of other pitches to learn besides a curveball, knuckle, screwball and change-up I say are bad for arms
I never knew how to throw curve slider before good videos
Super-interesting and for us very timely, thank you.
Hi Dan! I love your content and currently going through your Pitching isnt complicated book, which is great.
My question is, what would be your 3 tips for a new pitcher who struggles at the mound. IE, i have been pitching for a year alone indoor, my velo sits around 65-70 which is more then enough for my amateur league.
But when I face a real batter, my velo drops and so does my command. Need help! My friends told me not to care about the batters, and to throw harder but that doesnt seem to help. Kinda stuck rn.
Thank you,
Remi
What pitch would you recommend for a 11/12 year old who struggles with the changeup? I have a couple boys on my team who can't throw a changeup for a strike to save their lives, and both have been working on the pitch for at least 2 seasons. Both have good fastballs (4 seam). One is starting to learn a 2 seam/sinker but hasn't perfected it. The other is working on a "cutter" which looks like a slider grip but he releases it like a fastball and it only drops 4-5 mph compared to his 4 seam.
definitely not a cutter - I have videos explaining why it's wildly inappropriate and never thrown properly at young ages. They need to find a new coach to teach them the changeup. If they cant learn it in 2 years, it's the instructor's fault. There's no pitch in existence that can't be at least decent after two years.
@@DanBlewett Thanks for the feedback. I think that may be part of the problem. One kid has seen 3 different pitching coaches and they all teach him a different grip. Will tell him to scrap the cutter tho. Thanks!
If he's been exposed to a different change-up grip from multiple instructors then the kid has the tools to figure out which one works.
@@deepzone31 when I see this video, one of the main points I’m getting from it is that it is unnecessary to give a youth player tools that their maturity level can’t use properly. My son is 10 and he’s working with a fastball and a change up. Proper mechanics is already difficult to achieve on a consistent basis at this age.
So I saw your video on the pitches to not throw, and I noticed that you had a slurve. I throw a spike-curveball (Like Charlie Morton or AJ Burnett) but it has sweep+spin that makes it look like a sliding-curveball. I mix it with a changeup or a two-seam that both have solid movement. I also HAD a good slider, so should I throw that instead of the spike curve, and learn a different curveball?
I don’t know if this makes a difference, but I’m a 5’8 Freshman in highschool. If I can’t throw these due to the fact that I haven’t grown into them, should I throw them in the future after I’ve grown/gotten more durable?
Q: I'm in high school (junior), and one of my teammates (freshmen) that I'm helping out with is arsenal. I have him working on a cutter to get familiar with supination (he does not use it in a game, just flat ground) do you think this in a valid coaching method to learn a curveball and/or a slider?
Not really. Cutters are very hard to throw properly, much harder than either of the other two. The supination is very subtle and it’s rare to see any high schooler throw them correctly.
@@DanBlewett Thanks, to help the same guy out do you have any tips to not spick the curveball into the dirt. that is his primary problem.
i forgot to mention, look at all the football plyrs , a curvball is thrown so similar to a football, but no one tells football players to stop throwin, once again OVERUSE is the enemy
footballs weigh drastically more and are thrown drastically slower because of it. comparing the two is largely irrelevant because of this fact - it's apples to oranges.
Why is a changeup better to learn before a curve?
With a curve, the wrist/arm needs to stay as neutral as possible. But with a change, it works best if there is a little extra pronation.
Shouldn't the wrist being neutral be the safest possible way to throw a baseball?
changeups are proven through research to be less stressful: pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28968139/ also, you need a changeup AND a breaking ball - I'm not advocating people don't throw curves or sliders. I'm simply trying to help people stop believing this idea that their 12 year old can throw a "safe" version.
@@DanBlewett Oh I see, thanks. Yeah agreed the thinking that throwing a particular pitch is completely safe is wrong.
yeah - it's a problem in youth baseball because then parents dont think its a problem if their 12 year old throws 50 curveballs in a 90-pitch game, because it's "safe." Like eating a whole pizza thinking its health food - that was what I was trying to disprove here. I dont think curveballs in the general sense are to blame for arm injuries.
I tell my son to use the curveball to just show the other team he has one, maybe when he faces the lineup a second time around. And just to have fun while competing. Otherwise fastball, change up.
No pitch is "safe" per say. If you over throw, you will always get hurt. Having said that, young pitchers should be taught mechanics and arm car first. My philosophy, Coaches shouldnt teach any pitches until mechanics are sound and you can control a 4 seamer. Most kids cant, so even bother teaching a curve
My arm feels fine when I throw a bunch of cureves
So very simplified you could say, fastball = more stress on the shoulder. Curveball = more stress on the elbow.
...no? I didnt say or imply that.
@@DanBlewett i know, sorry that was kinda my own take as a PT. But it makes sense biomechanically - the fully supinated position on a curveball sets up the elbow for trouble, the fast armspeed and deceleration on a fastball the rotator cuff.. wouldn't you agree?
I'd mostly agree with that yes - thanks for clarifying.
I’m cooking my dad in backyard baseball ⚾️
the reason kids who throw more offspeed pitches have more arm pain or injuries is cus they are usually the better pitchers and coaches use them more, its OVERUSE that is the main issue NOT offspeed pitches, the study you reference is very flawed, also when you throw a curveball your body compensates by having you throw it slower wich puts less stress on arm, OVERUSE is the enemy not any individual pitch
and no - here's a study that explains that you're wrong. pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28968139/
@@DanBlewett well that study was useless, anyway i appreciate and love your videos, my son is 9yrs old and is a freakin beast because of you and tread athletics, thnx for all the great info you put out
what was useless about it?
@@DanBlewett its just a study Dan, some flaws are that 18 is a small sample size, not exactly going into each of the individual kinematic body differences, varying degrees of different arm slots from body types and builds, ages of the group....its just another study to me that reflects that there is no perfect way for any single group of throwers and coaches to teach proper throwing. (BTW, I really enjoy your content so do get me wrong here, I'm just venting somewhat)....but the change up is just one of the hardest pitches for development of youth due to varying levels of growth and maturity. Anything other than teaching control of the fastball and the different ways to hold the baseball seams for throwing fastballs is the mistake from my pov. One of the best pitches, and underutilized pitches for youth is the "1 seam" fastball, and learning how to hold it to create sinker like movement on a standard fastball release like any other 4 seam or 2 seam (there are some great videos showing people holding this and varying degrees of natural ball movement). Some kids may have just have bigger hands at 10-11-12, and introducing varying change up grips and teaching proper curves will at least keep them from doing it wrong amongst their peer group and screw up their arms when coaches and parents aren't watching. Looking forward to more content from you on this Hot Topic 💪⚾️
Curveballs are extremely dangerous to young kids, because it puts your arm in a very strange position compared to a fastball. The study is very useful because it was done by people who have a much better idea about baseball than you. Dan should know bc he pitched in pro ball. Questioning verified research is pretty stupid if you ask me. The Curveball is harmful, period.