Honestly, this decade in my 20s, between increasing work hours, hiking cost of living, increasing rent due to AirBnB epidemic in my city, the fact that I have family at the parts of the world under war at the moment - sex doesn't even enter my orbit of issues or things to deal with.
I feel that the real problem among here isn't a lack of sex, but isolation. People who are stuck on their own with no way of socialising are generally not likely to be having much sex, in addition to the various other impacts of being trapped and alone.
Yes. I've always seen sex as something that happens when a proper, intimate connection is formed. Even if it is "just" a hookup, there has to be *something* there. The lack of that something - desire, motivation, confidence, ability to express yourself sexually - is what the real issues are, and point to a broader issue.
@@misstigerbubblesI think that often groups such as incels mean connection, rather than intercourse, which is the most personal and intimate act 2 people can have. Of course, this becomes rather literal when radicalisation occurs, but for many, I think that is actually the case.
There should be no right to sex, there should be no right to intimacy, all has to be earned and conditional and fully consented on both sides. Even as a man I know it, even if I suffer I don't care.
You have no right to sex but you shouldn't be called entitled when you become unhappy for not having any. People like to play around with words to avoid the reality that it is absolutely devastating to go through life without an intimate partner.
My problem with this whole right to sex phrasing, is that i can see it turning very dark very quickly. Some people already feel entitled to other's bodies. Imagine if someone tries to withdraw consent but now people think they have a "right" to sex. Even though it's meant to decriminalize things like prostitution, i can imagine people abusing it right away.
I agree that it will become weaponised VERY quickly, because there's a lot of pent up frustration and anger. I foresee a lot of revenge being taken out on women generally, prostitutes specifically.
Withdrawing the consent and leaving the relationship while the other feels entitled to you and your body. I've seen this one, and I agree it can escalate easily into the ugly things. I believe it's down to education and the individual mentality that can't grasp some of the concepts and have to be regulated externally by the set of the rules or laws.
I think "the right to sex" sounds bad but the original twitter thread isn't about men having the right to have sex with any woman without consequence or issue, or that people (particularly men) are entitled to sex with whomever they want. the way it's phrased sounds like that, but what she's actually talking about is about people's rights to having sex without facing stigma for it. which doesn't mean decriminalizing actual assault, but if someone wants to have sex with a stranger or without any strings attached, or even if they pay for sex to occur, that shouldn't be something that is criminal or stigmatized. people have the right to engage in these activities without any issue - but currently, that's not the case as sex work and sex without relationships is harshly looked down on, especially when women are the ones that are engaging in these activities (as we can see from the slutshaming thats so common in society)
I think the "lack of sex" statistic is often used as a problem when in reality is only a symptom. Sex is used as a placeholder for human connection, intimacy and validation. And sex can be a very intimate experience, but it does not have to be. So in that sense I do no think that the "Right to sex" thing is an actual solution. We can have a society of people who all have sex but feel lonely, detached from each other and ultimately sad or miserable. I saw a video that talked about how we lack spaces to meet people "spontaneously" like we did before. Since we do not have places like this anymore we have to use things like Tinder, that is something so far from "normal" that 20 years ago I would tell you that it's sci-fi nonsense. Add to that that Tinder's main goal is not to find you love or sex, but to profit. The conclusion to that video was that we could build spaces in cities that allow for community to develop in a spontaneous manner.
The pandemic really threw the lack of public spaces into stark relief. A 18-22 college social club that I am the supervisor for had to go online only in 2020, and people who had talked online with one another for an entire year and a half didn't actually get to meet each other face to face until sometime in fall of 2021. It took another year of interaction for relationships to start to normalize again, and we had a wave of couples forming in the last few months here in fall of 2022. That's critical socialization time that was robbed from those young people, and I don't think some of them will ever recover. Online spaces are a pale substitute for face to face communication and connection, even non romantic ones. And these kids are the lucky ones, because they do have access to that open public space, with organized activities for socialization. Not every young adult has the opportunity to go to college, and those in my acquaintance are the ones most forced to replace healthy in person socialization with online only attempts instead.
It is a symptom, and while I don't think sex *has* to be intimate, I think that for many people there is a natural progression of learning social skills and developing relationships that makes sex a consequence. Not having those skills and checks is what creates a lot of modern incels. And while you can have sex without feeling that romantic passion or intimacy, I believe thoroughly that for most incels, that lack of social and relational development which would lead to them having sex is actually what's bothering them. If it was really just about sex for them, they'd find a legal avenue to hook up with a prostitute and be done with them. But if you ask them, which I have, they would say that it's cheating/doesn't count, since they didn't earn it and the person they slept with didn't do so out of desire, but only because they got paid.
@@newperson9662 maybe not in quantity, maybe not short-term, but long term I do believe 1/3 or more of guys pretty much being incel is going to affect women too.
@@Jazzmaster1992 1/3 of 50% men being incels doesn't affect women because they all are still going to date and have sex with the rest. Yes, they wont be able to marry, but who needs marriage nowadays? They can easily have sex, intimacy, and companionship with attractive men in short term relationships.
As a man with sexual trauma, I just wanted to say that you've been able to put into words the feelings I have had for years about sex and the fractured relationship between men and women in modern society. The extreme politicization of sex has made it nearly impossible for me to put myself out there because I can't relax enough to be comfortable around anyone. You're right: when sex is removed from the context of antipolitical love, it becomes something very strange and sinister. It becomes profane, when it should be sacred. Thank you. Never doubt that your words have immense impact. They have helped me and many others navigate the chaos. I only wish that more public figures were as reasonable and intelligent as you.
Isn’t that the issue? That sex is no longer scene as sacred. The you use to have to court someone, marry someone to have it. But now marriage, family and religion are in decline and these barriers for sex have been removed as well as the need to connect and really know one another. It’s become more transactional and simply physical.
People can have a healthy sexual encounter without being in love or wanting to get married. Its about two parties respecting each other and communicating with each other.
I kind of detest this idea that all the young men just “need to have sex” because the majority of young men I know don’t want sex they want relationships they want somebody who cares about them. I feel like just saying they want sex is discounting their feelings
The 'incels' are pathologically *obsessed* with sex and don't even realize that that's what makes them so creepy to women. And they fail to realize that many women and other men(!) aren't having sex either, and aren't 'suffering' from and being bitter about it the way the incels do. I'm starting to form the theory that what incels actually want is human connection, the same way everyone else does, but won't admit this (because that would require realizing that it's them and their personalities that actually drive others away) and instead see having sex as a 'magic bullet' solution to all their problems.
@iNSTAGiB I don't disagree with anything you wrote. And I have no problem with p0rn. The issue with people who go to incel forums is they become very extreme, blame women for all their problems, don't take any accountability or make any effort to improve themselves, and generally live in a state of perpetual victimhood because they're not getting what they want -- sex. My point is, not only will getting it not actually fix these people's problems, but that most guys I know who aren't getting laid either -- even though I know they want to -- don't go so far as to become *that*.
That's similar to the realisation that people studying incels had some years ago. It went like this: Incels: "Need pussy 😡" Everyone else: "Prostitutes exist." Incels: "Not like that! 🤬" Eventually people (including incels) realised that it's not sex they actually want, they want to be desired and/or be desirable. Sex was just a proxy for that external validation. The Western stereotype of men is emotionless and constantly horny so _if they're expressing a negative emotion is must be cos they're sexually frustrated_ 🙄
The biggest contributing factor to this problem is the commodification of human interaction via social media. The more time we spend online the less time we spend in the real world finding a meaningful connection. Facebook started off as a way to connect with friends at school but that wasn't the best way to keep people engaged and on the platform. In order to maximize profits the algorithm shifted to showing us the most funny post, the most educational, the most entertaining. This meant that fewer and fewer people's content were being marketed and thus it became a way to consume content rather than make new friends.
you cant waste people time trying to get this meaningful connection because alot of people dont want to sit around talking for 10 hours with someone all i hear is using someone to talk their ear off i know men who sit around listening to a woman for hours and still got not where . stop with this meaningful connection bullshit nobody should have to listen to someone for hours and hours
@@TheCoolgame24 that’s the problem. You want a superficial relationship. Not one that is meaningful and long lasting. In order to have a relationship that is worth a damn that involves talking and reciprocal care. You have no one but yourself to blame if you refuse to care about anyone but yourself.
@@casperthenotsofriendlyghos8968 and the men who talk for 1000 hours still get cheated on I use to do P.I work and I saw most of the conversations it didnt help shit and exposed so many women all that talking shit never worked it just a waste of time for a man
@@casperthenotsofriendlyghos8968 tons of men are talking and talking wasting 4000 hours talking to women and you know they still get cheated on and left so what you have to say about that no man should have to waste 1000 hours to a woman for her to just cheat or left
Define enthusiastic? I have sex sometimes with my partner when I am not entirely on the mood (I go through phases of having a low libido). I consent but not enthusiastically in those cases.
As someone who is demisexual - I genuinely can’t bring myself to have sex with someone I barely know even if I do think they’re physically attractive. I feel this internal resistance so if I’m dating someone sex is probably off the table for a month or two, even if we’re getting on really well, making out, and mutually attracted to each other. No guy I have dated has ever waited up to five weeks before they start cancelling plans (plans they made) to hang out with other people they were dating. They don’t leave, they just start flake on plans. My guess is they are having sex elsewhere, and not getting sex from me feels like rejection. I would never expect / give exclusivity or commitment in less than two months, but it seems quite obvious that most men start to run out of ideas of how to connect to women if sex isn’t on the table.
I feel sorry for you, that no guy waited for you longer than 5 weeks! Honestly, i am not demisexual, but i waited more then 1 year for my ex girlfriend of 7 years (really loved her very much). In these days, the vaccination against hpv was quiet new, so i suggest, that she should do this first, because she was a virgin anyways (in the age of 24). What i did'nt new is, that it takes 3 injections in several months, but i waited anyways....Years later (still a couple), we were talking about this and it turned out, that she thought i was waiting because her childhood in another, conservative country...But even if this would have been the issue, i would have waited for her as well. In the end, i was just thankful for our great relationship of 7+ years
I have the same experience as you in dating. I might be on the demisexual spectrum as well but I'm not sure. I definitely cannot be intimate without trust and a sense of safety and that takes time to develop. Most men lose interest in me/disappear after a few dates either because they feel like I'm not interested or "conservative" or they were not that interested in me beyond sex and are getting it elsewhere. Either way, I've started to make peace with solitude until and unless I find someone who is willing to take the time to know me and establish that environment of safety and trust.
Love seeing a privileged, middle class, white woman in the West who doesn’t have to choose between selling her body or providing food for herself/her kids campaign for a “right to sex”. Which really means a right for society to commodify poorer women’s bodies so people of her class don’t have to deal with the “incel” problem directly.
I don't think that is precisely the type of "right" she was discussing, but I think you've precisely identified the effects, holy shit. Commerce destroys anything it touches.
Something that came to mind throughout watching this…the idea of having a “right” to sex is convoluted without recognizing that sex has consequences. Those consequences can of course be positive or negative but they are effects, nonetheless. Children? Pregnancy? Physical issues? None of this seems to be touched on by people who are arguing for this so-called politicized “right”. As always, amazing video Kid :)❤️
But who is arguing for a "right" to sex? As opposed to a "desire" for it? Because let's be real, it's the latter of the two which is really going on. But these men are considered unattractive, which is why people *lie* and say that "incels" think they are "entitled" to sex.
@@rockymvvrcianu6846 nobody's ever said ppl aren't allowed to have desires. everyone has desires. they're uncontrollable. most people, when they can't find a date, think "it's unfortunate. it would sure be nice to have a date." and they leave it at that. if an incel acts as if other people are depriving them of something for refusing sex, then they'd be entitled.
Lovely follow up from your previous video. As you said before, our current generation has missed out on the "coming of age" phase. The whole boy meets girl, girl meets boy and working through the fear of getting to know each other. The our fast paced world has stripped us that crucial phase.
I definitely agree with this. I feel like one moment I was a high school kid and immediately after I was working long days, paying bills, waking up at 4am everyday. Fast forward to now, I'm 27 and I'm too old to go an meet people. Those awkward learning moments early on have passed by. I've come to peace with it.
@@newperson9662 agreed, men's rates of sex and relationship-forming are way down while women's rates haven't at all, meaning women are not affected negatively as in they don't have no one to date. Dating apps and social media have given nothing but a pure unfair advantage to women, although I'll concede that it's harder for them to sort through the men. Women are having their experiences and more, while men are not.
@@pointblanks You do know that there's 162.83 mil men in America and 166.24.mil women. So you do know for relationship formation it requires a one individual from each of those two populations. 20% of the male population can't be dating 90% of the female population, which kind of just a little maybe... completely undermines the logic of this disadvantaged male phenomenon that simply just isn't a thing in real life.
@@Romana6794 20% of the top males may not be dating 90%+ of females however it's pretty high. Are you trying to say that because there's more females, dating gives men the advantage? It should if that's the only variable yet there's so many more. In practice, that's not how it works according to biology. Women are the ones who choose and are pursued, not men. You don't think a highly desired guy can be a player and date 5 women at the same time and refuse to give any of them a relationship? On a similar thought, you don't think a decent-looking woman, who has 50+ matches in her dating apps and guys sliding into her DMs, can't or won't date 5 guys at the same time? We're in hook-up culture, not traditional monogamy. 1-on-1 pairings are not mandatory and people are not forming relationships.
The reason why we shame people for sex is because the want for will always be there and it’s someone a lot of people want to do. It’s why we say we shouldn’t feel entitled to sex but we shame people who can’t get it at the same time.
I definitely do not see any issue with that, but I accept I am a minority. Also I am a woman and I can accept this judgement may affect men more? I was troubled by this in my twenties thinking it will validate my worth somehow. Now in my thirties realised it is in no way connected and completely fine with it. Have bigger problems like paying rent.
Sex positive feminists didn't win, men did. Everyone does have the right to sex, it's called masturbation. When talking about the right to sex it seems to be from a male perspective. Where are all the hot guys making themselves available to service women with poor social skills?
Sad thing is, they never would be, because they're more well off, and because they aren't gromed to by porn culture and the male gaze. If you ask an incel, he would tell you there are no such woman, because "sex" to them is just physical coitus with a member of the opposite sex. They don't care about pleasure, or consent in the encounter, so they're not demanding rights to that.
The attractive men servicing socially inept women are everywhere, doing their "job" except the women don't have to pay, they just need to alert the attractive men of their intentions and the men will oblige pro bono. How do you not know this?
What Alexandra Hunt doesn't realise is that if we did have a truly healthy sexual culture, there would be very few people willing to go into the sex trade to provide this kind of Universal Basic Sex Care. Every study shows that going into the sex industry, even consensually, vastly correlates with previous experiences of child sex abuse.
Yep. I don't see many affluent college educated white women - not to mention men - dropping their cosy jobs to get into sex work or saying that their dream is to be a prostitutes. Somehow the sex industry is always dominated by immigrant poor women of color, who *coincidentally* are some of the most socially and economically vulnerable demographics in society. Funny how that works.
@@purplebutterfly314 You're right on. Elly Arrow is a fantastic channel you should check out if you want to learn more. She talks about how the pro-sex trade lobby in Germany where it is legalised is pretty much only represented by high class escorts, meanwhile the majority immigrant, non-german speaking labor force has no say
@@RapidBlindfolds isn’t that like every market those where those at the top get the very best in terms profit and customer quality and the people at the bottom get what’s left?
@@purplebutterfly314 There are some very high end call girls out in Silicon Valley who went into the profession because they enjoy it, and their clientele wants someone who is educated who can hold a conversation with them, but those workers are the exception for sure. (And they also charge $2000 a night.) I recall an interview with one of the women who said her clients honestly really did just want to talk more than anything else. They craved a human connection and were too busy or shy to try to make one, and she considered it a calling that she could give them that connection, even if only for a day. But those exceptions are perhaps 1% of sex workers in the US, and the vast majority are uneducated, exploited, and trapped.
The phrase ‘right to sex’ is so unsettling to me, I can’t help but think that someone would have to be forced into a sexual relationship for this vision to come true, rights make sure people are provided with objects like food and clothing, and services like medical assistance, so they don’t die. Is sex really something your survival depends on?
Totally agree. People already have what one might call the freedom to have sex (well, not everywhere in the world, but generally). If they aren't getting it when they want it, chances are that it's because people don't want to have sex with them. And that is their right. You don't have the right to use another person for your own enjoyment. Sex is mutual.
Love this video. I think the reason why sex is so politicized is because it is a foundational part of any society. Particularly because whether we like it or not, children are the products of sex. Unfortunately for most of human history, the responsibility of children and therefore “gatekeeping” sexuality has been put on the shoulders of women since our biology is closely tied to the creation of children. Keep in mind, most women who have existed have never had access to birth control since it is a relatively new technology. Having sex for pleasure and connection with a man has always been a gamble if she did not want to have a child.
The last couple minutes of this video was some of your best commentary yet. Many problems in our society, from many different angles, have come about due to making the personal political and from trying to make everything we may lack into a “right.” And, of course, there are always those waiting in the wings to exploit this demand that a “right” be delivered. No shortage of grifters and power-mongers, from the most petty manipulators to the highest offices.
The right to sex is the most privileged and aberrant thing I've ever come across. Humans span the range from non to consentual intercourse and this reflects the complexity of the full range of social relationships across cultures. Sex cannot be homogenised across the homo sapiens in the way it is done with other species, it is simply a facet of an individual's lot in life, with luck being a larger factor than it is in wealth creation.
@@aichabelle267 In practice, I would agree with you, and please forgive me if my comment seemed to imply this political reality is a recent development. Now, I'm not naive enough to expect society to reach an absolute state of divorce between personal and political, but I don't agree that "personal is political" is the default or inevitable reality. We could certainly take steps to move in a direction that left more of the personal realm untouched by both political debate and institutional interference, and I strongly believe we would be a mentally healthier populace for it. If you could have a citizenry that makes decisions (and votes) from a position of civic responsibility, mutual prosperity, and...I'm not sure how to say it..."common applicability?" (by this I mean, measures that a citizen believes could be fairly applied universally), then you would also have a citizenry that could have civil and productive debates rather than the constant and clashing demands of the personal, which by their very nature mean that most people can never "let it go." Now if that all sounds pie-in-the-sky impossible, I would only say that most citizens live the ethic that is introduced to them by their families, communities, and institutions. Feed children a diet of self-absorption and sham "activism" (self-promotion of some manner wrapped in a "higher cause"), and you get exactly the exploitative leaders and frenzied political climate you would expect. People are always going to want to accrue personal benefit to themselves; I'm expect we can agree that is reality. But there are plenty of spheres of life where you can attempt fulfillment of those personal desires. I think Kidology is right to be concerned when people feel compelled to drag EVERY aspect of life into the political sphere.
At the end of the day, is it more important and legitimate to defend the right to be alone or to have unwilling company? I start fuming everytime masculinists extol the fifties because my grand father was a very violent man and society forced my gran to stay for way too long. Ultimately, that is what we are talking about when we want to level the playing field and the job market. It's not about girl bosses. It's about everyone having the money to live alone should they want to. As for horn, there is a video on the French youtube between a priest and a horn actress. The comments are very telling about how much men respect women who do that. They say she can't talk to him with a mouth that has been used the way it has. I think I have more respect toward meat at the butcher than consumers of horn toward horn actresses.
Which is incredibly confusing, because they WATCH IT. Maybe it’s bot about intimacy, but about power - and that makes them horny? But in real sex even if you engage in power play, it has limits and boundaries and you can’t be a jackass
@@NonaMoreau I m not sure I am answering to you or going on a tangent. I should have written corn. Now, I'm confused about the meaning of horny. I write and read slash fanfics. People will tell me that I objectify men but I love really slow burn, where the subjectivity of the character is really explored. And I have a lot of friends who just say how much they love their boyfriend when they are catcalled. Usually, the catcaller becomes really nice. If you say "I have someone", it does not work this well. It's about serving people a side dish of your subjectivity. There is a text called the Sadeian Woman about the politics of pornography. A lot of it is about subjectivity. So, tell me if I'm answering off the mark or if I said something relevant. It's that meat actually makes people excited. It's sex without the connection that makes it complicated. Without the part where the other person is real and chaotic. That being said, some men are very respectful when people who have s*x for a living sign an article for the time literary supplement. I do not want to generalise.
I was just commenting this on another thread - the access to non-Eng YT. Would you say the "french YT" has the same sentiment? And that this issue of "sexless men" is equally prevasive in other cultures you have access to?
@@blondscientist At University (irl), I met a few friends with mental illnesses. Some of them were doing there P. h.D. and they had a lot of difficulties finding a relationship, even having a first sexual experience. Mostly, they were leftists. They would not say so but I felt there was a ressentiment toward women. A lot of the hate on the french yt toward what they call woke people come from an extreme right channel called psyhodelic, but every woman who fight for our right to have enough money to cover basic needs and maybe propriety (I don't think it should be a luxury but thanks to placement firms like Black Rock, it is for women and men alike by the way) would be considered woke. They want to supress faculties where we study social sciences, arts (they claim we are bourgeois) but they have no idea what we talk about in such places. Spoiler: we say nothing they think we say. There are lot of debates by a masculinist philosopher and an instagram feminist and basically the comments sections are an echo chamber of people saying that the girl is ridiculous. I would like this Rochedy (the philosopher) to do a debate with a woman like Barbara Stiegler on Nietzche, I think it could be eye opening about what women can be when they are in an environment that is positive and validating of their intelligence. Irl, I think a lot of men who are married realise that the real problem is that labor is delocalised in countries where people are cheaper. That the market is hard and competitive in western countries and that if they are helpful with chores, their girlfriend or wife will stay if she has more money. Ultimately, more money would be an advantage for them and the kids. We are anyway not in a society where one salary is enough for a family. We need to be more and more qualified to get jobs that pay less and less. Caviar left does very little to change that but when right wing people will realise that trade unions are the way forward, I think it will be too late for the west. Elsewhere on the planet, I think that autorarian regims are stifling innovation. I do not think that the real problem is men vs. women but keeping us divided helps people in power. They fight against me keeping my 3 rooms flat (despite my mental illness and what they call a master with an unemployment specialisation) while Trump has gold toilets but those guys love him and assume I am a nuisance stealing what is theirs. They are also all afraid about natality dwindling but the planet does not have ressources for everyone anymore. As for incels, I feel it is hypocrite, but using Carnegie (how to win friends) when you talk to a woman goes a longer way toward having sex than hitting the gym. Self care, automassage, sophrology, relaxation, journaling should not be gendered. People have to give themselves the time and attention they expect from others. The secret to good conversations is often to assume that the person in front of you is a spiritual master that knows a few secrets about the universe however stupid they look (and I'm not being hypocrite, I listened to them) And social networks really encourage people to think everyone but them is a dumbass. However, it still is an internet epiphenomenon. I'm not sure how much traction it gets with people who are busy having a life. I have heard philosophy tube saying that there is a pipeline between atheist channels and masculinist channels. It seems similar in French. Zetetism seems to be about promoting hard sciences. They love making fun of women practicing witchcraft on youtube. Ironically, the witchcraft proponents and the masculinists are geared toward women investing their home life. They would be ideal bed fellows if they did not hate each other. I'll stop the TED talk. Sorry for the novel.
@kshamwhizzle My married friends often complain about malicious compliance when it comes to house chores. It is not downright violence but it can destroy a couple. However, I do not know how to repair a tap and my boyfriend apparently cannot understand that a bifidus yogurt is probiotics despite being allergic to probiotics. I blame our respective education. If he does his laundry, I can't buy him a wool pullover. He will put it at 60 or even 90 with his underwear.
I rarely leave a comment on videos, but I have to say, this is just such a fantastic analysis. I have a PhD in philosophy and am currently working as a researcher at a university … and God, if people I know could manage to critically assess society like this! This video was just excellent! Beautifully presented and beautifully argued. On a personal note: having spent the first half of my 20’s just on studies, I really did not have anything at all to do with dating/romance until 25 (I’m 26 now… ) - and God, was I surprised at the world out there! I grew up in a really sheltered environment (all my family members have really healthy, loving relationships/marriages so that was the norm). So naturally my response to a few bad/disturbing experiences was to start researching a bit… I tried the book “The Case Against the Sexual Revolution” - which I thought was a good “first try.” But what I thought was so obviously missing is exactly what was hit upon in this video - love. It is like it is taboo in today’s world to say, sex should be about love. And the way that you connected the politicization of sex with this problem - perfect! So really, thank you so much for this - I hope very much that many, many more people watch this, and I’m encouraged to see someone who is so intelligent and so clearly well read and well educated put this kind of nuanced content out into the world. You really are doing us all a great service. Just a few other thoughts, I don’t know, just to put them out there: - the relationship between this issue about the politicization of sex and the prevalence of birth control/abortion (i.e. can we/how to strike a balance?) - the role of religion (is this connected with also the decline in religious values? I mean, whatever negatives about religions aside - speaking from a Judeo-Christian context - the most basic message is to love and value other human beings as ends in themselves, which is precisely what you are saying at the end of the video we need a good dose of) - the role of capitalism - what has been interesting me a lot is the idea of how this society of casual sex functions in a way to turn everyone into extremely productive members of a capitalist society - no families, so can work more; no stable relationship, so can move for jobs; no real meaning or security in personal relationships, so fill the void by consuming; etc. Personally, I’ve never been a fan of communist ideology - from an eastern european background so maybe I have some bias. But living in western europe, when I compare the way people think about relationships with how they do in eastern europe, it is very, very different (okay, still capitalist, but with a lot less economic stability - so people don't have the luxury to worry “have I banged enough chicks?” because they are more worried about “can I support my ageing parents?”)
I resonate with your experience, impressions and background very much. In addition to the questions you raised I often ask myself how wide-spread are these issues - sometimes I wonder if it is just the native English-speaking nations? Does that equate to rich nations?
If I had the time it would be interesting to dive into non English-speaking YT to gauge other experiences.... globalisation nonwithstanding maybe the rest of the world does not encounter/deal with these issues in the same way?
@@blondscientist I actually live in a non-english speaking country (and I've lived in a few others), and I find it more a division between countries where there is more or less economic security, so rich v. poor. In, e.g., Northern Italy and Germany, to me, youth culture seems the same. But I think you are onto something when it comes to an appropriation of lifestyle in english speaking countries, or just globalism generally as the root problem. I do have to say, when I get off a plane in eastern europe, I immediately can feel like… wow people are treating me more like a person. That's why I kind of feel like these issues about sex need to be framed within a wider problem in society where we just don't treat other people - let me put it plainly/stupidly - with basic kindness. Sure, that has always been an issue - people can be bad - but this widespread societal pressure to actively treat people like things… that's something new. PS. also something I Iiked about the video was this distinction between treating people as generalisations and treating people as individuals - maybe there is a key in there somewhere?
Very thought provoking. I’m 65 now and I think it wasn’t till my late 30’s that I really began the self evaluative work to see that what’s going on is actually a crime against humanity. Women take the bullet for it, YES, but we are all robbed of our humanity if we are unable to see ourselves in other humans ( irrespective of where we fall on the sexual spectrum) . That last part you said about our humanity, brought back a song; “Reflections of My Heart”, by Rochelle Ferrell. It’s about a couple who truly see themselves in the other. I’ve tried to live life with my wife based on the notion that if I truly do the work I need to do on me that will find myself in her. I’m not perfect, but I keep trying. You got a Brotha choking up here my Sista from another Mista.
What I love about your videos (based on the five I’ve seen since I found you last Sunday) is that rather than trying to convince us this is an invitation to think, research and just deeply analyze this topic that is everywhere these days. Thanks for that!
A problem here is that people confuse "rights" in the moral sense, with "legal rights" which imply absolute legal obligation. For example, when we say that children have a right to a family, that doesn't mean that people will be forced to adopt children against their will; in practice, children will simply stay in the system if no family sincerely wants them. Or when we say everyone deserves a home, we don't mean that homeless people can enter any house they want against their owner's will, or that we will give homes to drug addicts without any accountability. The language of "right" in this context simply means those things which are necessary for a person's wellbeing, and which we as a society need to work together in order to guarantee, not because they have earned it somehow but because everyone deserves to be happy and the basis of our ethical system is love for our fellow humans.
Very, very good point. This gets complicated when it comes to commodified s*x where legality is at the forefront of gatekeeping it. I don't think we even agree on the moral sense (i.e., wellbeing) considering that the same could be said for other rights - moral and/or legal - such as healthcare. It's all a muddle!
The problem is those goods and services are a function of labour which is a function of risk to bodily harm. There can never be a guarantee of goods and services to all people as you can't force people to take care of others from a moral standpoint. Right now we are seeing the breakdown of society accelerate as the fraud of government borrowing money into existence to provide these services is pushing inflation and the death of the currency to the vertical hyperbolic curve at which point only real value (skills, tangible goods and services) matter in the market and those who do not have them will be left on the metaphorical titanic without a life raft
As someone who doesn't get much of that but I'm not here being a femcel and wanting the man i want to give me that. No i use the presence of my mind. This entire thing is just another form of control towards people who are financially dependent on other people. Especially women.
You’re truly one of the best commentary channels out rn. This is a extremely hard topic to talk about. I feel like sex controls a lot of men’s lives and is something that is apart of most men’s personalities and a large part.
We should be careful with the second to last tweet 0:55 Everyone, including s3x workers, have a right to decline s3x with Johns or others if they don’t want to do it. I think I qualify as a s3x positive feminist (by its definitions) But the wording “Right to S3x” gives me pause because of the many ways that phrase could be interpreted.
When "rights" entered the political lexicon in a major way in the 18th century, it referred to "liberties" or "rights against state control," such as the freedom to speak freely, or the freedom to bear arms (which had traditionally been reserved for the aristocracy). Rights did not mean certain goods or services which one's fellow citizens either directly or by means of state power were required to provide to those who lacked them.
As others have already said, the right to have sex isn't a thing nor it should be but at the same time stigmatizing men who find no success dating is a bad thing on it's own. Just because a man has trouble finding love doesn't mean he's also a misogynist and/or a racist. What you see on the incel forums is a vocal minority of people who are unable to endure their situation with dignity. This mentality is only holding others back from reaching out and seek help or go to therapy. It's hard to be vulnerable about your problems when, since you're not getting laid, people tend to look at you as if you have to be an awful human being with sick intentions.
It’s not a right to sex that people have an issue with because most men know that they aren’t entitled to sex. Most men’s thing is if we are in a committed relationship with you that means your the only person I can have sex with. I’m not saying that you can’t say no or you have to have sex whenever he wants but the reason why some men have this “entitlement” is because if the man isn’t having sex with his women then who can he have it with?
I think a lot of that circles back to how we still attach value to ourselves according to our sexual status, just think about the concept of virginity, at least in a lot of conservative communities, the adults judge teens and people their age about virginity, and it differentiates by gender if you're a young woman you get judged if you loose your v card because the value previous generations put on it relates to purity, inocence, decency. Conversely young men are stigmatized from a certain age for BEING virgins because the value put in it for men is related to dominance, maturity, and experience. And these two different expectations are put simultaneously in the minds of teenagers, where you are still developing your views on sex and consent and more importantly self worth, it gets conflicting between men and women. And this are things that even when people don't say it verbatim is deeply ingrained in our minds. IT HAS TO STOP We can be sex positive, and understand consent and talk about sex, and talk about not having it without attaching it to our value as people ❤️ it has to be that way.
@@rafaeljohnson6220 same goes for women too. there's a study that came to the conclusion that women are equally interested in sex as men, but more quickly bored with the same sexual partner. men are generally happy to have a lot of sex even when it's with the same woman. this leads to women in long term relationships thinking they don't have sex drive or making up excuses with their partners, when in reality they just want different sexual experiences. i think for long term relationships it would make sense just to seperate sex from love and open it up so everyone involved can live out their desires.
My thoughts are all over the place on this subject and so right now, I honestly just want to say thank you for covering this in such a compassionate way. For guys like me, hearing a woman be so empathetic (**especially with DV and SA targeting women in such high numbers and in the most horrific ways**) towards men's frustration about having so little sex is really nice to hear. It really is like getting a glass of cold water in hell.
@@TimXDDDD as a woman who doesn't get much s"x anyways, even though i want too , i don't go around blaming men who don't want me. i understand that they want different things and if a guy who i like and he like me back comes around that'll be great. I'll never find myself be this delusional when it comes to not getting s"x by blaming people u know absolutely nothing about. Like the effing audacity some men have is beyond me. who tf taught u that it was a right to have and not an experience to share with someone u feel comfortable with.
You have nuanced and well articulated thoughts that I do not come across often. With the topic of sex and young men’s current lack of it, I see that a lot of people arguing on the men’s side are forgetting some very key things. What many left leaning and feminist people point out is the fact that the study mentions that men are “not having as much sex as they would like” and to many feminists this is a conversation about ego. The lack of sex amongst some young men is seen as a fault of women and society, however for much of human civilization the sexual health of women and girls has been of little concern. I admire what you do on your channel as you are more of a middle ground for the kind of men who would see themself following the manosphere, but you are still a feminist who forwards progressive talking points. It comes as no surprise to me that a lot of the left is unappealing to these kind of men because the left openly hate them sometimes. However it also does not surprise me why the left is adverse towards them because of the openly bigoted and authoritarian beliefs of these men. What I really want to get at is there are very rational reasons why “sex is a human right” would put a lot of left leaning people on the defensive. I believe a great many progressives would agree that human connections and relations are essential to a healthy life, but we want to be sure that safety and autonomy are guaranteed. Unfortunately the manosphere and much of broader conservative thought makes it very apparent that the rights and health of some people is irrelevant so long as some other people are about to feel powerful and have their egos affirmed.
I think the analogy that would make your point but that you're missing, is friendship. Friendship is based on too many abstract things to chalk up to a game or formula or simple sales tactic. There are tips and tricks, but no hack, no cheats, no catchphrase solutions. And bitterness in making friends is obviously counterproductive. Since female are lifted to this sexualised pedestal, sight of that mutual-relatable human connection is lost. That said I found you a just a tad dismissive of the power of horniness, and the role frustration plays in sexual arousal itself, as a builder for releif (the big o). "Angry", carnal sex can lead to powerful shared experiences, and as a very horny (yet celibate) female, the anatomy by itself certainly of high interest and not so much the romance. The reason I'm averse to casual sex is the safety security issue rather than intimacy. That gets conflated a lot on the topic of female sexuality. Desire for trust is lumped in with romance. I don't think women are actually that vanilla sexually, we're just living in much more dangerous circumstances than men.
As a young person who, rather inexplicably, found a genuine, intimate, and loving relationship via internet dating, I have a very hard time describing "how I did it" or giving advice to friends who want to know how to find such a thing. It was a magical "right person, right time," and felt like an almost unbelievable fluke. (note: I do believe that internet dating on a college campus is much different beast than internet dating in 'real' adult life, with unique and likely greater challenges than faced by Gen-Z college kids. Tinder is well suited to the hook-up culture and emotional immaturity that characterize many of our attempts at connection.) Among female college students, I often hear things like "I'm a romantic in a hookup culture, what am I supposed to do?" I can't answer that question. It seems like my generation never learned, were taught, or were given the opportunity to practice the emotional skills needed to make genuine connections. The mention in a previous video, of young people in the past having social encouragement (in the form of dance halls, etc) to just be children, teens, boys and girls, learning to romance or simply interact with one another. It struck me how now, we seem to be jumping right into being adults, men and women, never having had the chance to learn. Growing up, we always tried to act more mature than we were. I wish we had been our own age, and been given the social constructions and protections to do so. This applies mostly to straight dating culture, queer dating deserves its own conversation entirely. The funny thing is, I see more apparently 'emotionally mature' connections between my queer friends than I do my straight ones. My thought is that straight dating culture is so prescribed, and straight men and women are inundated with rules and etiquette and guides that offer a very narrow and skewed view of relationships, whereas queer dating culture, still more taboo, escapes from it for that very reason. The straight relationships I see in my friends and peers are often plagued by call-her-daddy-esque games, manipulations, detachment, and lack of honesty and/or emotional maturity that are really heartbreaking. We all just want to find love, in our own idiosyncratic worlds, but we seem to be absolutely unequipped to do so; worse, the mainstream advice on straight dating is often counterproductive to downright harmful. This is a rather tangential issue to celibacy, loneliness, and the dating pool at large, since the generational dynamics of Gen Z and the unique backdrop of a college campus are their own ecosystem. But, I appreciate so much your research and insight into topics like these. You, Kid, have inspired me to think much more critically (and independently) about modern society. I can't thank you enough for that! Much love and admiration, Annie
@@dwsel I didn't say OP is whining. I'm saying women generally whine more about the hookup culture yet partake way more than men in it. Read the first sentence of OPs 2nd para
@@newperson9662 I can't speak for all women obviously, but I can speak for a few of my friends, who have all basically taken the "I can't have what I want so I'll take what I can get" attitude toward hookup culture. Because sex doesn't fill the gap of true intimacy, but it feels good, and it's similar to compulsive shopping or spending every spare moment on social media. You can't get the thing that will make you happy, so you take your temporary little dopamine hits where you can get them.
@@SkullsNPockyLuv I dont think you understand. The reality is more ugly than that. To the average young woman nowadays, hook ups with super hot men are preferable than serious committed relationships and deeper connections with average looking guys within their league. When women say "I can't have what I want so I'll take what I can get" they're still referring to a relationship and casual sex with hot men they have crushes on.
As a woman who is totally asexual-haven't touched myself for reasons other than hygiene for over 20 years, and have never even made out with a guy, I avoid men because of the gross entitled attitudes towards women's bodies. If men want s*x they can buy it (so can women) or go DIY. Basically, I resent the idea that all people should be pressured to be sexual, against what feels comfortable.
I think we might experience a collective hurt and trauma around relationships. So many reasons for it, and partly I believe even the pandemic has amplified this to an extreme. We are all recovering, and some are dealing with it more constructively than others. We need to talk about it more I believe. Thank you for your amazing voice, not only audibly but as in commentary as well. Im glad we are talking about this 💜✌🏽
Watching one of your videos feels like a whole academic course in social & psychological studies! In the best way possible! Very interesting, intriguing, informative, insightful, & enlightening. I'm GRATEFUL that I came across your channel! Never stop doing what you are doing ❤️
I think that this is a very nuanced topic. Many say that you don't have the right to sex, but also feel as a society that it is ok to call people "incels". "Incel" shouldn't be a negative thing if we as a society actually didn't care about people not having sex. But the reality is that we do! Honestly I believe that sex (if not overdone) can be beneficial to ones self esteem and overall health! While I don't think we should force people to be having sex, I think that we should definitely provide opportunities for at least respectable guidance on how to get it if they are struggling. I mean honestly ask yourself, who would want a society filled with people that can't get sex?
@@hurrytoworry That's actually a misconception. Most "real incels" never identify as an "incel". However the people that do tend to be the extremists. If you want to look at this topic through a non-biased good faith lens, should not be judging an entire group by the most extreme sects. I get what ur saying tho
You're right that being involuntarily celibate shouldn't be considered a bad thing. But sadly the people who have claimed that term and made it an identity, have shown themselves to be some of the most disgustingly hateful people on the planet. When you go on incel forums and see all the gross and hateful beliefs they have about women, and men too, you can see why the term has a negative connotation. Which makes it hard for us sane people who are involuntarily celibate, to find a community of like-minded people with similar experiences, who aren't rabidly hateful and misogynistic.
@@ralphwilsin sounds a bit like "we have to listen to both sides", when one of the sides is all about dehumanising more than half the population of the world.
I think the ability to form a community with other incels makes it feel normalized and focus on social media thought rabbit holes rather than fixing personal issues eliminates any potential for them to take meaningful steps to change it. Prior to internet communities, if you had an issue like not getting laid - you had to work it out by trying new things. Now, you can go commiserate with others instead and wallow in the unfairness of the world instead of doing anything about it.
To say that all Incels just wallow in unfairness and not doing anything about it is wrong I think you know that. And what exactly would you recommend someone should do when he is sexually marginalized because of his height or a deformed face?
Seems to me we got here as a rection to the lack of personal freedoms (as it pertains to sex, love, relationships) that were repressed in religious and classist societies of the west. We wanted to liberate, so we made personal political, and now we put some technology to it for an extra dehumanising touch.
the problem is not lack of sex itself, or loneliness or whatever. There are plenty of lonely people out there, and the majority do not commit heinous crimes. Men and women alike feel lonely and unsatisfied sexually, yet they don't act like monsters. paying for sex is rape. you are exploiting someone that has no other choice. most sex workers live below the poverty line. the solution is simple: at the first sign of sexual deviance, at the first sign of sexual violence, you lock the deranged monster up. We should isolate them entirely from society. the moment they begin to watch violent and degrading porn, the moment they touch someone without their consent, the moment they seek to rape someone and apologize with monetary value, the moment they groom minors online - they get locked up and never let out. I do agree that we should seek to create more environments of socialization for everyone, but leave sex out of this. Sex should ALWAYS be between consenting, age-appropriate, enthusiastic parties, with no coercion, including monetary coercion, social coercion, harm, blackmail, or any other bullshit. NO ONE should be entitled to anyone's body but their own, and no one should be able to buy someone's body or consent.
the most interesting modern developments that i think we can learn a lot from is the fact that plenty of sex workers of many kinds are asexual or not attracted to their mostly male customers, which just proves how separated sexuality is from how it's viewed in the political. the other thing i think of is sex therapy - which often is about helping people through their relationship to their body, intimacy, learning to be physically vulnerable and otherwise, which is the closest thing we have to a remedy imo.
You make really good points and I am really grateful and thankful for this video. I think it is very important to consider. But I wished you touched on one of the benefits of politicizing sex, and that is the acknowledgement of r*pe and domestic violence. This has had great implications and influence on the justice system, as well as societal attitudes towards acceptable s*xual behaviour, e.g. understanding what is and what is not harassment. Although we still have a long way to go. Not to mention, it is because s*x has been politicized that contraception has also become something that is more or less accepted, and even encouraged instead of it being taboo. So I think there's a balance to be struck here. And while sex wars aren't what anyone wants, it is important to also acknowledge what is pushing us to make s*x political. And while in this video you made a much needed reminder that s*x is multifaceted, I still do not see exactly what it is you disagree with when it came to Alexander Hunt's proposals.
I love these videos, how you confront different point of views and academic references, and then give your own analysis, in a very clear and honest way. All this in a "respectful" and calm tone too, which makes for a very soothing viewing :)
Okay, so first of all, that little chart the twitter poster put up is kinda crap because that sample size is quite small it doesn't give much more data visuals to really be able to come to any kind of conclusion. Secondly, there are also other conflicting statistics out there that state that women are actually the ones having less sex currently than men, so "what's the truth". Thirdly, the question, "of those who would like to have sex: are you currently sexually active?" Doesn't conclusively signify any particular reason why they aren't having sex despite wanting it. Those men could have a whole host of reasons why, but it seems like the original tweet and the subsequent repliers let their imaginations run wild with the troubling chart to say they are all "incels". Forth, does anyone get any "hostage negotiation vibes from the "sex is a human right debate" arguments here👀? "Give these men what they want or everyone is gonna suffer." "Give the creep a chance, you could be the difference between his happiness and the safety of society." and it's usually at the behest of women to somehow resolve this issue, like we haven't been coddling and accommodating men's needs for millennia.
Great comment. I've dug into the data a little and there are 3 factors that could explain most of the trend: less of that sort of "chaotic and spontaneous" casual sex overall compared to GenX (in particular less binge drinking consumption was called out as a factor), an increase in same-sex partners chiefly among young women but not among men; and based on the sexlessness stats for older women (who nobody cares about), young women and older men are cozy bedfellows. Strangely, instead of some cultural critique of older men chasing young women, society praises these guys while blaming the gals. Well, as I always say, men pick your heroes carefully....because young women love a hero.
Way more young women are partaking in the hook up culture than young men. The gap is even wider than whats reported since women underreport and men overreport casual sex partners. No one's asking women to give mediocre / unattractive men a chance. We just want society to stop gaslighting men and acknowledge that dating is harder for men, as women are more selective, shallow, and find fewer men physically attractive than vice versa.
@@newperson9662 I don't believe "hook up culture" was ever a thing. Just because a bunch of people engage in the same single activity at a certain time period, doesn't make it a "culture". It just seemed like pop media hype to get people to read "journalists'" essays🙄. Secondly, so you'd be okay with absolutely nothing changing currently, at all, as long as "society" just "admits" to your little list of "realities"? Well, fine. I can start. Yeah, I admit men are ugly, every last one of them. Be it in physical appearance, attitude, morals, temperament, what have you. You and every guy with a beating heart is ugly and there's absolutely nothing they can do to change that fact. Yes, woman are selective with who we decide to bring into our lives, it be foolish not to be. Yeah, women be shallow. We are shallow with our lives, other's lives, the people we care about and the people we don't. Don't like it, too bad. There, you got one person within "society" to admit this and NOTHING has to change. I hope that helps 🙂 Have a great day.
I'm in the middle of the video and you bring up interesting points, but I do want to call out that sex has never *not* been political. even traditionally, sex was part of the marriage Contract. Which was implicitly agreed upon by both parties. For most of history, women and therefore sex have been seen as a commodity, and I think women choosing to "seize the means of production" so to speak, is the natural progression of that.
Men being lonely and not having (or getting) sex is a public security issue and something we should all care about. Women being lonely and not having (or getting) sex or meaningful relationships is apparently our own or feminism's fault. Excuse me while I roll my eyes and bring out the world's smallest violin for the menz. Female sexuality is no more complex than male sexuality. We are simply just so focused on the male gaze and perspective that very few people, including researchers, have been interested in studying it. It's like how with health care, women's bodies and health care is seen as less of a priority than men's because we are treated as "other" and therefore not worth caring for. The excuse often used though is that women's bodies are "too complex" to study. Don't believe that rhetoric. It's no different when it comes to female sexuality - it's not interesting enough to most people, particularly men, to care about. I guarantee that if it were men having periods and babies, tampons and sanitary napkins would be freely available at practically no cost, and abortion and reproductive health related health care would be considered essential and enshrined and protected in constitutional law. And unfortunately, it is indeed political. At a certain point we decided women are less important than men in every way possible. Less deserving of resources that matter and more deserving of exploitation and oppression. And the result of that decision is everything we see and experience today, since the agricultural revolution in fact. Things have only gotten marginally better for non-men recently, and only in a small minority of places in the world. Outside a few select places in the world, women are treated like objects and property still to this day. When we make these kinds of arbitrary hierarchies, don't believe for a second it's not political. On a closing note, I have to say I'm a bit disappointed to see your one-sided analysis on what is indeed a public health and security issue, when we are dealing with extremists such as incels and the manosphere and their violence against women, in the way you have framed it here or in other videos. It's hard for me to not to have the growing suspicion that many of your videos might be ripe for using as a tool to funnel young men into a pipeline that directs them to more explicitly alt-right and extremist spaces. It's unfortunately made me critically rethink engaging with and consuming your content, which I will likely not do anymore.
@@rulingstone123 1. The only time anyone cared to talk about lonely men was when a woman spoke up for them. Incels have been a thing for years and nobody cared. Lonely single women has been all over the news, they even won a midterm all in themselves. Pretty sure I saw an article once blaming men for not being good enough to attract women nowadays. 2. It is not the 1800's. The sciences have been infiltrated by feminist ideology and they're extremely self conscious about discriminating against women. Besides that, which by itself has been a huge force towards pushing the sciences a certain way, there's plenty of women biologists out there... none of them cared to study women's sexual attraction? This is a historical fact that feminists heard about it once and then they run with it. Yes, women's bodies were not studied when the sciences first appeared. However what age do you think we live in now? Still then? It shows how delusional it is to believe that you're still oppressed in such a cartoonish way. Our society has swung full on in the other direction. It should've swung somewhere in the middle, however men and masculinity has been actively suppressed for some time now. It will normalize as men make some noise and urge people to listen to their problems, however right now women are holding society by the balls. They make most of the consumer decisions and are swinging elections. For a gender that gets paid less they sure spend more, and there's power in that since all companies seem more than willing to push all kinds of narratives in their favor... some even selling them oppression since real world oppression is in low supply for the great demand of victimhood.
@@ernimuja6991 just say you hate women and minorities and go. It's clear you have no interest in facts, simply distorting reality for your own nefarious purposes instead. You want to be a victim so bad, and I truly wish you knew what it means to be one instead of only wishing it, then maybe you'd have some empathy instead of being so pathological. It also seems you don't even know where the term incel comes from. It was coined by a bisexual Canadian university student (a woman known online only as Alana) who wanted to articulate in a neutral way all the people in the world (men AND women) who found themselves in a state of involuntary celibacy for one reason or another. Now it just means terrorist because it's been coopted by the toxic manosphere crew. Btw, a whole bunch of Indigenous women and girls go missing and murdered on a regular basis due to the actions of yt supremacists like incels and other terrorists. They are subjected to violent sexual assault and torture before they're murdered. I don't see anyone in the manosphere advocating for them and countless other women who are brutalized or simply neglected on the regular every damn day. Where's your righteous anger for them? The pendulum has definitely not swung "too far", it's barely swung at all. Regardless of what they have to offer, men have felt so entitled to women's attention and bodies for so long, that now that some people have pushed back a little bit against it, some men aren't able to manipulate women as easily and they're throwing a hissy fit about it. That's not oppression. But the pendulum swinging even a little bit in the direction of equality can feel like oppression to those who are accustomed to privilege.
@@indrinita You definitely hate men. You’re projecting so hard. Also don’t bring deaths to this. Men have died for women since the dawn of time in the most brutal way. Should I start brining up grievances too? I love women, I just wished they loved us too. Misandry has become common place and nobody challanges it in public when women straight up say hateful things towards men. This video was all about men’s issues and here you come making it about womens. Men are lonely but did you know that indigenous women are killed in Canada? How does that make sense? Yes… I grieve for those indigenous women that are killed and assaulted by those white supremacists but what does that have to do with this video? Do you know how many atrocities go on in the world every day? To both men and women by both men and women and yet women are most oppressed? I am even willing to accept most of the issues women say plagues them if you said you’d accept only half of the issues I say plagues men. But you wouldn’t because you’re a pathological man hating bigot and you don’t know any better.
Kidology have you ever thought of being a columnist for national newspaper? The quality and depth of your discussions is worthy of being read in print.
I think pointing to the proliferation of sex work as a panacea to our cultural milieu of sexlessness among young men is very short sighted. What these men are lacking isn’t sex. At least not in the commodified, transactional, almost clinical way sex appears in the culture through solicitation, porn etc. They are lacking something much less visible. It is not a coincidence that any man you meet who self identifies as an “incel” generally won’t be doing very well in the rest of his life either. It is something deeper that precipitates the lack of sex, which is a visible and political symbol to be turned into a scapegoat. I don’t claim to know exactly what that lack is. I have a feeling it’s something quite abstract like purpose, meaning, perhaps love. But it certainly isn’t just sex. Lack of sex is a symptom, and effective healthcare doesn’t just manage symptoms - it treats the cause of the pathology. If we are to heal our young men we need to reach deeper and treat what is causing their despair.
Yes, you've articulated something I'd only intuited. There are some male self development Y'Tubers who state that men ought to stop chasing women and work on their "purpose" and meaning in life. Then the women will come. So, it's still being positioned as getting women (eventually) and having sex. Then ex-incels talk about how having sex didn't exactly make a difference to them afterwards. They still felt insecure and unhappy. I think that there are some people who are suffering from an internal and external disconnect from themselves and the world around them. It's both men and women, but it manifests itself in a more obvious way with men (as it does with most things). Men not having as much sex as before seems to be a metaphor for something else. It's easier just to blame women of course, but that's always been a thing.
What makes sex incredible to me is the love and connection you have between you and your partner. Being spirituality, emotionally and physically connected to each other elevates you from simple sexual intercourse to real intimacy and love making.
I feel like everyone is just dancing around both the core issue and giving no useful solutions. Of course no one is "owed" sex, no one is "owed" anything, we make up all rights, there's nothing encoded in our DNA saying we have the right to food or water either. There are some fundamental issues with the current "social contract" and we're seeing that unravel and the consequences are going to be terrifying. The most dangerous group of society is ALWAYS young, frustrated males, ignoring their needs usually leads to some horrific outcomes, it's nice to talk about normalizing sex work but that isn't going to fill the gap and someone will start to push ideologies that will take root in these communities. People will always attempt to carry out the biological imperative that drives all life on this planet, mixing that with the social expectations and it's pretty easy to see where this is going to lead. We now have a sizable population of this group, ready and primed for actual radicalization by both domestic and foreign entities, but as usual, society will just pretend it's not happening until it's too late. If they feel there is nothing to lose, then there is everything to gain, no matter the cost and the worst part is unlike some other parts of the world where this is an issue, they'll have both the resources and knowledge to truly destroy everything.
I don't see these severe issues self-correcting. I think Western societies will fracture and implode from all the problems like this one they've been sweeping under the rug. Oh well, enjoy the decline!
Coming from the field of Cultural Studies I am really finding your channel and your perspectives to be absolutely refreshing. Congratulations on all the good content and kudos for recommending Hannah Arendt (her works definitely deserve more attention and are of extreme relevance today).
Great video. A couple of points. 1. The politicization of sex is due to the sensitivity we have around it. If we were less sensitive, it being either political or a political would be lessed charged as a topic. We may want to start there prior to fight the fight of shifting ones politicization stance on sex. 2. Those on the desire to reach the destination of sex will be more willing to take shortcuts and care less of the journey if the goal of reaching the destination is difficult, time consuming, infrequent, absent, or impeded. There may significant difference in both the entrenchment of the other side and defensiveness of discussion of the seekers were more successful than not, say >30%. 3. Until you change the base state of human nature, desiring pleasure and sex as a great delivery system (also, certain drugs, etc) and the differences between the sexes with their goals and most probable methods to achieve the goal, then some form of all your issues will persist. Yes, additional study and knowledge into help like you mentioned. But until we get on the same page about our sensitivity about sex being lower, be in a position were talking about the journey is more amenable, and providing considerable empathy into the sexes base natures, your going to have a tough time discussion the destination, the journey, the origin of desriee and reason, its politicization, and ultimately, sex as a right. This is deep.
Society hasn't criminalized sex (unless we're talking about sex work). We're finally talking about consent and since lots of women are putting their foot down and men are being taught what consent really is men aren't able to coerce sex as often and woman are avoiding these situations in the first place. Why do we even care how much sex men, let alone people, are having? Of all the bad things I experience as a woman at the hands of men I'm happy I'm a woman. I can't imagine my penis ruling so much of my life.
@@newperson9662 women aren't having more hookup sex. Despite what people want to believe married people have the most sex. It's an incel or insecure man belief that woman are having more sex, particularly with the same pool of men. That's just weird. Women have been and will probably always be more picky because we bear the burden of the consequences of sex as far as society is concerned.
"I can't imagine my penis ruling so much of my life" This is so true. I enjoy sex and many other women do as well, but I think men are obsessed with sex to an unhealthy extent. The lengths men will go to to get their rocks off is genuinely concerning. It is the reason why we have issues like revenge porn and sex trafficking. Obviously there are some women who are horny 100% of the time as well, but I see this problem far more frequently in men.
@@dmb1745 shut up you have 0 fucking idea how it is to be a man. You have as much testosterone as a 12 year old boy so really you dont crave sex as much as we do. Your value by society is also not judged by how many women you are able to get. Finally, you have 0 idea whats its like to be sex starved and not be able to satiate it. If youre a woman and you want sex you go get it instantly with 0 hangups and for free. If you want those things as a man however... you better be hot.
I think one benefit in depoliticizing sex is that we don't blame one group or another for where we're at, but on that note, one problem in depoliticizing sex is that people may not feel they need to be accountable to their internalized phycological patriarchy. I'd love to see you compare and contrast thoughts of love between bell hooks and Hannah Arendt.
This is a brilliant and thorough analysis. I 100% agree with your explication about how one of the major problems is we don't interact with the other sex very often other than in certain very restricted and regulated places (like corporate workplaces). Outside of that the lack of community and social interactions are apparently becoming increasingly widespread. Even bars and clubs are being reduced, "protocalized' and becoming more dangerous, or perceived as such, and less playful/social than they used to. This may be a result of massively increasing drug addiction and other factors. Also, I love Hannah Arendt!! She is one of my favorite philosophers and her insights are profound. I
Men have to have sex, otherwise they get violent? What about women? I just don't buy this argument that the only way to keep men calm is to make sure they get enough sex.
Thank you for this video. This is something I've observed over the years with discussions over relationships and sex, it's been politicized to an extreme extent that it becomes "unsexy" so the speak, especially when talking about power imbalances between genders. It's actually exhausting to watch, because I realize I have a perspective that is incredibly rudimentary, because I understand we haven't evolved much as human beings and these discussions make the assumption that we have.
@Educat ional “high verbal iq” lol stfu with your reductive incel pseudoscience. You don’t need to explain to me why I find her an all-around agreeable person. I fucking hate how terminally online people esp the ones sucked into over-analyzing attraction with their pseudo-evolutionary-psychology disassemble and reduce everyone to a list of their components. It’s killing my soul just to read it.
This is an interesting topic - as a single parent of two who works, it's largely academic; in the words of Sweet Brown, "ain't nobody got time for dat!" However, it's encouraging that the younger generation is approaching the topic more...well, maturely, than earlier generations. A slight exception I take is that not all the euphemisms are violent - many, if not most, are - but there are some that are less so. I've always thought "getting busy" was nice and "hide the salami (or sausage or...)" and "bumpin uglies" to just be silly or playful. That said, I agree that I can't think of many terms that don't have some roughness to them. Great work!
Sex has not been politicized. Sexuality has. The act itself remains as it always was, a basic human drive, but the allowed forms that drive can take have become a point of contention for many who wish to gatekeep propriety and enforce their view of normalcy, in order to combat what they define as degeneracy under their value system. I think the old ways still work fine, but people aren't engaging with them, preferring to think there's an easier way with apps and such, when all those apps do is skew everyone's perception of their value on the sexual marketplace and prevent actual human connection, which should be the core of forming relationships. I do see a problem with the modern attitude, but I see a trend of prudeness, not liberation. I see so many attitudes from the youth reflecting a phobia around consent, to the point where less and less avenues of expressing sexual interest are allowed or proper, and so less connections get formed. It's reached the point where something as simple as a girl kissing a boy she likes without securing permission first is seen as a criminal act, and I think that's the big problem. Everyone's become more defensive, seeking ammunition for the so called oppression olympics and desiring more to be the more persecuted party, rather than to be the more desirable one. They're more concerned with how they will appear to their social group as a result of their sex life than they are with the meaningfulness of that sex life to themselves. As for the incels, even if we could grant them a right to sex, it wouldn't help them with their real problem, which is an inability to form intimacy with another person. Sex is merely the end goal to them, when it should be a conduit to love, which is what they really are lacking. But their situation is not society's fault, but their own. They are actively being bred out of the system for being unsuitable partners for anyone, and rarely are the reasons anything but mental. Even if we gave them government mandated gf's, they would just drive them away with their toxicity and be right back where they started. Sex and relationships are a consent based system in the end, and they basically have to get in line with just the lowest baseline of acceptability, respecting women as equals and respecting themselves, or they deserve what they get.
sex (and love, and close relationships in general) is a weird thing that no one should feel "unworthy" or "undeserving" of - in general, every body can be desirable, and every person can be loved, and no one should feel otherwise about themselves. it can be extremely healthy for one's mental health. on the other hand, it's not something that is a "right" or owed to anyone in any way - no one should feel (or in the case of abuse victims or those sex workers who do it for survival, literally BE) obligated to have sex with another, even less - to be attracted to them. sex is a thing everyone deserves but no one is owed. i fully agree with your point: love and sex should not be transactional. but this idea is so deeply ingrained into our consciousness that it's hard to imagine how a love life free from capitalistic logic can look like. comparing ourselves to other "commodities" on the dating "market", tying our worth to our sex life, in some cases believing we've been wronged by society/women/men because we can't get sex - it's extremely hard for people of all genders to free ourselves from.
You have mentioned before how you personally prefer to only have sex/date people who you feel a connection towards. I think this biases you towards thinking that what we all need is sacred sex (quoting you towards the end). I think that much like everything else in life, it depends, and everyone is different. Even the same person can want different things at different points in life. For instance, I like monogamy, I've been in a relationship for 3 years and I'm deeply in love with my partner. Before that I was in another 2 year relationship. But I've also had casual sex, and I have had a craving for sex without the emotional intimacy. Humans are so complex and multifaceted that I think practically any attempt yo universalize an experience will be flawed. We don't *all* and *all times* want casual sex, just as we dont all at all times want intimate love making. I wish everyone a healthy exploration of what their own needs are and how they change over time. Sex is simple and at the same time one of the most complex things in our lives. Stay safe and love your neighbor ❤️
Re "the personal is political" one of the barriers women and children encountered when seeking legal protection was the notion that sexual abuse, domestic violence, and harassment were "personal/family matters" and thus not subject to legal scrutiny. The feminists of the second wave sought to turn these personal issues into public issues because they correctly observed that deferring to an abusive family to resolve its absue issues would only serve the interests of the abusive party....note how different this notion of politicizing the personal is from today's. We have shifted from a goal of combating the structures that perpetuate violence to combating barriers to personal gratification. In the cases of lookism discussions about dating preferences are had at the expense of working to combat the impulse to make respect of others contingnet on their attractiveness.
I am not anti porn or anti sex work (I'd prefer it be legalized so that it can be regulated, as it's very easy for abuse to happen when it's illegal). However, the "right to sex" feels very icky to me. I think that mindset can be used to justify SA when someone gets turned down. No one owes another person sex or a relationship and consent is everything.
I think that the internet has made hookups and fantasy so available that today's generation finds it easier than pursuit of actually relationships. Loving relations require work and responsibility, and today's society lacks seeks quick gratification and may not be acclimated to such responsibility. I do mean responsible or safe sex, I mean the responsibility of deep loving relationship.
We live in a society where most, especially women, are shamed for not having sex, marriage, kids or hadn’t committed any form of intercourse like kissing. I remember my toxic ex friend (who’s straight) would tell how much she kisses other girls/guys, and then tell me how I’m just “scared”. She even offered me to kiss her- repulsive it was, which is why she’s called an ex friend. The truth is that I’m an aromantic bi who hates commitment, have my own ambitions as an individual and I enjoy solitude/ not interacting with others who provide me no emotional benefit. The fact that traditionalist and conformist dehumanize others as objects until it’s their turn to “breed 100 kids to keep the population strong” says enough of the matter.
To me men not having sex doesn't reveal a need for more sex services, it reveals that men in mass are having issues with forging meaningful relationships and being intimate. Men all over the world already have access to sex services and yet the number of sexually inactive men keep on rising. On the other hand most of what I've read on incel and manosphere forums seems to also show that a large percentage of the participants in them have no other interests apart from these communities. I've met so many people in real life I didn't find remotely attractive until they started passionately sharing their interests. Why would someone choose to date a person whose only interest is is how undateable they are? I also think a big part of why consent has been turned into the "right to sex" comes from western individualism, because although pleasure is an individual preference having sex is never an individual experience and turning it into such only does harm for both parties involved. Saying one has a "right" to have sex completely ignores that sex is not something one does on their own and perpetuates the belief that sex is about one's own enjoyment, rather than a bonding, intimate experience between two enthusiastically consenting people. It also diminishes consent into something to check off a list, rather than a process of exploration of one's own boundaries and trust in the other, that involves numerous factors and is constantly changing. It also begs the question does withholding consent halfway through (which is 100% valid) infringe on the "right" of the other person? What is the difference between "right to sex" and "right to consent"? And how can sex where one side of the consent has been bought ever be healthy and rewarding for both parties involved? I agree with you that sex and relationships of any kind are always specific and individual to each person. The issue for me comes from when people see themselves as the only individual that matters in the equation and I think we are all a little bit guilty of that.
If women dislike casual sex and the hook up culture so much, why are way more women than men partaking in the hook up culture? A significant percentage of men pay for sex, which means that paid sex is somewhat of an equalizer. If these men couldnt pay for sex, its not going to have any impact on women's sex lives. Thing is women are more selective, shallow, and find fewer men physically attractive than vice versa. A large number of men will have to compensate for that and find other means to convince women to have sex. Paid sex is a logical outcome of this.
@@newperson9662 I can't speak for all women, but since you commented under my comment I'll speak for myself. As а woman I don't hate hook up culture, but I also stopped participating in it because the empowerment it made me feel was really a delusion. You can participate in hook up culture without having sex absolutely devoid of meaning and connection. I have had sex with many people who I never dated, but to this day I feel care for them even if they are not a part of my life. They weren't just random people, they were people I forged a connection with in the amount of time that we had together, and that connection naturally culminated into sex. It can be done but it is probably a more common approach amongst queer people. Now the information we received in this video did not make it clear what the 82% of satisfied women were doing, they could be in relationships. Or they could be in casual sexual arrangements, but I doubt that they're all participating in hook up culture and satisfied with that. Men paying for sex will always hurt women. A man who has only ever payed for consent doesn't understand the process of earning it. A man who has learned that there are no boundaries in sex as long as you pay well, is not going to approach sex with a significant other with boundaries in mind, because he has never experienced that, most likely he doesn't even think about that. As a sexually experienced woman nothing would turn me off more than finding out that all my partner's sexual experiences were payed for. Sex is not a need, it's a desire, no one's gonna die from not getting it and having these services only stops men from doing the work. And LOL at the women are more shallow. Did you not watch the video, Kid literally said men are the more visual and if anything's gonna make one shallow, it's not the person who's attraction is psychological. And this is easily disprovable, I see ugly men with pretty women all the time, I've never seen a hot man date a woman uglier than him (unless it was for money and clout). If men think women are so shallow and selective, well they better step up their game. Women have been trying catering to men (in order to survive) for centuries , maybe it's time for those roles to reverse, as that is the way it usually is in nature.
@@annanaydenova8321 In the hook up culture, women exclusively have casual sex with conventionally hot men. You also have had F-buddies and FwB. How many of them were mediocre / below average in looks? I don't understand why you see this dynamic as a correction. Today, a below avg looking, fat, out of shape, broke woman with low self esteem can get on dating apps and find 100s of goodlooking guys willing to hook up, while her looksmatched guy will be totally unwanted. Please tell me what time in human history did we have the opposite of this?
Appreciate your thoughts and sharing. This is a big subject that needs a ton of conversation and less recriminations. Comments on RUclips does not seem the best place to do it justice, but I do want to help with your engagement to improve the algorithm's support. Thank you for what you do. Positive thoughts for you and those close to you.
Sex Is consensual Companionship consensual Conversation is consensual Friendship is consensual You being lonely is consensual Never having a husband is consensual We as men don't have be your friends, or give you companionships. You don't have to give us sex. We will just find women who are willing to do it. And ignore those who ain't on our level. Why is it so hard for people to get we all don't have to associate with one another. I don't associate with women I'm not having sex with. That's my right.
This whole thing is based on a flawed and incredibly naive premise: that sex was not already political. The phrase was not "Let's make the personal political!" Feminists were reacting to a the realization that society was already forcing people to practice sex, love, and marriage in a specific way, (i.e. 1950s gender roles). Sex positive feminism was trying to liberate us from those restrictions by replacing all of the unspoken rules with the relatively straightforward concept of consent. I guess like a lot of incels Kidology is assuming relationships were easy to get in the past and existentially fulfilling. In reality the feminist movement of the 1960s came into existence precisely because marriages at the time were full of problems and decidedly NOT existentially fulfilling. On average, if you include all of the abusive relationships, and women who do all of the chores while still working full time, marriage actually shortens the life of women, and makes them more stressed than single women. The reason incels want a right to sex is because they think men NEED sex somehow. They think of it as a vital resource, and imagine the deprivation to be the cause of all their problems. Feminists oppose "a right to sex" because somewhere someone would be forced to provide it and thus have sex against their consent. Christianity politicized sex nearly 2,000 years ago. Sex outside of marriage become a sin against God and thus the whole community. The strictness of chastity waxed and waned but was almost always more severe than most people alive today can imagine. The 20th century changed a lot of things, including almost eliminating the concept of chastity. I guess the problem is now engaging in the reverse of chastity feels like a requirement to an increasing number of men.
For clarity’s sake (in my mind), I believe we all don’t have “a right to sex” in a ‘civilized’/ cooperative society. I believe we have “a right to pursue consensual sex”, as well as “a right to have HAD consensual sex.”
I'm 34 years wise, and have never had sex with a woman. I've never dated a woman, despite my immense efforts to be with a woman. No first kiss, no dancing, etc. As far as I got was touching, though it was very limited. Friend Zone only, multiple times. Sure, one could argue that paying for sex is an option, but I don't desire that route, sex is sacred to me. It's painful loving different women, that for some reason don't want to be with me, let alone touch or be touched by me. What makes matters worse is that I was sexually abused in childhood, that is a f***ked up introduction into sexual activity.
Damn bro, stay strong, maybe you can't easily meet woman in your everyday life, maybe you should try to do some hobbies or activities where you can meet more women ? Or maybe your too shy ?
@@lukshi I've experienced social anxiety (strong anxiety in general) most of this life, as I became wiser in age I became more social & placed myself out into the world more as best I could. Of course, there's a big difference between In person vs over the internet. But the internet exposure doesn't deserve to be shunned or made less than, in person public interactions. We are all different in many ways, and each human navigates what works for them, and what doesn't. I've diligently put myself out there via the internet many times in many ways. Used several dating apps, and talked to several women (or perhaps impersonators) and it unfortunately is the same cycle of them choosing to randomly stop responding to me; And each time it's early within the fresh conversation. It has happened when I'm the one carrying the conversation, and when I'm not.
The trickyness of using a term "right to sex" without clarifying words to distinguish between an individual's ACCESS or all individual's CHOICES to engage OR NOT ENGAGE is just another example of our modern hate based mindset. I'm 100% pro-choice with regard to every aspect of life. The only limit for me is when the choice infringes on the personal choices of others. "If right to sex" means we coerce some people into being sex partners by economic, social or even legal coercion, that's institutionalized SA. I've worked in prisons, and most coerced sexual activity in that environment is by economic rather than direct physical coercion. It's just that in prison, physical safety and security is currency just like tobacco, commissary food, drugs, tattoo guns, cell phones, etc. Well if a person is surrendering their body for the currency of general safety, rather than surplus benefits that's no more consensual than being forcibly r...ped by a specific person, there's just less physical injury. In neither case does the victim want to do it, let alone enjoy the act. That's pure loss of choice. If "right to sex" means people can freely negotiate transactions or engage out of love and / or attraction without being told they are breaking the law or are risking ostricization and social condemnation, then that's access to choice. But the ambiguity of that single term will be weaponized by multiple groups to force, demonize or confuse in order to "win". Will most people ever embrace universal respect and denounce exerting force over other humans as a means to one's desired end? Not super optimistic about that.
Yes, there are a lot of conflicting views When Roe v Wade was repealed, there were a lot of comments from men saying "good, maybe more women will keep their legs closed". I wondered how that would help them really. I think it was about controlling female sexuality rather than anything else.
Because it’s clear as day that women keep their legs open for the top 20% of men only. Maybe closing it by force would mean everyone will have better chances
@@harsh3948 there it is. You’re mad cause they’re not sleeping with you. Lol. Even if they were willing to sleep with you you’re telling them to keep their legs closed. Can’t be mad if women listen. With abortion bans and men getting more violent, men not evolving etc; I don’t see why any women would sleep with men
Well 50 years ago they tried to make porn mainstream by having it in major theaters. Deep Throat’s premiere was attended by celebrities. Things were really weird back then lol
I was literally just thinking about this. The Catholic church is a prime example of how suppressing someone's natural, instinctual inclination makes them more likely to engage in the worst forms of sexual behavior
You see that sort of thing in most positions of power, though, including in churches where the pastor/priest is permitted to have a spouse. The Catholic church just gets more flak because they try to cover it up.
Disagree. If what you're implying here is that priests become p*dophiles because they can't marry or have sex, no. More like p*dos are attracted to jobs that give them higher status, protection, trust of them community or access to children. Priesthood is a choice, not something Catholic men are forced into. Also I grew up is a predominantly third world Catholic country, it's definitely NOT as s^xually deviant as when I went to the USA or Germany.
I dont know why the focus is always on the Catholic Church regarding child sex abuse. Every church denomination/institution has predators that prey on children/vunerable adults. Its not a uniquely catholic phenomenon.
With social media I think everyone is becoming more aware of how difficult intimacy is and probably should be. We simultaneously raise sex to such a high priority goal in life but at the same time are shamed or seen in a certain way if we don't achieve it. I still don't understand how it suddenly became a need rather than a want, either. On a less secular note, as someone who was raised religious but now is more spirit-minded but still following the usual habits regarding intimacy, it's hard to find a balance between the ultra-religious and misogynist demands of women and the expectations of the rest of the world. It's so true that one's sex life is a political statement now. Personally I don't see the solutions for this coming from the internet, corporate government, or studies of any kind. With how political everything is I don't trust that truth will be the goal but instead placating the political anger from any of the many schools of thought regarding these things. Starting with a political statement and then finding evidence to support it. With all this on my mind I really think that everyone, regardless of descriptors are struggling with the state of our world as it is and sex isn't even on the radar (to a certain point) I'm rooting for all of us, friends
You don't understand? Besides monks/nuns when in history have people been A-OK with celibacy? People have always felt like they "needed" it. It's a very strong motivator.
@@amo1704 I'm not confused as to why people want it. I'm confused where the idea of it being a "need" comes from. I've been happily celibate all my life.
@@heyhey439 I think it becomes a need when it becomes less guaranteed for young men. When more men had the opportunity to have relationships, marry and have regular sex, it was a need that was being met therefore it isn't mentioned. It's only when that need starts not to be met for these young men and the possible effects that it is now becomes an unmet need which is now publicly acknowledged.
@@rejectionisprotection4448 It is a want. People do not die of no bitches. Hugs are something I really really want and are great for a person but if I don't get it I'm not going to pass away.
This is probably one of the best videos or political commentaries I've seen in years. Thank you for making it. I agree, the personal need not be political. That is no way to be.
Well you sound like a philosopher in full, I will wait for your book.You should be published.✍🏽Thank you for giving me more ideas to think about-awesome blog🔥
@@KidologyCO definitely think you should consider it. Not necessarily just because of the money aspect, but because you seem to have a unique story that people could relate to.
@@KidologyCO You have a unique perspective on things, a deep interest in certain aspects of society, and well thought-out opinions. I would buy that book.
Interesting topic and conversations in the chat. Advice to parents is to take your kids outside to play and socialize. Stop coddling them and keeping them other children. Limit video games, TV and internet access so that they don’t spend almost all of their time not interacting face to face with people. All this awkwardness comes from people never learning how to socialize when they were kids. So they grow up to be awkward individuals in society/outside.
Sex education should include teaching children about the black pill and women actual standards for men and the fact that many, many men will never meet them and what that means for those men.
This is very toxic. Sex education should be based in science & how not to get a venereal disease and about contraception etc. They need to set up more youth clubs, were kids can meet and socialise with each other and start to form, relationships. And keep off computers.
@@redstar7292 You do realize that Blackpill is nothing BUT science right? A simple scientific tinder experiment proves you wrong on so many levels it’s not even funny There’s an entire subreddit dedicated to sharing the scientific proof’s behind the blackpill called r/blackpillscience
I love your videos on this kind of topics because it does bring much needed nuance to the conversation, however I can't help but notice how heterocentric they can be. I do understand that you speak from your perspective, however I'd love to see what you think of similar debates that have much different impacts/implications in queer culture and queer people's mental health
I reckon the general dynamic is that women have control over sex and men have control over relationships. The sexual revolution has normalised sex coming before relationships where it used to be the other way around, 50+ years ago. For women this had led to unhappiness due to a lack of emotional connection, feeling used, and relationship insecurity. For men this societal overemphasis on sex has led to it being viewed as a goal and a source of validation. Women now trade sex for romantic consideration, leading to a small group of men being highly competed over by women while most men aren't given a chance romantically. This is because the barrier for entry is too high, as sex is expected (by both sides) at the 3rd date, and women aren't having their emotional needs met by that stage. Dating pretty much means fucking these days, and that is a much higher bar for most women. So, everyone loses.
I think this is a bit of a narrow stereo typical analysis on men and women. I think sexual development and milestones through adolescence, have been lost. We almost need to go back to just having a landline with no answer machine, and no mobile phone/computer.
@@redstar7292 This is a criticism that can be levied against any commentary, because we are by necessity summarising, simplifying and stereotyping when commenting on anything. That is actually the point of analysis.
@@trianglesandsquares420 they don't. It's just that the playing field is less imbalanced and men have at least some leverage. Women still have the upper hand
This is a total side tangent, but your video reminded me a lot of the fanfiction communities I've been a part of for the better part of fifteen years. A lot of it is shipping/romance focused, and it's basically an online exchange of romantic (and/or erotic) stories. Well, this venue has become a total political battleground in the past 7ish years, with disputes surrounding if it's morally correct to write stories about abusive relationships or taboo topics (especially with sexually explicit stories). I feel like the "politicization of sex" is absolutely at the root of this, as it's no longer about enjoying stories and the emotion fiction gives us but a political struggle of proship vs antis. It wasn't like this ten years ago, but politics has seeped its way into everything. I blame social media for this--tumblr specifically. So much radical politics originated on tumblr.
I hate how sex centered our modern society has become, I hate it, I’m not religious or anything but like sex is such an intimate thing I just don’t feel comfortable having with no further intentions, I particularly don’t have a very high sex drive so I don’t suffer much, and if you feel empowered and live happily living a life with plenty of sex, more power to you honestly, but that’s not me, and I’m okay with that, it’s just that people view you as less, when I don’t get it… I chose not to have sex? And somehow that affects someone other than myself? How?
Not the most important comment, but been watching your content recently (love it) and i’ve been wondering if there’s a reason you say “woman” and not “women” (wimen) for “woman” plural form? 🧐
More important than the sex to men is the intimacy that it represents. Social programming dictates that that intimacy is most available to men through the medium of sex. Men who resent women and become violent are the same ones who feel helpless to break out of their feelings of loneliness and isolation - their inability to connect. That's where the toxic feeling of entitlement to sex comes from. That's different to the "right to sex" you mentuon here, I get that. But I don't see how just providing men/people with sex would fix anything. The class of workers providing the sex will still have to deal with men who want more and may resent them for not providing.
@@rulingstone123 that's true. Being in a relationship doesn't even solve the issue. It's an internal fracture in men. But of course thats not an isolated phenomenon. The politics of modern dating plus a lack of introspection and the comples trauma of being denied intimacy as young boys stoked the flames of hatred.
Men don't emotionally connect through sex, understand that? They don't equate sex with intimacy. For men sex is all about dopanine and relief. They thrust they ejaculate and then experience a dopamine low to the point they feel repulsed by the woman they just ejaculate in. The little oxytocin (love and attachment hormone) men produce during sex is washed away when ejaculation is complete For men, sex with women they are not in love with is just a release, an activity. It can also be connected with subjugating another human being. Men use sex as weapons agaisnt women since women have a natural submissive position in sex (they are penetrated).
@@redleeks6253 hm.. I don't understand that, no. What you're saying sounds a little dehumanising to men, and you're also making an equivalence between the vulnerable position someone being penetrated puts themselves in with submissiveness. Making yourself vulnerable is not the same as being submissive... and thinking that is a contributor to men not being emotionally vulnerable, since "submission" in a toxic sense is seen as a "negative" "female" "minor" role.
Well spoken and sincere. I agree with her general perspective and specifically appreciated her referring of sex as sacred. However, it was not so much what she said but didn't say that bothered me: Not once did sex get connected with procreation; sex is a step in a natural process, hence the overwhelming urge and incentive followed by an often underwhelming experience, because it's all about getting the act done and not just the act itself. Even the aspect of love and compatibility within the relationship is ultimately rooted in child rearing. I honestly don't assume to be telling others anything new but modern society seems to hate being reminded of their obligations to Mother Nature. We have created a culture monstrously obsessed with the artificial(in this instance contraception and porn), and society will continue to degrade until we recover an organic and sacred life.
A lot of our problems nowadays stem from the internet. Our ability to find community and echo chambers in hundreds of people across the world at the click of a button instead of socializing with the ones around us has done irreparable damage. It is both a blessing and a curse
The notion of rights - any kind of rights - doesn't really work without the concept of reciprocity, of your rights ending where another person's begin. A right to sex doesn't fit into that framework (at least as is commonly understood: some people do use the term "solo sex" to refer to masturbation, and that's a different story) because it intrinsically takes away some people's fundamental right to their own bodies in the name of giving a new "right" to others. The idea of an absolute right to sex that could override another person's right to bodily autonomy is an extremely dangerous one.
Isn't this in the end true for all non negative rights, e.G. welfare? And if you, like me, don't accept the libertarian world view their must indeed be something close to a "right" for sex, meaning a society must form conditions for it. As we did in the past.
Honestly, this decade in my 20s, between increasing work hours, hiking cost of living, increasing rent due to AirBnB epidemic in my city, the fact that I have family at the parts of the world under war at the moment - sex doesn't even enter my orbit of issues or things to deal with.
My thoughts are truly with you.
@@KidologyCO
I understand
My thoughts exactly
It does just fine for women and hot men.
I feel that the real problem among here isn't a lack of sex, but isolation. People who are stuck on their own with no way of socialising are generally not likely to be having much sex, in addition to the various other impacts of being trapped and alone.
It's not about sex at all...sex doesn't make you happy, it's connection and deep relationships we need to cultivate and promote in society
@@misstigerbubbles Maslow will figure it out.
Yes. I've always seen sex as something that happens when a proper, intimate connection is formed. Even if it is "just" a hookup, there has to be *something* there. The lack of that something - desire, motivation, confidence, ability to express yourself sexually - is what the real issues are, and point to a broader issue.
@@misstigerbubbles l
@@misstigerbubblesI think that often groups such as incels mean connection, rather than intercourse, which is the most personal and intimate act 2 people can have. Of course, this becomes rather literal when radicalisation occurs, but for many, I think that is actually the case.
There should be no right to sex, there should be no right to intimacy, all has to be earned and conditional and fully consented on both sides. Even as a man I know it, even if I suffer I don't care.
Agreed
same for the right to healthcare. no human being has a right to someone else's labour. that's slavery.
100% agree. This will of course impact men more as they have to initiate and do most of the work to get intimacy but no one "deserves" it
You have no right to sex but you shouldn't be called entitled when you become unhappy for not having any. People like to play around with words to avoid the reality that it is absolutely devastating to go through life without an intimate partner.
women dont a have a right to respect tbh, it has to be earned
My problem with this whole right to sex phrasing, is that i can see it turning very dark very quickly. Some people already feel entitled to other's bodies. Imagine if someone tries to withdraw consent but now people think they have a "right" to sex. Even though it's meant to decriminalize things like prostitution, i can imagine people abusing it right away.
I agree that it will become weaponised VERY quickly, because there's a lot of pent up frustration and anger. I foresee a lot of revenge being taken out on women generally, prostitutes specifically.
Withdrawing the consent and leaving the relationship while the other feels entitled to you and your body. I've seen this one, and I agree it can escalate easily into the ugly things. I believe it's down to education and the individual mentality that can't grasp some of the concepts and have to be regulated externally by the set of the rules or laws.
I think "the right to sex" sounds bad but the original twitter thread isn't about men having the right to have sex with any woman without consequence or issue, or that people (particularly men) are entitled to sex with whomever they want. the way it's phrased sounds like that, but what she's actually talking about is about people's rights to having sex without facing stigma for it. which doesn't mean decriminalizing actual assault, but if someone wants to have sex with a stranger or without any strings attached, or even if they pay for sex to occur, that shouldn't be something that is criminal or stigmatized. people have the right to engage in these activities without any issue - but currently, that's not the case as sex work and sex without relationships is harshly looked down on, especially when women are the ones that are engaging in these activities (as we can see from the slutshaming thats so common in society)
@@zorro...... oh absolutely. I just think there has to be a better way to phrase it
@@zorro...... What is she talking about, if that's already not criminalized? She wants to decriminalize something, what is it?
I think the "lack of sex" statistic is often used as a problem when in reality is only a symptom. Sex is used as a placeholder for human connection, intimacy and validation. And sex can be a very intimate experience, but it does not have to be. So in that sense I do no think that the "Right to sex" thing is an actual solution. We can have a society of people who all have sex but feel lonely, detached from each other and ultimately sad or miserable.
I saw a video that talked about how we lack spaces to meet people "spontaneously" like we did before. Since we do not have places like this anymore we have to use things like Tinder, that is something so far from "normal" that 20 years ago I would tell you that it's sci-fi nonsense. Add to that that Tinder's main goal is not to find you love or sex, but to profit. The conclusion to that video was that we could build spaces in cities that allow for community to develop in a spontaneous manner.
The pandemic really threw the lack of public spaces into stark relief. A 18-22 college social club that I am the supervisor for had to go online only in 2020, and people who had talked online with one another for an entire year and a half didn't actually get to meet each other face to face until sometime in fall of 2021. It took another year of interaction for relationships to start to normalize again, and we had a wave of couples forming in the last few months here in fall of 2022. That's critical socialization time that was robbed from those young people, and I don't think some of them will ever recover. Online spaces are a pale substitute for face to face communication and connection, even non romantic ones.
And these kids are the lucky ones, because they do have access to that open public space, with organized activities for socialization. Not every young adult has the opportunity to go to college, and those in my acquaintance are the ones most forced to replace healthy in person socialization with online only attempts instead.
It is a symptom, and while I don't think sex *has* to be intimate, I think that for many people there is a natural progression of learning social skills and developing relationships that makes sex a consequence. Not having those skills and checks is what creates a lot of modern incels. And while you can have sex without feeling that romantic passion or intimacy, I believe thoroughly that for most incels, that lack of social and relational development which would lead to them having sex is actually what's bothering them. If it was really just about sex for them, they'd find a legal avenue to hook up with a prostitute and be done with them. But if you ask them, which I have, they would say that it's cheating/doesn't count, since they didn't earn it and the person they slept with didn't do so out of desire, but only because they got paid.
Why are you ignoring the gender angle? Women aren't the ones lacking sex.
@@newperson9662 maybe not in quantity, maybe not short-term, but long term I do believe 1/3 or more of guys pretty much being incel is going to affect women too.
@@Jazzmaster1992 1/3 of 50% men being incels doesn't affect women because they all are still going to date and have sex with the rest. Yes, they wont be able to marry, but who needs marriage nowadays? They can easily have sex, intimacy, and companionship with attractive men in short term relationships.
As a man with sexual trauma, I just wanted to say that you've been able to put into words the feelings I have had for years about sex and the fractured relationship between men and women in modern society. The extreme politicization of sex has made it nearly impossible for me to put myself out there because I can't relax enough to be comfortable around anyone. You're right: when sex is removed from the context of antipolitical love, it becomes something very strange and sinister. It becomes profane, when it should be sacred.
Thank you. Never doubt that your words have immense impact. They have helped me and many others navigate the chaos. I only wish that more public figures were as reasonable and intelligent as you.
My childhood sexual trauma really messed me up.
Isn’t that the issue? That sex is no longer scene as sacred. The you use to have to court someone, marry someone to have it. But now marriage, family and religion are in decline and these barriers for sex have been removed as well as the need to connect and really know one another. It’s become more transactional and simply physical.
I just wanna say thank you for expressing your feelings about this. I wish you happiness and good vibes in the future
People can have a healthy sexual encounter without being in love or wanting to get married. Its about two parties respecting each other and communicating with each other.
@@katiez688 Noted. Had no idea that this form of a healthy sexual encounter is possible.
I kind of detest this idea that all the young men just “need to have sex” because the majority of young men I know don’t want sex they want relationships they want somebody who cares about them. I feel like just saying they want sex is discounting their feelings
The 'incels' are pathologically *obsessed* with sex and don't even realize that that's what makes them so creepy to women.
And they fail to realize that many women and other men(!) aren't having sex either, and aren't 'suffering' from and being bitter about it the way the incels do.
I'm starting to form the theory that what incels actually want is human connection, the same way everyone else does, but won't admit this (because that would require realizing that it's them and their personalities that actually drive others away) and instead see having sex as a 'magic bullet' solution to all their problems.
@iNSTAGiB I don't disagree with anything you wrote. And I have no problem with p0rn.
The issue with people who go to incel forums is they become very extreme, blame women for all their problems, don't take any accountability or make any effort to improve themselves, and generally live in a state of perpetual victimhood because they're not getting what they want -- sex.
My point is, not only will getting it not actually fix these people's problems, but that most guys I know who aren't getting laid either -- even though I know they want to -- don't go so far as to become *that*.
That's similar to the realisation that people studying incels had some years ago. It went like this:
Incels: "Need pussy 😡"
Everyone else: "Prostitutes exist."
Incels: "Not like that! 🤬"
Eventually people (including incels) realised that it's not sex they actually want, they want to be desired and/or be desirable. Sex was just a proxy for that external validation.
The Western stereotype of men is emotionless and constantly horny so _if they're expressing a negative emotion is must be cos they're sexually frustrated_ 🙄
The biggest contributing factor to this problem is the commodification of human interaction via social media. The more time we spend online the less time we spend in the real world finding a meaningful connection. Facebook started off as a way to connect with friends at school but that wasn't the best way to keep people engaged and on the platform. In order to maximize profits the algorithm shifted to showing us the most funny post, the most educational, the most entertaining. This meant that fewer and fewer people's content were being marketed and thus it became a way to consume content rather than make new friends.
you cant waste people time trying to get this meaningful connection because alot of people dont want to sit around talking for 10 hours with someone all i hear is using someone to talk their ear off i know men who sit around listening to a woman for hours and still got not where . stop with this meaningful connection bullshit nobody should have to listen to someone for hours and hours
Actually Facebook started off as a way to rate women's attractiveness.
@@TheCoolgame24 that’s the problem. You want a superficial relationship. Not one that is meaningful and long lasting. In order to have a relationship that is worth a damn that involves talking and reciprocal care. You have no one but yourself to blame if you refuse to care about anyone but yourself.
@@casperthenotsofriendlyghos8968 and the men who talk for 1000 hours still get cheated on I use to do P.I work and I saw most of the conversations it didnt help shit and exposed so many women all that talking shit never worked it just a waste of time for a man
@@casperthenotsofriendlyghos8968 tons of men are talking and talking wasting 4000 hours talking to women and you know they still get cheated on and left so what you have to say about that no man should have to waste 1000 hours to a woman for her to just cheat or left
I don't interpret "consent" as a negotiation at all. That's more coercion. Consent should be enthusiastic at all times, no back and forth required.
Yes lots of women intiate sex.
Thus the existence of Lookism and dating apps
Coercion is one form of negotiation. Every social interaction has some element of negotiation. Doesn't matter how you feel about it.
Yeah. Negotiation is a worst choice. But at the end of the day, if they chose to agree willingly then they simply did.
Define enthusiastic? I have sex sometimes with my partner when I am not entirely on the mood (I go through phases of having a low libido). I consent but not enthusiastically in those cases.
As someone who is demisexual - I genuinely can’t bring myself to have sex with someone I barely know even if I do think they’re physically attractive. I feel this internal resistance so if I’m dating someone sex is probably off the table for a month or two, even if we’re getting on really well, making out, and mutually attracted to each other.
No guy I have dated has ever waited up to five weeks before they start cancelling plans (plans they made) to hang out with other people they were dating. They don’t leave, they just start flake on plans. My guess is they are having sex elsewhere, and not getting sex from me feels like rejection. I would never expect / give exclusivity or commitment in less than two months, but it seems quite obvious that most men start to run out of ideas of how to connect to women if sex isn’t on the table.
I feel sorry for you, that no guy waited for you longer than 5 weeks! Honestly, i am not demisexual, but i waited more then 1 year for my ex girlfriend of 7 years (really loved her very much). In these days, the vaccination against hpv was quiet new, so i suggest, that she should do this first, because she was a virgin anyways (in the age of 24). What i did'nt new is, that it takes 3 injections in several months, but i waited anyways....Years later (still a couple), we were talking about this and it turned out, that she thought i was waiting because her childhood in another, conservative country...But even if this would have been the issue, i would have waited for her as well. In the end, i was just thankful for our great relationship of 7+ years
I have the same experience as you in dating. I might be on the demisexual spectrum as well but I'm not sure. I definitely cannot be intimate without trust and a sense of safety and that takes time to develop. Most men lose interest in me/disappear after a few dates either because they feel like I'm not interested or "conservative" or they were not that interested in me beyond sex and are getting it elsewhere. Either way, I've started to make peace with solitude until and unless I find someone who is willing to take the time to know me and establish that environment of safety and trust.
Love seeing a privileged, middle class, white woman in the West who doesn’t have to choose between selling her body or providing food for herself/her kids campaign for a “right to sex”. Which really means a right for society to commodify poorer women’s bodies so people of her class don’t have to deal with the “incel” problem directly.
Holy shit this is a great take
I don't think that is precisely the type of "right" she was discussing, but I think you've precisely identified the effects, holy shit. Commerce destroys anything it touches.
Its good that struggling women have the option to sell sex and make quick money. Men and women both struggle financially.
Poor women aren’t entitled to free money sweetie
@@harsh3948 Where did she say that?
Something that came to mind throughout watching this…the idea of having a “right” to sex is convoluted without recognizing that sex has consequences. Those consequences can of course be positive or negative but they are effects, nonetheless. Children? Pregnancy? Physical issues? None of this seems to be touched on by people who are arguing for this so-called politicized “right”.
As always, amazing video Kid :)❤️
But who is arguing for a "right" to sex? As opposed to a "desire" for it? Because let's be real, it's the latter of the two which is really going on. But these men are considered unattractive, which is why people *lie* and say that "incels" think they are "entitled" to sex.
@@rockymvvrcianu6846 nobody's ever said ppl aren't allowed to have desires. everyone has desires. they're uncontrollable.
most people, when they can't find a date, think "it's unfortunate. it would sure be nice to have a date." and they leave it at that. if an incel acts as if other people are depriving them of something for refusing sex, then they'd be entitled.
@@cabbage-soup They are not acting "entitled" point blank.
Are you abstaining from dating and sex?
@@rockymvvrcianu6846 but they are, point blank.
Lovely follow up from your previous video. As you said before, our current generation has missed out on the "coming of age" phase.
The whole boy meets girl, girl meets boy and working through the fear of getting to know each other.
The our fast paced world has stripped us that crucial phase.
I definitely agree with this. I feel like one moment I was a high school kid and immediately after I was working long days, paying bills, waking up at 4am everyday. Fast forward to now, I'm 27 and I'm too old to go an meet people. Those awkward learning moments early on have passed by. I've come to peace with it.
@@Capitanvolume Its not that way for women. Trust me. They're dating and hooking up more than ever.
@@newperson9662 agreed, men's rates of sex and relationship-forming are way down while women's rates haven't at all, meaning women are not affected negatively as in they don't have no one to date.
Dating apps and social media have given nothing but a pure unfair advantage to women, although I'll concede that it's harder for them to sort through the men.
Women are having their experiences and more, while men are not.
@@pointblanks
You do know that there's 162.83 mil men in America and 166.24.mil women. So you do know for relationship formation it requires a one individual from each of those two populations.
20% of the male population can't be dating 90% of the female population, which kind of just a little maybe... completely undermines the logic of this disadvantaged male phenomenon that simply just isn't a thing in real life.
@@Romana6794 20% of the top males may not be dating 90%+ of females however it's pretty high. Are you trying to say that because there's more females, dating gives men the advantage? It should if that's the only variable yet there's so many more. In practice, that's not how it works according to biology. Women are the ones who choose and are pursued, not men.
You don't think a highly desired guy can be a player and date 5 women at the same time and refuse to give any of them a relationship?
On a similar thought, you don't think a decent-looking woman, who has 50+ matches in her dating apps and guys sliding into her DMs, can't or won't date 5 guys at the same time?
We're in hook-up culture, not traditional monogamy. 1-on-1 pairings are not mandatory and people are not forming relationships.
Can we normalize NOT having sex? We shame people for not having sex.
Only heterosexual men are shamed
it doesn't matter whether you shame someone or not, the desire to have sex is always there
The reason why we shame people for sex is because the want for will always be there and it’s someone a lot of people want to do. It’s why we say we shouldn’t feel entitled to sex but we shame people who can’t get it at the same time.
I definitely do not see any issue with that, but I accept I am a minority. Also I am a woman and I can accept this judgement may affect men more? I was troubled by this in my twenties thinking it will validate my worth somehow. Now in my thirties realised it is in no way connected and completely fine with it. Have bigger problems like paying rent.
@@modernphilosopher1268 I think you are missing the point I was making.
Sex positive feminists didn't win, men did. Everyone does have the right to sex, it's called masturbation. When talking about the right to sex it seems to be from a male perspective. Where are all the hot guys making themselves available to service women with poor social skills?
Sad thing is, they never would be, because they're more well off, and because they aren't gromed to by porn culture and the male gaze.
If you ask an incel, he would tell you there are no such woman, because "sex" to them is just physical coitus with a member of the opposite sex. They don't care about pleasure, or consent in the encounter, so they're not demanding rights to that.
The attractive men servicing socially inept women are everywhere, doing their "job" except the women don't have to pay, they just need to alert the attractive men of their intentions and the men will oblige pro bono. How do you not know this?
@@mamotalemankoe3775 Really? Attractive men will sleep with obese and ugly women? Methinks not.
What Alexandra Hunt doesn't realise is that if we did have a truly healthy sexual culture, there would be very few people willing to go into the sex trade to provide this kind of Universal Basic Sex Care. Every study shows that going into the sex industry, even consensually, vastly correlates with previous experiences of child sex abuse.
Yep. I don't see many affluent college educated white women - not to mention men - dropping their cosy jobs to get into sex work or saying that their dream is to be a prostitutes. Somehow the sex industry is always dominated by immigrant poor women of color, who *coincidentally* are some of the most socially and economically vulnerable demographics in society. Funny how that works.
@@purplebutterfly314 You're right on. Elly Arrow is a fantastic channel you should check out if you want to learn more. She talks about how the pro-sex trade lobby in Germany where it is legalised is pretty much only represented by high class escorts, meanwhile the majority immigrant, non-german speaking labor force has no say
@@RapidBlindfolds Interesting. That confirms my understanding of how sex markets inevitably tend to play out.
@@RapidBlindfolds isn’t that like every market those where those at the top get the very best in terms profit and customer quality and the people at the bottom get what’s left?
@@purplebutterfly314 There are some very high end call girls out in Silicon Valley who went into the profession because they enjoy it, and their clientele wants someone who is educated who can hold a conversation with them, but those workers are the exception for sure. (And they also charge $2000 a night.) I recall an interview with one of the women who said her clients honestly really did just want to talk more than anything else. They craved a human connection and were too busy or shy to try to make one, and she considered it a calling that she could give them that connection, even if only for a day.
But those exceptions are perhaps 1% of sex workers in the US, and the vast majority are uneducated, exploited, and trapped.
The phrase ‘right to sex’ is so unsettling to me, I can’t help but think that someone would have to be forced into a sexual relationship for this vision to come true, rights make sure people are provided with objects like food and clothing, and services like medical assistance, so they don’t die. Is sex really something your survival depends on?
Yes Its so distopian too Me its giving goverment iussed wife or some shit.
Totally agree. People already have what one might call the freedom to have sex (well, not everywhere in the world, but generally). If they aren't getting it when they want it, chances are that it's because people don't want to have sex with them. And that is their right. You don't have the right to use another person for your own enjoyment. Sex is mutual.
The phrase is unsettling, but I think she meant ''the right'' to use prostitutes and be a prostitute without being shamed/arrested for it.
Love this video. I think the reason why sex is so politicized is because it is a foundational part of any society. Particularly because whether we like it or not, children are the products of sex. Unfortunately for most of human history, the responsibility of children and therefore “gatekeeping” sexuality has been put on the shoulders of women since our biology is closely tied to the creation of children. Keep in mind, most women who have existed have never had access to birth control since it is a relatively new technology. Having sex for pleasure and connection with a man has always been a gamble if she did not want to have a child.
The last couple minutes of this video was some of your best commentary yet. Many problems in our society, from many different angles, have come about due to making the personal political and from trying to make everything we may lack into a “right.” And, of course, there are always those waiting in the wings to exploit this demand that a “right” be delivered. No shortage of grifters and power-mongers, from the most petty manipulators to the highest offices.
Exactly
FOR REALSIES
When have politics and the personal ever been isolated from one another? The personal is political.
The right to sex is the most privileged and aberrant thing I've ever come across. Humans span the range from non to consentual intercourse and this reflects the complexity of the full range of social relationships across cultures. Sex cannot be homogenised across the homo sapiens in the way it is done with other species, it is simply a facet of an individual's lot in life, with luck being a larger factor than it is in wealth creation.
@@aichabelle267 In practice, I would agree with you, and please forgive me if my comment seemed to imply this political reality is a recent development. Now, I'm not naive enough to expect society to reach an absolute state of divorce between personal and political, but I don't agree that "personal is political" is the default or inevitable reality. We could certainly take steps to move in a direction that left more of the personal realm untouched by both political debate and institutional interference, and I strongly believe we would be a mentally healthier populace for it.
If you could have a citizenry that makes decisions (and votes) from a position of civic responsibility, mutual prosperity, and...I'm not sure how to say it..."common applicability?" (by this I mean, measures that a citizen believes could be fairly applied universally), then you would also have a citizenry that could have civil and productive debates rather than the constant and clashing demands of the personal, which by their very nature mean that most people can never "let it go." Now if that all sounds pie-in-the-sky impossible, I would only say that most citizens live the ethic that is introduced to them by their families, communities, and institutions. Feed children a diet of self-absorption and sham "activism" (self-promotion of some manner wrapped in a "higher cause"), and you get exactly the exploitative leaders and frenzied political climate you would expect.
People are always going to want to accrue personal benefit to themselves; I'm expect we can agree that is reality. But there are plenty of spheres of life where you can attempt fulfillment of those personal desires. I think Kidology is right to be concerned when people feel compelled to drag EVERY aspect of life into the political sphere.
At the end of the day, is it more important and legitimate to defend the right to be alone or to have unwilling company? I start fuming everytime masculinists extol the fifties because my grand father was a very violent man and society forced my gran to stay for way too long. Ultimately, that is what we are talking about when we want to level the playing field and the job market. It's not about girl bosses. It's about everyone having the money to live alone should they want to. As for horn, there is a video on the French youtube between a priest and a horn actress. The comments are very telling about how much men respect women who do that. They say she can't talk to him with a mouth that has been used the way it has. I think I have more respect toward meat at the butcher than consumers of horn toward horn actresses.
Which is incredibly confusing, because they WATCH IT. Maybe it’s bot about intimacy, but about power - and that makes them horny? But in real sex even if you engage in power play, it has limits and boundaries and you can’t be a jackass
@@NonaMoreau I m not sure I am answering to you or going on a tangent. I should have written corn. Now, I'm confused about the meaning of horny. I write and read slash fanfics. People will tell me that I objectify men but I love really slow burn, where the subjectivity of the character is really explored. And I have a lot of friends who just say how much they love their boyfriend when they are catcalled. Usually, the catcaller becomes really nice. If you say "I have someone", it does not work this well. It's about serving people a side dish of your subjectivity. There is a text called the Sadeian Woman about the politics of pornography. A lot of it is about subjectivity. So, tell me if I'm answering off the mark or if I said something relevant. It's that meat actually makes people excited. It's sex without the connection that makes it complicated. Without the part where the other person is real and chaotic. That being said, some men are very respectful when people who have s*x for a living sign an article for the time literary supplement. I do not want to generalise.
I was just commenting this on another thread - the access to non-Eng YT. Would you say the "french YT" has the same sentiment? And that this issue of "sexless men" is equally prevasive in other cultures you have access to?
@@blondscientist At University (irl), I met a few friends with mental illnesses. Some of them were doing there P. h.D. and they had a lot of difficulties finding a relationship, even having a first sexual experience. Mostly, they were leftists. They would not say so but I felt there was a ressentiment toward women. A lot of the hate on the french yt toward what they call woke people come from an extreme right channel called psyhodelic, but every woman who fight for our right to have enough money to cover basic needs and maybe propriety (I don't think it should be a luxury but thanks to placement firms like Black Rock, it is for women and men alike by the way) would be considered woke. They want to supress faculties where we study social sciences, arts (they claim we are bourgeois) but they have no idea what we talk about in such places. Spoiler: we say nothing they think we say. There are lot of debates by a masculinist philosopher and an instagram feminist and basically the comments sections are an echo chamber of people saying that the girl is ridiculous. I would like this Rochedy (the philosopher) to do a debate with a woman like Barbara Stiegler on Nietzche, I think it could be eye opening about what women can be when they are in an environment that is positive and validating of their intelligence. Irl, I think a lot of men who are married realise that the real problem is that labor is delocalised in countries where people are cheaper. That the market is hard and competitive in western countries and that if they are helpful with chores, their girlfriend or wife will stay if she has more money. Ultimately, more money would be an advantage for them and the kids. We are anyway not in a society where one salary is enough for a family. We need to be more and more qualified to get jobs that pay less and less. Caviar left does very little to change that but when right wing people will realise that trade unions are the way forward, I think it will be too late for the west. Elsewhere on the planet, I think that autorarian regims are stifling innovation. I do not think that the real problem is men vs. women but keeping us divided helps people in power. They fight against me keeping my 3 rooms flat (despite my mental illness and what they call a master with an unemployment specialisation) while Trump has gold toilets but those guys love him and assume I am a nuisance stealing what is theirs. They are also all afraid about natality dwindling but the planet does not have ressources for everyone anymore. As for incels, I feel it is hypocrite, but using Carnegie (how to win friends) when you talk to a woman goes a longer way toward having sex than hitting the gym. Self care, automassage, sophrology, relaxation, journaling should not be gendered. People have to give themselves the time and attention they expect from others. The secret to good conversations is often to assume that the person in front of you is a spiritual master that knows a few secrets about the universe however stupid they look (and I'm not being hypocrite, I listened to them) And social networks really encourage people to think everyone but them is a dumbass. However, it still is an internet epiphenomenon. I'm not sure how much traction it gets with people who are busy having a life. I have heard philosophy tube saying that there is a pipeline between atheist channels and masculinist channels. It seems similar in French. Zetetism seems to be about promoting hard sciences. They love making fun of women practicing witchcraft on youtube. Ironically, the witchcraft proponents and the masculinists are geared toward women investing their home life. They would be ideal bed fellows if they did not hate each other. I'll stop the TED talk. Sorry for the novel.
@kshamwhizzle My married friends often complain about malicious compliance when it comes to house chores. It is not downright violence but it can destroy a couple. However, I do not know how to repair a tap and my boyfriend apparently cannot understand that a bifidus yogurt is probiotics despite being allergic to probiotics. I blame our respective education. If he does his laundry, I can't buy him a wool pullover. He will put it at 60 or even 90 with his underwear.
I rarely leave a comment on videos, but I have to say, this is just such a fantastic analysis. I have a PhD in philosophy and am currently working as a researcher at a university … and God, if people I know could manage to critically assess society like this! This video was just excellent! Beautifully presented and beautifully argued.
On a personal note: having spent the first half of my 20’s just on studies, I really did not have anything at all to do with dating/romance until 25 (I’m 26 now… ) - and God, was I surprised at the world out there! I grew up in a really sheltered environment (all my family members have really healthy, loving relationships/marriages so that was the norm). So naturally my response to a few bad/disturbing experiences was to start researching a bit…
I tried the book “The Case Against the Sexual Revolution” - which I thought was a good “first try.” But what I thought was so obviously missing is exactly what was hit upon in this video - love. It is like it is taboo in today’s world to say, sex should be about love. And the way that you connected the politicization of sex with this problem - perfect!
So really, thank you so much for this - I hope very much that many, many more people watch this, and I’m encouraged to see someone who is so intelligent and so clearly well read and well educated put this kind of nuanced content out into the world. You really are doing us all a great service.
Just a few other thoughts, I don’t know, just to put them out there:
- the relationship between this issue about the politicization of sex and the prevalence of birth control/abortion (i.e. can we/how to strike a balance?)
- the role of religion (is this connected with also the decline in religious values? I mean, whatever negatives about religions aside - speaking from a Judeo-Christian context - the most basic message is to love and value other human beings as ends in themselves, which is precisely what you are saying at the end of the video we need a good dose of)
- the role of capitalism - what has been interesting me a lot is the idea of how this society of casual sex functions in a way to turn everyone into extremely productive members of a capitalist society - no families, so can work more; no stable relationship, so can move for jobs; no real meaning or security in personal relationships, so fill the void by consuming; etc. Personally, I’ve never been a fan of communist ideology - from an eastern european background so maybe I have some bias. But living in western europe, when I compare the way people think about relationships with how they do in eastern europe, it is very, very different (okay, still capitalist, but with a lot less economic stability - so people don't have the luxury to worry “have I banged enough chicks?” because they are more worried about “can I support my ageing parents?”)
I resonate with your experience, impressions and background very much. In addition to the questions you raised I often ask myself how wide-spread are these issues - sometimes I wonder if it is just the native English-speaking nations? Does that equate to rich nations?
If I had the time it would be interesting to dive into non English-speaking YT to gauge other experiences.... globalisation nonwithstanding maybe the rest of the world does not encounter/deal with these issues in the same way?
@@blondscientist I actually live in a non-english speaking country (and I've lived in a few others), and I find it more a division between countries where there is more or less economic security, so rich v. poor. In, e.g., Northern Italy and Germany, to me, youth culture seems the same.
But I think you are onto something when it comes to an appropriation of lifestyle in english speaking countries, or just globalism generally as the root problem.
I do have to say, when I get off a plane in eastern europe, I immediately can feel like… wow people are treating me more like a person. That's why I kind of feel like these issues about sex need to be framed within a wider problem in society where we just don't treat other people - let me put it plainly/stupidly - with basic kindness.
Sure, that has always been an issue - people can be bad - but this widespread societal pressure to actively treat people like things… that's something new.
PS. also something I Iiked about the video was this distinction between treating people as generalisations and treating people as individuals - maybe there is a key in there somewhere?
What she's saying is we shouldn't ask or wonder why some men are able to sexually attract so many women so easily while others fail miserably.
@@francisca1378 thank you for replying! :)
I just love how reasonable and nuanced you are on these topics.
What she's saying is we shouldn't ask or wonder why some men are able to sexually attract so many women so easily while others fail miserably.
Very thought provoking. I’m 65 now and I think it wasn’t till my late 30’s that I really began the self evaluative work to see that what’s going on is actually a crime against humanity. Women take the bullet for it, YES, but we are all robbed of our humanity if we are unable to see ourselves in other humans ( irrespective of where we fall on the sexual spectrum) . That last part you said about our humanity, brought back a song; “Reflections of My Heart”, by Rochelle Ferrell. It’s about a couple who truly see themselves in the other. I’ve tried to live life with my wife based on the notion that if I truly do the work I need to do on me that will find myself in her. I’m not perfect, but I keep trying. You got a Brotha choking up here my Sista from another Mista.
What I love about your videos (based on the five I’ve seen since I found you last Sunday) is that rather than trying to convince us this is an invitation to think, research and just deeply analyze this topic that is everywhere these days. Thanks for that!
A problem here is that people confuse "rights" in the moral sense, with "legal rights" which imply absolute legal obligation. For example, when we say that children have a right to a family, that doesn't mean that people will be forced to adopt children against their will; in practice, children will simply stay in the system if no family sincerely wants them. Or when we say everyone deserves a home, we don't mean that homeless people can enter any house they want against their owner's will, or that we will give homes to drug addicts without any accountability. The language of "right" in this context simply means those things which are necessary for a person's wellbeing, and which we as a society need to work together in order to guarantee, not because they have earned it somehow but because everyone deserves to be happy and the basis of our ethical system is love for our fellow humans.
Very, very good point. This gets complicated when it comes to commodified s*x where legality is at the forefront of gatekeeping it. I don't think we even agree on the moral sense (i.e., wellbeing) considering that the same could be said for other rights - moral and/or legal - such as healthcare. It's all a muddle!
The problem is those goods and services are a function of labour which is a function of risk to bodily harm. There can never be a guarantee of goods and services to all people as you can't force people to take care of others from a moral standpoint. Right now we are seeing the breakdown of society accelerate as the fraud of government borrowing money into existence to provide these services is pushing inflation and the death of the currency to the vertical hyperbolic curve at which point only real value (skills, tangible goods and services) matter in the market and those who do not have them will be left on the metaphorical titanic without a life raft
@@ShadowmanEXEv3 I think its the contrary with society. The "real values" matter the least more and more.
This
As someone who doesn't get much of that but I'm not here being a femcel and wanting the man i want to give me that. No i use the presence of my mind. This entire thing is just another form of control towards people who are financially dependent on other people. Especially women.
You’re truly one of the best commentary channels out rn. This is a extremely hard topic to talk about. I feel like sex controls a lot of men’s lives and is something that is apart of most men’s personalities and a large part.
We should be careful with the second to last tweet 0:55
Everyone, including s3x workers, have a right to decline s3x with Johns or others if they don’t want to do it.
I think I qualify as a s3x positive feminist (by its definitions)
But the wording “Right to S3x” gives me pause because of the many ways that phrase could be interpreted.
When "rights" entered the political lexicon in a major way in the 18th century, it referred to "liberties" or "rights against state control," such as the freedom to speak freely, or the freedom to bear arms (which had traditionally been reserved for the aristocracy). Rights did not mean certain goods or services which one's fellow citizens either directly or by means of state power were required to provide to those who lacked them.
💯 Agree
@@abby5533 so provide a solution for this man then
@@abby5533
Which is why transactional sex was a bad idea to begin with.
@@HiCenjoyer Sex robots. They’ll replace sex workers and women with unrealistic standards. Thus Everyone will be happy
As others have already said, the right to have sex isn't a thing nor it should be but at the same time stigmatizing men who find no success dating is a bad thing on it's own.
Just because a man has trouble finding love doesn't mean he's also a misogynist and/or a racist. What you see on the incel forums is a vocal minority of people who are unable to endure their situation with dignity. This mentality is only holding others back from reaching out and seek help or go to therapy.
It's hard to be vulnerable about your problems when, since you're not getting laid, people tend to look at you as if you have to be an awful human being with sick intentions.
It’s not a right to sex that people have an issue with because most men know that they aren’t entitled to sex. Most men’s thing is if we are in a committed relationship with you that means your the only person I can have sex with. I’m not saying that you can’t say no or you have to have sex whenever he wants but the reason why some men have this “entitlement” is because if the man isn’t having sex with his women then who can he have it with?
I think a lot of that circles back to how we still attach value to ourselves according to our sexual status, just think about the concept of virginity, at least in a lot of conservative communities, the adults judge teens and people their age about virginity, and it differentiates by gender if you're a young woman you get judged if you loose your v card because the value previous generations put on it relates to purity, inocence, decency. Conversely young men are stigmatized from a certain age for BEING virgins because the value put in it for men is related to dominance, maturity, and experience. And these two different expectations are put simultaneously in the minds of teenagers, where you are still developing your views on sex and consent and more importantly self worth, it gets conflicting between men and women.
And this are things that even when people don't say it verbatim is deeply ingrained in our minds. IT HAS TO STOP
We can be sex positive, and understand consent and talk about sex, and talk about not having it without attaching it to our value as people ❤️ it has to be that way.
@@rafaeljohnson6220 himself?
Judging by how big the manosphere is i don't think incels are a minority but i agree with the rest.
@@rafaeljohnson6220 same goes for women too. there's a study that came to the conclusion that women are equally interested in sex as men, but more quickly bored with the same sexual partner. men are generally happy to have a lot of sex even when it's with the same woman. this leads to women in long term relationships thinking they don't have sex drive or making up excuses with their partners, when in reality they just want different sexual experiences. i think for long term relationships it would make sense just to seperate sex from love and open it up so everyone involved can live out their desires.
My thoughts are all over the place on this subject and so right now, I honestly just want to say thank you for covering this in such a compassionate way. For guys like me, hearing a woman be so empathetic (**especially with DV and SA targeting women in such high numbers and in the most horrific ways**) towards men's frustration about having so little sex is really nice to hear. It really is like getting a glass of cold water in hell.
What's DV and SA?
@@gaunaareright domestic violence (dv) and sexual assault (sa)
One can emphasize and still do the same thigh that craete the problem.
@@TimXDDDD What do you mean by “create the problem”?
@@TimXDDDD as a woman who doesn't get much s"x anyways, even though i want too , i don't go around blaming men who don't want me. i understand that they want different things and if a guy who i like and he like me back comes around that'll be great. I'll never find myself be this delusional when it comes to not getting s"x by blaming people u know absolutely nothing about. Like the effing audacity some men have is beyond me. who tf taught u that it was a right to have and not an experience to share with someone u feel comfortable with.
Super underrated channel. Keep up the good work
the absolute QUEEN of making eloquent, intelligent, well-researched, increasingly socially relevant & important youtube video essays
You have nuanced and well articulated thoughts that I do not come across often. With the topic of sex and young men’s current lack of it, I see that a lot of people arguing on the men’s side are forgetting some very key things. What many left leaning and feminist people point out is the fact that the study mentions that men are “not having as much sex as they would like” and to many feminists this is a conversation about ego. The lack of sex amongst some young men is seen as a fault of women and society, however for much of human civilization the sexual health of women and girls has been of little concern.
I admire what you do on your channel as you are more of a middle ground for the kind of men who would see themself following the manosphere, but you are still a feminist who forwards progressive talking points. It comes as no surprise to me that a lot of the left is unappealing to these kind of men because the left openly hate them sometimes. However it also does not surprise me why the left is adverse towards them because of the openly bigoted and authoritarian beliefs of these men.
What I really want to get at is there are very rational reasons why “sex is a human right” would put a lot of left leaning people on the defensive. I believe a great many progressives would agree that human connections and relations are essential to a healthy life, but we want to be sure that safety and autonomy are guaranteed. Unfortunately the manosphere and much of broader conservative thought makes it very apparent that the rights and health of some people is irrelevant so long as some other people are about to feel powerful and have their egos affirmed.
Alexandra Hunt is on the left, but otherwise I agree
I think the analogy that would make your point but that you're missing, is friendship.
Friendship is based on too many abstract things to chalk up to a game or formula or simple sales tactic. There are tips and tricks, but no hack, no cheats, no catchphrase solutions. And bitterness in making friends is obviously counterproductive. Since female are lifted to this sexualised pedestal, sight of that mutual-relatable human connection is lost.
That said I found you a just a tad dismissive of the power of horniness, and the role frustration plays in sexual arousal itself, as a builder for releif (the big o). "Angry", carnal sex can lead to powerful shared experiences, and as a very horny (yet celibate) female, the anatomy by itself certainly of high interest and not so much the romance. The reason I'm averse to casual sex is the safety security issue rather than intimacy. That gets conflated a lot on the topic of female sexuality. Desire for trust is lumped in with romance. I don't think women are actually that vanilla sexually, we're just living in much more dangerous circumstances than men.
It was cool to read this piece of insight!
so if ugly women are like the most frustrated individuals out there, they probably come a lot too.
As a young person who, rather inexplicably, found a genuine, intimate, and loving relationship via internet dating, I have a very hard time describing "how I did it" or giving advice to friends who want to know how to find such a thing. It was a magical "right person, right time," and felt like an almost unbelievable fluke. (note: I do believe that internet dating on a college campus is much different beast than internet dating in 'real' adult life, with unique and likely greater challenges than faced by Gen-Z college kids. Tinder is well suited to the hook-up culture and emotional immaturity that characterize many of our attempts at connection.)
Among female college students, I often hear things like "I'm a romantic in a hookup culture, what am I supposed to do?" I can't answer that question. It seems like my generation never learned, were taught, or were given the opportunity to practice the emotional skills needed to make genuine connections. The mention in a previous video, of young people in the past having social encouragement (in the form of dance halls, etc) to just be children, teens, boys and girls, learning to romance or simply interact with one another. It struck me how now, we seem to be jumping right into being adults, men and women, never having had the chance to learn. Growing up, we always tried to act more mature than we were. I wish we had been our own age, and been given the social constructions and protections to do so. This applies mostly to straight dating culture, queer dating deserves its own conversation entirely. The funny thing is, I see more apparently 'emotionally mature' connections between my queer friends than I do my straight ones. My thought is that straight dating culture is so prescribed, and straight men and women are inundated with rules and etiquette and guides that offer a very narrow and skewed view of relationships, whereas queer dating culture, still more taboo, escapes from it for that very reason. The straight relationships I see in my friends and peers are often plagued by call-her-daddy-esque games, manipulations, detachment, and lack of honesty and/or emotional maturity that are really heartbreaking. We all just want to find love, in our own idiosyncratic worlds, but we seem to be absolutely unequipped to do so; worse, the mainstream advice on straight dating is often counterproductive to downright harmful.
This is a rather tangential issue to celibacy, loneliness, and the dating pool at large, since the generational dynamics of Gen Z and the unique backdrop of a college campus are their own ecosystem. But, I appreciate so much your research and insight into topics like these.
You, Kid, have inspired me to think much more critically (and independently) about modern society. I can't thank you enough for that! Much love and admiration, Annie
It's kinda ironic that female college students whine about hookup culture more than guys yet are getting laid way more. What with the double speak?
@@newperson9662 I don't see whining in the OP writing neither the double speak, so I don't know who you want to direct your answer to.
@@dwsel
I didn't say OP is whining. I'm saying women generally whine more about the hookup culture yet partake way more than men in it. Read the first sentence of OPs 2nd para
@@newperson9662 I can't speak for all women obviously, but I can speak for a few of my friends, who have all basically taken the "I can't have what I want so I'll take what I can get" attitude toward hookup culture. Because sex doesn't fill the gap of true intimacy, but it feels good, and it's similar to compulsive shopping or spending every spare moment on social media. You can't get the thing that will make you happy, so you take your temporary little dopamine hits where you can get them.
@@SkullsNPockyLuv I dont think you understand. The reality is more ugly than that. To the average young woman nowadays, hook ups with super hot men are preferable than serious committed relationships and deeper connections with average looking guys within their league.
When women say "I can't have what I want so I'll take what I can get" they're still referring to a relationship and casual sex with hot men they have crushes on.
As a woman who is totally asexual-haven't touched myself for reasons other than hygiene for over 20 years, and have never even made out with a guy, I avoid men because of the gross entitled attitudes towards women's bodies. If men want s*x they can buy it (so can women) or go DIY. Basically, I resent the idea that all people should be pressured to be sexual, against what feels comfortable.
Ace gang!
I absolutely agree. Sex workers are a thing.
I think we might experience a collective hurt and trauma around relationships. So many reasons for it, and partly I believe even the pandemic has amplified this to an extreme. We are all recovering, and some are dealing with it more constructively than others. We need to talk about it more I believe. Thank you for your amazing voice, not only audibly but as in commentary as well. Im glad we are talking about this 💜✌🏽
Well, at least you're able to find partners to have sex and relationships with and risk 'trauma'. Most men can't
@@newperson9662 its not that easy. I dont know what you are assuming about me....
Watching one of your videos feels like a whole academic course in social & psychological studies!
In the best way possible! Very interesting, intriguing, informative, insightful, & enlightening.
I'm GRATEFUL that I came across your channel!
Never stop doing what you are doing ❤️
I think that this is a very nuanced topic. Many say that you don't have the right to sex, but also feel as a society that it is ok to call people "incels". "Incel" shouldn't be a negative thing if we as a society actually didn't care about people not having sex. But the reality is that we do! Honestly I believe that sex (if not overdone) can be beneficial to ones self esteem and overall health! While I don't think we should force people to be having sex, I think that we should definitely provide opportunities for at least respectable guidance on how to get it if they are struggling. I mean honestly ask yourself, who would want a society filled with people that can't get sex?
Incel has a negative connotation to it because a vast majority of the men who are incels think that women should be sold in supermarkets.
@@hurrytoworry That's actually a misconception. Most "real incels" never identify as an "incel". However the people that do tend to be the extremists. If you want to look at this topic through a non-biased good faith lens, should not be judging an entire group by the most extreme sects. I get what ur saying tho
You're right that being involuntarily celibate shouldn't be considered a bad thing. But sadly the people who have claimed that term and made it an identity, have shown themselves to be some of the most disgustingly hateful people on the planet. When you go on incel forums and see all the gross and hateful beliefs they have about women, and men too, you can see why the term has a negative connotation. Which makes it hard for us sane people who are involuntarily celibate, to find a community of like-minded people with similar experiences, who aren't rabidly hateful and misogynistic.
@@ralphwilsin sounds a bit like "we have to listen to both sides", when one of the sides is all about dehumanising more than half the population of the world.
@@indrinita then one side demonizes the other half, see we can all make sweeping generalizations 😁
I think the ability to form a community with other incels makes it feel normalized and focus on social media thought rabbit holes rather than fixing personal issues eliminates any potential for them to take meaningful steps to change it.
Prior to internet communities, if you had an issue like not getting laid - you had to work it out by trying new things. Now, you can go commiserate with others instead and wallow in the unfairness of the world instead of doing anything about it.
I think it's a form of community which might even override the individuals need for sex.
Next time you will have a problem I wish you a lot of "just do" and "just be" advice.
Kudos!!
To say that all Incels just wallow in unfairness and not doing anything about it is wrong I think you know that.
And what exactly would you recommend someone should do when he is sexually marginalized because of his height or a deformed face?
@@itwasriggedfromthestart9520 sex dolls!
Definitely one of my favorite videos of yours. How love and sex is politicized, holyshit you opened my mind.
Seems to me we got here as a rection to the lack of personal freedoms (as it pertains to sex, love, relationships) that were repressed in religious and classist societies of the west. We wanted to liberate, so we made personal political, and now we put some technology to it for an extra dehumanising touch.
You can have all the personal freedoms you want. If you're not attractive, you will still be an incel
No one has a right to sex. Its good for people to have relationships and intimacy but not everyone should have those things.
the problem is not lack of sex itself, or loneliness or whatever. There are plenty of lonely people out there, and the majority do not commit heinous crimes. Men and women alike feel lonely and unsatisfied sexually, yet they don't act like monsters. paying for sex is rape. you are exploiting someone that has no other choice. most sex workers live below the poverty line. the solution is simple: at the first sign of sexual deviance, at the first sign of sexual violence, you lock the deranged monster up. We should isolate them entirely from society. the moment they begin to watch violent and degrading porn, the moment they touch someone without their consent, the moment they seek to rape someone and apologize with monetary value, the moment they groom minors online - they get locked up and never let out. I do agree that we should seek to create more environments of socialization for everyone, but leave sex out of this. Sex should ALWAYS be between consenting, age-appropriate, enthusiastic parties, with no coercion, including monetary coercion, social coercion, harm, blackmail, or any other bullshit. NO ONE should be entitled to anyone's body but their own, and no one should be able to buy someone's body or consent.
Oh wow I suppose I should be in jail right now because I lost my virginity to a 30 year old escort who agreed to meet with me 😮
the most interesting modern developments that i think we can learn a lot from is the fact that plenty of sex workers of many kinds are asexual or not attracted to their mostly male customers, which just proves how separated sexuality is from how it's viewed in the political. the other thing i think of is sex therapy - which often is about helping people through their relationship to their body, intimacy, learning to be physically vulnerable and otherwise, which is the closest thing we have to a remedy imo.
What is a right to sex? How does it work?
Doesn't that involve another party being forced to sex? I really don't get it.
What about love? Intimacy is more than just sex
Because of unlimited potential partner. People are less likely to beieve in it. It’s all about attraction and connection nowadays
Hookup with super hot guys > intimacy with an average looking guy within their league
You make really good points and I am really grateful and thankful for this video. I think it is very important to consider. But I wished you touched on one of the benefits of politicizing sex, and that is the acknowledgement of r*pe and domestic violence. This has had great implications and influence on the justice system, as well as societal attitudes towards acceptable s*xual behaviour, e.g. understanding what is and what is not harassment. Although we still have a long way to go. Not to mention, it is because s*x has been politicized that contraception has also become something that is more or less accepted, and even encouraged instead of it being taboo. So I think there's a balance to be struck here. And while sex wars aren't what anyone wants, it is important to also acknowledge what is pushing us to make s*x political. And while in this video you made a much needed reminder that s*x is multifaceted, I still do not see exactly what it is you disagree with when it came to Alexander Hunt's proposals.
I love these videos, how you confront different point of views and academic references, and then give your own analysis, in a very clear and honest way. All this in a "respectful" and calm tone too, which makes for a very soothing viewing :)
Okay, so first of all, that little chart the twitter poster put up is kinda crap because that sample size is quite small it doesn't give much more data visuals to really be able to come to any kind of conclusion.
Secondly, there are also other conflicting statistics out there that state that women are actually the ones having less sex currently than men, so "what's the truth". Thirdly, the question, "of those who would like to have sex: are you currently sexually active?" Doesn't conclusively signify any particular reason why they aren't having sex despite wanting it. Those men could have a whole host of reasons why, but it seems like the original tweet and the subsequent repliers let their imaginations run wild with the troubling chart to say they are all "incels".
Forth, does anyone get any "hostage negotiation vibes from the "sex is a human right debate" arguments here👀? "Give these men what they want or everyone is gonna suffer." "Give the creep a chance, you could be the difference between his happiness and the safety of society." and it's usually at the behest of women to somehow resolve this issue, like we haven't been coddling and accommodating men's needs for millennia.
Great comment. I've dug into the data a little and there are 3 factors that could explain most of the trend: less of that sort of "chaotic and spontaneous" casual sex overall compared to GenX (in particular less binge drinking consumption was called out as a factor), an increase in same-sex partners chiefly among young women but not among men; and based on the sexlessness stats for older women (who nobody cares about), young women and older men are cozy bedfellows. Strangely, instead of some cultural critique of older men chasing young women, society praises these guys while blaming the gals. Well, as I always say, men pick your heroes carefully....because young women love a hero.
Way more young women are partaking in the hook up culture than young men. The gap is even wider than whats reported since women underreport and men overreport casual sex partners.
No one's asking women to give mediocre / unattractive men a chance. We just want society to stop gaslighting men and acknowledge that dating is harder for men, as women are more selective, shallow, and find fewer men physically attractive than vice versa.
@@newperson9662 I don't believe "hook up culture" was ever a thing. Just because a bunch of people engage in the same single activity at a certain time period, doesn't make it a "culture". It just seemed like pop media hype to get people to read "journalists'" essays🙄. Secondly, so you'd be okay with absolutely nothing changing currently, at all, as long as "society" just "admits" to your little list of "realities"? Well, fine. I can start. Yeah, I admit men are ugly, every last one of them. Be it in physical appearance, attitude, morals, temperament, what have you. You and every guy with a beating heart is ugly and there's absolutely nothing they can do to change that fact. Yes, woman are selective with who we decide to bring into our lives, it be foolish not to be. Yeah, women be shallow. We are shallow with our lives, other's lives, the people we care about and the people we don't. Don't like it, too bad. There, you got one person within "society" to admit this and NOTHING has to change. I hope that helps 🙂 Have a great day.
Saying that "right to sex" is the way to decrease sexual assaults is like saying women can only be prostitutes or victims.
And it's like saying they can't be both.
I'm in the middle of the video and you bring up interesting points, but I do want to call out that sex has never *not* been political. even traditionally, sex was part of the marriage Contract. Which was implicitly agreed upon by both parties. For most of history, women and therefore sex have been seen as a commodity, and I think women choosing to "seize the means of production" so to speak, is the natural progression of that.
"All of humanity's problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone." - Blaise Pascal
Get lonely people!
Men being lonely and not having (or getting) sex is a public security issue and something we should all care about. Women being lonely and not having (or getting) sex or meaningful relationships is apparently our own or feminism's fault. Excuse me while I roll my eyes and bring out the world's smallest violin for the menz.
Female sexuality is no more complex than male sexuality. We are simply just so focused on the male gaze and perspective that very few people, including researchers, have been interested in studying it. It's like how with health care, women's bodies and health care is seen as less of a priority than men's because we are treated as "other" and therefore not worth caring for. The excuse often used though is that women's bodies are "too complex" to study. Don't believe that rhetoric. It's no different when it comes to female sexuality - it's not interesting enough to most people, particularly men, to care about. I guarantee that if it were men having periods and babies, tampons and sanitary napkins would be freely available at practically no cost, and abortion and reproductive health related health care would be considered essential and enshrined and protected in constitutional law.
And unfortunately, it is indeed political. At a certain point we decided women are less important than men in every way possible. Less deserving of resources that matter and more deserving of exploitation and oppression. And the result of that decision is everything we see and experience today, since the agricultural revolution in fact. Things have only gotten marginally better for non-men recently, and only in a small minority of places in the world. Outside a few select places in the world, women are treated like objects and property still to this day. When we make these kinds of arbitrary hierarchies, don't believe for a second it's not political.
On a closing note, I have to say I'm a bit disappointed to see your one-sided analysis on what is indeed a public health and security issue, when we are dealing with extremists such as incels and the manosphere and their violence against women, in the way you have framed it here or in other videos. It's hard for me to not to have the growing suspicion that many of your videos might be ripe for using as a tool to funnel young men into a pipeline that directs them to more explicitly alt-right and extremist spaces. It's unfortunately made me critically rethink engaging with and consuming your content, which I will likely not do anymore.
Everything you just said is wrong
Even under this video misandrist extremists like you are spewing their hatred.
It's an epidemic, especially online
@@rulingstone123 1. The only time anyone cared to talk about lonely men was when a woman spoke up for them. Incels have been a thing for years and nobody cared. Lonely single women has been all over the news, they even won a midterm all in themselves. Pretty sure I saw an article once blaming men for not being good enough to attract women nowadays.
2. It is not the 1800's. The sciences have been infiltrated by feminist ideology and they're extremely self conscious about discriminating against women. Besides that, which by itself has been a huge force towards pushing the sciences a certain way, there's plenty of women biologists out there... none of them cared to study women's sexual attraction? This is a historical fact that feminists heard about it once and then they run with it. Yes, women's bodies were not studied when the sciences first appeared. However what age do you think we live in now? Still then? It shows how delusional it is to believe that you're still oppressed in such a cartoonish way.
Our society has swung full on in the other direction. It should've swung somewhere in the middle, however men and masculinity has been actively suppressed for some time now. It will normalize as men make some noise and urge people to listen to their problems, however right now women are holding society by the balls. They make most of the consumer decisions and are swinging elections. For a gender that gets paid less they sure spend more, and there's power in that since all companies seem more than willing to push all kinds of narratives in their favor... some even selling them oppression since real world oppression is in low supply for the great demand of victimhood.
@@ernimuja6991 just say you hate women and minorities and go. It's clear you have no interest in facts, simply distorting reality for your own nefarious purposes instead. You want to be a victim so bad, and I truly wish you knew what it means to be one instead of only wishing it, then maybe you'd have some empathy instead of being so pathological. It also seems you don't even know where the term incel comes from. It was coined by a bisexual Canadian university student (a woman known online only as Alana) who wanted to articulate in a neutral way all the people in the world (men AND women) who found themselves in a state of involuntary celibacy for one reason or another. Now it just means terrorist because it's been coopted by the toxic manosphere crew.
Btw, a whole bunch of Indigenous women and girls go missing and murdered on a regular basis due to the actions of yt supremacists like incels and other terrorists. They are subjected to violent sexual assault and torture before they're murdered. I don't see anyone in the manosphere advocating for them and countless other women who are brutalized or simply neglected on the regular every damn day. Where's your righteous anger for them? The pendulum has definitely not swung "too far", it's barely swung at all.
Regardless of what they have to offer, men have felt so entitled to women's attention and bodies for so long, that now that some people have pushed back a little bit against it, some men aren't able to manipulate women as easily and they're throwing a hissy fit about it. That's not oppression. But the pendulum swinging even a little bit in the direction of equality can feel like oppression to those who are accustomed to privilege.
@@indrinita You definitely hate men. You’re projecting so hard.
Also don’t bring deaths to this. Men have died for women since the dawn of time in the most brutal way. Should I start brining up grievances too?
I love women, I just wished they loved us too. Misandry has become common place and nobody challanges it in public when women straight up say hateful things towards men. This video was all about men’s issues and here you come making it about womens. Men are lonely but did you know that indigenous women are killed in Canada? How does that make sense?
Yes… I grieve for those indigenous women that are killed and assaulted by those white supremacists but what does that have to do with this video? Do you know how many atrocities go on in the world every day? To both men and women by both men and women and yet women are most oppressed?
I am even willing to accept most of the issues women say plagues them if you said you’d accept only half of the issues I say plagues men. But you wouldn’t because you’re a pathological man hating bigot and you don’t know any better.
Kidology have you ever thought of being a columnist for national newspaper? The quality and depth of your discussions is worthy of being read in print.
She has a gift. She is where she should be.
I think pointing to the proliferation of sex work as a panacea to our cultural milieu of sexlessness among young men is very short sighted.
What these men are lacking isn’t sex. At least not in the commodified, transactional, almost clinical way sex appears in the culture through solicitation, porn etc. They are lacking something much less visible.
It is not a coincidence that any man you meet who self identifies as an “incel” generally won’t be doing very well in the rest of his life either. It is something deeper that precipitates the lack of sex, which is a visible and political symbol to be turned into a scapegoat.
I don’t claim to know exactly what that lack is. I have a feeling it’s something quite abstract like purpose, meaning, perhaps love. But it certainly isn’t just sex. Lack of sex is a symptom, and effective healthcare doesn’t just manage symptoms - it treats the cause of the pathology.
If we are to heal our young men we need to reach deeper and treat what is causing their despair.
Yes, you've articulated something I'd only intuited. There are some male self development Y'Tubers who state that men ought to stop chasing women and work on their "purpose" and meaning in life. Then the women will come.
So, it's still being positioned as getting women (eventually) and having sex.
Then ex-incels talk about how having sex didn't exactly make a difference to them afterwards. They still felt insecure and unhappy.
I think that there are some people who are suffering from an internal and external disconnect from themselves and the world around them. It's both men and women, but it manifests itself in a more obvious way with men (as it does with most things).
Men not having as much sex as before seems to be a metaphor for something else. It's easier just to blame women of course, but that's always been a thing.
What makes sex incredible to me is the love and connection you have between you and your partner. Being spirituality, emotionally and physically connected to each other elevates you from simple sexual intercourse to real intimacy and love making.
I feel like everyone is just dancing around both the core issue and giving no useful solutions. Of course no one is "owed" sex, no one is "owed" anything, we make up all rights, there's nothing encoded in our DNA saying we have the right to food or water either. There are some fundamental issues with the current "social contract" and we're seeing that unravel and the consequences are going to be terrifying. The most dangerous group of society is ALWAYS young, frustrated males, ignoring their needs usually leads to some horrific outcomes, it's nice to talk about normalizing sex work but that isn't going to fill the gap and someone will start to push ideologies that will take root in these communities. People will always attempt to carry out the biological imperative that drives all life on this planet, mixing that with the social expectations and it's pretty easy to see where this is going to lead.
We now have a sizable population of this group, ready and primed for actual radicalization by both domestic and foreign entities, but as usual, society will just pretend it's not happening until it's too late. If they feel there is nothing to lose, then there is everything to gain, no matter the cost and the worst part is unlike some other parts of the world where this is an issue, they'll have both the resources and knowledge to truly destroy everything.
@@lesaxon4159 And with that last four letter word it's clear to see why the love, touch and validation you espouse remains so elusive.
@@rejectionisprotection4448 lol… seriously. He could have just ended with his first sentence.
I don't see these severe issues self-correcting. I think Western societies will fracture and implode from all the problems like this one they've been sweeping under the rug. Oh well, enjoy the decline!
This is literally one of my favourite videos I have watched all year.
Coming from the field of Cultural Studies I am really finding your channel and your perspectives to be absolutely refreshing. Congratulations on all the good content and kudos for recommending Hannah Arendt (her works definitely deserve more attention and are of extreme relevance today).
Great video. A couple of points.
1. The politicization of sex is due to the sensitivity we have around it. If we were less sensitive, it being either political or a political would be lessed charged as a topic. We may want to start there prior to fight the fight of shifting ones politicization stance on sex.
2. Those on the desire to reach the destination of sex will be more willing to take shortcuts and care less of the journey if the goal of reaching the destination is difficult, time consuming, infrequent, absent, or impeded. There may significant difference in both the entrenchment of the other side and defensiveness of discussion of the seekers were more successful than not, say >30%.
3. Until you change the base state of human nature, desiring pleasure and sex as a great delivery system (also, certain drugs, etc) and the differences between the sexes with their goals and most probable methods to achieve the goal, then some form of all your issues will persist.
Yes, additional study and knowledge into help like you mentioned. But until we get on the same page about our sensitivity about sex being lower, be in a position were talking about the journey is more amenable, and providing considerable empathy into the sexes base natures, your going to have a tough time discussion the destination, the journey, the origin of desriee and reason, its politicization, and ultimately, sex as a right.
This is deep.
Society hasn't criminalized sex (unless we're talking about sex work). We're finally talking about consent and since lots of women are putting their foot down and men are being taught what consent really is men aren't able to coerce sex as often and woman are avoiding these situations in the first place.
Why do we even care how much sex men, let alone people, are having? Of all the bad things I experience as a woman at the hands of men I'm happy I'm a woman. I can't imagine my penis ruling so much of my life.
You dont have even the testosterone of a 12 year old boy, you cannot understand how important sex is to a man.
Your words would have more weight if women werent partaking in the hook up culture way more than men.
Why are women doing double speak?
@@newperson9662 women aren't having more hookup sex. Despite what people want to believe married people have the most sex. It's an incel or insecure man belief that woman are having more sex, particularly with the same pool of men. That's just weird. Women have been and will probably always be more picky because we bear the burden of the consequences of sex as far as society is concerned.
"I can't imagine my penis ruling so much of my life"
This is so true. I enjoy sex and many other women do as well, but I think men are obsessed with sex to an unhealthy extent. The lengths men will go to to get their rocks off is genuinely concerning. It is the reason why we have issues like revenge porn and sex trafficking. Obviously there are some women who are horny 100% of the time as well, but I see this problem far more frequently in men.
@@dmb1745 shut up you have 0 fucking idea how it is to be a man. You have as much testosterone as a 12 year old boy so really you dont crave sex as much as we do. Your value by society is also not judged by how many women you are able to get. Finally, you have 0 idea whats its like to be sex starved and not be able to satiate it. If youre a woman and you want sex you go get it instantly with 0 hangups and for free. If you want those things as a man however... you better be hot.
I think one benefit in depoliticizing sex is that we don't blame one group or another for where we're at, but on that note, one problem in depoliticizing sex is that people may not feel they need to be accountable to their internalized phycological patriarchy. I'd love to see you compare and contrast thoughts of love between bell hooks and Hannah Arendt.
This is a brilliant and thorough analysis. I 100% agree with your explication about how one of the major problems is we don't interact with the other sex very often other than in certain very restricted and regulated places (like corporate workplaces). Outside of that the lack of community and social interactions are apparently becoming increasingly widespread. Even bars and clubs are being reduced, "protocalized' and becoming more dangerous, or perceived as such, and less playful/social than they used to. This may be a result of massively increasing drug addiction and other factors. Also, I love Hannah Arendt!! She is one of my favorite philosophers and her insights are profound. I
Men have to have sex, otherwise they get violent? What about women? I just don't buy this argument that the only way to keep men calm is to make sure they get enough sex.
Nobody ever said that, what are you talking about
Violence is a natural outcome in the face of your genetic extinction. In the end, Might is always Right
Thank you for this video. This is something I've observed over the years with discussions over relationships and sex, it's been politicized to an extreme extent that it becomes "unsexy" so the speak, especially when talking about power imbalances between genders. It's actually exhausting to watch, because I realize I have a perspective that is incredibly rudimentary, because I understand we haven't evolved much as human beings and these discussions make the assumption that we have.
Sooo what is your incredibly rudimentary perspective?
As a straight woman I'm falling in love with you lol. You're so mature and well-spoken.
"High verbal IQ" - K.
@Educat ional “high verbal iq” lol stfu with your reductive incel pseudoscience. You don’t need to explain to me why I find her an all-around agreeable person. I fucking hate how terminally online people esp the ones sucked into over-analyzing attraction with their pseudo-evolutionary-psychology disassemble and reduce everyone to a list of their components. It’s killing my soul just to read it.
This is an interesting topic - as a single parent of two who works, it's largely academic; in the words of Sweet Brown, "ain't nobody got time for dat!" However, it's encouraging that the younger generation is approaching the topic more...well, maturely, than earlier generations.
A slight exception I take is that not all the euphemisms are violent - many, if not most, are - but there are some that are less so. I've always thought "getting busy" was nice and "hide the salami (or sausage or...)" and "bumpin uglies" to just be silly or playful. That said, I agree that I can't think of many terms that don't have some roughness to them.
Great work!
Sex has not been politicized. Sexuality has. The act itself remains as it always was, a basic human drive, but the allowed forms that drive can take have become a point of contention for many who wish to gatekeep propriety and enforce their view of normalcy, in order to combat what they define as degeneracy under their value system. I think the old ways still work fine, but people aren't engaging with them, preferring to think there's an easier way with apps and such, when all those apps do is skew everyone's perception of their value on the sexual marketplace and prevent actual human connection, which should be the core of forming relationships.
I do see a problem with the modern attitude, but I see a trend of prudeness, not liberation. I see so many attitudes from the youth reflecting a phobia around consent, to the point where less and less avenues of expressing sexual interest are allowed or proper, and so less connections get formed. It's reached the point where something as simple as a girl kissing a boy she likes without securing permission first is seen as a criminal act, and I think that's the big problem. Everyone's become more defensive, seeking ammunition for the so called oppression olympics and desiring more to be the more persecuted party, rather than to be the more desirable one. They're more concerned with how they will appear to their social group as a result of their sex life than they are with the meaningfulness of that sex life to themselves.
As for the incels, even if we could grant them a right to sex, it wouldn't help them with their real problem, which is an inability to form intimacy with another person. Sex is merely the end goal to them, when it should be a conduit to love, which is what they really are lacking. But their situation is not society's fault, but their own. They are actively being bred out of the system for being unsuitable partners for anyone, and rarely are the reasons anything but mental. Even if we gave them government mandated gf's, they would just drive them away with their toxicity and be right back where they started. Sex and relationships are a consent based system in the end, and they basically have to get in line with just the lowest baseline of acceptability, respecting women as equals and respecting themselves, or they deserve what they get.
sex (and love, and close relationships in general) is a weird thing that no one should feel "unworthy" or "undeserving" of - in general, every body can be desirable, and every person can be loved, and no one should feel otherwise about themselves. it can be extremely healthy for one's mental health. on the other hand, it's not something that is a "right" or owed to anyone in any way - no one should feel (or in the case of abuse victims or those sex workers who do it for survival, literally BE) obligated to have sex with another, even less - to be attracted to them. sex is a thing everyone deserves but no one is owed.
i fully agree with your point: love and sex should not be transactional. but this idea is so deeply ingrained into our consciousness that it's hard to imagine how a love life free from capitalistic logic can look like. comparing ourselves to other "commodities" on the dating "market", tying our worth to our sex life, in some cases believing we've been wronged by society/women/men because we can't get sex - it's extremely hard for people of all genders to free ourselves from.
You have mentioned before how you personally prefer to only have sex/date people who you feel a connection towards. I think this biases you towards thinking that what we all need is sacred sex (quoting you towards the end). I think that much like everything else in life, it depends, and everyone is different. Even the same person can want different things at different points in life. For instance, I like monogamy, I've been in a relationship for 3 years and I'm deeply in love with my partner. Before that I was in another 2 year relationship. But I've also had casual sex, and I have had a craving for sex without the emotional intimacy. Humans are so complex and multifaceted that I think practically any attempt yo universalize an experience will be flawed. We don't *all* and *all times* want casual sex, just as we dont all at all times want intimate love making. I wish everyone a healthy exploration of what their own needs are and how they change over time. Sex is simple and at the same time one of the most complex things in our lives. Stay safe and love your neighbor ❤️
"do forgive me...and humankind" .... you're so smart and hilarious, thanks for sharing with us!
Re "the personal is political" one of the barriers women and children encountered when seeking legal protection was the notion that sexual abuse, domestic violence, and harassment were "personal/family matters" and thus not subject to legal scrutiny. The feminists of the second wave sought to turn these personal issues into public issues because they correctly observed that deferring to an abusive family to resolve its absue issues would only serve the interests of the abusive party....note how different this notion of politicizing the personal is from today's. We have shifted from a goal of combating the structures that perpetuate violence to combating barriers to personal gratification. In the cases of lookism discussions about dating preferences are had at the expense of working to combat the impulse to make respect of others contingnet on their attractiveness.
I am not anti porn or anti sex work (I'd prefer it be legalized so that it can be regulated, as it's very easy for abuse to happen when it's illegal). However, the "right to sex" feels very icky to me. I think that mindset can be used to justify SA when someone gets turned down. No one owes another person sex or a relationship and consent is everything.
I think that the internet has made hookups and fantasy so available that today's generation finds it easier than pursuit of actually relationships. Loving relations require work and responsibility, and today's society lacks seeks quick gratification and may not be acclimated to such responsibility. I do mean responsible or safe sex, I mean the responsibility of deep loving relationship.
We live in a society where most, especially women, are shamed for not having sex, marriage, kids or hadn’t committed any form of intercourse like kissing.
I remember my toxic ex friend (who’s straight) would tell how much she kisses other girls/guys, and then tell me how I’m just “scared”. She even offered me to kiss her- repulsive it was, which is why she’s called an ex friend.
The truth is that I’m an aromantic bi who hates commitment, have my own ambitions as an individual and I enjoy solitude/ not interacting with others who provide me no emotional benefit.
The fact that traditionalist and conformist dehumanize others as objects until it’s their turn to “breed 100 kids to keep the population strong” says enough of the matter.
To me men not having sex doesn't reveal a need for more sex services, it reveals that men in mass are having issues with forging meaningful relationships and being intimate. Men all over the world already have access to sex services and yet the number of sexually inactive men keep on rising. On the other hand most of what I've read on incel and manosphere forums seems to also show that a large percentage of the participants in them have no other interests apart from these communities. I've met so many people in real life I didn't find remotely attractive until they started passionately sharing their interests. Why would someone choose to date a person whose only interest is is how undateable they are?
I also think a big part of why consent has been turned into the "right to sex" comes from western individualism, because although pleasure is an individual preference having sex is never an individual experience and turning it into such only does harm for both parties involved. Saying one has a "right" to have sex completely ignores that sex is not something one does on their own and perpetuates the belief that sex is about one's own enjoyment, rather than a bonding, intimate experience between two enthusiastically consenting people. It also diminishes consent into something to check off a list, rather than a process of exploration of one's own boundaries and trust in the other, that involves numerous factors and is constantly changing. It also begs the question does withholding consent halfway through (which is 100% valid) infringe on the "right" of the other person? What is the difference between "right to sex" and "right to consent"? And how can sex where one side of the consent has been bought ever be healthy and rewarding for both parties involved?
I agree with you that sex and relationships of any kind are always specific and individual to each person. The issue for me comes from when people see themselves as the only individual that matters in the equation and I think we are all a little bit guilty of that.
they should just make sex robots for men.
If women dislike casual sex and the hook up culture so much, why are way more women than men partaking in the hook up culture?
A significant percentage of men pay for sex, which means that paid sex is somewhat of an equalizer. If these men couldnt pay for sex, its not going to have any impact on women's sex lives.
Thing is women are more selective, shallow, and find fewer men physically attractive than vice versa. A large number of men will have to compensate for that and find other means to convince women to have sex. Paid sex is a logical outcome of this.
@@newperson9662 I can't speak for all women, but since you commented under my comment I'll speak for myself.
As а woman I don't hate hook up culture, but I also stopped participating in it because the empowerment it made me feel was really a delusion. You can participate in hook up culture without having sex absolutely devoid of meaning and connection. I have had sex with many people who I never dated, but to this day I feel care for them even if they are not a part of my life. They weren't just random people, they were people I forged a connection with in the amount of time that we had together, and that connection naturally culminated into sex. It can be done but it is probably a more common approach amongst queer people. Now the information we received in this video did not make it clear what the 82% of satisfied women were doing, they could be in relationships. Or they could be in casual sexual arrangements, but I doubt that they're all participating in hook up culture and satisfied with that.
Men paying for sex will always hurt women. A man who has only ever payed for consent doesn't understand the process of earning it. A man who has learned that there are no boundaries in sex as long as you pay well, is not going to approach sex with a significant other with boundaries in mind, because he has never experienced that, most likely he doesn't even think about that. As a sexually experienced woman nothing would turn me off more than finding out that all my partner's sexual experiences were payed for. Sex is not a need, it's a desire, no one's gonna die from not getting it and having these services only stops men from doing the work.
And LOL at the women are more shallow. Did you not watch the video, Kid literally said men are the more visual and if anything's gonna make one shallow, it's not the person who's attraction is psychological. And this is easily disprovable, I see ugly men with pretty women all the time, I've never seen a hot man date a woman uglier than him (unless it was for money and clout). If men think women are so shallow and selective, well they better step up their game. Women have been trying catering to men (in order to survive) for centuries , maybe it's time for those roles to reverse, as that is the way it usually is in nature.
@@annanaydenova8321
In the hook up culture, women exclusively have casual sex with conventionally hot men. You also have had F-buddies and FwB. How many of them were mediocre / below average in looks?
I don't understand why you see this dynamic as a correction. Today, a below avg looking, fat, out of shape, broke woman with low self esteem can get on dating apps and find 100s of goodlooking guys willing to hook up, while her looksmatched guy will be totally unwanted. Please tell me what time in human history did we have the opposite of this?
Great comment! My thoughts exactly. Especially on the part about men not being able to form meaningful relationships in general.
Appreciate your thoughts and sharing. This is a big subject that needs a ton of conversation and less recriminations. Comments on RUclips does not seem the best place to do it justice, but I do want to help with your engagement to improve the algorithm's support.
Thank you for what you do. Positive thoughts for you and those close to you.
Sex Is consensual
Companionship consensual
Conversation is consensual
Friendship is consensual
You being lonely is consensual
Never having a husband is consensual
We as men don't have be your friends, or give you companionships. You don't have to give us sex.
We will just find women who are willing to do it. And ignore those who ain't on our level.
Why is it so hard for people to get we all don't have to associate with one another. I don't associate with women I'm not having sex with. That's my right.
Sir, this is a Wendy's.
@@seapeajones what u mean
I don't see where she said otherwise.
@@chelseashamim9148 I'm entitled to sex with women who want to have sex with me. Every one else is invisible to me. I don't see your person hood
This whole thing is based on a flawed and incredibly naive premise: that sex was not already political. The phrase was not "Let's make the personal political!" Feminists were reacting to a the realization that society was already forcing people to practice sex, love, and marriage in a specific way, (i.e. 1950s gender roles). Sex positive feminism was trying to liberate us from those restrictions by replacing all of the unspoken rules with the relatively straightforward concept of consent.
I guess like a lot of incels Kidology is assuming relationships were easy to get in the past and existentially fulfilling. In reality the feminist movement of the 1960s came into existence precisely because marriages at the time were full of problems and decidedly NOT existentially fulfilling. On average, if you include all of the abusive relationships, and women who do all of the chores while still working full time, marriage actually shortens the life of women, and makes them more stressed than single women.
The reason incels want a right to sex is because they think men NEED sex somehow. They think of it as a vital resource, and imagine the deprivation to be the cause of all their problems. Feminists oppose "a right to sex" because somewhere someone would be forced to provide it and thus have sex against their consent.
Christianity politicized sex nearly 2,000 years ago. Sex outside of marriage become a sin against God and thus the whole community. The strictness of chastity waxed and waned but was almost always more severe than most people alive today can imagine. The 20th century changed a lot of things, including almost eliminating the concept of chastity. I guess the problem is now engaging in the reverse of chastity feels like a requirement to an increasing number of men.
For clarity’s sake (in my mind), I believe we all don’t have “a right to sex” in a ‘civilized’/ cooperative society. I believe we have “a right to pursue consensual sex”, as well as “a right to have HAD consensual sex.”
I'm 34 years wise, and have never had sex with a woman. I've never dated a woman, despite my immense efforts to be with a woman. No first kiss, no dancing, etc. As far as I got was touching, though it was very limited. Friend Zone only, multiple times.
Sure, one could argue that paying for sex is an option, but I don't desire that route, sex is sacred to me. It's painful loving different women, that for some reason don't want to be with me, let alone touch or be touched by me. What makes matters worse is that I was sexually abused in childhood, that is a f***ked up introduction into sexual activity.
You haven’t received any sexual advances from a female ever? Including ones you may have not been attracted too?
@@markelg6809 Correct.
Damn bro, stay strong, maybe you can't easily meet woman in your everyday life, maybe you should try to do some hobbies or activities where you can meet more women ? Or maybe your too shy ?
not a single woman in any of kidologys comments sections can relate to this comment
they are on hush mode
@@lukshi I've experienced social anxiety (strong anxiety in general) most of this life, as I became wiser in age I became more social & placed myself out into the world more as best I could.
Of course, there's a big difference between In person vs over the internet. But the internet exposure doesn't deserve to be shunned or made less than, in person public interactions. We are all different in many ways, and each human navigates what works for them, and what doesn't.
I've diligently put myself out there via the internet many times in many ways. Used several dating apps, and talked to several women (or perhaps impersonators) and it unfortunately is the same cycle of them choosing to randomly stop responding to me; And each time it's early within the fresh conversation. It has happened when I'm the one carrying the conversation, and when I'm not.
The trickyness of using a term "right to sex" without clarifying words to distinguish between an individual's ACCESS or all individual's CHOICES to engage OR NOT ENGAGE is just another example of our modern hate based mindset. I'm 100% pro-choice with regard to every aspect of life. The only limit for me is when the choice infringes on the personal choices of others. "If right to sex" means we coerce some people into being sex partners by economic, social or even legal coercion, that's institutionalized SA. I've worked in prisons, and most coerced sexual activity in that environment is by economic rather than direct physical coercion. It's just that in prison, physical safety and security is currency just like tobacco, commissary food, drugs, tattoo guns, cell phones, etc. Well if a person is surrendering their body for the currency of general safety, rather than surplus benefits that's no more consensual than being forcibly r...ped by a specific person, there's just less physical injury. In neither case does the victim want to do it, let alone enjoy the act. That's pure loss of choice. If "right to sex" means people can freely negotiate transactions or engage out of love and / or attraction without being told they are breaking the law or are risking ostricization and social condemnation, then that's access to choice. But the ambiguity of that single term will be weaponized by multiple groups to force, demonize or confuse in order to "win". Will most people ever embrace universal respect and denounce exerting force over other humans as a means to one's desired end? Not super optimistic about that.
I thought men told us to keep our legs closed. $lut shaming but whining about not getting laid doesn’t make any sense either
Yes, there are a lot of conflicting views
When Roe v Wade was repealed, there were a lot of comments from men saying "good, maybe more women will keep their legs closed". I wondered how that would help them really. I think it was about controlling female sexuality rather than anything else.
Because it’s clear as day that women keep their legs open for the top 20% of men only. Maybe closing it by force would mean everyone will have better chances
@@spliffrotation7238 huh??? Who cares about who other ppl are sleeping with? Why you trying to control anyone?
@@harsh3948 there it is. You’re mad cause they’re not sleeping with you. Lol. Even if they were willing to sleep with you you’re telling them to keep their legs closed. Can’t be mad if women listen. With abortion bans and men getting more violent, men not evolving etc; I don’t see why any women would sleep with men
@@Yomel123 I’d rather they sleep with no one than give some men unfavorable treatment. It’s not about Revenge, it’s about what’s FAIR
Well 50 years ago they tried to make porn mainstream by having it in major theaters. Deep Throat’s premiere was attended by celebrities. Things were really weird back then lol
I was literally just thinking about this. The Catholic church is a prime example of how suppressing someone's natural, instinctual inclination makes them more likely to engage in the worst forms of sexual behavior
Look at the stats for the Church of England.
You see that sort of thing in most positions of power, though, including in churches where the pastor/priest is permitted to have a spouse. The Catholic church just gets more flak because they try to cover it up.
Disagree. If what you're implying here is that priests become p*dophiles because they can't marry or have sex, no. More like p*dos are attracted to jobs that give them higher status, protection, trust of them community or access to children. Priesthood is a choice, not something Catholic men are forced into.
Also I grew up is a predominantly third world Catholic country, it's definitely NOT as s^xually deviant as when I went to the USA or Germany.
I dont know why the focus is always on the Catholic Church regarding child sex abuse. Every church denomination/institution has predators that prey on children/vunerable adults. Its not a uniquely catholic phenomenon.
@@Ghastly1 true
I wish this was a longer video, I enjoyed it
With social media I think everyone is becoming more aware of how difficult intimacy is and probably should be. We simultaneously raise sex to such a high priority goal in life but at the same time are shamed or seen in a certain way if we don't achieve it. I still don't understand how it suddenly became a need rather than a want, either.
On a less secular note, as someone who was raised religious but now is more spirit-minded but still following the usual habits regarding intimacy, it's hard to find a balance between the ultra-religious and misogynist demands of women and the expectations of the rest of the world. It's so true that one's sex life is a political statement now.
Personally I don't see the solutions for this coming from the internet, corporate government, or studies of any kind. With how political everything is I don't trust that truth will be the goal but instead placating the political anger from any of the many schools of thought regarding these things. Starting with a political statement and then finding evidence to support it.
With all this on my mind I really think that everyone, regardless of descriptors are struggling with the state of our world as it is and sex isn't even on the radar (to a certain point)
I'm rooting for all of us, friends
I didn't even read the whole thing but exactly. This is how a person should feel.
You don't understand? Besides monks/nuns when in history have people been A-OK with celibacy? People have always felt like they "needed" it. It's a very strong motivator.
@@amo1704 I'm not confused as to why people want it. I'm confused where the idea of it being a "need" comes from. I've been happily celibate all my life.
@@heyhey439 I think it becomes a need when it becomes less guaranteed for young men. When more men had the opportunity to have relationships, marry and have regular sex, it was a need that was being met therefore it isn't mentioned.
It's only when that need starts not to be met for these young men and the possible effects that it is now becomes an unmet need which is now publicly acknowledged.
@@rejectionisprotection4448 It is a want. People do not die of no bitches. Hugs are something I really really want and are great for a person but if I don't get it I'm not going to pass away.
This is probably one of the best videos or political commentaries I've seen in years. Thank you for making it.
I agree, the personal need not be political.
That is no way to be.
Well you sound like a philosopher in full, I will wait for your book.You should be published.✍🏽Thank you for giving me more ideas to think about-awesome blog🔥
That is most kind of you! Perhaps one day...
@@KidologyCO definitely think you should consider it. Not necessarily just because of the money aspect, but because you seem to have a unique story that people could relate to.
@@KidologyCO You have a unique perspective on things, a deep interest in certain aspects of society, and well thought-out opinions. I would buy that book.
Interesting topic and conversations in the chat.
Advice to parents is to take your kids outside to play and socialize. Stop coddling them and keeping them other children. Limit video games, TV and internet access so that they don’t spend almost all of their time not interacting face to face with people.
All this awkwardness comes from people never learning how to socialize when they were kids. So they grow up to be awkward individuals in society/outside.
Sex education should include teaching children about the black pill and women actual standards for men and the fact that many, many men will never meet them and what that means for those men.
This is very toxic. Sex education should be based in science & how not to get a venereal disease and about contraception etc. They need to set up more youth clubs, were kids can meet and socialise with each other and start to form, relationships. And keep off computers.
@@redstar7292 You do realize that Blackpill is nothing BUT science right? A simple scientific tinder experiment proves you wrong on so many levels it’s not even funny
There’s an entire subreddit dedicated to sharing the scientific proof’s behind the blackpill called r/blackpillscience
I love your videos on this kind of topics because it does bring much needed nuance to the conversation, however I can't help but notice how heterocentric they can be. I do understand that you speak from your perspective, however I'd love to see what you think of similar debates that have much different impacts/implications in queer culture and queer people's mental health
I reckon the general dynamic is that women have control over sex and men have control over relationships. The sexual revolution has normalised sex coming before relationships where it used to be the other way around, 50+ years ago.
For women this had led to unhappiness due to a lack of emotional connection, feeling used, and relationship insecurity. For men this societal overemphasis on sex has led to it being viewed as a goal and a source of validation.
Women now trade sex for romantic consideration, leading to a small group of men being highly competed over by women while most men aren't given a chance romantically. This is because the barrier for entry is too high, as sex is expected (by both sides) at the 3rd date, and women aren't having their emotional needs met by that stage. Dating pretty much means fucking these days, and that is a much higher bar for most women. So, everyone loses.
I think this is a bit of a narrow stereo typical analysis on men and women. I think sexual development and milestones through adolescence, have been lost. We almost need to go back to just having a landline with no answer machine, and no mobile phone/computer.
@@redstar7292 This is a criticism that can be levied against any commentary, because we are by necessity summarising, simplifying and stereotyping when commenting on anything. That is actually the point of analysis.
Some things make sense, but I don't get how men have control over relationships, care to explain?
@@redstar7292
So you're arguing for restricting women's sexual options in their youth?
@@trianglesandsquares420 they don't. It's just that the playing field is less imbalanced and men have at least some leverage. Women still have the upper hand
This is a total side tangent, but your video reminded me a lot of the fanfiction communities I've been a part of for the better part of fifteen years. A lot of it is shipping/romance focused, and it's basically an online exchange of romantic (and/or erotic) stories.
Well, this venue has become a total political battleground in the past 7ish years, with disputes surrounding if it's morally correct to write stories about abusive relationships or taboo topics (especially with sexually explicit stories). I feel like the "politicization of sex" is absolutely at the root of this, as it's no longer about enjoying stories and the emotion fiction gives us but a political struggle of proship vs antis.
It wasn't like this ten years ago, but politics has seeped its way into everything. I blame social media for this--tumblr specifically. So much radical politics originated on tumblr.
I hate how sex centered our modern society has become, I hate it, I’m not religious or anything but like sex is such an intimate thing I just don’t feel comfortable having with no further intentions, I particularly don’t have a very high sex drive so I don’t suffer much, and if you feel empowered and live happily living a life with plenty of sex, more power to you honestly, but that’s not me, and I’m okay with that, it’s just that people view you as less, when I don’t get it… I chose not to have sex? And somehow that affects someone other than myself? How?
Not the most important comment, but been watching your content recently (love it) and i’ve been wondering if there’s a reason you say “woman” and not “women” (wimen) for “woman” plural form? 🧐
More important than the sex to men is the intimacy that it represents. Social programming dictates that that intimacy is most available to men through the medium of sex. Men who resent women and become violent are the same ones who feel helpless to break out of their feelings of loneliness and isolation - their inability to connect. That's where the toxic feeling of entitlement to sex comes from. That's different to the "right to sex" you mentuon here, I get that. But I don't see how just providing men/people with sex would fix anything. The class of workers providing the sex will still have to deal with men who want more and may resent them for not providing.
@@rulingstone123 that's true. Being in a relationship doesn't even solve the issue. It's an internal fracture in men. But of course thats not an isolated phenomenon. The politics of modern dating plus a lack of introspection and the comples trauma of being denied intimacy as young boys stoked the flames of hatred.
Men don't emotionally connect through sex, understand that?
They don't equate sex with intimacy. For men sex is all about dopanine and relief. They thrust they ejaculate and then experience a dopamine low to the point they feel repulsed by the woman they just ejaculate in.
The little oxytocin (love and attachment hormone) men produce during sex is washed away when ejaculation is complete
For men, sex with women they are not in love with is just a release, an activity. It can also be connected with subjugating another human being. Men use sex as weapons agaisnt women since women have a natural submissive position in sex (they are penetrated).
@@redleeks6253 hm.. I don't understand that, no. What you're saying sounds a little dehumanising to men, and you're also making an equivalence between the vulnerable position someone being penetrated puts themselves in with submissiveness. Making yourself vulnerable is not the same as being submissive... and thinking that is a contributor to men not being emotionally vulnerable, since "submission" in a toxic sense is seen as a "negative" "female" "minor" role.
Well spoken and sincere. I agree with her general perspective and specifically appreciated her referring of sex as sacred. However, it was not so much what she said but didn't say that bothered me: Not once did sex get connected with procreation; sex is a step in a natural process, hence the overwhelming urge and incentive followed by an often underwhelming experience, because it's all about getting the act done and not just the act itself. Even the aspect of love and compatibility within the relationship is ultimately rooted in child rearing. I honestly don't assume to be telling others anything new but modern society seems to hate being reminded of their obligations to Mother Nature. We have created a culture monstrously obsessed with the artificial(in this instance contraception and porn), and society will continue to degrade until we recover an organic and sacred life.
A lot of our problems nowadays stem from the internet. Our ability to find community and echo chambers in hundreds of people across the world at the click of a button instead of socializing with the ones around us has done irreparable damage. It is both a blessing and a curse
The notion of rights - any kind of rights - doesn't really work without the concept of reciprocity, of your rights ending where another person's begin. A right to sex doesn't fit into that framework (at least as is commonly understood: some people do use the term "solo sex" to refer to masturbation, and that's a different story) because it intrinsically takes away some people's fundamental right to their own bodies in the name of giving a new "right" to others. The idea of an absolute right to sex that could override another person's right to bodily autonomy is an extremely dangerous one.
Isn't this in the end true for all non negative rights, e.G. welfare?
And if you, like me, don't accept the libertarian world view their must indeed be something close to a "right" for sex, meaning a society must form conditions for it. As we did in the past.