Nicely done! Very cool. Any tips on where to find a CDI for these old triples? I have a 96 600 with a dead CDI. I wish there were new aftermarket ones but I can't find anything. Only old used ones on ebay.
Hi Paul! A nice tip for CDI units: You can use any cdi box for a rotary valve twin (470, 580, 617, 670,) and wire a splice to split the output for 3 coils. All the cdi units are identical and the triples are just split into 3 outputs internally.
Wow! Nice tip - the triples are hard to come by. The twins seem readily available and half the price. I had it in my head (not understanding these things 100%) that the cdi was required for timing and they "tell" the coils when to fire aka 120 degrees apart for a triple. I guess it doesn't work like that? The CDI is just providing power to the coils, then and the firing is controlled elsewhere? Thank you so much. Paul
@@paulhaines5755 The CDI only stores the capacitive energy and controls a very rough timing advance through the RPM range. The actual signal to fire comes from the trigger coil and flywheel inside the ignition housing (behind your recoil starter). Once the trigger coil fires, it signals the CDI to release its energy into the 3 high tension coils. These boost the voltage to the required level for the spark plug and fire the plug.
Thanks for the info! I must admit it's a bit of a mystery for me when it comes to electrical. I've rebuilt some engines on bikes and wave runners, etc. but never really had electrical issues until now so I'm learning more as a result. So glad I asked you. Thanks again! Paul.
O.k. - so a little research in my manuals shows me the CDI unit for the engines you mention is 410 9189 00 Same for all these engines! Easily available and inexpensive. One difference I see when compared to a triple CDI (part number 410 9195 00). I can splice in the wires to get to the three coils on my triple no problem. I see how that would work. I also see there is one extra wire on the triple CDI that I have in hand when compared to the twin CDI. It's in the bundle that goes down into the case cover on the engine. It is a black wire. Not sure what to do. Don't know the function of the wires. Can you help me? Thanks! Paul
20:10 in the video shows you the service plug/bolt to the oil cavity on the water pump. You can top that up with injection oil or gear/chaincase oil. You will need a syringe to do it and also need to take off your mag pipe.
I had antifreeze on the PTO spark plug, so i decided to remove all 3 jugs and have them sent out to get re chromed. i replaced all 3 cylinders, did a base gasket and new o rings on the head. Took it out for a quick 5 min ride and noticed my coolant resevoir going low, topped that off and decided to check the spark plugs, the PTO plug had a lot of antifreeze again! all the other plugs had no antifreeze. any ideas ?
There are only a few things that would cause that: - Leak in head gaskets (cylinder or plug o-rings) - Leak in base gasket (most likely and common) - crack in coolant jacket in cylinder or crank case. A few things to check: Make sure you check the truness of the crank case / cylinder mating surfaces and cylinder / head mating surface. If there is any warping, you will get leaks. Also, use gasket dressing on both sides of the base gasket to aid sealing. Hope this helps you out.
Ask your question here and I'll try to do a video to answer them. I sold my triple sled and a bunch of the parts - but I'll help anyone out if I have the answers
Ok. If there is no scores in piston, can I just get by with rags and WD? There are so many opinions on whether to hone this nikasil. Would you? 2) SPI or Wiseco pistons? obviously big price difference (forged is apparently expensive) 3) When I install the rings, how do I know the position to put them in to NOT hit a port on the cylinder? 3) I have the shop manual and it says to “grease” cylinder and head bolts. Should I be doing that? I will be shining the bolts up and tapping the holes to clean them out before hand. Im hearing just screw in dry (more accurate torque) . Even heard of pipe dope on threads because there are actually a couple holes that have water ports in them? Like I said, Im a novice at this, so Im not sure who to believe. Thanks for any experience you have had with your Formulas with these issues
Build sheet? Seriously? I've rebuilt hundreds of Rotax engines as a service tech for 42 yrs. I don't need no steenking build sheet! You're either REALLY bored or like to waste time!
The build sheet is to keep track of the progress of the entire sled - not just the engine. For those new to a full restoration project (tear down to the nuts and bolts and build up) on an older sled, it’s a very good way of breaking the project down into smaller tasks, building an accurate cost estimate, and compiling a list of rare/hard to find parts you need to hunt down. You have 40+ yrs of experience with Rotax engines - great. As mentioned in the videos, they are for people new to taking on a project like this and the build sheet is just a system to keep track of everything throughout the process.
Great video looking forward to some porting and casing ideas, thank you
Thanks Lawrence! I actually have an old case that I can port out a bit and do a video on it. I may just do that soon. Cheers!
Nice video, curious to know if you have a video explaining the difference from 95-97 f chassis f3 600’s. Thanks
I dont have a video on that specifically - but it may be worth it to do one shortly.
Any clue how to make a 1999 mach Z CDI work on a 1998 formula 3 600? My weather pack connectors are slightly different.
Or do you happen to have a wiring diagram of both models? I’m having a tough time tracking down. A CDI for my 98 f3.
Parts for the 98 & 99’s are a bit hard to come by. Lots of people convert the CK III motors to the
Nicely done! Very cool. Any tips on where to find a CDI for these old triples? I have a 96 600 with a dead CDI. I wish there were new aftermarket ones but I can't find anything. Only old used ones on ebay.
Hi Paul! A nice tip for CDI units: You can use any cdi box for a rotary valve twin (470, 580, 617, 670,) and wire a splice to split the output for 3 coils. All the cdi units are identical and the triples are just split into 3 outputs internally.
Wow! Nice tip - the triples are hard to come by. The twins seem readily available and half the price. I had it in my head (not understanding these things 100%) that the cdi was required for timing and they "tell" the coils when to fire aka 120 degrees apart for a triple. I guess it doesn't work like that? The CDI is just providing power to the coils, then and the firing is controlled elsewhere? Thank you so much. Paul
@@paulhaines5755 The CDI only stores the capacitive energy and controls a very rough timing advance through the RPM range. The actual signal to fire comes from the trigger coil and flywheel inside the ignition housing (behind your recoil starter). Once the trigger coil fires, it signals the CDI to release its energy into the 3 high tension coils. These boost the voltage to the required level for the spark plug and fire the plug.
Thanks for the info! I must admit it's a bit of a mystery for me when it comes to electrical. I've rebuilt some engines on bikes and wave runners, etc. but never really had electrical issues until now so I'm learning more as a result. So glad I asked you. Thanks again! Paul.
O.k. - so a little research in my manuals shows me the CDI unit for the engines you mention is 410 9189 00 Same for all these engines! Easily available and inexpensive. One difference I see when compared to a triple CDI (part number 410 9195 00). I can splice in the wires to get to the three coils on my triple no problem. I see how that would work. I also see there is one extra wire on the triple CDI that I have in hand when compared to the twin CDI. It's in the bundle that goes down into the case cover on the engine. It is a black wire. Not sure what to do. Don't know the function of the wires. Can you help me? Thanks! Paul
My water pump service brown and nasty. I believe there is a plug to fill up that cavity with 2 stroke? Hope to do mine 700 next fall
20:10 in the video shows you the service plug/bolt to the oil cavity on the water pump. You can top that up with injection oil or gear/chaincase oil. You will need a syringe to do it and also need to take off your mag pipe.
I had antifreeze on the PTO spark plug, so i decided to remove all 3 jugs and have them sent out to get re chromed. i replaced all 3 cylinders, did a base gasket and new o rings on the head. Took it out for a quick 5 min ride and noticed my coolant resevoir going low, topped that off and decided to check the spark plugs, the PTO plug had a lot of antifreeze again! all the other plugs had no antifreeze. any ideas ?
There are only a few things that would cause that:
- Leak in head gaskets (cylinder or plug o-rings)
- Leak in base gasket (most likely and common)
- crack in coolant jacket in cylinder or crank case.
A few things to check: Make sure you check the truness of the crank case / cylinder mating surfaces and cylinder / head mating surface. If there is any warping, you will get leaks. Also, use gasket dressing on both sides of the base gasket to aid sealing.
Hope this helps you out.
Do you know where to source a shop manual for 99 mach 1 or mach z? Have both and would love an actual shop manual
www.dropbox.com/sh/48a8q5wc55gh6gz/AAC9LmKCHxUM5oldVto57W-Qa
@@jasonblier awesome, looks like a lot of good info, thanks 👍
@@89JDmac glad to assist!
Will there be a series 4? This is my 2nd F3 but my fist top end rebuild and I have several novice questions
Ask your question here and I'll try to do a video to answer them. I sold my triple sled and a bunch of the parts - but I'll help anyone out if I have the answers
Ok. If there is no scores in piston, can I just get by with rags and WD? There are so many opinions on whether to hone this nikasil. Would you? 2) SPI or Wiseco pistons? obviously big price difference (forged is apparently expensive) 3) When I install the rings, how do I know the position to put them in to NOT hit a port on the cylinder? 3) I have the shop manual and it says to “grease” cylinder and head bolts. Should I be doing that? I will be shining the bolts up and tapping the holes to clean them out before hand. Im hearing just screw in dry (more accurate torque) . Even heard of pipe dope on threads because there are actually a couple holes that have water ports in them? Like I said, Im a novice at this, so Im not sure who to believe. Thanks for any experience you have had with your Formulas with these issues
@@kevincasey4864 I'll do a video this week - just for you. These are all great questions 👍
cool man, Thanks!
@kevin casey m.ruclips.net/video/-Xtu4DERwKs/видео.html
Build sheet? Seriously? I've rebuilt hundreds of Rotax engines as a service tech for 42 yrs. I don't need no steenking build sheet! You're either REALLY bored or like to waste time!
The build sheet is to keep track of the progress of the entire sled - not just the engine. For those new to a full restoration project (tear down to the nuts and bolts and build up) on an older sled, it’s a very good way of breaking the project down into smaller tasks, building an accurate cost estimate, and compiling a list of rare/hard to find parts you need to hunt down. You have 40+ yrs of experience with Rotax engines - great. As mentioned in the videos, they are for people new to taking on a project like this and the build sheet is just a system to keep track of everything throughout the process.
Forty years of being a jerk.