As an Indian with a third person's perspective, after witnessing the whole unravelling of this farce, now I have a far deeper understanding how Brexit came to pass.
There's plenty of pods out there with old stalwarts of the game, legends and literal gods of cricket all spouting eternal and valuable cricketing wisdom on all the current drama but I await for this pod and only this pod to firmly set in my mind how I feel about the team, the nation and my life, cheers boys.
Geoffrey Boycott’s sanctimony was the funniest for me. It’s a matter of record that Pat Cummins has never been convicted in a French court for repeatedly punching his girlfriend.
In psychology terms, what Johnny did perfectly follows "The Declan Principle" of narcissism. I see it in the schools a lot where I teach: an entitled child (narcissist) constantly and arrogantly pushes acceptable boundaries in class. When the teacher reinforces the boundaries with a consequence, the spoilt child immediately defaults to "victim" status. In doing so, a whole bunch of empathetic kids (enablers) rush in to "support" the "oppressed" child, and give the "evil" teacher morally superior daggers and gossip and supply the kid with "compassion". The child stays silent, and lets his/her flying monkeys do all of the dirty work (revenge against the teacher) for him/her. Repeat and rinse the cycle ad nauseum. Transpose this phenomenon onto the cricket field wherein 1. Bairstow is the narcissist child, 2. The Aussies are the teacher, 3. The umpires are the "acceptable boundaries" (laws), and 4. The English public are the "flying monkeys" (his enablers) and hey presto! You have the Declan Principle of narcissistic behaviour/supply in an Ashes Test match.
@dragonballfanscantread2383both teams have been dickheads towards the laws of the game. They've only agreed with the law when it was in their favour. Take starc's catch or bairstow's stumping as an example. It's just that Australia played better cricket and deserved to win.
I am an Australian and my first instinct upon seeing the Bairstow dismissal was that it was pretty average from the Aussies, with the test at a critical juncture and Englands last recognised bats at crease, the stage was set, then they pull that?! What the fuck? The right hemisphere of my brain quickly went into overdrive. Having previously spent a couple of hours putting a 1 year old and a 3 year old to bed I was eagerly anticipating an entertaining contest between bat and ball, that I ultimately thought the Aussies would wrap up around lunch time anyway, I felt robbed. The decisive blow to this partnership was so… anticlimactic. As you so eloquently discussed in your post match, what followed was an absolute fever dream as Ben Stokes seemed to be manifesting the response to the collective frustration of every English fan watching and probably the only Australian who felt that frustration… me? Ironically, as the anger/frustration at being robbed of a good contest ran through me, I was witnessing one of the most epic batting displays you’ll see on an international cricket field. As the days follows, so too did the endless discussions with mates about the spirit of cricket.. the philosophy of win at all costs v how you win, zero sum mindset vs growth mindset, scarcity vs abundance and even an (some what tenious) argument for the dismissal being not out under the laws of cricket through the Australians setting up Bairstow by noticing his mannerisms, implicitly setting the terms of a dead ball with Jonny in the previous 1000+ Ashes balls he faced and cunningly stabbing him in the back at the appropriate time. It is a case that would need Johnnie Lee Cochran Jr or more tastefully, Harvey Specter to pull off “41.5 - Deliberate distraction, deception or obstruction of batter 41.5.1 In addition to 41.4, it is unfair for any fielder wilfully to attempt, by word or action, to distract, deceive or obstruct either batter after the striker has received the ball.” … finally the discussion inevitably cycled through the idolising phase of the earlier 2000s Aussie team then morphed into the despising phase of CA, the selectors and the head-butting-the-line-sandpaper-on-the-field Aussie mentality, before finally settling on the humanisation phase… as my RUclips feed filled with opinions, vitriol, jingoism, Pat Cummins saying "Ok" and the morality of tossing a ball at some sticks, I realised I had done it again… I had cared too much. The game had sucked me in. Yeah the dismissal might have rated on the more shit bloke side of the scale then a screaming 150kph inswinging yorker, but the cold hard facts... as mentioned ad nauseam are that none of this discussion happens unless Jonny Bairstow wanders out of his crease like a geriatric crossing the road daring the car to hit him.. and didn’t it fucking hit him. Great pod lads, grateful for the sobering reflections highlighting the absurdity of this last week. Keep it up!
Where is it in the rules that you have to be trying to gain an advantage to get out anyway? Concentration and awareness is a key skill in cricket, I teach this to my 12 year old now. I can only imagine that's on steroids in test cricket, and if a player doesn't have those attributes, that is as much a weakness as say playing across the line all the time. Ponting was spot on about Stokes having hours to process, and conveniently he would have withdrawn the appeal, we''ll never know will we. I have special distaste for Mcullum's attitude to this. He seems to think he's the equivalent of some modern day cricketing messiah, who has done exactly the same thing multiple times but his redemption arc over years and years has led him to believe that because he apologised to Kumar (not Murali who he actually ran out) he has cleansed not only his sins but for all wicketkeepers past present and future on this matter. Why is he the only one afforded this journey of introspection, and how's the arrogance that his was the only inevitable concusion? Other's will be at peace with it till the day they die. It beggars belief. The mob mentality of the poms is quite sad and as for Piers Morgan and Boycott (no skeletons in his closet), well enough said. Smith and Stokes quite brilliant, Solar Panels Cummins is pretty much the best cricketer in the world.
Australia have been losing close games in these conditions that evens up the gap between the teams - Edgbaston 2005, Trent Bridge 2005, Trent Bridge 2013, Chester-Le-Street 2013, Headingley 2019, it's about time England were on the receiving end of some close games
54:51 "Name one Scotland player" Can't name a current player, but can name an ex one: Rahul Dravid. He played a season for them in 2000, I think. Some time around then.
australian and england don,t really realize how lucky they are to have competition between the ultimate in national team sports. we hope to have this in canada soon!!!
Boys when Indians do it: "yeah its out, but it doesn't sit well with meeeee" Boys when Aussies do it: "if its technically out, its out" Make up your mind! On such dismissals i'm on Aussies side, and i'm on Ashwin's side and on Deepti's side as well. If its out, its out.
I agree with you, mate. We were far too hard on Ashwin at the time, for example. It took us a while to see the reasoning and eventual good he did for the game. Maybe the general Pom population will come around eventually as well, just like a list of their former captains have.
@@harshkumarf4379 they did say its out. But they were faaaaaaaaar more judgemental and critical of Ashwin and Deepti. Just listen to their podcast with Ellyse Perry. Curious to see their reactions of such dismissals in future.
Cameron Green is undoubtedly talented, (Im thnking generationally) but needs a good dropping to fire him up to sharpen up his game. He needs to learn how to chip it around to get off strike so he can cruise in the early stages of his innings and his bowling lacks a bit of Mongrel. Maybe he needs to grow a bit and his body harden up so he's clear of the injury phase but it would be ideal if he could spice up his bouncer. We actually dont have a Mitch Johnson style enforcer in our team. Starc has the swinging yorkers but a lot of his bouncers are fence fodder because of his low arm delivery. Cummins has dropped a yard since his debut as a young tearaway and only invokes fear in a batsmen of losing their offstump and not their head. If Cam Green can work with Lillee to become that fearsome enforcer (short sharp bursts), then we would have all bowling aspects covered in our attack.
Great stuff boys. Yes something else is going on here. I have never seen anything like this before. The gentry and the convicts. They get to be moral, and we get to be larrikins. Everyone wins.
From a Pommie prospective, it's the Ashes, bugger spirit of the game, that's for Sunday village cricket. Just a bit more brain applied to our batting approach would help. This Bairstow business just hid the fact we spent hours of bowling short pitched dross (and stupid amount of no balls over the two tests)
Stokes discredited Aus win by saying that he would not want to win in this manner. Thats an indirect way of saying that Aus won because of that one wicket. He has not once said that the Aus played better than them.
Everyone should agree it's out by the laws of the game. I dont even have a problem with the ethics of it. What I have a problem with is that so many Aussies that are staunchly against Mankading are somehow defending this. Mankad actually punishes you for trying to gain an unfair advantage. This was just a difference of judgement as to when the ball is dead. He didnt overbalance like in a stumping. He wasnt trying to gain an advantage. He left the crease fully in control thinking the ball is dead. Now you can say he was wrong in thinking that and Id agree but somehow acting like it isnt worse than Mankad is really perplexing. And yes, the Poms who are moaning are also hypocrites who have done similar things themselves.
As a fan of the associate game (Go USA!) I have to give credit to the ICC. Cricket World Cup League II provided the top associate teams with 36 ODI matches conducted as tri-series across every teams home ground (sans Netherlands who were in the Super League). Each game mattered, whether it was to qualify for the World Cup Qualifier, or avoiding the risk of relegation (losing ODI status). The consistent high pressure fixtures has resulted in associates continuing to close the gap on the bottom end Full members.
Sam's point about Bairstow thinking he's a law unto himself being an advantage is interesting. His perceived advantage is nowhere near that of a non-striker leaving the crease before the ball is bowled, which is the non-striker gaining a direct advantage by reducing the length of the pitch to run for singles. My point is that people nearly universally find mankads unacceptable, which is a much more obvious way of seeking an advantage. I think the people who think mankading is unethical, but this isn't are contradictory. What they are saying is it's not ok to get a better out that is seeking a direct advantage, but it is acceptable to get a batter who isn't seeking an advantage other than being naive. I think it's fine to accept that it's out and ethical, but then those people need to apply their same thought process to mankads.
With all this though lads, are we still entertained?! Aren't you hard as fuck talking about it being out? Or spirit shit? Or whatever crap? We're all hard as fuck and drawn in to the shithousery... We're all winners in this.
Difference between Aus and Eng media is that had someone in Aus team managed to get themsleves out like this, Aus media would have lambasted the batter and would be asking for Cummins to be dropped as a captain ( which they generally do anytime anything slightly goes wrong) Gotta give props to Eng for making a controversy of a simple stumping, any good keeper with awareness would have done the same what Carey did. Eng response was it shouldn't have been done because Johny *thought* ball was dead.
This has gone beyond a joke. Let me be perfectly clear: The MCC members especially and even the Lord's crowd ought to be ashamed of themselves. That, above all else. Carey _is_ using gamesmanship. It's the equivalent of a striker standing in front of a goaly before he makes a kick. Does it pay off? Sure. Is he being a dick? Yep. That said; Bairstow needs a very good shouting out. So does Starc. Egos and adrenaline can make a game but it absolutely destroyed this one. Cummins had one or two series to prove himself a capable leader and he's done it in two tests. It doesn't matter what happens in the last three, Cummins has gone up 100% in my estimation. He's been class personified on and off the field. The England players have displayed a level of bitterness. A low level of bitterness, reasonably expressed. For Pez to claim they are "inciting" is fucking ridiculous. If the roles were reversed and this had have happened at the MCG I a) would expect better behaviour from the members and Aus fans and b) would absolutely guarantee you'd have the same behaviour from the press and pundits. Publicity-wise the entire thing has been a partisan shit show with people who's opinion I once respected going completely off the rail. Fucking yuck.
Aussies showing why they are the World Test champions! Irrespective of losing the Border Gavaskar Trophy, they beat India convincingly in the WTC final. Now showing England the dirt at their Home
187,000 criminals were sent to Australia and it takes more than 150 years to breed that badness out especially when many are in-bred.The second colony ship crew were shocked to find several cases of canibalism,not by the Abbos but by colonists! there were other documented cases which were kept quiet by parliament but is recorded in Hansards,one man ate his two children due to hunger he claimed, another did the same but pleaded mental illness as you would so running out Bairstow is nothing to these people
Getting the English out of our blood has taken a while but it's been well worth it. Hope you enjoy your weekend of soccer related violence and mushy peas.
No surprise to see Indians uniting with Aussies on ‘if it’s in the rules’ it’s fair. But at least with the Mankad, a batsman is seeking an advantage. Which makes the Bairstow ‘stumping’ even worse. But for now we in England are enjoying the sounds of Aussies whinging about ‘colonial past’ and MCC behaviour.
Yes, because either you agree with us or not, we don't change our opinion. We don't have a culture of whining for no strong reason. The only "spirit of cricket" we know is to play by the rules.
Pearl-clutching Poms, Pearl-clutching Poms, Stole the World Cup, Without any qualms. But soon as the cons, Fairly ran out their John, Pearl-clutching Poms, Sang the spirit of psalms!
To be impartial I think it is showing a few cracks in the psyche of both nations - Brits calling Aussies cheats and Aussies calling Brits whingers, and cry babies. I haven't seen any of the England team cry on TV yet. It is a bit unpleasant from both sides - it's good to see a competitive game with a bit of niggle, but it has been a bit unsavoury off the pitch from both sides - but could be good for cricket to keep it interesting whilst the series is otherwise a bit dead now!!?
I also really think you're overstating the colonial stuff. England really want to beat the Aussies because most of us of a certain age have watched us getting destroyed by the Aussies for most of our lives in quite a brutal, unforgiving way. It's much more to do with that, than colonial history, I can assure you. Most of us also despise the Lords longroom. The ''cheats'' stuff is ugly though, I agree with you there and I am not into that at all. I think that's pure desperation. It's definitely a desire to have the moral high ground, if we lose the match. It's not just that though. It's an attitude that has crept into all sport and much of society, not just in England. If something doesn't go your way, the only explanation is cheating or conspiracy. Too hard to acknowledge that you didn't win because you weren't good enough.
Loving your coverage of the Ashes. Couple of points -Bazball would be better termed “Egoball” The individual before the team seems to be the result of this philosophy. Such a contrast with Australia who play the epitome of the “team first” game. The only challenge to the so called “spirit of the game” has been McCullum and Stokes stirring the pot to disperse the heat away from the fact that they are down 0-2 and have essentially dropped any realistic chance of nabbing the Ashes from the world champs. The Stumping. Neither umpire moved from their place contrary to Stokes post match comments. Clearly a stumping. The argument that he wasn’t trying to run or gain an advantage is silly. A batsman playing a shot to a medium pacer or spinner, lifts his foot and gets stumped. He didn’t lift his foot in order to gain an advantage. No issue. And Barstow’s a keeper who tries to do the same thing. Carey stumping on the final ball of the over was clever too. Not because he left the crease early due to it being the end of the over. He was leaving his crease regularly. There is more ambiguity Re the ball being dead for the first 5 balls. The last ball of the over, the ball is dead when the Ump says it is. If you want to see an actual example of a wicket keeper behaving, shall we say questionably, look no further than “Brezza’s” infamous stumping of Murali. Is this an attempt by McCullum to cleanse his past sins by lining up his apology vs a (rightly) unrepentant Aust team. Saying things like “They’ll live to regret not withdrawing the appeal” or whatever rubbish it was he said. Win/Win as far as McCullum is concerned. By taking such a holier than thou stance he deflects attention from his current predicament as coach and past actions as keeper. All of a sudden stumpings are detrimental to the spirit of the game! DO’H!! And finally, I have NEVER heard Brendan shortened to “Baz”. BARRY could be “Baz” or “Bazza”, but definitely not Brendan. He’d be “Macca” or at a push “Brez” or “Brezza” Aussies and Kiwis also add O’s to the end of names like John -Johnno David - Davo “BregoBall” is what I’m calling it.
#ASKTGC Remember the "accidental" World cup final boundary that came off Stokes' diving bat, why didn't they say nah that's against the Spirit of Cricket we wont take that four? Why did Stokes not adhere to his current holier than thou ideology which comes with the catchy tagline of "We don't wanna win like that". CRY ME A MOREEE!
@@alexwilliams4264 if england did to aussies , aussies will whine whole universe and wanted to change rules and shiet. Pathetic cheaters. You want to win in non cricketing way in cricket. WTF You people making sports into steet bully fight. Who can cheat better can win.
Where would you rank this bairstow dismissal vs. the mankad where batsman is tyring to get a run but here no one is trying to get a run ou of it. ... SO worse than Mankad??
Both are in the laws of the game. But yeah this one is way worse than mankad. And I remember these guys were sitting on a fence while talking about mankad. But the Indians have fully supported them in this situation.
@@mcmoore02but I didn't see the same amount of support for Indians when deepti did the mankad. It shows hypocrisy. Whereas Indians have fully supported Australia in this regard. But that's what you'll get from India, "brutal honesty".
@@mcmoore02 you're an exception. These 2 idiots made a mockery of the incident when it happened. In my opinion, in this series both countries have failed to respect the laws of cricket. Be it the Australians whining about starc's failed catch attempt or the English whining about bairstow's stumping. Both countries have agreed with the rules when it favoured them. So I've no dog in this race.
I could listen to you two talk about the Bairstow dismissal all day. It's therapeutic after all the drivel that's been spouted online the last few days.
I dont understand how running out the striker when he thinks the ball is dead is different to running out the non striker when they know the ball isn't. Everything the Boys are saying here to defend the wicket can be said for the mankad. Both are out and both are morally good.
We've been brought up with this myth of Chappell's dastardly act with the underarm ball, but even as a kid I struggled to understand why it was such a big deal. If the rules let you bowl underarm, how can you be upset when somebody does it? And then a few ashes back when Broad nicked to slip and didn't walk, the australian media, and even players and coaches, lost their shit and are still going on about it today. But Broad did nothing wrong, it's not his fault the umpire was asleep, or that the Aussies couldn't review (don't get me started on reviews, punishing captains for not being able to correctly guess when an umpire has made the wrong decision is crazy to me).
Great to see the arguments around "laws", "technical","advantage" by aussies only when it comes to them ..but "spirit" when it comes to Mankading Appeal should have been revoked ..period. Especially since no warnings were given Baristow.. But problem is with expecting this from Aussies..
It's frustrating that incidents always seem to end up being journalists' opinions vs. journalists opinions. I dont know, nor have heard of any English non journo, non cricketer who thinks it's anything other than out and a brainfade.
As an Englishman thoroughly embarrassed by the comically hypocritical reaction to the Bairstow dismissal, I have to say it all absolutely reeks of Brexit.
As an Indian with a third person's perspective, after witnessing the whole unravelling of this farce, now I have a far deeper understanding how Brexit came to pass.
spot on call!!
Explain?
All you need to do is look at france last weekend to entirely justify a leave EU vote.
Good attempt at a joke, hahahahaha
😆
There's plenty of pods out there with old stalwarts of the game, legends and literal gods of cricket all spouting eternal and valuable cricketing wisdom on all the current drama but I await for this pod and only this pod to firmly set in my mind how I feel about the team, the nation and my life, cheers boys.
Deliciously put. I agree 🤌🏼
Agree...I also come here for that "f*ck yeah" soul scream.
Geoffrey Boycott’s sanctimony was the funniest for me. It’s a matter of record that Pat Cummins has never been convicted in a French court for repeatedly punching his girlfriend.
Last time I checked, Patty had a black eye. So if anything, he could've been Boycott's victim.
@@kiriakoz Good point. Geoffrey has a wizard right hook. Apparently.
"You Never hate anyone whose story you know". The best quote I've heard in a while.
In psychology terms, what Johnny did perfectly follows "The Declan Principle" of narcissism. I see it in the schools a lot where I teach: an entitled child (narcissist) constantly and arrogantly pushes acceptable boundaries in class. When the teacher reinforces the boundaries with a consequence, the spoilt child immediately defaults to "victim" status. In doing so, a whole bunch of empathetic kids (enablers) rush in to "support" the "oppressed" child, and give the "evil" teacher morally superior daggers and gossip and supply the kid with "compassion". The child stays silent, and lets his/her flying monkeys do all of the dirty work (revenge against the teacher) for him/her. Repeat and rinse the cycle ad nauseum.
Transpose this phenomenon onto the cricket field wherein 1. Bairstow is the narcissist child, 2. The Aussies are the teacher, 3. The umpires are the "acceptable boundaries" (laws), and 4. The English public are the "flying monkeys" (his enablers) and hey presto! You have the Declan Principle of narcissistic behaviour/supply in an Ashes Test match.
The dunce thought it was the end of the over and went to chat to his skipper like every player on the planet does. Nothing more, nothing less.
@dragonballfanscantread2383both teams have been dickheads towards the laws of the game. They've only agreed with the law when it was in their favour. Take starc's catch or bairstow's stumping as an example.
It's just that Australia played better cricket and deserved to win.
@dragonballfanscantread2383 yes of course only Australia sledges - who doesn't love a good stereotype?
Add Broad to that list, bigtime.
Notice how missing Bairstow has been for last couple of days?
Been eagerly waiting for this chance to get around the boys.
Bloody hell boys, that was BRILLIANT. Thanks for putting in the hard yards, you must be walloped after the long haul flights. I appreciate it greatly.
"Tantrum" is actually the perfect way to describe the extremely over-the-top reaction of the English media.
Appreciate the effort Higgos. Absolute legend. We needed this content from you both
Time for England the change their tactics from the McCullum “we feel like the won” to the Broad “this series didn’t count”?
Or change the tactics to "this series never happened' ?
An early congratulations on 50,000,000 views, TGC team! 🎉
This show is the shit. Love it
Johnny BONGTOKE was off to the fairies and considering he tried it in the same test is awesome that he got out that way.
Amazing as always boys! Higgos fighting through it like Nathan Lyon!
Best take on 'the incident' I've seen. Really looking forward to tonight's next installment of whingeball.
Best take I've heard on the Bairstow dismissal, well done boys
#ASKTGC BOIS, what ya think about the idea of having a bi-lateral 'spin-off' series between LSG and RCB and calling it Bashes?
the trophy is a big juicy mango
Hoping for an Aussie mankad in this series. Interesting how you guys react to that.
Vote +
they'll justify it without a second thought
Stay in your crease
I can imagine every Australian batter will remain in his crease till it's absolutely dead
I don't know how the English press could manage to get any angrier but it sounds like a great experiment to try out.
Sam Perry absolutely laying it out from 17:01 to whatever, wow. #WeAreAllCoats #WeAreAllOneConsciousness, my next t-shirt slogan is ready
I am an Australian and my first instinct upon seeing the Bairstow dismissal was that it was pretty average from the Aussies, with the test at a critical juncture and Englands last recognised bats at crease, the stage was set, then they pull that?! What the fuck?
The right hemisphere of my brain quickly went into overdrive. Having previously spent a couple of hours putting a 1 year old and a 3 year old to bed I was eagerly anticipating an entertaining contest between bat and ball, that I ultimately thought the Aussies would wrap up around lunch time anyway, I felt robbed. The decisive blow to this partnership was so… anticlimactic.
As you so eloquently discussed in your post match, what followed was an absolute fever dream as Ben Stokes seemed to be manifesting the response to the collective frustration of every English fan watching and probably the only Australian who felt that frustration… me? Ironically, as the anger/frustration at being robbed of a good contest ran through me, I was witnessing one of the most epic batting displays you’ll see on an international cricket field.
As the days follows, so too did the endless discussions with mates about the spirit of cricket.. the philosophy of win at all costs v how you win, zero sum mindset vs growth mindset, scarcity vs abundance and even an (some what tenious) argument for the dismissal being not out under the laws of cricket through the Australians setting up Bairstow by noticing his mannerisms, implicitly setting the terms of a dead ball with Jonny in the previous 1000+ Ashes balls he faced and cunningly stabbing him in the back at the appropriate time. It is a case that would need Johnnie Lee Cochran Jr or more tastefully, Harvey Specter to pull off “41.5 - Deliberate distraction, deception or obstruction of batter 41.5.1 In addition to 41.4, it is unfair for any fielder wilfully to attempt, by word or action, to distract, deceive or obstruct either batter after the striker has received the ball.” … finally the discussion inevitably cycled through the idolising phase of the earlier 2000s Aussie team then morphed into the despising phase of CA, the selectors and the head-butting-the-line-sandpaper-on-the-field Aussie mentality, before finally settling on the humanisation phase… as my RUclips feed filled with opinions, vitriol, jingoism, Pat Cummins saying "Ok" and the morality of tossing a ball at some sticks, I realised I had done it again… I had cared too much. The game had sucked me in.
Yeah the dismissal might have rated on the more shit bloke side of the scale then a screaming 150kph inswinging yorker, but the cold hard facts... as mentioned ad nauseam are that none of this discussion happens unless Jonny Bairstow wanders out of his crease like a geriatric crossing the road daring the car to hit him.. and didn’t it fucking hit him.
Great pod lads, grateful for the sobering reflections highlighting the absurdity of this last week. Keep it up!
dreamland arrives when 5-0 happens
Australia (the continent) levitates from Earth and becomes a new planet
Still on the cards haha.
@@sitaylor No shit shirlock, how long did it take you to figure that out? The 3rd and 4th test have already past mate.
Where is it in the rules that you have to be trying to gain an advantage to get out anyway?
Concentration and awareness is a key skill in cricket, I teach this to my 12 year old now.
I can only imagine that's on steroids in test cricket, and if a player doesn't have those attributes, that is as much a weakness as say playing across the line all the time.
Ponting was spot on about Stokes having hours to process, and conveniently he would have withdrawn the appeal, we''ll never know will we.
I have special distaste for Mcullum's attitude to this.
He seems to think he's the equivalent of some modern day cricketing messiah, who has done exactly the same thing multiple times but his redemption arc over years and years has led him to believe that because he apologised to Kumar (not Murali who he actually ran out) he has cleansed not only his sins but for all wicketkeepers past present and future on this matter.
Why is he the only one afforded this journey of introspection, and how's the arrogance that his was the only inevitable concusion?
Other's will be at peace with it till the day they die. It beggars belief.
The mob mentality of the poms is quite sad and as for Piers Morgan and Boycott (no skeletons in his closet), well enough said.
Smith and Stokes quite brilliant, Solar Panels Cummins is pretty much the best cricketer in the world.
Wish warne could see this. His cheeky comments is the only thing missing
You said the same thing of what i thought of this. Chanting CHEAT CHEAT at a team is against Spirit of cricket.
The English have never been great practitioners of self awareness.
This is nothing to do with english. its basically open cheating because aussies control the umpires
ironic from Aussies
@@muzz852the ironing is delicious as Bart once said.
Last ticatape was Cedal Evans, or that girl with the boat, aye?
Real alpha shit from cummins🫡
Australia have been losing close games in these conditions that evens up the gap between the teams -
Edgbaston 2005, Trent Bridge 2005, Trent Bridge 2013, Chester-Le-Street 2013, Headingley 2019, it's about time England were on the receiving end of some close games
Winning close games is a skill
Bazball is a glass cannon, when it's working it'll do a lot of damage but it's one mistake from catastrophe
As an Indian, START RESPECTING THE NON STRIKER RUN OUT.
54:51 "Name one Scotland player" Can't name a current player, but can name an ex one: Rahul Dravid. He played a season for them in 2000, I think. Some time around then.
australian and england don,t really realize how lucky they are to have competition between the ultimate in national team sports. we hope to have this in canada soon!!!
Boys when Indians do it: "yeah its out, but it doesn't sit well with meeeee"
Boys when Aussies do it: "if its technically out, its out"
Make up your mind!
On such dismissals i'm on Aussies side, and i'm on Ashwin's side and on Deepti's side as well.
If its out, its out.
I agree with you, mate. We were far too hard on Ashwin at the time, for example. It took us a while to see the reasoning and eventual good he did for the game. Maybe the general Pom population will come around eventually as well, just like a list of their former captains have.
Yeah, their stance on this is a little hypocritical. Touting the laws when it suits them, major crows feet.
The English are still big crybabies tho.
did'nt they said that its out in both the cases ,,
@@harshkumarf4379 they did say its out. But they were faaaaaaaaar more judgemental and critical of Ashwin and Deepti. Just listen to their podcast with Ellyse Perry.
Curious to see their reactions of such dismissals in future.
@@brotherben4357 must say, I'm very pleasantly shocked to read your comment. Cheers mate! 🍻
FINALLY. I nearly died waiting
Anyway, do the tigers or the swans get it done tonight?
Cameron Green is undoubtedly talented, (Im thnking generationally) but needs a good dropping to fire him up to sharpen up his game. He needs to learn how to chip it around to get off strike so he can cruise in the early stages of his innings and his bowling lacks a bit of Mongrel. Maybe he needs to grow a bit and his body harden up so he's clear of the injury phase but it would be ideal if he could spice up his bouncer. We actually dont have a Mitch Johnson style enforcer in our team. Starc has the swinging yorkers but a lot of his bouncers are fence fodder because of his low arm delivery. Cummins has dropped a yard since his debut as a young tearaway and only invokes fear in a batsmen of losing their offstump and not their head. If Cam Green can work with Lillee to become that fearsome enforcer (short sharp bursts), then we would have all bowling aspects covered in our attack.
Nah. He’s still the best option. He’ll come good.
Let Pezza cook, brilliant take mate 9:03
Mccullum trying so hard to look relaxed and not bothered on the balcony 24/7 is giving me a crows feet 🤢. Shambles
Great stuff boys. Yes something else is going on here. I have never seen anything like this before. The gentry and the convicts. They get to be moral, and we get to be larrikins. Everyone wins.
A lot of insecurity and inferiority complex going on more like.
Good question. Mitch Marsh and Cam Green are definitely packing heat.
From a Pommie prospective, it's the Ashes, bugger spirit of the game, that's for Sunday village cricket. Just a bit more brain applied to our batting approach would help. This Bairstow business just hid the fact we spent hours of bowling short pitched dross (and stupid amount of no balls over the two tests)
Johnny Bairstow….keep walking 🚶
Stokes discredited Aus win by saying that he would not want to win in this manner. Thats an indirect way of saying that Aus won because of that one wicket. He has not once said that the Aus played better than them.
That's how the game is played 7:12...BOIS you'v smashed it..
Everyone should agree it's out by the laws of the game. I dont even have a problem with the ethics of it. What I have a problem with is that so many Aussies that are staunchly against Mankading are somehow defending this. Mankad actually punishes you for trying to gain an unfair advantage. This was just a difference of judgement as to when the ball is dead. He didnt overbalance like in a stumping. He wasnt trying to gain an advantage. He left the crease fully in control thinking the ball is dead. Now you can say he was wrong in thinking that and Id agree but somehow acting like it isnt worse than Mankad is really perplexing. And yes, the Poms who are moaning are also hypocrites who have done similar things themselves.
Australia did the right thing and england who broke the rules should shut up and focus on the next test.
As a fan of the associate game (Go USA!) I have to give credit to the ICC. Cricket World Cup League II provided the top associate teams with 36 ODI matches conducted as tri-series across every teams home ground (sans Netherlands who were in the Super League). Each game mattered, whether it was to qualify for the World Cup Qualifier, or avoiding the risk of relegation (losing ODI status).
The consistent high pressure fixtures has resulted in associates continuing to close the gap on the bottom end Full members.
Nobody bothers reading a cars manual, until the time it can drive and park itself. 👀
Not just the English cricket but the best explanation of British coloniality 😂
It's weird but a nice feeling at the same time to have Indians and Kiwis etc actually agreeing with Aussies over this
amazing content, im hooked
Sam's point about Bairstow thinking he's a law unto himself being an advantage is interesting. His perceived advantage is nowhere near that of a non-striker leaving the crease before the ball is bowled, which is the non-striker gaining a direct advantage by reducing the length of the pitch to run for singles. My point is that people nearly universally find mankads unacceptable, which is a much more obvious way of seeking an advantage.
I think the people who think mankading is unethical, but this isn't are contradictory. What they are saying is it's not ok to get a better out that is seeking a direct advantage, but it is acceptable to get a batter who isn't seeking an advantage other than being naive.
I think it's fine to accept that it's out and ethical, but then those people need to apply their same thought process to mankads.
100%
With all this though lads, are we still entertained?! Aren't you hard as fuck talking about it being out? Or spirit shit? Or whatever crap? We're all hard as fuck and drawn in to the shithousery... We're all winners in this.
5-0 Boysssss lets go
Difference between Aus and Eng media is that had someone in Aus team managed to get themsleves out like this, Aus media would have lambasted the batter and would be asking for Cummins to be dropped as a captain ( which they generally do anytime anything slightly goes wrong)
Gotta give props to Eng for making a controversy of a simple stumping, any good keeper with awareness would have done the same what Carey did. Eng response was it shouldn't have been done because Johny *thought* ball was dead.
This has gone beyond a joke. Let me be perfectly clear:
The MCC members especially and even the Lord's crowd ought to be ashamed of themselves. That, above all else.
Carey _is_ using gamesmanship. It's the equivalent of a striker standing in front of a goaly before he makes a kick. Does it pay off? Sure. Is he being a dick? Yep.
That said; Bairstow needs a very good shouting out. So does Starc. Egos and adrenaline can make a game but it absolutely destroyed this one.
Cummins had one or two series to prove himself a capable leader and he's done it in two tests. It doesn't matter what happens in the last three, Cummins has gone up 100% in my estimation. He's been class personified on and off the field.
The England players have displayed a level of bitterness. A low level of bitterness, reasonably expressed. For Pez to claim they are "inciting" is fucking ridiculous. If the roles were reversed and this had have happened at the MCG I a) would expect better behaviour from the members and Aus fans and b) would absolutely guarantee you'd have the same behaviour from the press and pundits. Publicity-wise the entire thing has been a partisan shit show with people who's opinion I once respected going completely off the rail. Fucking yuck.
If 3-0 happens after this test match, my god, it will be fooking fun and visceral.
Aussies showing why they are the World Test champions! Irrespective of losing the Border Gavaskar Trophy, they beat India convincingly in the WTC final. Now showing England the dirt at their Home
Wow great context from your dad
These guyz were cursing and trolling deepti sharma when she mankad the english better but now they changed all of their tunes and logics..
Guys... whatever was the audio issue with the original, even if it is barely audible... publish it... 😊
Had Carey missed the stumps, and the backup got fumbled, would Johnny have taken the overthrow runs?… YES.
You can't reject scored runs, they will go on the scoreboard regardless of whether you choose to 'take' them or not.
@@Greg12 you’re assuming a boundary overthrow. He would’ve run 1
187,000 criminals were sent to Australia and it takes more than 150 years to breed that badness out especially when many are in-bred.The second colony ship crew were shocked to find several cases of canibalism,not by the Abbos but by colonists! there were other documented cases which were kept quiet by parliament but is recorded in Hansards,one man ate his two children due to hunger he claimed, another did the same but pleaded mental illness as you would so running out Bairstow is nothing to these people
Getting the English out of our blood has taken a while but it's been well worth it. Hope you enjoy your weekend of soccer related violence and mushy peas.
Hey.. they were hungry. Give 'em a break.
The fellas in those boats were poms. After a few generations the sun bleaches the scum out. Not so cool for those that stayed behind.
For what it’s worth Josh hazelwood would easily have the largest “member” from the Aussie team. Ben stokes for England obviously..
Did you guys forget to hit the “record” button on Monday?
No surprise to see Indians uniting with Aussies on ‘if it’s in the rules’ it’s fair. But at least with the Mankad, a batsman is seeking an advantage. Which makes the Bairstow ‘stumping’ even worse. But for now we in England are enjoying the sounds of Aussies whinging about ‘colonial past’ and MCC behaviour.
Yes, because either you agree with us or not, we don't change our opinion. We don't have a culture of whining for no strong reason. The only "spirit of cricket" we know is to play by the rules.
#ASKTGC Can you guys talk about why icc updating every ranking except men’s test team ranking?
Pearl-clutching Poms,
Pearl-clutching Poms,
Stole the World Cup,
Without any qualms.
But soon as the cons,
Fairly ran out their John,
Pearl-clutching Poms,
Sang the spirit of psalms!
To be impartial I think it is showing a few cracks in the psyche of both nations - Brits calling Aussies cheats and Aussies calling Brits whingers, and cry babies. I haven't seen any of the England team cry on TV yet. It is a bit unpleasant from both sides - it's good to see a competitive game with a bit of niggle, but it has been a bit unsavoury off the pitch from both sides - but could be good for cricket to keep it interesting whilst the series is otherwise a bit dead now!!?
Johnny 'walker' bairstow
I also really think you're overstating the colonial stuff. England really want to beat the Aussies because most of us of a certain age have watched us getting destroyed by the Aussies for most of our lives in quite a brutal, unforgiving way. It's much more to do with that, than colonial history, I can assure you. Most of us also despise the Lords longroom. The ''cheats'' stuff is ugly though, I agree with you there and I am not into that at all. I think that's pure desperation. It's definitely a desire to have the moral high ground, if we lose the match. It's not just that though. It's an attitude that has crept into all sport and much of society, not just in England. If something doesn't go your way, the only explanation is cheating or conspiracy. Too hard to acknowledge that you didn't win because you weren't good enough.
as long as i keep watching this marsh won't get out
302 short deliveries is all part of saving test cricket.
Loving your coverage of the Ashes.
Couple of points
-Bazball would be better termed “Egoball”
The individual before the team seems to be the result of this philosophy. Such a contrast with Australia who play the epitome of the “team first” game.
The only challenge to the so called “spirit of the game” has been McCullum and Stokes stirring the pot to disperse the heat away from the fact that they are down 0-2 and have essentially dropped any realistic chance of nabbing the Ashes from the world champs.
The Stumping.
Neither umpire moved from their place contrary to Stokes post match comments.
Clearly a stumping. The argument that he wasn’t trying to run or gain an advantage is silly. A batsman playing a shot to a medium pacer or spinner, lifts his foot and gets stumped. He didn’t lift his foot in order to gain an advantage. No issue.
And Barstow’s a keeper who tries to do the same thing. Carey stumping on the final ball of the over was clever too. Not because he left the crease early due to it being the end of the over. He was leaving his crease regularly. There is more ambiguity Re the ball being dead for the first 5 balls. The last ball of the over, the ball is dead when the Ump says it is.
If you want to see an actual example of a wicket keeper behaving, shall we say questionably, look no further than “Brezza’s” infamous stumping of Murali.
Is this an attempt by McCullum to cleanse his past sins by lining up his apology vs a (rightly) unrepentant Aust team. Saying things like “They’ll live to regret not withdrawing the appeal” or whatever rubbish it was he said.
Win/Win as far as McCullum is concerned. By taking such a holier than thou stance he deflects attention from his current predicament as coach and past actions as keeper.
All of a sudden stumpings are detrimental to the spirit of the game! DO’H!!
And finally, I have NEVER heard Brendan shortened to “Baz”.
BARRY could be “Baz” or “Bazza”, but definitely not Brendan. He’d be “Macca” or at a push “Brez” or “Brezza”
Aussies and Kiwis also add O’s to the end of names like
John -Johnno
David - Davo
“BregoBall” is what I’m calling it.
The question that should be asked is to Stokes did you hear the umpires call over?
Remember this when some PoC does Mankad.
Better behaved folks in Scruffy Murphys than the Long Room at Lords 🤷♂️
#ASKTGC Remember the "accidental" World cup final boundary that came off Stokes' diving bat, why didn't they say nah that's against the Spirit of Cricket we wont take that four? Why did Stokes not adhere to his current holier than thou ideology which comes with the catchy tagline of "We don't wanna win like that". CRY ME A MOREEE!
Love how the tone of Bois changed when Aussies do this as compared to when Ashwin and Deepti Sharma do it. 😉
Nothing could be comparable to the current whinging by the Engligh
All the nuance they had with Mankading is gone, now it's "just out" apparantly
Average Indian supporter resist the urge to deploy a nonsensical strawman in service of feeding your perpetual victim-complex CHALLENGE (impossible)
Boom 💥
I'm not sure it counts when English people move to a far away land, settle it, peacefully get independence, prosper and THEN 'But muh Colonialisms!'
A lot has been said.
I have to admit, even as an Aussie I was barracking for Stokes … on the Aussie cricket app, mind you. I couldn’t watch it live because I’m too soft. 😂
Yes Australia are the good guys in this instance.
Sought of.
I see opposite. AUSSIEs are open cheaters because they control the umpires. 2008 sydney test still on my mind. Bucknor was plantations lave.
Who cares about good guys and bad guys. JB was the stupid guy, AC was the smart guy and Australia are the winning guys🤣 LMFAO
@@alexwilliams4264 if england did to aussies , aussies will whine whole universe and wanted to change rules and shiet.
Pathetic cheaters. You want to win in non cricketing way in cricket. WTF
You people making sports into steet bully fight. Who can cheat better can win.
Where would you rank this bairstow dismissal vs. the mankad where batsman is tyring to get a run but here no one is trying to get a run ou of it. ... SO worse than Mankad??
Both are in the laws of the game. But yeah this one is way worse than mankad. And I remember these guys were sitting on a fence while talking about mankad. But the Indians have fully supported them in this situation.
Both are the same - stay in your fucking crease or your out. It's that simple. People who try to differentiate outs are insane.
@@mcmoore02but I didn't see the same amount of support for Indians when deepti did the mankad. It shows hypocrisy. Whereas Indians have fully supported Australia in this regard. But that's what you'll get from India, "brutal honesty".
@@Sunny-sc5vq I have always supported mankad. It's great cricket. Anyone saying otherwise is a toffee wanker.
@@mcmoore02 you're an exception. These 2 idiots made a mockery of the incident when it happened.
In my opinion, in this series both countries have failed to respect the laws of cricket. Be it the Australians whining about starc's failed catch attempt or the English whining about bairstow's stumping. Both countries have agreed with the rules when it favoured them. So I've no dog in this race.
The fact that you spent 40 minutes defending it speaks volumes 😂
Fun fact: Texas Aggies hiss to convey their dissatisfaction during the football games, since they are too classy to boo
I could listen to you two talk about the Bairstow dismissal all day. It's therapeutic after all the drivel that's been spouted online the last few days.
I dont understand how running out the striker when he thinks the ball is dead is different to running out the non striker when they know the ball isn't. Everything the Boys are saying here to defend the wicket can be said for the mankad. Both are out and both are morally good.
Agreed 100%. Both are absolutely legitimate.
Anyone else think pez' story about his dad prosecuting, sounded alot like the plot to Hot Fuzz?
We've been brought up with this myth of Chappell's dastardly act with the underarm ball, but even as a kid I struggled to understand why it was such a big deal. If the rules let you bowl underarm, how can you be upset when somebody does it? And then a few ashes back when Broad nicked to slip and didn't walk, the australian media, and even players and coaches, lost their shit and are still going on about it today. But Broad did nothing wrong, it's not his fault the umpire was asleep, or that the Aussies couldn't review (don't get me started on reviews, punishing captains for not being able to correctly guess when an umpire has made the wrong decision is crazy to me).
Is Mankad out?
Of course mankad is out.
Great to see the arguments around "laws", "technical","advantage" by aussies only when it comes to them ..but "spirit" when it comes to Mankading
Appeal should have been revoked ..period. Especially since no warnings were given Baristow..
But problem is with expecting this from Aussies..
@47:47 😂😂😂😂… His cricket BAT
what does he mean by 'red'? stokes hitting 200 red etc
not out
Get Ravi Ashwin on the pod, guys. He's one of the most brainy and forward-thinking cricketers and open-minded, you guys will surely hit it off.
It's frustrating that incidents always seem to end up being journalists' opinions vs. journalists opinions.
I dont know, nor have heard of any English non journo, non cricketer who thinks it's anything other than out and a brainfade.
Very brave when youre back home
Funny how you two reacted to Ashwin running people out versus Carey running Bairstow out. Stinks of hypocrisy from your end too. Just saying.
As an Englishman thoroughly embarrassed by the comically hypocritical reaction to the Bairstow dismissal, I have to say it all absolutely reeks of Brexit.