Many thanks for describing the first years of the brave Wild Weasels. As a co-op engineering student I worked two quarters in 1967-68 at the clone of the S-band SA-2 radar at Eglin AFB that you mentioned. It was in a dome on the USAF portion of Santa Rosa Island across from Fort Walton Beach. I seem to recall it was made by GE partly informed by the SA-2 system captured by the Israelis in the Six Days War. Attached to the rotating antenna was a dish broadcasting fake control messages to the missile to trigger missile-in-flight alarms. -As one of the radar operators I could see how well the jamming worked. During my 1967 quarter there, we could always track through the jamming. During my 1968 time, tracking through jamming was becoming increasingly difficult. I cheated, memorizing rough angles and ranges during the first and dry run that I'd use during the jammed ones. I figured any trick I could use the North Vietnamese could use. They would know the routes. And by the way, the Wild Weasel pilots at the end of their approach loved to buzz our dome. Unlike the actual SA-2 sites, it was visible for miles around. -For a time we also had a GE-built clone of the VHF search radar parked next to us. During a Blackbird flyby, I ran the PPI scope attached to it. Despite getting position reports incoming and outgoing, I never saw it. It was so blasted fast, I got two sweeps to see it inbound and two outbound before it was out of range. -Aviation museums should do more to display the ECM planes and equipment that is a major factor in modern air wars.
@@doc_sav NOW. I am a Former Air Training Command ECM Subject Matter Expert for the F-16 1980-83. and F-15 Maintainer from 1983-1992. Still a lot more/newer information still not able to see the light of day.
@@erloriel there's also Rex's Hangar and Military Aviation History. The former sometimes sources from obscure books in other than English, the latter includes original research from German archives.
@@lifeontheX one of the good things is that it's not AI narration, which is still uncanny valley and difficult to listen to. It's not a trivial amount of narration per video and there is a good rate of video production.
When I was a kid one day an F-105G Wild Weasle was the only 1:72 model I could afford at the shop. Started me down the rabbit hole about this dangerous trade.
The guys that flew the F-100's on these missions were beyond courageous! Not to take anything away from the later F-105 and F-4 Wild Weasel crews but doing this in the MUCH slower F-100 really took nerves of steel!
"You want me to fly in the back of a tiny little jet with a crazy fighter pilot who thinks he's invincible, home in on a SAM site in North Vietnam, and shoot it before it shoots me?? You've gotta be shittiin' me!" ~Jack Donovan, former B-52 EWO who was one of the first weasel EWOs
@@scottl9660 Not by much if any, the F-100 was not exactly known as a tight turner but it was better than the F-105. But I think most guys would trade the rocket ship speed of the F-105 at low levels.
Yeah it is a very hard question for aircraft available at the time. Part of the trouble is the SAMs were a giant threat but AAA accounted for like 80% of all American aircraft shot down. Slow is bad for evading AAA, and the radar guided ones were starting to appear in great numbers. Hanoi alone had more AAA than Nazi Germany had spread out over all Europe at the height of it's power.
I was going to say, YGBSM was missing from this video…and the story behind it. “You gotta be shittin me!” …in response to the mission briefing to fly in toward a SAM site to attack it.
Good job on this one. Not many aviation channels will touch the Vietnam War for some reason. I'd love for you to continue this as a series, tracking the evolution of Wild Weasel to the F-105 and the F-4, and even to the Navy versions (EA-6 and EA-18).
I can't stand the general sentiment towards Vietnam. Every vet I've talked to who went there was supportive of the mission and just complained about DC micromanaging and tying their hands behind their back on everything they did
Certain conflicts will lose you contacts at museums and archives because of the sentiment towards to resolution and politics of the conflicts. This is why a lot of historians stay out of it. The korean war is another major one for example. There is also the monitisation part of it where youtube has a hard stance on politics tying your hands behind your back when it comes to covering the topics. Its silly and petty when you look at it but it is what it is. I mean the current Ukranian-Russian conflict made a lot of folks not cover anything russian due to youtubes stance on the conflict is just silly to penalise the historians.
@angelofwar_7711 Or…. stop playing the game you keep on losing. Really.. the only war the US has won in the last 75 years to a satisfactory post-bellum was Grenada.
Great video. When I worked for Texas Instruments, an engineer related his experiences working on the F-100 Wild Weasels. Ergonomics proved to be important as it was difficult to manipulate the buttons and switches when performing high G maneuvers. Another lesson learned was to ditch the white helmets since the AAA gunners would key on them when tracking the attacking jets. Until the Air Force decided on a new color, they issued camouflage tape to cover the helmets.
For those wanting to know more there is an excellent book called Iron Hand Smashing the Enemy's Air Defences which covers from early SEAD to nearly current SEAD/DEAD... it is well written and an excellent read as well as very informative. Great video as usual.
Smithsonian Air and Space magazine had an awesome article on this back in the early 2010's. They even had the stories on their opponents: the North Vietnamese SA2 operators.
Love the channel, and this instalment really hooked me , as I've always had an interest in SEAD aircraft, including a 1/32 F-100F Weasel . YGTOSH - as Weasel crews are reputed to have said when being briefed on the missions
The weasel wasn't chosen as the motto animal for it's fierceness, it was chosen because weasels hunt snakes, i.e. they attack things that can attack them. Hence the analogy with SAM site attackers.
Thank you for explaining that the original Wild Weasel crews weren't told what the job would be until AFTER they had volunteered. I think this explains the origin of the motto "YGBSM" that is still seen on Wild Weasel patches to this day. I imagine this was the most common response when their new assignment was revealed to them!
Measurement of the effectiveness of the SA2 should take into account the aircraft that had to jettison their bombs, when attacked by a SA2, and were then forced to a low levels where they were within range of more AA guns.
This missed the most important statistics of the Wild Weasel I, After 45 days of operations against North Vietnamese targets, the 354th had one airplane left (Of seven Wild Weasel Is built) and of the 16 volunteer aircrew members, four had been killed, three wounded, two captured, and another two quit.
One thing I learned from this video is to give more weight and consideration to the idea of "rough & ready". The concept, illustrated at 15:43 , seems much broader and deeper than I'd thought after a lifetime of hearing the cliche'. Thank You!
Fascinating information. I once worked with an instructor who, I found out flew Wild Weasel missions. Of our group, he was stoic, quiet, and had an ironic sense of humor. Good video - thanks.
17:13 in fact, famously one of the volunteers was supposed to have exclaimed in the middle of the briefing "You gotta be shitting me!" Which became a motto of sorts for the Wild Weasel community.
ive stood next to an sa2 launcher once. it is a huge system. the rocket wasnt as fast as the sa3 and definitely not ass manuverable . some pilots describe getting chased by it as getting a phone pole chasing you. but it did take down a lot of fighters in its day..
This is an excellent video explaining the mission that would eventually become SEAD, Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses. The data and lessons learned during the Wild Weasel missions would be used to develop the aircraft I worked on, the EA-6B Prowler.
Love the narration by the Brit... about the use of the weasel art- 'development of the insignia provided a significant for the ATI graphics department, none of whom had ever seen one' (sic) Laughing out Loud !
In the Air Force, I was an Electronic Warfare technician. I worked on the AN/APR-25/26 system, as well as the QRC-160 jamming pods like the one at 7:15. Our motto was "ECM - live with it, die without it."
Ahem.. Sir, I must protest. Weasels and Ferret's are not rodents, they are Mustelids, of which the Wolverine is also a family member. But you probably knew that, and were fishing for Ferret owners, like I.
My Daddy was an aircraft mechanic in the USAF. We were with him in 1968-70 in Libya. Khadafy took over while we were there. There were F-100s on the flightline and I took to drawing them as a 4th and 5th grade artist. They were so sleek and shapely! Anyway, my school class had pen pals we corresponded with. They wrote us back and said, have that kid that draws the planes send more!
I really enjoyed watching this video and learning a significant amount of information. Your videos are exceptional and I learn something whilst watching each one. Excellent work sir, thank you! Cheers from 🇺🇸
BlueBells ring, are you listenin'? The SA-2's, they're a-bristlin' They're comin' for you, In ones and in twos, You're flying through a Missile Wonderland.
Wild Weasel, Wild Weasel they call me by name, I fly over Thud Ridge and I play the great game. I fly over the mountains and dodge around the hills, I dodge all the missiles and take all the kills.
@@stickiedmin6508Close but not quite a cigar - new-build Navy F4 variants were the A, B and J. USAF production variants were C, D and E. I understand the F4G Wild Weasels were conversions of F4E airframes.
@@Ant1815 read the book Thud Ridge. That will make your blood boil and it was written in 1969! I had always assumed it was written years AFTER the Vietnam war. It was written DURING the war! That blew my mind after reading it!
You were never going to win…. PERIOD! Just like those of us in 2002 knew you’d never win Iraq or Afghanistan. Just look at Israel going all out in Gaza and Lebanon. Any day now… right? Lulz.
There is actually a free Guideline simulator one can download on the internet. Its the very same one Sa2 Sam operators used to train on ! I tried it one time. It's the real deal.
@@rambie2131 Just Google for "SAM simulator" - it'll take you right to it. Breal's information is a little out of date, the software simulates many more Soviet / Warsaw Pact systems than just the SA-2. Also it's the *_manuals_* used by the software's author (and included with the download) that are authentic. The simulator was only written within the last decade or so. There's no way any SAM crew ever used it as part of their training. Computers capable of running it simply didn't exist back then. It's still absolutely fascinating however. Well worth downloading.
In American vernacular, a “weasel” is a person who is simultaneously dangerous, untrustworthy, and cowardly. But of course, Americans know the real weasel, the animal, to be cunning and fierce. So “wild weasel” has a bit of irony to it. It’s kind of cool and witty. I know, the British can’t wrap their heads around Americans being cool and witty, but… there it is! In your face Limeys! 😀 BTW what an awesome channel. More BTW, where’s that Su-15 video?
The “weasel” in “Wild Weasel” come from the WW2 USAAF “Ferrets” which flew B-17’s and B-24’s loaded with ECM gear in support of bomber raids. It was felt that calling the program “Ferret” would give what it was away, so they decided to use Weasel instead since weasels and ferrets are in the same family and it would show the lineage to the WW2 Ferrets to the people who knew.
Great alongside of reading First In, Last Out which has a chapter by a former ATI engineer and company exec Dr John L Grigsby, discussing the development of each WW generation, testing, in-country support etc. Also numerous hair raising stories from the nose gunners and bears.
Dad flew with 433rd out of Uban. He said that they looked like flying telephone poles. If you could spot them you could avoid them. It's one they you don't see that gets you.
1:11 Probably one of the most interesting parts of this story. A guy that flew in two two very different wars, in two very different places, and surviving time as a POW in both.
According to ROE, sites under construction could not be attacked. At times, they were off-limits until they actually engaged US aircraft. Pilots reported flying over sites that were, to all appearances, fully functional; but like MiGs on the ramp, they could not be attacked because they were 'not a threat'. These rules were imposed and lifted capriciously, according to the political whims of the White House.
Thats amazing that you mention that its NOT the same Applied Technology. I work in the printed electronics industry and thats immediately where my mind went!
Another tremendous presentation! Thanks for the time you put into making a quality and informative video! I'm hoping/wondering if you'll continue this with the F-105G sometime...?
Brave men flying AT those hunting them in an aircraft already being pushed to the limits inside an arena it was not designed to fight in. Look forward to the complete story of the Wild Weasels.😮👍🏻
One of the darkest secrets of the Wild Weasel missions is that no evidence exists that the missiles they used were effective. So many SAM guidance radar units were missed, insufficiently damaged to disable hem, or shut-down too early when the enemy realized they were under attack that Wild Weasel strike packages, that SOP for these missions was to time-on-target a huge load of cluster bombs on the guidance radar. Because the cluster munitions shredded everything, it was impossible to verify any damage caused by anti-radiation missiles. This isn't something you have to dig-through endless heaps of recently-declassified documents to learn; it was in an episode of Discovery Wings in the 1990s.
Sir, the channel name is "not a pound for air to ground"; I do believe surface to air missiles are located on the ground. Otherwise, a most informative digest. Regards
I have been interested in Wild Weasels since i got a nice little F-105G model ten years ago. Good topic. The only book i ever got ahold of until now was pretty mediocre and full of a lot of sensational or incorrect stuff, if i remember correctly.
Great video. The unpreparedness of the USAF to tackle a Soviet Union-provided ADGE almost defies belief. Quite a contrast when you consider how good the allies were at the game in 1945. Things are much better today, but I wonder if the IDF is now the master of the art.
Unlikely, the IDF rarely has to deal with intense anti-air as their opponents are anything but well-funded. The US is obviously the king at this game with a lot of experience in SEAD and the budget to to do the training. The war in Ukraine is providing them excellent information on the capabilities of current Russian systems.
@@Justanotherconsumer Not well funded? How many rockets have Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis, and Iran fired at Israel in the last year alone? You must be too young to remember the 1973 Yom Kippur war, when Egyptian SAMs caused unanticipated losses of Israel aircraft
@@reonthornton685 You don't have to have the same type of sophisticated equipment as the IDF to qualify as being "well funded". If HAMAS and Hezbollah are not well-funded why is the IDF still trying to subdue them after a year at war? And as I said, you may be too young to remember the 1973 war in which a sophisticated Egyptian air defense network inflicted significant losses of IAF aircraft.
@jimroberts3009 I think that Mustelidae are four-legged arseholes as a general trait. The only exception I can think of is the ferret. The make great pets once their scent glands are removed. However, there could be some selective breeding at work resulting in a domestication, similar to dogs vis a vis wolves. Modern ferrets were bred to catch chinchillas in their burrows, something that ferrets would do naturally. The selective breeding only produced a version which was more well disposed towards humans.
Volunteers: "what kind of mission is it?" Command: "Basically a suicide mission." The fact the air crews weren't deterred, speaks volumes about their appreciation for command being honest with them for once.
Interesting point about the cultural connotations of "weasel" - I'm Scottish, so I took weasel to mean sneaky, and so was an apt name because the Wild Weasels sneak around the radar!
Several of these guys reenlisted for additional tours in Vietnam, even though it was an absolutely insane job, because they wanted to keep people from getting shot down.
The point was that the USSR was not the enemy, and the Johnson Administration was fearful of any action that might make make it the enemy and turn a minor regional conflict into a major superpower conflict. This was not a new concept. Before Germany declared war on the U.S. in December 1941 it did not conduct unrestricted warfare against all U.S. ships supplying England, in order to keep the U.S. out of that war. That changed when Hitler declared the U.S. to be an enemy on December 11th.
@gort8203 true, but, I guess that makes the missiles launched by those SA5s not hostile either. You see, the USSR specifically delivered them to inflict harm on US aircraft, not attacking the sites was silly.
@@katamarankatamaranovich9986 Obviously people can disagree as to whether these sites should have been attacked, as many did at the time. Many years later even more people can disagree from the comfort of hindsight and no responsibly for avoiding escalation of what supposed to be a limited war, not a no-holds-barred war. I also think they should have attacked the sites, but I can't say I would have made that decision if I'd been in LBJ's chair at the time. The point was the concern was not about 'offending the enemy' -- which is a sarcastic throw-away line in the video -- it was about fear of killing non-enemy personnel on site in an advisory capacity, out of fear of possibly forcing undesired consequences. We've now had had a lot of time to study that war, which didn't look so simple back then. (BTW, they were SA-2s, not SA-5s.)
@gort8203 I am convinced that escalation management is a fundamentally flawed concept that loses wars. If you let your oponent escalate and take the initiative, set the rules, you will lose eventually, as simple as that. By delivering those missiles Soviets already escalated enough for those sites to be legitimate targets.
Many thanks for describing the first years of the brave Wild Weasels. As a co-op engineering student I worked two quarters in 1967-68 at the clone of the S-band SA-2 radar at Eglin AFB that you mentioned. It was in a dome on the USAF portion of Santa Rosa Island across from Fort Walton Beach. I seem to recall it was made by GE partly informed by the SA-2 system captured by the Israelis in the Six Days War. Attached to the rotating antenna was a dish broadcasting fake control messages to the missile to trigger missile-in-flight alarms.
-As one of the radar operators I could see how well the jamming worked. During my 1967 quarter there, we could always track through the jamming. During my 1968 time, tracking through jamming was becoming increasingly difficult. I cheated, memorizing rough angles and ranges during the first and dry run that I'd use during the jammed ones. I figured any trick I could use the North Vietnamese could use. They would know the routes. And by the way, the Wild Weasel pilots at the end of their approach loved to buzz our dome. Unlike the actual SA-2 sites, it was visible for miles around.
-For a time we also had a GE-built clone of the VHF search radar parked next to us. During a Blackbird flyby, I ran the PPI scope attached to it. Despite getting position reports incoming and outgoing, I never saw it. It was so blasted fast, I got two sweeps to see it inbound and two outbound before it was out of range.
-Aviation museums should do more to display the ECM planes and equipment that is a major factor in modern air wars.
Very interesting and good information.
What's also interesting is how the Soviets/Russians still haven't put major emphasis on SEAD missions.
Thanks for the insight to history. You're absolutely right, more attention should be given
How long was it before you could talk about all that stuff?
@@doc_sav NOW. I am a Former Air Training Command ECM Subject Matter Expert for the F-16 1980-83. and F-15 Maintainer from 1983-1992. Still a lot more/newer information still not able to see the light of day.
@@complexblackness Western forces use fewer SAM systems, except on ships, so there is less need for a dedicated SEAD mission set.
This is without a doubt one of the two best aviation channels on youtube.
The other one being either Greg's or IHYLS
I was gonna say include flight dojo
@@erloriel there's also Rex's Hangar and Military Aviation History. The former sometimes sources from obscure books in other than English, the latter includes original research from German archives.
Agree, the other one may be Greg, Paper Skies or Ed Nash?
@@lifeontheX one of the good things is that it's not AI narration, which is still uncanny valley and difficult to listen to. It's not a trivial amount of narration per video and there is a good rate of video production.
When I was a kid one day an F-105G Wild Weasle was the only 1:72 model I could afford at the shop.
Started me down the rabbit hole about this dangerous trade.
I had one too.
Cynically, it was referred to as the 'Thud', because of the sound it made when it crashed at high speed after being hit by a flying telephone pole.
I collect diecast models (pre built), so it’s not as nice as yours, but damn do I love my hobby master f-105g
The guys that flew the F-100's on these missions were beyond courageous! Not to take anything away from the later F-105 and F-4 Wild Weasel crews but doing this in the MUCH slower F-100 really took nerves of steel!
"You want me to fly in the back of a tiny little jet with a crazy fighter pilot who thinks he's invincible, home in on a SAM site in North Vietnam, and shoot it before it shoots me?? You've gotta be shittiin' me!"
~Jack Donovan, former B-52 EWO who was one of the first weasel EWOs
You say much slower, I hear smaller turning radius
@@scottl9660 Not by much if any, the F-100 was not exactly known as a tight turner but it was better than the F-105. But I think most guys would trade the rocket ship speed of the F-105 at low levels.
It Was? Which served in the Role longer?@edwardpate6128
Yeah it is a very hard question for aircraft available at the time. Part of the trouble is the SAMs were a giant threat but AAA accounted for like 80% of all American aircraft shot down. Slow is bad for evading AAA, and the radar guided ones were starting to appear in great numbers. Hanoi alone had more AAA than Nazi Germany had spread out over all Europe at the height of it's power.
YGBSM! My Uncle was one of the first F-105G Wild Weasel Wizzos. He went on to the F-4G, survived the war and is still around.
I was going to say, YGBSM was missing from this video…and the story behind it. “You gotta be shittin me!” …in response to the mission briefing to fly in toward a SAM site to attack it.
Good job on this one. Not many aviation channels will touch the Vietnam War for some reason. I'd love for you to continue this as a series, tracking the evolution of Wild Weasel to the F-105 and the F-4, and even to the Navy versions (EA-6 and EA-18).
Me too.
I can't stand the general sentiment towards Vietnam.
Every vet I've talked to who went there was supportive of the mission and just complained about DC micromanaging and tying their hands behind their back on everything they did
Certain conflicts will lose you contacts at museums and archives because of the sentiment towards to resolution and politics of the conflicts.
This is why a lot of historians stay out of it.
The korean war is another major one for example.
There is also the monitisation part of it where youtube has a hard stance on politics tying your hands behind your back when it comes to covering the topics.
Its silly and petty when you look at it but it is what it is.
I mean the current Ukranian-Russian conflict made a lot of folks not cover anything russian due to youtubes stance on the conflict is just silly to penalise the historians.
The beginning of the USAFs thinking the answer to paper is more technologically advanced rocks
Ouch! 😂
Well, what would you do if all you get are rocks anyway?
@@Pikilloification The Marines would eat them
More like switching to scisor because they're more advanced and expensive but hey maybe we should return to crossbows with that kind of thinking
@angelofwar_7711
Or…. stop playing the game you keep on losing.
Really.. the only war the US has won in the last 75 years to a satisfactory post-bellum was Grenada.
You are such an under appreciated channel.
Great video. When I worked for Texas Instruments, an engineer related his experiences working on the F-100 Wild Weasels. Ergonomics proved to be important as it was difficult to manipulate the buttons and switches when performing high G maneuvers. Another lesson learned was to ditch the white helmets since the AAA gunners would key on them when tracking the attacking jets. Until the Air Force decided on a new color, they issued camouflage tape to cover the helmets.
Yeah Boyi! Love this channel, if you were a South African we'd call you: "Not a Rand for air to grand"! Thanks for the content buddy.
Nie n rand vir lug tot grond nie
@@C4Cole05 Glad nie
Is the Rand a unit of weight?
@@neiloflongbeck5705 Nope, currency, the good old weight pound vs currency pound strikes yet again
@@neiloflongbeck5705 with our current economic status....sure it is!
This is such a good historical lesson. How much ingenuity and invention is behind the purely military application!
For those wanting to know more there is an excellent book called Iron Hand Smashing the Enemy's Air Defences which covers from early SEAD to nearly current SEAD/DEAD... it is well written and an excellent read as well as very informative. Great video as usual.
Smithsonian Air and Space magazine had an awesome article on this back in the early 2010's. They even had the stories on their opponents: the North Vietnamese SA2 operators.
Love the channel, and this instalment really hooked me , as I've always had an interest in SEAD aircraft, including a 1/32 F-100F Weasel .
YGTOSH - as Weasel crews are reputed to have said when being briefed on the missions
Surely YGTBSM.
What does YGTOSH mean? My understanding was that it’s YGBSM which stands for “You Gotta be Shitting me”
@@federicoguinand9451 OOPS! - you got me !
The weasel wasn't chosen as the motto animal for it's fierceness, it was chosen because weasels hunt snakes, i.e. they attack things that can attack them. Hence the analogy with SAM site attackers.
Thank you for explaining that the original Wild Weasel crews weren't told what the job would be until AFTER they had volunteered. I think this explains the origin of the motto "YGBSM" that is still seen on Wild Weasel patches to this day. I imagine this was the most common response when their new assignment was revealed to them!
You've Got to Be Shitting Me, patch is a classic.
Similar vibes as the tunnel rats' motto _"Non Gratum Anus Rodentum"_
I remember seeing the patch in the USAF Museum and instantly knew what it meant, cause I was thinking the same thing.
Measurement of the effectiveness of the SA2 should take into account the aircraft that had to jettison their bombs, when attacked by a SA2, and were then forced to a low levels where they were within range of more AA guns.
This missed the most important statistics of the Wild Weasel I, After 45 days of operations against North Vietnamese targets, the 354th had one airplane left (Of seven Wild Weasel Is built) and of the 16 volunteer aircrew members, four had been killed, three wounded, two captured, and another two quit.
This era of aviation warfare fascinates me. It was the true leading edge of electronic warfare. I've probably read a dozen plus books on it
One thing I learned from this video is to give more weight and consideration to the idea of "rough & ready". The concept, illustrated at 15:43 , seems much broader and deeper than I'd thought after a lifetime of hearing the cliche'. Thank You!
Fascinating information. I once worked with an instructor who, I found out flew Wild Weasel missions.
Of our group, he was stoic, quiet, and had an ironic sense of humor. Good video - thanks.
The courage of Weasel crews is amazing.
17:13 in fact, famously one of the volunteers was supposed to have exclaimed in the middle of the briefing "You gotta be shitting me!" Which became a motto of sorts for the Wild Weasel community.
Wild weasels are one of my favorite topics in aviation. Thank you for the video I enjoyed it very much.
ive stood next to an sa2 launcher once. it is a huge system. the rocket wasnt as fast as the sa3 and definitely not ass manuverable . some pilots describe getting chased by it as getting a phone pole chasing you. but it did take down a lot of fighters in its day..
Great video as always. I look forward to every video coming from you
This is an excellent video explaining the mission that would eventually become SEAD, Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses. The data and lessons learned during the Wild Weasel missions would be used to develop the aircraft I worked on, the EA-6B Prowler.
Great little touch at 10’50” ‘The project needed a codename for secrecy and for cool points’ 😃👍
Comprehensive. Thank you.
Love the narration by the Brit... about the use of the weasel art- 'development of the insignia provided a significant for the ATI graphics department, none of whom had ever seen one' (sic)
Laughing out Loud !
In the Air Force, I was an Electronic Warfare technician. I worked on the AN/APR-25/26 system, as well as the QRC-160 jamming pods like the one at 7:15. Our motto was "ECM - live with it, die without it."
Always love learning about weasels!
Ahem.. Sir, I must protest.
Weasels and Ferret's are not rodents, they are Mustelids, of which the Wolverine is also a family member.
But you probably knew that, and were fishing for Ferret owners, like I.
Is the weasel same with the moongose...?
I believe the first SAM hunters were Navy Shrike-armed A-4 "Iron Hand" flights.
I love the F-100 looks. My first viewing was in 1966. I was only 7 years old and the plane was huge to me.
My Daddy was an aircraft mechanic in the USAF. We were with him in 1968-70 in Libya. Khadafy took over while we were there.
There were F-100s on the flightline and I took to drawing them as a 4th and 5th grade artist. They were so sleek and shapely!
Anyway, my school class had pen pals we corresponded with. They wrote us back and said, have that kid that draws the planes send more!
@@warnerchandler9826 hope you kept the drawings
I really enjoyed watching this video and learning a significant amount of information. Your videos are exceptional and I learn something whilst watching each one. Excellent work sir, thank you!
Cheers from 🇺🇸
BlueBells ring, are you listenin'?
The SA-2's, they're a-bristlin'
They're comin' for you,
In ones and in twos,
You're flying through a Missile Wonderland.
Rather listen to this in fall or winter than... her...
Wild Weasel, Wild Weasel they call me by name, I fly over Thud Ridge and I play the great game. I fly over the mountains and dodge around the hills, I dodge all the missiles and take all the kills.
Thank you. Ex Rapier SAM NCO of the Swiss Air Force here. These things worried me
My father worked at Raytheon in the 60s. 70s. They were involved with many ECM projects very hush hush😊
"re-gifting the missiles" - nearly an actual ROTFL moment here, brilliant phrasing.
Fascinating stuff! I'm very impressed by your channel and I think that you're exceeding Rex in many ways.
I love how the aircraft type improved over time for the USAF, from F-100, a mid 50s fighter, then to the Thud G variant and eventually the faster F-4C
Wasn't the F-4C a USN aircraft? Did you mean the F-4G?
@@stickiedmin6508Close but not quite a cigar - new-build Navy F4 variants were the A, B and J. USAF production variants were C, D and E. I understand the F4G Wild Weasels were conversions of F4E airframes.
@@neilturner6749
You're right. My mistake.
Must have been the lack of a gun that threw me.
Thuds G variant was faster than any F-4
@@stickiedmin6508 F4G was a post war SEAD Variant of the USAF Phantom but an F-4C wild weasel did see use in Vietnam
Thanks for the video. Looking forward to the next episode.
They were still flying F-105s in the early 80s when I was in the Air Force. Surprised the heck out of me.
In the US, the connotations of "weasel" include "sneaky" and "treacherous" in addition to "fierce". It's a fitting name, I think.
The detail in this video is astounding.
Finally, I get a presentation that is new to me. Thank you, please do more like this.
Robert McNamara sure did everything he could to cause us to lose the Vietnam war...
The more I find out about the vientam war the more that I'm convinced that the ultimate aim was to just keep the war going for as long as possible.
@@Ant1815 read the book Thud Ridge. That will make your blood boil and it was written in 1969!
I had always assumed it was written years AFTER the Vietnam war. It was written DURING the war! That blew my mind after reading it!
LBJ wasn't much help, either.
@@Ant1815which actually makes a twisted amount of sense - draw out resources and keep attention in SE Asia to avoid a conflict in Europe.
You were never going to win….
PERIOD!
Just like those of us in 2002 knew you’d never win Iraq or Afghanistan.
Just look at Israel going all out in Gaza and Lebanon. Any day now… right? Lulz.
Fantastic overview - thank-you!
Thx again for a great video!
There is actually a free Guideline simulator one can download on the internet. Its the very same one Sa2 Sam operators used to train on ! I tried it one time. It's the real deal.
What is it called?
@@rambie2131
Just Google for "SAM simulator" - it'll take you right to it.
Breal's information is a little out of date, the software simulates many more Soviet / Warsaw Pact systems than just the SA-2.
Also it's the *_manuals_* used by the software's author (and included with the download) that are authentic. The simulator was only written within the last decade or so. There's no way any SAM crew ever used it as part of their training. Computers capable of running it simply didn't exist back then.
It's still absolutely fascinating however. Well worth downloading.
@@rambie2131 Sa-2 simulator I believe.
A forced three day layover in Hawaii sounds horrible
Sounds expensive
Viper Pilot by Dan Hampton is a great autobiography of his time as a Wild Weasel in the F-16.
his book on this subject “Hunter Killers” is a good one too
Also Dan Hampton's The Hunter Killers is an excellent read.
It feels like at least one pound was spared for Air to Ground on this one... Not that I mind.
In American vernacular, a “weasel” is a person who is simultaneously dangerous, untrustworthy, and cowardly. But of course, Americans know the real weasel, the animal, to be cunning and fierce. So “wild weasel” has a bit of irony to it. It’s kind of cool and witty. I know, the British can’t wrap their heads around Americans being cool and witty, but… there it is! In your face Limeys! 😀 BTW what an awesome channel. More BTW, where’s that Su-15 video?
The “weasel” in “Wild Weasel” come from the WW2 USAAF “Ferrets” which flew B-17’s and B-24’s loaded with ECM gear in support of bomber raids. It was felt that calling the program “Ferret” would give what it was away, so they decided to use Weasel instead since weasels and ferrets are in the same family and it would show the lineage to the WW2 Ferrets to the people who knew.
Great alongside of reading First In, Last Out which has a chapter by a former ATI engineer and company exec Dr John L Grigsby, discussing the development of each WW generation, testing, in-country support etc. Also numerous hair raising stories from the nose gunners and bears.
Dad flew with 433rd out of Uban. He said that they looked like flying telephone poles. If you could spot them you could avoid them. It's one they you don't see that gets you.
I always thought the F100 was quite a neat looking plane ... Never gets the love ...but it did it's job without much fuss and glamour
Thanks for posting
1:11 Probably one of the most interesting parts of this story. A guy that flew in two two very different wars, in two very different places, and surviving time as a POW in both.
WOW what a GREAT channel! Fantastic narration and content.. Reminds me of Discovery Wings Channel!!!
My father was on the Hawk missile system from 1975-78.
What did Sam do to piss off the Air Force so much that they decided to hunt him?
He cried “Uncle” at the wrong time.
And why does Usaf own so many aircraft when he can only fly 1 at a time?
According to ROE, sites under construction could not be attacked. At times, they were off-limits until they actually engaged US aircraft. Pilots reported flying over sites that were, to all appearances, fully functional; but like MiGs on the ramp, they could not be attacked because they were 'not a threat'.
These rules were imposed and lifted capriciously, according to the political whims of the White House.
Thats amazing that you mention that its NOT the same Applied Technology. I work in the printed electronics industry and thats immediately where my mind went!
Another tremendous presentation! Thanks for the time you put into making a quality and informative video! I'm hoping/wondering if you'll continue this with the F-105G sometime...?
aside from the decoy sites, Johnson/McNamara actually released the pre-strike info to the press. well done . Dane
Super pic of that F-100.
Excellent!! Thank you!
The F-100s had to have the ejection seats and cockpits widened to accommodate the crewman’s balls.
Brave men flying AT those hunting them in an aircraft already being pushed to the limits inside an arena it was not designed to fight in.
Look forward to the complete story of the Wild Weasels.😮👍🏻
Excellent video.
Although named Not a pound for Air to Ground, I would appreciate if you can do videos on helicopters or you can make new channel for it.
One of the darkest secrets of the Wild Weasel missions is that no evidence exists that the missiles they used were effective. So many SAM guidance radar units were missed, insufficiently damaged to disable hem, or shut-down too early when the enemy realized they were under attack that Wild Weasel strike packages, that SOP for these missions was to time-on-target a huge load of cluster bombs on the guidance radar. Because the cluster munitions shredded everything, it was impossible to verify any damage caused by anti-radiation missiles.
This isn't something you have to dig-through endless heaps of recently-declassified documents to learn; it was in an episode of Discovery Wings in the 1990s.
So why are SEAD operations became successful then
@@BarryAllen__1A23 Because the ARM attacks are followed-up by cluster bomb attacks.
Yesss new video! 😊
Sir, the channel name is "not a pound for air to ground"; I do believe surface to air missiles are located on the ground. Otherwise, a most informative digest. Regards
It’s a channel title. I think we all know the point of the title
It's "a pound for ground to air" via superthanks
The channel name refers to a rather famous fight over fighter design specifications in the years leading up to the F-15 Eagle.
I have been interested in Wild Weasels since i got a nice little F-105G model ten years ago. Good topic. The only book i ever got ahold of until now was pretty mediocre and full of a lot of sensational or incorrect stuff, if i remember correctly.
Good show as always.
Great video.
The unpreparedness of the USAF to tackle a Soviet Union-provided ADGE almost defies belief. Quite a contrast when you consider how good the allies were at the game in 1945. Things are much better today, but I wonder if the IDF is now the master of the art.
Unlikely, the IDF rarely has to deal with intense anti-air as their opponents are anything but well-funded.
The US is obviously the king at this game with a lot of experience in SEAD and the budget to to do the training. The war in Ukraine is providing them excellent information on the capabilities of current Russian systems.
Technology always runs ahead of tactics.
@@Justanotherconsumer
Not well funded? How many rockets have Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis, and Iran fired at Israel in the last year alone?
You must be too young to remember the 1973 Yom Kippur war, when Egyptian SAMs caused unanticipated losses of Israel aircraft
@@gort8203 Compared to the equipment the IDF is using, yeah.
Rockets are cheap. Guided bombs are significantly less so.
@@reonthornton685 You don't have to have the same type of sophisticated equipment as the IDF to qualify as being "well funded". If HAMAS and Hezbollah are not well-funded why is the IDF still trying to subdue them after a year at war?
And as I said, you may be too young to remember the 1973 war in which a sophisticated Egyptian air defense network inflicted significant losses of IAF aircraft.
Looking forward to additional videos
I agree with @yes-head - It would be interesting to see how the Wild Weasel developed through the Thuds, the Phantoms and the Intruders.
Weasel. A mustelid, not a rodent, but I suspect that was known, and just spoken to get a rise.
Can't go wrong with Mustelids...definitely good hunters.
The Wolverine, the biggest Mustelld, is a mean bugger!
@@jimroberts3009 I believe that the Giant Otter is larger. Also nasty bastards.
@Fred_Lougee * That's very true, what I meant was it's the largest of the Marten branch of the Mustelids.
@jimroberts3009 I think that Mustelidae are four-legged arseholes as a general trait. The only exception I can think of is the ferret. The make great pets once their scent glands are removed. However, there could be some selective breeding at work resulting in a domestication, similar to dogs vis a vis wolves. Modern ferrets were bred to catch chinchillas in their burrows, something that ferrets would do naturally. The selective breeding only produced a version which was more well disposed towards humans.
Actually, in the US the weasel is considered a lowly varmint or rodent. Definitely, not a fearsome animal, lol.
Weasels punch way above their weight, they’re a tough, and fierce little predator.
@@Bagledog5000 Some farmers even have them to hunt other rodents
These, and their crews were different.
Volunteers: "what kind of mission is it?"
Command: "Basically a suicide mission."
The fact the air crews weren't deterred, speaks volumes about their appreciation for command being honest with them for once.
John Pitchford. I grew up in his home town.
Small note - SA2 was use in China prior to shoot down high flying recon planes.
"Gifting" and then "Re-gifting." Crikey! That's damned clever!
How did the American military manage to fight at all with their hands tied behind their backs whilst wearing blindfolds?
Incredibly courageous and innovative men...
Rules of Engagement.
They had the patience of Brits.
Hey!! Ironhands my thing!
Interesting point about the cultural connotations of "weasel" - I'm Scottish, so I took weasel to mean sneaky, and so was an apt name because the Wild Weasels sneak around the radar!
11:14 Weasels are really much cuter than that!
No they not. They scary and mean and weaselly
Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses (SEAD) is a persistent predicate to tactical attack.
The kinetic element of Israel's Iron Dome is supplemented by an integrated / multi-spectrum (RADAR, LIDAR, Infrared, Sonic, et al) sensor network.
Several of these guys reenlisted for additional tours in Vietnam, even though it was an absolutely insane job, because they wanted to keep people from getting shot down.
7:19 good photo
F 105 F. G best of the WWs.
4:54 concerns about offending your enemy in a war. some things never change, huh
The point was that the USSR was not the enemy, and the Johnson Administration was fearful of any action that might make make it the enemy and turn a minor regional conflict into a major superpower conflict.
This was not a new concept. Before Germany declared war on the U.S. in December 1941 it did not conduct unrestricted warfare against all U.S. ships supplying England, in order to keep the U.S. out of that war. That changed when Hitler declared the U.S. to be an enemy on December 11th.
@gort8203 true, but, I guess that makes the missiles launched by those SA5s not hostile either. You see, the USSR specifically delivered them to inflict harm on US aircraft, not attacking the sites was silly.
@@katamarankatamaranovich9986 Obviously people can disagree as to whether these sites should have been attacked, as many did at the time. Many years later even more people can disagree from the comfort of hindsight and no responsibly for avoiding escalation of what supposed to be a limited war, not a no-holds-barred war. I also think they should have attacked the sites, but I can't say I would have made that decision if I'd been in LBJ's chair at the time.
The point was the concern was not about 'offending the enemy' -- which is a sarcastic throw-away line in the video -- it was about fear of killing non-enemy personnel on site in an advisory capacity, out of fear of possibly forcing undesired consequences. We've now had had a lot of time to study that war, which didn't look so simple back then. (BTW, they were SA-2s, not SA-5s.)
@gort8203 I am convinced that escalation management is a fundamentally flawed concept that loses wars. If you let your oponent escalate and take the initiative, set the rules, you will lose eventually, as simple as that. By delivering those missiles Soviets already escalated enough for those sites to be legitimate targets.
You had zero business being there, having regrets about not purposely exploiting any opportunity to piss off nuclear power is peak absurdity.
You are an excellent narrator, you could consider doing narration work for others, for a cost of course.
I agree. Most YT clips use AI or over-cheerful Americans
When one was shot down, did they say "Pop goes the weasel!"?
LBJ and Robert strange McNamara were the best generals the North Vietnamese had!