What on earth is this? - WRC’s terrible new points system
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- Опубликовано: 11 янв 2024
- Last month, the FIA announced, via it's release of the 2024 sporting regulations, that WRC will be having a new points system. And it's safe to say, that people are not happy. In my opinion, it's the worst ever points system I've seen implemented in any series, and in this video, I go through that points system, and explain why it will do more harm to the sport, than help it.
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WRC decider meeting be like:
Hmmm, what should we do to make the sport more popular again?
Introduce a rule set with cheaper but not less spectacular cars, so more manufacturers will join?
Make deals with TV and streaming, so more people will watch WRC?
Maybe advertise just more?
Or replace our tried and tested point system with an overly complicated one, which maybe even won't reward success in some cases? This is it.
Ahh, so they chose to take the NASCAR Route 😂
@@ianwhite2264 Exactly! I had not watched NASCAR since I was a kid, and tried to get back into it because my father is a big fan. I just can't. I have no idea what's going on and they use all these sports analogies and stuff. It's awful!
The current Rally1 cars and regs already heavily limit who can join, as the 1.6L I4 street car based engine requriement rules out most manufacturers including Subaru. Practically no one makes turbo 1.6L I4's ATM with 2L ones being preferred everywhere and Subaru can't use their boxer engines not only because of the I4 requirement, but also because they wouldn't work with the transverse 4WD system. The chassis being identical for all cars makes it far more boring from a technical aspect as well and essentially made the GR Yaris pointless as it was designed to be a lower roofline Yaris to build a Rally1 car off of. At least we got a cool homologation special but at the end of it's production run another one isn't happening. Just a depressing state of affairs for the series.
@@stuntvistYes it seems they will switch to Rally2 but that is also highly restricted in frustrating ways.
and wrc+ or rallytv bought erc rights too...
erc was amazing with their live commentary streams now its basically dead
i am not gonna pay for rallytv if its the same as wrc+.
very bad quality with connection dropping all the time, even the highlights do not have proper footage taken directly from cars but just the plane satelliate broadcasted muddy freezy image really disgusting
I don't understand why they didn't go the JWRC route and just award 1 point per stage win, it seems a way better solution to me and extremely simple and easy to understand. I hope they abandon it after Monte when hopefully the FIA comes to their senses and realizes how stupid this is.
I had thought of that system but then the rallies wouldn't be equal, as they have different number of stages. They'd have to adjust that, as well.
@@ikr9358 Why? No need for all the rallies to be equal. Hell, with the majority of the grid only being part time, it would actually be better for them. You can tactically skip the rallies with the least stages, and potentially still compete for the championship on a part time schedule, which again, most of them are on.
@@CharlesFreckBut wouldn‘t that make Monte Carlo and Safari worth less than most rallies?
@eggselent9814 they're worth the length. Yes, less overall points for the weekend, bur you'll still want to win Monte Carlo regardless. It's still points
@@ikr9358 I don't think the length would really matter since any driver competing would have the same amount of opportunities to score points as long as they don't crash out. However I just watched a lengthy interview with Elfyn Evans on Dirtfish and he suggested a point per stage on Sunday before the power stage which would stay the same. Or to give everyone a fresh set of tires for the power stage so they wouldn't have to worry about saving tires. I highly recommend watching the interview though he made some really good points about the new system and the issues it will likely cause.
When WRC promoter acquired right for World Rallycross and proceeded to butcher it, i thought they just hated rallycross or something. Now it looks like they just hate motorsports.
You go eletric you go broke, I wachted rallycross in portugal with a friend that saw years earlier when cars where all combustion, he said it was spetacular, races all morning non stop, no boring time between races and stands are full. But when we to watch 2 years ago we didnt know the cars were all eletric, paid a fortune and was the most disapointing race i ever watched, and what nade it worse we have to wait more than 1.30 hours to see another round, we didnt even watched the final and left, never again i will watch eletric cars races.
I have been a fan of NASCAR for the last 10 years and I know that points system well. I have to say this is the only thing I have seen come close to the level of stupidity that is the NASCAR championship. Thank God Indycar is still doing things right (for the most part).
the day nascar goes to a full season points system (if it ever happens) will be the happiest day off my life
Tried to go back through results from last year to see how this new points system would have affected the championship, but the WRC website itself doesn't even show splits per day so you'd have to manually add up stage times for the final day to see how it would have played out. Absolutely bonkers to award points based on a split that wasnt even getting published before
Have you tried ewrc-results' website?
They changed something that didn't need change. I really hope it goes after this year. Also interested to see what changes you'd make. Think we might have similar ideas
It did need change tho
It needed change to help keep the championship more open instead of having the leader run away with it. That's it though. They could have just fixed that.
feels like someone said "here, design a points system that awards the most points to someone who drives like Colin McRae did"
No matter how much I read about it and how many times I will watch this video I still won't understand this new points system. You say that the points system won't last beyond 2024, hell I doubt it will last past Monte Carlo. I'm dead serious. I would LOVE for someone from the FIA/WRC to come out and try to explain this shitshow. How are the new fans let alone the current and old fans supposed to understand. It blows my mind. Great job explaining it the best you can Joe! Most others can't and won't be able to
Fundamentally though, any sport where pushing hard has a small but significant probability that you hit a tree/fall of a cliff and get seriously injured is not going to encourage flat out all the time racing, and that's just how it is going to be.
This is so, so mind-numbingly stupid. I don't understand the reasoning behind this. Hell, I don't understand any of this. In the last 24 hours, the SRX series has collapsed, Nascar has introduced more restrictor plates to ruin the Xfinity series, and now THIS. I am immensely disappointed and the racing season has barely begun.
On a lighter note, for a brief moment, I thought Gordon Ramsay was Marcus Gronholm at 11:08.
In my opinion, what WRC needs is 1) an easy way to follow it (yes, I know there is a summary on redbull tv, but as a casual fan i usually don't go there specifically to watch it), as well as a 2) clear point system and 3) a way for spectators to get information on how / where to attend the events.
1) They have highlights on their youtube channel aswell, but feel like it's hard to follow as a non-native english speaker to understand what happened on which stage etc. So adding some graphics in between with total and stage times etc. would help.
2) I think that having stage wins should reflect in the points a team / car-team (driver and co-driver) / manufacturer gets. I think of something like this:
Stage points: Rally points
1st - 5 pts 1st - 50 pts
2nd - 4 pts 2nd - 45 pts
3rd - 3 pts 3rd - 40 pts
4th - 2 pts 4th - 30 pts
5th - 1 pt 5th - 25 pts
6th - 20 pts; 2 point gaps til 10th (12pts), 11th (10pts) 1 point gap til 20th (1 pt)
Manufacturer points are combined of the 2 highest points scored over the rally of 2 individual cars (can be from different teams, but might need overhaul due to actual manufacturer teams, unlike e.g. M-Sport which isn't a manufacturer team.
3) I've been on multiple websites of rallys of different levels (rally du chablais, WRC events, Rally du Jura etc.). On most of them the information about where to go to watch it, possible shuttle busses from the hub to stages etc. are very minimal and keep potential attendees from actually going there to watch it.
Thank you for trying to explain.
This is really the dumbest points system I have ever seen. Even as someone who follows the WRC since over 40 years and does a lot in statistics and research I find this hard to understand. So how are they going to explain this to new fans?
What disturbs me most is that this system is very unfair and as such doesn’t reward the endurance character of rallying. If at least the Saturday points were fix. What happens now:
The driver who gains 18points on Saturday, but then retires on Sunday, not only gets zero Sunday points and zero power stage points, he loses his Saturday points as well. He could have been leading the rally for 23 out of 24 stages and still gets exactly zero?
How about Kalle’s part time season turns out like this: Spend Friday and Saturday on the beach, just turn up for the the last 4 out of 24 stages and get 12points from this. Times 13 rallies that gives him 156points, that is enough to become World Champion!
The fix to this problem could have been so easy:
- Give them new tyres before the power stage, as saving tyres was the main reason for slow Sunday runs. In fact before we had power stages there was none of this tyre saving, so it really is a self inflicted problem.
- Or 1 point per stage win on Sunday.
- Or give us longer Sundays!
In fact I feel like the WRC should look at their little sister ERC.
For starters: In ERC we used to have a system with day points. In the end it was utterly complicated, it was close to impossible to see Sunday standings only, even the commentators couldn’t explain it and even the drivers that profit from it couldn’t be arsed to look at day results. So the system was kicked out of ERC - and now the WRC wants to do it? Haven’t we done this mistake before and learned from it?
Longer Sundays: Why do I keep hearing WRC events should be shorter? Surely WRC should be longer than ERC.
Well, one thing that annoys me is that WRC Sundays are so short, often only 4 stages, often only 30-40km. For a start this is not spectator friendly. F1 starts Sundays at 2pm because this is the best time. Who the heck came up with the idea that WRC power stages have to start at noon? My son and my wife watch WRC with me, but not the Sunday because it means they have to get up at 6am on the only day they don’t have to go to work/kindergarden!
And on a short Sunday not much is happening. Yes, the ERC only has 2 days, but the last day is still 8-10 stages, often more than 100kms, often the power stage is the longest stage of the day. That guarantees fights to the finish line! And it’s obvious, if a driver is 40sec in front his place is secure for 30kms but when the last day is 120kms there is still a point to fight.
Honestly in the last 5 or so years I have never seen a dull Sunday in ERC, while in WRC a dull Sunday is the norm. And to my mind this has nothing to do with how long the rallies are, if it is 3 days and the last day is 100-120kms there is still a lot that can happen!
Isn’t it a shame that I honestly say I enjoy the ERC more than the WRC? In WRC we only have 8 Rally1 cars, in ERC we have plenty of guys that can win, including local surprises.
Or let alone the starting order discussion in WRC, being unfrair to regular drivers and championship leaders…. Well in ERC the shakedown is used as a qualifying stage, the starting order is determined by shakedown results. It gives a meaning to shakedown too. This system works wonderfully in ERC since many years, why does the WRC not adopt this?
I could go one forever and ever.
JW, I find it very interesting what you list at 10:45 as most stupid things the WRC has done. I do agree with all of them, also roughly in that order. But interesting you mention S2000 here. I thought I was pretty much alone not liking S2000. For me in torque vs weight a non-turbo 4x4 formula was the worst of all worlds. Non-turbo works for 2WD, turbo 2WD is great too, but if you have 4x4 then there must be a turbo. And we know from Audi quattros, Subarus, Cosworths that turbos can sound mega.
But this leads me to the moment the FIA tried to rectify this. Along the 2L atmo S2000 we suddenly had the 1.6 turbo RRC car aka Regional Rally Car. The RRC cars were very much level with S2000, but the brilliance was that you could convert WRC cars to RRC cars and vice versa. This opened the sport to more drivers and cars. This is exactly what we need instead of Rally1! Besides I hate this space frame hybrid thing, you can’t use a Rally1 car outside the WRC, so you can’t sell it! No wonder M-Sport is struggling, no wonder Citroen and Skoda rather stick to Rally2, they would even be pretty dumb to go to Rally1! Think about it…
I am utterly looking forward to your video on “how to fix WRC”
If you wish you can discuss with me by email or so, as I obviously think a lot about this myself. Well, my 2 cents in short for now:
- Get rid of Rally1 cars, back to more road car relevance
- Back to the old points system
- Longer Sundays or at least a tyre change before the power stage
- More interesting rallies.
On the last point, you say too some great rallies are lost. I follow ERC & WRC and in past years we had 5 fast gravel rallies one after the other over the summer months, it does start getting boring.
And a wild idea from me: At the moment D.Richards and R.Reid are discussing that exactly rallies should be more different, even different formats. I love Rally Japan, but I don’t think it is ideal to have the season finale on the other side of the globe. I know a return of the RAC Rally is highly unlikely. But just as an idea: How about do a 5-day Safari mid season and then end the season with a 5-day RAC like it used to be. And then go and award double points for these extra long events. Would keep the championship open to the last round.
Well, sorry I wrote long and not in the best structure, but rallying is my favourite sport and it annoys me that the very people who should run and promote our sport seemingly do everything to destroy it! And that with methods that are extremely obviously wrong, as if they destroyed it on purpose.
Watching this is like gunshot after gunshot. What the hell man. Thanks for (trying to) explain(ing) this…
My brain.exe has stopped working.....
This new points system is one of the most idiotic and stupid things I've ever seen in all of motorsports and I hope it gets scrapped ASAP
Great video Joe
Before coming to this video, I was "oh boy, how this could go wrong?"
Oh boy, am I wrong for that, ended up spending my time internally screaming at the new points system.
Doesn’t anybody realize that only awarding the winning driver one point for winning the stage would mean that if someone came in second all year long, they lose to somebody who only came in first once and fifth every other time.
You can hear the passion in your voice. This is my first time viewing your channel, and i now have a new RUclipsr to follow. Keep it up!
If they desperately want to use a system where points are given at different moments during the rally weekend. Fine.
But change it to a more logical system.
- Use the 7 points table for the Saturday stages
- Use the 18 points table for the actual rally winner on Sunday
- Reduce the Power Stage points to 3 for first place, 2 for second place, and 1 for 3rd place.
Honestly, the only thing they need to do (and the thing Thierry probably meant) is bringing the points between the different positions closer to each other. Now they gave 25 points to first place and 18 to second. Which was kind of ridiculous, given how close it can be between those 2 positions during the rally. But they've created that themselves with those 5 Power Stage points. If the gap between 1st and 2nd is 5 points or less, that could mean that 2nd place can get more points than first place if they take all the PS points and first place doesn't get any. 1/5 of the points you get for winning a rally is awarded for winning one short stage. That's just stupid imo.
How many times have we seen it happening that the driver in first place had to push his car so much that they don't have any good tires left for the PS. While another driver was lucky enough to profit from a couple of DNFs to get to second place and still having some good tires left because he wasn't pushing anymore, and was already counting on the PS points. The fastest driver throughout the rally rarely picks up all the points in the PS. Unless it's a rally which isn't too hard on the tires. But that also means that this point system favours certain drivers whose favourite surface is one that's not too hard on tires.
Anyway I had to rant a bit about this...
To be honest, most of the time the race is decided before Sunday anyways, so most drivers aren't driving flat out and are just protecting their position. I really don't know how much the Power Stage points really matter.
@@ikr9358 I understand why it's there. It's a bit of a catch up mechanic, and to make sure there's still some points up for grabs up until the absolute end of the rally.
But at some point it gets kind of ridiculous how many points you get for winning one stage compared to the whole rally.
Someone in first place isn't going to push too hard anyway. If they crash they lose 25 points. If they win they get 7 points more than 2nd place. However, if 2nd place goes full out and wins the PS, first place only gains 2 measly points on second place.
So you're right for some drivers, it's too much risk to go full in the PS, for others it might be an "easy" way to gain back points after a disappointing rally. But it's definitely a case of driving that stage on 2 minds.
We need more wrc content like this on RUclips. Keep bringing them
Wow, this video already has 2,000 views in just two days! Good for you man, keep up the good work. 😊
WRC has the current world champion competing part-time, has under 10 cars competing in rally1 category and has also introduced this confusing points system all the while raising the monthly payment it wants from fans. I got into WRC a few years back and honestly, I don't care anymore and I'm NOT paying more for a worse season... Gutted.
Thanks for making this vid, I had no idea they'd made these ridiculous changes. They could make it more exciting using the original points system and cars with far less aero, doesn't need this meddling.
This new FIA management generation is just destroying every motorsport category, down with the actual FIA bosses that are a bunch of idiots that only care about money
Big W for ur 2003 WRC video, got a 9 on the test and top fragged the presentation 🐐
I don't mind providing points separately for a different day, but it should be the first day of the event... I think it happening AFTER the main points are locked in makes it stupid.
WTF it like having a Playoffs every race just DAMN!
When I first saw the rules I thought I misunderstood them, just because of how stupid they are. Apparently I did understand them right...
If they didnt want people cruisin on sunday, they could have just added the fastest sunday points and kept the rest the same.
Now basically Friday and Saturday is a complete seperate rally without a powerstage, and sunday is a rally on its own with little points, but with a relative super awarding powerstage...
The FIA and WRC could’ve done a points system like this. And this is just me thinking about it for less than 30 minutes.
Saturday Stages Points
1st 8 Pts
2nd 7 Pts
3rd 6 Pts
4th 5 Pts
5th 4 Pts
6th 3 Pts
7th 2 Pts
8th 1 Pts
Sunday Stages Points
1st 10 Pts
2nd 9 Pts
3rd 8 Pts
4th 7 Pts
5th 6 Pts
6th 5 Pts
7th 4 Pts
8th 3 Pts
9th 2 Pts
10th 1 Pts
Overall Rally Points
1st 25 Pts
2nd 18 Pts
3rd 15 Pts
4th 12 Pts
5th 10 Pts
6th 8 Pts
7th 6 Pts
8th 5 Pts
9th 4 Pts
10th 3 Pts
11th 2 Pts
12th 1 Pts
Power Stage Points
1st 5 Pts
2nd 4 Pts
3rd 3 Pts
4th 2 Pts
5th 1 Pts
This☝️
Couldn't agree more! Great video mate!
so its being treated as two seperate days, with saturday being more important and now the overall winner is just a sideshow
Looking forward to the WRC Fix video!
if they don't want drivers to cruise on Sunday, couldn't they have just given the new Sunday points on top of the previous format? moving overall points to be awarded Saturday is just perplexing.
Welp, another reason not to watch this year. Rovanperä's part-time campaign is already almost enough to drive off an experienced Finnish rally fan like me, but this is just on another level. This series has become such a joke in the last couple of decades. It really needs some sort of a refresh. And it's a massive shame as rallying is an amazing sport. The only problem is that the world championship it has is such a joke
Tell WRC's organizers that if they want to bring their views back to where it used to be don't come up with any illogical points system and bring back the goddamn Group A regulations.
Does it really matter when they have hidden it behind a paywall anyway? did pay for it for 5 years but the coverage is so repetative, you can predict with great accuracy what the presnters will say. They reuse the same shots over and over so you get to see one corner many times, then they reuse stages to make it more repetative.
After paying for the whole season you are unable to rewatch the season (or wasn't at the time I left 2 years ago) later in the year which also makes no sense.
The most skilled drivers in the world are now hidden from view and should someone buy viewing, are presented with dull repetative content. At least there is more rallies now, still only mostly 1 per month. There is something upto about 30h of coverage for a rally but it's very rough to watch all that sadly due to the repetition.
I've loved this sport since the 80's, but feels it's been pulled away from viewers or putting views to sleep. All at the same price as full video platforms but only having 1 event per month (mostly). It's one of the most spectacluar things to behold in motorsport but the entertainment Vs cost Vs content ratios just don't add up anymore. ☹
when the R5 Championship have more manufactores, drivers and sponsor, a question must be made.....
Looks like they want to go more on the route of spectacular crashes on Saturday.
We will see how it works out.
FIA, are you fucking trying to kill WRC as a sport?
Coz surely it looks like so.
Imagine how confused fans are when in the end of year new champion is KR69 after he drove only 9 rallies 😅
What the fuck are they thinking? This is ridiculous
I understand everything about it accept the part where the Sunday points don't go towards the drivers point count, but only the leaders on sunday??? Please explain!
And to think that calculating the points towards the end of the Brazil 2009 F1 GP felt kind of complicated...
They should've done it this other way...
· 5-3-2-1 for the top4 of both Friday and Saturday alone (not cumulative, just the best days), same for the power stage
· Then normal points at the end of the rally
Also, to avoid the whole tyre saving thingy, why not give teams an exclusive extra set just for it? Teams could bring only tyres to the stage on vans. You give a tight time window for drivers and co-drivers to change all 4 tyres WITHOUT help and that's it. No time to repair shit, just change all 4 wheels.
So go hard on Saturday, then go for a cruisy, slow Sunday drive. Got it. Sounds like it will be exciting...
My idea to make Sunday more interesting would be to give brand new tires for the Power stage then drivers have less reason to save tires on rest of the day
I can’t even comprehend this 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭
fia is getting worse and worse by each year. I mean i mainly watch f1 and only watch some rally. But wtf happened. From inconsistent penalties. Drivers being in the same scenario but receiving very different penalties. Sprint shootout, idek wtf that does, it just completely lost the meaning of sprint, and btw, if you missed fp1 in a sprint weekend, you can be dsq as you are required to atleast participate one fp throughout the weeked. And then carlos sainz las vegas incident. And now this piece of sh*t. truely speechless
Wait what? That does not make any sense!
One damn FIAsco yet again!
This is big f* up. You can be 60 seconds ahead of the driver in second place after both Saturday and Sunday, then you finish P6 10 seconds behind on the power stage which is won by the driver that was P2 all weekend. Then you would still be 50 seconds ahead on the overal leaderboard but leave the weekend with less points then the driver in P2. Who gets credited with the win that rally? The driver with most points? Or the driver with the lowest time?
Rally should just be about surviving the set total distance in the least amount of time.
Great video 👍 yes the new points system does have flaws. It is built in a way to stop dominant drivers run away with the championship. Saturday and Sunday points are fine to keep the drivers pushing throughout a rally weekend. Ultimately if your rewarding Sunday points there is no purpose for the power stage just give podium finishers the extra points for 1st,2nd and 3rd over the entire weekend
They hope the power stage will draw viewership as a big event but meh. I would be fine with Sunday points being awarded and no Power Stage.
Honestly i think it would make it more interesting if only the top 2 drivers got points since theres almost nobody in rally 1
Surely the points should either be awarded on the basis of the finishing order of the rally, or by awarding points for the finishing order of each stage. If WRC and Fia want more spectators they should have other " Rally show stage or stages" for a separate award and are compulsory. Do the Fia want a rally or a money making show?
quick revamp if we want try something different:
top 3 get points: 3, 2, 1 after every stage
then use the f1 top10 for the final overall rally standings
this would mean no need for a power stage
If the championship leader goes into the final rally with a five points lead and wins on Saturday, the lead extends to eight points. So even if they get zero points on Sunday and the driver who is 2nd in the championship gets 7 points, they still become world champion. This means they will be encouraged to go as slow as possible on Sunday, as the only way they could possible lose the championship is by retiring.
This is almost as bad as that football match where one of the teams had to score an own goal to advance to the next round. When the 2024 season is over, we'll get youtube videos like "Why this driver had to finish last to become world champion!"
This is dreadful!
Hopefully it will get dropped the first time the overall winner doesn’t get maximum points.
I like the idea of incentivising Sunday when it is most likely large parts of the final result are ‘decided’ - but that what the power stage is for!!
Two better ideas-
Reward points for overall result, + power stage + 3,2,1 for 3 fastest driver across enterity of Sunday
Reward points for overall results + power stage + 1 point for the individual stage winner of the final 5 stages
Both of these ideas incentivise pushing on Sunday without rewarding a driver who spins off on Sunday without totalling the car.
You've gotta be kidding me. I'm a NASCAR fan that's just getting into rally and now this shit happens. This genuinely is worse than NASCAR's system.
I think the only points system that comes close, was when F1 allowed you to drop your worst scores during a season, as only your best 11 races out of 16 counted!
It even changed the 1988 championship, with Prost scoring more overall points than Senna, but with less points counting...
Dropped scores made the maths hard for commentators, but the idea that a champion should be the one who does well every time their car allows, rather than the driver who never breaks down, wasn't silly given the reliability of F1 cars at the time.
@@DanielHarveyDyer But if your car is fast but unreliable, why should you be more deserving of winning the championship than a car that isn't as fast, but finishes more races for overall more points? They are two soulutions to the same problem, and they should carry the same weight.
If it was just about winning performances, they could just use Mario Party rules, where your number of wins (stars) were all that mattered for the championship, and in a tie, it becomes 2nd places, then 3rd places and so on...
@@skynet0912 I think for a drivers title it made sense at the time, because failures were prevalent and fairly random, so a great driver could only expect to get 11 chances in a 16 race season to show what they can do. But ultimately they changed it, and now I think the current system with the current cars is good.
I can see how teams would like it if they have a breakdown they can come back and win stage points the next day. But having 3 different points levels for day1 day2 powerstage is too complicated. Also there is a mathematical possibility the rally winner on overall times, could score less points than someone behind him.
Gimmicks, gimmicks and still more gimmicks. Oh for the good old days when, if you did something spectacularly stupid on day one that, as they say "was it!"
I love the new point system better. will make it more competition
This is like taking part of rally medals.
10:08 spot on! 😂
I mean if they swap the points from Saturday to Sunday it would already make a lot more sense
It will probably bring a bit of chaos which I don’t mind lol but I think what the FIA went for is to try and get surprise “winners” (Sunday winners) and grab more headlines and audience for the third day of the rally
where the hell is the logic behind getting rid of the incentive to win a rally to make it more competitive and exciting??? bro 2024 season's gonna suck
were these decisions made before Kalle announced his 2024 season to be part-time? if so, it probably was a petty scheme to prevent another domination streak (considering how Kalle took Rally1 by storm from the onset), but what's the point of carrying it out now that Kalle is part-time and out championship contention???
Sure there were winning streaks before, but it's not like Loeb and Ogier didn't earn them the hard way. They make it sound like they had no competition, therefore somehow this would justify them to artificially manufacture competition by rewarding failing backmarkers and stopping rally win rewards??? this is fucked
Got back into WRC after being a big fan in 90’s and early 00’s after enjoying the video game so much, but this is baffling. Hope it’s one season wonder like the elimination Qualyfing in f1
New to WRC and watching old season reviews, I like the 10,8,6 point system best. However, in defense of this new point system; it rewards performances over the entire weekend. Basically, there is a 2 day rally, a 1 day rally for half points, and a single stage rally for 1/3 points. Winning the 3 day rally gets you the trophy; but to win the championship, you have to be consistent across the 3 time domains and avoid DNFs at all costs. Should the 3 day rally winner get the most points, I suppose; but I think incentivising Friday, Saturday, and Sunday performance explicitly is fine.
If you need to use the word 'basically' and still write half a novel to explain something as simple as a points system, it is a system far too fucking convoluted! Nothing positive about it.
Youd think the brilliant and overqualified marketing analysts who carry forward these decisions would be able to see from the utter collapse of the entertainment industry that "Broader Audience" approaches _dont work_ .
This sounds like a heavy over-correct for a problem that doesn't exist. Honestly if you want viewing figures up, maybe don't charge a small fortune for WRC+
So... what happens to the quickest person on friday and thursday?
when JW said that this system was worst them the Nascar Playoff´s i was like:
- no way is worst them the stupid Play....
(JW says the Sunday points)
- oh my god it is worst.
This system us messed up, but let's award it points for showing up.
Seems simple enough,one rally is now treated as 2 races
Heres a way to reenergise the series - put it on free tv. No one has BT sport in the UK unless they like football, no ones shelling out for the wrc only subscription, and your general f1 fan - the biggest audience to try and tap into - is already paying for Sky. I got into F1 and motorsports through watching it for free (yes telly license ik) on channel 4. I would have never considered rally if not for a reupload site I was on for something else. If you want fans you have to show it to people, no ones going to go out their way to pay for something they might not like yet.
So effectively it’s 2 seperate rallys, one till end of saturday and one on sunday
8:14, I do not understand, how could the rally winner end up not scoring points?
Because then you'd need to end-up 11th and 8th, which doesn't make you the winner.
If you end-up 1th, you get 7 points? I don't see any way how you could both win the rally and not earn any points?
Hi, very good question and I'll give you an example. It's a rare scenario, and more than likely won't happen because it would need certain factors to fall into place, but it's not impossible.
Say after Saturday the overall top 11 are very close to each other, and the top 10 end up finishing the rally, meaning they get the Saturday points, and the driver who was 11th gets nothing for Saturday. But let's say the P11 driver passes all 10 of those drivers on final day to win the rally. However that driver gets no points, because 7 drivers who retired on either Friday or Saturday, end up restarting on Sunday via the super rally rules, and those 7 drivers happen to be the fastest across Sunday, meaning those 7 drivers get the Sunday points. And to add to that, 5 of those 7 drivers, end up getting the power stage points. This means as a result, the rally winner gets no points as you don't get any points for the overall result after Sunday. That's how the rally winner could end up with no points. As mentioned it's a rare scenario, and will more than likely never happen depending on how long this points system lasts, but it's not impossible. A scenario like this should not be possible, no matter what the likelihood is, but the FIA and WRC Promoter have made it possible via this stupid points system.
Hope I explained it clearly.
@@JWTalksMotorsport Oh yes that's a lot clearer and indeed really scuffed.
Just the fact it required such an explanation also kinda shows how bad of a system it is as a "casual WRC enjoyer" can't easily understand it.
I really have no clue what kinda stuff got passed around while the FIA and WRC promotor came up with this system.... Must have been some good shiet, I want me sum of that.
I'm not too involved in WRC competition, but here are my possibly flawed thoughts on the system:
Winning the Saturday points is of course the main objective now, so the drivers have to push for that on all days.
Now Sunday comes up. The drivers could cruise to keep their Saturday points, but they could also push to sack in the additional points.
So lets say you have Driver1 win the Saturday stage, but cruisingSundays to finish 5th both overall and on the power stage. They get 22 points.
Driver 2 could finish in 4th on Saturday and by winning Sunday and the power stage still get 23 points, keeping up with the championship.
I could see a world where that works. It's a power day. But you might as well make all days like that. Hell, make every stage a power stage and get rid of any other given point. It just feels so half baked.
What were they even thinking
i am new at being a Fan of wrc, i had a little bit of trouble following the former points system, but now i'm watching this video and i can barely follow it.
Imagine Nascar awarded more points to stages than the finishing order,
That is basically the new 2024 WRC format.
I have a fix for this point system:
Saturday points and must finish the rally to get them are alright
Sunday points will change to Rally points which would be based on the overall result, not just on Sunday
Explain:
If somebody leading the rally on Saturday, they have a higher chance to win the overall, so the driver would get 18+7=25 (the old) points. What my fix do it let's the driver who had lead the whole rally win, but at the same time encourage the others to push more (I think this is the reason for the change) than the leader, because as long as they finish the rally. We still could end up with situation where the winner didn't get the most points, but with this it has way less chance (and also less confusing)
As I read another solution:
Switching Saturday and Sunday (which for me the overall after rally) points would fix the "not the most amount points for the winner" problem, but also allow drivers to push more (less than before my version, more than the original) as they know there are points in the tally
It would make more sense if they just gave the points out randomly throughout the season. They could do it at random events to keep everybody guessing when and where the points are awarded.
more than ever ...is about to get: Points!
Give your bro my compliments. I'm sitting this one out as well, probably. I think i'm over all the micromanaging governing bodies are exerting on motorsports anymore. They've sacrificed too much in the name of "spectacle." There's too much strategy involved in doing well anymore, not just in WRC, but just about everywhere.
Why just why. I can't believe they have done this.
I'm so confused. Why couldn't they just flatten the curve.
ah yes the scientifically worst possible point system
could only be worse if they change it mid season but don’t retroactively change the points from already completed rallies so that there’s two different point systems in a single season and the second system will still not make any sense
FIA make things worse I see the FIA never changes in its ability to make things worse
Feels like WRC needed Liberty Media and F1 stick with the old promoter lol
How the hell did they screw this up so badly?!
I really hope Neuville won't still win the wdc this year.
If they want drivers to push to the end of the race, why not have a points system which is dependent on the time gap between the drivers, maybe something like the least points at the end of the year wins, and you get points based on how many seconds behind the leader of the rally you are at the end, this way the leader may still have an incentive to push as he could gain a greater advantage over his rivals, and in theory this will always go down to the final round, could be something quite different to other motorsports and I feel it could work with rally, might need to iron out some kinks with DNFs but just an idea
Maybe you're not allowed to DNF and if you break the car you're just gonna have to walk to the end of the special!
I feel bad for the drivers, it kinda feels like the FIA and manufacturers are sabotaging them. The cars are boring but relatively close in performance and the short relatively fair stages mean you have to make the difference, which usually means taking high risk. The coverage is anywhere between awful to non existant and to top it off this points system pretty much makes it a "watch cars go fast" thing rather than bothering with the standings/titles for all but the most hardcore fans.
Rallye used to have drivers become legends, but in WRC's current state, there could be a new Walter Röhrl, Tommi Mäkkinen, Colin McRae etc. and nobody would notice.
To put things into perspective, Carlos Sainz (Senior) won his 4th Dakar this year and is becoming a legend almost 20 years after finishing his WRC career.
We also don't see any Rallye/Race Driver special editions of cars anymore afaik, because frankly the street versions of those are aimed mostly at the kind of driver that wraps it around a tree thinking he can drive like a pro from playing Forza or Gran Turismo.
We don't see homologation specials anymore because there aren't any homologation classes anymore.
@@wiegraf9009 It's not about Homologation specials, but simply special editions named after ace drivers. The TME Evo mostly had different bumpers, wheels and bucket seats. Tough, the Carlso Sainz Celica (only called that in Europe) was indeed a Homologation special.
WRC is one step forward (WRC 2) and ten steps back (WRC1 cars, lack of manufacturers and points system)
The talk is they'll drop Rally1 next year and just run Rally2.
Gave up on WRC last season when Hyundai kept fiddling with the car order
What in Gods name is happening? That sit he worst idea for a point system I have ever seen...
I stopped watching WRC twenty years ago. Doesn't look like I've missed much. Nice to see the FIA are still incompetent clowns.
That’s Bonkers
Looks just like Mario cart points. Doesn’t seem to bad as long as you get a couple of mushrooms and an odd star 🌟 😅
Seriously though, Does this system promote consistency?
Or is it more of a let’s give some variation to winning/teams/stages?
I’ve been watching Rally more recently so to say I’m confused isn’t really the whole story. 😬
As ever, the WRC & FIA address the big issues as badly as ever. Nothing wrong with the points system......
How about, trying to do something about how poor the sport is? Better promotion, a rethink on the generic WRC events, how about trying to attract new manufacturers, etc