FIXED! - High Torque / High Performance Starter For Big Block Chevrolet 454 7.4 liter Engine
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- Опубликовано: 24 дек 2022
- It's Fixed! :)
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My name is Dave and I travel with my dog Bella in a 1990 Fleetwood Bounder Class A Motorhome. This is our tour across America. So join us if you’re open to travel, fun, excitement, hiking & exploring. Wish us luck on this adventure! Maybe we’ll see you down the road sometime. Happy trails!
My channel is about full time RV Living in an older RV while keeping the wheels rolling on a budget. I do the repairs, updates and upgrades myself. I’ve become my own RV Mechanic/Medic! I seek boondocking opportunities every chance I can and power the RV with 500 watts of solar and approximately 500 amp hours of batteries. RV Resorts are just not our style!
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The original starters had three bolts that bolted horizontally and bolted to the bell housing. It was in the 60's that the starters started bolting to the block.
The nose cone was the main design change.
The small blocks were the 265, 283, 302 (really 301), 305, 307, 327, 350, 383, and 400. The early, first after 1954, big block was called a "W" head and was the 348 and 409. The second big block, which would not interchange in any way with the 348/409 block, was the 366, 396, 427, 454. There are also specialty engine that are larger.
There are several different starters for these GM vehicles. Some bolt to the bell housing, some bolt to the block with shims, some have the bolts straight across and some of them have bolts that are like yours at an angle.
The primary difference in torque strength is the size of the wire that the starters are wired with. Motors have fixed windings in the outside casings and movable (rotating) windings in the armature. In the early use of these starters the wire was a larger size. The bigger the wire the more current the wire could handle. It became known that the wire was far oversize for the current that was being used under normal conditions.
Re-winding the motors with much smaller wire that was still large enough to handle the required current resulted in large voids inside the standard case. A re-design of the case resulted in the much smaller started that you now have and is called the "high torque" starter. This new started will bolt in the standard positions of the old starter and its much smaller size makes for easier started maintenance. (An easy secondary heat shield can be made from sheet metal and bolted to the exhaust manifold header flange bolts.)
Re-manufactured starters sourced from quality parts suppliers can be as good or even better than the older "new" or original manufacturers starters. There are many but I only recommend NAPA. Lifetime guaranties are great but, if you have to replace it every three years it is work not needed with a quality three month or one year starter that never needs replaced.
Specialty, high torques, gear reduction "racing" starters are the way to go if you can stand the cost.
Can the sky not get any bluer? Wow!
When I used to work for a couple different auto parts stores, they had us take ASE Parts classes and one of them goes through the reman process for starters, alternators, etc. What we we learned was that reman (mostly in Brazil at the time) companies, only repaired what was actually bad and left the rest of the half wore out crap in the part.
Set your choke plate opening to 3/16" opening while cold and start there with the adjustment in most cases that distance will be good for cold starts. You have my number. My card doesn't say mobile Rv Tech but I am and I'll be in Quartzsite until Feb or March.
I worked with manufacturers and parts/service. Part numbers can be a mess. It all starts with engineering and making changes as needed. If the drawings and specs (drawing numbers referenced and updated) are not handled right, then the bill of materials will be wrong. Can be a nightmare to start over and track changes and drawings. Example: one infra-red burner had original part number with drawing. It had problems so first revision was (dash) A. Ended up with revisions B,C,D,E,F,G. Each change had a drawing....each change entered into bill of material. Serial number on range told date of manufacture each date matched drawing to tell which revision was in the range. It was one very large headache for the Service Dept. And it was worse for customer's! So glad you got it right finally! Good job!
I have a 79 Itasca 454 and the cheapest starter on rock auto is working fine so far. It turns it over quick.
Back in the early '80s I had a Chevy truck that I put headers on. The headers went right beside the starter. After driving to a store for a 5 or 10 minute stop, the solenoid would heat soak and cause slow cranking. I saw a tip in a magazine that they took a soup can, cut out both ends and put a split down it. Took some fiberglass motorcycle muffler packing for insulation. Wrapped the insulation on the outside of the solenoid and covered with the soup can held in place by 2 hose clamps. Never had it slow down again.
my dad used to deliver water in az during the blazing summer and said his chevy starters would fail. so he just added a remote solenoid on the firewall like ford did and problem solved.
Nice fix! :)
Ho, Ho, Ho....Merry Christmas to you annnd you, annnnnd YOU! You're welcome! Glad you got to spend some time with me.😁.....may you have smooth roads in 2023.
☕Now I know why Bella is so hyper in her seat! She gets a contact high from the steam💨 from the coffee maker 😂 😂
lol.. :)
🫂
Dave can always find a way. Cheers brother. Hi Bella!!!
Merry Christmas Dave and Bella. Sounds like that new starter was what you needed. Have a great holiday and Happy New year 🙏🙏☃️🧑🎄🎄🎁🎀✌️❤️🐾💞🐾☕☕
Thanks, you too!
Exhaust heat rap will work
merry christmas to you dave and bella.. we always look forward to your videos.. also i wanted to commend you on your stand against drinking alcohol... you know what it can do a family..so do i it killed my father and his father before him..sometimes its hard to resist pressure among friends.. good job dave god bless you...
I didn't understand a thing you were talking about how ever I do like watching your videos. Merry Christmas 🎄 and happy holidays.
Merry Christmas 🎅 🎄 ❤️ Dave and Bella! I hope to see in Quartzsite before i leave. Kisses to Bella! ❤️
Glad ya resolved that. After building numerous high performance engines I automatically use Ihigh torque starters that in your case would have worked. Talk to any performance speed shop, that’ll get ya right.
So great you figured it out.
Job well done, glad it worked.
I don't comment very often, but I found this video requires it. I can really relate to your explanation & speculation. You take me back to my manufacturing days. We had a rule that if Fit, Form or Function changed, you had to change the part #!
Numbers were cheap compared to confusion in the field. Thanks
It would be nice to be able to box up the confusion, lost time and expense and send it back to the decision makers of these manufacturers for compensation.
That's a very good theory. Makes sense to me.
Glad to here the engine turn over sooo fast , Merry Christmas.
Merry Christmas to you too and happy new year
I had to put a high torque in after that no more problems
Sounds good Dave. Glad you got it fixed. 👍🏻
8am!! Wow! Lazy day, getting started so late.
Merry Christmas to you and Bella!
Merry Christmas Dave & Bella! Happy New Year!
We love ya Dave & Bella!
Thank your Dave for another awesome video
Great job Dave.
Take some time and have a Merry Christmas.
Hugs to Bella💋
Yea!!!!! Merry Christmas!!!
Same to you!
Merry Christmas Dave and Bella!
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to You and Bella.
My suburban with a 350 used that smaller style starter.I didn't have a clue until I went to replace it.I already bought the standard one, nope back to get the much more expensive small one.
Merry Christmas Dave and Bella and the best wishes for 2023
Back in the 70's and 80's when I had trouble with a slow moving big blocks starter there was a guy in nashville that rebuilt starters. I'd tell him my problem and he'd rebuild my starter and he'd rewind the armature and man they'd crank fast. And of course it had a lot to do with the compression of the motor. I'd check the tightness on those occasionally.
I don't think I've ever seen anybody mice a washer before. Cool
Merry Christmas Dave and Bella 🎄🎁
Yeah I got a 1983 Ford Jamboree with the 460 7.5 L V8 yeah I always have to keep my foot on the gas for a little while when I first started up once it gets warmed up she's good to go but that first cold start Ford is also the same way as Chevy
I like watching you video’s!! Thank You Dave👍
Merry Christmas Dave and Bella, very interesting video good job on you starter, good luck,
Thanks 👍
Merry Christmas Dave and. Bella enjoy your channel
💯 percent better
Merry Christmas Dave and Bella
Wow Man! Never heard of the pygmy starters that's half the size and twice the price! Makes me wanna take a nap!
Merry Christmas Dave & Bella
Merry Christmas Dave and hope you have an awesome day :)
Merry Christmas, Dave.
👏 👏 👏 👏 👏 yessss
Merry Christmas back to ya brother.
Merry Christmas to you Dave
MERRY CHRISTMAS Dave & Bella 🎄.
Big Block in cu in: 348, 366, 396, 402, 409, 427, 454, 496. After Market has 502, 572, 622, 632.
Merry Christmas from Brazil Indiana
Merry Christmas Dave and Bella! My thought is that big block and small blocks have about the same compression ratios. So their starting resistance is about the same. When you start raising compression ratios, 10:1, 11:1 it makes a starter grunt more. That's where High performance starter come in, Most of them have gear reduction in the nose of the starter now and they can crank a higher compression engine over easier. I think the starter you had in there was defective if it didn't last. Always buy the manufacturers brand if you can, new only. I worked at Autozone and have seen some crappy stuff in the rebuilds! Be good, have fun!
GOOD MORNING BEAST DAVE BELLA RUclips CANADA ONTARIO VIDEO 🎅🎅❄️❄️🎄☃️☃️🐕
Sweet dog
Merry Christmas. Can’t believe you bought that rig for $2500. What a jem you’ve turned her into. Great revival. There is a new template for your future perhaps.loads of work though.time to reap your rewards of all that effort.cheer
Cold blooded Chevy! Heard that many times 😆
Get some header wrap for that exhaust next to the starter. Heat is brutal on electronics starter windings
Cool. You're missing all the fun on this side of the continent lol. 🖖🏻
Merry Christmas 🎄
Same to you!
As you know… You need to change those bolts and put the right length ones in because if you don’t they will fall out with all those washers on there like that so I would make a point to buy some shorter bolts keep the other ones in case you arrive to go back to that starter for whatever reason but I will put the shorter right length bolts in it and get rid all them washers just saying bud talk soon… Timmer
Merry Christmas To you & Bella! What you explained makes sense. What I don't understand is why they wouldn't test them and charge more for the stronger ones. I'd be so irritated to have to get under a vehicle 4 times to switch it out and get it right. Most people don't have that kind of time and how many businesses go thru that before they get the right starter on a larger motor. But, Hey! I'm a girl and let the men handle that problem! LOL HUGS~Donna
Hope that's permanent...seems like it should be👍👍
Dave when I was younger I had a Chevy engine once it got hot and shut off it would not start right away
Hope you had a VERY MERRY CHRISTMAS.....................
Time for a fuel injection conversion. 😁
It would make a great video series.
Sounds good..
I drove a delivery truck with a 454, for 10 years, the problem is heat from the manifolds would constantly ruin the starter and alternator. The good news is the engine Never failed in 10 years.
You can make shimming easy by just swapping the old nose cone to the new one on OEM ones. But with the smaller starter you may have to shim.
That's what I say one size fix all 😊
7:39 Christmas I think.
5:51 PM Christmas day, tons of food, again.
49 sounds pretty good compared to 30 below in the Milwaukee area. AL
Those starters were basically the same all thru the Seventies with the acception of the Oldsmobile as the nose cone was set up for the opposite side of the motor..
That is funny, smaller starter is better.
I might get me one as a spare for when mine goes out and thanks to this video I will be prepared with the washers I need since you did alk the hard work of determining the exact measurements needed.
Glad I could help! The short bolts are availble for that starter.
merry Christmas
Hi Dave, I was thinking about your older video where you removed the smog equipment off your motor and changed your timing. That can change the cranking when hot. As a teen all motors were messed up with the smog crap and they altered the timing as well if you have trouble you can try 10° btdc. that's a go to for old motors. I have had alot of Frankenstein cars that engines didn't match o.e.m. good luck, a former 45 yr. machinist and freind of Bill W. also. good video!
Go #Dave go
With do respect... you have the answer yet bring out the mics rather then go with the first result which is a working to fix the overall problem =-)
👍
see that type of starter was the same off a 350. but the 454 did not see much love from chevy till 88 when it got tbi. & by 92 that 454 was a great engine. but i won't worry about the flex plate or fly wheel it be fine to me. i ran that type of starter before & had nothing go wrong. no arm chair person here, just owned many 454 & 350 before & still do.
Merry Christmas Dave give Bella a scratch from Journey and I.
Clutch fan
Has the clutch, needs the fan.
Great
Oh yeah and first and foremost merry Christmas and I hope you have a great new year if I don’t talk to you sooner… :-) Timmer
Thanks, you too!
The engine compression also comes into play.
This is why I have a hard time leaving nuts, bolts and washers behind. 😂 oversized nuts make good spacers but you would want 7/16 on a 3/8 bolt, which would be harder to find than a pterodactyl.
I’ve been using gear reduction starters on Chevys for 35 years
It's time to tighten the choke flap a bit more. Drive Safe
My suburban had the smaller more expensive starter from the factory 350 1998 I believe was the year.
Merry Christmas Dave, wishing you a great 2023 with safe travels, lots of fun times with friends , Bella and family🙋🏼♀️🥰
Same to you!
❤❤❤❤
I hope that The New Starter fixes it.
I've got to do mine on a 454 with headers.I don't want to pull the headers, it's going to be tight.
Merry Christmas Dave & Bella, I've really enjoyed your videos this past year...
Hey Dave, enjoy your videos! The coachman is Sure lucky to have you as its owner!
Merry Christmas Dave and Bella. I'm glad that new starter did the trick.
Dave, 396.427 and 454 engines used different starters from small blocks - Your starter won't bolt to a small block. The problem you had wasn't really the starter, it was the cables. They are much too long for the wire gauge. Your positive cable is 2 pieces and if you add in the length of the negative cable, you've probably got 6 feet of cable, which is OK if you use larger gauge wire If you had replaced the cables with a one piece positive and negative both with a much larger wire diameter, your old starter would have started your engine just fine - You had so much voltage drop in the cables that your starter was probably trying to start on only 8 volts or so
Your new starter is a gear reduction starter - The smaller motor spins much faster and there is a gear reduction between it and the starter gear so it has much more poweon
Couldn't of said it any better
@Don Miller My new starter is not a gear reduction starter. Would you even recognize one if you seen one? The are quite different with the electric motor very much offset similar to how the solenoid is on direct drive starters. My new starter is a PMGR direct drive starter. My battery cables are just fine and are correct for the vehicle.
Dave after watching you cranking that engine and stomping on the pedal I'm wondering if your accelerator pump is working?
Another Christmas with your girl, Bella. How cool is that :) It makes me smile that you got it working....yay! Cheers, matey!
Thank you Mary! :)