Thank you gents. I appreciate videos like this. Most of us do not have access to the clubs and equipment you have at your beckon call. My next set of clubs will be in my bag for 10 to 12 years and I think the shaft will be very important in what is in my bag. More please.
I think it would have been good to have him swing a tour stiff or x flex as well. I think it makes sense to see a wider dispersion with a shaft that is too weak, but I’d be curious how too stiff would react.
The way this guy hits the ball even taking into account the shafts are mixed, is better than a 25 HC, he must have zero short game and lots of 3 and 4 putts.
Shaft weight and feel are much more important than the flex printed on the shaft. I've seen plenty of blind tests where professional golfers can't tell the difference or guess which are which. They only say how heavy it feels or how it loads/unloads.
from my beginner experience, I found that regular flex shaft is easier to hit the ball and provide better error margin while stiffer shaft will get you more precise hit if I hit it right...:)
Great video James. As someone who is a average mid to high handicap player improving my game and going for lesson this is the reason I booked a fitting for the first week in May. I think about shaft flex not so much with regards to distance gained but rather improving how the face path is at contact. I have a “fast” swing speed and my dispersion with my regular flex irons is not great and I want the fitting to improve that dispersion if I see improvements like he just did with the stiff shaft I will be over the moon. One again always great content! Have a good weekend!
Very interesting! The thing I find with different shafts is the main difference is ball flight characteristics (and spin) unless you are choosing only for distance. And, I think people underestimate ball flight a lot; on a simulator it's one thing, but out on a real course, I find it very important.
I agree. I think because the simulator is a "controlled environment", it gives you somewhat of a false sense of confidence. Hitting on a driving range, in the elements, affects body and mind more, and subsequently gives you a more REALISTIC look at what may help and what doesnt.
@@franklinniesterjr3812 Absolutely, not to mention the wind factor, dry vs wet fairways, firmness of greens, etc. In my very humble opinion, that's when ball flight (and spin) become much more crucial live than indoors. And your point about mind/body feel is also super important - great point!
yeah, playing on the course is different, What I find is the lie is always different (grass length, humidity, etc...) and the feet' positioning is always different (downslope, upslope, ball in a divot, etc...)
Shafts matter! I hit the modus 120 stiff and carry it through to my wedges. How about a video on the difference of iron shafts and wedge shafts? Should you carry the same shaft through or have different shafts in your wedges? 🤔
I have the same shafts and even though my swing speed is 92mph for my 7iron I find myself wishing I had a lighter shaft. After a driving range session they seem so heavy
Good morning from Bama! The flex test is quite interesting. Going off what some other fitters say, I suppose its about the decent angle so you can create stopping power. Great video as usual James!
Although in theory I’m a bit borderline between regular and stiff, the stiff option definitely gives me tighter dispersion and more consistency in flight and distance. With shaft weight I err towards lighter in irons and heavier in the driver.
James love the video! Played Torrey a few months back. Great story to tell! First time my wife took me to San Diego we went La Jolla and I played TP. I pronounced it exactly like you did and she laughed. The Ls in Jolla are silent. Hoy-A is the proper way. I agree with the way we say it although it will always make people laugh.
I have the Modus S too and what a difference? I’m not as hesitant going after the ball and the dispersion is much tighter. I may have lost a little yardage but I’ll sacrifice for consistency.
For me as someone who shoots in the 90s and drives the ball 230yards flex means nothing I can grab anyones clubs and get similar results regardless of what they are. If I make a good swing I get good results
James can you do some analysis on an all hybrid- up to pitching wedge. I use Ping 5,6,7 hybrids and 7,9 woods. Is Ping going to bring out a 9 hybrid - can you ask them I enjoy your videos and you seem a fun character. You’ll be off to Hollywood!
That and shaft weight for me, too. My driver seems to be having an issue with fore left right now, and after a fitting, we decided to go 13 grams heavier from 65 to 78.
Hi! Like your video's! Great job you guys... Whats the size of the simulator room? I want to build one in my back yard... but dont know what size to build? Keep on making video's plz 😉
So just to see what the results would be. I used PIng's online fitting tool and it recommends a stiff shaft for driver, irons and wedges but regular flex for 5 & 7 wood and 4 hybrid. Really need to go to a fitter and see what they recommend.
I'm not a good golfer, in fact I'm terrible. And driver is the one club I hit badly. And before I changed my driver Shaft, I was using a refular flex Shaft which was really whippy. I slices a lot on that. I decided to try an X stiff Shaft. And even though my distance hasn't really improved, but my shots had been straighter and more consistent.
And the winner is: what shaft feels better! Shafts are about feel and timing the strike; flex and shaft weight can make a big difference, can affect strike and trajectory as a result. Some players are skilled enough to make any shaft work for them (e.g., MC). Cheers!
Shaft weight and shaft length matter much more to me verses shaft flex. Could this be because there’s really no measurement or standard between different flexes?
How much testing and experimenting have you actually done? This sounds more like an anecdote. That being said most shafts of the same weight will have “similar” characteristics. Iron shafts esepcially, not so much in wood shafts. You wont find a 130 gram regular flex steel iron shaft because it doesnt exist. For wood shafts part of the flex IS he weight (aka how thick the wall of graphite is) a 45 gram stiff will feel whippier than 65 gram stiff even if they have the same kick point
@CooksMcGooks Where is your u tube video with this information? You seem full of facts on other people's comments. I would like to see your video on the information you are posting
@@gordonmckay914 2 clubs of the same flex and different weights will produce different flex results when measured on a shaft frequency analyzer. A 45 gram is guranteed not as stiff as a 65 of the same exact type of shaft. I know this because ive measured it with my bare hands…
@@gordonmckay914 my point that i forgot to include was that there is a muchhh bigger difference between a regular flex and a stiff flex than 2 stiff shafts with different weights. The weight makes a difference, but its not that big of a difference
Since the deviation for R-flex is smaller, he should go for R-flex? Maybe. I would calculate the standard deviation (mean square) with regard to target distance, which is the pin. Not so sure which shaft would be in front....
so the senior shafts that bend as much as a fishing rod are what we're thriving to achieve, to get that extra power directed at the ball? seems i should just swap them out with an unbreakable flexible fiberglass setup.
Never even thought about shafts for irons. It makes it even more sense for fittings for clubs no matter what handicap you are . Great video with Mr Fox. Always enjoy seeing him. ⛳️⛳️
This video is proof that if you are a high or mid handicapper you can still use more "players" irons. Don't lock yourself into the game improvement category, try whatever you want then decide! Those Z785 are gorgeous (ZX7 is the new version)
I see lots of these videos with full swing speeds. I would like to see comparisons with partial shots that you normally use around the greens. Touch shots are more difficult than a full swing that comparison is what I would like to see
These are such weird tests. I’m technically a “stiff flex” SS but at my last fitting I narrowed down to Modus 105s in regular flex. I was 7 yards longer and my dispersion was tighter. I never would have thought about that shaft if not for tbe fitting and seeing the numbers.
So which shaft had better spin stopping power? You didn't use a senior flex? That would have interesting. If he got same distance but better apex stopping power on the green
Same here. Always played regular shafts but just switched to Elevate 95 stiff shafts on my new PXG iron set. Hitting 7i 165 - 170 but more accurately. 63 years old and 6 handicap.
It’s based on ALL swing characteristics - full stop. We all swing differently - speed, tempo, delivery, angle… the only way to know the best shaft / head combo for your game is to try loads of different options - preferably with a “good” fitter 👍
Watching some expert fitters on RUclips they seem to all agree it's the tempo that's most important for them to fit around, but that it must feel good in the players hands so that they are confident stepping up to every shot. The tempo of the swing, say Jon Rahm is fast tempo for example, and the transition between top of backswing and start of downswing seems important, apparently. Mainly with accuracy, consistency, dispersion. I played 120g stiff dynamic gold and my next set had 90g regular flex. I hit both equally well (or equally poorly!) but found it easier to swing smooth and fast on long irons after 15 or 16 holes. If I played a few games in the same week I really a noticed the light regular shaft was easier to repeat my swing after lots of balls and rounds.
What is the clicking noise when tightening the club head onto the shaft? When I change loft on my SLDR I'm really wrenching it and I don't hear that sound. Wouldn't want to break it!
@@lukejackson1933 cheers man. I'm not using an actual golf club wrench as my 2nd hand club didn't come with it. I've just got a stubby ratchet driver with a Star head that fits. Hoping the head doesn't fly off one day!
I'm a senior golfer, wondering if there is enough of a difference in shaft weight, rather than flex, especially with graphite, to make a real difference in swing speed. If so, what weight among graphite shafts should I consider using? Thanks.
Yes shaft weight matters but so does flex. Also as you get older driver loft is critixal - I switched my 77 year old dad to a callaway xr16 driver in 15 degree loft reg shaft and he’s never drove it so far and so straight. Good luck
I find light A flex graphite helps in the top part of my bag for some extra speed, Driver to 7 iron, 8 to pw I play a light steel in reg flex, 52 and 56 wedge I play in a flighted 6.0 project x. This setup has allowed me to keep some distance in the top part of my bag as I've aged and control in my scoring half of the bag. Hope this helps.
Ok he is a high handicapper, but what is his swing (club head) speed and how much would shaft stiffness relate to slower swing speeds? One last point, I did enjoy this video and it was informative, but someone can be a high handicapper because they are poor in all aspects of the game, or play poor in one aspect, for instance some high handicappers can hit good irons but have trouble with chipping, pitching and putting, some have trouble getting off the tee.
Foxy’s swing was looking better there. I think he gets that tempo down and he will do much better. He has an athletic build but has looked clumsy at times with his swing but he’s just getting going here. Probably get down to a mid handicap in a couple of years.
Interesting test. If you chose a shaft based on the numbers here you might go for the regular (higher launch and spin), but the stiff clearly felt better for Foxy and enabled him to start the ball on line a lot more consistently (going 1* upright might get a similar result with the regular). I just did a fitting this week and tried 6 different iron heads, all with different shafts (all standard no up charge). The best results came from two different heads with two different graphite shafts, and both gave me much better feel for the clubhead than any of the heads I tested with steel shafts. Interestingly, I’ve been using steel shafts in my irons for 17 years! Maybe I’m just getting old and slowing down - wish I could hit 7i 180 like Foxy 💪
I find it hard to quantify, I have stiff shaft irons, stiff tipped 5 wood, regular mini driver (3 wood replacement but fills the yardage gap better) and x stiff driver and 2 iron. I dont notice anything different really, my gapping is as you would want between clubs, dont have to try harder with some vs others and dispersion doesnt drastically change. Miss is always the same way, doesnt change so im not so adamant on what shaft flex I must play anymore.
One of the biggest factors the right shaft can improve is face contact. If u ever use a shaft thats too whippy or too stiff your biggest problem isnt gonna be “squaring the face” its going to be hitting the ball on the center of the face 😂 which is why its important for higher hdcpers to use the right equipment, while at the same time dont really notice a big difference when they use the wrong equipment. Cause they arent finding the center of the face that often anyways 😂
This has been driving me crazy for months now. I’ve been watching your vids just enjoying the fitting experience. I decided to go and get fitted myself from a local shop. From the start I didn’t enjoy their experience. Im not a fitter so I just put my trust into them. I have a 97mph club head speed so they put me into the modus 120 stiff. I hit about 7 balls with it and they said this is for you and I ordered the clubs(6 week back order) I then went golfing in another town and met a rep from Mizuno. I wanted to try out their t22 wedges since I was getting their clubs and he told me since I was getting their clubs to come out and he will do a full fitting for me. Spent time with him and when we were done we had 2 completely different clubs. First was mizuno 223 with modus 120 s, and the second was mizuno 223 with modus 120 x stiff and +2 upright. He had me go back and change my order through them. So I called them and asked if I could try them side by side on the monitor. They were bitchy but let me hit about 5 balls each then told me they messed up because the x stiff has better data. So we ordered them and After 2 months I finally get to swing them. But they feel so damn heavy. The clubs Mae me feel like I need to swing harder just to get them up to speed which is throwing off my game badly. I liked the way the stiff felt, but I’m not a fitter and he told me they would never put someone with a 97 mph speed into a stiff. So I’m not sure what to do as the stiff felt way better but I was convinced to purchase the x stiff. Either way I can’t take them back, but I know golf is a huge mental game and it’s driving me crazy. Should I stick with the x stiff and just try to make it work or should I sell these clubs on eBay for a loss and start over?
This exactly represents why all these tests should be done with the Iron Byran machine to take all the doubts away. If nobody is doing this on RUclips we all know why because they can't get paid.
For a particular shaft, what specifically is being done to the shaft to make a senior vs stiff. It always struck me as odd when I would look at the different specs between senior, regular, stiff for a certain shaft and they all had the same weight (within a gram), same length, and same torque (within a tenth)
After seeing Foxy hitting 175 - 180 7 irons , I would like to see him in a Project X 6.5 LZ maybe up against the 6.0LZ but definitely leaning towards a X flex maybe in a Modus 105 X or Dynamic gold 105 X if he needs more landing angle to offset the low spin numbers .
How on earth is he hitting the ball that distance with a 7 iron when you James only hit a ping i200. 6 iron 180 yards when you went to SGGT and you are a pro.????
I feel let down by the title, this is not a game changer. Basically there was very little difference between the shafts. Same distance, same spin rates same ball flight. Maybe a slight indication that a stiff shaft may help him be a little more consistent but all I saw were good and bad shots with both which is basically the noise of a 25 handicap. He did prefer the feel of it which is important and he did work out which was the stiff but it took quite a few shots. I do find it so funny that people still believe that a shaft will drastically change how a 25 handicap performs. I tell you what will change it, lessons and lots of practice.
@@fritoboat13 go back and watch the video. The dispersion pattern for the regular flex is actually smaller(I.e the red circles is smaller than the blue one). Yes he hit a few closer to the pin with the blue but as the so called dispersion pattern shows there were plenty off line with the stiff. Could he repeat this on the course and will it make a difference, probably not. You could give a regular shaft and lessons over just fitting a stiff shaft and he will be better with the regular.
ok now let a 45-50 yr old do the same test ,, at 59 im just now starting to use regular flex from stiff my whole life , my swing speed is just not as fast as before ,, i notice with the reg flex my ball flight is longer and more consistent then using stiff flex ,, i actually brought my handicap back down to a 10-12 after it s been going up the last couple of yrs was hovering around 15-17 ,, and yes luv the Srixon irons was using the Z785s stiff shaft but just ordered the ZX7s PW-5 reg shaft ,, cant believe the young man holds a 25 handicap he was throwing darts
Stiff vs. Regular seems to me to be more of a comparison of shaft STIFFNESS, not "flex". I think of FLEX as more descriptive of a comparison between a "high kickpoint" vs. a low one.
The more I watch videos about shafts the more I realise that there are no "rules" about what shafts work best for any particular player, the "rules" are simply loose guidance and, just to annoy fitters everywhere, in a fitting you need to try many different shafts to find that one that seems to suit you best. For me, shaft weight seems more important than flex. So I play 80g reg in my irons, 70g stiff in my hybrid and having just had a driver fitting I may go from a 44.5" long reg 60g shaft in my driver to a TM Stealth with a 45.75" long, 50g stiff shaft. But that is just me, everyone is different
Is there a website I can go on to to find a shaft flex comparison? This is just watching a man hit a large bucket of balls. By the way he's not a 25 handicapper.
Kid swings a nice club for a 25 handicap. I played an 11 handicap last year and would take 90% of those shots. Not to mention if I'm playing 175 I'm hitting a 6 iron.
Not sure if a statistician would accept your results; might need greater number of shots and through out some outliers. One thing is for sure; this young man could use either shaft and be a 10-12 Hcp if he has a decent short game and course management . He hits it well enough with either; spend some time on short game practice.
11:50 is not the best posture. Jokes aside, my slx microsim says i got average driver clubhead speed of 103mph, but i am only hitting balls for a month so i have everything in regular flex. Damn i think i need a fitting now. My wifes gonna kill me.
shaft flex is the trendy thing to play with because you can buy the right one and put a shiny sticker on it, but get your lie angles right and then start to see the real improvement in your dispersions all for the cost of 1 or 2 shafts...
Kbs tour reg heavy (110?) great, take em any day. Kbs tour reg lighter…urgh. Kbs tour stiff (110) close but not quite. Project x reg graphite OMG sold. Just to be sure tried many others. Just unreal the difference in all shafts. Do not be blinkered by label or ego. Buy what fits you and you can’t blame the tools.
This guy is awfully consistent for a high handicapper. Obviously we haven't seen his short game nor his putting. I spoke too soon. His consistency went to what is more typical for him.
FINALLY! Someone uses a high handicapped player for the shaft flex. Great video overall. For once higher handicaps get in to the experimentation
Thank you gents. I appreciate videos like this. Most of us do not have access to the clubs and equipment you have at your beckon call. My next set of clubs will be in my bag for 10 to 12 years and I think the shaft will be very important in what is in my bag. More please.
I think it would have been good to have him swing a tour stiff or x flex as well. I think it makes sense to see a wider dispersion with a shaft that is too weak, but I’d be curious how too stiff would react.
Whatever makes you feel most confident and consistent is what you should use
The way this guy hits the ball even taking into account the shafts are mixed, is better than a 25 HC, he must have zero short game and lots of 3 and 4 putts.
There is no way this guy is hitting the ball that distance with that swing and I noticed you don't show his club head speed , I am a 3 hcp golfer.
Shaft weight and feel are much more important than the flex printed on the shaft.
I've seen plenty of blind tests where professional golfers can't tell the difference or guess which are which. They only say how heavy it feels or how it loads/unloads.
This is one of only a few comments worth reading. The differences are so negligible between S, R and stiff that no one can tell
from my beginner experience, I found that regular flex shaft is easier to hit the ball and provide better error margin while stiffer shaft will get you more precise hit if I hit it right...:)
Mr Fox!! What awesome grouping!! Methinks sir, you are a bandit!!🤔🤔🤠🤠
Interesting test. As a tall high handicap golfer myself, I like it when you have Foxy on as it seems more targeted to my skill level.
Great video James. As someone who is a average mid to high handicap player improving my game and going for lesson this is the reason I booked a fitting for the first week in May. I think about shaft flex not so much with regards to distance gained but rather improving how the face path is at contact. I have a “fast” swing speed and my dispersion with my regular flex irons is not great and I want the fitting to improve that dispersion if I see improvements like he just did with the stiff shaft I will be over the moon.
One again always great content! Have a good weekend!
Very interesting! The thing I find with different shafts is the main difference is ball flight characteristics (and spin) unless you are choosing only for distance. And, I think people underestimate ball flight a lot; on a simulator it's one thing, but out on a real course, I find it very important.
I agree. I think because the simulator is a "controlled environment", it gives you somewhat of a false sense of confidence.
Hitting on a driving range, in the elements, affects body and mind more, and subsequently gives you a more REALISTIC look at what may help and what doesnt.
@@franklinniesterjr3812 Absolutely, not to mention the wind factor, dry vs wet fairways, firmness of greens, etc. In my very humble opinion, that's when ball flight (and spin) become much more crucial live than indoors. And your point about mind/body feel is also super important - great point!
yeah, playing on the course is different, What I find is the lie is always different (grass length, humidity, etc...) and the feet' positioning is always different (downslope, upslope, ball in a divot, etc...)
Shafts matter! I hit the modus 120 stiff and carry it through to my wedges. How about a video on the difference of iron shafts and wedge shafts? Should you carry the same shaft through or have different shafts in your wedges? 🤔
I have the same shafts and even though my swing speed is 92mph for my 7iron I find myself wishing I had a lighter shaft. After a driving range session they seem so heavy
Good morning from Bama! The flex test is quite interesting. Going off what some other fitters say, I suppose its about the decent angle so you can create stopping power. Great video as usual James!
Although in theory I’m a bit borderline between regular and stiff, the stiff option definitely gives me tighter dispersion and more consistency in flight and distance. With shaft weight I err towards lighter in irons and heavier in the driver.
James love the video! Played Torrey a few months back. Great story to tell! First time my wife took me to San Diego we went La Jolla and I played TP. I pronounced it exactly like you did and she laughed. The Ls in Jolla are silent. Hoy-A is the proper way. I agree with the way we say it although it will always make people laugh.
I have the Modus S too and what a difference? I’m not as hesitant going after the ball and the dispersion is much tighter. I may have lost a little yardage but I’ll sacrifice for consistency.
"La JoLLA pines" 🤣1:06
For me as someone who shoots in the 90s and drives the ball 230yards flex means nothing I can grab anyones clubs and get similar results regardless of what they are. If I make a good swing I get good results
James can you do some analysis on an all hybrid- up to pitching wedge. I use Ping 5,6,7 hybrids and 7,9 woods. Is Ping going to bring out a 9 hybrid - can you ask them
I enjoy your videos and you seem a fun character. You’ll be off to Hollywood!
Awesome video guy’s and how well is foxy swinging the club 👏👏. Looking forward to seeing foxy’s fitting at Mizuno
That and shaft weight for me, too. My driver seems to be having an issue with fore left right now, and after a fitting, we decided to go 13 grams heavier from 65 to 78.
Hi!
Like your video's! Great job you guys...
Whats the size of the simulator room? I want to build one in my back yard... but dont know what size to build?
Keep on making video's plz 😉
So just to see what the results would be. I used PIng's online fitting tool and it recommends a stiff shaft for driver, irons and wedges but regular flex for 5 & 7 wood and 4 hybrid. Really need to go to a fitter and see what they recommend.
I'm not a good golfer, in fact I'm terrible. And driver is the one club I hit badly. And before I changed my driver Shaft, I was using a refular flex Shaft which was really whippy. I slices a lot on that. I decided to try an X stiff Shaft. And even though my distance hasn't really improved, but my shots had been straighter and more consistent.
Are "Powered Series 63" golf shafts in the Mizuno a.m.c V-33 Tour Series any good?
And the winner is: what shaft feels better! Shafts are about feel and timing the strike; flex and shaft weight can make a big difference, can affect strike and trajectory as a result. Some players are skilled enough to make any shaft work for them (e.g., MC). Cheers!
Brilliant content guys and foxy has really improved well done foxy swinging smooth bud and looking forward to seeing your fitting bud.
Shaft weight and shaft length matter much more to me verses shaft flex. Could this be because there’s really no measurement or standard between different flexes?
How much testing and experimenting have you actually done? This sounds more like an anecdote. That being said most shafts of the same weight will have “similar” characteristics. Iron shafts esepcially, not so much in wood shafts. You wont find a 130 gram regular flex steel iron shaft because it doesnt exist. For wood shafts part of the flex IS he weight (aka how thick the wall of graphite is) a 45 gram stiff will feel whippier than 65 gram stiff even if they have the same kick point
@CooksMcGooks
Where is your u tube video with this information? You seem full of facts on other people's comments. I would like to see your video on the information you are posting
@@gordonmckay914 i am a golf club repair man actually, i work with clubs and shafts of all varieties on a daily basis. I am the living knowledge lmao
@@gordonmckay914 2 clubs of the same flex and different weights will produce different flex results when measured on a shaft frequency analyzer. A 45 gram is guranteed not as stiff as a 65 of the same exact type of shaft. I know this because ive measured it with my bare hands…
@@gordonmckay914 my point that i forgot to include was that there is a muchhh bigger difference between a regular flex and a stiff flex than 2 stiff shafts with different weights. The weight makes a difference, but its not that big of a difference
Foxey is a top lad, doing the vids with you, i hope his h’cap comes down he deserves it. Good video, keep it going, enjoying your content
Gear testing by high handicap is the best part of this channel.
Since the deviation for R-flex is smaller, he should go for R-flex? Maybe. I would calculate the standard deviation (mean square) with regard to target distance, which is the pin. Not so sure which shaft would be in front....
I've always been fitted into x stiff iron shafts but whenever I hit friends irons that are stuff they always feel better
Which Srixon was Foxy using? Great work!
My biggest takeaway from this is that, as a 25 handcapper. He's an absolute bandit.
🤣🤣he’s a good lad.. but I keep having to play against “25 handicappers” who hit it 20 yards past me as a 17 .. and mine is right !!
so the senior shafts that bend as much as a fishing rod are what we're thriving to achieve, to get that extra power directed at the ball? seems i should just swap them out with an unbreakable flexible fiberglass setup.
Never even thought about shafts for irons. It makes it even more sense for fittings for clubs no matter what handicap you are .
Great video with Mr Fox. Always enjoy seeing him. ⛳️⛳️
What is the totque spec you are using?
This video is proof that if you are a high or mid handicapper you can still use more "players" irons. Don't lock yourself into the game improvement category, try whatever you want then decide! Those Z785 are gorgeous (ZX7 is the new version)
L-R dispersion is surprisingly tight for a high handicapper.
What was his iron swing speed
I see lots of these videos with full swing speeds. I would like to see comparisons with partial shots that you normally use around the greens. Touch shots are more difficult than a full swing that comparison is what I would like to see
Shaft flex means almost nothing at pitching/chipping speeds. X/S/R steel shafts will all perform similar on short shots
Very interesting James. What I take from this video is Foxy needs some Srixon irons 🤣🤣
These are such weird tests. I’m technically a “stiff flex” SS but at my last fitting I narrowed down to Modus 105s in regular flex. I was 7 yards longer and my dispersion was tighter. I never would have thought about that shaft if not for tbe fitting and seeing the numbers.
Yes sir, always best to get fitted. Individual swings will work best with individual shaft brands and flexes.
What’s your swing speed?
So which shaft had better spin stopping power? You didn't use a senior flex? That would have interesting. If he got same distance but better apex stopping power on the green
I have around 80-82mph with a 6 iron... I heard this is still inside the limit for regular shaft right?
Nice hitting Foxy. I think that was all about the feel to the player. Not a gnats between the performance.
I went to regular shafts when I turned 55 but now at 65 went back to stiff shafts to improve my accuracy...Still hit an 8 iron 150 yards.
Same here. Always played regular shafts but just switched to Elevate 95 stiff shafts on my new PXG iron set.
Hitting 7i 165 - 170 but more accurately.
63 years old and 6 handicap.
Am 65 and just got Mizuno JPX 921 Hot Metal with 95 gram Graphite Recoil Shafts and they Spin to High for My Taste may Reshaft !
@@thegolfingmusician6345 What’s the loft on your PXG 7 iron?
@@seanm3226 I had mine set to 30 degrees.
PXG will adjust loft and lie when ordering for no charge.
Well done James 👏
Isn't flex stiffness based on swing speed rather than handicap level? Serious question
It’s based on ALL swing characteristics - full stop. We all swing differently - speed, tempo, delivery, angle… the only way to know the best shaft / head combo for your game is to try loads of different options - preferably with a “good” fitter 👍
Watching some expert fitters on RUclips they seem to all agree it's the tempo that's most important for them to fit around, but that it must feel good in the players hands so that they are confident stepping up to every shot.
The tempo of the swing, say Jon Rahm is fast tempo for example, and the transition between top of backswing and start of downswing seems important, apparently. Mainly with accuracy, consistency, dispersion.
I played 120g stiff dynamic gold and my next set had 90g regular flex. I hit both equally well (or equally poorly!) but found it easier to swing smooth and fast on long irons after 15 or 16 holes. If I played a few games in the same week I really a noticed the light regular shaft was easier to repeat my swing after lots of balls and rounds.
@@RC-9 👍
What is the clicking noise when tightening the club head onto the shaft? When I change loft on my SLDR I'm really wrenching it and I don't hear that sound. Wouldn't want to break it!
That sound means it's tight. The wrench is set so not to over tighten the screw. Keep going until it clicks.
@@lukejackson1933 cheers man. I'm not using an actual golf club wrench as my 2nd hand club didn't come with it. I've just got a stubby ratchet driver with a Star head that fits. Hoping the head doesn't fly off one day!
I'm a senior golfer, wondering if there is enough of a difference in shaft weight, rather than flex, especially with graphite, to make a real difference in swing speed. If so, what weight among graphite shafts should I consider using? Thanks.
Yes shaft weight matters but so does flex. Also as you get older driver loft is critixal - I switched my 77 year old dad to a callaway xr16 driver in 15 degree loft reg shaft and he’s never drove it so far and so straight. Good luck
I find light A flex graphite helps in the top part of my bag for some extra speed, Driver to 7 iron, 8 to pw I play a light steel in reg flex, 52 and 56 wedge I play in a flighted 6.0 project x. This setup has allowed me to keep some distance in the top part of my bag as I've aged and control in my scoring half of the bag. Hope this helps.
Good morning Gents. Redbull and watching James and Foxy testing the flex in their shafts. 😂
If i was Foxy, I'd be looking for a full set of those Srixon's on Ebay right now!
Ok he is a high handicapper, but what is his swing (club head) speed and how much would shaft stiffness relate to slower swing speeds? One last point, I did enjoy this video and it was informative, but someone can be a high handicapper because they are poor in all aspects of the game, or play poor in one aspect, for instance some high handicappers can hit good irons but have trouble with chipping, pitching and putting, some have trouble getting off the tee.
Foxy’s swing was looking better there. I think he gets that tempo down and he will do much better. He has an athletic build but has looked clumsy at times with his swing but he’s just getting going here. Probably get down to a mid handicap in a couple of years.
Interesting test. If you chose a shaft based on the numbers here you might go for the regular (higher launch and spin), but the stiff clearly felt better for Foxy and enabled him to start the ball on line a lot more consistently (going 1* upright might get a similar result with the regular).
I just did a fitting this week and tried 6 different iron heads, all with different shafts (all standard no up charge). The best results came from two different heads with two different graphite shafts, and both gave me much better feel for the clubhead than any of the heads I tested with steel shafts. Interestingly, I’ve been using steel shafts in my irons for 17 years! Maybe I’m just getting old and slowing down - wish I could hit 7i 180 like Foxy 💪
You could add 10+ yards with forged irons.
@@killan001 The results I was describing at my fitting were using forged irons.
I find it hard to quantify, I have stiff shaft irons, stiff tipped 5 wood, regular mini driver (3 wood replacement but fills the yardage gap better) and x stiff driver and 2 iron. I dont notice anything different really, my gapping is as you would want between clubs, dont have to try harder with some vs others and dispersion doesnt drastically change. Miss is always the same way, doesnt change so im not so adamant on what shaft flex I must play anymore.
One of the biggest factors the right shaft can improve is face contact. If u ever use a shaft thats too whippy or too stiff your biggest problem isnt gonna be “squaring the face” its going to be hitting the ball on the center of the face 😂 which is why its important for higher hdcpers to use the right equipment, while at the same time dont really notice a big difference when they use the wrong equipment. Cause they arent finding the center of the face that often anyways 😂
This has been driving me crazy for months now. I’ve been watching your vids just enjoying the fitting experience. I decided to go and get fitted myself from a local shop. From the start I didn’t enjoy their experience. Im not a fitter so I just put my trust into them. I have a 97mph club head speed so they put me into the modus 120 stiff. I hit about 7 balls with it and they said this is for you and I ordered the clubs(6 week back order) I then went golfing in another town and met a rep from Mizuno. I wanted to try out their t22 wedges since I was getting their clubs and he told me since I was getting their clubs to come out and he will do a full fitting for me. Spent time with him and when we were done we had 2 completely different clubs. First was mizuno 223 with modus 120 s, and the second was mizuno 223 with modus 120 x stiff and +2 upright. He had me go back and change my order through them. So I called them and asked if I could try them side by side on the monitor. They were bitchy but let me hit about 5 balls each then told me they messed up because the x stiff has better data. So we ordered them and After 2 months I finally get to swing them. But they feel so damn heavy. The clubs Mae me feel like I need to swing harder just to get them up to speed which is throwing off my game badly. I liked the way the stiff felt, but I’m not a fitter and he told me they would never put someone with a 97 mph speed into a stiff. So I’m not sure what to do as the stiff felt way better but I was convinced to purchase the x stiff. Either way I can’t take them back, but I know golf is a huge mental game and it’s driving me crazy. Should I stick with the x stiff and just try to make it work or should I sell these clubs on eBay for a loss and start over?
Hmmm maybe see your local pro and see what they say?
some fitters are just salesmen mate, you have to go to a good one.
Foxy must be the best 25 handicap in the world! 180 with a 7 iron?!
But he is tall so he must lots of centrifugal force.
On foresight this plays downhill 17 yards. It’s roughly a 160 shot. No knock on foxy…I think he’ll get well below 25 this year
@@garrettmckelvie this makes me feel better lmao. My 7 goes about 165 with game improving irons off a 13 HC
I have a buddy who can’t brake 100 but he is strong and can hit a 7 190
Distance isn’t everything
Hey JR. Why is Foxy a 25 handicap? He plays with you enough to be improving. Is he stubborn?
This exactly represents why all these tests should be done with the Iron Byran machine to take all the doubts away. If nobody is doing this on RUclips we all know why because they can't get paid.
Foxy swings really well when he takes his time and not just base one out - Hark at me 28 handicapper coaching! 😂😂😂
For a particular shaft, what specifically is being done to the shaft to make a senior vs stiff.
It always struck me as odd when I would look at the different specs between senior, regular, stiff for a certain shaft and they all had the same weight (within a gram), same length, and same torque (within a tenth)
Great swing for a 25 handicaper.
After seeing Foxy hitting 175 - 180 7 irons , I would like to see him in a Project X 6.5 LZ maybe up against the 6.0LZ but definitely leaning towards a X flex maybe in a Modus 105 X or Dynamic gold 105 X if he needs more landing angle to offset the low spin numbers .
I'd really like to try the dynamic gold 105 in the x100 flex
With standard deviation there is no difference.
How on earth is he hitting the ball that distance with a 7 iron when you James only hit a ping i200. 6 iron 180 yards when you went to SGGT and you are a pro.????
I feel let down by the title, this is not a game changer. Basically there was very little difference between the shafts. Same distance, same spin rates same ball flight. Maybe a slight indication that a stiff shaft may help him be a little more consistent but all I saw were good and bad shots with both which is basically the noise of a 25 handicap. He did prefer the feel of it which is important and he did work out which was the stiff but it took quite a few shots. I do find it so funny that people still believe that a shaft will drastically change how a 25 handicap performs. I tell you what will change it, lessons and lots of practice.
Dead on. It’s an interesting test, but misleading to pretend that any definitive conclusion can be made from such limited, noisy data
It definitely helped me out. Was using a stiff and stepped back down to reg and I’m hitting it 35/40y longer and straighter.
Are you intentionally ignoring the improved dispersion, or did you not think that it was good enough to warrant consideration?
@@fritoboat13 go back and watch the video. The dispersion pattern for the regular flex is actually smaller(I.e the red circles is smaller than the blue one). Yes he hit a few closer to the pin with the blue but as the so called dispersion pattern shows there were plenty off line with the stiff. Could he repeat this on the course and will it make a difference, probably not. You could give a regular shaft and lessons over just fitting a stiff shaft and he will be better with the regular.
ok now let a 45-50 yr old do the same test ,, at 59 im just now starting to use regular flex from stiff my whole life , my swing speed is just not as fast as before ,, i notice with the reg flex my ball flight is longer and more consistent then using stiff flex ,, i actually brought my handicap back down to a 10-12 after it s been going up the last couple of yrs was hovering around 15-17 ,, and yes luv the Srixon irons was using the Z785s stiff shaft but just ordered the ZX7s PW-5 reg shaft ,, cant believe the young man holds a 25 handicap he was throwing darts
Stiff vs. Regular seems to me to be more of a comparison of shaft STIFFNESS, not "flex". I think of FLEX as more descriptive of a comparison between a "high kickpoint" vs. a low one.
Very interesting. IMO weight makes much more of a difference between shafts than flex
Does handicap level actually affect shaft stiffness? Shouldn't that just be swing speed related?
Nope. Totally swing eelated
This goes on for an infinite amount of time. Like most of these videos. On and on and on longer than a regular 18-hole round
Stiff shafts are the favorite shafts at Ping!
The more I watch videos about shafts the more I realise that there are no "rules" about what shafts work best for any particular player, the "rules" are simply loose guidance and, just to annoy fitters everywhere, in a fitting you need to try many different shafts to find that one that seems to suit you best.
For me, shaft weight seems more important than flex. So I play 80g reg in my irons, 70g stiff in my hybrid and having just had a driver fitting I may go from a 44.5" long reg 60g shaft in my driver to a TM Stealth with a 45.75" long, 50g stiff shaft. But that is just me, everyone is different
High handicapper hitting a 7 iron 179 yards, holy crap
Is there a website I can go on to to find a shaft flex comparison? This is just watching a man hit a large bucket of balls. By the way he's not a 25 handicapper.
What’s his swing speed?
He hit 117 ball speed on one of his good strikes. So I'm guessing mid 80s
Kid swings a nice club for a 25 handicap. I played an 11 handicap last year and would take 90% of those shots. Not to mention if I'm playing 175 I'm hitting a 6 iron.
What.......the........fox??? That's some impressive 7 iron distance, not bad stoppage either.
As a 25 HC I'd take every one of those first 12 shots!!
How does a 25 hit it 180 with a 7 Dx
🤣🤣🤣 foxy...yep "golf is bloody hard"
Not sure if a statistician would accept your results; might need greater number of shots and through out some outliers. One thing is for sure; this young man could use either shaft and be a 10-12 Hcp if he has a decent short game and course management . He hits it well enough with either; spend some time on short game practice.
11:50 is not the best posture. Jokes aside, my slx microsim says i got average driver clubhead speed of 103mph, but i am only hitting balls for a month so i have everything in regular flex. Damn i think i need a fitting now. My wifes gonna kill me.
shaft flex is the trendy thing to play with because you can buy the right one and put a shiny sticker on it, but get your lie angles right and then start to see the real improvement in your dispersions all for the cost of 1 or 2 shafts...
It would be great if some of these "shaft flex" videos included A Flex shaft players and not just the young guys that bomb it with stiff shafts.
Kbs tour reg heavy (110?) great, take em any day. Kbs tour reg lighter…urgh. Kbs tour stiff (110) close but not quite. Project x reg graphite OMG sold. Just to be sure tried many others. Just unreal the difference in all shafts. Do not be blinkered by label or ego. Buy what fits you and you can’t blame the tools.
No way that lads a 25 hc with that consistency
It was an exceptional purple day
I reckon shaft 1 is stiff, tended to drift right. Shaft 2 is reg more kick helping to square the face…
Turns out I was wrong… very interesting 🤔
For me a stiff shaft in my irons felt like a telephone pole compared to a regular shaft.
Yeah, I can feel the difference at the top of my backswing. Doesn't feel like it's loading.
Mark crossfield would disagree with you, he done a shaft flex test a couple of weeks ago
Sneaky there James… KBS shafts in the thumbnail, ha! They are so backlogged they might as well be NFTs at this point.
25 handicap types typically can barely advance it.
You want to tell your mate Crossfield James, he swears blind shafts make no difference.. lol
Shaft flex is more important than club heads or anything else that you can bce flitted for other than a. All fitting. Just my opinion.
This guy is awfully consistent for a high handicapper. Obviously we haven't seen his short game nor his putting. I spoke too soon. His consistency went to what is more typical for him.
Clearly the blue dots the stiff shaft is scattered more than the red dots the red dots are closer to the green
This guy is a 25 handicaper. No way. I'm like a 30 and I can't even strike the ball consistently every time. I shank it a lot.
I thought shaft weight would be more important