I have been using Marine Juice for basically every Mini since you first showed it on your channel. Just recently I used your new recipe for an Imperial Fists test mini, but I must have messed up and the effect had weird pooling issues and was very spotty. I overbrushed it with yellow again, but I still wasn't happy. So I switched to Salamanders and so far it works like a charm over the new and fabulous Scorpy Green from Vallejo. Still the best wash ever in my opinion. 🙂
VERY USEFUL comparison. Thank you very much. I 100% agree about the re-formulated Citadel shades. I'm hoping they re-release the original formulas before my stockpile runs out.
There are absolutely subtle differences - I suspect even more noticeable in the real world as opposed to being on the screen. The other take away is that, if you don't have the specific one indicated in a color scheme, any of them will actually get the job done; in spite of the differences, they are more similar than not. Thanks as always for the insights!
With the new nuln oil that's less dark and pigment dense, I've had pretty good results using 2:1 nuln:reikland as my marine juice without any medium. I don't have any of the old stuff to compare it to, but it nicely fills the same role of a universal shade
I've just started messing with the AK Deep Shades, they seem to behave a lot like the old GW washes, though they are slightly more gloopy when you apply them. I think they're well worth a look mate 😎
I'm just coming to the end of my marine juice stash, so this is perfect. I tend to put a little sepia in mine, so I'll have to play around and find a new combo I like. Cheers as always.
Ultimately, 'mix a shade you like' is a bit of a process, but I think it bears mentioning occasionally how easy it can be once you've got your colours dialed in.
The juice is loose - it's hard to beat. FYI I think a reason why the juice recipes work so well is the raw acrylic medium GW uses is just great. Lahmian mixes better with acrylics than any other medium I've tried. Some others like liquitex do prevent coffee stains to the same degree. But "artist" mediums in my experience tend to be mixed too thickly for miniature work. They transport the pigments of washes mixed with them in a way that causes odd pooling of color. Also, I suspect a reason why some folks have had trouble with the mkII mixture is Army Painter tones are great - but went they settle and separate the pigments clump very badly. You REALLY REALLY have to mix and shake AP washes if they've settled. Otherwise you'll find gluey streaks and splotches all over the surface.
Man, that Thunder Warrior looking marine is still as cool as I remember it watching you paint him up. This video was really helpful. I know when I started painting it took me a bit to really get which washes to use on what colors to create the effects I needed. Hell, I still struggle with that from time to time. But if for someone just starting to get into painting minis, this video would be really helpful right out of the gate.
I have used the shades you have recommended in the past and they all worked very well. I like the Marine Juice but I also like the Dark Tone thinned 50/50 with the Quick Shade Medium. This was a very interesting and helpful tutorial. I have learned a lot from your channel. Thanks for sharing this.
I’m painting a ton of late war British Infantry for Bolt Action and am using new formula Umber Wash from Vallejo Game Colour over their English Uniform Spray primer, a couple of ‘glayers’ over the top, job done. The results are stunning and look like they took hours.
Thanks for the video, Troy. I happened to have a partial bottle of old-formula Nuln Oil and some Dark Tone, and a nearly full bottle of Reikland Fleshshade. So overall, enough to mix myself up a big old bottle of this stuff. I've seen it (and probably asked about it) in your videos before, so I'm looking forward to giving it a go!
Great video, thanks for the breakdown! You've really opened up my pallette to loads of other options when it comes to washes. I think I'm now in the market for some new marine juice!
I'd almost want to see neat Reikland Fleshshade for comparison. Or as an example of going too far. Big fan of Army Painter and Quickshade mix. Just to add a bit of trivia. I find neat strong tone over a metallic is a great visual effect for grease or hydraulic fluids. Make of that what you will
Distilled water works well for thinning washes too. Cheaper than medium at least. It's what I've been doing lately and the difference between using water from the tap is noticeable - especially if you live in a place with hard water.
Important detail I think it's lost in camera, Strong Tone has a somewhat "glossy" finish (or at least happened to me the time I tried it). I think it may have some kind of barnish included, maybe thought as a 1 coat solution, shade+barnish. Something to be considered.
He's a 3D print, from Modiphius. I printed him at 116% scale so he's the same size as Star Wars Legion figures, but they also produce a resin set of miniatures if you don't have a printer.
What range is the Bavarian Grenadier from; he looks like he'd fit in well with 40k minis. I like how the mud on his trousers reflects how the fabric rises up as the legs are bent to kneel down or climb over something. All in all, this looks to great technique and the models are all spiffing.
His shirt starts with a base of 3:1 Vallejo Tan Yellow and Valleo Beige, a coat of the Marine Juice, then a veeeeery light drybrush of Beige to add some texture, and thin highlights of Beige with a brush at creases to sharpen some of the detail.
@SonicSledgehammerStudio brilliant! Really looks great thanks for coming back to me, I'm starting a Steel Legion force and found your 2 videos on them, thinking I will use this as the colour for their great coats and marine juice too
This is great, thanks! What kind of brush did you use? I'm having trouble getting my shade to spread evenly, and I think the brush may be a part of that.
Bigger is better with an all-over wash, generally. I use the Medium Shade Brush from GW, and it's worked well for years. Otherwise most any relatively big brush with a fat well in the bristles will do the job.
Could you tell me where the ultramarine looking chap was from please. That's some great 80's looking, mega-city 1 looking bad ass dude if I ever saw one. Great video as always, appreciate the content :]
Thanks for the video, very interesting. I wonder why you used Lahmian Medium rather than contrast medium as they are thinner than paints. I’m going to try both to see if there’s any difference!
With The Army Painter launching their new fanatic range, do you know if their "Dark Tone" is getting a new formula? Are you stocking up on the old one ? :P
Thank you for this very informative comparison. I'm thinking of using shading over white undercoat as an quicker alternative to Slapchop technique. I mean painting the whole mini with an pure white undercoat then applying an shade (like Marine Juice) all over, then applying Contrast (or any brand Contrast-like) paints. Have you ever tried a similar approach ? If succesful it will speed up the slapshop process but I'm worrying about details getting filled up by too large amounts of shade + Contrast.
Have you tried the Marine Juice using Contrast Medium? Just out of curiosity of course. Also, that's a really great recipe for a skin wash. I always find washes out of the bottle to be too overwhelming for skin, and especially faces. I'll have to mix some up and try it out.
Thank you for showing the new recipe for the juice and shade comparisons. Curious, with the marine juice having a reddish tint, would it be a good shade for say painting up Blood Angels or red armor?
It should work! It's dark enough that it'll settle nicely in the detail and still give it a bit of shading without significantly changing the main red colour.
I'm on a quest to find a replacement for Agrax. The new formula introduced a couple years ago is awful. Trying strong tone now. Have yet to try acrylic washes from AK interactive, Vallejo and Ammo by MIG.
I've found that thinning the Agrax with a couple dotes of medium gives a consistency far more similar to the old stuff; just enough to break that gloopy texture of the Contrast-style medium it uses now and it's golden. Of course, that'll slightly thin the colour as well, so it's not a straight-up solution, though I do like thinning most of my shades anyhow.
Here is my recipe for full Army Painter Marine Juice: 1 part of Strong Tone + 1 Flesh Wash + 1 Quickshade Wash Mixing Medium. It is usefull if I need to mix the juice just for one miniature or dont want to prestock with full bottles. Just counting drops with simple math :)
what would be an alternative for lamian medium? could I Try water? and would you recommend it for stuff like ultramarines if I want to achieve a bit of an older colour on the gold trims
I have been using Strong Tone with Quickshade Mixing Medium in a 50/50 mix for quite some time. A painter I know goes with 4 parts Lahmian Medium, 3 parts Nuln Oil and 3 parts Reikland Fleshshade. Thats going to be my next Marine Juice.
For Crimson Fists I'd probably use Nuln Oil; Marine Juice is pretty versatile but on *really* dark colours like that, a stronger shade would work better.
He's a 3D print, from Modiphius. I printed him at 116% scale so he's the same size as Star Wars Legion figures, but they also produce a resin set of miniatures if you don't have a printer.
Hey all, I recently started painting imperial fists and Im having a lot of trouble with applying the marine juice to the model. It makes all of the areas super dark and brown, and streaks, partially because Im trying to be so thin with it since its been so dark. The creases in the armor look good, but the flat parts are pooled, streaky and a bad brown yellow. Does anyone have any suggestions for what I could be doing wrong or has run into this in the past? Im applying it straight from the pot (24 ml L medium : 18 ml dark tone: 18 ml riekland fleshshade).
Sounds like you've spotted the first issue, though. By trying to apply less, you're ending up it working more as a stain than a wash; you really want to be pretty generous first throwing it on so that it has a chance to settle in the recesses and pool. While it's wet, you can wick stuff away (especially around shoulder pads and flat panels like legs). It will dry lighter than it appears going on, so try to hold your nerve and apply enough of it at first for it to settle the way it should. A shade brush or similar is a good choice - trying to apply it with a Medium Layer brush or something along those lines is going to give certain parts time to dry while you're working, and that's another way you'll get streaking and grimy tide marks.
Hey sonic! How would you go about making a zerg 'creep' base? If you dont know what it is, thats the web like organic material from the starcraft series. Some of leviathan's new models feature patches of the effect in their sculpts. Cheers!
The really short answer is I wouldn't, I'm afraid. 😅 I'm not really into spending a lot of time on the bases, so I don't have an arsenal of extra bits to do them beyond paint and grass.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio Totally fair, you're my favorite go to guy for tips and such so sorry if I ask too much or too often. Infact its thanks to your 'how to paint Raptors space marines' video I now have a kill team of Raptor intercessors! Planning to do the leviathan marines the same, so thanks for everything! :)
Great video!! I’ve tried it and it seems to stain my yellow imperial fists. Can you use this one larger areas or do you recommend only models with lots of areas to flow into like contrast paint? Does this work well on blood angels red? It is helpful seeing all the shades over white.
It should work on Imperial Fists; it's how I painted the guy in the video, after all. If you're getting stains, try adding a little more Medium, or don't let it settle as heavily on flat areas - move around big clumps while you're applying it. It should work fine over Blood Angels as well.
my online video translator may be translating incorrectly. It is necessary to mix a dark tone of 18 ml and a Lamian medium of 24 ml, do I understand correctly?
I've got a question about getting Marine Juice in other colours? For going for a more blue tint or Grey/white tint what would you swap out the Reikland Flesh and Dark tone for?
Thanks for the comparison vid very useful. Have you ever tried thinning your shades with alcohol 70% it seems to give me a better result. I'd be curious if it would help with the new Agrax formula.
Great video. Was waiting for that. BTW, do you still use Aly’s Brown Liquid? And do we have to adapt the formula? Or did you switch to Marine Juice completely?
Fantastic video as usual man! Tried my hand at making some Marine Juice and while it looks great, I noticed that I'm getting quite a bit of foam after shaking. I often have to scoop it out / off with the side of my brush. Any ideas why this might be or if you've run into this yourself in the past?
The foam is just how the medium reacts to a bit of the ol' ultra-violence during shaking. You can just stir your brush around the pot a couple times and use it straight away, or let the bubbles settle and after a couple minutes the wash will still be good to use.
After. Almost always after; it's a very, very rare occasion I'd do a decal before a shade, even if there's weathering to be done. As long as it's applied before varnishes, though, you're good.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio - thanks mate. I recently did a test of the previous marine juice versus a few other shades over White Scar, and it came up well. I had a really nice Nuln based brew result in the same test but was unable to repeat it for some reason. If it tests up well I intend to do a bunch of Luna Wolves units with I am putting together at the moment with the new v2.0 Juice recipe.
Any recommendations on fixing marine juice with the newer shades? As a new painter I made the old formula from a video of yours with the new shades of nuln oil and such, 1 part of each, before seeing this lol. Just curious if it is just best to restart? Stick with it currently? Or if I can just add something here or there to bring it closer to mk2?
I have Blood Angels and I am wondering if I should put marine juice only over the red and black parts, or on the yellow aquila too? I paint them the 2nd edition Blood Angels theme. Or should I use over the yellow just Reikland fleshshade?
Aly's Brown Liquid will, luckily, still work pretty similarly with the new shades. The amount of medium in the mix is what breaks the Contrast-style consistency of the new washes, letting them flow and pool more similarly to the old washes, and the colours are near enough identical to the old pots. New Sepia is just a tiiiiny fraction more yellow than old Seraphim Sepia, but you can swap for AP Soft Tone instead.
Could anyone write the full "receipe" of Marine Juice mkII as a response for this comment? It's not easy, when english is not your native language, to understand the full receipe... :/ Is it 1 Full bottle of ReiklandFleshade + 1 Full bottle of Lahmian Medium + 1 Full bottle of dark tones?
A bottle of Reikland Fleshshade, a bottle of Dark Tone, and a bottle of Lahmian Medium. Or 3:3:4 in ratio if you want to do it by mixing parts to test it. I've added it to the description, too.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio thanks a lot! 😁😁😁 Another question: have you ever tried to use cold tones instead of warm tones (like reikland fleshade is) in your mix to get deeper shadows?
Question about something I don't think you've mentioned. Have you tried the new nuln oil/reikland fleshshade with about half as much medium? Since the formula change was specifically to bring in some of the qualities you're looking for in marine juice (subtler effect, less pooling) it seems like continuing to us them and playing with the ratios may work fine?
The new Nuln Oil doesn't behave *anything* like what it used to; I've adjusted the medium ratio, but it then results in the shade mix pooling differently to the old stuff, clinging to more flat areas and such. The Reikland/New Nuln mix also isn't as close to the Reikland/Dark Tone mix colour-wise. It's a faff, but Dark Tone's cheaper than a bottle of New Nuln anyway. ;D
I am curious as to why you havent shown what new Marine Juice (new Nuln, new Reikland, Lamian) looks like? Or have you? If you used the one bottle of each (18, 18, 24), you still end up with the extra Lamian. Wouldnt that make the same difference? If not, it would be nice to see what it looks like compared to everything shown in this video. You say its bad but dont show us why. Makes things confusing.. Unless I've just completely missed it, which is possible
I haven't used the new Nuln in a mix in the video because it's basically water past a point. It'd honestly just be a waste of material. If you want to try it and see how it looks for yourself, by all means, but I'd rather share what I know to work.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio fair point. I'd try it myself, but being disabled and on a fixed income, I'm not able to afford more paints at this time. Maybe by December I can give it a go. I was just hoping to see what it looked like before I could make some myself
How? That's not the ratios suggested at all. One bottle of each mixed together should be sufficient, and *maybe* a little extra Lahmian Medium if you prefer it.
You're reading it wrong, 3:3:4 is the ratio, it's what you get when you use an 18ml bottle of Dark tone, 18ml bottle of Reikland and 24ml bottle of medium. 18, 18 and 24 each divided by 6 is 3:3:4. Put another way, use the 3 bottles and get 60ml of Marine Juice. 😉
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Dziękujemy.
I have been using Marine Juice for basically every Mini since you first showed it on your channel. Just recently I used your new recipe for an Imperial Fists test mini, but I must have messed up and the effect had weird pooling issues and was very spotty. I overbrushed it with yellow again, but I still wasn't happy. So I switched to Salamanders and so far it works like a charm over the new and fabulous Scorpy Green from Vallejo.
Still the best wash ever in my opinion. 🙂
VERY USEFUL comparison. Thank you very much. I 100% agree about the re-formulated Citadel shades. I'm hoping they re-release the original formulas before my stockpile runs out.
There are absolutely subtle differences - I suspect even more noticeable in the real world as opposed to being on the screen. The other take away is that, if you don't have the specific one indicated in a color scheme, any of them will actually get the job done; in spite of the differences, they are more similar than not.
Thanks as always for the insights!
These are some of my favourite videos, the differences between comparable products from different ranges, strengths weaknesses and different uses.
With the new nuln oil that's less dark and pigment dense, I've had pretty good results using 2:1 nuln:reikland as my marine juice without any medium. I don't have any of the old stuff to compare it to, but it nicely fills the same role of a universal shade
I've just started messing with the AK Deep Shades, they seem to behave a lot like the old GW washes, though they are slightly more gloopy when you apply them. I think they're well worth a look mate 😎
This must be *the* definitive video on Marine Juice. Great stuff, love it!
I'm just coming to the end of my marine juice stash, so this is perfect. I tend to put a little sepia in mine, so I'll have to play around and find a new combo I like. Cheers as always.
Ultimately, 'mix a shade you like' is a bit of a process, but I think it bears mentioning occasionally how easy it can be once you've got your colours dialed in.
I've been using Army Painter Dark Tone, Fresh Wash and wash mixing medium.
I was literally just coming back to your channel to have a look at the marine juice recipe from one of your older videos! This is perfect, thank you!
The juice is loose - it's hard to beat. FYI I think a reason why the juice recipes work so well is the raw acrylic medium GW uses is just great. Lahmian mixes better with acrylics than any other medium I've tried. Some others like liquitex do prevent coffee stains to the same degree. But "artist" mediums in my experience tend to be mixed too thickly for miniature work. They transport the pigments of washes mixed with them in a way that causes odd pooling of color.
Also, I suspect a reason why some folks have had trouble with the mkII mixture is Army Painter tones are great - but went they settle and separate the pigments clump very badly. You REALLY REALLY have to mix and shake AP washes if they've settled. Otherwise you'll find gluey streaks and splotches all over the surface.
Man, that Thunder Warrior looking marine is still as cool as I remember it watching you paint him up. This video was really helpful. I know when I started painting it took me a bit to really get which washes to use on what colors to create the effects I needed. Hell, I still struggle with that from time to time. But if for someone just starting to get into painting minis, this video would be really helpful right out of the gate.
That Bavarian Grenadier is lovely! Nice job
I love using Marine Juice over Slap Chop paint jobs. It is wonderful for tying everything together for a more realistic finish.
I always struggled with shading before seeing your videos. Thank you!
I have used the shades you have recommended in the past and they all worked very well. I like the Marine Juice but I also like the Dark Tone thinned 50/50 with the Quick Shade Medium. This was a very interesting and helpful tutorial. I have learned a lot from your channel. Thanks for sharing this.
I also love Marine Juice but use a bit more Lahmian Medium in the ratio so the effect is more subtle. Thanks for the tips and comparisons!
I’m painting a ton of late war British Infantry for Bolt Action and am using new formula Umber Wash from Vallejo Game Colour over their English Uniform Spray primer, a couple of ‘glayers’ over the top, job done. The results are stunning and look like they took hours.
Thanks for the video, Troy. I happened to have a partial bottle of old-formula Nuln Oil and some Dark Tone, and a nearly full bottle of Reikland Fleshshade. So overall, enough to mix myself up a big old bottle of this stuff. I've seen it (and probably asked about it) in your videos before, so I'm looking forward to giving it a go!
Super interesting - I was hoping for an in-depth look at Marine Juice. And there was a Terry Thomas reference!
i just finished off my first mix of MJ going to get the stuff to get the stuff to make more tomorrow
Great video, thanks for the breakdown! You've really opened up my pallette to loads of other options when it comes to washes. I think I'm now in the market for some new marine juice!
Thanks for making the comparison video, great insight, if you’re not using this juice I highly recommend it.
Thanks! I want to make some Marine Juice for an army I am working on! 😊
I'd almost want to see neat Reikland Fleshshade for comparison. Or as an example of going too far. Big fan of Army Painter and Quickshade mix. Just to add a bit of trivia. I find neat strong tone over a metallic is a great visual effect for grease or hydraulic fluids. Make of that what you will
I use contrast medium in mine. I find it helps keep the flat surfaces clear.
Distilled water works well for thinning washes too. Cheaper than medium at least. It's what I've been doing lately and the difference between using water from the tap is noticeable - especially if you live in a place with hard water.
This was a brilliant demonstration!
Battle Mud wash by Two Thin Coats is the bomb.
Troy awesome video, I noticed the marine juice seemed to flow better and not pool.
I like the comparisons displayed here. Have you tried Duncan Rhodes's Battle Mud wash yet?
Thank you I’m definitely going to make this
Important detail I think it's lost in camera, Strong Tone has a somewhat "glossy" finish (or at least happened to me the time I tried it). I think it may have some kind of barnish included, maybe thought as a 1 coat solution, shade+barnish. Something to be considered.
I'll try that. Thank you for sharing! Great video!
Wow, that miniature really DOES look like Terry-Thomas!
Thank you so much for explaining this
Great video as always!
Thank you , Troy .
🐺 Loupis Canis .
Who makes the Star Trek miniature? That would be fun for my Stargrave crew!
He's a 3D print, from Modiphius. I printed him at 116% scale so he's the same size as Star Wars Legion figures, but they also produce a resin set of miniatures if you don't have a printer.
Is that lovely Kirk the Modiphius one?
What range is the Bavarian Grenadier from; he looks like he'd fit in well with 40k minis. I like how the mud on his trousers reflects how the fabric rises up as the legs are bent to kneel down or climb over something. All in all, this looks to great technique and the models are all spiffing.
PianoWargames.de - available as STL or in white metal! They're stunning, really; all the Piano Wargames stuff is really beautifully sculpted.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio Thank you 👍
Great vid Troy, really useful.
What a fantastic video thank you for sharing! What yellows have you used on Captain Kirk?
His shirt starts with a base of 3:1 Vallejo Tan Yellow and Valleo Beige, a coat of the Marine Juice, then a veeeeery light drybrush of Beige to add some texture, and thin highlights of Beige with a brush at creases to sharpen some of the detail.
@SonicSledgehammerStudio brilliant! Really looks great thanks for coming back to me, I'm starting a Steel Legion force and found your 2 videos on them, thinking I will use this as the colour for their great coats and marine juice too
Great video. Thank you
Could we get a comparison between using dark tone and using the new nuln oil?
I spy a Thunder Warrior. He looks really good. Also sweet video topic today
super intresting video, thanks!
This is great, thanks! What kind of brush did you use? I'm having trouble getting my shade to spread evenly, and I think the brush may be a part of that.
Bigger is better with an all-over wash, generally. I use the Medium Shade Brush from GW, and it's worked well for years. Otherwise most any relatively big brush with a fat well in the bristles will do the job.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio Thanks very much!
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio I got the medium shade brush, and it made a really big difference, thanks again!
Could you tell me where the ultramarine looking chap was from please. That's some great 80's looking, mega-city 1 looking bad ass dude if I ever saw one. Great video as always, appreciate the content :]
I would love to see if Marine Juice can be made with "Midwinter Medium."
If you've got some, it'd be worth mixing up a little amount and seeing how it goes. I haven't access to it myself, so you're on your own there!
Thanks for the video! Makes my life easier 😂.question what is the base color you used for the Bavarian rifle? Thanks!
Gore-Grunta Fur Contrast over a white primer, shaded with Marine Juice. ✌
Thanks! Keep up the great work!
The Napoleon trooper looks pretty darn cool.
Indeed. I can't imagine the amount of patience it takes to paint up a full Napoleonic Army; or even just a squad.
Welp crap, this throws a wrench in my shade plans for a Scarlett Blood Angels scheme for sure. Agrax, Reikland Fleshshade or Marine Juice??
Thanks for the video, very interesting. I wonder why you used Lahmian Medium rather than contrast medium as they are thinner than paints. I’m going to try both to see if there’s any difference!
With The Army Painter launching their new fanatic range, do you know if their "Dark Tone" is getting a new formula? Are you stocking up on the old one ? :P
Thank you for this very informative comparison.
I'm thinking of using shading over white undercoat as an quicker alternative to Slapchop technique. I mean painting the whole mini with an pure white undercoat then applying an shade (like Marine Juice) all over, then applying Contrast (or any brand Contrast-like) paints.
Have you ever tried a similar approach ? If succesful it will speed up the slapshop process but I'm worrying about details getting filled up by too large amounts of shade + Contrast.
What about over metallics? Golds, silvers in particular
Have you tried the Marine Juice using Contrast Medium? Just out of curiosity of course.
Also, that's a really great recipe for a skin wash. I always find washes out of the bottle to be too overwhelming for skin, and especially faces. I'll have to mix some up and try it out.
Thank you for showing the new recipe for the juice and shade comparisons. Curious, with the marine juice having a reddish tint, would it be a good shade for say painting up Blood Angels or red armor?
It should work! It's dark enough that it'll settle nicely in the detail and still give it a bit of shading without significantly changing the main red colour.
I'm on a quest to find a replacement for Agrax. The new formula introduced a couple years ago is awful. Trying strong tone now. Have yet to try acrylic washes from AK interactive, Vallejo and Ammo by MIG.
I've found that thinning the Agrax with a couple dotes of medium gives a consistency far more similar to the old stuff; just enough to break that gloopy texture of the Contrast-style medium it uses now and it's golden. Of course, that'll slightly thin the colour as well, so it's not a straight-up solution, though I do like thinning most of my shades anyhow.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio thank you for the tip. I have liquitex matte medium that I use to thin the strong tone. I'll try it on the Agrax.
Here is my recipe for full Army Painter Marine Juice: 1 part of Strong Tone + 1 Flesh Wash + 1 Quickshade Wash Mixing Medium. It is usefull if I need to mix the juice just for one miniature or dont want to prestock with full bottles. Just counting drops with simple math :)
what would be an alternative for lamian medium?
could I Try water?
and would you recommend it for stuff like ultramarines if I want to achieve a bit of an older colour on the gold trims
I have been using Strong Tone with Quickshade Mixing Medium in a 50/50 mix for quite some time. A painter I know goes with 4 parts Lahmian Medium, 3 parts Nuln Oil and 3 parts Reikland Fleshshade. Thats going to be my next Marine Juice.
Great vid! You mentioned using marine juice on lighter colors. I want to start painting crimson fists, is that too dark for marine juice?
For Crimson Fists I'd probably use Nuln Oil; Marine Juice is pretty versatile but on *really* dark colours like that, a stronger shade would work better.
@SonicSledgehammerStudio thanks so much for the response! Saved me a lot of headache
Great Tutorial, Thank You for sharing. The Capt. Kirk figure, who produced it? Hope you have a great week. Take care, Tony
He's a 3D print, from Modiphius. I printed him at 116% scale so he's the same size as Star Wars Legion figures, but they also produce a resin set of miniatures if you don't have a printer.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio Thank You !!!!!!😁
Hey all, I recently started painting imperial fists and Im having a lot of trouble with applying the marine juice to the model. It makes all of the areas super dark and brown, and streaks, partially because Im trying to be so thin with it since its been so dark. The creases in the armor look good, but the flat parts are pooled, streaky and a bad brown yellow. Does anyone have any suggestions for what I could be doing wrong or has run into this in the past? Im applying it straight from the pot (24 ml L medium : 18 ml dark tone: 18 ml riekland fleshshade).
Sounds like you've spotted the first issue, though. By trying to apply less, you're ending up it working more as a stain than a wash; you really want to be pretty generous first throwing it on so that it has a chance to settle in the recesses and pool. While it's wet, you can wick stuff away (especially around shoulder pads and flat panels like legs). It will dry lighter than it appears going on, so try to hold your nerve and apply enough of it at first for it to settle the way it should. A shade brush or similar is a good choice - trying to apply it with a Medium Layer brush or something along those lines is going to give certain parts time to dry while you're working, and that's another way you'll get streaking and grimy tide marks.
Hey sonic! How would you go about making a zerg 'creep' base? If you dont know what it is, thats the web like organic material from the starcraft series. Some of leviathan's new models feature patches of the effect in their sculpts. Cheers!
The really short answer is I wouldn't, I'm afraid. 😅 I'm not really into spending a lot of time on the bases, so I don't have an arsenal of extra bits to do them beyond paint and grass.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio Totally fair, you're my favorite go to guy for tips and such so sorry if I ask too much or too often. Infact its thanks to your 'how to paint Raptors space marines' video I now have a kill team of Raptor intercessors! Planning to do the leviathan marines the same, so thanks for everything! :)
Is there an alternative for reikland fleshshade? Perhaps from vallejo or one of the competing brands?
Great video!! I’ve tried it and it seems to stain my yellow imperial fists. Can you use this one larger areas or do you recommend only models with lots of areas to flow into like contrast paint? Does this work well on blood angels red? It is helpful seeing all the shades over white.
It should work on Imperial Fists; it's how I painted the guy in the video, after all. If you're getting stains, try adding a little more Medium, or don't let it settle as heavily on flat areas - move around big clumps while you're applying it. It should work fine over Blood Angels as well.
my online video translator may be translating incorrectly. It is necessary to mix a dark tone of 18 ml and a Lamian medium of 24 ml, do I understand correctly?
I've got a question about getting Marine Juice in other colours?
For going for a more blue tint or Grey/white tint what would you swap out the Reikland Flesh and Dark tone for?
Thanks for the comparison vid very useful. Have you ever tried thinning your shades with alcohol 70% it seems to give me a better result. I'd be curious if it would help with the new Agrax formula.
Marine juice….One freshly squeezed marines unit in every bottle.
Great scientific experiment ❤
Well consider me sold! I was looking for the best way to add some nuances to my Finnish troops.
What's your thoughts on using only Army Painter products? Dark tone, flesh tone, and the wash mixing medium?
It'll flow completely differently. You can try it, but the Quickshade Mixing Medium has a thicker consistency than Lahmian Medium by a wide margin.
Great video. Was waiting for that. BTW, do you still use Aly’s Brown Liquid? And do we have to adapt the formula? Or did you switch to Marine Juice completely?
Fantastic video as usual man! Tried my hand at making some Marine Juice and while it looks great, I noticed that I'm getting quite a bit of foam after shaking. I often have to scoop it out / off with the side of my brush. Any ideas why this might be or if you've run into this yourself in the past?
The foam is just how the medium reacts to a bit of the ol' ultra-violence during shaking. You can just stir your brush around the pot a couple times and use it straight away, or let the bubbles settle and after a couple minutes the wash will still be good to use.
Would you do decals before the Marine Juice, or after?
After. Almost always after; it's a very, very rare occasion I'd do a decal before a shade, even if there's weathering to be done. As long as it's applied before varnishes, though, you're good.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio - thanks mate. I recently did a test of the previous marine juice versus a few other shades over White Scar, and it came up well. I had a really nice Nuln based brew result in the same test but was unable to repeat it for some reason. If it tests up well I intend to do a bunch of Luna Wolves units with I am putting together at the moment with the new v2.0 Juice recipe.
Forgive me if you’ve posted it or have updated things, is there an updated new formula for Aly’s magic wash?
Any recommendations on fixing marine juice with the newer shades? As a new painter I made the old formula from a video of yours with the new shades of nuln oil and such, 1 part of each, before seeing this lol. Just curious if it is just best to restart? Stick with it currently? Or if I can just add something here or there to bring it closer to mk2?
thank you, now i can use my pots of marine juice without hesitation :).
I have Blood Angels and I am wondering if I should put marine juice only over the red and black parts, or on the yellow aquila too? I paint them the 2nd edition Blood Angels theme. Or should I use over the yellow just Reikland fleshshade?
How is marine juice different from Aly's Brown Liquid? Do you have an updated recipe for Aly's Brown Liquid?
Aly's Brown Liquid will, luckily, still work pretty similarly with the new shades. The amount of medium in the mix is what breaks the Contrast-style consistency of the new washes, letting them flow and pool more similarly to the old washes, and the colours are near enough identical to the old pots. New Sepia is just a tiiiiny fraction more yellow than old Seraphim Sepia, but you can swap for AP Soft Tone instead.
Free range marines… so funny. Thanks for another great video!
Could anyone write the full "receipe" of Marine Juice mkII as a response for this comment? It's not easy, when english is not your native language, to understand the full receipe... :/
Is it 1 Full bottle of ReiklandFleshade + 1 Full bottle of Lahmian Medium + 1 Full bottle of dark tones?
A bottle of Reikland Fleshshade, a bottle of Dark Tone, and a bottle of Lahmian Medium. Or 3:3:4 in ratio if you want to do it by mixing parts to test it. I've added it to the description, too.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio thanks a lot! 😁😁😁
Another question: have you ever tried to use cold tones instead of warm tones (like reikland fleshade is) in your mix to get deeper shadows?
Question about something I don't think you've mentioned. Have you tried the new nuln oil/reikland fleshshade with about half as much medium? Since the formula change was specifically to bring in some of the qualities you're looking for in marine juice (subtler effect, less pooling) it seems like continuing to us them and playing with the ratios may work fine?
The new Nuln Oil doesn't behave *anything* like what it used to; I've adjusted the medium ratio, but it then results in the shade mix pooling differently to the old stuff, clinging to more flat areas and such. The Reikland/New Nuln mix also isn't as close to the Reikland/Dark Tone mix colour-wise. It's a faff, but Dark Tone's cheaper than a bottle of New Nuln anyway. ;D
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio Good to know! Thanks!
Nice comparison video Sonic. How does Marine Juice stack up against Aly's Brown Liquid with the new formulations?
Would it work with other mediums like AP's speedpaint medium?
Hiya Mr Sledgehammer! I picked up the Umber wash when the new vallejo range game out and I'm having issues with porosity. Any suggestions?
I am curious as to why you havent shown what new Marine Juice (new Nuln, new Reikland, Lamian) looks like? Or have you? If you used the one bottle of each (18, 18, 24), you still end up with the extra Lamian. Wouldnt that make the same difference? If not, it would be nice to see what it looks like compared to everything shown in this video. You say its bad but dont show us why. Makes things confusing..
Unless I've just completely missed it, which is possible
I haven't used the new Nuln in a mix in the video because it's basically water past a point. It'd honestly just be a waste of material. If you want to try it and see how it looks for yourself, by all means, but I'd rather share what I know to work.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio fair point. I'd try it myself, but being disabled and on a fixed income, I'm not able to afford more paints at this time. Maybe by December I can give it a go. I was just hoping to see what it looked like before I could make some myself
I'd still recommend using the materials as presented in the video; the bonus is that Dark Tone is cheaper than Nuln Oil anyhow.
What is the exact ratio you used for marine juice mk 2? :o
A bottle of each. Which works out at 3:3:4 from two 18ml bottles with one 24ml bottle.
@@SonicSledgehammerStudio tysm!
❤ the video. Pin it. This is such a good reference and I think you're the only one who uses this wonder wash on the regular.
I thought marine juice was called geneseed
this is very expensive. I needed 3 bottles of Medium and Reikland and then 4 bottles of strong tone to make a nice batch of wash.
How? That's not the ratios suggested at all. One bottle of each mixed together should be sufficient, and *maybe* a little extra Lahmian Medium if you prefer it.
You're reading it wrong, 3:3:4 is the ratio, it's what you get when you use an 18ml bottle of Dark tone, 18ml bottle of Reikland and 24ml bottle of medium. 18, 18 and 24 each divided by 6 is 3:3:4. Put another way, use the 3 bottles and get 60ml of Marine Juice. 😉