Regarding future reviews, I intend to cover some of the older routes (e.g. Great Western Express and East Coastway). But I don't want to buy every single new DLC, and only review packs that I think are genuinely interesting. As such, I may review Mainz to Koblenz when it's released, but I won't review Skyhook's questionable Midland Mainline.
I’m glad we have players like you that are honest. So many others are giving bs that don’t know anything. I was so excited for this route until they gave us pathetic 288 which 101 are yard moves. I didn’t get this route and I’m glad. Only 10 ALP-46 pulling to Trenton 24 hour timetable. But like you said you have too many players and fan boys that just blindingly buy their routes. I sure they made their money. Now is on to the next German UK DLC
I love the honest reviews and how you stand up to DTG. I've tried saying things during their lives and either get muted or ignored. DTG and their fan boys don't care.
As an American player I'm tired of how biased dovetail is. It's actually insane the amount of excuses I hear from Matt when they are on stream as to why they couldn't do simple things to improve routes.
You're lucky Rivet Games have never done any American routes. I dread to think how badly they would screw up something like Marias Pass or the Alaska Railroad.
They need to start extending the lines. Next gen consoles can take extensions. Also crew base to crew base( I work for one of the railroads) so nyp-phili would be the crew base! By doing that, you can add long branch or for boston sprinter you can add other Mbta lines.
Those short turns to Jersey Avenue that make up a good chunk of the playable timetable are run almost exclusively with Arrow III’s, so that’s further insult to injury as far as leaving out the Arrows and their glorious woodgrain interiors.
You'd like to think that DTG are aware of the immense backlash against this route. Here's hoping they take the hint and add the Arrow III (amongst many other improvements).
I totally agree with you, I have tried my very best to not get DTGs dlc (Even tho it’s tempting). At the moment I’m willing to get SimRail because I think it has a bright future and it’s going to have modding. Great video as always, you have saved me from wasting 35€😄
They also seem to have all they cab cars going to ny but in real life nj transit doesn't do that some of their trains have the locomotive first going towards ny
I actually commute on this route with NJT daily and was looking forward to purchasing it however after your review I think I’ll wait until it’s on a decent sale. Thanks for the honesty! Totally agree with your critiques.
One other thought now that I remembered to finish watching this one: the standard ALP-46 predates the multilevel cars, and the uprated ALP-46A was specifically intended to handle the added weight of the larger trains. I’d be lying if I said I was observant enough to notice whether regular ALP46s are used exclusively with Comet trains in practice but the mismatch in the game might at least explain the poor acceleration.
They didn’t even add the Path trading at Newark. And irl the NEC is the “busiest train corridor in America you nearly see any trains. NJT realistically as a service every 15 minutes on there
Well the game doesnt have a PATH route, so i can understand that part. Wasnt there a game i think world of subways and they had the entire PATH route??And then when reaching Newark, u see static Amtrak SUPERLINERS peaking out the station smfh. Like superliners dont even operate for the NEC.
I agree that this route should have had more varied rolling stock like the aem-7, arrow III and single decker comet coaches. But something that would have made the route much more interesting would be if Dovetail changed the time period entirely. Specifically to the mid 1990s as Amtrak had much more cooler rolling stock and liveries back then. The rolling stock i’d want incuded would be aem-7 in phase III, e60 in phase III, amfleet in phase III, viewliner I in phase III, retro baggage car phase III, retro sleeper and pasanger car also in phase III, njt alp-44, njt single decker comets and njt arrow III.
Good review. I gave up on Dovetail games and Train sim world after they came out with the third iteration, which is almost exactly the same game as TSW 2. Just felt like a slap on the face after five years with few improvements. I came back to TSW when this route came out as I’m a NEC super fan being a local in the area, but after playing it it’s just wasted potential. Although this entire game is wasted potential. I seriously recommend checking out SimRail, which has a multiplayer mode that makes driving way more fun than TSW. It also has 300 miles of track so journeys are nice and long, and lots of different trains to choose from.
Yes you are correct . Im really pissed off especially when you have ambassadors out there that don’t known the US routes making comments like wow is this route is so busy. DTG don’t care about US content because they know they will get their sales and it won’t matter what state the route is in.
I don't like those ambassador / sellout channels at all, especially since they don't make proper reviews but rather glowing reports / adverts instead. I will never be one of them, and will always make independent reviews after buying DLC with my own money.
The lack of updates to broken routes after the initial release is also a huge problem! I am also fed up with the high prices and the below standards of routes so I will not be buying anymore dtg products until they get there shit together.
They have the geep 38’s on the map yet zero scenarios. These devs are beyond ridiculous. They shaft US dlcs leave them halfway completed and don’t have the geep 38’s scenarios available.
How Dovetail could of bollocked up so much is mind boggling, but unsurprising. I for one am not going to get this route, not in its current state. Which is a shame as I would of liked more track to drive the Acela for one. Also why Dovetail never brought back the New York to New Rochelle is baffling too.
Nice review... brutal and honest.. Always buy on sale... and by sale.. to be happy.. be around 50-60% off... Unfortunately, they are still the best thing out there... for now.
The May roadmap says that the devs are working on a bigger timetable for this route. Well, if they are fixing that, then they should be able to fix many of the things that ruin the immersion on the route, right?
I would just like to thank you man, a lot of things that you happen to mention were exactly the idea I had in mind such as the EMD SW1000R addon and espeically reusing the Newark Airport station up to Sunnyside. You really did show the world actually what Dovetail laziness really is to the US community espeically to me, I live in New Jersey myself and this just makes me feel upset as a lot of these stations on the NEC i've even been too, look nothing like it. Thank you again for really stepping up.
Great review, really love it. I do have a suspicion as to what DTG may have thought about. (Though before being yelled at, am not defending them) When at 20:19 you stated the station is way to empty, which I agree on, the part reason for this could be due to potential FPS drops, such as the one you had in An Honest Review of Bahnstrecke: Bremen - Oldenburg (Train Sim World 3) Though again, am not defending them as I went and bought this on a big sale, and just couldn't make myself enjoy it and had to refund, DTG is not making me buy their new expensive stuff, screw this.
That's a good idea, but they would have to include something other than the GP38-2 as we already have that engine with Sand Patch Grade. Same goes for the SD40-2, AC4400CW and C40-8W.
Loved the review, as this being my local line I'm absolutely disgusted and disappointed with DTG. Another thing I wanted to add on was the missing Morrisville yard just south of trenton only 2 miles away. That's my 2nd biggest gripe with the line Below the timetable. As operating the equipment I'm familiar with I just want the experience of doing round trips uninterrupted without trains despawning
Just bought the game was gonna buy the us passenger bundle or both us bundles but I watched this review and got the one with Birmingham Germany and Cajon pass
I remember when Microsoft had a train sim and the trains went far. I wish they would make a new one so we can dump TSW. Tired of 30-mile tracks for $32 a total rip off.
One of the reason's I don't like the route is because dovetail reused the LIRR New York Penn and Sunnyside yard section you know the nearly 5 year old route. Dovetail also reused the section between New York Penn and Newark International Airport you can tell because of the scenery and the water texture looking bad why did Dovetail reused 5 year old content instead of rebuilding the section we will never know. And if we ever got the New Haven line don't expect dovetail to reuse the same area between New York Penn and New Rochelle.
But probably not the sort of attention DTG wants. Seems like they want to, as I say in the video, barricade themselves in their echo chamber of fanboys and other yes-men.
With the amount of people buying overpriced addons and other useless stuff, I think they can afford to get the SEPTA license. Its a great game, just the some addons are rushed.
I bought this because I love njt and live in ny and compared to Harlem line it’s ok but the timetable it’s a simple update to make it busier. Two of the busiest routes with lax timetables.
The thing is we are getting to "what is even the point of this route?" turf. Yeah Clinchfield had a incomplete timetable, but it had one of the best journey modes ever put to a route. We are getting routes with incomplete timetables, and and slapped together journeys now of like 20 runs with no real flow to them.
now you said that, in boston sprinter, there is an extra two tracks with third rail on the southwest corridor, DTG should have put ai trains on the orange line. Hell, even make the MBTA subway route like The Red, Orange, and Blue subway line routes in Tsc or Tsw3 and there are more tracks on southampton street yard. this where the red line sit's in the yard. but it's incredibly empty. there stations on the adjacent northeast corridor. these are orange line subway stations dovetail didn't bother. you should make a honest review and criticism's and rant on the tsw 3 review, even though it's a tsw 2 route. you should do it. not only that there are no station platforms on the orange line stations on southwest corridor. and also the passengers information screens are 100% incorrect. and also the pawtucket central falls stations is absent and also they couldn't make the extension branch to Wickford Junction station and add T.F green airport station. and also they shouldn't make the Needham Branch. that goes to Needham Junction station. also they shouldn't go the worcester/framingham branch or short worcester branch 47 miles. or even to go the Lansdowne station to take sports fan to Fenway Park for Boston red sox baseball games. or even make the route to worcester. but this worst case scenario and far to ask. even theyshould pay more attention to the MBTA since they should make more routes and DLCS.
I do appreciate your honest reviews about these DLC's. Frankly I don't think this dlc is worth picking up on a sale. It's ridiculous that they increase prices and say they did it because of inflation only to then rush out these dlc's. DTG will never learn. SimRail will be releasing on consoles as well and I am glad because that game has alot of potential especially since there will be an editor and I hope it will be an alternative option to tsw
This tactic of releasing unfinished content and not at least coming back to fix it, is going to come back to bite them when another developer comes along to compete with them. Hopefully sooner rather than later. Then maybe they'll get their act together. For now I'm sticking to %50 off sales with DTG. I do like their game and graphics engines, but their quality and pricing leave something to be desired. Also why is it we can't see neighboring routes (Like NEC and LIRR) connect into one big package when you have all the DLC, this would solve a lot of the shortcomings, or is that beyond the capabilities of the engine for some reason?
There are two cases of previous routes that I think should be merged, but DTG have never done it for some reason. I'm referring to Ruhr-Sieg Nord + Rhein-Ruhr Osten and London Commuter + East Coastway + Southeastern High Speed (if the Hampden Park to Ashford section was added). Considering how expensive the add-ons are, and just how much people have had to pay these greedy sods, I think they should make a new engine or route and give it away for free.
This man speaks true words. 9:45 Oh thats why the textures are so bad in that part of the route. Now I get it. I Spent 48.58 Euros on the Acela And New York-Trenton and what do I get. A bad quality half assed Add-On. I want my money back! 22:17 these issues are also present on. Schnelfahrstrecke Köln-Aachen (cologne-Aachen), Dresden-Riesa, I think Hamburg-Lübeck or basically all catenary routes from tsw except Main Spessert Bahn and 1 or 2 more! I feel...Uhhh...Robbed!!! yeah thats like 50 Euros down the f*cking drain!!!
There are a few sections of missing wires on MSB, one of which is on the passenger line near Aschaffenburg Hbf going away from Gemünden Hbf. There are only about 3 tiny sections of missing wires on that route... thankfully there are not as many missing wires compared to this one and Dresden to Riesa, yet I enjoy Dresden to Riesa.
Honestly I ain't a American rail enthusiast but at least they brought back the original Northeast corridor with trenton I ain't a dovetail defender like certain ambassadors who I won't say names there's a few I agree with people they need to get out of the main 3 UK, US and Germany people want different European, Asia and other country's Honestly a Aussie route with the XPT would be great Eurostar route London St Pancras - Paris nord or Amsterdam ect.
I admit I love Train Sim World 3 because Train Sim World 2 had alot bugs and viruses issues throughout the game. But don’t get me wrong they should added more routes on New York and New Jersey and Long Island Railroad known as LIRR, I’m glad they add Amtrak Acela to the New York to Trenton route also it can use as commuter as well.
Yeah! We need to fired them the entire of Dovetail Games Team employees now for Being so lazy, Unfinished Work in Progress, Missing a overhead wire and catenary, Lack of scenery, & Also included using an old recycle sounds from previous locomotive of railwoks on this NEC: New York to Trenton. It looks like garbage. This it's got to stop that doing some stupid things on TSW3. This is ridiculous.😡
Hallo, every penny you pay to them is lost for nothing then dlc full with bugs never fixed. With njt there are some services long 12 min from sunyvale to ny try them most of them go nowhere or to wrong platforms, red lights or tracks with no overhead wires. Supreme dovetail quality. I think they never will be fixed.
All these issues, the missing overhead, AI pantographs down, heavy prices, and many more are leading to DTG for causing confusion and delay. But this was a very good review!
It's sad to see the severe decline in quality on US routes. I was really looking forward to this one but was on the fence since the $40 is quite high and players have complained about glitches. Ultimately I'm glad I didn't get it because this is worse than I feared. The pantos down and invisible catenary is unforgivable on an electric route. And the lack of AI layers is disappointing since London Commuter set a new standard. There should be constant LIRR trains, plus the NEC passes under the Lehigh line where there should be a CSX or NS train passing every 20 minutes. There are also daily freight trains here so they could've added a drivable GP38 layer but didn't. I don't get the lack of Princeton Branch since the Arrow could be a potential add on. And Secaucus station just looks bad. The textures look way too clean and cartoony, very out of place. One day I hope there can be a perfect US release...
it's a difficult choice for me, I picked it up on sale from a third party website for $15 so it was fine, but at full price it would have been weird, it is my main line and I use it every day to go from New Brunswick-NYC, I think it is modeled well, and the trains are good, but the safety systems are kind of bad, this video review seems a little bias though, and I would say it is alright, i think the main reason they didn't include the ALP45DP and Comet Coaches is because they would be difficult to do, with the ALP45 power changing stuff it would be complex, and the systems in the comet coaches that have both electric loco stuff and diesel loco stuff. But being a frequent rider on this route I think it is well done, the only thing I would have liked to see is the Arrow 3 EMU and an extension down to Philly with septa services, but I understand the license issue, I don't think any game has a septa license, but maybe in the future we could see it as another DLC, also would be nice if we could get a heritage loco pack for it, which could include the Amtrak AEM-7, and the NJT ALP44 electric locomotives, and maybe the HHP-8, and some Amtrak View liner Cars, but all in all I think it is a good route, just needs to have some updates to fix it, But I would not recommend this to be purchases at normal retail price, I would wait for a sale, on steam it can go down to $25, this short review is coming from someone who rides it all the time, and knows what the entire route looks like, I may be bias, but I have experience with this route. So, I will leave you with this, don't get it at full price, get it on sale, but I would recommend it, people say it is bad, but I think it is good, And I would know.
They can still add the ALP45 with comet couches but within a different route such as the North Jersey Coast Line and overall they were seen in train simulator classic
Great review as usual. So sick of DTG this might be the straw that breaks the camels back in my case. Certainly changing my view of pre-orders and all that. They completely dropped the ball on this one.
11 months late here, but what do you expect? Its typical of European train game developers to half ass US routes and stock. They all do it. We now have Railroader which is awesome but is set in the 1950’s in North Carolina. One day we may get a good North American dev team to come out with a good modern day sim for those of us who dont give a hoot about foreign rail. The prices are absolutely insane too. Thanks for the review!
They did a horrible job on this route as well, saying they ran out of time. Please this wouldnt been the same excuse if it was a UK route... The train traffic/timetable is DEAD once again, and not even a LIRR ai layer in and out of Penn Station. They also shouldve added a small portion of the North Jersey Coast Line as far as South Amboy and at least another addidition of Newark Broad Street. Then i wouldve tried this route, but thank god i didnt thanks to other reviews and videos to prove the garbage attempt by Dovetail. Supposingly the timetable is being reworked on and may come out and few months, but i diont believe it not one bit.
To be fair they don't have the arrows which only runs on the shuttle to Princeton so I can see them not adding that line alps don't run there and if they don't have septa license, they can't extend to Philadelphia because septa may own that area from Trenton to Philadelphia
personally i like the dlc, but this is also my first train sim. i am hoping and praying they add the jersey coast line to long branch. i take those trains alot. one gripe i have tho is once you leave the tunnel, its a bit barren.
Thanks for this will definitely help in my consideration to buy this add on! Edit: after seeing this is 58 DOLLARS 50 IM NOT BUYING IT even if it was perfect
I was disappointed with the Birmingham route which is like a ghost town, and I can’t play it, it loses all the immersion for me. I live near New street and although the station is well modelled its sooo much busier in real life. After watching your review you have saved me even contemplating buying this boring ghost route. Looks like they have been caught with their pantographs down again
I live in Maryland, US and I am utterly disappointed. I have been to New York Penn Station many times and even my mom said once when I was doing a LIR timetable that Penn needed to be more busy and the npc model variants were so sparse lol
3:37 Its about time they put a New Zealand Suburban route in TS Classic as well. Wellington and Aukland both. I am actually quite surprised that they did that NZ Midland route. I thought that DTG was allergic to the Pacific. (NZ and Australia).
Edinburgh - Glasgow was the last DTG product I bought. It was so bad and for £30 I could see the writting on the wall. Its a shame, but the quality is so poor I can't justify the cost. Sim Rail is much better in terms of putting player in front of business interests
I was so excited for this Route, but I don’t think I’m buying this. I’m done with dovetail games. They had so many chances to make this the best route in tsw3 but failed to I am extremely disappointed. Il. No longer play tsw3 again.
NGL, this addon is the first one i'm truly mad at. This Addon is in a horrible state. Some of the Issues will be fixed, but this route shouldn't have been released this week, it wasn't ready.
Don't tell DTG, because they seem to think there's no such thing as a route not being ready. They've proven with this one that they'll still release a route regardless of its condition.
I feel like a problem with the doing the NEC is that there hasn't been any frieght on this part of the corridor since the early 90s. If they did this route say back in the Penn Central or Even PRR days it would be more fun. Hell if they did it in the days of the Pennsy we could've had massive yards along the route with steam aswell. One of my friends told me once that US add-ons dont get any attention as there isn't any Americans in DTGs board of directors.
Warning: a brutal Kiwi at work. When companies make simulations which allow for no modding by the common simmer the simulation has limited appeal and has a limited life span. I support your well argued criticism of DTG in its rehashing of the NJT. I don't think abusing the people who control DTG decision making helps though. The business model of the company from the very beginning was to have tight control over the output of this rendition of train simulation. The original Train Simulator by Microsoft was a modders dream but the quality was highly variable. Coals to Newcastle was one the best examples of how a large scale map could be produced by a modder based on a historical information from a rarely modelled part of the world. It demonstrated what the limitations of such routes were but indicated the potential of train simming. DTG have stifled the creativity of the train simming public by not developing the opportunities from input by the general public. This is where the greatest complaint can be made at developers at DTG. But nothing will change because the average punter will still spend his/her hard earned New Zealand peso on what DTG serves up. Ching! Ching! Cheers from across the ditch.
I never had MSTS, but I think it's surprising that such an old game had good modding capacity while TSW barely has any. Incidentally the older Train Simulator 'Classic' still holds up today, and there's loads of people making good mods for it that keep the game alive.
Dovetail announced they were updating the NJT timetable (despite conveniently not bothering to add more NJT motive power like the Arrow 3 or ALP-45DP) and adding some freight services to this route, so I'd recommend waiting until that update is released.
Honestly, you should do a review on cane creek, I personally think the rolling stock is horrible because the sd40-2 and the ac4400cw are BOTH RECYCLED from Sand Patch Grade (which is also a bit of a disaster) and it’s so fcking boring to the point where I only have it to use the rolling stock for other lines, it’s so ridiculous, especially how the route map isn’t the same as how DTG presents this, I am usually a sucker when it comes to freight lines, the fact I can’t use the SD70ACE on this line is extremely disappointing. I should’ve not wasted my $27 on this line, the only difference between this lines rolling stock and Sand Patch Grade’s rolling stock is only the ditch lights, that’s it. Problem is they didn’t even BOTHER not changing the bell and the horn on the 2 locos, using recycled content I see dovetail? I’ve been playing tsw for 3 years and honestly most of the routes are boring but this, this is the worst line I’ve bought.
No freaking way yet another route with NO OVERHEAD WIRES. Again. Absolutely shocking this is a constant issue for TSW. I would just stop buying the dreadfully overpriced dlcs. Hopeful that Simrail will not repeat TSW's constant rushing. Like I have said before, this company will lose business if they don't listen to it's own customers.
I think the fanboys, and DTG's refusal to improve themselves because they still make money, will eventually destroy the game and its developer. It's really sad to see that some people are still so uncritical despite overwhelming evidence of sub-par products.
I'm just wondering what the UK version of Consumer affairs is because i'm really tempted to shoot them an E-Mail complaining of DTG Ripping off their customer for either recycled, unfinished or them metaphorically giving us the middle finger. Take your pick. Furthermore i don't think RUclips Channel Retired Railfan Horn Guy if he has TSW3 i don't know and even if he did he would be furious with DTG not showing ALL NJT Motive Power or even The Dinky because it's a known fact he lives near The NEC all his life as he's 100% New Yorker born and raised. He even takes almost regular forays into The LIRR Non Electrified routes. If you like you can subscribe to his channel and find what DTG couldn't be bothered including in The latest DLC.
I’ll second that, there’s not many people who capture the way the real NEC bristles with activity better than he does. Compare one of his videos to the wasteland shown in-game and it’s almost shocking.
I really think they need to cut out all the useless routes and add on's. The game is called Train Sim WORLD. How can you call a game WORLD if its only 5-6 countries in the game and you only update 3 of them.
Only six countries are in the game, but DTG insist on focussing on just the UK, US and Germany (and they can't even do that right). The others are France, Canada and Switzerland, but we only have one French, one Canadian and two Swiss routes and they're all fairly disappointing. The Canadian one is especially bad, because it's only 21 miles of mostly dead-straight track with only two diesel locomotives that have garbage sounds.
I only bought this because of NJT💀, At least im having fun with the ALP-46/Multilevel Cab Car ON BOSTON SPRINTER with Runs On NEC as far as Newark not NYP. That Section from Sunnyside to MAYBE Newark is just Awful. Just playing the route makes me want to throw the goddamn controller at the window/tv. And also please seriously rip into routes trust me I want too rip in this route so bad. Im just really pissed off. Might as well stick with GTA Online OH Wait Rockstar is just like DTG, *Cough Cough GTA+ I'm looking straight at you* I only bought this damn Add-on to take a break from GTA. If they wanted a remake, They should have NYC-NH(New York to New Haven) Although yes NYP is reused andnso is GCT but at Least we would have had the M8 and the route wouldn't even be linear. And you wanna know something, The ALP-46A has one of the best sounding motors I have ever heard imo. Thats enough of my mini rant. But seriously keep going I rlly like these videos. Wait Tees Valley Line is still a thing💀
I think even the addition of the M8 to the Harlem Line, let alone a full New York to New Haven remake, would be far too much to ask from the lazy idiots known as DTG. I wouldn't be surprised if they did that route anyway but without any branch lines (because New Canaan, Danbury and Waterbury more than likely wouldn't exist in DTG's world). As for future reviews like this one, that will depend entirely on whether or not I want to buy future add-ons.
@@DC4260Productions Yea, I agree especially. After this release, I think these two add-ons will be the last. I ever buy for a while. It's kind of a shame really, what was TSW strength (Being in console) might end up being it's ultimate downfall. Can't wait for Train Sim World 4(Where we pay 50 BUCKS for the same game and no changes thanks to the Princesses at DTG)
Regarding future reviews, I intend to cover some of the older routes (e.g. Great Western Express and East Coastway). But I don't want to buy every single new DLC, and only review packs that I think are genuinely interesting. As such, I may review Mainz to Koblenz when it's released, but I won't review Skyhook's questionable Midland Mainline.
I’m glad we have players like you that are honest. So many others are giving bs that don’t know anything. I was so excited for this route until they gave us pathetic 288 which 101 are yard moves. I didn’t get this route and I’m glad. Only 10 ALP-46 pulling to Trenton 24 hour timetable. But like you said you have too many players and fan boys that just blindingly buy their routes. I sure they made their money. Now is on to the next German UK DLC
I love the honest reviews and how you stand up to DTG. I've tried saying things during their lives and either get muted or ignored. DTG and their fan boys don't care.
Train sim world could be such an amazing game. But it's like dovetail just doesn't care
24:07 whether you noticed or not, but the 155 has it's pantographs down...
As an American player I'm tired of how biased dovetail is. It's actually insane the amount of excuses I hear from Matt when they are on stream as to why they couldn't do simple things to improve routes.
You're lucky Rivet Games have never done any American routes. I dread to think how badly they would screw up something like Marias Pass or the Alaska Railroad.
there's actually a compilation video of Matt lying 😂
@@anyvideo8876 could you provide a link to the compilation?
DTG didn't even add AI CSX trains on the bridge that goes from Oak Island Yard to the Lehigh Line (near Newark Airport)
They need to start extending the lines. Next gen consoles can take extensions. Also crew base to crew base( I work for one of the railroads) so nyp-phili would be the crew base! By doing that, you can add long branch or for boston sprinter you can add other Mbta lines.
Those short turns to Jersey Avenue that make up a good chunk of the playable timetable are run almost exclusively with Arrow III’s, so that’s further insult to injury as far as leaving out the Arrows and their glorious woodgrain interiors.
You'd like to think that DTG are aware of the immense backlash against this route. Here's hoping they take the hint and add the Arrow III (amongst many other improvements).
I totally agree with you, I have tried my very best to not get DTGs dlc (Even tho it’s tempting). At the moment I’m willing to get SimRail because I think it has a bright future and it’s going to have modding. Great video as always, you have saved me from wasting 35€😄
They also seem to have all they cab cars going to ny but in real life nj transit doesn't do that some of their trains have the locomotive first going towards ny
I actually commute on this route with NJT daily and was looking forward to purchasing it however after your review I think I’ll wait until it’s on a decent sale. Thanks for the honesty! Totally agree with your critiques.
You know DTG screwed up when even a local is disappointed with how the devs did their line.
One other thought now that I remembered to finish watching this one: the standard ALP-46 predates the multilevel cars, and the uprated ALP-46A was specifically intended to handle the added weight of the larger trains. I’d be lying if I said I was observant enough to notice whether regular ALP46s are used exclusively with Comet trains in practice but the mismatch in the game might at least explain the poor acceleration.
Your freaking spot on for someone that lives nowhere near the NEC.
The nearest I've got to the NEC in real life is Melbourne, Australia. Make of that what you will.
They didn’t even add the Path trading at Newark. And irl the NEC is the “busiest train corridor in America you nearly see any trains. NJT realistically as a service every 15 minutes on there
Well the game doesnt have a PATH route, so i can understand that part. Wasnt there a game i think world of subways and they had the entire PATH route??And then when reaching Newark, u see static Amtrak SUPERLINERS peaking out the station smfh. Like superliners dont even operate for the NEC.
I agree that this route should have had more varied rolling stock like the aem-7, arrow III and single decker comet coaches.
But something that would have made the route much more interesting would be if Dovetail changed the time period entirely. Specifically to the mid 1990s as Amtrak had much more cooler rolling stock and liveries back then.
The rolling stock i’d want incuded would be aem-7 in phase III, e60 in phase III, amfleet in phase III, viewliner I in phase III, retro baggage car phase III, retro sleeper and pasanger car also in phase III, njt alp-44, njt single decker comets and njt arrow III.
Good review. I gave up on Dovetail games and Train sim world after they came out with the third iteration, which is almost exactly the same game as TSW 2. Just felt like a slap on the face after five years with few improvements. I came back to TSW when this route came out as I’m a NEC super fan being a local in the area, but after playing it it’s just wasted potential. Although this entire game is wasted potential. I seriously recommend checking out SimRail, which has a multiplayer mode that makes driving way more fun than TSW. It also has 300 miles of track so journeys are nice and long, and lots of different trains to choose from.
Yes you are correct . Im really pissed off especially when you have ambassadors out there that don’t known the US routes making comments like wow is this route is so busy. DTG don’t care about US content because they know they will get their sales and it won’t matter what state the route is in.
I don't like those ambassador / sellout channels at all, especially since they don't make proper reviews but rather glowing reports / adverts instead. I will never be one of them, and will always make independent reviews after buying DLC with my own money.
It's a Known Fact that New York Penn is The U.S's Second Busiest station after Grand Central.
The lack of updates to broken routes after the initial release is also a huge problem! I am also fed up with the high prices and the below standards of routes so I will not be buying anymore dtg products until they get there shit together.
They have the geep 38’s on the map yet zero scenarios. These devs are beyond ridiculous. They shaft US dlcs leave them halfway completed and don’t have the geep 38’s scenarios available.
How Dovetail could of bollocked up so much is mind boggling, but unsurprising. I for one am not going to get this route, not in its current state. Which is a shame as I would of liked more track to drive the Acela for one. Also why Dovetail never brought back the New York to New Rochelle is baffling too.
I was waiting so long for this route and they missed it up. Up to this day I have not bought it needs update
Completely agree with everything you have mentioned in your video.
Nice review... brutal and honest.. Always buy on sale... and by sale.. to be happy.. be around 50-60% off... Unfortunately, they are still the best thing out there... for now.
The May roadmap says that the devs are working on a bigger timetable for this route. Well, if they are fixing that, then they should be able to fix many of the things that ruin the immersion on the route, right?
That would probably be a bit too much to ask from these hack developers.
I would just like to thank you man, a lot of things that you happen to mention were exactly the idea I had in mind such as the EMD SW1000R addon and espeically reusing the Newark Airport station up to Sunnyside. You really did show the world actually what Dovetail laziness really is to the US community espeically to me, I live in New Jersey myself and this just makes me feel upset as a lot of these stations on the NEC i've even been too, look nothing like it. Thank you again for really stepping up.
Great review, really love it. I do have a suspicion as to what DTG may have thought about. (Though before being yelled at, am not defending them)
When at 20:19 you stated the station is way to empty, which I agree on, the part reason for this could be due to potential FPS drops, such as the one you had in An Honest Review of Bahnstrecke: Bremen - Oldenburg (Train Sim World 3)
Though again, am not defending them as I went and bought this on a big sale, and just couldn't make myself enjoy it and had to refund, DTG is not making me buy their new expensive stuff, screw this.
They could have even added some freight locos from CSX like the GP38-2"s
That's a good idea, but they would have to include something other than the GP38-2 as we already have that engine with Sand Patch Grade. Same goes for the SD40-2, AC4400CW and C40-8W.
26:28 lol
Nice name
Loved the review, as this being my local line I'm absolutely disgusted and disappointed with DTG. Another thing I wanted to add on was the missing Morrisville yard just south of trenton only 2 miles away. That's my 2nd biggest gripe with the line Below the timetable. As operating the equipment I'm familiar with I just want the experience of doing round trips uninterrupted without trains despawning
Just bought the game was gonna buy the us passenger bundle or both us bundles but I watched this review and got the one with Birmingham Germany and Cajon pass
How much was it originally because its 30$ right now
I can hear the fanboys saying but but new train new route Love DTG
I def agree
I remember when Microsoft had a train sim and the trains went far. I wish they would make a new one so we can dump TSW. Tired of 30-mile tracks for $32 a total rip off.
One of the reason's I don't like the route is because dovetail reused the LIRR New York Penn and Sunnyside yard section you know the nearly 5 year old route. Dovetail also reused the section between New York Penn and Newark International Airport you can tell because of the scenery and the water texture looking bad why did Dovetail reused 5 year old content instead of rebuilding the section we will never know. And if we ever got the New Haven line don't expect dovetail to reuse the same area between New York Penn and New Rochelle.
Not to mention they dont even have an underpass at Newark Penn Station. MAJOR fail!
Good video, it deserves a lot of attention
But probably not the sort of attention DTG wants. Seems like they want to, as I say in the video, barricade themselves in their echo chamber of fanboys and other yes-men.
With the amount of people buying overpriced addons and other useless stuff, I think they can afford to get the SEPTA license.
Its a great game, just the some addons are rushed.
It’s more of a matter of if septa is willing to give it up , but I agree
I bought this because I love njt and live in ny and compared to Harlem line it’s ok but the timetable it’s a simple update to make it busier. Two of the busiest routes with lax timetables.
The thing is we are getting to "what is even the point of this route?" turf. Yeah Clinchfield had a incomplete timetable, but it had one of the best journey modes ever put to a route. We are getting routes with incomplete timetables, and and slapped together journeys now of like 20 runs with no real flow to them.
now you said that, in boston sprinter, there is an extra two tracks with third rail on the southwest corridor, DTG should have put ai trains on the orange line. Hell, even make the MBTA subway route like The Red, Orange, and Blue subway line routes in Tsc or Tsw3 and there are more tracks on southampton street yard. this where the red line sit's in the yard. but it's incredibly empty. there stations on the adjacent northeast corridor. these are orange line subway stations dovetail didn't bother. you should make a honest review and criticism's and rant on the tsw 3 review, even though it's a tsw 2 route. you should do it. not only that there are no station platforms on the orange line stations on southwest corridor. and also the passengers information screens are 100% incorrect. and also the pawtucket central falls stations is absent and also they couldn't make the extension branch to Wickford Junction station and add T.F green airport station. and also they shouldn't make the Needham Branch. that goes to Needham Junction station. also they shouldn't go the worcester/framingham branch or short worcester branch 47 miles. or even to go the Lansdowne station to take sports fan to Fenway Park for Boston red sox baseball games. or even make the route to worcester. but this worst case scenario and far to ask. even theyshould pay more attention to the MBTA since they should make more routes and DLCS.
I do appreciate your honest reviews about these DLC's. Frankly I don't think this dlc is worth picking up on a sale. It's ridiculous that they increase prices and say they did it because of inflation only to then rush out these dlc's. DTG will never learn.
SimRail will be releasing on consoles as well and I am glad because that game has alot of potential especially since there will be an editor and I hope it will be an alternative option to tsw
This tactic of releasing unfinished content and not at least coming back to fix it, is going to come back to bite them when another developer comes along to compete with them. Hopefully sooner rather than later. Then maybe they'll get their act together. For now I'm sticking to %50 off sales with DTG. I do like their game and graphics engines, but their quality and pricing leave something to be desired. Also why is it we can't see neighboring routes (Like NEC and LIRR) connect into one big package when you have all the DLC, this would solve a lot of the shortcomings, or is that beyond the capabilities of the engine for some reason?
There are two cases of previous routes that I think should be merged, but DTG have never done it for some reason. I'm referring to Ruhr-Sieg Nord + Rhein-Ruhr Osten and London Commuter + East Coastway + Southeastern High Speed (if the Hampden Park to Ashford section was added).
Considering how expensive the add-ons are, and just how much people have had to pay these greedy sods, I think they should make a new engine or route and give it away for free.
This man speaks true words. 9:45 Oh thats why the textures are so bad in that part of the route. Now I get it. I Spent 48.58 Euros on the Acela And New York-Trenton and what do I get. A bad quality half assed Add-On. I want my money back! 22:17 these issues are also present on. Schnelfahrstrecke Köln-Aachen (cologne-Aachen), Dresden-Riesa, I think Hamburg-Lübeck or basically all catenary routes from tsw except Main Spessert Bahn and 1 or 2 more! I feel...Uhhh...Robbed!!! yeah thats like 50 Euros down the f*cking drain!!!
There are a few sections of missing wires on MSB, one of which is on the passenger line near Aschaffenburg Hbf going away from Gemünden Hbf. There are only about 3 tiny sections of missing wires on that route... thankfully there are not as many missing wires compared to this one and Dresden to Riesa, yet I enjoy Dresden to Riesa.
Honestly I ain't a American rail enthusiast but at least they brought back the original Northeast corridor with trenton I ain't a dovetail defender like certain ambassadors who I won't say names there's a few I agree with people they need to get out of the main 3 UK, US and Germany people want different European, Asia and other country's Honestly a Aussie route with the XPT would be great Eurostar route London St Pancras - Paris nord or Amsterdam ect.
Very good video! Please make more such reviews to TSW :-)
I admit I love Train Sim World 3 because Train Sim World 2 had alot bugs and viruses issues throughout the game. But don’t get me wrong they should added more routes on New York and New Jersey and Long Island Railroad known as LIRR, I’m glad they add Amtrak Acela to the New York to Trenton route also it can use as commuter as well.
15:17 freight exists, but is uncommon on the NEC
What is this princeton branch?
It's a branch line that runs from Princeton Junction to Downtown Princeton Station.
Yeah! We need to fired them the entire of Dovetail Games Team employees now for Being so lazy, Unfinished Work in Progress, Missing a overhead wire and catenary, Lack of scenery, & Also included using an old recycle sounds from previous locomotive of railwoks on this NEC: New York to Trenton. It looks like garbage. This it's got to stop that doing some stupid things on TSW3. This is ridiculous.😡
Hallo, every penny you pay to them is lost for nothing then dlc full with bugs never fixed.
With njt there are some services long 12 min from sunyvale to ny try them most of them go nowhere or to wrong platforms, red lights or tracks with no overhead wires.
Supreme dovetail quality. I think they never will be fixed.
All these issues, the missing overhead, AI pantographs down, heavy prices, and many more are leading to DTG for causing confusion and delay. But this was a very good review!
It's sad to see the severe decline in quality on US routes. I was really looking forward to this one but was on the fence since the $40 is quite high and players have complained about glitches. Ultimately I'm glad I didn't get it because this is worse than I feared. The pantos down and invisible catenary is unforgivable on an electric route. And the lack of AI layers is disappointing since London Commuter set a new standard. There should be constant LIRR trains, plus the NEC passes under the Lehigh line where there should be a CSX or NS train passing every 20 minutes. There are also daily freight trains here so they could've added a drivable GP38 layer but didn't. I don't get the lack of Princeton Branch since the Arrow could be a potential add on. And Secaucus station just looks bad. The textures look way too clean and cartoony, very out of place. One day I hope there can be a perfect US release...
it's a difficult choice for me, I picked it up on sale from a third party website for $15 so it was fine, but at full price it would have been weird, it is my main line and I use it every day to go from New Brunswick-NYC, I think it is modeled well, and the trains are good, but the safety systems are kind of bad, this video review seems a little bias though, and I would say it is alright, i think the main reason they didn't include the ALP45DP and Comet Coaches is because they would be difficult to do, with the ALP45 power changing stuff it would be complex, and the systems in the comet coaches that have both electric loco stuff and diesel loco stuff. But being a frequent rider on this route I think it is well done, the only thing I would have liked to see is the Arrow 3 EMU and an extension down to Philly with septa services, but I understand the license issue, I don't think any game has a septa license, but maybe in the future we could see it as another DLC, also would be nice if we could get a heritage loco pack for it, which could include the Amtrak AEM-7, and the NJT ALP44 electric locomotives, and maybe the HHP-8, and some Amtrak View liner Cars, but all in all I think it is a good route, just needs to have some updates to fix it, But I would not recommend this to be purchases at normal retail price, I would wait for a sale, on steam it can go down to $25, this short review is coming from someone who rides it all the time, and knows what the entire route looks like, I may be bias, but I have experience with this route. So, I will leave you with this, don't get it at full price, get it on sale, but I would recommend it, people say it is bad, but I think it is good, And I would know.
They can still add the ALP45 with comet couches but within a different route such as the North Jersey Coast Line and overall they were seen in train simulator classic
Great review as usual. So sick of DTG this might be the straw that breaks the camels back in my case. Certainly changing my view of pre-orders and all that. They completely dropped the ball on this one.
I advise against pre-ordering, especially since you may not know what the product will be like.
lol also… why is nyc not even modeled
Yes. This is exactly true. I have started considering pirating the game.
I had to pirate the game for the new versions because I started on xbox, but I wanted to play on pc
First thing i did when i wanted to play train sim world so bad
11 months late here, but what do you expect? Its typical of European train game developers to half ass US routes and stock. They all do it. We now have Railroader which is awesome but is set in the 1950’s in North Carolina. One day we may get a good North American dev team to come out with a good modern day sim for those of us who dont give a hoot about foreign rail. The prices are absolutely insane too. Thanks for the review!
would give my right arm for a metra electric/SSL route
That would also probably be shitty too.
They were to busy with TSW4
This was a year ago……
They did a horrible job on this route as well, saying they ran out of time. Please this wouldnt been the same excuse if it was a UK route... The train traffic/timetable is DEAD once again, and not even a LIRR ai layer in and out of Penn Station.
They also shouldve added a small portion of the North Jersey Coast Line as far as South Amboy and at least another addidition of Newark Broad Street. Then i wouldve tried this route, but thank god i didnt thanks to other reviews and videos to prove the garbage attempt by Dovetail. Supposingly the timetable is being reworked on and may come out and few months, but i diont believe it not one bit.
To be fair they don't have the arrows which only runs on the shuttle to Princeton so I can see them not adding that line alps don't run there and if they don't have septa license, they can't extend to Philadelphia because septa may own that area from Trenton to Philadelphia
personally i like the dlc, but this is also my first train sim. i am hoping and praying they add the jersey coast line to long branch. i take those trains alot. one gripe i have tho is once you leave the tunnel, its a bit barren.
Thanks for this will definitely help in my consideration to buy this add on!
Edit: after seeing this is 58 DOLLARS 50 IM NOT BUYING IT even if it was perfect
I might get it just to see how it is myself and then refund it if its not good
@16:30 Also another Loco and country that should have been there since TS classic.
I was disappointed with the Birmingham route which is like a ghost town, and I can’t play it, it loses all the immersion for me. I live near New street and although the station is well modelled its sooo much busier in real life. After watching your review you have saved me even contemplating buying this boring ghost route.
Looks like they have been caught with their pantographs down again
I live in Maryland, US and I am utterly disappointed. I have been to New York Penn Station many times and even my mom said once when I was doing a LIR timetable that Penn needed to be more busy and the npc model variants were so sparse lol
3:37 Its about time they put a New Zealand Suburban route in TS Classic as well. Wellington and Aukland both. I am actually quite surprised that they did that NZ Midland route. I thought that DTG was allergic to the Pacific. (NZ and Australia).
That route wasn't a Dovetail product; it was made by NZTS Workshops.
Edinburgh - Glasgow was the last DTG product I bought. It was so bad and for £30 I could see the writting on the wall. Its a shame, but the quality is so poor I can't justify the cost. Sim Rail is much better in terms of putting player in front of business interests
The ScotRail route was made by Rivet, not Dovetail. Regardless, I feel the same way about the route as you do.
I was so excited for this Route, but I don’t think I’m buying this. I’m done with dovetail games.
They had so many chances to make this the best route in tsw3 but failed to I am extremely disappointed.
Il. No longer play tsw3 again.
NGL, this addon is the first one i'm truly mad at. This Addon is in a horrible state. Some of the Issues will be fixed, but this route shouldn't have been released this week, it wasn't ready.
Don't tell DTG, because they seem to think there's no such thing as a route not being ready. They've proven with this one that they'll still release a route regardless of its condition.
There’s not many differences compared to the 46 and 46A. Other than it’s cab signalling system.
Route feels so quiet!
I feel like a problem with the doing the NEC is that there hasn't been any frieght on this part of the corridor since the early 90s. If they did this route say back in the Penn Central or Even PRR days it would be more fun. Hell if they did it in the days of the Pennsy we could've had massive yards along the route with steam aswell. One of my friends told me once that US add-ons dont get any attention as there isn't any Americans in DTGs board of directors.
There is freight. Not much but csx does run freight on the line
@@Atrail_Mckinley4786 exactly
Freight is boring af
Warning: a brutal Kiwi at work. When companies make simulations which allow for no modding by the common simmer the simulation has limited appeal and has a limited life span. I support your well argued criticism of DTG in its rehashing of the NJT. I don't think abusing the people who control DTG decision making helps though. The business model of the company from the very beginning was to have tight control over the output of this rendition of train simulation. The original Train Simulator by Microsoft was a modders dream but the quality was highly variable. Coals to Newcastle was one the best examples of how a large scale map could be produced by a modder based on a historical information from a rarely modelled part of the world. It demonstrated what the limitations of such routes were but indicated the potential of train simming. DTG have stifled the creativity of the train simming public by not developing the opportunities from input by the general public. This is where the greatest complaint can be made at developers at DTG. But nothing will change because the average punter will still spend his/her hard earned New Zealand peso on what DTG serves up. Ching! Ching! Cheers from across the ditch.
I never had MSTS, but I think it's surprising that such an old game had good modding capacity while TSW barely has any. Incidentally the older Train Simulator 'Classic' still holds up today, and there's loads of people making good mods for it that keep the game alive.
I am angry on DTG Because they did not put the prenstun junction branch😡
Excellent video , trainspotter
From the look of the gameplay of this route the performance needs to be smoothed out
It's so tempting to buy but I think I will I hold off on it.
Dovetail announced they were updating the NJT timetable (despite conveniently not bothering to add more NJT motive power like the Arrow 3 or ALP-45DP) and adding some freight services to this route, so I'd recommend waiting until that update is released.
@@DC4260Productions alright thank you. I will
Honestly, you should do a review on cane creek, I personally think the rolling stock is horrible because the sd40-2 and the ac4400cw are BOTH RECYCLED from Sand Patch Grade (which is also a bit of a disaster) and it’s so fcking boring to the point where I only have it to use the rolling stock for other lines, it’s so ridiculous, especially how the route map isn’t the same as how DTG presents this, I am usually a sucker when it comes to freight lines, the fact I can’t use the SD70ACE on this line is extremely disappointing. I should’ve not wasted my $27 on this line, the only difference between this lines rolling stock and Sand Patch Grade’s rolling stock is only the ditch lights, that’s it.
Problem is they didn’t even BOTHER not changing the bell and the horn on the 2 locos, using recycled content I see dovetail? I’ve been playing tsw for 3 years and honestly most of the routes are boring but this, this is the worst line I’ve bought.
With all due respect, I have no interest in reviewing Cane Creek.
Amazing video you got everything spot on I thought dtg might have got something right but just another waste of my money.
No freaking way yet another route with NO OVERHEAD WIRES. Again. Absolutely shocking this is a constant issue for TSW. I would just stop buying the dreadfully overpriced dlcs. Hopeful that Simrail will not repeat TSW's constant rushing. Like I have said before, this company will lose business if they don't listen to it's own customers.
I think the fanboys, and DTG's refusal to improve themselves because they still make money, will eventually destroy the game and its developer. It's really sad to see that some people are still so uncritical despite overwhelming evidence of sub-par products.
I'm just wondering what the UK version of Consumer affairs is because i'm really tempted to shoot them an E-Mail complaining of DTG Ripping off their customer for either recycled, unfinished or them metaphorically giving us the middle finger. Take your pick. Furthermore i don't think RUclips Channel Retired Railfan Horn Guy if he has TSW3 i don't know and even if he did he would be furious with DTG not showing ALL NJT Motive Power or even The Dinky because it's a known fact he lives near The NEC all his life as he's 100% New Yorker born and raised. He even takes almost regular forays into The LIRR Non Electrified routes. If you like you can subscribe to his channel and find what DTG couldn't be bothered including in The latest DLC.
I imagine he'd be very annoyed with this add-on, even more so than me.
@@DC4260Productions Annoyed wouldn't even come close as he knows pretty much every single train along The NEC and as i said beyond there.
I’ll second that, there’s not many people who capture the way the real NEC bristles with activity better than he does. Compare one of his videos to the wasteland shown in-game and it’s almost shocking.
The UK trading standards must act to stop this malpractice
I really think they need to cut out all the useless routes and add on's. The game is called Train Sim WORLD. How can you call a game WORLD if its only 5-6 countries in the game and you only update 3 of them.
Only six countries are in the game, but DTG insist on focussing on just the UK, US and Germany (and they can't even do that right). The others are France, Canada and Switzerland, but we only have one French, one Canadian and two Swiss routes and they're all fairly disappointing.
The Canadian one is especially bad, because it's only 21 miles of mostly dead-straight track with only two diesel locomotives that have garbage sounds.
@@DC4260Productions TSW means exploring routes and trains in free roam in first person, not around the world
DTG needs to take more time to make shit correctly.
I only bought this because of NJT💀, At least im having fun with the ALP-46/Multilevel Cab Car ON BOSTON SPRINTER with Runs On NEC as far as Newark not NYP. That Section from Sunnyside to MAYBE Newark is just Awful. Just playing the route makes me want to throw the goddamn controller at the window/tv. And also please seriously rip into routes trust me I want too rip in this route so bad. Im just really pissed off. Might as well stick with GTA Online OH Wait Rockstar is just like DTG, *Cough Cough GTA+ I'm looking straight at you* I only bought this damn Add-on to take a break from GTA. If they wanted a remake, They should have NYC-NH(New York to New Haven) Although yes NYP is reused andnso is GCT but at Least we would have had the M8 and the route wouldn't even be linear. And you wanna know something, The ALP-46A has one of the best sounding motors I have ever heard imo. Thats enough of my mini rant. But seriously keep going I rlly like these videos. Wait Tees Valley Line is still a thing💀
I think even the addition of the M8 to the Harlem Line, let alone a full New York to New Haven remake, would be far too much to ask from the lazy idiots known as DTG. I wouldn't be surprised if they did that route anyway but without any branch lines (because New Canaan, Danbury and Waterbury more than likely wouldn't exist in DTG's world).
As for future reviews like this one, that will depend entirely on whether or not I want to buy future add-ons.
@@DC4260Productions Yea, I agree especially. After this release, I think these two add-ons will be the last. I ever buy for a while. It's kind of a shame really, what was TSW strength (Being in console) might end up being it's ultimate downfall. Can't wait for Train Sim World 4(Where we pay 50 BUCKS for the same game and no changes thanks to the Princesses at DTG)
It was all good up until the "should've been a PC exclusive part" 🙄 it being on consoles isn't the reason the game has so many shortcomings
It’s a huge factor dude. The game has been held back now for years because of it.
How tho? Current gen consoles are way more powerful than you might think, so why would it be the case?@@Owencr905
I will not be getting this price of crap
If it does not have the Dinky its nothing else on the NEC worth a dam
Deg is bool crap😒