I grew up on Beacon Hill overlooking Boeing field in Seattle, WA. My brother and I used to watch the B-29's take off and land during test flights. Later it was the B-49's and B-52's! This was in the late 1940's and 50's. It was an incredible place to grow up and so exciting to see and hear these massive aircraft take off and land! They were built and tested right below our house at the Boeing #2 plant and Boeing Field.
My uncle was a pilot in WW2, the Korean war, and Vietnam. He's 98 years old now. He told me that when he flew B52's it was like sitting on the front porch of your home and flying the block you lived on. He flew most of the aircraft in the US inventory but the B52 was one of the most remarkable. He also flew the F111 for several years but that's another story.
"Kick the tires and light the fires" on Alert Duty in the 70's. I was a Crew Chief of both a (at different times) B-52 and KC-135. I learned early on that the best kept aircraft were chosen by flight crews for TDY assignments. Soon my aircraft 57-1495 had on-time take-off records and flew all over the world as a result. My time in the Air Force was priceless, thanks for bringing back the memories!
The engine does not start from small explosions. They use a slow burning cartridge to generate enough fumes and gas to get the starter turbine to rotate, to rotate the engine and get it started. Each cartridge is about a gallon of powder.
I was born in 1960 and grew up near Hill AFB. We had SAC on the base back then. I have good memories for the B-52s scrambling, of touch and go exercises, of the roar from static engines. I used to lay on the roof of the house and watch them fly overhead, it almost felt like I could reach up and touch the underbelly. Dad used to make the comment 'That's the sound of freedom' as they flew overhead. Eventually HAFBs mission changed and the F-16s came in. Dad would still comment 'That's the sound of freedom' as the F-16s flew overhead. We had railroad tracks on the side of the house opposite HAFB. A girlfriend at the time once commented 'You all stop stalking mid-sentence when a plane fly's over or a train rolls by'. I'd never noticed this, it was just part of living where we did.
Around 1982 wife and I were out on one of the Ausable river backwaters when the AFB at Oscoda scrambled their fleet. It was just about dusk. We heard this tremendous roaring. And one after another flew over, just above tree top level. We could FEEL the sound and wind disturbance. It was a sight we'll never forget
@@sd906238 It truly was. That base was decommissioned some years back, sadly. I lived about 20 miles South of the Willow Run airport in the 50's and 60's. That was where the bomber plant was during the war. I saw a LOT of military planes flying over as a kid. B36's with their insane droning. P 61 Black Widows. When the air shows are around, I still see B17's, B24's, and B25's. And an occasional C47.
A F16 jet had an aborted landing in Tromsø and when it was climbing at what I assume was full afterburner it triggered the car alarms in half the city and even if I was about 3km away I could feel the vibrations in my body more then I could hear that roaring thunderous loud sound... Only thing similar I have experienced was top fuel drag race.
Cartridge start engines, not explosive blast. The cordite (or modern equivalent) cartridge produces the gas pressure at a controlled rate to rotate and start the engines. It saves the aircraft from being reliant on external start trucks. A more up to date system is an APU air producer, the Auxiliary Power Unit produces compressed air to rotate and start the engines. But if the APU is dead, the aircraft then needs an external source of compressed air. I’ve worked with cartridge start aircraft, no matter how ready I was for the start it always made me jump. The engine goes from stationary to idle in about 3 seconds, it’s quite a sudden experience.
It's amazing that parts are not broken. It is really the best way to start the engine for fast response, I think the cartridge is about the size of a 5 inch shell. They might have used the same cartridges to launch torpedoes and depth-charges. Cartridge start was also used on piston engines.
@@Adrianokingslyprentice5435 I worked on Hunter aircraft years ago in the very early 70’s when I was an apprentice, some marks of Hunter used cartridge start some used IPN starter systems, both systems did a similar thing, started the engine with a very loud and sudden “whoosh”. Later on I went on to work on large civil aircraft with APU’s which produced the compressed air to turn and start the engines, plus of course provide electrical power and air for air conditioning systems while on the ground. So after 50 years working as an aircraft engineer on aircraft such as Gnats, Hunters, Hawks, Harriers, Sea Harriers, DC10, A300, A310, Boeing757, BAC111, A320, A340, A330, Boeing747-200 and Boeing747-400. The last 31 years as a CAA licensed avionics engineer, I didn’t need to “copy and paste” I felt I could talk from experience!
Actually, the black smoke during Cart Starts is from the black powered in the cartridges, not inefficient engines as stated. As a former B-52 flying crew chief, I was also engine run qualified, and periodically had to do cart starts, which is a rather neat feature, except for the cleaning of the carts afterwards. Ended up all black from the soot.
In the beginning there was a water injection system which increased the thrust from the engines for takeoff. That created the heavy, black exhaust you see in the old films from the 50’s and 60’s. The old pilots used to tell the new pilots that the plane used to run on coal, not jet fuel.
You should have seen those older models that had the water injection during a runup to full throttle on the ground and then hit the water injection. It would make that whole wing tip move about 1 1/2 foot forward, then when you cut the throttle it would spring back to where it originally was.
@@stephenmonken1337 I thought it was the H model that they dropped the water injection. I was stationed at Roswell NM, Walker AFB '60 to '63 Periodically had G model in transit from Castle AFB. As I recall, we had to refill their water tanks before they left Walker.
@@stephenmonken1337 they dropped the water injection when the J-57's were replaced with the TF-33's on the H models, which had more power and used less fuel
AGREE!! always liked to watch those big boys rolling down the runway at 30 second intervals. Only thing thing was, you wanted to be the first one to take off, because the turbulance was a real pain for all the rest that followed. Did you ever notice that they flared off to left or right as soon as they could to get out of that rough air?
Yeah, I think that's the greatest generation of Americans to ever live, the one's that really loved their country, the one's that fought in the second world war and Korea, My dad was one of them. !!
The "unburned fuel" is NOT from fuel inefficiency. It was from WATER INJECTION used to cool the engines while they PURPOSELY dumped more fuel into the compressor to gain more power.
It's called a cartridge start, they are not explosives, think of them as a small solid propellent rocket that spins a small gas turbine to get the bigger gas turbine running
That nose up take off is unusual. They normally take off tail high. Worked on B52’s, mods D, G & H …from 1976 to 1981. Retired in 2000. Do it again in a minute! Cheers
First off, Thanks for your service! I know what you mean. I used to work on E models from 1960-1963. Watching them take off now just looks wrong to me. Watched many of those nose down takeoffs.
@@rolandemartin854 No kidding. I worked both H and G models and never really paid much attention to the takeoff attitude until I was at Andersen after they reorganized the maintenance squadrons. It was really strange watching one take off and climb out in a nose down attitude.
I don't know about B-52 starter cartridges but I handled starter carts for F-105's and they are about the size of a gallon paint can. The black smoke you see is not unburned fuel as the narrator said but the gas emitted from the starter cart. I've been engulfed in that black smoke many times and it has a very unique odor. Though not exactly an explosive device, they were stored in the munitions storage area.
The starting cartridges were a propellant that burned and emitted a volume of gas that was used to turn the starting turbines attached to each the engine. The black smoke is not unburned jet fuel. If a ground equipment start turbine air supply was used, the air it supplied would turn this same turbine, like a car's starter would turn an engine, to start the engine rotation. Once one engine was running, it could supply compressed air to the other engines that needed to be started. Using two start cartridges assured the flight crew that at least one engine would start that could be used to start the others. If the two failed to start their respective engines then new cartridges could be installed and the effort to start retired.
MITOs in pre turbofan days were particularly hazardous. At Mather in Sacramento we had one go down because it could not overcome the turbulence of the wake of the plane just before it. Never gained sufficient lift to stay airborne. The pilot did manage to get it out over empty fields before it went in. No survivors. They extended MITO distances after the crash. I believe they were readjusted with the addition of turbofans and the retirement of water injection. Carts themselves were not exactly safe. We had one installed incorrectly across the flightline on a BUFF. They had a handle you held and then rotated them into place until they locked. This one was not rotated properly. When they did the cart start the thrust blew it right through the cowling and it howled down the flightline several hundred yards and caught a guy in our unit right in the leg. Shattered it severely. Don't think he ever walked right again.
MARAVILLOSO, VER ÉSTOS AVIONES Y ELICOCTEROS , CON TAN AVANZADA TECNOLOGÍA Y PODER. LOS PILOTOS MECANICOS, Y TÉCNICO EN GENERAL CON UNA ALTA CALIDAD PROFECIONAL QUE LOS CARACTERIZA. SEGUIRA SIENDO EL PAÍS, PIONERO DE LA AVIACIÓN MUNDIAL.SALUDOS Y BUENAS SUERTE, EN ESTA HERMOSA CARRERA. DESDE MIAMI FLORIDA. SALUDOS.
I was very lucky to live by March AFB in So Cal in the early 80's. Many a night we woke up to the house shaking because these birds where flying over. We used to watch these for hours. You don't know power until you see a B52 take off...
Used to work around them, considering their nickname BUFF for big ugly fat feller (more derogatory names can be substituted), we never considered them skinny.
@@iampakistani4092 That was never in Afghanistan if it only was u wouldnt even be able to say that word because a plane something like that, bomb japan
When I was in school, there was a SAC base in Rome, NY, about 12 miles away. B52's used to fly over my house all the time. I also remember sonic booms frequently.
@@flyjetz They had other planes that would make the sonic booms. Griffis AFB was a SAC base at the time, so they had whatever was in the US inventory. When I remember the booms it was late elementary school and Jr. High. That would make it between 59 and 63. One day in October, about 8PM, we had a power failure. I looked out the window and saw a big orange thing on the horizon through the trees. I freaked out. I thought it was a nuclear explosion. It turned out to be half of the rising harvest moon. Turns out the entire Northeast and Canada had a power failure. Those were the times I grew up in though. Kruschev went to the UN, pounded his shoe on his desk, and said "we will bury you". I really didn't think I would grow up.
I was in SAC starting in the 70s. Quick start cans were most often used during alert aircraft repositioning exercises when aircraft were outside normal alert areas and didn’t have all the normal AGE equipment handy. I wasn’t a maintenance guy but they told me quick start cans work but prolonged or excessive use accelerates engine wear. We had to don masks during quick starts because of the toxicity of the smoke and you never knew which way it would blow. Ah, back when things made sense!
Cart starts were the normal for many piston aircraft using radial engines, especially in the Navy-it made the aircraft lighter and faster starting. Many early jet engines used the system also.
Cart start is not a good expression for using cartridges since there is also start carts, wagons with an engine for the normal start of the aircraft's engines. What would you call it when you start with a start cart then? A start cart start? To differentiate from the cart start.
It looks strange to me as I watch these big boys start engines and taxi out. I was assigned to Walker AFB 1960 to 1963. The planes in these pictures are H models. The ones I worked on were E models. Much much different aircraft in the way it operated.The E models had all air started engines plus practically all of the other equipment waas air driven as well and you didn't have all that smoke and thunder on start-up. Watching these modern ones take off is weird looking to me. The E models were configured in a way that on take off, the rear landing gear would come off the runway first and the plane would take of in a nose down additude!!
They still use air carts to start them, this type of take off is for training, day to day we would still use air carts, I got out last December but I was a crew chief on them.
@@yrs_kino7928 OH FOR THE GOOD OLD DAYS!! in '63 we used the MD-3 electric cart and the MA-1-A air cart. Even in Alert Area. Just unhooked them and Aircraft taxied right over top of them. We then had to clean up area after, to repark planes later
Perfectly normal cartridge start technique, used so the aircraft doesn't need external resources. Once one (or two) engines are started they can be used to start the others. Normally they'd use a start cart but they practice other techniques too. Violent, noisy but very effective.
Every time I see the BUFF, on in the air or on the ground, my first thought is always: THAT IS ONE MASSIVE BIRD! It must be like being in another world to fly it, at least to this GA pilot!
Known as a "Cartridge Start"..........Has been around in the jet engine world for many years.....Also recall seeing an old tractor that was started using a shotgun shell type cartridge......
Love the B52. One of my favorite planes along with the B747. It's great to see them still flying after all these years. I thought that they had rocket assist for take off or was that when they were new??
I havnt seen a b52 with rocket assist but could be wrong. Did see that special ops c130 herc that had them on for some rescue mission, although in the end it was never used
I was stationed at Griffiss AFB before the cold war ended- I witnessed several "Alert Pad Scramble" drills, where the real alert bombers, with the real nukes and full load of fuel, would scramble and be gone in literally about 20 minutes, thundering the sky with the old school 'water injection' thrust assist while so fully loaded (FYI the 'Center Wing fueltank' gauge went up to 250,000 lbs of fuel.. they really dont make them like they used to). We often thought the world was ending, that the bombers had to get clear before the enemy nuke took out our location. So YIKES. The drills were always performed 100% authentic, it was real right up until the crew broke open their mission cards, and read the order: RTB. whew. So in the end, it was a drill to have all of the crew trained with the muscle memory to do all of that with speed when the real- real time occurred. Thankfully it never did. PS: regarding the age of the BUFFs... I can recall a specific B-52. A G model, "53-5008" (funny how you only remember the plane nicknamed "5-balls-8"). The 53 in the tail # signifies it was a 1953 serial #.
Lane, I'm afraid your memory is doing disservice to you. B-52G production began in 1957, so that was likely a '57 or '58 model, not a '53. Also, A-G model BUFFs had 5 digit serial numbers, not 6.
There is a lot of confusion about the various starting methods for B-52's. Originally they started one (or more) engines with compressed air from ground "start carts" or by cross-bleed of compressed air from engines that had already started. On-board APU's could be started by battery power and then supply the bleed air to rotate the main engines. I am not familiar with the concept of firing a cartridge directly into the engine turbine.. I was part of a team at AirResearch (now part of Honeywell) in Phoenix AZ in the late 1970's that provided SAC with a "Cartridge Starter" that used old surplus JATO cartridges to produce a sustained burst of hot gasses to spin a version of air-turbine starter geared to individual turbine shafts to rotate each of the eight turbine engines for very quick "scramble" takeoffs from fully manned B-52's parked near the runways of Military Air Bases. The bomber was allowed to start its take-off run even if the cantankerous JATO bottles failed to fire on one engine. These JATO bottles produced a very corrosive sulfurous gas at about 1800 degrees. It would have destroyed the main engine components if it were injected into gas path of the J-57 engines. I think that this starting method was never used again after the Cold War ended.
Absolutely incredible aircraft. No doubt about it. Curious though, and I ask the question out of pure ignorance... given they're still in operation, why have the engines never been replaced with more modern and considerably more fuel efficient variants? It would seem that the increased range and reduced operating costs would make this something worth considering. But, like I say, I say that based out of ignorance of the life cycle agenda and associated budgets for these aircraft.
The remaining B52s are slated to be upgraded to the Rolls Royce F130. The Hs had the T33 when new. The older model B52s were already reaching the hours limit of the airframes and it just wasn't cost-effective to upgrade the planes, especially with lots of J57s laying around. At least. that my understanding. I was Navy, not Air Force, so everything was second-hand info
I think they got the idea from the old tractors. Some of them even used an explosive charge to fire them bad boys up. Just saying and then one on to have a pony motor on the tractor to start up the diesel. Innovation is great
They are called jettison packs, the external bomb point on aircraft wings. Where Ordinance went and they were use to drop the bombs that were hung on the wings. And where gun pods or rocket pods where hung. In case a fire 🔥 or something shorted out. And to keep from blowing the aircraft or helicopter up. They would jettison it away from them.
I don't quite see the similarity between jump starting a car and "jump starting" 8 jet engines on B-52s which is called a cartridge start or "cart start".. I don't know what other start modes B-52s have but on F-4s they normally use "pneumatic mode" and sometimes cart start or cartridge start... They install a huge explosive cartridge in the engine cart breech which the pilot detonate..which produces lots of gasses enough to rotate the engine (compressor) enough to support ignition and engine start...The cartridge produces a lot of foul smelling smoke....
I wonder when that mod got put in. The ones we used had a ten foot lanyard with a toggle on it. You grabbed the toggle and ran away, when you hit the end of the lanyard it fired the cart and (hopefully) started the left engine. I worked F-4G at George AFB in 1980.
Actually they cold start four engines one on each pylon. This is consistent with what the video shows as smoke is seen coming from on engine out of each set of two engines. The remaining engines use power from its sister engine right beside it to start.
So in 70 years they didn't upgrade the engines? I understand that the electronics are very important nowadays but the engine upgrade could increase the range.
The Dark clouds are also coming from water being injected. The wing tip gear is because the plane cannot take off with a full load of fuel. The outrigger wheels help with fuel load. Then fully refuel depending on the task.
The outriggers have little to do with the fuel load. They are there because of the landing gear bicycle configuration with the main gear being on the centerline. Light or heavy fuel, the external tip tanks will drag if not for the outriggers. The Buff can indeed take off with a full fuel load. As for the water injection, those are H models which never had a water-injection system. It was not used after the G model.
@@barrygrant2907 I worked on many B52;s at Tinker AFB. The tip gear is indeed a part of the overall gear but the plane cannot take off with a heavy fuel load. 12% was the norm and 100% tank off at altitude. The tip gear used to just fall off like the 71.They even have to dump fuel if they have to RTB.
@@Loreleifury We used to launch routinely with 190k fuel load without ordnance, or 95k with full bomb load. That was G models, in addition to the water.
During the Vietnam War, I participated in anti war demonstrations in front of the Seattle Federal Building and Federal Courthouse. From time to time, a B52 made a relatively low level pass over demonstrators. Just practicing for dropping bombs in Vietnam, I always supposed. Or perhaps it was just a way to say "Hi!" Other than that, I've never observed a B52 flying across Seattle airspace.
During WW2 I believe the RAF had at least one type of aircraft whereby a Coffman starter was used to get the engine to fire up?? I'm talking about well after The Battle of Britain & suspect it may well have been the Hawker Typhoon or the Tempest?? Can someone enlighten me please and or correct me!!
I grew up on Beacon Hill overlooking Boeing field in Seattle, WA. My brother and I used to watch the B-29's take off and land during test flights. Later it was the B-49's and B-52's! This was in the late 1940's and 50's. It was an incredible place to grow up and so exciting to see and hear these massive aircraft take off and land! They were built and tested right below our house at the Boeing #2 plant and Boeing Field.
B-49's? Don't you mean B-47's? B-49 was a jet powered Northrop Flying Wing which never actually entered service.
My uncle was a pilot in WW2, the Korean war, and Vietnam. He's 98 years old now. He told me that when he flew B52's it was like sitting on the front porch of your home and flying the block you lived on. He flew most of the aircraft in the US inventory but the B52 was one of the most remarkable. He also flew the F111 for several years but that's another story.
respect
I know a retired Command Chief that would agree with your Uncle 100%. Please, if possible, relay my profound gratitude to your Uncle.🇺🇸❤️
Stop open fire.
@@xuncao6043 stop open fire
@@cyndersloohoo7822 stop open fire
"Kick the tires and light the fires" on Alert Duty in the 70's. I was a Crew Chief of both a (at different times) B-52 and KC-135. I learned early on that the best kept aircraft were chosen by flight crews for TDY assignments. Soon my aircraft 57-1495 had on-time take-off records and flew all over the world as a result. My time in the Air Force was priceless, thanks for bringing back the memories!
The engine does not start from small explosions. They use a slow burning cartridge to generate enough fumes and gas to get the starter turbine to rotate, to rotate the engine and get it started. Each cartridge is about a gallon of powder.
Failed in Afghanistan ☠️☠️👽👽
And the "black smoke" is from the cartridges, not burning oil or fuel by the engines.
@Brandon Palmer
No war US won in the history
Y they have to do that?
@@theeraphatsunthornwit6266 emergency override emergency procedures hard start emergency field operations
Can we just sit back and appreciate the A/M32A-86 in the back ground. Work horse 💪🏾
I am a proud, past member of the U.S. Coast Guard, serving from 1966-70 at Alameda, Groton and Cape May.
Thank you for your service! God bless!
I was born in 1960 and grew up near Hill AFB. We had SAC on the base back then. I have good memories for the B-52s scrambling, of touch and go exercises, of the roar from static engines. I used to lay on the roof of the house and watch them fly overhead, it almost felt like I could reach up and touch the underbelly. Dad used to make the comment 'That's the sound of freedom' as they flew overhead. Eventually HAFBs mission changed and the F-16s came in. Dad would still comment 'That's the sound of freedom' as the F-16s flew overhead. We had railroad tracks on the side of the house opposite HAFB. A girlfriend at the time once commented 'You all stop stalking mid-sentence when a plane fly's over or a train rolls by'. I'd never noticed this, it was just part of living where we did.
Around 1982 wife and I were out on one of the Ausable river backwaters when the AFB at Oscoda scrambled their fleet. It was just about dusk. We heard this tremendous roaring. And one after another flew over, just above tree top level. We could FEEL the sound and wind disturbance. It was a sight we'll never forget
That was the sound of freedom, must of been awesome.
@@sd906238 It truly was. That base was decommissioned some years back, sadly. I lived about 20 miles South of the Willow Run airport in the 50's and 60's. That was where the bomber plant was during the war. I saw a LOT of military planes flying over as a kid. B36's with their insane droning. P 61 Black Widows. When the air shows are around, I still see B17's, B24's, and B25's. And an occasional C47.
shouldve told your wife right there and then this is a show u organized for her and start to sign Berlin
A F16 jet had an aborted landing in Tromsø and when it was climbing at what I assume was full afterburner it triggered the car alarms in half the city and even if I was about 3km away I could feel the vibrations in my body more then I could hear that roaring thunderous loud sound... Only thing similar I have experienced was top fuel drag race.
Yes I was stationed at Wurtsmith in 1972. Those were "G" model Buff's. Still had ADC on base flying F-106's at the time.
Cartridge start engines, not explosive blast. The cordite (or modern equivalent) cartridge produces the gas pressure at a controlled rate to rotate and start the engines. It saves the aircraft from being reliant on external start trucks. A more up to date system is an APU air producer, the Auxiliary Power Unit produces compressed air to rotate and start the engines. But if the APU is dead, the aircraft then needs an external source of compressed air. I’ve worked with cartridge start aircraft, no matter how ready I was for the start it always made me jump. The engine goes from stationary to idle in about 3 seconds, it’s quite a sudden experience.
Thanks for imformation!
Did you go onto a wiki site to copy and paste this and then change a few things to make it noticeable? 🤣🤣
It's amazing that parts are not broken. It is really the best way to start the engine for fast response, I think the cartridge is about the size of a 5 inch shell. They might have used the same cartridges to launch torpedoes and depth-charges. Cartridge start was also used on piston engines.
@@Adrianokingslyprentice5435 I worked on Hunter aircraft years ago in the very early 70’s when I was an apprentice, some marks of Hunter used cartridge start some used IPN starter systems, both systems did a similar thing, started the engine with a very loud and sudden “whoosh”. Later on I went on to work on large civil aircraft with APU’s which produced the compressed air to turn and start the engines, plus of course provide electrical power and air for air conditioning systems while on the ground.
So after 50 years working as an aircraft engineer on aircraft such as Gnats, Hunters, Hawks, Harriers, Sea Harriers, DC10, A300, A310, Boeing757, BAC111, A320, A340, A330, Boeing747-200 and Boeing747-400. The last 31 years as a CAA licensed avionics engineer, I didn’t need to “copy and paste” I felt I could talk from experience!
@@charliegould5865 I believe you
My, things have changed since I was a Radioman in the Coast Guard. Thank You to todays young men and Women in the Coast Guard.
Actually, the black smoke during Cart Starts is from the black powered in the cartridges, not inefficient engines as stated. As a former B-52 flying crew chief, I was also engine run qualified, and periodically had to do cart starts, which is a rather neat feature, except for the cleaning of the carts afterwards. Ended up all black from the soot.
In the beginning there was a water injection system which increased the thrust from the engines for takeoff. That created the heavy, black exhaust you see in the old films from the 50’s and 60’s. The old pilots used to tell the new pilots that the plane used to run on coal, not jet fuel.
You should have seen those older models that had the water injection during a runup to full throttle on the ground and then hit the water injection. It would make that whole wing tip move about 1 1/2 foot forward, then when you cut the throttle it would spring back to where it originally was.
They dropped the water injection on the H models.
@@stephenmonken1337 I thought it was the H model that they dropped the water injection. I was stationed at Roswell NM, Walker AFB '60 to '63 Periodically had G model in transit from Castle AFB. As I recall, we had to refill their water tanks before they left Walker.
@@stephenmonken1337 they dropped the water injection when the J-57's were replaced with the TF-33's on the H models, which had more power and used less fuel
@@mrbubbarosa I said "They dropped the water injection on the H models.
A MITO off the alert pad is a sight to behold. I ALWAYS loved to watch them
KC/EC-135 Crew Chief 1980-1991
AGREE!! always liked to watch those big boys rolling down the runway at 30 second intervals. Only thing thing was, you wanted to be the first one to take off, because the turbulance was a real pain for all the rest that followed. Did you ever notice that they flared off to left or right as soon as they could to get out of that rough air?
Bomber crews are just next level badass
Yeah, I think that's the greatest generation of Americans to ever live, the one's that really loved their country, the one's that fought in the second world war and Korea, My dad was one of them. !!
The "unburned fuel" is NOT from fuel inefficiency. It was from WATER INJECTION used to cool the engines while they PURPOSELY dumped more fuel into the compressor to gain more power.
What an awesome Birds of real strength. God bless you Birds and gangs.
Failed in Afghanistan ☠️☠️👽👽
Awesome looking plane in the sky! Great filimng
It's called a cartridge start, they are not explosives, think of them as a small solid propellent rocket that spins a small gas turbine to get the bigger gas turbine running
Thanks, I wondered what weirdness went on to get them going with ‘stuff’ rather than compressed air.
Sounds expensive. Nobody can burn money like the military. Not disparaging the forces, just constantly amazed.
Wow god bless America Everyone 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
That nose up take off is unusual. They normally take off tail high. Worked on B52’s, mods D, G & H …from 1976 to 1981. Retired in 2000. Do it again in a minute! Cheers
First off, Thanks for your service! I know what you mean. I used to work on E models from 1960-1963. Watching them take off now just looks wrong to me. Watched many of those nose down takeoffs.
Has to do w/ turbo fan engines on the H model , I was told they had enough power to rip the wings off
@@rolandemartin854 No kidding. I worked both H and G models and never really paid much attention to the takeoff attitude until I was at Andersen after they reorganized the maintenance squadrons. It was really strange watching one take off and climb out in a nose down attitude.
I've got no clue about this ,nose up, nose down ! More info please! Or video? I'm not good on the internet! Thanks in advance.
I don't know about B-52 starter cartridges but I handled starter carts for F-105's and they are about the size of a gallon paint can. The black smoke you see is not unburned fuel as the narrator said but the gas emitted from the starter cart. I've been engulfed in that black smoke many times and it has a very unique odor. Though not exactly an explosive device, they were stored in the munitions storage area.
Correct in all respects.
Taking off from Galena Alaska, as I taxied out I had great sympathy for that poor troop guarding an aircraft in the cold.
Hey Terrance! When we’re you at Galena? I was stationed there from Nov 91-Nov 92
Had a CH53K show up to my job last year. It was absolutely badass
The starting cartridges were a propellant that burned and emitted a volume of gas that was used to turn the starting turbines attached to each the engine. The black smoke is not unburned jet fuel. If a ground equipment start turbine air supply was used, the air it supplied would turn this same turbine, like a car's starter would turn an engine, to start the engine rotation. Once one engine was running, it could supply compressed air to the other engines that needed to be started. Using two start cartridges assured the flight crew that at least one engine would start that could be used to start the others. If the two failed to start their respective engines then new cartridges could be installed and the effort to start retired.
Those cartridges usually contained cordite.
I love the buff. I have pictures refueling on the way to Australia from Guam. 43rd SPS for life...
What year? I made the trip in 1987. Ten days at Darwin.
@@bobmorgan1575 It was Jun 1986.
The cart starts are not explosions but quick powerful burns. We used them in the 70s in the 'G' on engines #4 and #6 during SAC alert exercises.
Now that's some serious rolling coal!
MITOs in pre turbofan days were particularly hazardous. At Mather in Sacramento we had one go down because it could not overcome the turbulence of the wake of the plane just before it. Never gained sufficient lift to stay airborne. The pilot did manage to get it out over empty fields before it went in. No survivors. They extended MITO distances after the crash. I believe they were readjusted with the addition of turbofans and the retirement of water injection.
Carts themselves were not exactly safe. We had one installed incorrectly across the flightline on a BUFF. They had a handle you held and then rotated them into place until they locked. This one was not rotated properly. When they did the cart start the thrust blew it right through the cowling and it howled down the flightline several hundred yards and caught a guy in our unit right in the leg. Shattered it severely. Don't think he ever walked right again.
MARAVILLOSO, VER ÉSTOS AVIONES Y ELICOCTEROS , CON TAN AVANZADA
TECNOLOGÍA Y PODER. LOS PILOTOS
MECANICOS, Y TÉCNICO EN GENERAL
CON UNA ALTA CALIDAD PROFECIONAL
QUE LOS CARACTERIZA. SEGUIRA SIENDO EL PAÍS, PIONERO DE LA AVIACIÓN MUNDIAL.SALUDOS Y BUENAS SUERTE, EN ESTA HERMOSA
CARRERA. DESDE MIAMI FLORIDA. SALUDOS.
HELICOPTEROS
It's the airframe that's massive, not the engines. And Coffman starters have been around forever.
Awesome video👌
Yup. Cart starts on B-52Gs at Barksdale AFB in the late 80s during exercises and to impress the visiting SAC commander. Interesting times.
I love this plane
I was very lucky to live by March AFB in So Cal in the early 80's. Many a night we woke up to the house shaking because these birds where flying over. We used to watch these for hours. You don't know power until you see a B52 take off...
If you've never seen a B52 up close at an airshow etc you will never understand how incredibly skinny the body is?
Used to work around them, considering their nickname BUFF for big ugly fat feller (more derogatory names can be substituted), we never considered them skinny.
i dont understand
Failed in Afghanistan ☠️☠️👽👽
@@iampakistani4092 That was never in Afghanistan if it only was u wouldnt even be able to say that word because a plane something like that, bomb japan
True of all the old bombers. Just enough body for the load. But huge wings.
Saturn V rocket: 7.6 million pounds of thrust. The mind boggles.
When I was in school, there was a SAC base in Rome, NY, about 12 miles away. B52's used to fly over my house all the time. I also remember sonic booms frequently.
B-52s are subsonic
@@flyjetz They had other planes that would make the sonic booms. Griffis AFB was a SAC base at the time, so they had whatever was in the US inventory. When I remember the booms it was late elementary school and Jr. High. That would make it between 59 and 63. One day in October, about 8PM, we had a power failure. I looked out the window and saw a big orange thing on the horizon through the trees. I freaked out. I thought it was a nuclear explosion. It turned out to be half of the rising harvest moon. Turns out the entire Northeast and Canada had a power failure. Those were the times I grew up in though. Kruschev went to the UN, pounded his shoe on his desk, and said "we will bury you". I really didn't think I would grow up.
Now that's green energy! Greenpeace got nothing on this!
@@FunnyVideoCollector are you a pollution protester or a B-52 pilot??
F111's had the same starter system
I was in SAC starting in the 70s. Quick start cans were most often used during alert aircraft repositioning exercises when aircraft were outside normal alert areas and didn’t have all the normal AGE equipment handy. I wasn’t a maintenance guy but they told me quick start cans work but prolonged or excessive use accelerates engine wear. We had to don masks during quick starts because of the toxicity of the smoke and you never knew which way it would blow. Ah, back when things made sense!
Cart starts were the normal for many piston aircraft using radial engines, especially in the Navy-it made the aircraft lighter and faster starting. Many early jet engines used the system also.
That is black powder, not great for engine wear.
I can't see these on fligth radar 24 but amazingly, some of the newest military jets can be seen !
you must be a badass mfkn plane to have your engines started with EXPLOSIVES
THKS
The Daily Aviation is usually pretty accurate but there are some glaring discrepancies in this B-52 story.
The retrofit will be interesting . Can you detail any changes coming to this aircraft ,engine wise ?
Cart start is not a good expression for using cartridges since there is also start carts, wagons with an engine for the normal start of the aircraft's engines. What would you call it when you start with a start cart then? A start cart start? To differentiate from the cart start.
Nice vid
It looks strange to me as I watch these big boys start engines and taxi out. I was assigned to Walker AFB 1960 to 1963. The planes in these pictures are H models. The ones I worked on were E models. Much much different aircraft in the way it operated.The E models had all air started engines plus practically all of the other equipment waas air driven as well and you didn't have all that smoke and thunder on start-up. Watching these modern ones take off is weird looking to me. The E models were configured in a way that on take off, the rear landing gear would come off the runway first and the plane would take of in a nose down additude!!
They still use air carts to start them, this type of take off is for training, day to day we would still use air carts, I got out last December but I was a crew chief on them.
@@yrs_kino7928 OH FOR THE GOOD OLD DAYS!! in '63 we used the MD-3 electric cart and the MA-1-A air cart. Even in Alert Area. Just unhooked them and Aircraft taxied right over top of them. We then had to clean up area after, to repark planes later
I'm no bomber expert but one would think that they would have replaced or upgraded them engines by now......
They've tried several times. The airframe can't take the stress.
You should see one of these take off and land on an aircraft carrier....mind blowing.......
😂😂😂
Фантастические машины!
There are more pilots here than there are planes in existence. Someone is lying
These planes are an awesome beautiful sight in the sky above you ! 51222
Could B-52 engines be replaced by new and more efficient ones?
The Democrats are going to put on electric motors. Don't worry.
@@texancowboy9988 Instead of bombs, it will carry batteries. Ha ha
Perfectly normal cartridge start technique, used so the aircraft doesn't need external resources. Once one (or two) engines are started they can be used to start the others. Normally they'd use a start cart but they practice other techniques too. Violent, noisy but very effective.
Every time I see the BUFF, on in the air or on the ground, my first thought is always: THAT IS ONE MASSIVE BIRD! It must be like being in another world to fly it, at least to this GA pilot!
Muito bom.
Amazing plane getting older but still important ang deadly
Known as a "Cartridge Start"..........Has been around in the jet engine world for many years.....Also recall seeing an old tractor that was started using a shotgun shell type cartridge......
Awesome birds.
Love the B52. One of my favorite planes along with the B747. It's great to see them still flying after all these years. I thought that they had rocket assist for take off or was that when they were new??
I havnt seen a b52 with rocket assist but could be wrong. Did see that special ops c130 herc that had them on for some rescue mission, although in the end it was never used
@@_Shinasu Chuck Norris's C130 had them in Delta Force 😆
@@_Shinasu JATO units are probably not needed with more powerful engines. Why strain the air-frame?
I consider it deterence and peacekeeper.
I was stationed at Griffiss AFB before the cold war ended- I witnessed several "Alert Pad Scramble" drills, where the real alert bombers, with the real nukes and full load of fuel, would scramble and be gone in literally about 20 minutes, thundering the sky with the old school 'water injection' thrust assist while so fully loaded (FYI the 'Center Wing fueltank' gauge went up to 250,000 lbs of fuel.. they really dont make them like they used to). We often thought the world was ending, that the bombers had to get clear before the enemy nuke took out our location. So YIKES.
The drills were always performed 100% authentic, it was real right up until the crew broke open their mission cards, and read the order: RTB. whew.
So in the end, it was a drill to have all of the crew trained with the muscle memory to do all of that with speed when the real- real time occurred. Thankfully it never did.
PS: regarding the age of the BUFFs... I can recall a specific B-52. A G model, "53-5008" (funny how you only remember the plane nicknamed "5-balls-8"). The 53 in the tail # signifies it was a 1953 serial #.
Lane, I'm afraid your memory is doing disservice to you. B-52G production began in 1957, so that was likely a '57 or '58 model, not a '53. Also, A-G model BUFFs had 5 digit serial numbers, not 6.
@@ArmadilloMan1948 I agree, all the E-models that I worked on were made in '56
MY GOD THE EXHAUST POLLUTION!!!!
Único,irreemplazable, durará 100 años volando , ningún otro avión tendrá esta duración!!!
Refueling: The Buff gets heavier, with little effect... the tanker gets a whole lot lighter
Hurry !! The bombs are dropping dang
Believe it or not, I could smell the smoke
BUFF is a great warplane.
There is a lot of confusion about the various starting methods for B-52's. Originally they started one (or more) engines with compressed air from ground "start carts" or by cross-bleed of compressed air from engines that had already started. On-board APU's could be started by battery power and then supply the bleed air to rotate the main engines.
I am not familiar with the concept of firing a cartridge directly into the engine turbine..
I was part of a team at AirResearch (now part of Honeywell) in Phoenix AZ in the late 1970's that provided SAC with a "Cartridge Starter" that used old surplus JATO cartridges to produce a sustained burst of hot gasses to spin a version of air-turbine starter geared to individual turbine shafts to rotate each of the eight turbine engines for very quick "scramble" takeoffs from fully manned B-52's parked near the runways of Military Air Bases. The bomber was allowed to start its take-off run even if the cantankerous JATO bottles failed to fire on one engine. These JATO bottles produced a very corrosive sulfurous gas at about 1800 degrees. It would have destroyed the main engine components if it were injected into gas path of the J-57 engines.
I think that this starting method was never used again after the Cold War ended.
I never could figure why the military never upengined the B52 with better engines.
GREAT
Piston AC have been started with just explosives since WW2.
Absolutely incredible aircraft. No doubt about it. Curious though, and I ask the question out of pure ignorance... given they're still in operation, why have the engines never been replaced with more modern and considerably more fuel efficient variants? It would seem that the increased range and reduced operating costs would make this something worth considering. But, like I say, I say that based out of ignorance of the life cycle agenda and associated budgets for these aircraft.
The remaining B52s are slated to be upgraded to the Rolls Royce F130. The Hs had the T33 when new. The older model B52s were already reaching the hours limit of the airframes and it just wasn't cost-effective to upgrade the planes, especially with lots of J57s laying around. At least. that my understanding. I was Navy, not Air Force, so everything was second-hand info
There was an instance where a BUFF was fitted with a By pass turbofan. But only one. Don't know what came of that experiment.
Living History
Lindo !!! PIÚMA, ES, Brazil.
The BUFF has only been doing engine starts like this for at least 60 + years, not exactly breaking news.
Quite a few aircraft of this era were cart start eg Hawker Hunter
My grandpa had a plane that used a blank shotgun shell to start it
I think they got the idea from the old tractors. Some of them even used an explosive charge to fire them bad boys up. Just saying and then one on to have a pony motor on the tractor to start up the diesel. Innovation is great
They are called jettison packs, the external bomb point on aircraft wings. Where Ordinance went and they were use to drop the bombs that were hung on the wings. And where gun pods or rocket pods where hung. In case a fire 🔥 or something shorted out. And to keep from blowing the aircraft or helicopter up. They would jettison it away from them.
I woke up on General LeMay's birthday in 1993 and didn`t believe in God anymore.
I don't quite see the similarity between jump starting a car and "jump starting" 8 jet engines on B-52s which is called a cartridge start or "cart start".. I don't know what other start modes B-52s have but on F-4s they normally use "pneumatic mode" and sometimes cart start or cartridge start... They install a huge explosive cartridge in the engine cart breech which the pilot detonate..which produces lots of gasses enough to rotate the engine (compressor) enough to support ignition and engine start...The cartridge produces a lot of foul smelling smoke....
I wonder when that mod got put in. The ones we used had a ten foot lanyard with a toggle on it. You grabbed the toggle and ran away, when you hit the end of the lanyard it fired the cart and (hopefully) started the left engine. I worked F-4G at George AFB in 1980.
elephant walk formation is called "line astern" formation.
So is this the same with coffman starter or not?
There's cart start from a pony engine on a small wheeled cart, and there is cartridge start from an over-size shotgun shell looking thing. Sheesh!
'
american beautifully B-52 bomber airplanes...
american company must keep up make many more better B-52 bomber airplanes
Actually they cold start four engines one on each pylon. This is consistent with what the video shows as smoke is seen coming from on engine out of each set of two engines. The remaining engines use power from its sister engine right beside it to start.
You're close, all the engines feed a common bleed air manifold and the air can be directed through valves to whichever engine it's needed.
So in 70 years they didn't upgrade the engines? I understand that the electronics are very important nowadays but the engine upgrade could increase the range.
I use the same start method to get my Chevy wagon going.
How have these dinosaurs not been re-engined with a cleaner more fuel efficient power plant ?
That is a lot of fuel the B-52s take onboard .... who/what plane(s) refuel the HC-130, KC-10, KC-130, KC-130J, KC-135 ?
Any that use a refueling boom instead of the Navy probe and drogue system
The Dark clouds are also coming from water being injected. The wing tip gear is because the plane cannot take off with a full load of fuel. The outrigger wheels help with fuel load. Then fully refuel depending on the task.
The outriggers have little to do with the fuel load. They are there because of the landing gear bicycle configuration with the main gear being on the centerline. Light or heavy fuel, the external tip tanks will drag if not for the outriggers. The Buff can indeed take off with a full fuel load. As for the water injection, those are H models which never had a water-injection system. It was not used after the G model.
@@barrygrant2907 I worked on many B52;s at Tinker AFB. The tip gear is indeed a part of the overall gear but the plane cannot take off with a heavy fuel load. 12% was the norm and 100% tank off at altitude. The tip gear used to just fall off like the 71.They even have to dump fuel if they have to RTB.
@@Loreleifury We used to launch routinely with 190k fuel load without ordnance, or 95k with full bomb load. That was G models, in addition to the water.
Why not put some newer more fuel efficient engines on them if we're going to keep flying them?
Some weird thing about wing and engine frame loads. It can’t have four modern ones to replace the eight.
During the Vietnam War, I participated in anti war demonstrations in front of the Seattle Federal Building and Federal Courthouse.
From time to time, a B52 made a relatively low level pass over demonstrators. Just practicing for dropping bombs in Vietnam, I always supposed.
Or perhaps it was just a way to say "Hi!"
Other than that, I've never observed a B52 flying across Seattle airspace.
It looked like they used at least 5 cartridges, not two-am I wrong?
The black smoke is the cartridges used to start the engines (Gun powder)
Those cartridge starters are commonly referred to as Coffman starters.
During WW2 I believe the RAF had at least one type of aircraft whereby a Coffman starter was used to get the engine to fire up?? I'm talking about well after The Battle of Britain & suspect it may well have been the Hawker Typhoon or the Tempest?? Can someone enlighten me please and or correct me!!
Dahl country thank you.
I have personally taken out many enemies with a B-52 bomber... on GTA :)