Heating A Boiler Or Still : Simple Right? . . . Right?
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- Опубликовано: 5 сен 2024
- You couldn't be faulted for assuming that heating a still would be a simple job. But it turns out there are a few things that could go wrong that you need to consider!
My family gave me an induction cooker for my birthday and I think this will help illustrate a few problems. So lets crank it up and have a look!
You definitely need a constant power source but regulated like a 10 000 watts scr motor controller. Pid is another option. Great video mate. Happy distilling Jessy.
Thata just silly , i know of someone eho has produced countless gallons of alcohol on a cheap chef magic induction cooktop and it always performs perfectly.. the trick is to use a 5 gallon still ...anytjing above thst wont work but 5 gallons as nd below you cant best an induction cooktop for this purpose you have 100 % control of the heat ,whst more could you want ..he as t transfer is near 100%
But of we use a thick, heavy cast iron plate, or even a layer of sand in a metalic pan between the induction cooker and still, is it a good idea to create some thermal inertia to avoid those fluctuations (boiling, stopping, boiling, stopping)?
Brilliant! I love your wisdom on groking the 'simple things'. Well done!
+Nate Ashe thanks my man. Not too sure what groking is, shalltake it as a compliment hehe
Sry, it's an 'old geek' term, meaning to understand on a deeper level. It comes from a 1960's sci-fi book, Stranger in a Strange Land by Robert A. Heinlein.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grok
+Nate Ashe don't be sorry. Always happy to learn another geek term!!
Great vid and super clear explanation!
+Bearded & Bored thanks my man! Looking forward to the colab!!
I use an induction hob (similar to the one in your vid) and have never any problem with my reflux still.
The effect of SSR cycling is greatest in a small mass being heated such as an element. If the mass is greater the effect is reduced and much more controllable. Think of a heavy cast iron pot vs a cheap thin, frying pan. Having a heating mass between the pot and the heat source will temper the effect of cycling. this includes elements with a heat sink attached.
+Layne Rossi thanks dude! makes a whole lotta sense.
Wow. Brilliant explanation thanks Jesse :)
a gas flame would be easiest I control. the cycling hotplates are the worst. you have inspired me to get into the hobby
+Kevin p awesome. Careful once you start..... Haha
Still It it's too cosy eve give not to do it yourself is how it looks
Well done Jesse. God Bless you mate
I bought a $29 electric hot plate from Kmart and it works great with good control as it has thick plates.
Question, as long as the induction plate will hold the weight doesn't cycle heat it should work? If I follow correctly
That induction plate attempts to regulate by switching the power on or off for set amounts of time, depending on how you set the dial. If the induction plate was controlled in such a way that power was continuous AND could that power input could be controlled by a thermostat at the output, then it would work better for your needs.
The reason the oscillation occurs is not from the small change in composition in the boiler. It is caused by the cooling effect and the heat of revaporization.
well said. thanks.
try a heavier
plate to retain the heat buy an induction Adaptor 24 cm from Amazon and a Digital Thermometer to check for a constant heat, and do a proper comparison, also check out DYI induction forges, they hold heat.
I use my induction heater for cooking corn etc. p.s now that you are successful, Aussie’s will now claim you as one of us. ( only joking )
+Rod Drysdale that's a good idea dude! Well I was born in Cairns......
I like your video very much. It's really great. I'll keep an eye on your channel. I am your fan and I will support you.
This question is off topic, but I have a 15.5 gallon stainless steel beer keg used for a boiler, I have a 8 inch ferrule fitting welded to the top center of the keg in place of the original 2 inch tap connection, my question is how do I cut off the top skirt from the keg exposing the nice round dome portion without rupturing the keg and without leaving a gnarly jagged edge on the side of the keg? I want to expose that nice smooth dome and polish the keg shiny bright.
i made a makeshift pot still for my first attempt. i surrounded my still with water and boiled the water. it worked well but was rather slow. this must be the reason i dont see this often
Great vid.
I would add that, some induction cooktops have thermometers, to boil at a set temperature.
So, if you are simultaneously monitoring head temperature, you will get used to distilling with the cooktop.
I won't comment about the reflux column on it. I wouldn't know and not interested in them, personally. 👍
Great topic and video! One question...If I got a Brewzilla 65l boiler and trying to use a SCR t oregulate that power....that will surely be a problem for me due to the fact that it´s using a display with electronics that should be furious If I´d start dialing down that power.... What can I do to mitigate this? Use a weldless 2 in tri-clamp in the side of the boiler and mount a 3kw heating element to control it?
I don´t wanna ruin the Brewzilla by by-passing the control unit or such due to the fact that I'm also using it as a brew kettle for my beer.... What should you do?
That is a cool heating unit it baffles me to see you touching the top of the pot. Does that not get hot up there?¿ The pots I have that have boiling water in them are freaking hot.
+Reese Wawarosky yeah it does. But I only had it on there for 30 sec or so. I wanted to test the Ptfe "gasket" I switched out on it. Leak test haha.
Great info once again
the electric plates i have seen shut off after 4 hours because of safety is that really enough to distill at all?
Hi Jessie I have never fun a still but I am learning as much about doing it as possible.
I was considering what would happen if you use a propane burner and a 2KW element until you get up to temperature. Have you ever tried that?
Hi Jesse, I am new at distilling and have a question. I have a 2' reflux till that I am making out of a 15 gal keg. My question is where is the better place to locate the bubbler plates, above or bellow the 16" column to get the highest ABV? Any and all input is welcome. Thanks.
Hey man,I've got myself a big ass Chinese pot still to use for my stripping runs. The pamphlet says that its induction compatible, so I ordered myself an induction cooktop. Great...however I put a magnet on the boiler and it doesnt stick. The cooker hasn't got here yet so I cant test it immediately so I'm not even sure that it's going to work at all and I'm hoping that maybe you could lmk what to expect
They make those with a temp setting at 5 degree increments
I'm trying to find a way to control my mash & boil (or if it can be done).
So I get what your saying, the temperature at which the still will produce is different but is this method not worth doing? Or can I still do it but just accept that I may lose some product?
Just' when you think you got a new heating element for your birthday, it turns out to be the latest ipad :(
I have an opportunity to convert a 10 gal jacketed kettle to a boiler on my reflux still, the jacket fluid is controlled via a thermostat so would be cycling to maintain temp. What's your thought on that cycling affecting the mash temp stabilizing? I was thinking this type of heat source might also limit scorching too, or is that just wishful thinking?
Great video. As someone who uses propane and wants to get away from that into electric heat I am still having a hard time know what to go with thats affordable and effective. I need something that can provide consistent and adjustable heat to a small(ish) 20litre pot still. Do you use an SCR? Is it viewable in any of your videos? Can you recommend a decent brand for a heater and/or an SCR? Any assistance would be appreciated. Thanks.
+Kevin Burkhart how's it man. Yeah I am using a SCR right now. It's a no name eBay one. Just be aware if you go that way get one that is grosly over rated, and have a think about buying 2.
Elements seem to be different depending on where you are man. I got some on AliExpress.
Kevin Burkhart Use a water heater element with a PID Controller trust me it will save you a lot of headache in the long run or just buy a variable controller from mile high distilling for a few hundred bucks.
I use an induction hob on my set for now. On mine settings 1-4 cycle, but upward settings 5-10 are constant, 5 being the lowest energy. So yes, 1-4 are useless but 5-10 are good. I have it on 10 to get up to heat which takes about 40 minutes for 12L of wash, then I knock it down to 5. 5 may still be just too powerful for my set up though I think.
So I think some induction hobs may be ok and others not. The problem is there's no way of knowing until you try them.
+Marc Duff good point dude! Just because it is so on this one doesn't mean it will be on all!
Same with mine. I have 2. One is 2kw and cycles below 800W. The other is 3kw and cycles below 1700W. Both good above those values though :-)
+Mike Woodward-Gregg awesome. Thanks guys, I will have to re test my one.
Not sure if half power will be low enough for that little pot still. But I can give it a crack!!
The lowest continuous setting of 5 was too strong for a spirit run.
So, It's excellent for a stripping run but no good for a spirit run.
I'm going to try a hotplate next.
+Marc Duff true that......I was hoping that wouldn't be the case. But assumed it was haha.
I'm thinking stove elements with scr.
Hey I have a 6 gallon copper still and I'm looking for a good way to heat it with electric and I'm not good at making things but I will be doing it in a shed so I don't think propane is safe thanks
I get that this is 2 years old but hopefully you read this and reply. So what you are saying about heat cycles means that the PID's that George from Barley and hops makes and sells are not good for distilling?
I see it :).
Honestly I have no idea what I said in this video haha. Long time ago!
But a pid does not, by it self make cycles. Depends how it's set up.
I actually just got back from Texas. There is a podcast coming, bearded, George and I sat down and talked about a bunch of stuff. Pids were one of those things :) . . . . Watch this space!
I have an 8 gallon stainless still and have been using a propane turkey fryer to heat it and want to switch to electric to control it better. Please help!!
Delayed comment...what if you used a metal plate between the induction top (or any cycling heat source) and the boiler? Would it hold and dispense heat in a more uniform manner? Cast iron perhaps? Just a random thought/question from a newbie.
Yup I can definitly see that making a huge difference . . . . But Im probably still going to build something. You know. Because I "have to" haha
Can anyone recommend an SCR heater that would do a good job of heating a 20 liter copper pot still but is somewhat affordable?
+Kevin Burkhart hi man. Do you want to build something yourself or just buy? And what general part of the world are you in?
Sorry about my above comment. I didn't notice you replied. Im in North America and would prefer not to have to build one but if you can save a substantial amount of money building one then I am open to it. Because I am cheap lol. BTW where I am at I do not have access to 240V as all outlets are 120 here.
Hey Jesse, any solution on using a electric stove with thermostat for running a still? Got myself a cheap electric stove that has 5 heat levels and it cycles for few seconds when the heat has reached its chosen level. I was avoiding gas stoves/open flames to be safe. Any replies would be appreciated thanks.
can you put a heating element in the bottom with element going toward the top?
You can actually get thermo controlled induction cookers that have a 1 degree Celsius margin of error. A thermometer goes into solution and controls the temperature of that solution by powering on and off the induction cooker. They are so accurate I use them in chemistry applications (often working with volatile chemicals). I fractional distill (separate) ethanol from water very successfully using a pot distiller. Hmmm I'm now thinking I might make some rum:-)
I just got a pid. Which has an ssr. And in 5 gallon pot once it gets to temp it does cycle but with a millisecond response so I found no slag or anything but watch the output if using an electric element it can go from nothing to puke in no time.
#barley and hops. Thanks again for the pid hook up.
+Randall Janc that's cool man. Yeah I really need to get my one set up lol
But if u use it as a water bath for reservoir...
I need something like that only industrial size.
+Thomas edwin exciting. How big dude?
Still it; big enough for a 15 gallon keg.
If you wanted to use this on a 15gal keg you would first need to put a flat bottom on it. Kegs have only a small flat spot on the bottom the rest is tapered.
Reese Wawarosky; The bottom of my 15.5 gallon keg has no flat spot at all, it's completely bowl shaped, not only that it's made from 304 food grade stainless steel, that will not heat up from induction heating, because good stainless steel is non-magnetic, I would have to put a flat iron or regular steel piece on the bottom for it to get hot.
I have been looking for some type of heating element that sets in the very bottom of the bowl shape of the bottom of my beer keg so I can have as little as 1/2 a gallon of liquid in the bottom of the keg and still cover the element so it doesn't run dry and burn out.
Why is cycling so bad? What do you think happens when you run a PID controlled setup?
If it takes 30 seconds to go through 1 on off cycle then it is pulsing vapor through the still. That means a total lack of control.
If the PID is cycling at that slow a frequency then it is also a problem. If the on off cycle is happening multiple times a second then its not really a issue.
Still It I’ll buy that...for now :-)
A temp probe in the kettle and a PID will solve the problem as you can adjust temp exactly
Hi ya Old norse brewery.
Problem is that the liquid in the kettle is boiling. So we don't want to control temp (you CANT control the temp of a boiling liquid). Instead we are trying to control the rate of evaporation. A PID is actually a hindrance to that.
I was thinking about this like a home brewer for a long time about this too haha
Still It Hi. Ethanol evaporates at 77 C? So not 102 C so you can’t boil violent?
You wouldn't by chance know how to make a good Irish whiskey would you?
Every time I ask anyone a question I feel like I'm getting bullied again.. I haven't started distilling yet I'm planning and building just a simple pressure cooker/ copper coil / bucket of ice. Do you think I should add a thermometer somewhere? I'm also planning on using a hotplate if possible as I will need to do my distilling in the shed.. if anybody can help me out it would mean alot.
A thermometer always helps, if you have it in the top lid it won't give you an exact reading but you can use it to tell when your still will produce (every still is a different animal) and you can use that as an idea of when to make your cuts. Although I would go more by taste, having an idea like "around this temp I cut my heads last time so it should stand to reason the next time should be close to this temp" is really nice to have. Honestly it's just a little more data to help you know how your run is going. And every little bit can help haha. Good luck my man!
It's a no no for induction cooker.
Thanks for sharing. I'm thinking of getting into the fun. Question on the Induction heater, to battle the up/down cycling of the heat caused by the on/off again would thermal mass stop the fluctuations like what a double broiler does?
It may help a little I I have not tried it to be honest.
I know this is from years ago...but I still have a question. This is obviously being done in a shed on your property I assume? Why would someone buy you an induction hot plate cooker when I assume you have a full kitchen and stove/oven? LOL Great vid just that question always crawls in my head lol. If you lived in a very small apartment in a city then it would make more sense as a gift idea....and I'm thinking entirely too much about this, time to stop.
Because he doesn't have an induction stove top.
@@joelennss I guess the easiest answer is in fact the answer sometimes.
Lol, yup.
Merry Christmas!
So im drunk as hell and probably not paying attentione, but the more expensive induction cooktop i have at work lets us choose the temperature at 10 degree increments. why Would that not work? Also how come you dont use a chinese sukiyaki propane camping stove? They are crazy cheap.
+Generalissmo yeah man I'm thinking of using one of those. I just prefer electric.
It's the cycling that's a problem. As in will give you a temp but it's more of a average. It will spike higher and drop lower.
Also there is no good way to run a still based on the temp. So you want to have manual control of your heat source (percent of full power).
Did I win the contest?
+InglisHill it would seem that way.....
How hot should you run your boiler on a reflux still
I remember thinking induction would be so the great for the still... meh.
+dannalbob yeah kinda ruined my day! Haha.
I was wondering if you could bypass all the electric interface stuff, and use it in conjunction with a SCR the though.
I can't see why you couldn't. People are able to bypass the cycling of regular hotplates, so why not this? You would need to have some electronics knowledge to attempt it however. In the end I bet you could indeed make an induction cooker continuously variable.
FOR US NEWBIES PLEASE NO ACRONYMS
I understand what you are saying. But, why should you spend many dollars doing all this and lose it to the electric company or the gas company? I am trying to save money and the most expensive item doing this is trying to heat the mash. So I guess the answer is to go outside and use wood that can be picked up in the yard? This video was close to useless.
I hear you mate, gotta do what's right for you. But I have to do what makes sense for at least a decent portion of the people watching. If the video ain't for you that's cool.
@@StillIt I can go to the store and buy anything I want. Good quality... I am trying to save money making my own. The people that are watching are angry at the prices we have to pay to have a drink? I am trying to heat 50L. So this video was good but did not help me save money. I am learning, thank you for helping me the best you could. I want free heat or as close as I can come. No electric or gas bill. Or at least a small one. You help do this and you will be my hero. Free heat for a still?
No idea sorry mate, fire is not free either.....unless you have free wood. Which I do not. Will keep an ear out though 👍🏻🥃
@@StillIt I have so much free wood I do not know what to do with it?
Nice! Lucky man lol