Volkswagen's diesel scandal, explained
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- Опубликовано: 23 сен 2015
- The EPA announced that Volkswagen was using a "defeat device" to side-step emission laws. Here's what that means.
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Not saying what VW did was right, but don't the emissions tests have some problems if the car is able to tell it apart from normal driving? In other words, doesn't that mean these tests are not representative of how the cars are normally used?
That's my thought exactly.
I know this is an old thread, but I the way it knew was vehicle speed, steering angle and atmospheric pressure. Basically saying it knew the vehicle was not in motion. The only way to counteract this would be an emission test that is done on the road, versus the quick 5 minute test where a computer just connects with your car's computer to get readouts. I much prefer that method as some minimum wage teenager wouldn't be driving my car around town "emissions testing".
A potential alternative would be if the car is taking in and logging this data while you are using the car during the time between emissions tests and for the test a tester would use that data off the cars computer, versus doing the quick test on the spot with data from the sensors.
But they admitted that they cheated
@@ramanjitsingh4340 They did not own up , VW managers immorally stalled / hindered / and mis-led the EPA investigators for 15 months until a VW whistleblower " blew the whistle" to the EPA officials, For their part in the misleading and perjury to the EPA VW managers are serving lengthy gaol sentences in the USA and a number of German VW senior executives are subjects of extradition orders by the USA FBI, fear of arrest makes the USA is a No-Go country for european VW executives involved in the scandal
It does increase in real world as compared to tested numbers, but they don't increase 40 times
Yes, bash VW, but keep in mind that people prefer good milage (cost efficiency) over eco friendliness.
That is the overarching problem.
Think again. Your logic is flawed.While I agree with your points, you sound like you own a VW...
Obviously no fraud would occur if the priorities were different.
+SerenityReceiver The overarching problem is living in a society that revolves around money. Remove money from the equation and the environment will become so much more important.
+89DerChristian
Honda and Ford were also caught cheating by the EPA a few years ago
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+Justice Suggest me an alternative to money for transactions.
Paianni We need to go back to trading cows and chickens.
the background audio makes it sound like my iPhone is ringing ;P
I thought the same thing haha.
Exactly my thought
I thought someone's phone in that office was ringing
So VW is a typical car enthusiast, that's awesome
+Jerry Neutron So VW is a typical car company, trying every dirty trick in the book to sell more cars, even if that means putting deadly toxins in the air, making you and your children lives shorter. That's awesome.
You clearly drive a gasser since you aren't at all pissed that you paid a higher price for a diesel, and now has zero resale value since it violates emission standards.
+maclunar
Honda and Ford were also caught cheating by the EPA a few years ago
.
fuckoffgoogle I haven't gotten a recall notice and VW still hasn't said anything about a fix or retrofit so shut up you peanut.
They're banned from selling new models where I live in texas also the reason they're the top manufacturer is cuz they're cheaters and have misleading ads.I'm sticking to American made from now on.Honestly the only reason I bought a TDI was for the mileage which will be irrelevant since a fix will slash the mpg of my car.
I'm always thankful for the Verges explanations like this. Keep these coming, it's an easy way to get caught up and understand recent news
+apeirrron
They shouldn't call it #dieselgate though. BMW, Mercedes, Chevrolet all make excellent diesel cars that passed the EPA tests (and overseas Mazda, Honda, Toyota make diesels that pass tough EU 6 tests). A better hashtag is #VWgate since it's only VW that is the problem not diesel tech
.
+electrictroy2010 ehh, doesn't have the same ring to it...
+apeirrron possibly explanation is wrong. Liquid-urea tank is too small and they had to reduce amount of urea which is added to reduce Nox during normal driving. The correct amount of urea is added when a test mode is detected. It is only connected to comfort of the driver (nobody want to addblue too often). VW will add bigger tank and upgrade the software and the problem is gone.
+electrictroy2010 or Volkswagens Diesel Scandal
+Hubert Rybak NO the video explanation is not wrong; you're just ignorant. The VW TDIs in question (beetle, golf, jetta) don't have urea. VW left off that equipment in order to keep the selling price low
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Every car company who reaches #1 spot will always have some type of recall or major scandal. GMC, Toyota, now Volkswagen
5 years later you ain't wrong. Vauxhall back at it again
xD its different when it happens by accident or a flaw, than done on purpose lol
VW wasn't number 1 when they got caught lying, and they still aren't.
@@tommurphy4307 correct, Volkswagen has never been number one especially in the US. See more Hondas, Toyotas, and Ford trucks on the road
not true.
good time to buy a gti on the cheap
If GTIs were diesels, then yeah
Nick Catelli All VW tdi new and used models is banned from selling at all dealers in the us, except for private s3llers. VW will lose billions after this scandal. They will practically beg you to buy there cars. Be informed before you make a comment.
+Ray Cheng VW had less then 2% market share in the US before the scandal anyway.BUT worldwide they are the biggest automaker. in europe i don`t think it will affect the sales much.VW its very popular here and for good reason.
but ofc the company image has a big stain now and they will lose some money
+TheBaxter96 I guess losing billion of dollars just means some money according to you.
+TheBaxter96
Bzzz..... Toyota is the biggest company worldwide, followed by GM, and then Volkswagen in third place. As for Europe it is already affecting sales since the EU opened an investigation of the cars. If they find the same emissions-cheating software, then they plan to suspend TDI sales
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This was very simple yet very informative. Thank you very much.
GREAT video. so informative. I really appreciate that the verge is starting to hit on automotive technology a little bit. Thanks Chris!!
The US automotive industry is suffering, from toyota and vw taking a big market share year by year, they will do anything to slow them down i guess.
I say that because american made cars are known for their big engines and bad millage and environmental impact and now they're against vw for their diesel engine being not so clean? Look at those huge v8 american cars how clean are they in compare to a vw?
Dodge eco diesel, ford eco boost v6 (has almost completely replaced the gas guzzler V8). Prius, Tesla ,mustang Mach E, volt, etc
Very clean since they don’t spew copious amounts of NOx into the atmosphere like a diesel does.
And what V8s? Most American vehicles have four cylinders.
Guys y'all are really good! You explain stuff really well and 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼 for the quality and quantity of the content that you all make!!! 😀😀😀
#1st comment
Awesome video. Been wondering what exactly all the talk had been about.
Thanks for report EPA. Let's test some more .... of other car manufacturer - for example. Do you approximately think others don't act just the same?
+khalid1312
Honda and Ford were also caught by the EPA a few years ago
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+electrictroy2010 tyfi. Have got a link to according report? Just wondering why the echo is much greater... . Can indeed only be a coincidence that all this happening right now where the passat is going to be released.. ?!? :-)
+electrictroy2010 Not like this bud...
no, they usually come clean when they are caught- VW just made things worse by lying about it when they were already outed. they should be forbidden from doing business in the US market.
It's not about fuel consumption that would be the smallest problem but the fact that those cars would loose power if the system was running nonstop.
The emission levels are set by politicians that don't know anything about cars and that is the problem. People demand cheaper cars and in order to meet this demand VW had to do these kind of things.
I don't understand what gain would a VW owner have suing the car company. He got what he paid for and the car works as intended. Almost nobody buys a card because it has low emissions, that is probably the very last thing on the list.
+UltraFighter18 I am an owner of a 2013 Jetta TDI which is affected by this scandal. If my car didn't have to be recalled and nothing changed about it then yes, i would be happy as i paid for and received the product that i wanted. The problem lies in the fact that they are likely going to have to recall my car and make it meet current emission standards, when they do that my car will no longer be the product that i had intended to buy, it will get lower gas mileage and have less power. So VW should have to pay me the difference in value of the car i bought vs what i will have received, because a car that gets 6mpg less and has less power, is not worth what i paid for my vehicle.
+thopkins22 No the car was advertised as getting less than they're getting without the fix, because the EPA tests the car's mpg when they're being tested for emissions and figures out the fuel efficiency. You take away that fix then the mileage goes way higher than advertised. I just got a '15 Golf TDI about 2 weeks before this came out and have been getting upper 40s easily when it's advertised at lower 40s.
+Cam RUclips Your car is better than advertised, meaning you should be getting better mpg now than you thought you were getting before. So when the fix comes, you'll be getting whatever you thought you were getting before. The only loss of value is the hurt brand name associated with your Jetta.
Thank you for explaining.
Ah yes, this. As a Volkswagen fan I can assure you, most of us found the scandals hilarious. Even window decals were made that said "genuine high emissions Volkswagen".
so basically
unburned fuel going into the exhaust pollutes the atmosphere with more nitrogen oxide .
so to prevent that " Nox trap" is made and basically Volkswagen hacked to make it look like they have the best tool to prevent nitrogen oxide but it isn't in reality.
the hack:
though Nox trap is terrible in Volkswagen it would work well if more fuel would be used so basically when the software knows it's being tested it would use more fuel to look like something Good.
reality
while on road it would use less fuel to make it give more mileage to the customer.
conclusion:
profiting the customer by polluting the atmosphere.
thanks guys didn't know what the hell they were talking about.
+shankar yskr True, good for consumer, not good for EPA
+shankar yskr out there ofcourse theres a lot of cars that has more nitrogen oxide intolerant than these VW.... nowadays, they just put a higher tax for them. So do VW have to pay that 'tax' to end this scandal or what?
+Adhi Suryana 'good for consumer'? I'd argue that polluting the atmosphere is in long run NOT good for the consumer. The emission limits are there for a reason. Ever heard stuff like 'each cigarette you smoke shortens your life by 5 minutes'? Think of all the days, months, years you're losing because of polluted air.
maclunar Really? I doubt it will make a difference, since "not everybody" able to afford these cars
The "1%" doesn't pollute the air by their car, it's the "20%" that will
Can you get one of these devices in the aftermarket?
Where's the follow up for this
how did you do it can you share with me , thank you
Wow I’m shocked! I thought big manufacturers are super trust worthy… fingers crossed these big Pharma companies aren’t as scrupulous as these guys
VW was caught by the govt
Big Pharma is the govt (US)
@@roshanantony7467 well said
Big Pharma’s worse. 😂
Is a Nox trap same as Catalytic converter?
Jeremy Clarkson would say ''Save the world, drive fast''
so more fuel burned equals better emissions, but more miles on less gas doesn't equal less emissions?
+Jonathan Root When ever that trap need to clean it's self. A little extra fuel is injected n to the engine after the main power stroke. This heat up the exhaust and the trap and it burn off soot. I drive a tractor and trailer that does this also. My old truck got 6.5 without the trap. The new one only get 5.9.
+Jonathan Root
My hybrid car has a "lean burn" mode that uses less gasoline, but makes more nitric oxides. In fact most modern Direct Injection engines have the same side effect. (Burning more fuel eliminates the NOx but at cost of reduced MPG)
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+Jonathan Root Yup...welcome to the United States!!!!!!
I drove diesel cars in Europe in 2007 and was amazed...I mean totally astounded as to the performance and mileage that cannot come close to the US diesel cars. So I tried to buy one and was told that none were available in the US and if they were the performance would be at least 30% less. All this due to US standards, requiring you to to spew tons more greenhouse gas at the cost of other trace pollutants. It is even worse now here...all new diesels in the US will need an "additive" in a separate tank that when it runs down, the engine performance decreases to compensate and keep the emissions standard up to par. It gets so expensive to operate, in addition to the higher diesel taxes in the US, the bottom line is we do not want the more efficient diesel engines on US roads. Hence you are at the mercy of gasoline.
+eddie telleed the NOx are directly harmful to humans while CO2 is a greenhouse gas, it's not clear cut what's better
yeah I think this is just a ploy to get us to buy more fuel
TDI's are awesome, 51mpg all day FTW! Old school vw diesels got around 45 with NA engines, some guys have done mods (turbo+goodies+tune) to bump that up to the 70's!
good.... but, at the end of the day you're still driving a car built by liars.
@@tommurphy4307 Next on the list of liars Lucid
Actually no one still knows whether they stopped putting in extra fuel for NOx trap regeneration as explained in video. Another possible way to rig official test also includes turning off Exhaust gas recirculation in real driving conditions, in which case, the performance of vehicle is likely to get affected too after they fix the cars.
I like how they cheated just to do better for their customers, but people are complaining about it, I’ll keep my 05 Passat TDI.
and now everyone has just become a lover and protector of the environment. Think of how many SUVs in the US alone, so please let's all just stop pretending :))
Yes true if they stop driving those big cars with v10 v8 and v6 engines the co2 problems should be solved in europe we are driving around now a days in 2and 3 cilinder cars. So us i think vw is doing not so bad comparing to the big american cars
so you like to be lied.
Fade Away i defent vw because even they cheat they are more environmental friendly than any other us car brandt
+J IJzer CO2 might contribute to global warming, but NOx are much more reactive and contribute to the general attributes that used to define diesels as dirty, eg smog, acid rain, and attacks to the respiratory tract. IMO those are worst than the minute and incremental disadvantage in CO2 emissions in petrols.
There's no justification for the obvious and direct lies Volkswagen engineered. NOx emmisions are harmful in ways incomparable to CO2
+Egyptian Doctor i know right. ford is probably the worst, big engines for no reason. Id like to see comparisons of cars and trucks on the road for emissions. In the US all you see are suv's and pickups, its ridiculous.
And they are such moronic retards they dont understand that a v8 pickup guzzles gas like a motherfucker over a 4 or 5 cylinder car, so at the end of the day they BITCH about gas prices and they go up because of this.... VERY fuckin funny. You can only blame yourselves for this, where as some others would like to save you money and give better mpgs like VW, they didnt go about it right but hey at least they arent bitching about gas prices in europe as much
I have one of these scam cars and my family and I are deciding wether or not to sue
BMW managed to make their USA specification diesel cars compliant to the EPA standards without cheating, so it proves it is not impossible, it is a matter of building the cars with a properly engineered exhaust gas treatment system, VW chose to not to comply, equipping their cars with cut-price dysfunctional exhaust gas treatment systems VW cheated upon their competitors, the EPA, the consumer, and the American public in the goal of securing an advantage over those car makers who sought to do the right thing
Only Americans gonna sue, because thats the one of the ways to become ritch esealy.
yep
+Johnson Taylor easyyyyy!!!!
+Johnson Taylor heavy lunch?
+Johnson Taylor Compensation per car will be about $5000. A compensation for $2300(diesel engine option,canada) right off the bat plus compensation for Decreased Performance and Increased Fuel Consumption.
+hfsyuSghf I'd be careful accepting $1000 credit towards a card. That could be taken as acceptance of compensation.
The only GOOD Lawyer is a DEAD Lawyer !
Hey the Verge, nice explanation but I have one little thing I didn't like.
That's the background audio. The little jingle wasn't that bad but the noise from your colleagues was a bit distracting. But overall good one, thanks!
Ive heard It was based on using more urea based solution to flush out the NOx so to speak.
PSA groups BlueHDI has SCR (Selective Catalytic Reduction) which has been tested and It meets european standard. It gets even more hp and better economy.
Love this channel unbiased and they explain everything
From what I understand the Passat TDI is not affected because it has the Urea exhaust treatment and the Jetta, Golf, and Beetle do not have the Urea exhaust treatment thus relying on the NOx trap?
Most people who'll complain are soccer moms in their big SUVs which hasn't seen a stretch of off road since Saab made only airplanes and land rovers were climbing dams.
It was a psyop to start a ban on diesel engines.
So if the car gets less mpg wouldn't that mean it puts more exhaust out?
yaaas this is why im subbed to verge
Very good and funny videos bring a great sense of entertainment!
verge you guys are awesome
makes you wonder what other things corporates are doing unethically but keeping hush about
I bought my golf 6 tdi second handed and got a letter today that it has to be updated, i'm not gonna do it lol
I still love Volkswagen.
They love your cash too
Adnan Ahmad *HURRR Derp* I doNT lIKe A ComPANy sO eVerYONe liKinG iT iS sTUPid *herrrrrr*
@@turnip5465 it's more like the simple fact of loving a corporate identity is utterly stupid.
So they've cheated to get better fuel economy for their customers...
and those same people that benefitted are upset. The quality of these cars are far far better and more reliable than any USA made car.
aveen mahabal when they close business due to backstabbing customers, then they will have no regrets because they tried everything, even throwing themselves under the bus.
aveen mahabal German cars reliable? Is that a joke?
@@josephk1342 any given vw is much more reliable than a chevrolet.
OKAY- in the next demo derby- you take the beetle and i'll take the impala. done deal....
Very informative video.
Two facts:
-without nox trap the car is still alot cleaner than 20 years old diesel.
-20 biggest container ships polute as much as all the cars on the planet.
bonus fact:
-electric car polute air more than vw diesel
Why are you not talking about this as about DeNox?
Dang and I’m just tryna get a diesel
VW is by far not the only manufacturer doing this
explanation to the detection system is incorrect, all modern cars have software to detect if they are on a dyno to ensure breaking and stability systems are functioning correctly when only the drive wheels are moving, the con was then running a totally alternative engine management software when this was detected. Also all vehicles effected will have a optional recall, so i wont send mine back and keep my high mpg ^^
Is My old 2007 passat tdi safe?
No man get rid of that and buy a disel B2 you will love the black gas coming out the echaust like BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
Poor volkswagen :(
Some segments in the video are stamped not adjacent to each other
I don't really get the idea of a private (classaction) lawsuite against VW, yes I was cheated that my car was cleaner in daily use than it really was but fuel economy wise it was actually better than advertised, or at least after an software update the ad numbers are right again...
I'm not going from 50 to 30 mpg!
.....there is a huge lot of vw's near Colorado springs....a sad site
so they want people to voluntarily give up fuel economy?
Is this the same for gasoline cars or just Diesel??
could be someone who hasn't been caught yet
emissions huh? a single trip of a container ship releases more pollution into the environment than my whole family in lifetime...
at least hyundai doesn't lie about it- even after they are caught
I'm sure they're not the only ones trying to pass these regulations tests and ignore the environment
Informative but i always wondered why only VW was struck hard since i have been working with Opels/vauhalls and others and many models recieved a campaing/update after this :D :D
Thanks for the clear and unbiased explanation. But wow - what a really, really dumb thing for VW to do.
Back in high school I had a Earth & Space Science teacher who boasted about keeping the environment clean with his Jetta TDI. Ohhhh the irony!!!!!
My tdi was in the optimum tune for performance and economy but EPA says no. And thats the truth...
BRO I GOT A VOLKSWAGEN ADVERT BEFORE THE VIDEO!
Now interested in a video that shows pre and post update for the MPG.
Didn't it go from ~500k to 11m affected cars?
+HellzHonour 500k in the USA, 11 million internationally
are we forced to di the recall? caus my buddy dosent want to get rid of his golf tdi lol
you mean it won't run unless its registered?? what a POS!
why would you want fewer milage?
The best thing that can come out of this is exposure of EPA scam in the USA that prohibits proper, efficient Diesel engines. The rumor is fuel taxes from such high efficiency engines will not be sufficient.
No wonder the emission test machine is broken when a vw has it
If I were an owner of a blessed vehicle it would get a software flash over my dead body! The EPA emissions levels are absurd and unnecessarily restrictive. I say Volkswagen deserves kudos for providing its customers with automatic software the rest of us covet.
+hfsyuSghf Doubtful, unless caused by the EPA mandated ultra low sulfur Diesel fuel. The EPA along with the CARB is an agency that has outlived its usefulness and needs to be dissolved.
+hfsyuSghf Doubtful, unless caused by the EPA mandated ultra low sulfur Diesel fuel. The EPA along with the CARB is an agency that has outlived its usefulness and needs to be dissolved.
+hfsyuSghf "Other countries" can be thankful for that!
It's happened sooner than you thought.
I didn't expect this from a German car company.
Terrible backdrop. Why film near a bunch of people talking aloud while you explain something not directly related to them?
EPA should test some trucks for emission, owners of the VW were in profit, only loss was for country where car was registered and insurance company.
+shankar yskr out there ofcourse theres a lot of cars that has more nitrogen oxide intolerant than these VW.... nowadays, they just put a higher tax for them. So do VW have to pay that 'tax' to end this scandal or what?
Is the time they put into making this custom program to fool testing worth the (hopefully sever) punishment.
I'm no experet but they should have just focus on making a good car that legitimately pass the standard tests.
l personally will be Buying a Volkswagen now,
that l know this.
Thank you VW.
Nathan Trigg Have fun with your piece of junk of a diesel car
Nathan. you got or ever had a VW. you don't know what in the hell you're talking about. I had all kinds of cars in my lifetime and VW was some of the best cars I ever owned.
Clayton Turner same bro
@@clayman8371 you didn't drive your beetle enough
I bought a new 2011 VW Tdi Jetta. I'm up to 86,000 miles on it and it's averaged 43 MPG ! All the time is was roomy, quiet, no diesel smoke, solid and zipped around like a sports car. Typical German quality to; NEVER had to take it to the dealer for any issues (Plus free maintenance until 36K miles). Now here's the cherry on top of the whole deal... The VW company is giving me essentially every dime I've put into it ! Thank you 'tree-huggers' in California for making the stink about VW lying and providing me with a free car. Still, too bad for VW getting busted, this was a fantastic vehicle !
y2ktube What's funny is that many other car companies have been accused of doing the same exact thing.
@@hydrogenperoxide9741 who cares of if this comment thread is old? Still matters. It still relevant topic. How the heck does Ford trucks so more economical than diesels. Lol American diesel in stink rich but polluted lolol.
Diesel-powered cars generally have a better fuel economy than equivalent gasoline engines and produce less greenhouse gas emission.Their greater economy is due to the higher energy per-litre content of diesel fuel and the intrinsic efficiency of the diesel engine. While petrodiesel's higher density results in higher greenhouse gas emissions per litre compared to gasoline, the 20-40% better fuel economy achieved by modern diesel-engined automobiles offsets the higher per-litre emissions of greenhouse gases, and a diesel-powered vehicle emits 10-20 percent less greenhouse gas than comparable gasoline vehicles.(right from Wiki)
My question is, What is the actual amount of pollutants caused by this scheme?
The EPA claims of "UP TO 40 times more pollutants". First off, "UP TO" could be 2 times. Secondly 40 times could still be an insignificant amount. For example; I could add 10 ppm or 400 ppm to something and it may or may not make any significance. Is this a real problem, or the environmentalists at the EPA over blowing it. Because we know that they have never done that before.
This scandal has had a direct result in the death of 47,000 polar bears, true fact the EPA told me
Remember the 47 polarillion.
My last video agree that ! :D
My brother got a refund for his jetta
Please don’t use iPhone ringtones as background music.
Wow
Well so much for that, then again, I think Volkswagen has done those who want to keep their cars a favour, i love the fuel economy and good power, A lean tune with high turbo boost tends to make a diesel very clean from black particulates and very efficient, but the NOx tends to rise quite a bit, I think it makes more sense to use less fuel anyway to contribute to less to the demand, so that there is more for everyone else while saving your money, there is Algae farms in development to experiment with Diesel production through photosynthesis, Bio fuel with non toxic combustion by-products, we no longer need emission controls then. Volkswagen is probably doing their fight claiming that maybe the EPA doesn't want anybody to laugh, same as banning cannabis, you know what Nitrogen Oxide is? lol. Nah really, I am well aware there are many configurations of atoms in that molecule, and some of them are toxic, but I am just wondering if the rules are getting a bit over the top? Come on, the aim is to conserve fuel isn't it? Or is the EPA enjoying watching people sweat when the fuel prices soar while they do every bit to try and cripple the fuel economy of cars?
Haha Volkswagen is like “ yo keep this on the low but we still running things old school here”
Very high quality German car...
No wonder I can see many vw cars putting out black smoke on the street very often
IT'S A "DIESEL PARTICLE FILTER" DPF FOR SHORT, NOT A NOX TRAP. Rest 99% is correct though.
The funny thing is that everybody is fixated on what they did but nobody understands why!!!! That really cracks me up, and VW unfortunately is getting the heat for what they did to save the customers on stupid maintenance costs because of the EGR crap.
Okay so...what's the problem?
All (new and old) VW TDI cars will have higher fuel consumption in future because of this change they will have to do in the software inside the VW car. So they will get worse CO2 emissions and loose in emissions competition against other brands.
This could drop the price of used VW cars and put higher price on the new ones, so be prepared, VW owners/buyers!
Really like the part when he says that the lawyers are gearing up to take on lawsuits.... hmm i wonder how the lawyers are thinking/feeling... Also, the CEO step down but was this his order/doing or someone else did it without him knowing(still making him pretty shitty)...???
Brilliant! I'll buy one
get two- one that will lie about the emissions and one will lie about how far its been driven....
I heard somebody higher up at the company got 6 or 7 year jail time for this.
Such disgraceful tactics coming from the biggest car company in the world.
what did toyota do now?
Meanwhile in Pennsylvania, diesel vehicles, like my 25-year-old Benz, don't have to be tested for emissions.
VW should perfect a car that will lie about how far it was driven in the past year- we know they have both the dishonesty and the technology to do it.