This is one of the most calm ways this issue has been expressed and it gives the necessary context to understand the issue. I feel like most (newer) fans, who often dismiss this "issue", don't know what the standard was earlier and what one could ask from Lego. This video points this out perfectly. Thanks for that
I have been building Star Wars sets since I was 8, or in 2015. I have no problem with the helmet holes, but I do think the waist capes should come back. I'm not super crazy about it though unlike the crazy perfectionists.
@@cutestcreeper569The helmet holes look weird, otherwise it’s alright. A change on the 2023 clone trooper helmets that many people are not discussing, are the ring shaped area between the visor and the Mohawk. Compare the 501st clone troopers from sets 75280 and 75345, then you might see the differences (besides the helmet holes)
@@cutestcreeper569the issue I have is the fact that they were lazy with the helmets. No other figure that had helmet holes have the actual hole and a molded hole. Just the new troopers, it's very disappointing
I cannot express enough how much I think someone that works at Lego needs to see this video. It’s so well reasoned and perfectly explains why fans are upset. This was great video!
After someone at Lego sees it, a suit will beat them into submission and explain why saving .0003 cents per clone will make the investors more money while they continue to raise prices even though inflation and the supply chain issues of the pandemic have stabilized
Might be easier for LEGO just to make a new helmet that works with the old visor. Wouldn't mind if they made a new one tho. It's not the best to represent Commander Cody's, especially.
@@PenPlays I must say, that Cody is the last Clone trooper since the holes, which people should complain about. I mean he looks the most accurate of all these commanders we are getting lmao.
...But...Look at this from a child perspective, Legos are toys, And the helmet holes let them be customized however, As for waistcapes? Well, Now they can sit with it without bending a cloth, And can be posed more, I'm a clone fan, And while I understand others want accuracy, I'm just glad we get clones again with new builds, Pieces, Sets, And the ability to customize them, Creativity is a wonderful thing, Especially in children! So these ones are pretty darn good! Not movie accurate, Sure, But to be fair...They gave us battlefront troopers, A large AT-RT, And kashyyk droids in a set that seems to take place on definitely not kashyyk!
@@skullofglory10 I'm not gonna front, LEGO is far from a kids toy now. Designers know this, consumers know this. Rationalizing some of the worst design choices in LEGO Star Wars history for the virtuous cause of "children" is just wrong. Things were fine for 15 years one way... but now look awful "because kids" when LEGO is less "for kids" than ever.
I think they should compromise by removing the fake visor holes, Extending the height of the well...Lines leading up to the holes, And leave the holes in, I can see why i came across as virtuous...But i'm speaking from experience as someone with 5 child siblings, 3 of whom are hardcore clone wars fans, That and, Well, To be fair...I personally dunno why the designs get so much hate, Like, I grew up with the early 2000s clones and whatnot, And then the later ones, And now these ones, I get it, They look inaccurate, And are missing details, But...To be fair, It isn't like they're going to make the troopers look like those customs, All and all...I dunno, Man, I feel as though the lego star wars community is freaking out for no reason over something as simple as a clone. I get it, Having something you have a connection with being messed up can get on your nerves, But i feel like people are being too harsh about this, I, Personally, Get it, Lego should put in effort, But i feel like what we have is already good enough, And, I mean, Even for collectors and MOC builders like myself...I dunno, I guess we're not that vocal majority on youtube, Talking about how we hate this or that. But, Eh, I guess i AM the guy ranting on a youtube comment section to a guy who's known to buy lots of lego. So, I s'pose i'm not really one to talk...But uh...Yep, MASSIVE rant over, Have a good day...Army building, Or collecting sets, Or whatever it is you do. I'm off to build a kamino mess hall for my clones! :D
This video nails 99% of the issues I have with the clones. One thing that wasn’t mentioned is the inaccuracy of the prints. Back in the day, Lego would have 2 separate prints for P1 and P2 armors (since, y’know, they’re different). Nowadays, Lego uses one print for both that combines elements of them for a strange mishmash of designs that doesn’t look *bad* per se, but isn’t as accurate as it should be.
@@Xyzimaactually it was p1 vs p2, but only on animated clones which was accurate to the clone wars. on realistic style clones (and the original 2002/2005 styles) the torso style was the same on both p1 and p2 which is actually accurate to the films. the new 2020 style would be better if it had separate styles for both types but the blend of realistic (which is the same on p1 and p2 anyway) and animated does kind’ve work as the more angled yet still slightly curved design is a mix of all styles which is effectively what the new 2020 style does. it mixes everything into a single design so 2 separate styles aren’t needed anymore and therefore makes things a bit easier for everyone (or at least i believe thats what they were going for)
That was the best and most professional video on lego stuff ive seen in a good while, good job! One last thing (that i dont think you mentioned?...) is the fact that lego costs alot. Some of these figures come in really expensive sets. This is a premium product with a premium price...
Thank you for the kind words. Price is definitely a huge factor, but there’s just so much to discuss on the matter that it deserves it’s own video. It’s also a given as a LEGO Star Wars shopper too. But man the quality you get for the price, at least on the minifigs is…somethin else
I do want to point out that the helmet with the holes IS a new mold. They didn't just mod the old one. If you look at the back of the helmets in particular there's a lot of different details. Thank you for pointing out the rangefinder position on the 501st pack!
The new clone figures to me aren’t as great as 2014 and even 2008 or 2005. I’m very passionate about the designs of the previous clone minifigures before the design changes. The holes is just a new thing that seems to set the new figures apart from previous years, unless the holes are just a fad but I’m sure they’re still gonna be around. People take criticism of some of the downgrades as complaining but our voices need to heard to make things right and mend the quality of future clone trooper minifigures.
I don't think there is much to save through criticism though. Prices of single figures and 20-50$ battlepacks keep climbing and with the print designs not matching older collections anyway, there is nothing making what Lego is currently producing worth it or attractive aside from being able to order the sets very easily (though at high prices compared to before). I rather go full custom decals on blank body parts. A real aficionado will want to use custom blasters either way so the one thing Lego has a monopoly on are helmets and only when you willfully ignore that there are countless manufacturers of reasonably priced alternatives. Call them customizers, chinese online shops or bootlegers, they all use the same methods in manufacturing and the product is 99% identical between each other and Lego.
I loved this video. I found myself agreeing with almost of what you had to say. I too like that we’re getting so many clones, but wish they could be they best they can be. I hope you make more videos like this one in the future!
Not sure if explaining complaints will be a constant thing, or whether it will always be about Star Wars, either, but I'll definitely put my best effort in whatever I do next. Thanks for the kind words.
I think another reason why this is such a controversial issue is because the fans of the Clone Wars show in 2008 have grown up and are looking for that same quality they got from sets in 2008-2013. LSW went from being a toy, to a hobby for many adult fans (like myself). Here we are 15 years later, and LEGO has been releasing clone wars sets again for a few years. They have a massive range in market, ranging from kids to adults. Things have changed a lot since 2008-2013 era of LSW though, and they have to meet the standards. Older fans that have grown up want quality, and sadly LEGO isn't producing it like they used to. Whether they like it or not, younger/new fans will never understand the nostalgia of being a LSW fan in 2007-2013, when life was fun and easy for us. These little details may not be a big deal to them if they were born before or in that era of the Clone Wars, but they are important and LEGO should fix them. If they did, I believe young/new fans wouldn't even notice anyways, but older fans would. Even speaking from a marketing perspective, fixing these helmets and kama issues would be a huge W for LEGO.
6:05 it’s neither. It’s simply marketing. Everyone can claim things about their products to sell said product Also about the printed kamas and helmet holes: these things don’t/didn’t happen because the designers don’t need to care. There wasn’t a new helmet mold because lego knew people would buy it anyways. Same with the kamas. They wanted to make the 332nd bp 27€ for godsake. Because people would buy them anyways. Don’t like it, don’t buy it. That’s the only way you can make change happen
I think you made the most reasonable way of describing these issues and criticisms, whereas a lot of other people have been going on a rampage about it. While I mostly disagree about the new helmet, as I actually think it works completely, the kama is something I can totally agree with. I would propose that we keep the front printed ones, but add a new cloth shape for the waist, like the one on Mime Joker in the UCS Batwing. The old kama going around the front corners cause an articulation issue in my opinion. I'm also thankful that you brought up how there will always be some level artistic license with minifigure proportions and lego's general artstyle, because that's what I find appealing about lego. A lot of the hyperdetailed custom figures just look ugly to me, as they cram so much detail on a form that's not meant for it. Personally, I think the new clones mostly are the best they have ever looked, a good blend of the clone wars and live action designs.
@@joshuamueller3206 the fabric one kinda worked but it did wear and tear on me and I have only had a figure with it for a couple years. It’s because it doesn’t just go down the sides and back, but also a bit in the front. That’s why I think the cloth piece from Mime Joker combined with the legs we have might work the most
My first complaint, I'm totally fine with the holes on the helmet as long as they're used. Either by macrobinoculars or a visor. However, when you add rangefinders and flashlights to the helmets it looks out of place because the attachments are way too high up. Not only that, the entire shape of the Phase 2 helmet is completely botched just by adding those 2 small holes. It's also affecting prints on the forehead of the helmets. The 212th and 332nd Clone prints look worse than the original ones Lego made a few years ago and custom markets has "fixed" the 212th helmet print from the ATTE. My second complaint with the new Clones is of course the kama. Kids aren't dumb. When we had a Darth Vader or Emperor Palpatine minifigure it would be common sense to remove their capes so they don't get damaged while in a tight spot or sitting down. Todays kids can do that with the Clones as well. You have to add the kama on before you put the torso and legs together so it would be painfully obvious that in order to make your Clones sit down, you'd remove the torso and legs, remove the kama and reattach the legs and torso, it's that simple. My third and final complaint is the accuracy of the Clones themselves. Commander Fox and Captain Vaughn in the upcoming summer sets look terrible. Fox is missing red on his chest and his kneeguards aren't even red like they are in the 2008 Clone Wars show. Not only that, Lego is making his visor gray when it's supposed to be black and the printed kama on the figure is also gray, again it should be black and red. As for Captain Vaughn from the seventh season of the 2008 Clone Wars show, he is basically Commander Cody but blue. Lego has kind of replicated him by giving him the same torso as the Phase 2 Commander Cody released in 2022, however the prints are very, very wrong. Vaughn's abdomen and the 2 pouches on his belt are supposed to be gray but in the upcoming battlepack they are both white. Another problem with the Captain Vaughn figure is that his helmet isn't a regular 332nd helmet with a visor. If you watched the episode closely, he actually has dark red markings below the "eyes" and "mouth" of the visor, neither of those details are present on his 2023 minifigure. It sucks because I've been collecting Lego Star Wars for over a decade and it hurts me see how bad Lego is, especially when it comes to details and small errors, that when fixed, take the figure from a 20 to a 90 easily. I just really hope that Lego gets their head in the game and makes better Clone figures in the future.
Fox's visor is dark gray, the lighting of some scenes just makes it look black, in scenes such as him arresting ahsoka you can see it's lighter than his kama, both phase 2 hasbro figures of him have the gray visor, in the vader comics it seems to be gray, tho the comics don't always get things right, and the magazine Star Wars Insider #130, released in 2011 before the release of Season 4 and the onscreen debut of phase 2 Fox, includes a photo of a render of his phase 2 armor clearly shows it's gray, Fox's phase 2 visor is gray and always has been, but the kama, lower chest and kneepads are indeed wrong.
@@TylertheCC1010fan It hasn't always been grey, phase 1 fox does have a red visor according to several pictures from tcw on wookiepedia, although I cannot attest to the lego fox as I haven't seen pictures of him yet.
@@julienvalley28 yea phase 1 fox is dark red, but phase 2 fox has always been gray, phase 1 lego fox was gray purely because at the time the clone trooper accessories only came in black or gray, with black accessories only coming in like 2, maybe 3 sets, dark red visors do exist but weren't created at the time, which is why phase 1 Cody also had a gray visor, they also had gray kamas which at the time where hard plastic and where packaged with the the visors and rangefinders, along with floodlights, clone specific pistols which lack the scope, and hard plastic animated style phase 1 pauldrons, all of which where the same color, and where mostly gray.
This was the best video I've yet seen on LEGO's slipping quality control. More people need to be discussing this important topic and holding LEGO accountable. As you mentioned, LEGO does listen to the fan community (such as they started putting some transparent clear windshield pieces in separate bags to prevent them from getting scratched up). The other major issue that comes to mind is the noticeable differences in coloration of dark red pieces. Some dark red pieces are clearly a different shade than other dark red pieces, when they should be consistent.
As I said in the video, it's not about the holes existing, it's where they're placed. The parts they used for customizing them is not meant for them, and is more a compromise than a solution. Which sucks, cuz they could be even better!
This is a very good way of explaining the current state of clone troopers and the criticism most fans have against how they look now. The waist cape thing honestly bothers me more than helmet holes since it feels like something is missing when looking at figure from behind or sideways.
The worst part is that they couldn’t be bothered to update the printing machine to take into account the new helmet shape which means all the helmet prints are distorted and look horrible
Since the helmet holes are where they are because of Cody’s visor, I think if visor helmets just got there own dual molded piece and normal helmets got holes in the correct spot that may fix that issue. I don’t care too much but I know to others it’s a big deal.
remove the unsightly shadow printing on the cheeks, sort the unsightly helmet holes out and fix the poorly printed markings. Give us fabric kamas again. If clones need dual moulded legs, give them dual moulded legs.
@@PenPlays it’s just strange. sure the shadows often appear ‘naturally’ in the shows but it’s because of the physical topography of the helmet which casts the same on the minifigure helmet because it’s got the same shape. it would be like painting shadows under bits of a dolls house even though the shadows would cast the same under a room light as the real one would with the sun
Should we expect a response from lego? I think at this point that’s the question we should be asking, I remember when solid brick studios got an interview with the lead designers and I think the lead concept artist and he asked a few similar questions about quality of product and they were like fishes outta water, they acted like they’ve never heard of these problems.
The only time LEGO will ever respond to something with a post, would be if something controversial from all aspects would occur. For something like this, asking that from them would be a fool's errand. The only response we'll get is if they change the designs in time. Takes about two years for them to process feedback, and since this only really started to get serious in Summer of 2022, we likely won't see any change until Summer of 2024.
Great job summarizing this issue! Hopefully Lego will improve on the product. I am happy that we are getting so many variations of clones, but I think everyone would be even more happy if these issues were taken care of. A few minor fixes and things would be just about perfect! As much as it may not be enjoyable, Lego should receive the feedback from the community and act on it, whether they like the delivery of the feedback or not. It can definitely be harsh at times, but I think their lack of communication around this makes things worse. Any brand that really listens to fans and addresses their frustration/betters their products ends up doing much more business in the long run.
LEGO being as private as they are makes it tough for them to respond, but I'm not sure them being owned by the public would either. They do act on things, but it takes them way too long. Usually two years, and the helmet holes, for example, were not an issue until Summer of 2022. That means we'd have to wait until Summer of 2024 for any results, if there even will be any.
That's what I'm saying they ahve the hol that they made for the accessories. However in the picture it looks like they are using what they should have used?
My take on this issue is that LEGO is a high-end quality toy manufacturer. The prices have always been high, and they always will be. With recent price hikes which have left fans feeling like LEGO is more expensive than ever, (although accounting for inflation, that is only marginally true) with LEGO prioritizing budget on other factors as well as minifigures, (more new parts, sustainable packaging, their Adults Welcome Icons line…) it makes people feel like the quality is going away, whereas, LEGO is using their budget on advancing areas many fans would not have prioritized. These criticisms are valid, because as customers who pay a high price for these toys/collectables, it is understandable to be alarmed when certain aspects aren’t up to our expectations, however, despite that, I do not partake in vilifying The LEGO Group, as understanding the nuance of the situation, (such as that hardcore AFOLs and TFOLs aren’t LEGO’s key focus) is of far more interest to me in order to better find the flaws with which LEGO is more realistically suited to mend.
They are pricing their key focus out of the market right now, parents aren't going to buy kids the Lego sets they want if it's price hiked by as much as 30% with no additional value and don't even get me started on how expensive they make 4+ sets.
I think the biggest issue really comes down to that these are premium products at a premium price. Lego is far and away, one of the popular most toy ever and the top dog in their field, no question. It feels like they kind of just realized that people will just buy it regardless. (Self admittedly i am a part of the problem.)
Yes, bc in the same time we are pissed about those matters, and happy that they started making more clones again, after years of neglect and we are buying them like crazy 😂 we cant vote with out wallets for the changes, without voting againts making more clones, so frustration grows
I really like the way you addressed this issue so many fans are whining and slating Lego and it comes across as so entitled, smug and immature however you have calmly explained the issue and have changed my mind on the issue.
I appreciate your open-minded view on these different controversial LEGO topics. It’s very educational and has served as inspiration for some of my videos. Thanks for your insight!
with the orientation of the nobs where the accessories should be, it does fall short but looking at captain rex, the position lines up with where it should be on the helmet. essentially the latest phase 2 mold without the holes was still bad because of the positioning. but since there were no holes before it didn't really matter. I understand recycling/re-using things to a point but also as said in the video, you'd think they'd have the budget to make the new mold with holes in the right place and the positioning proper. good video honestly. I'm glad someone takes the time to explain such things for people on the outside. as a massive lego star wars collector I appreciate this
Great video👍🏻 im from Denmark and have never seen the danish sign for “Only the best is good enough” - but a real translation would be “The-best-is-not-too-good” Hope this helps😅
Yep, and thank you! The translation to English is loose so that the same weight is given to the perspective LEGO has. That ending of "...not to good" can be read different ways, several of which aren't the best, hence why it's translated so different.
Thank you so much for the kind words. My hope was to make it known just why these issues are going on, but in a way that’s easy to understand as well as easy to share
First I would like to thank you for taking a calm look at this issue compared to some of the other Lego youtubers. Second, in regards to how i feel, i am a late arrival to being a lego collector. I've only been collecting for about 5 years. That means the current crop of Clone sets are the only ones i have been able to buy, I don't have the means to buy the retired sets. I like the clone sets, i'm not worried about cosmetic issues as i am not a huge clone wars fan. I am as old as Star Wars (you do the math), i did not watch the clone wars show. I did try it out, but it didn't hold my interest. Lego is doing what companies do, separate you from your money, while spending as little as possible. All of the complaining is free PR and attention for them, they are not beholden to us, and they probably think of fans who complain are a "vocal minority", so they will continue on and see no issues here to be concerned about.
Me personally I don’t want a new helmet mold, cuz then all the armies of p2 troopers have built would look weird if diffident helmets would suddenly appear so yeah and I think the helmet holes are not THAT bad, I mean it ads more customisation opportunities which I like
This was a very well written and delivered video but I still do not get the rabid dislike for helmet holes, or even more than minor dislike personally. I think the P2 helmets look the best they have ever looked and I am just super happy that all helmets support customization considering we get 4 visors and 4 range finders in every set that even has 1 clone with them. I can barely see the issue with my eyes and its only really evident in macro pictures of the helmets. Even in a world that had 2 or 3 separate helmets with 1 hole for a range finder right on the round bit where the range finder is supposed to go and helmets with dual holes for visors, possibly a helmet with no holes we would still have the problem of not having the right helmet when you wanted it. In this world we would have to also people complaining about how much a clone trooper costs because to have 3 different helmets when you could realistically have just 1 means a ~3x price increase of each helmet because each of them would probably require a different mold. Certainly 2 different molds, 1 for plain and range finders, and 1 for visors. I agree completely with the rest of the video especially about kamas, I really wish they'd do more sets with cloth ones, possibly redesigned if necessary.
We should absolutely continue to have helmet holes. The hope is that they can go in a different, less intrusive spot on the piece. Customization is very important for the clones, after all
While the clone trooper design these days has some cons to it, I’m hoping this is a learning/experimental phase for LEGO, seeing the feedback in regards to things like the helmets, waistcapes and helmet holes, what is working and not working. Some decisions LEGO makes like how they executed Captain Vaughn I have questions about. I’m not a LEGO designer and in their shoes, so I don’t know what their limitations are but I wonder why they skip out on some details or where they pull their source material from sometimes.
Succinct, to the point, and a simple listing of the issues that present themselves over time. Great video, especially for non-Lego or non-Star Wars customers/fans. Another issue is that the new holes only look fine with the visor pieces as they help cover the side areas, but the rangefinder attachments are very poor. They require force to push into the holes and they cannot be moved without falling out. Even the Phase 1 troopers of recent months didn't have that problem. I feel like the issue with the kamas/waist-capes can be easily handled if Lego provided a pick-a-brick style purchase option for either online or in-store shopping. Just buy a number of cloth pieces (be it capes, waist capes, etc.) for a set price and BAM, fans and older collectors could just buy the missing pieces, Lego can make more money, and any concern dealing with younger kids is mitigated.
Just thinking out loud, but could one solution to helmet holes be that lego included small little white plastic plugs that simply pop into the holes to cover them up? Pull em out of you need to put a range finder on for exampme.
It's a good idea on paper. The super small pieces needed to do that would be easy to lose. They'd still look like strange dimples on their helmets too, which is also part of the full issue as well.
Kamas and printing are a problem, but I wholeheartedly support the holes themselves. Lego is a building toy. Customization should be priority. As a matter of fact, that's also the same reason physical kamas are so important
Honestly considering the clone wars drought we were in for such a long time with the sequel trilogy sets I'm happy to finally get some decent customization options with the new stuff
This is the best video explaining the situation. Hopefully those people who shill for Lego and constantly defend these obvious bad design/marketing decisions can get it through there thick skull that the fans “complaining” have valid reason too and only want the figures to be the best they can be like we once had.
I agree with the issue on the helmet holes. They should have placed it where the circle part is and should have designed the new microbinoculars around that. The 'OG' commander visor is too big anyway so they should have used the opportunity to make a completely new mold to also accommodate the position. Sadly it's kind of too late as they've released so many now with it, it would hurt if they completely remade the helmet. But might be best if they did a minor change with the hole position and new attachments to fit it.. Making kamas printed is definitely a downgrade by miles... I think it's a cost cutting thing which doesn't make sense when they're making peak profits. So it's got to be 'greed' which goes against their motto with quality.
I think the helmet holes are fine, they allow more customizability! We only had that for 3rd party phase 2 troopers, and to have it on standard lego clones is a great thing
That’s precisely what people want. Like I said in the video. People just assume fans want them gone. Makes no sense to do that. People just want them moved
@@PenPlays Yeah I agree. They could be improved. Lets also consider that the 2014 phase 2 clones were peak design. What I fail to understand is how people are so upset about such a little detail on a plastic toy. If you want accuracy collect action figures, if you want better clones you can also buy them from 3rd party companies that jave always made better custom minifigures than lego anyway
The big issue there is that one single action figure, or one single custom helmet, can cost as much as an entire LEGO set. It’s why the action figure market is as fragile as it is at the moment, as the quality isn’t delivering for the price. Customs are also very hit or miss, so most people want nothing to do with them, and would much prefer the official source get it right the first time.
Most of the people who make a sound on the helmet hole are those resellers who intend to sell old minifigures. I think a Battlepack like this is more worth the money than buying old minifigures from a reseller.
I think another issue is that with the more expensive sets that are targeted to adults there is a quality drop, such as the upcoming Rex in the 650 dollar venator being completely inaccurate. There is the argument that Lego is for kids, but sets such as these are targeted to adults and they do cost a lot of money. So the inaccuracy of the clones suck even more especially since it is a legacy character such as Rex in a ver anticipated set such as the venator.
It arguably is the most high-quality Rex we've gotten. With everything going on tho, it still could be so much better, and that's why it doesn't feel as good. Especially for a set that expensive.
The problem for me is LEGO set a standard of quality for Clone Troopers in the 2010s. The last cloth kama included with a Clone was in 2020 with the 212th Airborne Trooper; afterwards, that standard LEGO set for themselves dropped unceremoniously when the cloth was stripped away and the kama printed on. If I wasn't already familiar with Star Wars, I wouldn't be able to tell what the two vertical lines printed on the Clones' legs were supposed to be. I asked a friend recently if he could tell, and then showed him a Clone with the cloth kama for comparison, and he was shocked at the difference!
Dude, I agree with almost all of these takes. I also really appreciate explaining everything in the video, which I did not quite understand previously.
Personally the only major problem I have is the advertising for the minifig helmets. The T-visor is different on the box than whata in the box. I'm not sure why they make the visor wider in the ads qhen they aren't very big in production.
I’ve asked people on the Lego Star Wars subreddit to please explain what they’re angry about and have just gotten snarky comments and downvotes. Thanks for actually explaining it.
I haven’t bought any clone trooper set in a while, and the decals for me are why, the 2013-2018 Decals with the AOTC/ROTS accurate printing was so good and was honestly the perfect design that shouldn’t have been changed and they made the Clone Wars animated designed mini-figs alongside a separate entity, so when they showed the 501st set with the new decals back in 2020, I was disappointed, they made this weird amalgamation of the Clone Wars animated design with live action, and imo it just doesn’t work, its weird that the clones ended up this way, because even with the new Stormtrooper helmet mold, they still did their best to make them movie accurate and didn’t make this weird Rebels Animated live-action hybrid trooper, The printed waist capes are bad, they cut corners when they didn’t need too, and what I also don’t like is lego has been doing this particular process for awhile where they make a specific number of legions for the clones and then they move on to a new artstyle, so as an example my disappointment for the 501st minifigs in 2020 is partly because we didn’t see the 501st in the 2013-2014 Decals (not counting the clone wars minifig that came with the AT-RT and Z-95 sets) I wish lego would just make a list of all the movie legions and just make sets about everyone of them before moving on to a new minifig artstyle etc.
Not having been able to enjoy 501st clones in 2002-2007 or 2013-2019 is my biggest gripe in all of this. I wanted to play with those in 2005, not with Shocktroopers, 327th or these stupid Swamp clones that are actually 442nd Siege Battallion and only exist in online promo images. So many sets with so many clone variants in all these years but much of what we got is entirely pointless, not the major legions that actually played roles in stories. Who is actually happy about Bomb Squad and Geonosis Camo Phase 2 & Airbornes? They could have made Geonosis camo ARFs or at the very least Phase 1s to mimic the com troopers.
I didn't mind printed kamas when it started on snowtroopers. But they wear white kamas on white trousers and armour. However, it most assuredly does look terrible with drastically different colours. To be honest, I'm still not entirely over the move from the old print - I'm a big fan of the old torso and helmet, though the new face and legs are better.
Oh heck yes - more droids!! We can't send it to LEGO directly, but if the video is shared around, and the RUclips algorithm sees that, maybe it'll end up in their feeds one day?
I like how you presented the issues in video. I would just move up the little things on the sides. while it would be less accurate it would at least look better
The missing quality in stark contrast to their mission statement has often confused me, but never as much as in the last two years. I’m glad that a few different factors have come into play to reduce the amount of lego that i buy, which is a boon to my wallet
Small theory, but what if the rangefinder on the officer in the battle pack was a prototype that had 2 holes. One for a visor and one for a rangefinder
Honestly I would imagine the people at Lego are exhausted with adult Lego clone fans complaining as there decisions make a lot of sense from a toy perspective and cost perspective. Adults simply aren’t the target audience and although we sometimes get our way it’s important to remember who these toys are truly made for
Are you saying kids shouldn't have the best they can get? I'm not asking to get rid of the holes and removing playability. Watching the video will help make that clear.
@@PenPlays i understand your point but I think the printed capes make sense as when I was younger I would often accidentally rip them or lose them and as for side printing Lego is already pretty expensive and that would raise the price
Lego is the biggest toy company on the planet and their sets are extremely fucking expensive (even more nowadays) - and because of this there is absolutely nothing wrong with demanding premium quality for the premium^2 price they are demanding.
My main issue is that they don’t really make plain standard clones anymore. An army doesn’t look as impressive when every uniform looks different. In the rare occasion I decide to buy minifigures or sets now, I would much rather just purchase older minifigures/sets off eBay rather than buying a new set. Clone wars era sets (when the tv show was airing) and earlier are the only ones that interest me now as I feel the designs just look better (though that may just be nostalgia speaking)
I think the true reason for why we dont get waste capes with star wars is the budgeting for lego sets , with the new Lego dreamzzs example we have an unlicensed theme that has at least 10 if not 20% more budget do to not having to pay disney or any other company license fees and well soft good on figs even outside of Lego are always a premium so thats what gets scrapped first.
They don’t cost a few dollars. That’s the problem. The blue clones in the video come in sets that should be $15 tops. They’re $20 at most retailers. Some have them for more. Commander Cody, comes in a set that is $140. Also, yes, it is a toy, but for kids and adults alike, shouldn’t they be the best they can be?
When it comes to the printed kamas vs the fabric ones, to me that reeks of there being no official style guide for designers to reference when designing these sets and minifigures. That, or designers are regularly rotated off certain IPs, leading to different design approaches from different creative teams (meaning that any unofficial style guides aren't carried over from project to project).
That gives a lot of food for thought. They definitely cycle out designers, but there are also leads that have been there for a while that don't seem to enforce things. From what I understand, this is especially applicable to print/sticker artists.
Potentially multiple reasons. Could be to better allow the accessories to fit in, or so that, in the event one is ingested, holes in the part can still allow air to pass thru.
Honestly I don’t think the helmet holes are an issue, they’re fine tbh and trade aesthetics over functionality My main issue is the quality of printing and lack of waist capes which have no excuse to be absent or lacking
My issue with the clones is that Lego obsesses over making remake after remake, different moulds and prints of clones - but the droids have been using the same peices since the start - even going back on using printed peices on some of the droids like the Commander Droid and Security Droid - not even mentioning the sheer ridicuolsness of the Magna Guard being made in 2 sets and selling for around £30 over here. Plus, the quality of the legs on B2s and Commando droids is abysmal, constantly snapping and requiring replacements to be bought. Oh! And also the X-20 Tactical Droid thats only been sold in 1 set, which now sells for something like £60 on the low end. Idk, seems like some attention could be diverted from all this clone stuff - because like you said its upsetting when Lego messes up things we care about
i hope we get some all white cones soon! not complaining as these new clones are sick but it’s been a while! edit- AND we need some green 442nd clones! but i am glad the holes in the helmets don’t bother me! seems like a big deal to a lot of people
We could all live with this, truly, but with LEGO’s efforts for quality, & previously accomplishing that with older troopers, we might as well get to enjoy that again.
This is one of the most calm ways this issue has been expressed and it gives the necessary context to understand the issue. I feel like most (newer) fans, who often dismiss this "issue", don't know what the standard was earlier and what one could ask from Lego. This video points this out perfectly. Thanks for that
You're very welcome. If you find people who fit the description you mentioned, send them here. I'll be glad to keep people informed.
I have been building Star Wars sets since I was 8, or in 2015. I have no problem with the helmet holes, but I do think the waist capes should come back. I'm not super crazy about it though unlike the crazy perfectionists.
@@cutestcreeper569The helmet holes look weird, otherwise it’s alright. A change on the 2023 clone trooper helmets that many people are not discussing, are the ring shaped area between the visor and the Mohawk. Compare the 501st clone troopers from sets 75280 and 75345, then you might see the differences (besides the helmet holes)
@@cutestcreeper569the issue I have is the fact that they were lazy with the helmets. No other figure that had helmet holes have the actual hole and a molded hole. Just the new troopers, it's very disappointing
I cannot express enough how much I think someone that works at Lego needs to see this video. It’s so well reasoned and perfectly explains why fans are upset. This was great video!
Thank you so much! Sharing it with people will help RUclips recommend it, and, who knows, maybe someone at LEGO will see it!
After someone at Lego sees it, a suit will beat them into submission and explain why saving .0003 cents per clone will make the investors more money while they continue to raise prices even though inflation and the supply chain issues of the pandemic have stabilized
They wont listen
Lego doesnt care for anything that is not their money to stuff into their pockets instead of quality products
Lego needs to do a minifiguers run, adding cool unique clones that may never get to be in sets like Fives, Echo etc.
i think the reason they havent is that hasbro copyrighted star wars action figures (which minifigures technically are)
Search for WM Blocks 501st clones. They are better than original legos and cheaper
I think there is an echo minifigure. I feel like I’ve seen it before
Fives is in one now
i think the best course of action would be to put the holes where they’re supposed to be and reinvent the visor. would’ve been so much better
Might be easier for LEGO just to make a new helmet that works with the old visor. Wouldn't mind if they made a new one tho. It's not the best to represent Commander Cody's, especially.
@@PenPlays I must say, that Cody is the last Clone trooper since the holes, which people should complain about. I mean he looks the most accurate of all these commanders we are getting lmao.
@@baartysyeah to Legos credit the Cody Minifig was well executed. The new Fox looks awful though lmao
💯
They should’ve never changed the previous helmet design
I still can't believe they've fallen this far :/ great video.
At least there's still room for change.
Thanks for the kind words.
Hi mandr
...But...Look at this from a child perspective, Legos are toys, And the helmet holes let them be customized however, As for waistcapes? Well, Now they can sit with it without bending a cloth, And can be posed more, I'm a clone fan, And while I understand others want accuracy, I'm just glad we get clones again with new builds, Pieces, Sets, And the ability to customize them, Creativity is a wonderful thing, Especially in children! So these ones are pretty darn good! Not movie accurate, Sure, But to be fair...They gave us battlefront troopers, A large AT-RT, And kashyyk droids in a set that seems to take place on definitely not kashyyk!
@@skullofglory10 I'm not gonna front, LEGO is far from a kids toy now. Designers know this, consumers know this. Rationalizing some of the worst design choices in LEGO Star Wars history for the virtuous cause of "children" is just wrong. Things were fine for 15 years one way... but now look awful "because kids" when LEGO is less "for kids" than ever.
I think they should compromise by removing the fake visor holes, Extending the height of the well...Lines leading up to the holes, And leave the holes in, I can see why i came across as virtuous...But i'm speaking from experience as someone with 5 child siblings, 3 of whom are hardcore clone wars fans, That and, Well, To be fair...I personally dunno why the designs get so much hate, Like, I grew up with the early 2000s clones and whatnot, And then the later ones, And now these ones, I get it, They look inaccurate, And are missing details, But...To be fair, It isn't like they're going to make the troopers look like those customs, All and all...I dunno, Man, I feel as though the lego star wars community is freaking out for no reason over something as simple as a clone. I get it, Having something you have a connection with being messed up can get on your nerves, But i feel like people are being too harsh about this, I, Personally, Get it, Lego should put in effort, But i feel like what we have is already good enough, And, I mean, Even for collectors and MOC builders like myself...I dunno, I guess we're not that vocal majority on youtube, Talking about how we hate this or that. But, Eh, I guess i AM the guy ranting on a youtube comment section to a guy who's known to buy lots of lego. So, I s'pose i'm not really one to talk...But uh...Yep, MASSIVE rant over, Have a good day...Army building, Or collecting sets, Or whatever it is you do. I'm off to build a kamino mess hall for my clones! :D
As a lego star wars fan I can say you covered everything and explained it verry wel. Bravo!
Thank you very much!
This video nails 99% of the issues I have with the clones. One thing that wasn’t mentioned is the inaccuracy of the prints. Back in the day, Lego would have 2 separate prints for P1 and P2 armors (since, y’know, they’re different). Nowadays, Lego uses one print for both that combines elements of them for a strange mishmash of designs that doesn’t look *bad* per se, but isn’t as accurate as it should be.
Nah, it was Animated vs Realistic style not p1 vs p2
@@Xyzima
Yeah you’re correct this guy clearly doesn’t know what he’s talking about
@@Xyzimaactually it was p1 vs p2, but only on animated clones which was accurate to the clone wars. on realistic style clones (and the original 2002/2005 styles) the torso style was the same on both p1 and p2 which is actually accurate to the films. the new 2020 style would be better if it had separate styles for both types but the blend of realistic (which is the same on p1 and p2 anyway) and animated does kind’ve work as the more angled yet still slightly curved design is a mix of all styles which is effectively what the new 2020 style does. it mixes everything into a single design so 2 separate styles aren’t needed anymore and therefore makes things a bit easier for everyone (or at least i believe thats what they were going for)
@@doctorcreeps2169 eh, the p1 to p2 animated style difference is very tiny
@@Xyzima still a difference nonetheless
That was the best and most professional video on lego stuff ive seen in a good while, good job! One last thing (that i dont think you mentioned?...) is the fact that lego costs alot. Some of these figures come in really expensive sets. This is a premium product with a premium price...
Thank you for the kind words. Price is definitely a huge factor, but there’s just so much to discuss on the matter that it deserves it’s own video. It’s also a given as a LEGO Star Wars shopper too. But man the quality you get for the price, at least on the minifigs is…somethin else
I do want to point out that the helmet with the holes IS a new mold. They didn't just mod the old one. If you look at the back of the helmets in particular there's a lot of different details.
Thank you for pointing out the rangefinder position on the 501st pack!
The new clone figures to me aren’t as great as 2014 and even 2008 or 2005. I’m very passionate about the designs of the previous clone minifigures before the design changes. The holes is just a new thing that seems to set the new figures apart from previous years, unless the holes are just a fad but I’m sure they’re still gonna be around. People take criticism of some of the downgrades as complaining but our voices need to heard to make things right and mend the quality of future clone trooper minifigures.
I don't think there is much to save through criticism though. Prices of single figures and 20-50$ battlepacks keep climbing and with the print designs not matching older collections anyway, there is nothing making what Lego is currently producing worth it or attractive aside from being able to order the sets very easily (though at high prices compared to before). I rather go full custom decals on blank body parts. A real aficionado will want to use custom blasters either way so the one thing Lego has a monopoly on are helmets and only when you willfully ignore that there are countless manufacturers of reasonably priced alternatives. Call them customizers, chinese online shops or bootlegers, they all use the same methods in manufacturing and the product is 99% identical between each other and Lego.
well dont buy them
"We're are just toy figures, sir. We're meant to be badly made"
"Not to me"
I loved this video. I found myself agreeing with almost of what you had to say. I too like that we’re getting so many clones, but wish they could be they best they can be. I hope you make more videos like this one in the future!
Not sure if explaining complaints will be a constant thing, or whether it will always be about Star Wars, either, but I'll definitely put my best effort in whatever I do next. Thanks for the kind words.
I honestly actually want LESS clones. I like the clone figures, but stormtroopers aren't getting the love they deserve because of that.
I think another reason why this is such a controversial issue is because the fans of the Clone Wars show in 2008 have grown up and are looking for that same quality they got from sets in 2008-2013. LSW went from being a toy, to a hobby for many adult fans (like myself).
Here we are 15 years later, and LEGO has been releasing clone wars sets again for a few years. They have a massive range in market, ranging from kids to adults. Things have changed a lot since 2008-2013 era of LSW though, and they have to meet the standards. Older fans that have grown up want quality, and sadly LEGO isn't producing it like they used to.
Whether they like it or not, younger/new fans will never understand the nostalgia of being a LSW fan in 2007-2013, when life was fun and easy for us. These little details may not be a big deal to them if they were born before or in that era of the Clone Wars, but they are important and LEGO should fix them. If they did, I believe young/new fans wouldn't even notice anyways, but older fans would. Even speaking from a marketing perspective, fixing these helmets and kama issues would be a huge W for LEGO.
6:05 it’s neither. It’s simply marketing. Everyone can claim things about their products to sell said product
Also about the printed kamas and helmet holes: these things don’t/didn’t happen because the designers don’t need to care. There wasn’t a new helmet mold because lego knew people would buy it anyways. Same with the kamas. They wanted to make the 332nd bp 27€ for godsake. Because people would buy them anyways.
Don’t like it, don’t buy it. That’s the only way you can make change happen
I think you made the most reasonable way of describing these issues and criticisms, whereas a lot of other people have been going on a rampage about it. While I mostly disagree about the new helmet, as I actually think it works completely, the kama is something I can totally agree with. I would propose that we keep the front printed ones, but add a new cloth shape for the waist, like the one on Mime Joker in the UCS Batwing. The old kama going around the front corners cause an articulation issue in my opinion.
I'm also thankful that you brought up how there will always be some level artistic license with minifigure proportions and lego's general artstyle, because that's what I find appealing about lego. A lot of the hyperdetailed custom figures just look ugly to me, as they cram so much detail on a form that's not meant for it. Personally, I think the new clones mostly are the best they have ever looked, a good blend of the clone wars and live action designs.
Definitely agree with the purist/custom comparison. I'd hate for the Clones to be too detailed, but I love when they have a reasonable amount
What about the fabric kama? The legs moved well there in my experience. The plastic one forced them to penguin walk.
@@joshuamueller3206 the fabric one kinda worked but it did wear and tear on me and I have only had a figure with it for a couple years. It’s because it doesn’t just go down the sides and back, but also a bit in the front. That’s why I think the cloth piece from Mime Joker combined with the legs we have might work the most
My first complaint, I'm totally fine with the holes on the helmet as long as they're used. Either by macrobinoculars or a visor. However, when you add rangefinders and flashlights to the helmets it looks out of place because the attachments are way too high up. Not only that, the entire shape of the Phase 2 helmet is completely botched just by adding those 2 small holes. It's also affecting prints on the forehead of the helmets. The 212th and 332nd Clone prints look worse than the original ones Lego made a few years ago and custom markets has "fixed" the 212th helmet print from the ATTE. My second complaint with the new Clones is of course the kama. Kids aren't dumb. When we had a Darth Vader or Emperor Palpatine minifigure it would be common sense to remove their capes so they don't get damaged while in a tight spot or sitting down. Todays kids can do that with the Clones as well. You have to add the kama on before you put the torso and legs together so it would be painfully obvious that in order to make your Clones sit down, you'd remove the torso and legs, remove the kama and reattach the legs and torso, it's that simple. My third and final complaint is the accuracy of the Clones themselves. Commander Fox and Captain Vaughn in the upcoming summer sets look terrible. Fox is missing red on his chest and his kneeguards aren't even red like they are in the 2008 Clone Wars show. Not only that, Lego is making his visor gray when it's supposed to be black and the printed kama on the figure is also gray, again it should be black and red. As for Captain Vaughn from the seventh season of the 2008 Clone Wars show, he is basically Commander Cody but blue. Lego has kind of replicated him by giving him the same torso as the Phase 2 Commander Cody released in 2022, however the prints are very, very wrong. Vaughn's abdomen and the 2 pouches on his belt are supposed to be gray but in the upcoming battlepack they are both white. Another problem with the Captain Vaughn figure is that his helmet isn't a regular 332nd helmet with a visor. If you watched the episode closely, he actually has dark red markings below the "eyes" and "mouth" of the visor, neither of those details are present on his 2023 minifigure. It sucks because I've been collecting Lego Star Wars for over a decade and it hurts me see how bad Lego is, especially when it comes to details and small errors, that when fixed, take the figure from a 20 to a 90 easily. I just really hope that Lego gets their head in the game and makes better Clone figures in the future.
not reading all that
Fox's visor is dark gray, the lighting of some scenes just makes it look black, in scenes such as him arresting ahsoka you can see it's lighter than his kama, both phase 2 hasbro figures of him have the gray visor, in the vader comics it seems to be gray, tho the comics don't always get things right, and the magazine Star Wars Insider #130, released in 2011 before the release of Season 4 and the onscreen debut of phase 2 Fox, includes a photo of a render of his phase 2 armor clearly shows it's gray, Fox's phase 2 visor is gray and always has been, but the kama, lower chest and kneepads are indeed wrong.
@@TylertheCC1010fan It hasn't always been grey, phase 1 fox does have a red visor according to several pictures from tcw on wookiepedia, although I cannot attest to the lego fox as I haven't seen pictures of him yet.
@@julienvalley28 yea phase 1 fox is dark red, but phase 2 fox has always been gray, phase 1 lego fox was gray purely because at the time the clone trooper accessories only came in black or gray, with black accessories only coming in like 2, maybe 3 sets, dark red visors do exist but weren't created at the time, which is why phase 1 Cody also had a gray visor, they also had gray kamas which at the time where hard plastic and where packaged with the the visors and rangefinders, along with floodlights, clone specific pistols which lack the scope, and hard plastic animated style phase 1 pauldrons, all of which where the same color, and where mostly gray.
This was the best video I've yet seen on LEGO's slipping quality control. More people need to be discussing this important topic and holding LEGO accountable. As you mentioned, LEGO does listen to the fan community (such as they started putting some transparent clear windshield pieces in separate bags to prevent them from getting scratched up). The other major issue that comes to mind is the noticeable differences in coloration of dark red pieces. Some dark red pieces are clearly a different shade than other dark red pieces, when they should be consistent.
just got back into collecting lego clones again, honestly im fine with them having holes.
As I said in the video, it's not about the holes existing, it's where they're placed. The parts they used for customizing them is not meant for them, and is more a compromise than a solution.
Which sucks, cuz they could be even better!
Good video, and very calmly explained without lots of shouting, clickbait and calling Lego "lazy"
I appreciate you watching. Thanks for the kind words
This is a very good way of explaining the current state of clone troopers and the criticism most fans have against how they look now. The waist cape thing honestly bothers me more than helmet holes since it feels like something is missing when looking at figure from behind or sideways.
They won’t fix the clone issues because they’re going to sell regardless. They can produce the bare minimum and people will buy it regardless
The worst part is that they couldn’t be bothered to update the printing machine to take into account the new helmet shape which means all the helmet prints are distorted and look horrible
Since the helmet holes are where they are because of Cody’s visor, I think if visor helmets just got there own dual molded piece and normal helmets got holes in the correct spot that may fix that issue. I don’t care too much but I know to others it’s a big deal.
remove the unsightly shadow printing on the cheeks, sort the unsightly helmet holes out and fix the poorly printed markings.
Give us fabric kamas again. If clones need dual moulded legs, give them dual moulded legs.
I’ve heard a lot of negativity about the shadows. It’s interesting to hear
@@PenPlays it’s just strange. sure the shadows often appear ‘naturally’ in the shows but it’s because of the physical topography of the helmet which casts the same on the minifigure helmet because it’s got the same shape. it would be like painting shadows under bits of a dolls house even though the shadows would cast the same under a room light as the real one would with the sun
Should we expect a response from lego? I think at this point that’s the question we should be asking, I remember when solid brick studios got an interview with the lead designers and I think the lead concept artist and he asked a few similar questions about quality of product and they were like fishes outta water, they acted like they’ve never heard of these problems.
The only time LEGO will ever respond to something with a post, would be if something controversial from all aspects would occur. For something like this, asking that from them would be a fool's errand. The only response we'll get is if they change the designs in time. Takes about two years for them to process feedback, and since this only really started to get serious in Summer of 2022, we likely won't see any change until Summer of 2024.
@PenPlays
Which seems silly since the easiest change is to simply remove the warts under the helmet holes.
Great job summarizing this issue! Hopefully Lego will improve on the product. I am happy that we are getting so many variations of clones, but I think everyone would be even more happy if these issues were taken care of. A few minor fixes and things would be just about perfect!
As much as it may not be enjoyable, Lego should receive the feedback from the community and act on it, whether they like the delivery of the feedback or not. It can definitely be harsh at times, but I think their lack of communication around this makes things worse. Any brand that really listens to fans and addresses their frustration/betters their products ends up doing much more business in the long run.
LEGO being as private as they are makes it tough for them to respond, but I'm not sure them being owned by the public would either. They do act on things, but it takes them way too long. Usually two years, and the helmet holes, for example, were not an issue until Summer of 2022. That means we'd have to wait until Summer of 2024 for any results, if there even will be any.
2:25 Is the antenna on the leftmost clone trooper fixed in the wrong place?
That's what I'm saying they ahve the hol that they made for the accessories. However in the picture it looks like they are using what they should have used?
My take on this issue is that LEGO is a high-end quality toy manufacturer. The prices have always been high, and they always will be. With recent price hikes which have left fans feeling like LEGO is more expensive than ever, (although accounting for inflation, that is only marginally true) with LEGO prioritizing budget on other factors as well as minifigures, (more new parts, sustainable packaging, their Adults Welcome Icons line…) it makes people feel like the quality is going away, whereas, LEGO is using their budget on advancing areas many fans would not have prioritized. These criticisms are valid, because as customers who pay a high price for these toys/collectables, it is understandable to be alarmed when certain aspects aren’t up to our expectations, however, despite that, I do not partake in vilifying The LEGO Group, as understanding the nuance of the situation, (such as that hardcore AFOLs and TFOLs aren’t LEGO’s key focus) is of far more interest to me in order to better find the flaws with which LEGO is more realistically suited to mend.
They are pricing their key focus out of the market right now, parents aren't going to buy kids the Lego sets they want if it's price hiked by as much as 30% with no additional value and don't even get me started on how expensive they make 4+ sets.
I think the biggest issue really comes down to that these are premium products at a premium price. Lego is far and away, one of the popular most toy ever and the top dog in their field, no question. It feels like they kind of just realized that people will just buy it regardless. (Self admittedly i am a part of the problem.)
Yes, bc in the same time we are pissed about those matters, and happy that they started making more clones again, after years of neglect and we are buying them like crazy 😂 we cant vote with out wallets for the changes, without voting againts making more clones, so frustration grows
I really like the way you addressed this issue so many fans are whining and slating Lego and it comes across as so entitled, smug and immature however you have calmly explained the issue and have changed my mind on the issue.
I’m glad I could do that for you. Sometimes explaining things calmly is what’s needed
I appreciate your open-minded view on these different controversial LEGO topics. It’s very educational and has served as inspiration for some of my videos. Thanks for your insight!
No, thank you for the kind words! Sometimes what's needed is some civil conversation to get things figured out, and that's always been my goal
@@PenPlays You’re welcome, that’s exactly what the LEGO community needs right now
Great video! I really liked the way you approached this subject!
Thank you. I appreciate your kind words.
The 2014 212th troops look far superior to the 2022 version. I’m very glad that I stocked up on the 2014 troopers back in 2014
with the orientation of the nobs where the accessories should be, it does fall short but looking at captain rex, the position lines up with where it should be on the helmet. essentially the latest phase 2 mold without the holes was still bad because of the positioning. but since there were no holes before it didn't really matter. I understand recycling/re-using things to a point but also as said in the video, you'd think they'd have the budget to make the new mold with holes in the right place and the positioning proper. good video honestly. I'm glad someone takes the time to explain such things for people on the outside. as a massive lego star wars collector I appreciate this
Great video👍🏻 im from Denmark and have never seen the danish sign for “Only the best is good enough” - but a real translation would be “The-best-is-not-too-good”
Hope this helps😅
Yep, and thank you! The translation to English is loose so that the same weight is given to the perspective LEGO has. That ending of "...not to good" can be read different ways, several of which aren't the best, hence why it's translated so different.
Best summary and opinion on the clone trooper issue so far on RUclips that I have seen.
Thank you so much for the kind words. My hope was to make it known just why these issues are going on, but in a way that’s easy to understand as well as easy to share
First I would like to thank you for taking a calm look at this issue compared to some of the other Lego youtubers. Second, in regards to how i feel, i am a late arrival to being a lego collector. I've only been collecting for about 5 years. That means the current crop of Clone sets are the only ones i have been able to buy, I don't have the means to buy the retired sets. I like the clone sets, i'm not worried about cosmetic issues as i am not a huge clone wars fan. I am as old as Star Wars (you do the math), i did not watch the clone wars show. I did try it out, but it didn't hold my interest. Lego is doing what companies do, separate you from your money, while spending as little as possible. All of the complaining is free PR and attention for them, they are not beholden to us, and they probably think of fans who complain are a "vocal minority", so they will continue on and see no issues here to be concerned about.
Me personally I don’t want a new helmet mold, cuz then all the armies of p2 troopers have built would look weird if diffident helmets would suddenly appear so yeah and I think the helmet holes are not THAT bad, I mean it ads more customisation opportunities which I like
This was a very well written and delivered video but I still do not get the rabid dislike for helmet holes, or even more than minor dislike personally. I think the P2 helmets look the best they have ever looked and I am just super happy that all helmets support customization considering we get 4 visors and 4 range finders in every set that even has 1 clone with them. I can barely see the issue with my eyes and its only really evident in macro pictures of the helmets.
Even in a world that had 2 or 3 separate helmets with 1 hole for a range finder right on the round bit where the range finder is supposed to go and helmets with dual holes for visors, possibly a helmet with no holes we would still have the problem of not having the right helmet when you wanted it. In this world we would have to also people complaining about how much a clone trooper costs because to have 3 different helmets when you could realistically have just 1 means a ~3x price increase of each helmet because each of them would probably require a different mold. Certainly 2 different molds, 1 for plain and range finders, and 1 for visors.
I agree completely with the rest of the video especially about kamas, I really wish they'd do more sets with cloth ones, possibly redesigned if necessary.
We should absolutely continue to have helmet holes. The hope is that they can go in a different, less intrusive spot on the piece. Customization is very important for the clones, after all
That's the gist, although you did miss the part about colored arms on 501st and other Legion minifigs.
Great vid.
Slipped my mind as it doesn’t seem to be making the rounds like you’d expect it to. Important to note, however.
@@PenPlays It's a relatively minor issue compared to the helmet molds.
While the clone trooper design these days has some cons to it, I’m hoping this is a learning/experimental phase for LEGO, seeing the feedback in regards to things like the helmets, waistcapes and helmet holes, what is working and not working. Some decisions LEGO makes like how they executed Captain Vaughn I have questions about. I’m not a LEGO designer and in their shoes, so I don’t know what their limitations are but I wonder why they skip out on some details or where they pull their source material from sometimes.
Succinct, to the point, and a simple listing of the issues that present themselves over time. Great video, especially for non-Lego or non-Star Wars customers/fans.
Another issue is that the new holes only look fine with the visor pieces as they help cover the side areas, but the rangefinder attachments are very poor. They require force to push into the holes and they cannot be moved without falling out. Even the Phase 1 troopers of recent months didn't have that problem.
I feel like the issue with the kamas/waist-capes can be easily handled if Lego provided a pick-a-brick style purchase option for either online or in-store shopping. Just buy a number of cloth pieces (be it capes, waist capes, etc.) for a set price and BAM, fans and older collectors could just buy the missing pieces, Lego can make more money, and any concern dealing with younger kids is mitigated.
That’s a really smart idea. I feel like the only way to entice LEGO these days is
to show them the money.
Thanks for the kind words
at 2:32 there is a picture of a clone using a rangefinder, but its not even in the Hole!
I like adding visors to lots of clones and other attachments and I prefer the holes so I can add accessories to any clones
Just thinking out loud, but could one solution to helmet holes be that lego included small little white plastic plugs that simply pop into the holes to cover them up? Pull em out of you need to put a range finder on for exampme.
It's a good idea on paper. The super small pieces needed to do that would be easy to lose. They'd still look like strange dimples on their helmets too, which is also part of the full issue as well.
The issue isn't the lack of plastic within the wart. It's the wart.
So it could be possible to file a lawsuit against Lego for false advertising, after all you don't get what are you paying for
I feel like just redesigning the visors and moving the holes to the correct spot would look good
I like the holes, I can make my own clones of each class in each color
I like them too, I just wish they were handled a bit differently, like I said in the video
the UCS gunship was also a slap when they decided to put out a poll of who people wanted in the set and then disregarded it.
Kamas and printing are a problem, but I wholeheartedly support the holes themselves. Lego is a building toy. Customization should be priority. As a matter of fact, that's also the same reason physical kamas are so important
Oh. No, holes should be there, it’s just they could be applied better
Especially for the price of some of these sets, we definitely deserve to be getting actual quality minifigs.
Honestly considering the clone wars drought we were in for such a long time with the sequel trilogy sets I'm happy to finally get some decent customization options with the new stuff
This is the best video explaining the situation. Hopefully those people who shill for Lego and constantly defend these obvious bad design/marketing decisions can get it through there thick skull that the fans “complaining” have valid reason too and only want the figures to be the best they can be like we once had.
Wish we could get a phase 1 battle pack
Great video to explain everything.
Well written and thought out.
I agree with the issue on the helmet holes. They should have placed it where the circle part is and should have designed the new microbinoculars around that. The 'OG' commander visor is too big anyway so they should have used the opportunity to make a completely new mold to also accommodate the position. Sadly it's kind of too late as they've released so many now with it, it would hurt if they completely remade the helmet. But might be best if they did a minor change with the hole position and new attachments to fit it..
Making kamas printed is definitely a downgrade by miles... I think it's a cost cutting thing which doesn't make sense when they're making peak profits. So it's got to be 'greed' which goes against their motto with quality.
I think the helmet holes are fine, they allow more customizability! We only had that for 3rd party phase 2 troopers, and to have it on standard lego clones is a great thing
That’s precisely what people want. Like I said in the video. People just assume fans want them gone. Makes no sense to do that. People just want them moved
@@PenPlays Yeah I agree. They could be improved. Lets also consider that the 2014 phase 2 clones were peak design.
What I fail to understand is how people are so upset about such a little detail on a plastic toy. If you want accuracy collect action figures, if you want better clones you can also buy them from 3rd party companies that jave always made better custom minifigures than lego anyway
The big issue there is that one single action figure, or one single custom helmet, can cost as much as an entire LEGO set. It’s why the action figure market is as fragile as it is at the moment, as the quality isn’t delivering for the price.
Customs are also very hit or miss, so most people want nothing to do with them, and would much prefer the official source get it right the first time.
Most of the people who make a sound on the helmet hole are those resellers who intend to sell old minifigures. I think a Battlepack like this is more worth the money than buying old minifigures from a reseller.
I think another issue is that with the more expensive sets that are targeted to adults there is a quality drop, such as the upcoming Rex in the 650 dollar venator being completely inaccurate. There is the argument that Lego is for kids, but sets such as these are targeted to adults and they do cost a lot of money. So the inaccuracy of the clones suck even more especially since it is a legacy character such as Rex in a ver anticipated set such as the venator.
It arguably is the most high-quality Rex we've gotten. With everything going on tho, it still could be so much better, and that's why it doesn't feel as good.
Especially for a set that expensive.
The problem for me is LEGO set a standard of quality for Clone Troopers in the 2010s. The last cloth kama included with a Clone was in 2020 with the 212th Airborne Trooper; afterwards, that standard LEGO set for themselves dropped unceremoniously when the cloth was stripped away and the kama printed on.
If I wasn't already familiar with Star Wars, I wouldn't be able to tell what the two vertical lines printed on the Clones' legs were supposed to be. I asked a friend recently if he could tell, and then showed him a Clone with the cloth kama for comparison, and he was shocked at the difference!
Dude, I agree with almost all of these takes. I also really appreciate explaining everything in the video, which I did not quite understand previously.
I’m glad it helped. It can be a it confusing, which is why I wanted to make a video that was easy to share and help people understand
I’m happy that they’re making clone troopers
Personally the only major problem I have is the advertising for the minifig helmets. The T-visor is different on the box than whata in the box. I'm not sure why they make the visor wider in the ads qhen they aren't very big in production.
I’ve asked people on the Lego Star Wars subreddit to please explain what they’re angry about and have just gotten snarky comments and downvotes. Thanks for actually explaining it.
You bet. That was my goal. Something easy to follow along with and share.
I haven’t bought any clone trooper set in a while, and the decals for me are why, the 2013-2018 Decals with the AOTC/ROTS accurate printing was so good and was honestly the perfect design that shouldn’t have been changed and they made the Clone Wars animated designed mini-figs alongside a separate entity, so when they showed the 501st set with the new decals back in 2020, I was disappointed, they made this weird amalgamation of the Clone Wars animated design with live action, and imo it just doesn’t work, its weird that the clones ended up this way, because even with the new Stormtrooper helmet mold, they still did their best to make them movie accurate and didn’t make this weird Rebels Animated live-action hybrid trooper, The printed waist capes are bad, they cut corners when they didn’t need too, and what I also don’t like is lego has been doing this particular process for awhile where they make a specific number of legions for the clones and then they move on to a new artstyle, so as an example my disappointment for the 501st minifigs in 2020 is partly because we didn’t see the 501st in the 2013-2014 Decals (not counting the clone wars minifig that came with the AT-RT and Z-95 sets) I wish lego would just make a list of all the movie legions and just make sets about everyone of them before moving on to a new minifig artstyle etc.
Not having been able to enjoy 501st clones in 2002-2007 or 2013-2019 is my biggest gripe in all of this.
I wanted to play with those in 2005, not with Shocktroopers, 327th or these stupid Swamp clones that are actually 442nd Siege Battallion and only exist in online promo images.
So many sets with so many clone variants in all these years but much of what we got is entirely pointless, not the major legions that actually played roles in stories. Who is actually happy about Bomb Squad and Geonosis Camo Phase 2 & Airbornes? They could have made Geonosis camo ARFs or at the very least Phase 1s to mimic the com troopers.
I don’t mind the holes but the visor looks different from the box art
I didn't mind printed kamas when it started on snowtroopers. But they wear white kamas on white trousers and armour. However, it most assuredly does look terrible with drastically different colours.
To be honest, I'm still not entirely over the move from the old print - I'm a big fan of the old torso and helmet, though the new face and legs are better.
yesssss more clones!!! also... more droid sets!! and lego needs to watch this video!
Oh heck yes - more droids!!
We can't send it to LEGO directly, but if the video is shared around, and the RUclips algorithm sees that, maybe it'll end up in their feeds one day?
I like how you presented the issues in video. I would just move up the little things on the sides. while it would be less accurate it would at least look better
Thank you. I’m glad it made sense
I agree with what you said I just don't understand why people the helmet holes so much
i also dont understand why these days there are only battlepacks of clones but none with battledroids, generally no seperatist sets for some reason
The missing quality in stark contrast to their mission statement has often confused me, but never as much as in the last two years.
I’m glad that a few different factors have come into play to reduce the amount of lego that i buy, which is a boon to my wallet
Small theory, but what if the rangefinder on the officer in the battle pack was a prototype that had 2 holes. One for a visor and one for a rangefinder
Since the image is digital I assume not.
Honestly I would imagine the people at Lego are exhausted with adult Lego clone fans complaining as there decisions make a lot of sense from a toy perspective and cost perspective. Adults simply aren’t the target audience and although we sometimes get our way it’s important to remember who these toys are truly made for
Are you saying kids shouldn't have the best they can get?
I'm not asking to get rid of the holes and removing playability. Watching the video will help make that clear.
@@PenPlays i understand your point but I think the printed capes make sense as when I was younger I would often accidentally rip them or lose them and as for side printing Lego is already pretty expensive and that would raise the price
Lego is the biggest toy company on the planet and their sets are extremely fucking expensive (even more nowadays) - and because of this there is absolutely nothing wrong with demanding premium quality for the premium^2 price they are demanding.
My main issue is that they don’t really make plain standard clones anymore. An army doesn’t look as impressive when every uniform looks different. In the rare occasion I decide to buy minifigures or sets now, I would much rather just purchase older minifigures/sets off eBay rather than buying a new set. Clone wars era sets (when the tv show was airing) and earlier are the only ones that interest me now as I feel the designs just look better (though that may just be nostalgia speaking)
idk how you feel about this, but there are some good rumors of a new battle pack featuring generic standard clones
Awesome explanation, thanks for that.
As a former kid. I had the brainpower to understand that I can take off the waste cape
I think the true reason for why we dont get waste capes with star wars is the budgeting for lego sets , with the new Lego dreamzzs example we have an unlicensed theme that has at least 10 if not 20% more budget do to not having to pay disney or any other company license fees and well soft good on figs even outside of Lego are always a premium so thats what gets scrapped first.
Seems silly how butt hurt they are over a toys that costs a few dollars lmao
They don’t cost a few dollars. That’s the problem.
The blue clones in the video come in sets that should be $15 tops. They’re $20 at most retailers. Some have them for more.
Commander Cody, comes in a set that is $140.
Also, yes, it is a toy, but for kids and adults alike, shouldn’t they be the best they can be?
Bruh do you know expensive this shit is?
man, i hate the printing gaps between the fins
BrUH I just got back into Lego after a ~10 year break, last really good set I got was the play scale star destroyer that came out in the 2010s
It’s because the designers are salty OT fans who hate the prequels😂
If we ask enough for Lego to make a “pilot” battle pack maybe we can finally get all the commander figures. “Doubles as pilot”
When it comes to the printed kamas vs the fabric ones, to me that reeks of there being no official style guide for designers to reference when designing these sets and minifigures. That, or designers are regularly rotated off certain IPs, leading to different design approaches from different creative teams (meaning that any unofficial style guides aren't carried over from project to project).
That gives a lot of food for thought. They definitely cycle out designers, but there are also leads that have been there for a while that don't seem to enforce things. From what I understand, this is especially applicable to print/sticker artists.
I would’ve honestly preferred the plastic waistcape rather than the printed one by a long shot. Then keep the cloth pauldrons
I like the new helmet visor prints more than to old ones which looked off in my opinion but the helmet holes just look dumb
Yeah kamas need to come back
why drill the hole all the way through the helmet???
Potentially multiple reasons. Could be to better allow the accessories to fit in, or so that, in the event one is ingested, holes in the part can still allow air to pass thru.
The imperial logo on the laat too
The thing is lego knows they look bad they are falsely advertising the printing on the helmets and where the helmet holes are on their box art
Honestly I don’t think the helmet holes are an issue, they’re fine tbh and trade aesthetics over functionality
My main issue is the quality of printing and lack of waist capes which have no excuse to be absent or lacking
My issue with the clones is that Lego obsesses over making remake after remake, different moulds and prints of clones - but the droids have been using the same peices since the start - even going back on using printed peices on some of the droids like the Commander Droid and Security Droid - not even mentioning the sheer ridicuolsness of the Magna Guard being made in 2 sets and selling for around £30 over here. Plus, the quality of the legs on B2s and Commando droids is abysmal, constantly snapping and requiring replacements to be bought. Oh! And also the X-20 Tactical Droid thats only been sold in 1 set, which now sells for something like £60 on the low end. Idk, seems like some attention could be diverted from all this clone stuff - because like you said its upsetting when Lego messes up things we care about
i hope we get some all white cones soon! not complaining as these new clones are sick but it’s been a while!
edit- AND we need some green 442nd clones! but i am glad the holes in the helmets don’t bother me! seems like a big deal to a lot of people
I also hate the new design of the printing of the phase 2 helmet as well as them using clone wars styled torsos instead of live-action styled ones
The original phase 2 helmets are my favorite!
To be fair some of the clones can be inaccurate but for me I never had many clones as a kid so I’m am just super happy to see them in common now
Is it just me. Or do colored arms look cooler than white arms,unless thereis printing
I like them. Objectively it’s not that bad.
We could all live with this, truly, but with LEGO’s efforts for quality, & previously accomplishing that with older troopers, we might as well get to enjoy that again.
I just don't like where the holes are put in the helmets.