I have Spider-Man: Blue and Sins Past next to each other on my shelf. I get a kick out of having what could be said as the quintessential Gwen Stacy/Peter Parker story, right next to the character assassination of Gwen.
Nah, more like Peter had sex with Gwen's biggest bully from high school and that bully killed Peter because he choose Gwen over her... and also the child as well. When I put it like that, it sounds so much worse.
What would have made the Father reveal a thousand times better if they were on Maury. "Mr. Parker, you are NOT the Father". Gwen's daughter goes backstage and cries. Peter jumps up and cheers, and the brother throws a chair into the crowd.
Not only could Norman not dodge his own glider, he can't even dodge child support. Norman Osborn is probably the most self-destructive person in the Marvel universe.
I like to crawl around in a red head-sock and pretend I'm a spider. We all have things we like to pretend didn't happen. Let's all pretend both of those things didn't.
I had never heard of this story before watching this video. But when he said that Peter was originally supposed to be the father, but then they changed it to Gwen cheeting on Peter with some other dude, I literally brought my hand up to my mouth in horror, like "oh god, no. They didn't do what I'm thinking right now. Please, anything but that..." and then he said it. Gwen Stacy banged Norman Osborn... NO! GOD, NO! NO! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!"
That was most people's reaction when they read it. People still at it to this day. Heck, i'm not a comic reader and i'm shocked when i read it. I don't know if they retconned this story yet in comics or not but at least we got spider-gwen comic that i'm excited to read it when it arrive to my house.
I would say Strike One:Sins Past (Gwen Assassination) Strike Two:One More Day(Peter Parker Assassination) Strike Three:One Moment in Time(Mary Jane Assassination) Wow Joe Quasada. This proves you are absolutely freaking a**hole. These three storyline should be collected under the name "How to assassinate a character"
I HATE sins past more than any other Spider man story (with the exception of one more day). A much better "story" that deals with Spidey's past is Spider Man and Human Torch: I'm with Stupid, that is a collection of stories looking at Spider man's "friendship" with Johnny Storm over the years ending with a story in which Johnny learns that Peter is Spider Man when a group of heavily armed men take the school Peter is teaching at hostage.
Despite what is said about this comic in the official timeline, I do not consider this canon. And my reasoning, aside from it being terrible, is because of the continuity errors that just do not work. And here they are: 1: There is no way that Gwen kept her pregnancy a secret from anyone, especially Peter. 2: Gwen went to London, not Paris. 3: She was gone for weeks, not months. Even if you made the argument that she was gone for one or two months, still not enough time for pregnancy. 4: There is no way that Gwen would have banged NORMAN FREAKING OSBORN because he was strong, mysterious and sad! He’s old enough to be her father and he isn’t even that handsome! I can believe her banging Harry since they are closer in age and we’re going through hard times in their own way. 5: Even if there is no real evidence of Peter and Gwen banging, there is plenty of evidence of implying moments between them, mainly in Spider-Man: Blue, that clearly wanted us to know that they had been ‘together’. And to add, whether if the time period was supposed to be the 80s or 90s, couples were sleeping together as far back as the 60s, when the Death of Gwen Stacy was written! In the words of Linkara: “THEY BANGED!!!” 6: The pregnancy itself doesn’t make sense. Even if you make the argument that the rapid aging made them be born super fast and/or early, it doesn’t explain how the hell her body was able to handle that stress and hardship. 7: It was stated in the Death of Gwen Stacy comic that Norman was after Peter, not Gwen. He wasn’t there for her. And even if he was, why didn’t he just kill her right there?! 8: The rapid aging may explain why the kids are grownups now but only in terms of physical growth, not mentally. They’re not clones where they can already have the mindset of an adult, they’re sorta naturally born children, they’re minds can’t mature that fast. 9: No one recognizes that this comic exists and prefer to ignore it. It makes no sense, so it is not canon in my eyes. One More Day maybe recognized and plays a major role in things moving forward, this doesn’t. So yeah, F&CK THIS STORY!!!
Even if it's retconned now, #9 is incorrect. They had a couple of stories over the years with the girl, and Gabriel Stacy showed up in American Son, during Norman Osborne's Dark Reign which happened _after_ One More Day. Only after that (which was almost 10 years after the original story) did they not mention it until Sinister War.
This might have been the most entertaining Back Issues ep yet! It must have been a real treat for Sal to edit just by Ben's and Tiff's facial expressions alone. I was waiting for Ben to yell, "No! Not like this?!", when he found out that Norman Osborne took Gwen's virginity. lol Great job guys, and keep up the great work!
God, I KNEW about this twist and it's still just so gross. Marvel editorial thinking that it'd be a better idea for Gwen Stacy to be a cheater who had sex with Spider-Man's WORST ENEMY, THE MAN WHO KILLED HER, rather than admit that college-aged Peter Parker accidentally knocked up his girlfriend, because that "ages" the character? Two things, Quesada: 1. Accidental TEEN pregnancies are a thing IN REAL LIFE. I'm pretty sure it doesn't age the character for them to have that happen to them when they're in college. 2. Mary Jane is the Spider girlfriend initially dreamt up as the free-spirited one, Gwen is the more conservative, bookish one. I find it hard to believe that Gwen is apparently not at that point in her relationship with Peter to go that far, but will apparently boink 50-year-old industrialists at the drop of a hat.
They did their best to kill off Peter's daughter with MJ and destroy their marriage, so are you really surprised. Thank God, for DeFalco and the amazing fans that kept Spider-Girl going for 100 issues in her original run despite pushback from the top. Gwen hated Spider-Man, she blamed him for the death of her father and she didn't know he was the Goblin. Peter's healing factor isn't good enough to age them up that quickly. So having "his" kids try to kill him in your situation wouldn't be possible until Pete is in his 40s. Which would make an interesting story for Spider-Girl, but goes against the tone of her comic books. People are hypocrites and Peter and Gwen's relationship was doomed from the outset in universe due to the fact she hated Spider-Man.
@@kingjonstarkgeryan8573 It doesn't matter how good or doomed their relationship was, or if it made more sense if Norman was the father. The point is *it's still an awful story because it destroys Gwen as a character and also portrays Mary Jane as a liar who knew about this infidelity and never told Peter the truth just because Gwen asked her not to tell him, despite the fact that Gwen has been DEAD for YEARS and Peter and her had been MARRIED for a DECADE by the time this story came out.*
@@kingjonstarkgeryan8573 the issue isn't really the purity of the character (though there is that too), so much as it completely cheapens The Night That Gwen Stacey Died. It's like finding out that Uncle Ben actually committed suicide or something
I'd never read the story myself but I knew about most of the big plot points due to my history with Marvel Encyclopedias (thank you Elementary school book fairs). I couldn't wait to see Ben and Earth 2 Etha- I mean Tiffany's! ... o_o reactions to the big reveal. And their facial expressions when Sal kept listing off all of the usual cliches were priceless. Redemption for the hero, revenge for the villain multiple times, look alike of dead lover tries to sleep with main character, villain gets amnesia lol and surprisingly more. Great job as always guys.
While the retcon itself was pretty messy and I feel like a lot of factors both in and out of Spencer's control made the end of his run less than it should've been at least we got this good from it.
Tiffany's reaction is priceless. I remember reading this story when it came out and I don't remember what my initial reaction was I just know that I wouldn't mind forgetting this story. I'm not a bid Gwen fan but was this really necessary?
Someone please correct me if I misspeak at any point. I'm not above being corrected if I say something out of line. But it's this type of stuff that really gets on my nerves. I mean yeah, the dude did the story anyway but it simply because Marvel thought that Peter Parker having kids would make him seem to old. So in essence, they pissed on a beloved character just because they wanted to keep Peter Parker appealing to younger viewers.
It latter got reconnected recently with the revelation that Mifisto had interfered in Spider Man’s life before One More Day, and that he created the twins and placed false meteorites into Norman and Mary Jane.
mason harris Ignoring it doesn’t mean that it didn’t happen it just means that you (Generally speaking) want to be willfully blind. I, personally, will bring this up every time someone tries to claim that Gwen Stacy is a better love interest than Mary Jane .
My middle school had the trade paperback collection for this story in the library. Imagine being a middle schooler and finding out that Gwen Stacy cheated on Peter with Norman.
I love JMS, he's created so many wonderful things. This is not one of them. It's really unfortunate how badly Joe Quesada screwed him over during this run (Though JMS' idea wasn't much better).
As awful as this might sound I would've been okay with this if Norman raped Gwen because it would have made him more evil. But her wanting to sleep with him creeps me out a little.
Noah Reisner Oh yeah defo.To me it also ruins Norman Osborn as well as it seems completely out of character for him to do something like that. I just pretend that this story never happened and move on.
There are two Norman Osborns for me, there is the marvel version of joker (but not as crazy) and then their is the calm collected businessman. The first works for this where as the second does not for me. EIther way i wish it wouldn't have happened, or if it had, by a better writer who could've done something with it.
19:35 look at the ad on the back of the comic, it's Spider Man 2, one of the, if not, the greatest Spider Man films and on the same plane as the absolute worst Spider Man story
Oh my god its happening. Its really happening. This is the one comic that made me angry. I couldn't even think about Gwen Stacey because I would just get pissed off at this MADNESS! WTF IS THIS INSANITY?!? WHy would you do this?? Goodness the woman is already dead! WHY WOULD YOU PERVERT HER LIFE?!? ANIMALS! Animals I say! Thanks for doing this book btw guys. Just started the video and I already know its gonna be hilarious lol
One particular detail that's a retcon from Sins Past is whether or not Peter & Gwen did it. In this story arc they had him specifically say that they never did, but in comic issues that came out when she was still alive & they were going out, it's heavily implied that they did do it. One particular example (back when the Spider Sense wasn't yet established to go off for danger, but for external stimuli as well) is when at the end of an issue when Gwen & Peter are having an intimate moment in his bedroom at night as it seems that more will be happening before the final panel is a skyline view beyond their building & it has Peter's Spider Sense tingling as an obvious euphemism for what they were clearly doing.
21:31 was priceless lol.... That was pretty much my same reaction when I read that book 3 months ago and the only thing I can say to myself was Damn and I thought One more day ruined Spiderman for me but I think this takes the cake
I started watching your videos thanks to the weekly pull podcast. Since I discovered back issues I havent stopped laughing with you guys. Close-ups are hilarious and the screenshots of the issues are cool too. Keep it up!
11-year old me: "Oh golly, jee whiz! A comic book with awesome art! I can't wait to see how cool the fight scenes look!" Me starting down the rabbit hole that is the story of Spider-Man's girlfriend getting seduced, banged, knocked up, and killed by the Green Goblin: "Well, this sure won't give me trust issues or warped views of relationships in the future!"
To be fair, JMS has said that he never wanted to make those kids Norman's, editorial made him do that. And considering the...choices that editorial made around that time, I'm inclined to believe him
Thank GOD for this video guys, as a kid I had this really cool Spiderman encyclopedia I got from a book fair and it had character bios from the 60's till like 05? And I remember reading the Stacy Twins profile and seeing the Gray Goblin and thinking he looked SO COOL, and I always wanted to collect the story he was in. HOLY SHIT am I glad I never got the books.
The way I originally got into comic characters was just reading wikis. I remember reading about this on one of those, reading “Gwen had kids with Norman Osborn” weird, but maybe they could redeem something. Seeing Gwen having sex with Norman Osborn... ewww, we should fire whoever thought this was a good idea.
Wow this has absolutely ruined my whole view on like life, I didn't see that whole Gwen/ Osborne thing coming in what mind set was that a good idea? I will now nap and restart and try to forget that this was an actual thing.
Wow, I have lost all kinds of respect for whoever at Marvel made those editorial decisions... AND Straczynski's writing skills... P.S. Sal's one word reactions (at the 38 minute mark) as he flips through the individual issues is PRICELESS!
If they made Gabriel and Sarah actually Peter's kids and made Norman take the kids and raise them to hate Spiderman and think he killed Gwen then this story would be better.
I have to know was the fade to black and white with the slow motion in the middle of the video made to spoof a soup opera since Sin Past reads like a terrible soup opera?
Pick up Sins Past right here: amzn.to/1Jyo6uP
*later in 2018*
The worst part is the "I know they're not my kids because Gwen and I never fucked". Suspension of disbelief right to the shitter.
I have Spider-Man: Blue and Sins Past next to each other on my shelf.
I get a kick out of having what could be said as the quintessential Gwen Stacy/Peter Parker story, right next to the character assassination of Gwen.
Wow thats all sorts of wrong
you are a fucking monster!
love your name
Your the devil
I agree with ItsMichaelReid. That's the equivalent of having one of Shakespeare's love sonnets next to Fifty Shades of Grey on the same shelf.
So does this mean like, Peter from the Spider-Gwen universe had sex with Norman and gave birth to HIS Goblin children?
+TGuy Law Ha!
Maybe Spider-Gwen universe doesn't have this terrible story
Peter died before that could happen
Nah, more like Peter had sex with Gwen's biggest bully from high school and that bully killed Peter because he choose Gwen over her... and also the child as well. When I put it like that, it sounds so much worse.
He died very fast in Spider Gwen xD
I have a confession Sal. Gwen cheated on Peter with me too. I'll be mailing you a letter explaining all of this in two years.
Moartv M I look forward to destroying my place in a fit of angsty rage.
You have less than 3 months to send that letter.
it's time.
Still waiting...
Where's that damn letter!
I imagine that Spider-Gwen just read this book and threw up everywhere.
SirLuquent ^ this is brilliant
dont forget gwenpool now because one deadpool wasnt bad enough
@@donb7519 Gwenpool isn't a Gwen Stacy.
Sunny you sure about that?
SirLuquent same! 😂😂😂
What would have made the Father reveal a thousand times better if they were on Maury. "Mr. Parker, you are NOT the Father". Gwen's daughter goes backstage and cries. Peter jumps up and cheers, and the brother throws a chair into the crowd.
New comic title: Gwen bangs the marvel universe
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH u sir made my day
Hahahah this comment was GOLD
Hahahaha oh man xD
would read
Peter: “I knew we shouldn’t have dated”
Not only could Norman not dodge his own glider, he can't even dodge child support. Norman Osborn is probably the most self-destructive person in the Marvel universe.
Tiffany's face while the story unfolds is heartbreaking, poor girl's hear being crushed
James Edward Clark I feel so bad for any fans of Gwen Stacy.
I'm pretty amazed that you haven't burned those books.
Jeff Batista the fire doesn't want it
Jeff Batista after the video he probably did
Fire can't destroy this much evil
Jeff Batista me too.
I mean, that's more Linkara's schtick.
I'm STILL pissed about that comic.
I always liked MJ more, but Gwen didn't deserve that.
There are so many instances where Tiffany's face just says it all.
18:20
18:38
18:52
19:30
It's priceless
24:02 24:08 24:34
27:45 29:00 & 29:25 are amazing too!
I like to pretend this story never happened.
OldManGamerYo I'm pretty sure that everyone including Marvel wants to pretend that this story doesn't exist.
Isostormgamer 558 yet it has yet to be retconned it to my knowledge.
KiSwordsman Because retconning it would mean acknowledging that it exists and no one wants that.
I like to crawl around in a red head-sock and pretend I'm a spider.
We all have things we like to pretend didn't happen.
Let's all pretend both of those things didn't.
I watched it happen! I saw it happen! Don't tell me it didn't happen!
This video was my introduction to one of the absolute best youtube channels ever.
I had never heard of this story before watching this video. But when he said that Peter was originally supposed to be the father, but then they changed it to Gwen cheeting on Peter with some other dude, I literally brought my hand up to my mouth in horror, like "oh god, no. They didn't do what I'm thinking right now. Please, anything but that..." and then he said it. Gwen Stacy banged Norman Osborn... NO! GOD, NO! NO! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!"
That was most people's reaction when they read it. People still at it to this day. Heck, i'm not a comic reader and i'm shocked when i read it. I don't know if they retconned this story yet in comics or not but at least we got spider-gwen comic that i'm excited to read it when it arrive to my house.
Tiff's face throughout the video is hilarious!
The story in a nutshell.....What where marvel even thinking
Flame War Reviews no clue. I ask that when I also heard about one more day.
To reference ASDF:
“WHO’S IDEA WAS THIS?!”
How do you know when something's messed up? When your friends go full "Hello Darkness, My Old Friend".
Tiffany’s unending disappointment toward the end was my entire energy reading this shit. I gave up expecting it to get better
I love how Sal doesn’t talk about how bad the book is before starting and let’s the horribleness play out
Just got here after the retcon. I guess in the end the real sins past were the friends we made along the way.
Strike One: Sins Past
Strike Two: The Other
Strike Three: One More Day
JMS you are out
The other was very weird
I would say
Strike One:Sins Past (Gwen Assassination)
Strike Two:One More Day(Peter Parker Assassination)
Strike Three:One Moment in Time(Mary Jane Assassination)
Wow Joe Quasada. This proves you are absolutely freaking a**hole.
These three storyline should be collected under the name "How to assassinate a character"
@@rachitmittal448 To be fair when deserves it considering that the idealization of her keeps Peter pretty stagnant and hurts his real true love MJ.
I HATE sins past more than any other Spider man story (with the exception of one more day).
A much better "story" that deals with Spidey's past is Spider Man and Human Torch: I'm with Stupid, that is a collection of stories looking at Spider man's "friendship" with Johnny Storm over the years ending with a story in which Johnny learns that Peter is Spider Man when a group of heavily armed men take the school Peter is teaching at hostage.
Despite what is said about this comic in the official timeline, I do not consider this canon. And my reasoning, aside from it being terrible, is because of the continuity errors that just do not work. And here they are:
1: There is no way that Gwen kept her pregnancy a secret from anyone, especially Peter.
2: Gwen went to London, not Paris.
3: She was gone for weeks, not months. Even if you made the argument that she was gone for one or two months, still not enough time for pregnancy.
4: There is no way that Gwen would have banged NORMAN FREAKING OSBORN because he was strong, mysterious and sad! He’s old enough to be her father and he isn’t even that handsome! I can believe her banging Harry since they are closer in age and we’re going through hard times in their own way.
5: Even if there is no real evidence of Peter and Gwen banging, there is plenty of evidence of implying moments between them, mainly in Spider-Man: Blue, that clearly wanted us to know that they had been ‘together’. And to add, whether if the time period was supposed to be the 80s or 90s, couples were sleeping together as far back as the 60s, when the Death of Gwen Stacy was written! In the words of Linkara: “THEY BANGED!!!”
6: The pregnancy itself doesn’t make sense. Even if you make the argument that the rapid aging made them be born super fast and/or early, it doesn’t explain how the hell her body was able to handle that stress and hardship.
7: It was stated in the Death of Gwen Stacy comic that Norman was after Peter, not Gwen. He wasn’t there for her. And even if he was, why didn’t he just kill her right there?!
8: The rapid aging may explain why the kids are grownups now but only in terms of physical growth, not mentally. They’re not clones where they can already have the mindset of an adult, they’re sorta naturally born children, they’re minds can’t mature that fast.
9: No one recognizes that this comic exists and prefer to ignore it. It makes no sense, so it is not canon in my eyes. One More Day maybe recognized and plays a major role in things moving forward, this doesn’t. So yeah, F&CK THIS STORY!!!
Thankfully this was officially retconned by Spencer in Sinister war.
Even if it's retconned now, #9 is incorrect. They had a couple of stories over the years with the girl, and Gabriel Stacy showed up in American Son, during Norman Osborne's Dark Reign which happened _after_ One More Day. Only after that (which was almost 10 years after the original story) did they not mention it until Sinister War.
Just want to say: Ben and Tiffany's reactions said it all.
Bad Marvel editorial, BAD!
sfgiantsfanmike I know!!! They were spot on!
This might have been the most entertaining Back Issues ep yet! It must have been a real treat for Sal to edit just by Ben's and Tiff's facial expressions alone. I was waiting for Ben to yell, "No! Not like this?!", when he found out that Norman Osborne took Gwen's virginity. lol
Great job guys, and keep up the great work!
21:31 Yep! That's pretty much my reaction.
So Mary Jane is like the ultimate bro?
God, I KNEW about this twist and it's still just so gross. Marvel editorial thinking that it'd be a better idea for Gwen Stacy to be a cheater who had sex with Spider-Man's WORST ENEMY, THE MAN WHO KILLED HER, rather than admit that college-aged Peter Parker accidentally knocked up his girlfriend, because that "ages" the character? Two things, Quesada:
1. Accidental TEEN pregnancies are a thing IN REAL LIFE. I'm pretty sure it doesn't age the character for them to have that happen to them when they're in college.
2. Mary Jane is the Spider girlfriend initially dreamt up as the free-spirited one, Gwen is the more conservative, bookish one. I find it hard to believe that Gwen is apparently not at that point in her relationship with Peter to go that far, but will apparently boink 50-year-old industrialists at the drop of a hat.
They did their best to kill off Peter's daughter with MJ and destroy their marriage, so are you really surprised. Thank God, for DeFalco and the amazing fans that kept Spider-Girl going for 100 issues in her original run despite pushback from the top.
Gwen hated Spider-Man, she blamed him for the death of her father and she didn't know he was the Goblin.
Peter's healing factor isn't good enough to age them up that quickly. So having "his" kids try to kill him in your situation wouldn't be possible until Pete is in his 40s. Which would make an interesting story for Spider-Girl, but goes against the tone of her comic books.
People are hypocrites and Peter and Gwen's relationship was doomed from the outset in universe due to the fact she hated Spider-Man.
@@kingjonstarkgeryan8573 It doesn't matter how good or doomed their relationship was, or if it made more sense if Norman was the father. The point is *it's still an awful story because it destroys Gwen as a character and also portrays Mary Jane as a liar who knew about this infidelity and never told Peter the truth just because Gwen asked her not to tell him, despite the fact that Gwen has been DEAD for YEARS and Peter and her had been MARRIED for a DECADE by the time this story came out.*
@@pablocardoso7830 she had no character and pray tell when should Mj had told Peter he was running from. One crisis to another.
@@kingjonstarkgeryan8573 the issue isn't really the purity of the character (though there is that too), so much as it completely cheapens The Night That Gwen Stacey Died. It's like finding out that Uncle Ben actually committed suicide or something
Tiffany's expression through the whole thing is hilarious. It reads "I'm so done."
Gwen banged Osborn, Jackal and now it´s Miles Morales´turn. WTF has Marvel done to that character? xD
*sigh* being PC...
But I still don´t like anything they do with Gwen, because her death was sacred
Totally Agree MavErik, she's a sacred character it would be like if Tim Drake banged Catwoman, too weird
Now I'm glad Marvel doesn't own Lana Lang.
Matt Bison Why do black people have to bang black people
Who's re-watching this now that it's finally been retconned?
And now the evil is vanquished, but at the cost of telling a 75 issue story about nothing but moving furniture
As long as it was done, I don't care what it cost.
@@morganrobinson8042 did you do it?
Yes
What did it cost?
75 issues
I'd never read the story myself but I knew about most of the big plot points due to my history with Marvel Encyclopedias (thank you Elementary school book fairs). I couldn't wait to see Ben and Earth 2 Etha- I mean Tiffany's! ... o_o reactions to the big reveal. And their facial expressions when Sal kept listing off all of the usual cliches were priceless. Redemption for the hero, revenge for the villain multiple times, look alike of dead lover tries to sleep with main character, villain gets amnesia lol and surprisingly more. Great job as always guys.
Honestly I love when you guys do bad stories XD, everyone's reactions are the best
I just saw this pop up in my sub box. I remember reading this story. Oh boy can't wait for their reactions.
When I saw this in my inbox, I thought to myself "no, not like this!"
What's the deal with Norman's hair? Are they supposed to be cornrows, or is it a holdover from the old-timey comics art style?
Dylan Cisneros it’s supposed to be wavy hair
The waves
It’s Over! It’s finally over! SINS PAST HAS BEEN RETCONNED!!!! Thank you Nick Spencer!
While the retcon itself was pretty messy and I feel like a lot of factors both in and out of Spencer's control made the end of his run less than it should've been at least we got this good from it.
Tiffany's reaction is priceless. I remember reading this story when it came out and I don't remember what my initial reaction was I just know that I wouldn't mind forgetting this story. I'm not a bid Gwen fan but was this really necessary?
Someone please correct me if I misspeak at any point. I'm not above being corrected if I say something out of line. But it's this type of stuff that really gets on my nerves. I mean yeah, the dude did the story anyway but it simply because Marvel thought that Peter Parker having kids would make him seem to old. So in essence, they pissed on a beloved character just because they wanted to keep Peter Parker appealing to younger viewers.
Word brother.
Sorry it bugs you, but that's the problem. They were so preoccupied with their agenda, they forced a bad story to go out.
And this is probably why I prefer DC over Marvel.
@@DeadlyAlienInvader I mean...have you read All Star Batman?
@@NoBody-lj5xh that’s non canon so it doesn’t really have a bad effect on the main continuity
Tiffany and Ben's frustration with this story is probably my favorite thing in the universe.
Man, Tiff's reaction at 12:48 is perfect.
24:02 - Tiff looks horrified, pissed, and her anxiety is way over human levels lol.
It latter got reconnected recently with the revelation that Mifisto had interfered in Spider Man’s life before One More Day, and that he created the twins and placed false meteorites into Norman and Mary Jane.
I no longer care that Gwen Stacy died
Just ignore this story.
mason harris we can’t it’s so prolific that even if you don’t know about this comic you know this bit plus marvel keep bringing this up
mason harris Ignoring it doesn’t mean that it didn’t happen it just means that you (Generally speaking) want to be willfully blind. I, personally, will bring this up every time someone tries to claim that Gwen Stacy is a better love interest than Mary Jane .
@@KiSwordsman Some men... nust want to watch the world burn. You sir, are one of those men...😂
GL Customs hey, I’m not ashamed of it :)
I accidentally bought this comic
+Just Dewitt I love this
Did you burn it?
George Baynard I tried but not even the fire would touch it
Just Dewitt Good Mephisto!
Just Dewitt
Try firing it into the sun. That's how I solve most of my problems.
My middle school had the trade paperback collection for this story in the library. Imagine being a middle schooler and finding out that Gwen Stacy cheated on Peter with Norman.
I love JMS, he's created so many wonderful things. This is not one of them. It's really unfortunate how badly Joe Quesada screwed him over during this run (Though JMS' idea wasn't much better).
Quesada has some weird fetish. I swear he sees himself as Osborn and picks on Spidey simply out of weirdness.
As awful as this might sound I would've been okay with this if Norman raped Gwen because it would have made him more evil. But her wanting to sleep with him creeps me out a little.
+Noah Reisner Yeah I agree but even so it's still creepy.
+FatSnorlax yeah that may be creepier even but at least it redeems Gwen a lil
Noah Reisner Oh yeah defo.To me it also ruins Norman Osborn as well as it seems completely out of character for him to do something like that. I just pretend that this story never happened and move on.
There are two Norman Osborns for me, there is the marvel version of joker (but not as crazy) and then their is the calm collected businessman. The first works for this where as the second does not for me. EIther way i wish it wouldn't have happened, or if it had, by a better writer who could've done something with it.
Noah Reisner I absolutely share ur opinion. He is basically a Joker/Lex Luthor hybrid and that is why I love him so much! XD But not in this story...
So glad this story was fixed more recently and Osborn was not actually with Gwen ^^
Aah my first episode of back issues that made me instantly a fan of this channel and made me subscribe after a few videos.
This story was just retconned thank god.
21:39 best build up I have ever seen.
19:35 look at the ad on the back of the comic, it's Spider Man 2, one of the, if not, the greatest Spider Man films and on the same plane as the absolute worst Spider Man story
Oh my god its happening. Its really happening. This is the one comic that made me angry. I couldn't even think about Gwen Stacey because I would just get pissed off at this MADNESS! WTF IS THIS INSANITY?!? WHy would you do this?? Goodness the woman is already dead! WHY WOULD YOU PERVERT HER LIFE?!? ANIMALS! Animals I say!
Thanks for doing this book btw guys. Just started the video and I already know its gonna be hilarious lol
Now I can't rewatch Captain America without thinking that somewhere there is a picture of the general banging Gwen Stacy...
Did I miss something? I don't remember him ever saying anything about that.....
In the video they said Osborn looks like tommy lee jones the same actor in the captain america movie who played the general
Shadow Gabriel you son of a bitch.
They finally retconned this crap!
Sees episode number: Nice.
Listens to literally any element of this plot: Gross.
One particular detail that's a retcon from Sins Past is whether or not Peter & Gwen did it. In this story arc they had him specifically say that they never did, but in comic issues that came out when she was still alive & they were going out, it's heavily implied that they did do it. One particular example (back when the Spider Sense wasn't yet established to go off for danger, but for external stimuli as well) is when at the end of an issue when Gwen & Peter are having an intimate moment in his bedroom at night as it seems that more will be happening before the final panel is a skyline view beyond their building & it has Peter's Spider Sense tingling as an obvious euphemism for what they were clearly doing.
21:31 was priceless lol.... That was pretty much my same reaction when I read that book 3 months ago and the only thing I can say to myself was Damn and I thought One more day ruined Spiderman for me but I think this takes the cake
Spiderman Let there be Retcons
Now I want to see you guys do Mark Millar's Marvel Knights Spider-man
The zoom in on tiff and ben's faces was classic😂😂😂
I started watching your videos thanks to the weekly pull podcast. Since I discovered back issues I havent stopped laughing with you guys. Close-ups are hilarious and the screenshots of the issues are cool too. Keep it up!
Sal’s demeanour at the beginning of his explanation of the story feels like a parent about to tell their kids what REALLY happend to their grandpa
The reason no one retcons it, is that they’d have to acknowledge it exists first, which almost feels worse than it being canon.
11-year old me: "Oh golly, jee whiz! A comic book with awesome art! I can't wait to see how cool the fight scenes look!"
Me starting down the rabbit hole that is the story of Spider-Man's girlfriend getting seduced, banged, knocked up, and killed by the Green Goblin: "Well, this sure won't give me trust issues or warped views of relationships in the future!"
Been with you guys since like 6,000-7,000 subs I don't remember but I'm so proud of you guys
Thankfully this isn't canon anymore
@Joker He means the whole "Gwen bangs Norman Osborn" thing isn't canon anymore, since it didn't actually happen.
@Joker it actually never happened, it was Mysterio all along
Tiffany's reactions to this story are the perfect reactions that anybody could have.
how I love Tiff's face when she's reading that page where Norman does that :P
What kind of sick twisted story is this we’re in dire need of a retcon
Been rewatching these in order and Ive made it all the way to sins past! So ready for the ridiculousness
Oh and trust me guys....you don't want a female Goblin.... *looks at Menace*
Menace was probably the worst villain to come out of _Brand New Day_ (and that is saying something).
When this was uploaded, I lost my mind and it stayed in my head for the rest of the day
To be fair, JMS has said that he never wanted to make those kids Norman's, editorial made him do that. And considering the...choices that editorial made around that time, I'm inclined to believe him
I think Aunt May is played by Clint Eastwood.
I've been listening to the old Spider-Man back issues while I am in isolation and boy oh boy am I glad they FINALLY retconned this.
Thank GOD for this video guys, as a kid I had this really cool Spiderman encyclopedia I got from a book fair and it had character bios from the 60's till like 05? And I remember reading the Stacy Twins profile and seeing the Gray Goblin and thinking he looked SO COOL, and I always wanted to collect the story he was in. HOLY SHIT am I glad I never got the books.
By God. I'd heard about this story, but I never dreamed it would be this awful! Smhhh
The way I originally got into comic characters was just reading wikis. I remember reading about this on one of those, reading “Gwen had kids with Norman Osborn” weird, but maybe they could redeem something. Seeing Gwen having sex with Norman Osborn... ewww, we should fire whoever thought this was a good idea.
Wow this has absolutely ruined my whole view on like life, I didn't see that whole Gwen/ Osborne thing coming in what mind set was that a good idea? I will now nap and restart and try to forget that this was an actual thing.
I was looking for the back issues episode 69, i was not disappointed.
Sal are you going to do a Back Issues of Back in Black? 'cause you said that you are going to do one of One More Day
MAKE IT STOP! MAKE IT STOOOOOOOOOP!!!!!!!!!!! 😭
Love the long form videos. Keep up the awesome work!
This was one of the first comics i had ever bought...i regret it every day
Ben's explosion of rage is more sincere than Peter's in the comic.
Just wanna say, RUclips currently says this video contains no mature content, and that is hilarious
This needs a retcon badly
Marvel Entertainment has editors, don’t they? Because I have yet to hear about them preventing terrible stories from happening.
They keep putting them in the credits for some reason.
Wow, I have lost all kinds of respect for whoever at Marvel made those editorial decisions... AND Straczynski's writing skills...
P.S. Sal's one word reactions (at the 38 minute mark) as he flips through the individual issues is PRICELESS!
***** Thats a shame, cause I used to think Quesada could do no wrong...
crunson2000 yeah that reaction at the 38 min is great
Course this has to be ep. 69
My mombrought home the1st part of this back when it cam out. The cover made her think "This looked important, thought you might want it."
If they made Gabriel and Sarah actually Peter's kids and made Norman take the kids and raise them to hate Spiderman and think he killed Gwen then this story would be better.
if only they did
Sins past was referenced as an offhand remark by deadpool in an issue of the spider man/ deadpool series. Spideys reaction sells it.
Okay, now I need you to tell me the issue number pls.
2:50 Casting
I have to know was the fade to black and white with the slow motion in the middle of the video made to spoof a soup opera since Sin Past reads like a terrible soup opera?
Please somebody tell me this isn't in continuity anymore.