As a working student at the Kentucky Horse Park (1993), I groomed Forego. It was only later that I realized I was sharing space with royalty. Very large, often mean royalty. He taught me to grow eyes in the back of my head. Now, I see all horses as royalty. He was a good teacher. I miss him.
According to The Bloodhorse "U.S. Top 100 Racehorses of the 20th. Century" Forego is ranked in # 8 posición. 57 starts, 34 wins, 9 seconds, 3 thirds and U.S. $ 1.938.957,00 earned. Forego won eight Eclipse Awards, including "Horse of the Year" in 1974, 1975 and 1976 "Champion Handicap Horse" and "Champion Sprinter" 👍
Absolutely brilliant horse who peaked later in his career. I remember all those handicap races where Forego was carrying maximum weight and mowing down all opposition down the stretch. A monster and among the greatest thoroughbreds of all time.
Randy Bailin ; I was at Hialeah when he ran his first race a maiden special and since he was a first time starter I watched just him the whole race and let me tell you when he came down the stretch and made a move at the eight pole I had been watching horses run for over 20 years but NEVER in all those years did I ever see a horse stride so powerfully!! Although he finished I believe 4th, I turned to my dad and said “ this horse will some day be GREAT!!! “ And I told my dad that next time he runs I’m going to make a big bet on him. And he won with ease in his next start and at 5/2! One of the great ones!! Al
Yet Man O'War was 2 seconds off Secretariat's time, under MUCH more weight, on sub-standard surfaces with substandard track equipment (back then) with NO starting gate and NO digital timers! At all distances.
watchgoose Your response is biased and isn’t researched well. It’s also very off topic for a forego video. It seems you omit some key details that purposely make MOW look better. I feel the need to clarify some things. 1. Secretariat ran faster than just 2 seconds ahead of man o’ war at many distances. 1 1/8, 1 3/16, and 1 1/2 are a few examples in which he was over 3 seconds faster than Man O’ War. 2. Much more weight isn’t exactly true. Man O’ war did carry 138 lbs once, but that was 1 1/16 in a rather slow 1:44 4/5, and if you average all of the weight carried by man o’ way and secretariat carried during their track record performances, you get man o’ way: 125.1 lbs, secretariat: 124.8 lbs. only .3 difference, not “a lot more” 3 of man o’ wars record performances were carrying 118, 118, and 120 pounds, which is pounds which is less than the least weight secretariat carried in his track record performances (121 pounds). 3. You mentioned “sub standard” surfaces. Well, if you did your homework you would know that 5 of man o’ war’s 8 records were set at either Belmont or Saratoga that year, and both tracks were recently resurfaced. Saratoga in 1918 and Belmont in 1919. This, times were extremely fast compared to ones in years previous. So they weren’t sub standard at all. They were some of the fastest tracks at the time, and many records were broken in the 20s at those tracks. Still slower than 1973 Belmont track, I’ll give you that; but experts say only about a full second per 1 1/2 miles. Secretariat ran 2:24 flat 1 1/2 and MOW ran 2:28 4/5, which is close to 5 seconds or roughly 24 lengths. 3. You also mentioned equipment. The only really sub standard thing was steel horse shoes vs aluminum. Besides that, there’s nothing else. 4. No starting can can be an advantage and disadvantage. An advantage in that it can give a horse a straighter start. A disadvantage being they can hit the gate when they break and cause a minor or major injury. Ruffian being a prime example. 5. No digital timers can yet again be a disadvantage. It means that some of MOW’s races could’ve been timed too fast. Judging by some of his times, that might be the case. It’s very unlikely that some of his races were timed too slow. Though secretariat’s 1973 Preakness was!
Forego was without a doubt one helluva horse. He carried high weights like it was the thing to do. I saw him run 4 times and I can truly say I was amazed everytime he ran. Greatest handicap champion I ever saw.
@@kenkal1829 FOREGO'S list OF competition took a backseat to NO ONE. Not to forget a wealth of future sires that had fallen to defeat to the big hearted overwhelmingly beloved 8 time Eclipse Award Champion FOREGO.
@@makingthecoin3647 No doubt Forego was a champ! I was too small when Kelso raced but I have vivid memories of Forego! Raced 57 starts 50 in the money, fantastic! He won $1,938,000 in 5 years of racing 1973 -77. Kelso won $1,977,000 in 6 years of racing 1960-65. No doubt they were the best years in racing!! Today horses who are of any ability and win a classic race or two go straight to the breeding shed. It's why we will never see REAL racehorses like them again!!
@@kenkal1829 GREAT TO HEAR FROM YOU. I NEVER SAW KELSO BUT I STILL HAVE HIM AHEAD OF MY FAVORITE AS A KID FOREGO. BUT NO QUESTION THEY BOTH ARE IN THE TOP TEN. BUT I WOULD LIKE TO STAY CLEAR OF JUST COMPARING GELDINGS ETC. RACEHORSE IS A RACEHORSE. THAT IS WHY BOTH IN MY OPINION WERE GREATER THAN SOME TRIPLE CROWN WINNERS ALSO. I REMEMBER MY DAD BROUGHT FOREGO TO MY ATTENTION AS A KID AND THEN TOLD ME STORIES ABOUT KELSO TOO.
Forego won the 1976 Marlboro Cup at 1 1/4 miles, carrying 137 lbs, on a sloppy track, and won in 2:00 flat, only a fraction off of Secretariat's world record for that distance. Wow! Secretariat carried 126 lbs on a fast track. Not comparing the two...just saying. Give the Mighty Forego his due.
@@roundtable3501 Forego did more than Secretariat, and had greater longevity than him because Secretariat was retired after his three year old season. Forego was a gelding as well so there was no pending stud duty. Secretariat did carry weight in training, habitually carrying 130 to 132. In fact, while training for the Whitney, he put down a time that would have set a track record....in the mud. Laurin thought he could win with 140 on him. It's a shame he never got a chance to prove it.
GOD BLESS THE BELOVED FOREGO. HOW WONDERFUL ON THE DAY HE WAS ON THE TRACK TO SHOWCASE HIMSELF SEATTLE SLEW AND AFFIRMED WERE ALSO ON THE TRACK AND GUESS WHO RECEIVED THE LARGEST AND WARMEST CHEERS.
Forego was carrying as much as Pharlap did. Sign of a truly great horse .Poor Pharlap was made to carry 149 pounds ( 68 kilograms ) in the 1931 Melbourne Cup. He also won in a track winning time , carrying 129 pounds ( 58.5 kilograms ) .
I really loved Secretariat but Forego was my sentimental favorite horse of all time. Here's a thought - it's the early 1970's and Forego and Zenyatta happen to be born at that time. Imagine if Forego had been bred with Zenyatta before he was gelded of course - holy moly what a horse that would have produced!
I was at The Meadowlands when DR.Patches beat Seattle Slew and I had DR. Patches But the only horse in my opinion who comes close to Forego is Zenyatta who ironically is his niece. Talk about Bloodlines.
@@jackiebonds4359 lucky you ,vi galloped that spring at Tartan Farms before heading west to join then boyfriend Larry Barrera was at La Jolla when I saw on the news of Seattle Slew s defeat at the Meadowlands
Partymanners, I've never seen this, thank you so much. Forego was and will always be my favorite; the greatest race career of any horse I have had a pleasure of witnessing (Kelso was a little before me). "The Mighty Forego" indeed.
Go look up kelso and, make sure you're sitting down. Kelso only weighed about 900 pounds and, carried 12pct of his body weight. He beat more great and, good horses among them more champions and, international champions, more hall of famers than any other racehorse of all-times which for which alone makes him a hell of a candidate for being the greatest racehorse of all times. He is the only horse to be horse of the year 5 times and, in a row, and, he was beating good 3 year olds that were in the 5 triple crown races giving away weight to them, beating older horses, meanwhile he won the 2 mile jockey gold cup those same 5 years breaking the record twice on two sloppy tracks and, holding the 3 fastest timmings for it!!!! The last time he won the 2 mile jockey gold cup, he was 7 years old when they're not at their best and, he broke his own record at 3:19 1/5 on a sloppy track on dirt then just 11 days later, which no other horse has ever done, goes and, breaks the record on grass at 1 mile and a half at none other than the dc international againts some of the best horses in the world does 2:23 4/5 on 3 tight turns which are way harder than the 2 huge sweeping turns secretariat had at belmont, and, does the last quarter in 23 secounds 4/5, faster than he does the first quarter. Amazing being that they gotta slow down for those tight turns and, then pick up speed again!!!! Only 3 horses ever won the whitney, the woodward and, the jockey gold cup in the same year and, kelso's the only horse to pull that stunt 2 times!!!!!!!!!!!! Secretariat didn't win one of those, lost at the whitney and, got his butt kicked at the woodward by prove out whom he never raced again and, ducked prove out in the 2 mile jockey gold cup and, wisely cause prove out became the 2nd fastest horse to win the jockey at 3:20 flat at the 4th fastest timing for it after the great kelso who holds the 3 fastest timings for it breaking the record twice on 2 sloppy tracks! Only 4 horses have ever win the handicap triple and, some experts say it's even harder than the regular triple crown cause they gotta give away weight[handicap] and, kelso is the only of the 4 to ever win that carrying over 130 pounds and, up to 136 pounds, in ne race giving 20 pounds to the runner up! When kelso won the handicap triple crown also won the whitney, the woodward and, the 2 mile jockey gold cup, becoming the only horse to ever to put that package together in one year!!!!!!!!!! He also beat 5 horses that had won triple crown races, a number of 12 times in his carrear!!!!! I know forego had a bad leg but, he was also a big horse who was 17.2 hands and, weighed about 1, 200 pounds and was soppose to carry alot of weight yet kelso who was 16 hands even and, weighed about 900 pounds carried 12pct of his body weight, that was more than big forego! Oh, and, it wasn't like kelso was always a sound horse, he suffered from colic pains all his life and, they say he died from that. Forego is no doubt one of the all-time greats but, he falls short with the deer looking kelso who didn't even look like a killer and, yet was carrying all that weight. Funny most of the horses he beat he was giving away weight to them and, most of the horses he lost to he was also giving away weight to. Kelso was and, is the greatest racehorse of all-times and, it's not even close. You got some that were good at sprinting like Fager but never even ran 1 mile and, a half never mind 2 miles, kelso was good at all distances and, proved it all. 'ONCE UPON A TIME THERE WAS A HORSE NAMED KELSO BUT, ONLY ONCE'. KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
@@teddylopez747 Your wife must be jealous. Man you present a compellingly good argument.... but did Kelso come from way back the way Forego did routinely? That is what's so thrilling and shows such heart. And too bad they couldn't go up against one another pushing each other to the finish... that would be amazing. Hey futuristic software might tell you the outcome odds. But in your mind nothings close.... better check on the wifey, she may be packing her bags to go see her sister?
My favorite racehorse of all time. He was different then other horses in that he wasn't particularly graceful when he ran. However, what you sensed when you watched him race was just pure power and an indomitable will to win. In view of the top weights that he carried over his long successful career he was very likely the strongest thoroughbred ever to step on a race track.
spa747 Well said. He wasn't graceful because he was unsound. Hours of his day were spent standing in ice, and having his groom run cold water from a hose over his legs. This makes his career all the more impressive...he overcame pain & the 'weight' racing secretaries burdened him with. He beat the best, when he himself wasn't at his best...
Stan Jensen Yes - I've read about Frank Whitely his trainer hosing water on his legs for hours on end which prolonged his career. In most of his races Forego liked to run on the outside which when you think about it meant that he had to cover more ground than horses that rode near the rail which makes his accomplishments that more impressive.
Forego was 17.2 hands and weighed about 1,200 pounds so he was soppose to carrying big weight. Kelso made it to 16 hands even when he was 4 years old and, weighed only 900 pounds and, was still carrying 12pct of his body weight. Kelso for his size pound for pound was carrying more weight than forego. Forego had a bad leg they say and, they use to have to water him down at times, I'll consider that but then again kelso wasn't the soundest horse neither. Kelso suffered form colic pain most of his life and sopposedly died form that. One of the all-time greats forego but he falls short like all of them do with the great kelso who looked like a deer and, was still carrying all that weight. Kelso was and, is the greatest racehorse of all-times. KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
@@watchgoose Yah, I know. Kelso was and, is the greatest racehorse of all-times. I have trouble believing some of the things that only he's ever done. He was and, is the greatest racehorse of all-times. It's not even close. KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
Saw his first race and told everyone that altho finishing 4th I never in my life saw such strides coming into the stretch and predicted fame and fortune. And carrying such weight 135-137 and being able to win at short and long distances puts him in the top 5 greatest thoroughbred horses of all time! Al
what a horse!!! too bad we'll never see the likes of forego or other great horses of racing's past due to the lack of soundness of today's breed. Gotta give the california chrome people credit for still racing him when all of the recent champs are retired to stud after 8-9 lifetime races... PITY.
Entirely financial. Chrome is not an attractive stallion prospect to many and they calculated they could make more money racing than breeding him (and they did). Stallions such as American Pharoah were worth too much at stud to keep racing them past three (Secretariat too).
Hi there, great little feature! Just wondering if this was shown on an NYRA documentary as I have LEGENDS of the TURF plus another one that had pretty much the same footage as LEGENDS of the TURF but also had a segment on AFFIRMED and also SECRETARIAT and I never ran into this little segment on FOREGO. Do you know where it came from...just curious as I have a huge collection myself. Thanks for your Time! K
I can't tell which tracks some of these races are on, like Forego, but there is no information about him, if you could put together some information, that would be great, otherwise I could do it myself.
Forego (30 de Abril 1970 - 27 de Agosto 1997) está ubicado cómo el número 8 en la "Lista de los 100 Más Grandes Caballos de Carrera del Siglo 20" elaborada por la Revista "The Blood Horse" y en 1979 fue exaltado al Salón de la Fama de las Carreras de Caballos en Saratoga Springs, nueva York. Saludos desde Venezuela.
Forego was one of the greats and, ran almost on 3 legs. He was a real big horsie though at 17 hands he was bigger than secretariat, man of war and, many horses and, he weighed about 1,200 pounds so, he was soppose to carry alot of weight for his size. Yet the great kelso looked like a deer and, weighed 1000 or, under that and, just made 16 hands when he was 4 and, was carrying more weight than Forego! KING KELLY was carrying 12 percent of his body weight! When they put the 3 geldings together at belmont in 1983 some people there said that kelso who was 26 years old look younger than forego who was 13! It was in kelso genes. Kelso was the great man of wars' great grandson and, he had his temper too. That is why they gelded kelso. He still was never really a nice horse they say[laugh]! Forego was one of the greats though.
Saw Kelsi to at Saratoga in 1965 , I was ten then again at his home at the DuPonts farm in Delaware he even had his own war room displaying his numerous trophies and victories
Forego's trainer, after the Derby, in which he finished fourth (behind you-know-who): "My horse will never see that big red horse's rear end again. I don't want him breaking himself down trying to catch him." Forego was a great horse, and no one who knows horse racing would say otherwise; but he wasn't as good as Secretariat.
and catch him he would... secretariat was a great horse, no one who knows horse racing (and more likely, no one who doesn't know horse racing!) would say otherwise -- a unique horse for the records he broke and holds -- however, GREATNESS is something else, a lot loftier and deeper than fractions of seconds, or even 2... kelso was greater, and forego greater than either, and as steve haskins writing in bloodhorse 'delicately' put it -- may be the most remarkable horse ever
He won races from 7f to 2m I wonder how he could have been on Grass/Turf with the All Age Triple Crown of Grass (from 1977 Grand Slam ) Man O'War, Washington International. Canadian International and (from 1977) Turf Classic at weight for age as the Sire Forli had won the Argentine Grand Slam on Dirt and Turf had grass/turf pedigree with Gainsborough and Hyperion as Forego's Grandsires
Go look up kelso and, make sure you're sitting down. Only 3 horses ever won the whitney, the woodward and, the jockey gold cup in one year, kelsos' the only horse to ever pull that stunt twice!!! Oh, and that was when the jockey gold cup was 2 miles which only kelso won 5 times and, holds the 3 fastest timings for, breaking the record 2 of those times on two sloppy tracks!!! Kelso is only 1 of 4 horses to ever win the handicap triple crown which many say was harder than the regular triple crown and, kelso of the 4 is the only horse to win all 3 races carrying over 130 pounds giving up as much as 20 pounds to a runner up! Kelso also won the whtney, the woodward and, the jockey gold cup that year[1961], making him the only horse ever to win the handicap triple crown, the whitney, the woodward and, the hardest race of all the 2 mile jockey gold cup in 1 year!!!!!!! Kelso also is the only horse to break a record on dirt and, then just 11 days later break a record on grass and, the races he did it in, he broke the record on dirt at the jockey gold cup at 3:19 1/5 and, that was on a sloppy trsck. then just 11 days later goes and, breaks the record for grass at 1 mile and, a half on 3 tight turns which are way harder than the 2 huge sweeping turns secretariat had at belmont on that fast track which he was running right by the rail from the beginning. Kelso was and, is the greatest racehore of all times and, it's not even close. He beat more great and, good horses among them champions, international champions, hall of famers, 3 year olds and, older horses, than any other racehorse of all-times and, mind you giving away as much as 20 pounds to a few of them and, most of his loses were because he was giving away weight to most of those horses! Kelso was and, is in a class all by himself. Forego was one of the greats but like all of them falls short with KING KELLY who looked like a poor deer. Not even close. Kelso was carryng 12 pct of his body weight, HELLO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
See that shot of Forgo beating our horse Dr Patches in a special condition race the racing secretary write to give Forgo a race before he jumps in stake competition but in this three horse field champion sprinter Dr Patches also fit these tuff conditions and at equal weights , Patches had the lead who didn't like the front end but like a cat toying with a mouse HOTY three times got up to beat our tall rangy gelding
Had prove out been the same age as secretariat and, the great trainer Allen Jerkens had him and, been in that triple crown, secretariat would most likely have gotten his ass kicked like at the woodward. Secretariat never raced prove out again after the woodward. They were smart not to and, go to the woodbine in canada instead. Prove out became the secound fastest horse to ever win the 2 mile jockey gold cup after the great kelso who also holds the 3 fastest timings for it breakin the record 2 of those times on 2 sloppy tracks!!! Kelso was something else. KELSOS' BGGEST FAN.
He had Sham as a rabbit. Pace Handicapping 101 says that Forego sitting off a 1 :09 .4 three-quarter split is going to have a perfect trip, meaning he didn't need to be better than Secretariat to win or run a respectable second a few lengths behind, pushing Secretariat perhaps down to 2:23
@@watchgoose Yah Einstein but do you freakin know that sec was right by the rail from the beginning of that belmont race? Which is the freakin shortest way around any track? Bingo, the rail right? Why don't you go look at the great kelso when he did 2:23 4/5 for 1 mile and a half on grass but, that was on 3 tight turns Einstein, which are way harder than those punk 2 huge sweeping turns secretariat had at belmont. I have spoken to jockeys and, you better believe those tight turns slow you down more. You gotta know how to take those turns, yet the greatest racehorseof them all kelso did the last quarter faster than he did the first quarter and, go look at the competition kelso had in that dc international of 1964, that was against some of the best horses in the world Einstein and, not like sec whos' only competiton at belmont was sham and, sham broke down and, the other two horse were bums, one had lost 20 races out of 23. Don't give me this secretatiat at belmont bullcrap greatest performance ever by a racehorse . Go look at kelso at the dc international in 64' and, how there were no starting gates because the foreign horses didn't use starting gates making even harder for the two american horses. Who the hell you kidding cheif? Get back to me and this better e good. Kelso was and, is the greatest racehorse of all-times. Go look at how he had won the 2 mile jockey gld cup at 3:19 1/5 on a sloppy track just 11 days before the dc international and, broke his won record!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No horse has ever broken a record on dirt and, then broken a record on grass just 11 days apart never mind at 7 yeas of age. Kelso broke records at 3 and, was still breaking records at 7. You don't know nothing about kelso. I speak to alot of people that way then when you tell them some of the things the great kelso did they go 'Oh sh--!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Kelso was and, is the greatest and, it's not even close doctor. KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
Teddy Lopez That makes absolutely no sense. Prove out only won 9 out of 39 starts, and ran much slower than secretariat at all 3 distances! You’re really stretching this one and yet again proving you can’t have an intellectual discussion about this. That’s like me saying that if gun bow were 3 in 1960, he would’ve kicked kelso’s butt in all 5 jockey club gold cups!
Wow, I really wanted to watch this... But the combo of the loud soundtrack & scratchy voice track made it too hard for my moderately deaf old ears to handle. Feeling sad 😢
I Really don't know who "mixes" these documentaries, But whoever does, does A Horrible "job" And Very Lousuy work. The Music Is Louder than the narrator's voice.
For all you people saying he would have given secretariat a handful then why didn’t he. Big red still owns all three race records and a world record. Talk is cheap. Look at any all time list and big red is first or at worst 2nd.
@@mikewarren1401 Yah, and, the great kelso broke records at 3 and, was still breaking records at 7! Think sec would have kept up with that? Kelso at 7 won and, broked the record again for 2 miles at 3:19 1/5 on a sloppy track and, then went just 11 days later and, broke the record on grass for 1 mile and a half on grass at 2:23 4/5 on 3 tight turns and, there were no gates used in that race! Kelso did the last quarter in 23 secounds 4/5, he did the last quarter faster than the first quarter! No horse ever broke a record on dirt and, then just 11 days later break a record on grass at all! Kelso is the greatest racehorse of all-times and, it's not even close einstein. You just don't know much about the great kelso. KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
@@teddylopez747 I am confused where is his triple crown trophy? Seriously where is it? He is a top 5 all time no doubt but make no mistake Secretariat is the goat and there really isn’t a close second. Show me one list put together by experts who have kelso number 1. Yeah didn’t think so. It’s okay you are his biggest fan but that doesn’t change the fact that Secretariat is the greatest of all time. Eddie Arcaro rode both citation and kelso and said point blank citation was hands down the better horse. It is what it is.
As a working student at the Kentucky Horse Park (1993), I groomed Forego. It was only later that I realized I was sharing space with royalty. Very large, often mean royalty. He taught me to grow eyes in the back of my head. Now, I see all horses as royalty. He was a good teacher. I miss him.
Was my favorite horse to watch! Was always exciting. And to win carrying those weights, was unreal. He was one of the greats!
Most exciting horse in history!
Whenever I watch a race and some horse goes outside, from behind, way back in the pack and is coming on strong, I yell “Forego!”
My favorite horse of all time. A late developing horse. I believe if Secretariat had raced at 4, Forego would have eaten his lunch.
jack young we New Yorkers loved him so much. Forego was great in 75 and 76 too. An epic 🐴 horse
What a great, big, powerful horse. Carrying all that weight and winning without saving any ground. All those races and won over half of them.
According to The Bloodhorse "U.S. Top 100 Racehorses of the 20th. Century" Forego is ranked in # 8 posición. 57 starts, 34 wins, 9 seconds, 3 thirds and U.S. $ 1.938.957,00 earned. Forego won eight Eclipse Awards, including "Horse of the Year" in 1974, 1975 and 1976 "Champion Handicap Horse" and "Champion Sprinter" 👍
Was so thrilling to watch, he won over your heart with his, he was simply unmatched and amazing.
Absolutely brilliant horse who peaked later in his career. I remember all those handicap races where Forego was carrying maximum weight and mowing down all opposition down the stretch. A monster and among the greatest thoroughbreds of all time.
Randy Bailin ; I was at Hialeah when he ran his first race a maiden special and since he was a first time starter I watched just him the whole race and let me tell you when he came down the stretch and made a move at the eight pole I had been watching horses run for over 20 years but NEVER in all those years did I ever see a horse stride so powerfully!! Although he finished I believe 4th, I turned to my dad and said “ this horse will some day be GREAT!!! “ And I told my dad that next time he runs I’m going to make a big bet on him. And he won with ease in his next start and at 5/2!
One of the great ones!!
Al
Yet Man O'War was 2 seconds off Secretariat's time, under MUCH more weight, on sub-standard surfaces with substandard track equipment (back then) with NO starting gate and NO digital timers! At all distances.
Forego set the 7F track record at Belmont by going 1:20.1 with 139 pounds on his back. Secretariat would have had his hands full in the Belmont.
Ray Gordon Teaches Chess
That wasn’t forego. That was Dr. Fager at Aqueduct in 1968.
watchgoose
Your response is biased and isn’t researched well. It’s also very off topic for a forego video. It seems you omit some key details that purposely make MOW look better. I feel the need to clarify some things.
1. Secretariat ran faster than just 2 seconds ahead of man o’ war at many distances. 1 1/8, 1 3/16, and 1 1/2 are a few examples in which he was over 3 seconds faster than Man O’ War.
2. Much more weight isn’t exactly true. Man O’ war did carry 138 lbs once, but that was 1 1/16 in a rather slow 1:44 4/5, and if you average all of the weight carried by man o’ way and secretariat carried during their track record performances, you get man o’ way: 125.1 lbs, secretariat: 124.8 lbs. only .3 difference, not “a lot more” 3 of man o’ wars record performances were carrying 118, 118, and 120 pounds, which is pounds which is less than the least weight secretariat carried in his track record performances (121 pounds).
3. You mentioned “sub standard” surfaces. Well, if you did your homework you would know that 5 of man o’ war’s 8 records were set at either Belmont or Saratoga that year, and both tracks were recently resurfaced. Saratoga in 1918 and Belmont in 1919. This, times were extremely fast compared to ones in years previous. So they weren’t sub standard at all. They were some of the fastest tracks at the time, and many records were broken in the 20s at those tracks. Still slower than 1973 Belmont track, I’ll give you that; but experts say only about a full second per 1 1/2 miles. Secretariat ran 2:24 flat 1 1/2 and MOW ran 2:28 4/5, which is close to 5 seconds or roughly 24 lengths.
3. You also mentioned equipment. The only really sub standard thing was steel horse shoes vs aluminum. Besides that, there’s nothing else.
4. No starting can can be an advantage and disadvantage. An advantage in that it can give a horse a straighter start. A disadvantage being they can hit the gate when they break and cause a minor or major injury. Ruffian being a prime example.
5. No digital timers can yet again be a disadvantage. It means that some of MOW’s races could’ve been timed too fast. Judging by some of his times, that might be the case. It’s very unlikely that some of his races were timed too slow. Though secretariat’s 1973 Preakness was!
Forego was without a doubt one helluva horse. He carried high weights like it was the thing to do. I saw him run 4 times and I can truly say I was amazed everytime he ran. Greatest handicap champion I ever saw.
you never saw Kelso, compare thier race charts!!!!
You never saw Kelso!! 5 time horse of the year and it will never happen again!
@@kenkal1829 FOREGO'S list OF competition took a backseat to NO ONE. Not to forget a wealth of future sires that had fallen to defeat to the big hearted overwhelmingly beloved 8 time Eclipse Award Champion FOREGO.
@@makingthecoin3647 No doubt Forego was a champ! I was too small when Kelso raced but I have vivid memories of Forego! Raced 57 starts 50 in the money, fantastic! He won $1,938,000 in 5 years of racing 1973 -77. Kelso won $1,977,000 in 6 years of racing 1960-65. No doubt they were the best years in racing!! Today horses who are of any ability and win a classic race or two go straight to the breeding shed. It's why we will never see REAL racehorses like them again!!
@@kenkal1829 GREAT TO HEAR FROM YOU. I NEVER SAW KELSO BUT I STILL HAVE HIM AHEAD OF MY FAVORITE AS A KID FOREGO. BUT NO QUESTION THEY BOTH ARE IN THE TOP TEN. BUT I WOULD LIKE TO STAY CLEAR OF JUST COMPARING GELDINGS ETC. RACEHORSE IS A RACEHORSE. THAT IS WHY BOTH IN MY OPINION WERE GREATER THAN SOME TRIPLE CROWN WINNERS ALSO. I REMEMBER MY DAD BROUGHT FOREGO TO MY ATTENTION AS A KID AND THEN TOLD ME STORIES ABOUT KELSO TOO.
Forego one of the best handicap horse of all times
Yep. Right up there with Whirlaway and Exterminator
Forego won the 1976 Marlboro Cup at 1 1/4 miles, carrying 137 lbs, on a sloppy track, and won in 2:00 flat, only a fraction off of Secretariat's world record for that distance. Wow! Secretariat carried 126 lbs on a fast track. Not comparing the two...just saying. Give the Mighty Forego his due.
@@roundtable3501 Forego did more than Secretariat, and had greater longevity than him because Secretariat was retired after his three year old season. Forego was a gelding as well so there was no pending stud duty. Secretariat did carry weight in training, habitually carrying 130 to 132. In fact, while training for the Whitney, he put down a time that would have set a track record....in the mud. Laurin thought he could win with 140 on him. It's a shame he never got a chance to prove it.
GOD BLESS THE BELOVED FOREGO. HOW WONDERFUL ON THE DAY HE WAS ON THE TRACK TO SHOWCASE HIMSELF SEATTLE SLEW AND AFFIRMED WERE ALSO ON THE TRACK AND GUESS WHO RECEIVED THE LARGEST AND WARMEST CHEERS.
Forego my favorite of all time and his niece, Zenyatta, my second favorite of all time.
He lived to 27. Earned that charmed life!!
Certainly a terrific horse. Capper or not, he ran like a stallion to me.
Forego was carrying as much as Pharlap did. Sign of a truly great horse .Poor Pharlap was made to carry 149 pounds ( 68 kilograms ) in the 1931 Melbourne Cup. He also won in a track winning time , carrying 129 pounds ( 58.5 kilograms ) .
What a horse.he was my favorite behind secretariat and Ruffian.Affirmed was close
Love all the great horses that Forgo beat.
Thank you, this is wonderful!
Three times horse of the year is pretty impressive!
The Look of Eagles!! Such a pleasure to see💞💞💞💞💞💞
He had one move and it was Magnificent
I really loved Secretariat but Forego was my sentimental favorite horse of all time. Here's a thought - it's the early 1970's and Forego and Zenyatta happen to be born at that time. Imagine if Forego had been bred with Zenyatta before he was gelded of course - holy moly what a horse that would have produced!
Watching Forego in these races, he reminded me of Zenyatta coming from way behind to win.
Why was he gelded? They missed out on a lot of money right there
@@PhoenixAscending The information I have read over the years was that when Forego was young he was a tough unruly horse who had a bad disposition.
FOREGO! Stick-to-itivity! GREAT horse! 👌🙏🙌👏👏👏👏👏
I've named MYSELF Secretariat! This is my 50th year LOVING JESUS! I'm coming HOME WAY ahead of the rest of the field! HALLELUJAH! 🙏🙌👏💞
Amazing horse. Gonna have to get the book
Hialeah , I was there and saw many of these great races in person back in the day ! Rode Dr. Patches , 2nd to the big horse at equal weights
April Doornbo
I was at The Meadowlands when DR.Patches beat Seattle Slew and I had DR. Patches But the only horse in my opinion who comes close to Forego is Zenyatta who ironically is his niece. Talk about Bloodlines.
What happened to Hialeah? Why did it close?
@@jackiebonds4359 lucky you ,vi galloped that spring at Tartan Farms before heading west to join then boyfriend Larry Barrera was at La Jolla when I saw on the news of Seattle Slew s defeat at the Meadowlands
@@richbrake9910 bad neighborhood and Hurricane Andrew
Saw him at the Kentucky Horse Park back in 1989. Great horse.
Saw him there too - in '82.
Partymanners, I've never seen this, thank you so much. Forego was and will always be my favorite; the greatest race career of any horse I have had a pleasure of witnessing (Kelso was a little before me). "The Mighty Forego" indeed.
Kelso was the greatest of them all, go look him up and make sure you're sitting down and wearing a selt belt. KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
Go look up kelso and, make sure you're sitting down. Kelso only weighed about 900 pounds and, carried 12pct of his body weight. He beat more great and, good horses among them more champions and, international champions, more hall of famers than any other racehorse of all-times which for which alone makes him a hell of a candidate for being the greatest racehorse of all times. He is the only horse to be horse of the year 5 times and, in a row, and, he was beating good 3 year olds that were in the 5 triple crown races giving away weight to them, beating older horses, meanwhile he won the 2 mile jockey gold cup those same 5 years breaking the record twice on two sloppy tracks and, holding the 3 fastest timmings for it!!!! The last time he won the 2 mile jockey gold cup, he was 7 years old when they're not at their best and, he broke his own record at 3:19 1/5 on a sloppy track on dirt then just 11 days later, which no other horse has ever done, goes and, breaks the record on grass at 1 mile and a half at none other than the dc international againts some of the best horses in the world does 2:23 4/5 on 3 tight turns which are way harder than the 2 huge sweeping turns secretariat had at belmont, and, does the last quarter in 23 secounds 4/5, faster than he does the first quarter. Amazing being that they gotta slow down for those tight turns and, then pick up speed again!!!! Only 3 horses ever won the whitney, the woodward and, the jockey gold cup in the same year and, kelso's the only horse to pull that stunt 2 times!!!!!!!!!!!! Secretariat didn't win one of those, lost at the whitney and, got his butt kicked at the woodward by prove out whom he never raced again and, ducked prove out in the 2 mile jockey gold cup and, wisely cause prove out became the 2nd fastest horse to win the jockey at 3:20 flat at the 4th fastest timing for it after the great kelso who holds the 3 fastest timings for it breaking the record twice on 2 sloppy tracks! Only 4 horses have ever win the handicap triple and, some experts say it's even harder than the regular triple crown cause they gotta give away weight[handicap] and, kelso is the only of the 4 to ever win that carrying over 130 pounds and, up to 136 pounds, in ne race giving 20 pounds to the runner up! When kelso won the handicap triple crown also won the whitney, the woodward and, the 2 mile jockey gold cup, becoming the only horse to ever to put that package together in one year!!!!!!!!!! He also beat 5 horses that had won triple crown races, a number of 12 times in his carrear!!!!! I know forego had a bad leg but, he was also a big horse who was 17.2 hands and, weighed about 1, 200 pounds and was soppose to carry alot of weight yet kelso who was 16 hands even and, weighed about 900 pounds carried 12pct of his body weight, that was more than big forego! Oh, and, it wasn't like kelso was always a sound horse, he suffered from colic pains all his life and, they say he died from that. Forego is no doubt one of the all-time greats but, he falls short with the deer looking kelso who didn't even look like a killer and, yet was carrying all that weight. Funny most of the horses he beat he was giving away weight to them and, most of the horses he lost to he was also giving away weight to. Kelso was and, is the greatest racehorse of all-times and, it's not even close. You got some that were good at sprinting like Fager but never even ran 1 mile and, a half never mind 2 miles, kelso was good at all distances and, proved it all. 'ONCE UPON A TIME THERE WAS A HORSE NAMED KELSO BUT, ONLY ONCE'. KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
@@teddylopez747 Your wife must be jealous. Man you present a compellingly good argument.... but did Kelso come from way back the way Forego did routinely? That is what's so thrilling and shows such heart. And too bad they couldn't go up against one another pushing each other to the finish... that would be amazing. Hey futuristic software might tell you the outcome odds. But in your mind nothings close.... better check on the wifey, she may be packing her bags to go see her sister?
You're very welcome.. glad you enjoyed it.
A great champion!
James Kilcoyne
Agreed!
My favorite racehorse of all time. He was different then other horses in that he wasn't particularly graceful when he ran. However, what you sensed when you watched him race was just pure power and an indomitable will to win. In view of the top weights that he carried over his long successful career he was very likely the strongest thoroughbred ever to step on a race track.
spa747 Well said. He wasn't graceful because he was unsound. Hours of his day were spent standing in ice, and having his groom run cold water from a hose over his legs. This makes his career all the more impressive...he overcame pain & the 'weight' racing secretaries burdened him with. He beat the best, when he himself wasn't at his best...
Stan Jensen Yes - I've read about Frank Whitely his trainer hosing water on his legs for hours on end which prolonged his career. In most of his races Forego liked to run on the outside which when you think about it meant that he had to cover more ground than horses that rode near the rail which makes his accomplishments that more impressive.
Forego was 17.2 hands and weighed about 1,200 pounds so he was soppose to carrying big weight. Kelso made it to 16 hands even when he was 4 years old and, weighed only 900 pounds and, was still carrying 12pct of his body weight. Kelso for his size pound for pound was carrying more weight than forego. Forego had a bad leg they say and, they use to have to water him down at times, I'll consider that but then again kelso wasn't the soundest horse neither. Kelso suffered form colic pain most of his life and sopposedly died form that. One of the all-time greats forego but he falls short like all of them do with the great kelso who looked like a deer and, was still carrying all that weight. Kelso was and, is the greatest racehorse of all-times. KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
Kelso also showed as a hunter/jumper after retiring from racing.
@@watchgoose Yah, I know. Kelso was and, is the greatest racehorse of all-times. I have trouble believing some of the things that only he's ever done. He was and, is the greatest racehorse of all-times. It's not even close. KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
What a kick he has in his races, unbelievable.
Saw his first race and told everyone that altho finishing 4th I never in my life saw such strides coming into the stretch and predicted fame and fortune.
And carrying such weight 135-137 and being able to win at short and long distances puts him in the top 5 greatest thoroughbred horses of all time!
Al
Whata super handicap horse,all that weight ,never another one like him trust me
i miss the mighty forego i miss 70s racing
what a horse!!! too bad we'll never see the likes of forego or other great horses of racing's past due to the lack of soundness of today's breed. Gotta give the california chrome people credit for still racing him when all of the recent champs are retired to stud after 8-9 lifetime races... PITY.
Entirely financial. Chrome is not an attractive stallion prospect to many and they calculated they could make more money racing than breeding him (and they did). Stallions such as American Pharoah were worth too much at stud to keep racing them past three (Secretariat too).
Mr. Prospector turned out to be the best sire from 1973's three year-old crop. Forego, of course, was a gelding.
Hi there, great little feature! Just wondering if this was shown on an NYRA documentary as I have LEGENDS of the TURF plus another one that had pretty much the same footage as LEGENDS of the TURF but also had a segment on AFFIRMED and also SECRETARIAT and I never ran into this little segment on FOREGO. Do you know where it came from...just curious as I have a huge collection myself. Thanks for your Time! K
I love forego I was there on forego day
I can't tell which tracks some of these races are on, like Forego, but there is no information about him, if you could put together some information, that would be great, otherwise I could do it myself.
The “Freight Train”
I'm so happy that ea horse has to carry an equal amt of weight now! Also, kudos to one of the greatest trainers ever, Frank Whiteley! RIP Frank
I am sure his heart was big❤❤❤
Forego (30 de Abril 1970 - 27 de Agosto 1997) está ubicado cómo el número 8 en la "Lista de los 100 Más Grandes Caballos de Carrera del Siglo 20" elaborada por la Revista "The Blood Horse" y en 1979 fue exaltado al Salón de la Fama de las Carreras de Caballos en Saratoga Springs, nueva York. Saludos desde Venezuela.
Go Forego!
Forego was one of the greats and, ran almost on 3 legs. He was a real big horsie though at 17 hands he was bigger than secretariat, man of war and, many horses and, he weighed about 1,200 pounds so, he was soppose to carry alot of weight for his size. Yet the great kelso looked like a deer and, weighed 1000 or, under that and, just made 16 hands when he was 4 and, was carrying more weight than Forego! KING KELLY was carrying 12 percent of his body weight! When they put the 3 geldings together at belmont in 1983 some people there said that kelso who was 26 years old look younger than forego who was 13! It was in kelso genes. Kelso was the great man of wars' great grandson and, he had his temper too. That is why they gelded kelso. He still was never really a nice horse they say[laugh]! Forego was one of the greats though.
I saw him run many times , the first time was at Hialeah in1974 with True Knight in the field and many times at Belmont
Saw Kelsi to at Saratoga in 1965 , I was ten then again at his home at the DuPonts farm in Delaware he even had his own war room displaying his numerous trophies and victories
Why was it wise to retire Secretariat after his 3-year-old career: FOREGO!!!
Forego's trainer, after the Derby, in which he finished fourth (behind you-know-who): "My horse will never see that big red horse's rear end again. I don't want him breaking himself down trying to catch him." Forego was a great horse, and no one who knows horse racing would say otherwise; but he wasn't as good as Secretariat.
and catch him he would... secretariat was a great horse, no one who knows horse racing (and more likely, no one who doesn't know horse racing!) would say otherwise -- a unique horse for the records he broke and holds -- however, GREATNESS is something else, a lot loftier and deeper than fractions of seconds, or even 2... kelso was greater, and forego greater than either, and as steve haskins writing in bloodhorse 'delicately' put it -- may be the most remarkable horse ever
No , Forgo was unknown then and was a GELDING
You must be on crack to say that 😂. secretariat was retired at 3 because thats what his breeding syndicate members wanted.
He won races from 7f to 2m I wonder how he could have been on Grass/Turf with the All Age Triple Crown of Grass (from 1977 Grand Slam ) Man O'War, Washington International. Canadian International and (from 1977) Turf Classic at weight for age as the Sire Forli had won the Argentine Grand Slam on Dirt and Turf had grass/turf pedigree with Gainsborough and Hyperion as Forego's Grandsires
whata machine 131lbs ,gelding him made him a monster, 4 con, woodwards never happen again
They geld a horse if they are nasty! Gelding is supposed to calm them down. How did that make him a monster?
Go look up kelso and, make sure you're sitting down. Only 3 horses ever won the whitney, the woodward and, the jockey gold cup in one year, kelsos' the only horse to ever pull that stunt twice!!! Oh, and that was when the jockey gold cup was 2 miles which only kelso won 5 times and, holds the 3 fastest timings for, breaking the record 2 of those times on two sloppy tracks!!! Kelso is only 1 of 4 horses to ever win the handicap triple crown which many say was harder than the regular triple crown and, kelso of the 4 is the only horse to win all 3 races carrying over 130 pounds giving up as much as 20 pounds to a runner up! Kelso also won the whtney, the woodward and, the jockey gold cup that year[1961], making him the only horse ever to win the handicap triple crown, the whitney, the woodward and, the hardest race of all the 2 mile jockey gold cup in 1 year!!!!!!! Kelso also is the only horse to break a record on dirt and, then just 11 days later break a record on grass and, the races he did it in, he broke the record on dirt at the jockey gold cup at 3:19 1/5 and, that was on a sloppy trsck. then just 11 days later goes and, breaks the record for grass at 1 mile and, a half on 3 tight turns which are way harder than the 2 huge sweeping turns secretariat had at belmont on that fast track which he was running right by the rail from the beginning. Kelso was and, is the greatest racehore of all times and, it's not even close. He beat more great and, good horses among them champions, international champions, hall of famers, 3 year olds and, older horses, than any other racehorse of all-times and, mind you giving away as much as 20 pounds to a few of them and, most of his loses were because he was giving away weight to most of those horses! Kelso was and, is in a class all by himself. Forego was one of the greats but like all of them falls short with KING KELLY who looked like a poor deer. Not even close. Kelso was carryng 12 pct of his body weight, HELLO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
Go look up kelso and make sure you're sitting down, KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
@@teddylopez747 Fascinating; I'm still learning about horse racing, and this helps. I'd just assumed MOW or Secretariat were the best.
@@teddylopez747 Totally agree,
See that shot of Forgo beating our horse Dr Patches in a special condition race the racing secretary write to give Forgo a race before he jumps in stake competition but in this three horse field champion sprinter Dr Patches also fit these tuff conditions and at equal weights , Patches had the lead who didn't like the front end but like a cat toying with a mouse HOTY three times got up to beat our tall rangy gelding
Forego would have given Secretariat a run in the Belmont much like Frosted did with AP. Final time could have been 2:23.x even.
Had prove out been the same age as secretariat and, the great trainer Allen Jerkens had him and, been in that triple crown, secretariat would most likely have gotten his ass kicked like at the woodward. Secretariat never raced prove out again after the woodward. They were smart not to and, go to the woodbine in canada instead. Prove out became the secound fastest horse to ever win the 2 mile jockey gold cup after the great kelso who also holds the 3 fastest timings for it breakin the record 2 of those times on 2 sloppy tracks!!! Kelso was something else. KELSOS' BGGEST FAN.
"could have" doesn't get it done. Ron never had to touch the whip on Secretariat. He did it on his own.
He had Sham as a rabbit. Pace Handicapping 101 says that Forego sitting off a 1 :09 .4 three-quarter split is going to have a perfect trip, meaning he didn't need to be better than Secretariat to win or run a respectable second a few lengths behind, pushing Secretariat perhaps down to 2:23
@@watchgoose Yah Einstein but do you freakin know that sec was right by the rail from the beginning of that belmont race? Which is the freakin shortest way around any track? Bingo, the rail right? Why don't you go look at the great kelso when he did 2:23 4/5 for 1 mile and a half on grass but, that was on 3 tight turns Einstein, which are way harder than those punk 2 huge sweeping turns secretariat had at belmont. I have spoken to jockeys and, you better believe those tight turns slow you down more. You gotta know how to take those turns, yet the greatest racehorseof them all kelso did the last quarter faster than he did the first quarter and, go look at the competition kelso had in that dc international of 1964, that was against some of the best horses in the world Einstein and, not like sec whos' only competiton at belmont was sham and, sham broke down and, the other two horse were bums, one had lost 20 races out of 23. Don't give me this secretatiat at belmont bullcrap greatest performance ever by a racehorse . Go look at kelso at the dc international in 64' and, how there were no starting gates because the foreign horses didn't use starting gates making even harder for the two american horses. Who the hell you kidding cheif? Get back to me and this better e good. Kelso was and, is the greatest racehorse of all-times. Go look at how he had won the 2 mile jockey gld cup at 3:19 1/5 on a sloppy track just 11 days before the dc international and, broke his won record!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No horse has ever broken a record on dirt and, then broken a record on grass just 11 days apart never mind at 7 yeas of age. Kelso broke records at 3 and, was still breaking records at 7. You don't know nothing about kelso. I speak to alot of people that way then when you tell them some of the things the great kelso did they go 'Oh sh--!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Kelso was and, is the greatest and, it's not even close doctor. KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
Teddy Lopez
That makes absolutely no sense. Prove out only won 9 out of 39 starts, and ran much slower than secretariat at all 3 distances! You’re really stretching this one and yet again proving you can’t have an intellectual discussion about this. That’s like me saying that if gun bow were 3 in 1960, he would’ve kicked kelso’s butt in all 5 jockey club gold cups!
Wow, I really wanted to watch this... But the combo of the loud soundtrack & scratchy voice track made it too hard for my moderately deaf old ears to handle.
Feeling sad 😢
It was an expensive mistake to geld him. They are no horse whisper, but a bunch of impatient n greedy trainer n owners.
Also forgot John Henry
Never forgotten
I Really don't know who "mixes" these documentaries, But whoever does, does A Horrible "job" And Very Lousuy work.
The Music Is Louder than the narrator's voice.
This one had some loud music...but others I have seen are excellent. Regardless Forego was a monster..
They are largely gleaned from very old TV broadcasts. Cut them some slack.
Learn how to spell genius!
For all you people saying he would have given secretariat a handful then why didn’t he. Big red still owns all three race records and a world record. Talk is cheap. Look at any all time list and big red is first or at worst 2nd.
Because some horses are better at 4.
@@lorrainelloyd7750 Big Red running as a 4 year old. Now that’s a scary thought. He broke track and world records as a 3 year old!!!
@@mikewarren1401 Yah, and, the great kelso broke records at 3 and, was still breaking records at 7! Think sec would have kept up with that? Kelso at 7 won and, broked the record again for 2 miles at 3:19 1/5 on a sloppy track and, then went just 11 days later and, broke the record on grass for 1 mile and a half on grass at 2:23 4/5 on 3 tight turns and, there were no gates used in that race! Kelso did the last quarter in 23 secounds 4/5, he did the last quarter faster than the first quarter! No horse ever broke a record on dirt and, then just 11 days later break a record on grass at all! Kelso is the greatest racehorse of all-times and, it's not even close einstein. You just don't know much about the great kelso. KELSOS' BIGGEST FAN.
@@teddylopez747 I am confused where is his triple crown trophy? Seriously where is it? He is a top 5 all time no doubt but make no mistake Secretariat is the goat and there really isn’t a close second. Show me one list put together by experts who have kelso number 1. Yeah didn’t think so. It’s okay you are his biggest fan but that doesn’t change the fact that Secretariat is the greatest of all time. Eddie Arcaro rode both citation and kelso and said point blank citation was hands down the better horse. It is what it is.
@@mikewarren1401 Kelso won 4 consecutive Woodwards, that alone puts with the greatest of all time,