Avoiding Anime Protagonist Pitfalls
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- Опубликовано: 8 фев 2025
- Yes, I'm going to compare Naruto and YuGiOh, analyze how the stories were set up, and what they did right and wrong. I swear I have a point to all this.
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#manga #anime #shamanking #shonen #shonenjump #naruto #yugioh #dragonball
It’s not about card games, it’s about the heart of the cards.
The duelist and how they do it.
_"You mustn't forget the spleen and the liver of the cards._
_There are many organs you must put your faith in."_
@@TheArcSet What about the brain?
@@TheArcSet aaayyy a thunderpsyker quote
The heart of cards was created by the censorship group at 4soykids...
@@seanboglio3605 Incorrect. Watch the Japanese version sometime, and stop spreading misinformation and toxicity, Soyn Boglio.
You're on the right track but I actually think you missed an important part as to why Naruto kinda went down hill. The thing is, while yes Naruto wanted to become Hokage....That wasn't his REAL goal. The reason he wanted to become Hokage wasn't because he wanted to lead the village, he wanted to prove to the entire village that he was a somebody. His REAL goal was to gain acceptance by his people after they all shunned him and treated him like a monster for reasons he himself didn't understand and the thing is....He did achieve that goal....After he defeated Pain...and then the show keep going. Naruto wanted to stop being viewed as a monster and he got that but then the show kept going a lot longer. I think THAT's the real issue.
^ this. Yugioh was about the mystery of the Puzzle and the "other Yugi" and pretty much every arc revolved around establishing the mystery or solving it, and when the mystery was finally solved, they had a single climatic final battle to wrap up all of the manga's themes and it ended.
But Naruto kept going. The Pain Arc was pretty much THE climax of Naruto's character growth but the story kept going because there were still a lot of unresolved plot points, and this pretty much destroyed the pacing.
Oh hey. We made similar comments. (Except mine was way more disorganised lol) nice
You beat me to it. Thanks bro.
ok
Exactly! Naruto said it himself in the first chapter; "I'm gonna become Hokage *so that everyone will know that I'm the greatest!*" He never wanted to be Hokage, it was just the most effective way to get the treatment he wanted.
This is gonna be a fun one especially as an anime fan
same
Actually, the goal of Naruto wasn't just for the sake of being Hokage. His goal was to be accepted by everyone in the village and in order to do that, he thought he had to be the Hokage. Shippuden was to slowly change Naruto's perspective on what it really meant to be Hokage since it wasn't just about being strong and accepted but dealing with the politics and failures of his predecessors.
The Uchiha clan massacre was one of the greatest atrocities ever to have been committed in the history of the Leaf village and the person who orchestrated it went largely un-punished. What's worse, that person was considered an Elder and advisor to the Hokage himself. I guess what I'm trying to state here is that Sasuke's role was never irrelevant from the series' main goal of becoming a Hokage since the sins of the past don't just disappear until they're confronted.
Never thought about it this way. Makes a lot of sense and makes Sasuke WAY MORE bearable if you look at things like this. Awyway, thought the "SASSSSSSSKEEEEEEEE" thing went a little further than needed EVEN if I see the anime the way you described it in your last phrase. Seemed like Naruto had nothing else to do besides chasing Sasuke around most of the time... I loved Akatsuki because at least was a change of pace to be hunting down some random guys instead of going after Sasuke... Then motherfucking Saske-kun joined the Akatsuki ¬¬
This was well put and I'm a little sad as to how many people seem to hate Sasuke or consider him irrelevant to the plot. Also with regards to wanting to see Naruto become Hokage, it would have been nice to see Naruto learn how to deal with politics. Get the council on his side, meet with the various clan heads, actually learn how to govern the village and his role in dealing with, I dunno trade and commerce with other countries or villages and such. But then, it wouldn't have been as much of an action manga I guess...
One thing I noticed is that Takahashi wrote much better rivalry between Atem and Kaiba since it wasn't so cliche. Their dialogue was written beautifully in Battle City. Kaiba also was drowned in hatred and anger like Sasuke, but insted of Atem trying to be nice and friendly like any other Shonen protag would (Naruto), he gives him some much needed tough love and reality check. He told him straight up how he won't be able to defeat him with that. And even *if* Kaiba overcomes his hatred, he will still seek another thing to hate and end up in a vicious chain.
Kaiba really became a likable character in the DSOD movie. Zane on the other hand started out as a likeable character and went through Kaiba's arc in reverse and became an unbearable edge lord.
The way characters cycle through popularity is weird
Im not seeing a parallel in possibility with kaiba/atem and naruto/sasuke.
Atem was always kaibas superior wheras naruto was rarely sasukes. I dont ever remember naruto trying to be nice to sasuke. Aside from saving one another, both sasuke and naruto talked shit and disregarded one another all the way until the end.
@@solodolosolomon Not really. Naruto was submissive when he talked to Sasuke in Shippuden: he told him that they will die together and even when he tried to be more agressive, it fell on deaf ears because Naruto couldn't convey his words properly. His words never had enough substance to sway Sasuke and his arguments were pretty bullshit. I found their interactions in part 1 better because Naruto had a genuine backbone.
You might say that Naruto didn't understand Sasuke and yes, that might be true. But you don't need to understand a person to see clearly that they are making a bad mistake. Naruto never had a problem with Sasuke taking revenge, but because Sasuke was willing to give his life away for it.
Sasuke in general is type of friend you have that makes bad decisions, but it's up to you to be upfront with him and give him a reality check.
If you give Naruto and Sasuke Atem and Kaiba's dialogue in Battle City, it works much better than anything Kishi thought up.
@@kawaki4441 depends on how you see it
Sasuke was the first person Naruto’s age to show respect to him (that he noticed at least)
During the Zabuza arc, Sasuke followed Naruto’s plans without question and even nearly sacrificed his life for Naruto.
This is followed by him acknowledging Naruto as a rival.
Even if Sasuke didn’t think much about these actions, they’re what lead to Naruto being the kind of person that he is today.
Ah yes. The protag. Win every fight until they don't, and when they don't the world explodes..
I mean, jojo kills it’s mc at least twice, and only one of those is the world exploding so, it’s the world *usually* explodes
@@a70274 Jonathan doesn't count
@@matthewsmith2385 Why not? Nobody who went in blind expected that type of outcome, and so soon as well.
@@brandonadrien3476 that true rip Jonny
Or some new protag or miracle happens
This just reminded me that Yugioh is one of the most underrated Shonen and needs more love
More like dub the rest of GX and 5Ds
@@Ginko_Sakata Yeah definitely because it's so hard to find the sub in a safe way
Shounen anime protagonists fall towards this description:
"I'm a nobody weak character that wants to be the very best, like noone ever was!"
2-3 volumes later:
"I WAS SECRETLY THE SPECIAL SUPER JINCHUURIKI SLAYER HERO WIZARD PIRATE KING REINCARNATION OF GOD ALL ALONG"
That rival character: Bruh
That mentor character: Bruh
The antagonist: Bruh
This is why some series (Some shounen protags considered to be the best in their genre) stand out as "Classic" or "Masterpiece" beyond widespread fame and are objectively considered better than famous ones like Naruto or Goku. Power isn't everything. You can't just be the nobody we gotta root for while being special at the same time.
Example:
FMAB - Edward - He's not exactly the most powerful alchemist ever, and his goals in life are believable and achievable enough to root for him.
AOT - Eren - He becomes crazy powerful, but he's killable. Attack on Titan's world is one where even shit like falling rocks are enough to kill Titans. While he is special to a degree, there is no foretold prophecy that makes him special but rather it is through his own actions rather than some contrived plot bs. (I'm trying not to spoil here but manga readers will know) Besides he had an arc where he literally cries about not being special enough.
Death Note - Light - Ryuk explains to light in the very first time they met, that him finding the Death Note was an accident. he's not meant for power, but he marches forward with it in the pursuit of justice. (Death Note IS a shounen anime.)
One Piece - Luffy - He ate the fruit. Thats all. His rubber abilities aren't any stronger than anyone else who ate said fruit. He wins his fights by using his head and working with the crew.
Saitama - OPM - He's OP as hell, but it stands as an exception because alot of the time in the show is less about him fighting (Because it'll end with One Punch) and more about him as a person. He's special, and became that by working hard. He wasn't always this way, he worked hard to be strong.
It's not about the heart of the cards. Its about the player. -And whether your cards suck or not-
I only liked One Punch Man once the other characters started fighting. Saitama ending things in one punch is boring.
If you're saying goku's was like Naruto's, you're wrong because it was always hinted that Goku was special, for example, roshi took 50 years to master the kamehameha but Goku was able to do it perfectly instantly. The other characters always stated that Goku's growth and he himself was unnatural and he probably wasn't human, and it was basically confirmed when he turned into the great ape a couple times. When he was revealed to be a saiyan, it wasn't much of a shock, what *was* shocking to Goku was that he came from a race of mass murdering psychopaths. and he was weak by saiyan standards, being born with a power level of 2. And he was also a low level saiyan. That is why vegeta couldn't stand the fact Goku became stronger than him. It wasn't similar to Naruto's buff at all. Goku worked to become as strong as he is
@@thewatchersdidnothingwrong7702 I meant the similarity between Goku and Naruto is both being famous, not that Goku is special.
At least Goku makes the effort to train, and succeeds in demonstrating the "hardwork beats talent" lesson most other shows fail to do, as he's able to defeat Vegeta the prince of all saiyans.
But yeah, power keeps escalating in dragon ball to the point that the series wrote itself into a corner when only the interdimensional beings, and gods would pose a threat to Goku. That's a whole other can of worms.
@@jerichosombilon5169 I agree
@@jerichosombilon5169 But Naruto's message wasn't that "Hardwork beats talent", it was about stopping the cycle of hatred which was presented when Naruto with his hardwork changed the fate of Indra and Ashura
YEEEEEESSSSS FINALLY SOMEONE SEES THE BRILLIANT MOMENTS IN THE YUGIOH MANGA. I will always tell people to read the mangas over watching the anime because you get to see Takahashi's true intentions that aren't influenced by Konami. Sure, the card game was bs for the first-to-second part of the DM manga, and taking games extremely seriously is campy, but the writing of his characters and the conflicts felt very personalized, it was never about "the end of the world". Plus, the Pharoah wasn't a "spotlight hog badass"; he shared the role of protagonist with Yugi and received significant character development as well. All the other characters were also written better, Jounuchi being the biggest contrast to his anime counterpart. I wish Takahashi could write something else that would last as long as Yugioh did, he's such a talented man
I think you might have skimmed over the fact that saving the village was a criteria for becoming hokage because a hokage's "power level" doesn't matter as long as he is a able to keep the village safe and running on all fronts. But don't get me wrong I think you hit the notes with almost all of the points you made.
The criteria for hokage is that you need the respect of pretty the whole village and they must acknowledge your strength. Same thing applies to the leaders who ultimately decide on the next hokage. That’s why someone like Orochimaru was never picked because he didn’t gain the respect of the village and the leaders. Then again there are also other aspects to becoming Hokage
@@PlanScare Very true; although, specifically in Orochimaru's case, he had the respect of a lot of the village, just not the trust of some of it's leadership, who while they didn't know how insane the war and his feelings of powerlessness were making him, saw that he'd changed and something wasn't right
@@TheArcSet Same thing happened to Naruto where the whole world wanted him to be hokage but then the village elders and Tsunade denied it because he was to irresponsible
8:40 Actually, you're talking about the English version's wording on that scene, and I think the anime had it too. In the actual Japanese version of the manga, it wasn't that the shockwave from the attack would knock Kaiba off, it was that Kaiba was going to commit suicide if he lost. Yeah, Kaiba actually threatened Yugi with suicide by jumping off if Yugi won that duel against him. Then again, either version are still rather dark (especially the suicide version) since Kaiba would've died either way had Yugi had won his duel with him.
Also, the Yu-Gi-Oh Manga is pretty damn dark, even in the later series of Yu-Gi-Oh. And that's not including Season 0 which was incredibly dark and disturbing.
He did that on purpose because youtube these days are f**king wired
@@brox1195 While that is true about RUclips, I'm not sure why he couldn't have just hinted that the scene was "actually a 'little' dark." But then again, I'd be surprised if he DIDN'T know about that since he knows Yu-Gi-Oh wasn't always about card games. (i.e. Season 0)
I think the shockwave version impacts Yugi just a little more because it guarantees that kaiba would die if yami went through with it.
While with the suicide one, Yami can just call his bluff. Seto actually wouldn't have jumped because there's no way he'd be leaving Mokuba, but he used that tactic because he knew how soft hearted Yugi would be and took advantage of that. Simply put, Yami was confident it was a bluff, Yugi wasn't.
With the shockwave version Yugi would be thinking "Omg I was willing to kill someone"
With suicide version, he's more like. "Omg, I seriously doubted he'd jump, what if he actually did? It'd be my fault."
@@shikiira4185 Hm, true. Though I could see him actually going through with it. He's kinda mad and obsessed like that. But it could also be safe to assume he was confident in getting his way no matter which version we're talking about.
Both are still strong versions of the same scene; no doubt about that like you just mentioned.
I'd like to imagine that Kaiba was never actually in any danger, but he knew that the fact that Yugi could interpret his warning about what would happen should he attack either at face value (since Kaiba created the technology and would know what it was capable of better than Yugi) or as an insinuated threat of suicide (not unlike mafia members saying "we'd hate to see anything happen to your shop, so you should pay us for protection") would make him all the more convinced that his life really was on the line.
Fun fact: krptonite was actual made on the Superman radio show as a way to give the actors breaks and days off. They introduced kryptonite to explain why Superman couldn't do his thing that day.
They didn't add it to comics until 6yrs later
I think thats an oversimplification of naruto's plot. I think you miss the idea of what hokages are. They are not a rank that you fight through and eventually reach the level of hokage. Hokages are one of a kind, individuals that are not just stupid strong but that their existence bring something different to the way people live. If you think about it, why sasuke didnt become hokage if he is as strong as naruto ? The kage title isn't about being strong but what have you done to the world that is so crucial for you to become a hokage ? And that's the point, is not a path to become a hokage, you do amazing deeds that in the end MAYBE grant you the title. Naruto didn't forget that he wanted to become hokage, but to become wasnt about doing specific tasks, but doing things that made you worth to become hokage. It is about you personality, what people need and what you can do. That why takashi became hokage, not because he was the strongest but because in that group he was the most prepared to deal with a conflict in that scale.
Sasuke vs Naruto
"Whoever wins becomes Hokage" shouldn't have happened because by that point Naruto had alresdy gone above and beyond to prove that he deserved to be the Hokage.
@@NexusVFD completely agree. Naruto has a ton of plot holes, in no way or shape I'm saying that the anime is perfect. But the point on the video makes no sense. There isn't a test to become hokage, is your journey , motivation and what you done that will dictate if you are worth of the title. Personally, if was in the committee to decide who's gonna be hokage next, it would not matter if sasuke was stronger than naruto in the end. Here's the god that spent his life pursuing power and even fighting against us vs. The not so powerful God that through his whole life showed commitment to our community and fought hundreds of times to maintain our asses alive. It's an obvious choice that once again confirms the fact that hokage is not only the strongest but the one fitted to the political and militaristic duty he will have.
@@NexusVFD I feel that's more aline to, I could be wrong, if the winner let say Sasuke kill the loser Naruto then there will be "no one strong enough" to stop Sasuke from becoming kage
Who is takashi?
Yeah, I was wondering wtf he was talking about. You don't fight a hokage to become hokage. The hokage is the leader of the village.
*Lillie takes notes* I’ll try to avoid the protagonists anime pitfalls.
@Drakon590 In the bag
writers are finally making you a protagonist/side character?
@@TheKpa11 Yep
@Drakon590 Nani!!! What do you mean?
@@WarmLillie don't worry, it's another dimension's Nebby. I looked into it.
Yugioh is the shy protagonist that is supposed to be a self insert boys scout while naruto in part 1 did have a personality and was the stereotypical dumb hyperactive hot head with insecurities he later in part 2 becomes the self insert with personality
He was more of a self insert to me in part one than what japan thinks a "self insert" is as a kid since i didnt view myself as a shy and timid weakling due to having to goto prison(a horrid school) all my childhood.
@@Goretantath yeah you have a point but part 2 reeks of harem self insert vibes to the point that it makes it easy for fanfiction writers to erase any sense of personality he had left ,part 1 at least had actual flaws that made him stand out like his ego and pride which helped make his humanizing moments work and be more memorable but part 2 feels like a self insert for everything
Well naruto being, as you said, an stereotypical dumb hyperactive hot head with insecurities, is kinda of the self insert for majority of kids, specially in the west. Naruto was the normalest Western boy in regards of personality and that's why people loved him that much, kids could see someone as dumb, hyperactive as them doing amazing stuff, being cool and shit, and then could feel poweefull as well, in the end, both are self insert protagonists
@@vcamv2354 really ? Cause I thought that the shy kid with anxiety was the self insert for the west or I guess maybe is just both ?
@@carlacarrero4975 Shy kid with an anxiety is mpre of the self insert for Japanese, but it is the self insert in the West from 2008 trough here, bur when Naruto was running, the western kid was the hyperactive action packed yelling boy. Both are self inserts. When I think about a non self-i sert I always think about Ichigo Kurosaki, cause yes he's just a normal teenage boy without a clear goal but he's also a delinquent, and even then, he studies a lot and has high grades, he does sports, he has like a very clear personality that you can't summarize completely with maybe e words
I know it’s mostly filler but Rafael vs Atem is a great example of the struggle in the series. Atem can win as long as he believes in the heart of the cards (ancient magic etc) but giving him the temptation of the Seal of O as his only way out is great way to break him. There wasn’t cheating just mind games to make your opponent play to your advantage. You can see this in the actual card game where players will set spells/traps or hold extra cards in hand to make it seem like they have a response waiting. Fear of the unknown is a great strategy in this “children’s” card game.
I just glad we got more yugioh content.
Unrelated comparison, I love how much the art style evolved in both series from start to finish. Over the years, Masashi Kishimoto and Kazuki Takahashi really defined their own styles working on such influential series like Naruto and Yu-Gi-Oh! It’s one of my favorite things about long running manga in general.
sorry but the og naruto chapters look way better then late shippuuden drawing style, there is no love in there
@@vivvy_0 yeah end of part 1 and early part 2 is the best art style
Another Yu-Gi-Oh manga fan!!!
I'm so glad to find one, they are so rare nowdays T^T
Thaaaaank you, my gosh.
It's really hard to describe to people that Yu-Gi-Oh really IS a very thoughtful and well-written series, but of course almost everyone in the English-speaking western hemisphere thinks of the Bowdlerized 4Kids dub of the anime first and foremost with the series, and the official Viz localization of the manga has some... really weird and unnatural word usage.
I'm hopeful one day the series can get a more accurate retranslation, but that would be an enormous undertaking :/
Sincerely the idea of people gaining magic punitive power through ancient artifacts, but the condition for performing them is to challenge the target to a game, is quite interesting. I wish there was a comic or manga out there that uses this trope and sticks with it.
Fun fact: Here in Latin America when they make the Yughi oh anime, every time that they said "If you lose you're death" or something like, they traduct: "You'll be send to the shadow kingdom"... yeah, they create a whole new concept because they don't wanna to mention death 🤔
It was the same in the English version, dumbed down for kids. Except for Kaiba on the top of the castle, that was real death
@@PrincessAshley972 Ah yes, the infamous Shadow Realm lol
Still made more sense than dying and then coming back to life later.
Oh yeah the Shadow Realm. That’s the version I grew up with. Took me a really long time to realize that it was just death. I really just thought there was a whole separate dimension. Silly kid me thought peeps were just being forced to live in a new dimension as if it was the same as moving cross-state/country.
They did that everywhere outside of Japan.
Nice to finally see someone look past the initial content of Yu-Gi-Oh! And see the complex layers underneath. Love this franchise.
I was in High School reading the Yu Gi Oh manga and i remember when the Pharoah just straight up killed a bully for being a jerk. Like, that was his only crime. He cheated them out of their fair space and he's dead. Shit was wild. Also Mokuba's gang with actual guns and how he tried to cheat twice.
can I also just say that atem's character arc is very underrated? in the early chapters of the manga he’s a borderline antagonist,
but slowly comes to work with and become friends with Yugi. watching the anime subbed there are still some parts that aren’t half bad, and the early chapters that toei adaptated in 1998 (otherwise known as season 0) were honestly pretty well done.
One Correction:
If I remember correctly Kaibas Hologram explanation is only in the anime. In the Manga he steps to the edge and straight up threatens to jump if he loses.
On a totally unrelated note I just wanted to point out that you have amazing skin
I really feel like this has to do with a problem a lot of writers can come across with planned versus organic writing and the pitfalls of each.
Great video as always! Have an idea for "What Happend to..?". In 2009 when Disney XD was launched, one of their launch line-up was a Canadian show called Aaron Stone. It was so weird, like it looked that it was made to sell action figures but none merchendise was ever released for it. Whole plot was about some kind mmorpg that was based on real life, so a pro player in this game had to become his avatar in reality
I remember that show. It was pretty good, until season 2.
@@animedude8712 Yeah I watched and really enjoy it, but most of people I know totally forgot about it. I think that it was oveshadowed by Zeke and Luther popularity. Disney used cgi footage of this mmo game in other Disney Shows like Good luck Charlie and Descendants, but Disney refuses to put in Disney Plus
Well with Takahashi, he's a fan of Jojo and games. He never lost sight of that. He's also influenced with horror and adventure stories. Mixing that into a story about playing games that eventually effect the world is very unique. Also, to help with the stew of ideas- little Yugi had his own alternate persona...a darkside...that later evolved into the spirit of the Pharoh. What's amazing was the growth of his characters and finally ending the story with a dramatic battle between he( little Yugi) and his dark side ( Atem...or the Pharoh). Such a fantastic way to end a story.
Thank goodness, a man of culture! You have no idea how refreshing it is to not only see someone else share the same gripes with Naruto that I have, but also see Yu-Gi-Oh! for what it really is: A story, not just “that card game show where they play the game wrong. lol” Thank you so much; this was much needed.
Yugioh doesn't have power level problem but it has tech evolving in a day problem
Tbf, becoming hokage by becoming strong isnt right, thats just how naruto thought it was since he was an orphan and couldnt understand the concept of a "village". He just saw that the hokage was strong and powerfull,(which IS a requirement but not the only thing.) If naruto just became strong and claimed the title of hokage, would all the villagers who thought of him as a demon sit by and let him? Naruto is more about the struggle of being accepted and belonging, it just got swept under the rug due to it being a shounen created at the point in time where action packed fighting was the norm.
and yet the kage are almost always the strongest ninja in their village
After watching this, now I have the feeling that the yugioh's anime is like the abridged series of the manga instead of an actual anime, and that for some reason for me makes the concept of the actual abridged series way funnier
What’s funny is that the abridged version kept some of Kaiba’s original quotes from the anime because they are so over-the-top and hilarious that you can’t make them any funnier 😂
I loved the plot of naruto. Becoming Hokage was a personal goal, but the series does not revolve around his ambitions alone, it revolves around the whole village, friends' goals, and a whole lot more. Naruto not only had Hokage as his end goal to gain respect from the whole village, but his end goal becomes a whole lot more satisfying when he becomes Hokage. Masashi created a world filled with people, political tension, and more.
Yugioh was cool but i disliked all the weird gimmicks they added for the pharoh. Yeah, it was kinda smart, but I always knew he was gonna win. Also the fact he always drew the right card he always wanted. Those two were kinda a turn-off.
Pharaohs*
@@chaosqrow634 thnx. I struggled with this one.
8:31 Toooo be fair, even in the anime it's not really about the card games. I've personally both read the manga and watched the anime (in original Japanese, specifically, because I... just... liked it, really), and they make a point to show that every deck used by every character is essentially an expression of their mindset, something they like, or just how they think in general. And Atem's entire deal is to bluff his way through certain turns to push them to reveal their psychology, and the moment they do that, he starts figuring out a way to punish it.
It's _definitely_ more prominent in the manga, but every part of a duel really showcases how terrible of a person most of his opponents are. Such as how Yami Marik has like 80% of his deck being made of deformed demons and actual torture devices, or Pegasus' toons being messed up versions of the Looney Tunes, with his big gimmick being to force other monsters to become like that.
I totally agree that 4Kids missed that point and changed serious chunks of it though, which is definitely worth mentioning! Also, overall really fun video.
@Drakon590 Glad to be of service ^_^
Thank you!!
Totally understand what you mean. A lot of jump anime kinda suffers from Power Creep like Naruto. Stakes are always made higher and higher and the main casts has to grow with that higher stake.
People gotta realize bigger isn't always better. The stakes don't always have to be greater than the last, they just have to be different. Protagonists don't have to become stronger to overcome these stakes, they just gotta be more creative when facing them.
(spoilers coming up)
That's why Yugioh is better here, because with the duels you see, none are ever the same as the last. There's always something creative and new. Same goes with the stakes. First it was Yugi fighting Kaiba to prove cards are more about heart than power. Just a battle about opposing ideologies. Next was saving his grandpa from pegasus, after that, the plot thickened when yami and yugi had to face Marik to originally obtain the god cards so he could start regaining his memories. The whole world being thrown into darkness only was a side stake. Then finally, Yami faces his past and reclaims his memories and name. And then one last send off, yugi and yami battle, which needed to end with yami losing, so he could finally return to the afterlife.
Naruto was just bigger fights with a lot of drama mixed in.
The Yugioh manga is one of my favourites. Expanding on what you said about the cheating, Yugi often had the odds stacked against him because of cheating opponents (counterfeits, forbidden cards, tricks, magic), and eventually he also had to find ways to defeat the all mighty God cards too. As for the cheating, it's pretty weird that there wasn't some kind of judge system. I guess having certain cards being more powerful than others was a way that tension was built up, and established quite early on with instances like Yugi using, and eventually losing, Exodia.
I'm living for the anime rant and its making me happy... I need to read YuGiOh bc ive only ever watched it
Funfact, Jojo's bizarre adventure has no problems with power scaling because of how geniously set up "Stands" are
Jojo's bizarre adventure has no problems with power scaling because each part has a new protagonist, thus nullifying all the extreme power-ups previous protagonist received at the end of their story. Giorno becomes an invincible god at the end of Golden Wind, so Stone Ocean has to barely acknowledge his existence to have any stakes, and that isn't a very elegant way to solve the power-creep problem Araki wrote himself into.
@@genyakozlov1316 its not even a problem. It wraps up each character's story greatly
Thank you for doing a topic on yu-gi-oh; i’ve loved the series since the very first time i watched it but everyone can’t seem to get over the character design and the fact that it’s an anime about card games.
This made my little yu-gi-oh fan girl self so happy 🥺💖
This actually is a very objective inside view and analysis of how those two stories actually work in their inside logic so i liked this video very much.
Is very subjective sometimes but the nitpicky moments helped me out to realize the flaws and strong points of what i'm writing myself, because i always saw that "shounen power mechanic" issue but i couldn't actually put it into words that don't sound plain and boring and over simplifying the issue.
Now i can focus myself on overcoming my own problems as a writter that i didn't noticed before for my future comic, so thank you, this was extremely helpfull.
Loving this channel, love that you have real observations and comment on your own moments with the works you review. Too many youtubers just shallowly regurgitate summaries and can only work up any enthusiasm for unfunny skits and half thought through political screeds.
8:50 You’ve watched the 4Kids version. In the Japanese version, Kaiba said he would jump if he lost.
Thank you! I thought the same thing that the manga was so much better because the card game was not as important as the story. In the anime, it's the card game. That is why I wish the writers of Arc V would have concentrated more on the story and less on the dueling. They had a great story and they messed it up at the end. I still love it though. I know they have to sell the latest summoning method, but maybe with that story, they could have stretched it beyond 200 episodes.
What do you think about Togashi's HunterxHunter?? Or have you made a review of it already?
Thank you for this video! I really enjoy your insights to these things.
The anime is really good. However, the manga does suffer from bad paneling sometimes, having big text boxes that takes up several pages(similar to some american comics), and inconsistent art quality(though that is in scanlations and not the manga volume). The anime is a better medium for the series.
@@zippyzap1354 It is much better in the volumes. It’s only a real problem if you’re reading scans.
@@JustBenUnofficial Edited to mention that. I forgot that when it is rushed to the magazine they go back and fix the art
Well Kishimoto did say he was being controlled during the Manga days.. And I don’t believe everything was his fault.... Also he had a completely different editor after the Pain arc.. And the writing of his did drop.. And he did right himself into corners... But I believe there are reasons why things happen the way they did...
Fact, people who criticize superman never actually read his good stories
Like "Superman vs. the Elite", AKA "What's So Funny About Truth, Justice, and the American Way?".
And Superman:Grounded,For Tomorrow,and the Journey
I think that's why people enjoy the fights/characters of Jojo's Bizarre Adventure because for the most part, every fighting character has a set list of abilities/stand usage that doesn't really escalate in power levels, they end up becoming more mind games of how these characters with set abilities duke it out, and how despite one character having a disadvantage, they're able to think on the fly in a way that uses their abilities - it becomes an evolution/experience for the fighters and less of "now I'm this power level" for most of it
The final Naruto vs Sasuke was the big battle for homage. Or how the whole world would be governed
I would love to see you do the Last airbender fight scenes vs other shojo anime fight scenes.
I think my two favorite games in Early Yu Gi Oh! were the literal very first one, where they were stabbing into a stack of money on their hands, the silent contest, ice block on a hot surface table tennis.
Can you do a "What Happened to Spider Riders"?
you say people werent satisfied with it but in reality its just you guys having unreasonable expectations. madara getting betrayed was PERFECT for his character and made sense. the majority of people out in japan dont have these vitriolic responses to narutos ending BUT you guys. herd mentality.
One of the funniest things that he said in this video was that "There's not really some big battle that of which decides if he is the Hokage".
So, we're just gonna forget about Naruto vs Sasuke that not only focused on clashing ideologies on what it means to become Hokage, but it also determined whether Naruto would become Hokage. I swear that they stopped reading at Kaguya
a whole video to say "read YugiOh" hahahahaha. Loved the explanation, it reminded me of the Power Rangers, since their battles always "escalate" they have to bring the big guns, in their case the giant robots, but since you kinda expect that to happen you don't feel cheated or bored. It's funny and entertaining and it's even more rewarding when it's a special episode and they don't win, they loose and you wonder how are they gonna move on. I watched the series since I was very young, around 10-11 till I was 21 or so and never really hated it, sometimes it bugged me the cookie cutter episodes but it was a formula you had been warned about from the very beginning. Would you mind doing a video about them? the power rangers ?
No matter what you think of Naruto, the final Naruto vs Sasuke fight was artfully done. Barely any music, just people of equal power battling it out. Then when both of them are out of energy, they still keep fighting even when they are almost passed out. Kakashi vs. Obito was also great
I feel like that’s only something that someone who hasn’t watched anything better would say
@@justblaze1656 I feel like that’s something only someone who glorifies Jojo would say.
Knock it off with the whole "my taste is better than yours". It doesn't make you look smart.
I was very okay with Naruto not becoming Hokage at the end of Shipuden. His original reason for wanting to be Hokage was that he wanted the attention and love of the village. But he already had that at the end of the series. That was really his true motivation. It's all about the want/need of the protagonist. Naruto's want is to become Hokage, but his need is to find people who love him, support him and be his friend. Also to marry Sasuke, because I ship it and the writer is a coward for not going through with that at the end.
Sakura did marry Sasuke, what are you on about
@@garrethutchington1663 she said that she hope Naruto marry Sasuke instead of marrying Sakura because she shipped NaruSasu
So true about the NaruSasu part 😂 Sasuke had A LOT more chemistry with Naruto than Sakura
I just randomly stumbled onto this video while looking for anime merch.
I don’t regret it
edit: spell check
I lost my shit when you called the Izanagi a "quicksave" HAHAHAHDJGKHLMBL THATS BRILLIANT
I feel like they’re the same thing though. It was just as nebulous with naruto because we knew that hokage was just stand in for him being liked. How would he get the village to like him ? Some missions? Fighting ? Getting stronger? That stuff kinda would have the opposite effect. So his personal growth and relationship with others is the medium.
Early Naruto: Kunais can kill people
Post Shippuden Naruto: hit by an attack that previously destroyed a mountain, just a scratch.
I would say Samurai 8(his work after Naruto that got axed) was badly written compared to Naruto.
nah Kunai's where always useless since episode 1 since Iruka was able to live with a giant shuriken through his spine and lived completely fine the entire series
@@ricosuave9102 forgot that one, he should have been at least paralyzed xD
I usually don't ask for videos but you are just the perfect person for that: Do you know (about) the Show "Starla and The Jewel Riders"? It has everything you could wish for: Kinda wonky because 80s animation, a catchy theme song, girl power and friendship AND action figures!!!!
Hey could you do a video about who is your favourite female character in naruto and who you think is the strongest?
Its really fun to watch you video. :)
When God appeared at the end of Naruto, my reaction was just: What????
(Okay so this got long and rambly just read the summary at the end)
Here's a fundamental problem with Naruto becoming Hokage.
The only reason he _wanted_ to be Hokage in the first place is to have respect. Everyone hated him and treated him like the devil as a child but nobody could do the same to someone of higher status (in his mind anyway.) And the highest status in the village he was aware of was Hokage. Therefore to be respected and not be treated like Satan spwan he'd have to be Hokage as the logical conclusion.
The issue is after the Pain arc naruto already has the respect of practically everyone in the village. It happens long before the Kaguya fight and even the start of Shippuden. He had the respect of all his fellow Genin, The Chunin and some Jonin and for two whole years he hasn't had to interact with one person who knew he was the 9 tails jinjuuriki. He's had no reason to do anything other than train and keep Jiraya out of trouble.
And this Training rather than for being explicitly for becoming Hokage is for himself with the greater goal of reaching Sasuke.
There is no real effort made towards being Hokage from Naruto ever.
The other thing is that there is no set power level to being Hokage. In the leaf village itself they had Hiruzen, after Tobirama and Hashirama two of the strongest people ever (in base probably) and while Hiruzen is strong he's far more of a threat as a knowledgeable and tactical mind. The man isn't known for raw power.
It's said at some point the Kage is the strongest of the village but that isn't always true especially with Kakashi down the line.
Tl;Dr
This kinda talked about a lot more than necessary but basically Naruto shouldn't have become Hokage. It's not what he really wanted. It's not what he fought for, it's not something he kept in his thoughts, his strength alone doesn't make him a viable candidate and others were far more capable and likely ready for the job. (Like Shikamaru, potentially even Sakura.) Naruto instead should have just kept working as a regular Shinobi maybe even taking Sasuke's position travelling the world since he still as a lot to learn and there's a whole world he saved he doesn't know about
Well said.
I personally feel like he should have become Hokage right after Pain, and then cut off the entire War Arc and make it just Naruto vs Sasuke.
Your not that disorganized. Don't sell yourself short
But see I call you Chris HANDSOME
Negative Legend: the pitfalls of anime/manga protagonist.
Me: rereading Vagabond. 🧐
is it good?
@@Otra_Chica_de_Internet Very. I can’t decide if I like it or Berserk more.
9:00 -
Why yes, Atem is very ok with murder
I absolutely love NegLeg's videos. Keep it up
This was an interesting video. I recently found your channel again and I enjoy your commentary a lot. Quick idea... What happened to "Fire Breather". I remember my brother and I enjoying the movie and being bummed that they never continued the story. Anyone have thoughts? It may be a similar thing to Generator Rex where it could have been continued but there wasn't enough interest/money being earned.
So glad I click that winx video to this
Will this video be the reason I finally pick yu-gi-oh back up and maybe actually finish it this time? Maybe. XD The manga is really good but for every time I read it something ends up happening and I drop it for a while then have to start over because I took too long to come back to it.
To be Hokage you need to be the top but you also need to earn the recognition of the people. Eg. The reason why the Hiruzen Sarutobi took over over after Minato died isn't because at that time he was necessarily the strongest but because he was recognized as a leader. That is also why no one recognized Danzo as Hokage because despite being very strong you didn't feel he earned it and from what I recall he wasn't really recognized as a Hokage by the people. While I think Naruto kinda earned Hokage in the Pain arc and the 4th Ninja War slowly shaped him to be recognized as someone that could lead. I don't think he ever went full leader which would have been nice to see but he took steps to being one. That's especially why talk no jutsus were needed the in the story, a moral dilemma, which I think worked most of the times. I do think Madara was supposed to be in the story just not necessarily in the way he was to be used, but Kaguya probably not.
I dont really know much about yu gi oh since its not an anime that i grow up with, but for me Tsubasa Chronicle has such a complicated, amazing and intricate storyline and the writter did an amazing job corelating many universe in Clamp in the story and the characters in it so 3d to me. The writter really flesh out each character for me. The only sad part is the ending of the anime. Its breaks my heart but its also set this anime apart from any other anime out there.🤧
Negative Legend gets me on regards to the YuGiOh! manga
It's really good, you guys should read it. It's not mostly about card games except Duelist Kingdom and Battle City.
Yes, Thank you!!!
New to the channel and was just watching the "what happened to" series, but holy shit you are pretty
Honestly, I think that the hokage thing to Naruto comes from his desire to be recognized and valued, since he was hated by everyone for literally no freaking reason, and that opens the path to his famous line ''I was like you once'' lines comes from and the hole meme of the Evangelization no justsu comes from, fight these big bad and small bad enemies slowly earns him respect, but getting so powerfull gives him more attention than he initialy wanted to the point he becomes a literal idol.
Now the real problem of the story lies on the enemy side, because Kishimoto had to come with new ways to make the enemy interesting, but since most if not all of them were never stablished previously he had to rely heavily on flashbacks and then the anime made it worse by streaching the flashbacks or over using the power of friendship no justsu or both.
Then there's the other problem of battle shonen manga existing because of Dragon ball, Dragon ball itself being really dumb at handeling battles, and if that's your reference point for at leats half of your manga's runtime you are bount to make even more dumb situations and the only people that can improve on it are the people that come to the manga scene after you or you know, not work on a weekly manga.
I always have a blast watching Negative Legend
But wasn't part of Narutos reasoning to save Sasuke because of how he wouldn't be qualified for Hokage if he didn't save him, which was presented in the final battle between the 2 as well
Speaking of anime protags I swear your turning more into one every time I see you!
I know we're here for anime, but, dude, your eyes are gorgeous.
Your videos are great.
I wanna make a fanart of him just holding a volume of the yu gi oh manga while saying ''it's not about card games''
Well that made me want to read the yugioh manga.
its like comparing Ash from Pokemon to Dan Kouso from Bakugan[i guess you forgot :/ ],like an immortal to a being that will live maximum 4-5 years.
I swear your eyes were shining everytime you started talking about Yu-Gi-Oh
I love your channel.
I fully agree with you random youtuber i've never heard of before, Also, your eyes are very pretty.
I like the idea of people changing their goals.
The first goal Naruto latched onto was “become hokage”, possibly because he wanted happiness / contentment / to feel closer to his dad.
“If my dad was hokage, and I miss him, then I might feel closer to him by becoming hokage,” the logic could go.
However, as challenges arise to his ideal outcome (being happy, content, and feeling secure in his relationships), that professional attainment would drop below “keep his close friends together.”
I don't know why I've watched this whole video since I haven't read Yu-Gi-Oh or even watched all of Naruto Shippuden. But it's still an interesting video.
one of my favorites is Silver Fang or Ginga: Nagareboshi Gin in Japanese, I loved it as a kid and I still love it to this day and I love YuGiOh, Naruto and Dragon ball but Silver Fang is now still my favorite
You don't need to read the Yu-Gi-Oh manga to understand that it's not about card games. Also don't generalize the english dub with the manga and also also, the anime can't have everything in the manga.
A quicksave, I love that description 🤣🤣🤣
Now you got the Fallout 3 "Anything goes" stuck in my head! Thanks!
I'm not the biggest fan of Naruto but I disagree. Contrived rules work for Yugio because it's a card game. In naruto, they beat each other up. You could say the power level keeps escalating so much it's ridiculous but that's better than staying the same.
you know what, you should write a book. I think it would be good.
dude, i wanna see you watch precure anime specifically heartcatch precure and do a review of that. It's one of those anime that are marketed towards kids and girls but they surprisingly has a deep story. That's why heartcatch is my favorite the premise is the same as any precure anime but the story and character development of each cast is unlike any precure i have ever seen.
You can talk about Yu-Gi-Oh GX next time? Is my favorite Yu-Gi-Oh serie and I want to know your opinion in it and Jaden/Judai character
I think Judai is probably the most realistic and relatable protagonist next to Yuma especially in seasons 3 and 4
Now, thanks to you, I want to read Yu-Gi-Oh! I litterally had no idea it wasn't about cards. All just because I watched the first episode of the anime first.
Such a smart man❤👍👍👍...