Brian Mackenwells on Irish Names
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- Опубликовано: 19 мар 2020
- Brian talks about the Irish language, by way of his own surname.
Filmed at "An Evening Of Unnecessary Detail" at the Backyard Comedy Club - for their future gigs, go to www.aeoud.com
If only Irish had been taught like that in such a fun way mabey more of us would now be happy and confident to speak Irish.
I know it’s brilliant ! I am a native speaker. I never learned grammar. Instead I learned stories, rhymes ,poems, ditties, limericks, and dirty jokes based on bilingual word play. My grandfather would never say “shit” he would say “ainm coileach i mBéarla” which Translates as you probably know to “the name of a male hen in English” or cock which when pronounced as an Irish word is cac shit. You learn two languages two sets of grammar together without even thinking about it, and you never forget a word when it is so interesting.
Absolutely agree. We were taught just the language and to understand what people say not where it comes from. This was actually funny and uniquely informative 🤣
Nothing says "Irish is a better language than English" than a proud Irishman who found it boring in school and wasn't interested in it as an adult, and is currently learning it from Duolingo because he has a kid now :)
The points about place names also applies to Native American names across the US. We often use the original name but often know the meaning. Of course, we took all that even further by renaming mountains, rivers, etc., taking away the Native name but also its descriptiveness, using white men's names instead. Mt. Denali in Alaska became Mt. McKinley for a president who'd never actually seen it. That just went back to Denali, thankfully.
I grew up in Philadelphia and there are a ton of native place names. Passyunk, Manyunk, Wawa, Aramingo, Conshocken, neshaminy, Lahaska, Kingsessing, Moyensing, Nockamixon, Pennypack, Susquehanna, Tohickon, Wissahickon, to just name a few, they’re all from Native American place names. They’re names that almost always confuse out of towners on how to pronounce. I some how doubt our current pronunciation would be recognized by the Native people we stole the names from.
I live close to the Cherokee Nation and MIAMI has 9 recognized tribes.
That is My-Am-Uh. Not My-am-eee.
I grew up where the Cherokee capitol 2.0 was (New Echota) before the Removal. In Northwest Georgia, all of our rivers, most of our creeks, many of our mountains, and some of our towns still have Cherokee names or the English version of Cherokee names. (Talking Rock, Ball Ground, etc.) For instance, I live in Armuchee now (pronounced "Ar-mur-chee) near the Oostanaula River. I grew up near the confluence of the Conasauga and Coosawatee Rivers. I lived on Sequoyah Circle. As much as it pains me to think how few of the (kind of) native NW Georgians are left, I like to think of it as a necessary reminder that it's our fault all we have left are place names.
Yeah most names in Wisconsin were originally a Ojibwa name then was related in English, for example the places that are called devil's or devil is because they used to be called evil spirit in the Ojibwa language and the English called it devil to kinda white wash it, like how the Roman's would take a pagan god qnd say they are the same as one of the saints because they represent something similar
@@christinec7892 LETS GO BIRDS
Hay! This was an Irish lesson in disguise. Go hointeach
Brian Mackenwells... you should give Irish language classes. I will for sure sign up!
“That never had any weather” ROFL
The only thing better than comedy is comedy that educates. This is so great.
Understanding where words and names come from is so enlightening. Great teacher!
Love it. I teach English to Japanese and Koreans. It's so fun to see the reasons why their pronunciation happens their way, as well as many other language/culture connection. This stuff is fascinating...
‘Ireland is a closed book to those who do not know her language. No one can know Ireland properly until one knows the language. Her treasures are hidden as a book unopened. Open the book and learn to love your language’ - Margaret Dobbs
That's beautiful
Languages contain so much of the culture they come from. Your daughter is so lucky to have access to so much culture.
As a Canadian just back from our 3rd trip to Ireland in 4 years, you have now made me want to learn more about the language so I can discover more about the country we have fallen in love with! I have noticed how most towns have both the English and Irish names posted which already made me curious. Beautiful country with wonderful people!
That was really cool. I love hearing different languages and really geek out on the back story of how words come about.
im from newfoundland and i knew those names. corse newfoundlanders have irish heritage in em
Brilliant, thank you
He is very very smart and extemely clever and funny as well, I found myself thinking his wife is lucky - fair play to ye. I also learned soo much Irish, Irish names, etc - well done comedy presentation with education mixed in.
I also have an English child,... I called him Eóghan 😂😂😂. He lives in Norfolk, which makes it even worse 🤣🤣🤣 because they're really not able to cope with it.
So they just call him Owen ?
Great presentation!
Really enjoyed this! 👍
I enjoyed this... 👏👏👏👏
"English-- a nightmare"😄
If only I had Brian as an Irish teacher I might have learned something at school, instead of learning irish 10 years after I emigrated!😁
Although he could have elaborated on the three (trí) by saying theres no "th" pronunciation in the Irish language!
Didn't expect to see stand up maths here.
Thanks for the Irish lesson
Right good educational standup session !
That’s brill! Thanks man, really cool explanation of some things I never knew before. 👍🏻
I love learning about Linguistics, so this was just fascinating to me!!!! Love how you have blended your family name for your family! What a story to tell future generations!
If you like this talk, I'd recommend the book 'Thirty Two Words for Field' by Manchán Magan!
Pure random I was watching. This and when you said your grandparents were from the naul and your name was macken .I thought no I worked with your mam and dad 40 odd years ago how random I that
I am from the US and am sadly not aware of similarly formatted presentations, regardless of the subject matter, in my area. College lectures do not count. They are definitely not this, haha. That is terribly disappointing because this was fantastic. Well presented, funny, highly informative, and in an easy to watch bite size package.
I clicked on it because my grandparents were from Cork and were fluent in Irish. As an adult I have taken an interest in it, textbooks, videos, CDs and at one time an over 300 day streak on Duolingo, etc.but with no one to converse with and life getting in the way I am currently on a bit of a hiatus. I will get back into as soon I finish the University classes I am currently taking.
What I liked was that this was like a mini TED Talk for normal people. Now I often watch TED Talks when the topic interests me but they can occasionally cross the line into unwatchability (spell check is failing me so, either I suck, or perhaps that is not a real word. If not, it should be, LOL) Sometimes it is the presenters style, sometimes the subject, and sometimes it is good old fashioned pretentious nonsense.
This, on the other hand, was top shelf. Thank you for sharing it.
it is a comedy show, not a fucking ted talk...so here is a gormless gobshite award...
Welsh is similar. Place names are descriptions of the area.
Well done.
God this is so great 😂 i speak Welsh as a first language and oh my goddddddd English is so hard 😂
because you mentioned welsh, i read that as "oh my goth"
Well done ..
I'm American and I still loved the "never gets any weather" joke.
I'm Irish and never heard it before 😂 😂 😂
I laugh when I see American weather forecasts because either Canada doesn’t exist at all or we have no weather, just like Ireland! If we are lucky to be recognized we have to remember Fahrenheit. 😄🇨🇦
@@patriciawenzel3871 Oh why can’t the US get onboard with the metric system? They are like one of a small handful of countries rhar use it. I think only two do officially with the other being Liberia. Imperial was used here in Australia but was changed. The plane crash known as the Gimli Glider event was caused by improper calculation of fuel load when Canada converted to the metric system. I was born in the late 80’s and even now in my mid 30’s people like my mother and some of those around her age use what to me are made up mystery measurements like yards. She’ll always go when I say I don’t know how far a yard is that there’s 3 feet in a yard and 12 inches in a foot - all things I know but doesn’t really help me much. I legit have OCD. I like numbers that make sense. 0 degrees is the freezing point of water, 100 degrees the boiling point - perfect. When you get into chemistry and physics you need to convert some things to degrees Kelvin which is the exact same plus the absolute temperatures of space so by that measure I reckon metric proves it wins.
Love this. Maith thú!
GRMA!
As a 1/4 Irish I should know more about the language. It’s always lovely to hear an Irish accent.
Why should you?
Could have done with you as an Irish teacher when I was in school.
Yep!
I have a masters in ESL and we had to take a couple of linguistic classes and break down other languages like you’re doing here. Very interesting.
Genius.
the two dislikes are from the Empire!
I feel seen 😂
I'm teaching my 7 year old daughter and I'm realizing how difficult English is to learn. Wind blows and you wind a toy. You catch a bass and you can play a bass.
Love how close Irish is to the heavy Chicago accent for one two "tree". Going to have a couple two tree beers and watch... Da Bears
Wan, Too, Tree 😁 For = 4 👍🏼
I'm not from Dublin but I would hear people talking about 'the Naul' and wondered why that was. Now I know
so cute, funny, and smart... slainte...
My daughter is Clíodhna ☘️💚☘️
Wow!!! This is so cool, I learned a lot! I find the actual sound of the syllables in contrast to their spelling really interesting, but of course, this is cuz I'm unconsciously comparing it to English conventions. You should do some research into Newfoundland (most Eastern province of Canada)... We have a very present Irish, Scottish, English and even French culture (it's a cultural stew lol) but it's a staple of Newfoundland vernacular to say "tree" instead of "three". There's a really strong Irish inflection in the language, so much so that the rest of Canada laughs at us (mostly with good intentions, but sometimes not).. we called it "Newfinese" lol. I'm positive there are so many more similarities that have crossed the pond from Europe! And the music!!! A lot of similar music, and one of our beloved Newfoundland bands called Ryan's Fancy are actually from Ireland! And we have a great sense of humour, as a culture! The province has a huge sense of identity and unique slangs and sayings, so if you're interested, you should look it up (and maybe visit one day, post covid!)
??? why have you posted a thesis???
Lovely comment and thanks for sharing! The vast majority of people living in America /Canada are from the Eurasian Continent. The Irish & Scots Irish were brought to America as slaves, poor English too.
Unfortunately our race is dying 😢
O Caoindealbhán is my surname in Irish. Quinlan in English.
Bh makes a w sound sometimes
When my son was four, we had this conversation...
him - so I'm English
Me - yeah
Him - and I'm part Irish
Me - yeah
Him - and I'm part Polish
Me - yeah
Him - and I'm part Americish
Me - !! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Americish! I love that! I'm part Irish and Americish (among other bits) but I love that!
Very interesting and entertaining! I hope it was facts and not just jokes, cause ill make a fool of myself thinking i know something about it, so i will
it is facts! idk about the place names but i learn it on duolingo too 😂
An interesting and entertaining talk, but it seems that he is not aware that many English place names also have underlying meaning. Newcastle is an obvious one, but Birmingham is the ham (village) of the Beormings - the people of Beorma (just for starters). Names in the Danelaw have Norse roots (thorpe = village etc). Of course he also missed that not all the Irish names are that simple and he also did not mention the Norse influence in Ireland that goes back a long way.
One interesting example… Dublin comes from dubh-linn (meaning "black pool"), but its official Irish name is Baile Átha Cliath (meaning "town of the hurdled ford"). In this case the “Englis” name is closer to the original than the new Gaelic name.
He's not saying that English names don't have meaning, it's that English place names in Ireland have no meaning because what essentially happened was that when the British changed the names, they basically just made the names sound phonetically similar in a lot of cases. Tír Eoghain would be a classic example, it means land of Eoghan in Irish but the British just renamed it Tyrone which is just jibberish.
Bhain mé an taitneamh as an fís seo. GRMA!
How long was it illegal to even wear green in Ireland?
An mhaith
Technically the other version of the surname would be smackinwell
Thosaigh me an phian of losing the duolingo streak lol
What's your view of the Vikings invading Ireland and creating Dublin (a slave port created by the Vikings to sell slaves from because they couldn't in England)? And how many other places were created by the Vikings across the country?
Not that you where asking me but as an Norwegian i feel my inner norse saying that we probably could have done so much more if it wasn't for that bloody pond between us... a real shame in progress that.... but we did like the "hard to get resistance" that the Irish would put up... for a fight? or a show? :P ~ Hel heildünblöt ä valdr, Eir galdr sä Naglfar ät Helheimrs Hels-vete.~ /rough translation -It is for many pure hell to bleed in battle away from home, but we heal our mind as Naglfar take us for a new journey to Realm of Hel's and her wast knowledge. (Naglfar is the vessel/ship that transports the dead and it's literaly made out of fingernails of the dead, and the word we norwegians use for the f@ck word is Helvete and it means Hell but way back in 19-bow-and-arrow it was Hels-vite and was used in the same way we would today but the meaning of the word was to fear Hel's knowledge as she was very smart and creative when dealing out punishment as the ruler of hell was quite boring so learning stuff was her copium (Hel is Freaya's sister btw and is kinda lured into taking the job at hell and the entire mythos is strait out stolen/ripped/inspired by the Greek mythos)
Enjoyed that Brian. Not bad for a northsider. Maith an fear.
Maith an Fear means Good Man. Irish to english. Corkonian here, good man yourself there like now, ha ha!
Pretty sure it's more like 500 irregular English verbs, actually.
Fear maith!!
As someone with a very Irish surname that's been heavily Anglicized, it's shocking how literally no English speaker can actually pronounce it. Which to be fair, is probably more to blame on being in America, but that just makes me hate the English oppressors on both sides of the Atlantic.
Its only spoken in tiny pockets of Ireland and almost every child leaves school an never speaks a word of it again in their lives.
Sad but true, a whole decade of learning for nothing.
whenever anyone mentions Irish names I remember this: ruclips.net/video/PA5scaGG2iY/видео.html
FYI, in Ireland this is a famous bit, performed by many English hack comedians over the years. It's low hanging fruit to get audiences to laugh at foreign people by repeating their ignorance back at them.
@@decko87 its hilarious anyway
@@kalle911 I guess it’s funny if you don’t understand Irish grammar or spelling lol
@@decko87 so definitely funny for more than half of the people living in Ireland
@@kalle911 yeah Irish people think it’s real funny to say “why is there no H in Séan” in a shrill voice. I hope I haven’t damaged your enjoyment of the old Irish Names bit, I’m just making it known it’s considered hacky by about “half the Irish population.”
The only way to revive Irish is for the Irish government to provide free Irish lessons for everyone in Ireland who wishes to learn it.
The demand in Ireland to learn Irish is immense and it is a disgrace that Irish people who would like to learn their native tongue can only do so by paying private schools.
I have always thought this. I think the Welsh government did something similar & now more speak it. Unfortunately priorities aren't as they should be with the gang we have in the Dáil. Bring back our language.
@Zod of Heaven The demand is immense. There are at least four hundred Irish medium primary and secondary schools in Ireland and up until 2019, a dramatic shortage of teachers able to teach through Irish.
This is largely due to 'The growth of the grass-roots Gaelscoil movement (and) means the demand for teachers continues to increase at primary and secondary level' Irish Times, May 21st, 2019.
However, pupils who have studied at gaelscoil schools are now becoming available to teach, so we should see a sufficient catering for the demand in the near future.
The continued growth is in spite of the dearth of government support not because of a serious, concerted effort to return the native language to its rightful place in society.
The governments, since partition, have progressively manhandled the implementation of all strategies thought to enhance the re-establishment of Irish and in recent years have neglected any drive to do so.
www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/chinese-couple-told-to-reapply-for-citizenship-in-english-after-applying-in-irish-1.4539492
And some would suggest, the government has actively obstructed the language. In addition we occasionally witness idiotic denigrating of the native tongue and of people who attempt to learn Irish.
I'm Dutch, living in Dublin and I'd actually sign up for that.
The reason those are difficult to read is not "because Irish is a completely different language than English". It's because their misuse of the Latin alphabet would make the French blush.
Ah yes the English language well know for it's correct use of the English alphabet with words like cough , plough, through though .
@@mikeoxsmal8022 Hey, at least we Americans fixed some of it. Plow, color, maneuver...
@@Fahrenheit4051 that is true but still it is a mess
The language was originally runic, so wasn't originally written in Latin alphabet.
@@rebeccacalkins5938 when did Irish adopt Latin script?
Umm...help the American out here. My Irish is terrible, but I did take it for three years, and I swear I learned that bh *does not* always say "v", it only does so depending on where it is in the word (other times "w").
I'm not defending English here. At all. But I'm not sure "consistent" is the best description when letter sounds change depending on placement and sometimes you just drop a beginning letter from a word depending on where it is in a sentence.
Actually depends on where your speaking it, for example 'sa bhaile' I was tought in school, 'sa w-aile' but I believe In Mayo it was pronounced 'sa v-aile'. I was tought in Dublin. So I think it depends on the dialect your speaking or where your from.
To explain when 'bh' sounds like /v/ and when it sounds like /w/ we must introduce a concept similar to hard/soft-c.
Basically, Irish has two classes of sounds, Broad and Slender.
A O U are broad vowels.
e and i are slender vowels.
There are broad and or slender sounds for some consonants, but for the most part for an English speaking person you don't need to worry too much about the difference in sound from broad or slender 'r' for example, so we don't make a fuss about it. (but it makes a big difference when actually speaking Irish)
But, 'mh', 'bh' and 'dh' cause the most trouble for Monolingual Anglophones.
When slender both 'bh' and 'mh', make a /v/ sound, and when broad they make a /w/ sound.
How do you know which one to use?!
If the vowels beside them are slender use the slender, I'd they are broad use the broad sounds.
If they are at the end of a word?
Use /v/ ... You'll sound like a Dub, but... it's not wrong.
There are at least three dialects of Irish, and so spoken Irish varies.
And then there's 'dh' mwhahaha. Aim for a /y/ sound. Or like 'igh' in the English word 'sigh'
Sadhbh
S-y-v ... Like five with an S at the start.
You are not expected to know this, it's a whole language worth of spelling rules, it's more consistent than English but there are exceptions, less than in English but they exist.
I spent 10 years learning Irish can't remember a word of it because nobody speaks it
Ní labhraíonn aon duine an teanga? Sin é uafásach.
Cén fath? Cad a tharla?
Bhí na múinteoirí ag múineadh ach ní raibh tú ag éisteacht nó ag foghlaim.
at least say rhem as they come up ffs
It wasn’t the British Empire, it was the English Republic!
Contrast, sadly, Lee Mack ruclips.net/video/PA5scaGG2iY/видео.html not being funny but adding to the xenophobic everyday of Post Brexit referendum Britain. Oh dear, much as I can appreciate Lee’s quick wit on panel games and as a writer of and actor in farces on the telly, I do wish that he had seen/heard/ reflected on Brian Mackenwells’s piece here first, (and maybe seen Brian Friel’s play Translations) before displaying here at length and unmitigated what amounts to, to my mind, rather shameful, ignorantly anglocentric, oafishly ill-informed monoglottery (attitudes with the unfortunate pedigree he seems naively unaware of, namely of the worldwide genocidal colonialism of the British Empire) - notice that many in the audience are not laughing at his rant. He is no Al Murray. He is not Henning Wehn. Lee Mack may think he is playing ‘a character’ but in this extract on his YT channel he simply chimes with playground & pub bullies, rehearses the stale old objections, the lazily recycled antagonism towards foreign languages and their conventions, of English-born Englanders in England, demanding that the world speak/ read/ write the English way - demands all too often imposed on immigrant minorities within England - or local majorities even outside England in the rest of Britain or, stopping at nothing, overseas, unpleasant when intoxicated and rowdy as football fans or toxic ‘holidaymakers’. Maybe in the rest of the show he has the wit to subvert his own arguments but this extract shouldn’t stand alone.
That clip was funny & affectionate. Thanks for the link, I thoroughly enjoyed Lee, as always.
I have been studying Irish. He’s wrong, the spelling makes every word like a code word!
Halfway it started getting boring 😴