New York's Lost World's Fair Line
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- Опубликовано: 13 сен 2024
- The lost World's Fair Subway line in New York City has a rich yet fleeting history. Constructed for the 1939-1940 World's Fair held in Flushing Meadows-Corona Park, Queens, the line served as a direct route for fairgoers from Manhattan to the fairgrounds. However, its legacy was short-lived, as it ceased operations shortly after the fair's conclusion. Despite efforts to repurpose the line for public transit, logistical challenges and financial constraints led to its abandonment. Today, remnants of this once-prominent subway line linger beneath the city streets, serving as a nostalgic reminder of a bygone era of innovation and grandeur.
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IT’S HISTORY - Weekly Tales of American Urban Decay as presented by your host Ryan Socash.
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They should’ve keep the World Fair Branch. So they can extend it to LaGuardia Airport
True
No train going directly to LaGuardia is plain GOOFY.
@@GabrielMichael43 ok got it
OH, YES!
Not much "G" train service on the Queens Boulevard line these days; the 'G" line has been cut back to Court Square, not even reaching Queens Plaza these days.
As someone who lives in Newfoundland, big cities leave me in awe. I just can not fathom living with such large buildings, busy streets, and numbers if people. I mean, to drive home to visit family, over 450 kilometers, i pass a half dozen communities. In between is lots of forests, bogs, barrens and shorelines.
Thank you for informing me on things I would have not have known anything about.
I actually envy your situation. Sounds really nice.
@@dirtlevel I got to admit, I feel pretty lucky most times. I went to London, England, when I was a teenager and absolutely hated the lack of greenery and dirty air...so I'd probably not do well living in a big city. It was a shock to my system at the time.
@@applegal3058 yeah it does suck..I’m in New Jersey and even the so called country areas are full of people. McMansions going up everywhere they can fit them. Cities are crime ridden and the most secluded areas are the very wealthy areas.
@@applegal3058 I must say, it wasn’t always like that here.
I go back and forth between NYC, where I was born, and South Carolina where many of my family live.
The city is vibrant. There's exposure to many different kinds of people, cultures and influences. Food, art, music, and especially conversation. It's easy to spark up in-depth conversations with people from all over the world here.
The buildings are tall, but the streets are not always crowded. Crowded streets are actually a rarity, experienced mainly in the shopping and tourist areas. In many city neighborhoods, streets can be a quiet in the day as any you'd find in a small hamlet.
I feel the difference when traveling back to SC. Although you're closer to nature and there are many outdoorsy things to do, you don't have as much exposure to differing people and cultures, and it's a bit harder to have a long conversation with a stranger.
Life down south is slower paced. And the cost of living is much cheaper for most goods.
Both places have their appeal, and I'm glad to be able to go back and forth between them whenever I wish!
My house is shown in the satellite multiple times!!!
Living here my whole life I’ve explored the marshy area around the south lake and I’ve stumbled upon rails torn up left over!!
“Part of the fun of the World’s Fair is the subway special that takes you there” The radio and TV advertisements for the ‘64 fair had saccharine jingles.
I've seen on old maps where the subway went into the park.
Also i was told that in flushing meadow corona park there was a old wooden el car that was converted to rest rooms
There was 4th train operators that had lines going to the 1939, LIRR, IND via the videos mentioned shuttle, and IRT and BMT shared the same elevated subway line
The BMT rebuilt some gate cars into enclosed cars with sliding doors in 1938 since their steel subway cars were too large to run on the Flushing line. They wound up serving out their days on the Myrtle Avenue elevated line before being scrapped after the line was abandoned in 1969. The city bought out the IRT and BMT in 1940 during the Worlds Fair but didn't do much to integrate them into the rest of the system with the IND until after the war including creating free transfer points and new track connections along with a lot of other equipment upgrades.
The Pennsylvania RR owned the LIRR at the time, and some of the parent company's cars operated to the Fair.
A few corrections:
1. Today, the line serves the E, F, M, R trains. G hasn't gone there in years.
2. The signals in Jamaica yard are not dedicated to the World's Fair line and they have been replaced numerous times.
3. There still are visible tracks of the line. The two Worktrain tracks furthest west in Jamaica yard were the World's Fair line. They were cut off within the limits of the yard and are lay-up tracks for the worktrains.
EVERY "history " video this channel presents needs at least a few corrections, some more than others. Socash is just being careless or sloppy. Keep calling him out on it every time, and just maybe he'll stop presenting so many careless errors as facts, but don't bet on it. This channel needs to become history. Shit was so cash? Well Socash is so shit.
DON'T SUPPORT THE RUclips "JOUNALISTS" WHO HAVE NO CREDENTIALS, TRAINING OR EVEN AN EDITOR TO TELL THEM TO FIX THE MISTAKES.
@@speeta Eh even if he isn't 100% correct he at least brings up a decent topic that I can go research additionally on my own.
Contrast the World's Fair line costs of construction and repayment to the Monorail constructed for the Seattle World's Fair of 1962. Paid for from the farebox in the 1st month of operation, and still running today.
Wow😮
I love listening about the Worlds Fair line.
Good Evening Professor Socash, again great info about the World's Fair in New York 1939 and going to watch the one about 64 Worlds Fair, thanks again have a great evening....
I lived one block away from the #7 line at Junction Blvd. Took it to many times to school and mets games.
Part of the tracks of the line still exist in the yard. One is a dead end track, and the other is part of the car wash
Your channel is such a rich resource of NYC history. As a subscriber I really enjoy them. Hope you do a piece on Robert Moses too, a controversial figure but still a great planner of his time.
i wasn't even born yet it would be a kind of relaxin' vibe to envision & wonderful.
I rode in those Vintage cars. They were still in use in 1973.I would take them from Marcy Ave in Brooklyn to NYC.
I too remember some of those vintage cars as a kid in 1970's Brooklyn! But by the 80's they were certainly gone.
Awesome video. I would love to see you cover the 1898 Omaha Worlds Fair sometime!
Ryan, your documentary is top quality it's feel as if watching it on the History or Discovery channels. Keep up the great work. I love watching your rail series. Speaking of NY. Ryan, did you know in Bedford, Indiana there's a place called the Empire Quarry? It's where the huge hole in the ground is where the Indiana limestone was cut for the Empire State Building. The birthplace where it all originated. Several tons cut and hauled by rail to NYC back then to make what we see in the Manhattan skyline today since 1931. Other notable buildings like the Pentagon and in even in Chicago like the famous Palmolive Building along with some other historic buildings.
The irt snd bmt were bought by nyc in 1940 , not 1953. This worlds fair line from what i have been told was to have mulitple entrances each served directly.
With 25 years between the openings of the 1939 and 1964 Worlds Fairs, I had always naively imagined the next Worlds Fair would open in 1989. I'm still waiting. I mean, who wouldn't want another Worlds Fair? As a child attending in 1964, the experience was magical.
I envy you. Born in 1970, I never experienced it and most likely never will, unless I organize it myself!
@@pbase36 It was 2 experiences for me. I'd go with my parents and siblings, and on other occasions with my friend and his older brother. We lived 4-5 miles from the Fair and could ride our bicycles there if we were willing to lock them up outside the perimeter fence and risk have them stolen. One day, about 25 years ago, my friends older brother and I were coming home from Manhattan in his car when he told me to open his glove compartment at the precise moment we passed Flushing Meadow Park. In it was a pile of souvenirs from the '64 Fair over which we reminisced. Organize it, friend, and I will come. Be well.
The World’s Fair was great but lost money both times in NY. If you want to get an idea of what the fair was like, go to Epcot in Florida. That certainly doesn’t lose money
Excellent video.
the fact that this came 2 weeks after mystic transits video, and also giving him credit
There's a rail and bits of infrastructure that can be found along the East side of Willow Lake where the IND World's Fair Right of Way once ran. I took a hike in the area last year discovering these artifacts.
I heard about that extension from the F train yard to the world’s fair. Interesting because a big part of it ran on the existing Vanwick expressway to the fairgrounds
Not the existing Van Wyck, but rather the Extension of the Van Wyck Expwy north of Grand Central Pkwy taking over the former IND right-of-way.
@@speeta ok thanks for clarification
How cool and great history
You are incorrect on two points. First, the Willets Points station was served jointly by the BMT and IRT, not just the BMT. As you point out, the Fair was also served by the LIRR. Second, the NYTA was formed by the merger of the IRT, BMT, and IND subways and did not include the LIRR, as you claim. Yes, the LIRR did go bankrupt, but not until about 25 years later.
Was the LIRR being sold off by PRR any part of the PennCentral merger?
@@paulluchter137 No. The Penn sold the LIRR to NY State in 1966. The PennCentral merger was in 1968.
@Yedid201 Am a native New Yorker and RR and subway buff.
The lost World Fair line was an extension of the IND Queens line going from the Jamacia train yard at the southern tip of Flushing Meadows Park north to the southern tip of the World's Fair.
I was in grade school when we went to the 1964-65 World's Fair. I doubt there will ever be another one.
They still have them… but they really don’t do them in the US. Then again we also have EPCOT…
EPCOT looks so cool form my POV of a Brit its like Pompidou France the Era of optisermism is fascinating to me@@metropod
Only the 1939-1940 world’s fair line is gone. The 1964-1965 still stands because it todays 7 line and also there structure was already build since 1920-1923
We know. He even says it.
"Modern day E//F/G trains" the G hasn't gone down Queens Blvd for a long time now. Its history.
The World's Fair used to be an amazing event! Not so much today since the Internet shrunk the world, cultures have drastically changed maybe not fot the better, you always hear they havre been Americanized! Japan, Russia etc all want to live like we do/did, they can see everything everywhere 24/7 Now. Even traveling the USA today is not what it used to be from one town/state to the next, its Walmarts fast food, rest stops with the same things in them. Even language dialects are vanishing. RT 66 was probably the prime time to explore the USA, driving slow enough to see the country, today most just want to get on a plane or interstate driving 80-90 mph to get there as fast as possible no time to see anything how can you its all a blur at that speed, the passengers faces embedded in a phone sometimes even the drivers paying more attention to what their thousands of friends they never met are doing lol what a world we are in today. When Autopilot is perfected its will only get worse.
I miss those dialects once those are extinct.😢
It's true. Back when I was a kid in the 1970s while going on long dostsnce car trips,, I used to be in awe of scenery and surroundings along the road. Last year I did a long distance car trip with a friend and her kid. The entire trip the kids attention was on his phone screen.
i've taken that train, city still has some in storage they used to run a few of those older ones around holidays
NYC should have kept the line, case closed.
It could have been extended to La Guardia Airport but the Mayor of NYC and Robert Moses did not have a big imagination.
@@luislaplume8261 All Robert Moses cared about was cars and how to move then.
@@luislaplume8261 They no longer wanted to build non-subways. Now a line to LaGuardia should come off the Connecting Railroad (the Bay Ridge branch of the LIRR onto the Hells Gate). Maybe as part of their use of that line for a new subway line...
Helo from flushing meadows queens parsons and jewel
Another great vid. But to call Robert Moses ... Ruthless !! Lol.I have to ask.at 3:00 I see the parachute Jump but that's not Coney Island. Was it at the world's fair ground first and later moved?
Yes, the parachute jump was at the 1939 World's Fair and continued tradition. The tall tower with an original Otis Elevator was at the 1876 Philadelphia Centennial (World's Fair) and was moved to Coney Island (Dreamland I think, but maybe Luna Park) and stood until a big fire in 1908 or so..
I've always wondered why the subway stops at 179th St in Jamaica and why it was not extended all the way to the Cross Island Pkwy.
This was originally the Jamaica Plank Road which began running heavy street level cars using trolley poles in late 1880s, not an interurban, but a "suburban" line. From a depot near East New York to 179th. There wasn't much east of that, certainly no Cross Island for some 60 years. Development, already there, began in earnest along that line (The soon-to-be-called Dodgers played at Eastern Park just south of the Plank Road railway's western terminus. College football was also played there. Dexter Park was just to the west. East New York was a riot of transit for a long time. Anyway, 179th was sort of where it terminated with little reason to go further east. Eventually electric traction lines performed that task (as well as the LIRR)
Of course the private competing train lines went bankrupt as they were not allowed to raise their fare rates (by NYC government) despite having increased costs to run the line. A good "what if?" vid would be what the train lines would look like today if the lines remained privately run.
Actually pretty insane to think that Subway fares actually remained the same for nearly forty years as a result of the government wanting to cause private companies to go bankrupt!
Look at britan if you want privateizeion
@@troybellamy4615thats amazing
@@troybellamy4615 I don't believe that the city government wanted the private companies to go bankrupt as much as they were more interested in keeping their voters happy by maintaining the five-cent fare. Once the private companies ran out of money (bankrupt) and sued that they shouldn't be forced to operate a money losing business (and the courts agreed) did the city buy the operations, and after WWII, raised the fair to ten cents.
How many privately run urban transit companies can you name having lasted past WWII? None? The Long Island Railroad (Pennsy) did not have a fare limit and went bankrupt. New York Central didn't do so well either. NY, W & B didn't last long. If they hadn't been taken over by the Transit Authority, those subways would have gone the way of Cincinnati or Rochester subways. Boston, Philly, Chicago, none remained private.
The BMT was not bankrupt, it was profitable to it's last day.
Get it right.😊
He tends to make small mistakes like that.
It might've not been officially bankrupt, but both the BMT and IRT were losing money badly. The reason was that the city refused to allow these private companies to raise fares which was set at 5 cents in the Dual Contracts. MayorJohn Hylan's main campaign issue was to keep the subway fare at the original 5 cents and it was speculated that this was partly as revenge for getting fired from the BMT's predecessor, the BRT, in his younger days. Hylan also got the ball rolling on the creation of the city owned IND. Ironically, after the private companies were bought out, the fare was raised to 10 cents in 1940.
@@kurt9395Also Hylan specifically built many IND lines literally underneath both existing IRT and BMT lines to take away business from these companies! Something that no private company would ever be allowed to do
@@troybellamy4615 The Manhattan Beach RR (which eventually bought the LIRR) did eventually have their ROW parallel to the railroad to Brighton Beach. Both were private.
@@kurt93951940 or 1948?
Can't believe that they didn't save the 1939 Worlds fair sphere and spire like the did the 1964-65 World's fair Unisphere.
The Unisphere was built by US Steel using stainless steel which reputedly could last for centuries. I doubt that the same could be said of the Trylon and Perisphere. Not much of the 1964 Worlds Fair still exists, but the likely reason the Unisphere survived is that it would've cost more to dismantle it than just leave it in place.
Fun fact: The only surviving building from the 1939 Worlds Fair is the former NYC pavilion which is now the Queens Museum.
@@kurt9395 The current Science museum was the AT&T exhibit building in 1964 Fair. Also the building with the heliport on the roof still stands as does the deteriorating New York state exhibit structures. A couple of buildings from 1939 also still stand.
I think the various NASA rocket parts are still outside the Science museum.
@paulluchter137
The 1939 New York City pavilion is now the Queens Museum.
For the 1964 World's Fair, it was still the New York City pavilion.
The 39-40 worlds fair took place before the existence of the Vanwick expressway. After the fair closed, the tracks were torn up to provide the right of way for the new highway. Thank Robert Moses for that!
IIRC, at the time of the 39-40 worlds fair, both the BMT and the IRT co-operated the Flushing line, which is now only run under the IRT subway branch. The Astoria line was also co-operated by the BMT and IRT, it is now run under the BMT-IND division. If you travel on either line today, you can still see traces of abandoned steelwork on the EL structure where the two lines once interconnected. There was also an interconnection between the Astoria line and the F,A and E line to Queens.
People were saying the World's Fair could've kept running another five years. Two years later, many of the countries that had exhibits there were taken over by the Axis. The IND World's Fair Line was only meant to be temporary. The Van Wyck Expressway needs the Clearview Expressway Extension to deal with the existing traffic problems leading to JFK Airport.
I remember wicker seats from Chicago's Ravenswood line in the 1950's. No relation to this story, however.
I don't mind. I rode old subway trains with those type of seats in the 1960s and in 1968 I and my little brother and our late parents took the Myrtle Ave El to Downtown Brooklyn 4 blocks from the Brooklyn Bridge and those El trains had the same wicker seats.😊
The Canarsie line had old cars with white wicker seats into the 80s
@@paulluchter137 Not true. The last R9s ran in 1976 til 1977. Some were on the LL Canarsie line from 1969 til 1974. Check out the history of the R1 thru R9 subway fleet.
Wish I could see colorized photos of this.
Robert Moses hated trains. End of story.
It was the end of the World's Fair that brought an end to the World's Fair Line, not Robert Moses.
Can you make a video on Downing stadium now Icahn stadium on Randall’s Island
I’m so early!
We lost the train, but keep the alien spaceships...
So Flushing Meadows is NOT a field full of outdoor toilets?
But unlike Gowanus Canal (with an outlet into the East River), plans to have an outlet for Newtown Creek into Flushing Bay never materialized.
7 train is the best in the City! LET'S GO METS!!!!
Yay another Mets fan!
@@Kool_Fish_Here Meet the Mets! Meet the Mets. Come on everybody and meet the Mets. All the other teams are having a howl seeing the Mets drop those balls. Those teams are having a lot of fun, seeing their fly balls bounce over the wall after hitting the ground by the wall. All the people are throwing garbage at them all for missing and dropping those hit balls. That is why we call them the New York Mutts! Bow wow, bow wow. 😊
I live off the 7 and it’s super convenient and timely compared to other lines
@@johnallenbailey1103 the 7 train been breaking down a lot
The line was also supposed to extend past Flushing into Bayside and Douglaston. But thats probably for another video.
N O
That was the planned extension of the #7 line past the Main Street station.
I REMEMBER THE N Y WORLDS FAIR IN 1964 IS THIS THE SHOW OF SHOW S!!!!????🤗🤗🤗
💛💛💛
So much bull in this video, many UNTRUE things!
A good example of why government shouldn’t be allowed to subsidize the kinds of shysters who run “world fairs” and own sports teams.
Except for the McCaskey Family, who have proven themselves to be completely powerless in and around Chicago.
You look at that area now and its a total DUMP!! Riddle with trash, crime and prostitution.
At 1:51 Robert Moses is wearing skin. Looks like a skin mask and his hand also looks like skin wrapped.
All my homies hate Robert Moses
Do your homies know that Robert Moses didn't kill the World's Fair Line?
Not old enough to remember the 1939 Fair, but I did go in the 60’s. Thanks for a great video on the WF Line.
I was born just after the 1964-65 World's Fair closed.