If McLaren's engines didn't blow up so often or the mechanics didn't fuck up Raikkonen quite often too, he would be at least a three-times champion '-'
Yet Kimi beat Alonso in head-to-head quali results 11-8. And how was the McLaren faster? At the start of the season it clearly wasn't and often they looked quite equal. Bottom line being, both cars looked fast to me, but only one looked reliable. I'm quite confident that the Renault was "the better car overall" that season. Can I add Michelin boycotting the US GP to Kimi's bad luck? He was starting 2nd to Fernando's 6th there. Say what you want, I think that reliability won the title for Alonso.
Welp Alonso lost out on 3 other championships by a few points so I feel it balances out. Plus luck always plays with and against the same and different people and kimi was not so lucky
Easily the fastest driver in the world from 2002-2006 on the MICHELIN tyre during the tyre war. Suited his front end positive driving style perfectly. Here is Martin Brundle comparing his speed of this period to that of Senna, (last paragraph, also mentions MSC): www.formula1.com/en/latest/features/2014/5/With-Ayrton-in-mind---the-F1-paddock-on-Senna.html
There wasn't any of the top four who didn't deserve it. But kimi was the fastest over the season and had two failures which without he would've won the title by quite some margin.
Actually he's right. Back then there were two qualifications: -Saturday - one low fuel lap -Sunday morning - one lap with race fuel on Combined times decided grid order This was Saturday's qualification which put him on provisional pole. In Q2 Alonso were 0.4s faster (Kimi had fuel for 17 laps more)
In my opinion that was the best grand prix of Kimi... Best pole and best race... In 2005 Kimi had his best year... And he deserved to be a world champion much more than in 2007. However, McLaren was not reliable enough... Nevertheless, he won in 2007 because of the fight between McLaren drivers. Virtually he "was given back by McLaren" what he had been deprived of by them... :)
@whateverman1028 Fastest yes but far from the best. It badly lacked realibility. 05 McLaren was the best tool for Räikkönen during his F1 career. It really got best out of him and suited his driving style just perfectly. Car looked like possesed at the times. Kimi drove the car at it's limit most of the time and he destroyed Montoya completelly. It was brilliant to watch Kimi with this car. Bad start for the season and 3 x DNF from the lead (Alonso winning each time) robbed Kimi's WC that year.
@Anime998877 Kimi didn't loss 20 points to Alonso due to reliability.. He lost 47 points to him. And he had to fight from those points with Montoya unlike Alonso who was the number one driver for renault.. So its a bit more than 3 points.
Alonso is just a lucky bastard~~ he drove pathetically and trying to gain benefit from other's misfortune~~ thats why he is so boring to watch~~ unlike Kimi who went flat out, sadly the car couldn't match him!!
@Giggeli15 In fairness, Montoya went out earlier than Kimi, when there would be considerably less grip on the track. Montoya did manage to push Raikkonen fairly hard in 2005.
I want to compare the 2019 pole lap from Hamilton (1:10.1) to this lap from 2005, the last year of the V10s. The pole lap was 3.5 seconds slower. However, when you adjust for the grooved tires, tire tech advances, the longer wheelbase and greater aero of today’s cars, I think you can make the case that today’s hybrid F1 cars are, at last, roughly equivalent to the V10s from 14-15 years ago. There is no comparison on sound however. Give me a V10 any day of the week and twice on Go Fast Day.
@DeadbeatXT Oh yes it can, especially with those 2005 tyres, and a track like Monaco. The track temperature also increased quite a bit since Montoya's run.
sure I saw it. And sure you can believe what you want, too.It's true that Alonso hardly put a wrong foot all season, but he was aided by a trouble-free car. Sometimes championships are won that way too, and it doesn't take anything away from them. Think Keke Rosberg in 82 or Niki Lauda in 84. They weren't the fastest those years, but they were the most consistent and had the least car failures, just like Alonso in 2005.
@Anime998877 Australian GP: Kimi's car stalled and he started from the pits and was therefore only able to finish 8th. Surely a few points lost. Malaysian GP: Kimi suffered a puncture right after his pitstop and finished only 9th, his pace suggested that he would have been on podium otherwise. San Marino engine failure cost a win. European GP suspension failure cost a win. German GP hydraulic failure cost a win. Also a bunch of engine failures meant 10 grid slot penalties from front row.
As for Alonso. McLaren signed him with a multi-year contract because they wanted to win titles with him Hamilton was a promising new talent Suddenly it appeared Hamilton outraced Alonso in the same way Senna outraced Prost.Should they apply brakes on either driver? I think not. Say how did Button outscore Hamilton in 2011?? Another one of your "McLaren favoritisms"?? What version of reality do you live in anyway?? Go watch Star Wars.Lucas ripped the story from Kurosawa's "Hidden Fortress"
@Anime998877 So if you correct everything. You can EASILY add up that Kimi lost at least 40 points due to bad luck/reliability issues. Had his car been as reliable as Fernando's, he would've been more than 20 points ahead. Enough? I'm not saying that Alonso didn't drive well that season, cause he did. But Kimi/Mclaren combo was faster and only lost because Alonso was able to pick consistent finishes all the time while Kimi struggled with his the mercedes engines failing every other weekend etc.
Lauda was free to race Prost. So Lauda won the '84 title. Prost then won the '85 title. In 1988 McLaren didn't give Prost any favoritism despite him winning two titles for them and being the most successful driver in F1 of all time with a record 28 wins. That annoyed him, that they let Senna challenge him. I suppose McLaren gave Prost favoritism in 1989 when Senna's car always broke down?? Montoya could never match Raikkonen and his mistakes cost McLaren a well deserved constructors' title.
Yeah, they paid a ton of money and signed a multi year contract so that they could support the rookie. Makes perfect sense. Listen up. They agreed to give both drivers equal opportunities. That is something Alonso never could accept (and neither could a certain Michael Schumacher who had handpicked number 2's) When Senna came to McLaren in 1988 then a certain Alain Prost said McLaren favoured him too. At least Prost was man enough to stay for 1989 in the same team, and he won the title too.
you don't know english do you? James allen sounded like Kimi was under pressure because of a possible lack of results but then James reminds himself that Kimi was looking for his 3RD POLE, how can a guy searching his 3rd pole in a row be on pressure.
bullshit, how many 10 grid penalties given to kimi due to merc engine?? did you count in that as well?? Montoya inherited win from kimi in silverstone and monza despite kimi clinch the poles~~!!
Prost didn't like how he suddenly wasn't the best driver in the world. Under the current points systems he'd be champion both in 1988 and 1989 Coulthard managed to spin off twice in the formation lap while driving for Williams in 1995, so they kept Hill for 1996 despite him being 11 years Coulthard's senior Also in 1999 it was clear both Coulthard and Hakkinen were free to race for the title. Coulthard squandered his chances on 3 races he could have easily won. What about Spa '99?? Favoritism?
@Giggeli15 - Lol if you want to randomly come up with 47 points i'm not going to bother arguing with you. So please explain where the 47 points came from?
Equal opportunities..Yeah. That must be why prost, coultard, Alonso, Montoya, Hekki ect pretty much one driver of every pairing under Ron Dennis has complained of favoritism at one point. Coincidence?? Mclaren the biggest hypocrite team and fans in formula one. Quite fitting that you share their name.
1:13 644 non lo fai neanche in aereo ... giro per antonomasia ... perfect lap .. fantastico ... per me raikkonen rimane il pilota più forte ... il più completo è alonso e il più veloce è hamilton...
Alonso won the title because he was consistent. He had 15 podiums in 19 races while Fisichella was tooling around the whole year. Kimi beat Alonso in head to head quali results yes, but like I said the mclaren was much much faster than the renault and it was obvious if you even saw the 2005 season. Yes Mclaren had reliability issues but that was the trade off. I don't say what I want, I say what I believe. And I believe Alonso was the best driver in 2005.
Are you aware that in 2008 Hekki was regularly forced to run more fuel in Q3 to make sure he was out of the way in the race?? He publicly complained about it. Are you also aware that at on more than one occasion in 2009 he was unable to run development parts as early as hamilton?? Even the team have admitted this. LMAO! at how delusional you are.
lol What facts?? You don't even know anything about 2007 except whatever rumors you heard. FACT is only ron, alonso and maybe a few others inside mclaren KNOW what actually happened any they are not talking. The rest is pure assumption and speculation. You're are entitled to your own opinion but don't mistake it for being fact OK? BTW You can make fun of my name all you want but everything i have said is fact. If you disagree simply point out where i am wrong...
with ferrari? not rly!!! its true that he was so unlucky with mclaren!!! but not that time with ferrari just think that he got the championship with one more point than lewis and alonso....lewis didnt got the championship cause of 0 alonso's brain!
Kimi/Mclaren combo was faster for only one reason. The mclaren was far quicker than the renault and that's it. In nuburgring Kimi fucked up his tyre so bad with a terrible lockup in the first corner mid-race and went off the track twice. It was entirely down to him that the tyre failed. Alonso scored more poles than Raikkonen in 2005 regardless . Kimi inherited 2 wins when montoya retired and Alonso had some bad luck himself. I'd say Alonso drove better than Raikkonen in 2005.
If McLaren's engines didn't blow up so often or the mechanics didn't fuck up Raikkonen quite often too, he would be at least a three-times champion '-'
At least mate ! At least ! For me Kimi is a modern time Senna
exactly, and if Ferrari didn’t sabotage him and if Kimi didn’t make too many errors in 2008 he would’ve won back to back championships with Ferrari
Absolutely. No one is quicker than Kimi in the modern era. Not even Schumi @@inerttech2570
@@drfeelgood94 yeah but he wasn't complete as Michael on the other aspects
@@francescosalvato6612what could schumacher do that kimi couldnt?
Just hear that mighty V10 in between the buildings... Awesome.
When kimi has the car he likes he is the fastest!!!!! Mclaren s mechanics kmew that,even the great Michael knew that!!!!
Greatest quali lap of all time
It was faster in 2006 and faster today also.
Not "the" greatest, but one of the them for sure!
Kimi Raikkonen Champion 2003, 2005, 2007!!!
yes, U're damn right!!!
@@stefancelmare4631 And Alonso had bad luck in 2010 and 2012 and could have also be wdc in 2007
@@batallaschamberi6451 yes, U are almost right, the spaniard had bad luck in 2010 and 2012 but in 2007 the real winner in my opinion was Lewis!
Yet Kimi beat Alonso in head-to-head quali results 11-8. And how was the McLaren faster? At the start of the season it clearly wasn't and often they looked quite equal. Bottom line being, both cars looked fast to me, but only one looked reliable. I'm quite confident that the Renault was "the better car overall" that season. Can I add Michelin boycotting the US GP to Kimi's bad luck? He was starting 2nd to Fernando's 6th there. Say what you want, I think that reliability won the title for Alonso.
Couldn't agree more
Welp Alonso lost out on 3 other championships by a few points so I feel it balances out. Plus luck always plays with and against the same and different people and kimi was not so lucky
Definitely one of the best qualifying moments of recent F1 history
woow....this is so awesome to see.......Kimi was on fire during the Mclaren years!!
Easily the fastest driver in the world from 2002-2006 on the MICHELIN tyre during the tyre war. Suited his front end positive driving style perfectly. Here is Martin Brundle comparing his speed of this period to that of Senna, (last paragraph, also mentions MSC): www.formula1.com/en/latest/features/2014/5/With-Ayrton-in-mind---the-F1-paddock-on-Senna.html
-0.481 amazing + amazing commentary
Kimi had a diamond-encrusted helmet that weekend. Pole position and a dominant win. Swagger par excellence.
There wasn't any of the top four who didn't deserve it. But kimi was the fastest over the season and had two failures which without he would've won the title by quite some margin.
Actually he's right. Back then there were two qualifications:
-Saturday - one low fuel lap
-Sunday morning - one lap with race fuel on
Combined times decided grid order
This was Saturday's qualification which put him on provisional pole. In Q2 Alonso were 0.4s faster (Kimi had fuel for 17 laps more)
Kimi the most under rated F1 driver of all time
Wow. 16 years later and this coverage is still getting me hyped up! Great commentary and camera angles. As well as the sound
"Now then, Mr. Raikkonen, what can you do?"
Oh boy
Hot lapping Monaco is so bloody awrsome
In my opinion that was the best grand prix of Kimi... Best pole and best race... In 2005 Kimi had his best year... And he deserved to be a world champion much more than in 2007. However, McLaren was not reliable enough... Nevertheless, he won in 2007 because of the fight between McLaren drivers. Virtually he "was given back by McLaren" what he had been deprived of by them... :)
This lap rivals Senna's 1988 as the greatest F1 lap ever. Kimi at McLaren was not from this planet.
Those words live in my head to this day... "Nowthen, Mr. Raikkonen, what can you do?".
@whateverman1028 Fastest yes but far from the best. It badly lacked realibility. 05 McLaren was the best tool for Räikkönen during his F1 career. It really got best out of him and suited his driving style just perfectly. Car looked like possesed at the times. Kimi drove the car at it's limit most of the time and he destroyed Montoya completelly. It was brilliant to watch Kimi with this car. Bad start for the season and 3 x DNF from the lead (Alonso winning each time) robbed Kimi's WC that year.
Raikkonen was the best 04 an 05 let down by his car still my favourite driver ever aka The Ice Man
I’ve been watching this so much the last couple days
Great commentary.
that's F1 for you
@Anime998877 Kimi didn't loss 20 points to Alonso due to reliability.. He lost 47 points to him. And he had to fight from those points with Montoya unlike Alonso who was the number one driver for renault.. So its a bit more than 3 points.
Welcome back to F1 Kimi... :D
Those were the days! Kimi could whoop ass!
those accelaration sounds damn..
Monaco 2005 was the first GP I ever watched. Bringing back memories for sure.
JP Montoya +1.214 with the same car.. Kimi is one of the best of all time, not the car
Now that he did better than that amazing lap, let's get that win tomorrow!!
Yeah this is too good.
Alonso is just a lucky bastard~~ he drove pathetically and trying to gain benefit from other's misfortune~~ thats why he is so boring to watch~~ unlike Kimi who went flat out, sadly the car couldn't match him!!
the last car of Mclaren West era..
I wish we could see a similar battle this year in Monaco! :)
Boy, that escalated quickly.
@Giggeli15 In fairness, Montoya went out earlier than Kimi, when there would be considerably less grip on the track. Montoya did manage to push Raikkonen fairly hard in 2005.
@PJ2436 a green track can't be responsible for a whole second.
He’s a guy who very likely would be a 3 time world champion given better reliability in McLaren cars
I want to compare the 2019 pole lap from Hamilton (1:10.1) to this lap from 2005, the last year of the V10s. The pole lap was 3.5 seconds slower. However, when you adjust for the grooved tires, tire tech advances, the longer wheelbase and greater aero of today’s cars, I think you can make the case that today’s hybrid F1 cars are, at last, roughly equivalent to the V10s from 14-15 years ago. There is no comparison on sound however. Give me a V10 any day of the week and twice on Go Fast Day.
Kimi's technique through Tabac and Swimming Pool is far better than that of Hamilton. At least Kimi from this tyre war era.
@DeadbeatXT Oh yes it can, especially with those 2005 tyres, and a track like Monaco. The track temperature also increased quite a bit since Montoya's run.
@santaPotrashitel This is MP4-20
sure I saw it. And sure you can believe what you want, too.It's true that Alonso hardly put a wrong foot all season, but he was aided by a trouble-free car. Sometimes championships are won that way too, and it doesn't take anything away from them. Think Keke Rosberg in 82 or Niki Lauda in 84. They weren't the fastest those years, but they were the most consistent and had the least car failures, just like Alonso in 2005.
McLaren MP4-20 Engine: Mercedes-Benz FO 110R 90° V10
@Anime998877 Australian GP: Kimi's car stalled and he started from the pits and was therefore only able to finish 8th. Surely a few points lost. Malaysian GP: Kimi suffered a puncture right after his pitstop and finished only 9th, his pace suggested that he would have been on podium otherwise. San Marino engine failure cost a win. European GP suspension failure cost a win. German GP hydraulic failure cost a win. Also a bunch of engine failures meant 10 grid slot penalties from front row.
it's not pole, this was his q1 lap
As for Alonso.
McLaren signed him with a multi-year contract because they wanted to win titles with him
Hamilton was a promising new talent
Suddenly it appeared Hamilton outraced Alonso in the same way Senna outraced Prost.Should they apply brakes on either driver? I think not.
Say how did Button outscore Hamilton in 2011?? Another one of your "McLaren favoritisms"??
What version of reality do you live in anyway??
Go watch Star Wars.Lucas ripped the story from Kurosawa's "Hidden Fortress"
@09Murphy09 Shame the McLaren wasn't the most reliable car in 2005.
kimi for FERRARI in 2013!!!
WORLD CHAMPION AGAIN!!!
MP4-25 BEST OF ALL TIME!!!!
@Anime998877 So if you correct everything. You can EASILY add up that Kimi lost at least 40 points due to bad luck/reliability issues. Had his car been as reliable as Fernando's, he would've been more than 20 points ahead. Enough? I'm not saying that Alonso didn't drive well that season, cause he did. But Kimi/Mclaren combo was faster and only lost because Alonso was able to pick consistent finishes all the time while Kimi struggled with his the mercedes engines failing every other weekend etc.
many "deserved" more than one, or at least one....
how can a guy that made 2 poles in a row be under pressure, thats why I was stating that james allen doesnt make any sense.
Lauda was free to race Prost. So Lauda won the '84 title. Prost then won the '85 title. In 1988 McLaren didn't give Prost any favoritism despite him winning two titles for them and being the most successful driver in F1 of all time with a record 28 wins. That annoyed him, that they let Senna challenge him.
I suppose McLaren gave Prost favoritism in 1989 when Senna's car always broke down??
Montoya could never match Raikkonen and his mistakes cost McLaren a well deserved constructors' title.
Yeah, they paid a ton of money and signed a multi year contract so that they could support the rookie. Makes perfect sense.
Listen up. They agreed to give both drivers equal opportunities. That is something Alonso never could accept (and neither could a certain Michael Schumacher who had handpicked number 2's) When Senna came to McLaren in 1988 then a certain Alain Prost said McLaren favoured him too. At least Prost was man enough to stay for 1989 in the same team, and he won the title too.
@09Murphy09 now he comes back to get more! GO KIMI GO FINLAND!
@Giggeli15 so true!
Late 2008 onwards kimi started getting lazy and growing his hair and was defo over his peak 😂
2003 and 2005 he was so quick and agile in the car
Growing his hair..?
Mister Raikkonen B)
James Allen doesnt make sense "under pressure..., looking for his 3rd pole in a row"
No kimi No, you will not have da drink
Ok!
you don't know english do you? James allen sounded like Kimi was under pressure because of a possible lack of results but then James reminds himself that Kimi was looking for his 3RD POLE, how can a guy searching his 3rd pole in a row be on pressure.
@09Murphy09 He's coming back so... You never know.
bullshit, how many 10 grid penalties given to kimi due to merc engine?? did you count in that as well?? Montoya inherited win from kimi in silverstone and monza despite kimi clinch the poles~~!!
the original comment which started this conversation was spammed.
Prost didn't like how he suddenly wasn't the best driver in the world. Under the current points systems he'd be champion both in 1988 and 1989
Coulthard managed to spin off twice in the formation lap while driving for Williams in 1995, so they kept Hill for 1996 despite him being 11 years Coulthard's senior
Also in 1999 it was clear both Coulthard and Hakkinen were free to race for the title. Coulthard squandered his chances on 3 races he could have easily won. What about Spa '99?? Favoritism?
"the jewel takes another twist?"
Blueocea he says ‘dual’ not jewel. The dual between Raikkonen and Alonso, they were the two championship rivals in 2005
@Giggeli15 - I did check the facts. I don't see it. That's why you need to explain it. Duh.
@Anime998877 You are not going to argue but still are. Check the facts if u dont believe it.
@Giggeli15 - Lol if you want to randomly come up with 47 points i'm not going to bother arguing with you. So please explain where the 47 points came from?
@Sembee83
6wins vs 4(lewis and alonso) wins in 2007
they would favour the driver who was scoring the most points
Actually, I prefered more this type of qualification...
Now that you understood what I meant please stop spamming my comment.
lol? he only won 07 o.0 what are u on? :D
ei voi muuta sanoo ku että huh huh!!
Equal opportunities..Yeah. That must be why prost, coultard, Alonso, Montoya, Hekki ect pretty much one driver of every pairing under Ron Dennis has complained of favoritism at one point. Coincidence?? Mclaren the biggest hypocrite team and fans in formula one. Quite fitting that you share their name.
Montoya Win Monaco 2003 :)
Good or bad history isn't written with if's
are you crazy?
1:13 644 non lo fai neanche in aereo ... giro per antonomasia ... perfect lap .. fantastico ... per me raikkonen rimane il pilota più forte ... il più completo è alonso e il più veloce è hamilton...
LOL That must be the record for most assumptions in one post. Impressive even by your standards ;)
Alonso won the title because he was consistent. He had 15 podiums in 19 races while Fisichella was tooling around the whole year. Kimi beat Alonso in head to head quali results yes, but like I said the mclaren was much much faster than the renault and it was obvious if you even saw the 2005 season. Yes Mclaren had reliability issues but that was the trade off. I don't say what I want, I say what I believe. And I believe Alonso was the best driver in 2005.
Are you aware that in 2008 Hekki was regularly forced to run more fuel in Q3 to make sure he was out of the way in the race?? He publicly complained about it. Are you also aware that at on more than one occasion in 2009 he was unable to run development parts as early as hamilton?? Even the team have admitted this. LMAO! at how delusional you are.
lol What facts?? You don't even know anything about 2007 except whatever rumors you heard. FACT is only ron, alonso and maybe a few others inside mclaren KNOW what actually happened any they are not talking. The rest is pure assumption and speculation. You're are entitled to your own opinion but don't mistake it for being fact OK? BTW You can make fun of my name all you want but everything i have said is fact. If you disagree simply point out where i am wrong...
with ferrari? not rly!!! its true that he was so unlucky with mclaren!!! but not that time with ferrari just think that he got the championship with one more point than lewis and alonso....lewis didnt got the championship cause of 0 alonso's brain!
ignore all these silly facts i have presented to you like a good little fanboy should :)
Kimi/Mclaren combo was faster for only one reason. The mclaren was far quicker than the renault and that's it. In nuburgring Kimi fucked up his tyre so bad with a terrible lockup in the first corner mid-race and went off the track twice. It was entirely down to him that the tyre failed. Alonso scored more poles than Raikkonen in 2005 regardless . Kimi inherited 2 wins when montoya retired and Alonso had some bad luck himself. I'd say Alonso drove better than Raikkonen in 2005.
Mark FormulaRacer WTF
is this supposed to be some sort of insult or something?? Do you really think that i care what you think?? Xd You trolls are too funny.